Politics

Stunning Photo Reveals How Vatican Learned to Spin Global Warming

11 years ago
Bob Tisdale

Guest Post by Bob Tisdale. Pope Francis’s entry into the political climate-change debate was welcomed by some, frowned on by others. A new photo reveals who taught the Pope the proper way to spin global warming. Pope Francis Global Warming Advisors [My apologies to the Harlem Globetrotters.] Will the Vatican be adding solar panels atop the Sistine Chapel and a windmill at the peak of the obelisk in Saint Peter’s square?  They should lead by example.

UPDATE:  My little add-on note at the end was unwarranted.  According to blogger imoira, the Vatican had added a large photovoltaic plant a number of years ago and has proclaimed itself the greenest state in the world.  See Vatican City Is The ‘Greenest State In The World’

Thanks, imoira.

 

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jono1066
May 9, 2015 5:45 pm

calling Mr Thomas Paine ………

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u.k.(us)
May 9, 2015 6:57 pm

Someone way smarter than me once said something like:
“Never Discuss Politics or Religion in polite company”
========
It never turns out well, no matter the good intentions.

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E.M.Smith
Editor
Reply to  u.k.(us)
May 9, 2015 9:07 pm

so that is why the Warmwrs are so darned impolite. ..

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u.k.(us)
Reply to  E.M.Smith
May 10, 2015 10:41 am

See what I mean.

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Max Photon
May 9, 2015 7:53 pm

“Harlem Globewarmers” … it’s a slam dunk!

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Max Photon
May 10, 2015 7:43 am

… +1… but I had to wait for it. 🙂

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Bad-Clown
May 9, 2015 8:10 pm

Whoring fer the UN–that’s a little cheap. Guess when yer main business is failin’, ya has to tries somethin’ else. Let’s hope he’s the last…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes
But yous can’t expects much from a Nazi. Ratzi run-off with his boyfriend when the goin’ got tuff. Now this one’s not even takin’ care of business!

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ferdberple
May 9, 2015 9:45 pm

Vatican was spending $660 million on a massive 100MW photovoltaic installation
estimated to have saved the Vatican 89.84 tons in oil.
==============
about 600 barrels of oil, at $60/barrel. $36 thousand dollars.

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scute1133
May 9, 2015 10:02 pm

I suppose a carbon tax (or green subsidies) is like paying a modern day indulgence. After all, it’s paid to avert the threat of being roasted.

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Manfred
May 9, 2015 11:27 pm

I’m idly wondering whether Maurice Strong is a closet catholic?

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tobyglyn
May 10, 2015 12:00 am

“ferdberple
May 9, 2015 at 9:45 pm
Vatican was spending $660 million on a massive 100MW photovoltaic installation
estimated to have saved the Vatican 89.84 tons in oil.
==============
about 600 barrels of oil, at $60/barrel. $36 thousand dollars.”
From the article discussing the installation:
“The main solar array is located on a 740 acre site near Santa Maria di Galeria, but the solar panels that were installed on Paul VI’s conference hall were put in two years ago and are estimated to have saved the Vatican 89.84 tons in oil”
So it’s the panels on the conference hall roof that have apparently saved the Vatican 89.84 tons in oil, not the $660 million installation.
Sadly, they don’t mention how much those conference hall panels cost.

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David Chapman
May 10, 2015 1:59 am

The Pope has said nothing as yet. Before he does he will, no doubt ponder Pope John-Paul II’s observation, “One Galileo is enough”.

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Alexander Feht
May 10, 2015 2:41 am

All religions of the world aren’t worth one hair on the head of a prophetic genius, Giordano Bruno (after a long torture, burnt at the stake upside down at 6 AM while gagged that he couldn’t say anything to the few onlookers that happened to witness his execution at this early hour (what cowards!) — and all this for saying that stars are other Suns, that there are other planets, and that the Earth is not in the center of everything).
I would be ashamed to call myself a Christian.

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Antonia
Reply to  Alexander Feht
May 10, 2015 5:31 am

I’m not. Christianity has in the main overwhelmingly benefitted humanity.

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Gunga Din
Reply to  Alexander Feht
May 10, 2015 1:12 pm

Christianity, what it is really about, is not what men have done to other men but about what God has done in Christ for Man despite what Man has done to God.
Many have done things in the name of God before first finding out what it is God wants done. Don’t blame God for that. There’s only been one who by his freedom of will always did what God wanted done. (And what He wanted done was for our benefit. If you want to learn mote, go to the Book itself and not just what someone told you about it.)
PS I was born and raised Roman Catholic. Then, after a few side trips and a heart-felt plea to God, I was helped and directed to The Book itself.

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Alexander Feht
Reply to  Gunga Din
May 10, 2015 2:17 pm

There is no logical argument capable of convincing a believer.
Therefore, any intelligent conversation with believers is impossible.
You just have to live with your Book until the end of your days, when you shall disappear, and your Book will remain, forgotten, in the dust.

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Alexander Feht
May 10, 2015 2:49 am

One Galileo? ONE Galileo??? How about hundreds and thousands of the best minds of Europe, burnt alive, disemboweled, quartered, tortured, persecuted, hunted down, castrated, denounced and given to the crowds to have bloody fun, belied, defamed, slanderer, destroyed physically and spiritually for centuries?
Christians like so much talking about their martyrs who died for nonsense but they created hundred times more martyrs who died for reason. And still, Vatican is at it: it supports and finances the gigantic lies of climate change and its last cast for creationism, the Big Bang Idiocy.
Oh boy, if only I could say what I really think about this old socialist fox in Rome!

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Alexander Feht
May 10, 2015 7:41 am

Wow.. got a real hate on doncha? Here to begin, and where to end? You know your facts are so abusively wrong and you frame of mind so intractable hostile, I ain’t gonna bother with you at all. You are a lost cause.
Folks, if you at all believe this troll, I suggest you challenge anything and everything he just wrote, and look up anything for yourself.

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Vince Causey
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 10, 2015 10:35 am

Just try and mention Putin, and you’ll see real hate.

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Alexander Feht
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 10, 2015 2:13 pm

Paul Westhaver,
Yes, I am hostile to murder and torture. Facts are on my side, and you know it.
Bring William Tyndale back to life, then we’ll talk again.

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Gary Hladik
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 5:40 pm

“…I suggest you challenge anything and everything he just wrote, and look up anything for yourself.”
CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!!!

Being lazy, I started and stopped with Wiki. I assume Alexander Feht refers to the Roman Catholic Church Inquisition, so I went straight to the page on the Spanish Inquisition, which is of course just part of the story but arguably the worst part:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Inquisition
By one estimate, in its entire history the Spanish Inquisition “processed” some 150,000 people, executing some 3,000 to 5,000 of them. This is, frankly, less than I expected, though it’s horrific enough. Of course there was also considerable torture and intimidation involved, not to mention collateral damage such as the deaths of children orphaned by the Inquisition.
Although some of Alexander Feht’s “best minds of Europe” may have fallen victim, the Inquisition seems to have been more interested in enriching the Church (and presumably the Inquisitors) than enforcing scientific orthodoxy:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Inquisition#Confiscations
You don’t suppose some of the modern Gaia worshipers have shrines to the almighty Dollar in their basements, do you? 🙂

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Gary Hladik
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 5:42 pm

Aaaargh! THIS is the link to “challenge accepted”:

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Anoneumouse
May 10, 2015 3:37 am

If they closed down Vatican City how many carbon PILGRIM footprints’ could be saved!

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kim2ooo
May 10, 2015 3:52 am

Reblogged this on Climate Ponderings.

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Khwarizmi
May 10, 2015 4:58 am

My Catholic heritage is why I became an atheist at a very young age. Catholics produce a lot of atheists for some reason.
http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/IMAGES/parade.jpg

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RobRoy
Reply to  Khwarizmi
May 10, 2015 6:34 am

K, Why not try Agnosticism, Catholics(Christians) are only Human beings. They have no special connection to God. Why throw the baby out with the bath water.

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Khwarizmi
May 10, 2015 7:13 am

…”I became an atheist at a very young age”

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Bill Treuren
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 6:23 pm

Clearly atheism is a belief in itself as you can never rationally eliminate all possibility of a god, that is rationally.
So agnosticism is the rational consequence of not adopting a religion but continuing life with an open mind which is the rational position.
CAGW is a belief because it lives as a settled position we are told, if we oppose we risk ridicule. the most irrational space.

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Antonia
May 10, 2015 5:40 am

I also like many young Catholics abandoned my faith but took it up when I had children.
Why? The atheists’ thinking is don’t impose your values on your children. Let them decide.
How ridiculous. If you never expose your children to religion how will they ever experience it to make a decision between religion and atheism?

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Slywolfe
Reply to  Antonia
May 10, 2015 6:38 am

There is a difference between “impose” and “expose.”

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Antonia
May 10, 2015 7:29 am

I think that people naturally move in and out of their relationship with their religions. People grow, suffer, learn, change, and somehow the process of life adds to the complex Mulligan’s Stew of our mind. People go through rationalism, charismaticism, stubborness, loneliness, boyant exhilaration, dark abandonment… all of it.
People are not computers, they feel. When you have children, you share in our divine nature as creators.
I suppose if people don’t provide a child with a philosophical framework, the child will find one, likely in the dark reaches of the internet.

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Stevan Makarevich
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 10, 2015 9:38 am

Mr. Westhaver, your comments regarding religion are the most thoughtful and intelligent that I’ve read here.
Although I was raised Eastern Orthodox, my parents allowed me to attend many other churches when I was young, since there wasn’t an Orthodox church near our house. They taught me me that ALL religions, not only Christian or the various denominations, were good. Governments may make laws, but it is religions that instill morals, what is right and wrong, and even more important, these morals guide us from within – we strive to do the right thing even though there isn’t a sanctioned punishment for doing the wrong.
I do not have children, but as I entered mid-life, I returned naturally to the religion of my childhood; it also helped that my wife was of the same religion. There is a degree of comfort with this.
One last thing – whenever I read or hear of the “evils” of religions, they always neglect to mention what religions do provide: hope. There are untold number of people on this planet, for which life would be unbearable without the hope that religions give them.

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 10, 2015 11:17 am

Stevan Makarevich,
Life is a rough road. And Life is good.
Слава Ісусу Христу!
Cheers.

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J_Bob
May 10, 2015 8:23 am

Looking at many of the posts, I would think I happened to click on RealClimate or SkepticalScience.

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Gunga Din
May 10, 2015 12:53 pm

UPDATE: My little add-on note at the end was unwarranted. According to blogger imoira, the Vatican had added a large photovoltaic plant a number of years ago and has proclaimed itself the greenest state in the world.

You corrected a mistake. Now I know that you are not a “Climate Scientist”! (A sub-pontife.8-)
Regarding what I quoted, I for one am not green with envy.

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rgbatduke
May 10, 2015 1:23 pm

It’s easy to be the greenest state in the world when you are the 19th wealthiest “country” on the planet and have a land surface area the size of a good sized college campus. However, if one extends the size of this “country” to include all church owned real estate and investments and possessions globally, where would they rank then? It seems difficult to imagine that they would be anywhere but near the middle, given that almost none of those investments, possessions, and so on generate their own electricity on the limited premises, but instead get electricity from whatever the local power grid happens to be.
We could also tot up the non-green cost of all of the gasoline and fossil fuels required to heat the churches, consumed by individuals who make a mandatory trip at least once a week to a common building that could be many miles from their homes to attend a pointless group reconditioning session to help them continue to believe in the unbelievable, expended in making odd custom clothing complete with funny hats to indicate “rank”…
But even if Francis makes the church truly “green” or the more difficult “carbon neutral”, it won’t alter the underlying facts and science of the climate, which is more unknown and less known, although even as a new world religion it is better known than the absurdities of the old ones.
rgb

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Khwarizmi
May 10, 2015 2:45 pm

Paul Westhaver
May 10, 2015 at 7:13 am
…”I became an atheist at a very young age”
=======================
Yes, I did.
I also stopped believing in santa clause elves and the easter bunny a young age.
But some people never grow up.
[trimmed]

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agfosterjr
May 10, 2015 5:45 pm

At the age of seven I became convinced somehow that my true essence could not be annihilated. I have never doubted that since. –AGF

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Truthseeker
Reply to  agfosterjr
May 10, 2015 11:35 pm

Since the atoms that you are made of were created billions of years ago, and will continue billions of years from now, you are essentially correct.

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Truthseeker
Reply to  agfosterjr
May 10, 2015 11:37 pm

Since the atoms that you are made of have existed for billions of years and will continue to exist for billions of years, you are essentially correct. Religion is not required.

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agfosterjr
Reply to  Truthseeker
May 11, 2015 8:13 am

There’s no reason a mature human brain could not eventually be replicated on a circuit board, but to believe you could create a conscious being out of it takes more faith than I have. –AGF

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Gunga Din
Reply to  agfosterjr
May 11, 2015 3:07 pm

Agf, you must not have fluoride in your drinking water. 😎
(Reference to “Dr. Strangelove”.)

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Alexander Feht
May 11, 2015 4:30 am

“The man and his religion are one and the same thing. The unknown exists. Each man projects on the blankness the shape of his own particular world-view. He endows his creation with his personal volitions and attitudes. The religious man stating his case is in essence explaining himself. When a fanatic is contradicted he feels a threat to his own existence; he reacts violently.
The atheist projects no image upon the blank whatever. The cosmic mysteries he accepts as things in themselves; he feels no need to hang a more or less human mask upon them.”
— Jack Vance

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Paul Westhaver
Reply to  Alexander Feht
May 11, 2015 1:13 pm

Except for the atheists of the 20th century, who through their totalitarian government apparatuses, killed 262,000,000 people in projecting their world view that humanity has no intrinsic value.
Atheism… 350 million gallons of human blood spilled in the last 100 “enlightened” years
Atheism.. high tech rational mass murder on a mega scale.

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thebillyc
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 1:43 pm

Thank You Mr. Westhaver. Our Western Civilization, created by believers in your Faith, is decline. Believers will abide while the destroyers bring down what was built, truths will live on in books and, perhaps, new Irish monasteries, will save the West once again. Hold fast, brother- from an old Protestant.

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Gunga Din
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 3:15 pm

Paul, Alex seems to be a “True Un-Believer”.
He’s heard. He has the rest of his life to choose.
“When a fanatic is contradicted he feels a threat to his own existence; he reacts violently.”

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Alexander Feht
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 3:38 pm

Mr. Westhaver,
You’ve been true to a form. I criticized your religion, not you personally, but you immediately attacked me personally, calling me a “troll” and saying many other things about me, for which you should apologize for. As turning the other cheek is obviously an alien concept to you.
Communism is an illogical religion in itself, and, clearly, a derivative of Christianity. In spirit, there is no difference between a Communist Party meeting (I’ve been there, I know) and a collective worship, be it Christian or Muslim (been there, too).
Stalin was not an atheist. He christened his children and regularly attended a church in Kremlin. The irony of it all is that religion doesn’t make a moral man; most of the murderers, liars and con artists are devout god-worshipers.
Atheism also doesn’t make a moral man (morality, I think, is an in-born, evolution-created instinct that some people are lacking genetically) — but at least it calls for spending our energies and time to solve problems of this life and this world, not to deserve the ridiculous eternity (who or what do you think you are, to deserve an eternal life?).
You would have to work on your arguments, folks. Religion is absurd by definition, so, while you are digesting your misery, I’ll take a nap.

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Bill Treuren
Reply to  Alexander Feht
May 11, 2015 4:16 pm

It seems quite hard to not have a belief on that argument.
I quite like that, belief is hard wire into language, we ask if you believe in CAGW when in fact it is a rational analysis separate from “belief” supposedly.
i don’t think the 20th century was very different from the others in brutality probably less so on a per capita basis we also have very much better tech.
consider the US civil war relative to the then population of the US .2% of population killed.

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dbstealey
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 4:52 pm

Bill Treuren wrote:
consider the US civil war relative to the then population of the US .2% of population killed.
That can’t be right. Weren’t about 600,000 killed?

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Bill Treuren
Reply to  dbstealey
May 11, 2015 5:17 pm

thats right but I missed a space 600k killed and 32m people

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dbstealey
Reply to  Paul Westhaver
May 11, 2015 5:19 pm

Bill,
Thanks. Now that I look at it, it looks like a typo: 2%, not .2%.
I agree with the other part of your comment.

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