Uh oh: Study says 'collapsing' Thwaites Glacier in Antarctica melting from geothermal heat, not 'climate change' effects

ThwaitesTongue-600x423[1]Remember the wailing from Suzanne Goldenberg over the “collapse” of the Thwaites glacier blaming man-made CO2 effects and the smackdown given to the claim on WUWT?

Well, never mind. From the University of Texas at Austin  and the “you can stop your wailing now” department, comes this really, really, inconvenient truth.

Researchers find major West Antarctic glacier melting from geothermal sources

AUSTIN, Texas — Thwaites Glacier, the large, rapidly changing outlet of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, is not only being eroded by the ocean, it’s being melted from below by geothermal heat, researchers at the Institute for Geophysics at The University of Texas at Austin (UTIG) report in the current edition of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

The findings significantly change the understanding of conditions beneath the West Antarctic Ice Sheet where accurate information has previously been unobtainable.

The Thwaites Glacier has been the focus of considerable attention in recent weeks as other groups of researchers found the glacier is on the way to collapse, but more data and computer modeling are needed to determine when the collapse will begin in earnest and at what rate the sea level will increase as it proceeds. The new observations by UTIG will greatly inform these ice sheet modeling efforts.

Using radar techniques to map how water flows under ice sheets, UTIG researchers were able to estimate ice melting rates and thus identify significant sources of geothermal heat under Thwaites Glacier. They found these sources are distributed over a wider area and are much hotter than previously assumed.

The geothermal heat contributed significantly to melting of the underside of the glacier, and it might be a key factor in allowing the ice sheet to slide, affecting the ice sheet’s stability and its contribution to future sea level rise.

The cause of the variable distribution of heat beneath the glacier is thought to be the movement of magma and associated volcanic activity arising from the rifting of the Earth’s crust beneath the West Antarctic Ice Sheet.

Knowledge of the heat distribution beneath Thwaites Glacier is crucial information that enables ice sheet modelers to more accurately predict the response of the glacier to the presence of a warming ocean.

Until now, scientists had been unable to measure the strength or location of heat flow under the glacier. Current ice sheet models have assumed that heat flow under the glacier is uniform like a pancake griddle with even heat distribution across the bottom of the ice.

The findings of lead author Dusty Schroeder and his colleagues show that the glacier sits on something more like a multi-burner stovetop with burners putting out heat at different levels at different locations.

“It’s the most complex thermal environment you might imagine,” said co-author Don Blankenship, a senior research scientist at UTIG and Schroeder’s Ph.D. adviser. “And then you plop the most critical dynamically unstable ice sheet on planet Earth in the middle of this thing, and then you try to model it. It’s virtually impossible.”

That’s why, he said, getting a handle on the distribution of geothermal heat flow under the ice sheet has been considered essential for understanding it.

Gathering knowledge about Thwaites Glacier is crucial to understanding what might happen to the West Antarctic Ice Sheet. An outlet glacier the size of Florida in the Amundsen Sea Embayment, it is up to 4,000 meters thick and is considered a key question mark in making projections of global sea level rise.

The glacier is retreating in the face of the warming ocean and is thought to be unstable because its interior lies more than two kilometers below sea level while, at the coast, the bottom of the glacier is quite shallow.

Because its interior connects to the vast portion of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet that lies deeply below sea level, the glacier is considered a gateway to the majority of West Antarctica’s potential sea level contribution.

The collapse of the Thwaites Glacier would cause an increase of global sea level of between 1 and 2 meters, with the potential for more than twice that from the entire West Antarctic Ice Sheet.

The UTIG researchers had previously used ice-penetrating airborne radar sounding data to image two vast interacting subglacial water systems under Thwaites Glacier. The results from this earlier work on water systems (also published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences) formed the foundation for the new work, which used the distribution of water beneath the glacier to determine the levels and locations of heat flow.

In each case, Schroeder, who received his Ph.D. in May, used techniques he had developed to pull information out of data collected by the radar developed at UTIG.

According to his findings, the minimum average geothermal heat flow beneath Thwaites Glacier is about 100 milliwatts per square meter, with hotspots over 200 milliwatts per square meter. For comparison, the average heat flow of the Earth’s continents is less than 65 milliwatts per square meter.

The presence of water and heat present researchers with significant challenges.

“The combination of variable subglacial geothermal heat flow and the interacting subglacial water system could threaten the stability of Thwaites Glacier in ways that we never before imagined,” Schroeder said.

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Man Bearpig
June 10, 2014 1:03 am

RexAlan says:
June 10, 2014 at 12:23 am
I think some of you guys may find this interesting.
http://io9.com/our-clearest-view-yet-of-antarctica-stripped-of-all-its-511636795
—————–
Wouldn’t it all be under water ?

RexAlan
June 10, 2014 1:42 am

No, they show out to the edge of the continental shelf. Where the color changes from grey to a dirty brown color that is the ice shelf edge. The lightest brown color is above sea level.
There is a video at the bottom of the page that explains things better.

SandyInLimousin
June 10, 2014 2:45 am

Nick Stokes says:
June 9, 2014 at 7:53 pm
With things like geothermal, the natural question is, if it is having a big effect now, why not before?
Perhaps it’s a precursor to another Eyjafjallajokull ,Mount St Helens or even a Surtsey, Nishinoshima. or El Hierro who knows for sure?

Brendan Robinson
June 10, 2014 2:49 am

I wouldn’t believe a word from the University of Texas as they get massive funding by the Oil and gas industry.
http://www.dallasnews.com/news/state/headlines/20131122-texas-oil-boom-means-more-money-for-ut-am.ece

June 10, 2014 3:55 am

Bu-bu-but!!! Danny Glover says that is just mother earth expressing her anger over Global Warming, so it is STILL due to global warming!

June 10, 2014 4:52 am

I’ve always wondered how you can record melting and record cold temps at the same time.

Alan Robertson
June 10, 2014 5:53 am

Brendan Robinson says:
June 10, 2014 at 2:49 am
I wouldn’t believe a word from the University of Texas as they get massive funding by the Oil and gas industry.
http://www.dallasnews.com/news/state/headlines/20131122-texas-oil-boom-means-more-money-for-ut-am.ece
________________
Do you want to go through life just operating in a state of belief, or disbelief, or do you want to find out the truth of things, for yourself? Do you “believe” all of the government proclamations? Do you believe all of those studies which were paid for by the government and which support the government’s position?
Do you believe that your opinion matters in the world of science?

June 10, 2014 5:55 am

oops maybe he should delayed this..Retired UMaine Professor Hughes Makes Early Prediction of West Antarctic Ice Sheet Collapse
http://climatechange.umaine.edu/
Is It Too Late to Save Our Cities From Sea-Level Rise?
http://climatechange.umaine.edu/news/article/2014/06/09/retired_umaine_professor_hughes_makes_early_prediction_of_west_antarctic_ice_sheet_collapse

Latitude
June 10, 2014 5:56 am

its interior lies more than two kilometers below sea level…
Global warming causes glaciers to defy gravity……

June 10, 2014 5:57 am

This has to do with Antarctica so I will post it here. Man Made Warming of Antarctica???
https://twitter.com/NJSnowFan/status/476344491373527040/photo/1

Alan Robertson
June 10, 2014 5:59 am

Brendan Robinson says:
June 10, 2014 at 2:49 am
I wouldn’t believe a word from the University of Texas as they get massive funding by the Oil and gas industry.
__________________
Do you believe the Sierra Club? They received $25,000,000 from Chesapeake Energy to oppose the coal industry.

Andy_E
June 10, 2014 6:00 am

Well if they plug this extra heat source into their models and rerun them they will probably find that this glacier actually melted 2000 years ago and that the ice we think we see melting now is just a figment of our CO2 poisoned imagination.
Because of course models always trump reality.
Not sure if I need a sarc tag.

June 10, 2014 6:07 am

Leo Geiger says:
June 9, 2014 at 7:12 pm
Remember the first sentence of the press release being quoted? Maybe the selective highlighting is needed here:
”Thwaites Glacier, the large, rapidly changing outlet of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, is not only being eroded by the ocean,..”
Leo, the ocean erodes along a linear strip (around the whole world even) and in this case the geothermal energy is also warming the ocean doing the eroding- did you miss that? What happens below is a three dimensional thing. No we didn’t ignore this factor but the article was about the largest newsworthy effect. Man I do have to congratulate you, though. These are highly honed CAGW guerrilla tactics on display. I’m sure this kind of stuff is now on academia curricula.

Alan Robertson
June 10, 2014 6:09 am

Chris Beal (@NJSnowFan) says:
June 10, 2014 at 5:57 am
This has to do with Antarctica so I will post it here. Man Made Warming of Antarctica???
________________________
Chris,
Check out the Sea Ice page on the sidebar: Antarctic temp graphs show decline for decades and Antarctic sea ice is over 1.37 Million Km2 greater than the 30 year average.

June 10, 2014 6:19 am

rogerthesurf says:
June 9, 2014 at 7:22 pm
”…but -if- this glacial is largely below sea level, and ice having a larger volume compared with water, will the complete melting of this glacier not tend to make the sea level fall?
At least the below sea level part will have an effect on how much contribution it makes to sea level change.”
Not a bad point, although the glacier is grounded. If its 4000m thick and in a 2000m deep basin, then it isn’t near being afloat (if it were afloat, about 10% would be sticking above the water). However, if it is going to take 1000s of years to melt, then glacial rebound will raise the land surface under the glacier gradually while causing the ocean around it to deepen (conservation of mass). Indeed, if the whole Antarctic ice sheet were to melt at rates equal to isostatic rebound, it seems to me there would be no change in sea level at all. If however a big slab should slide off into the sea, or is should otherwise melt quickly, we would have an abrupt rise in sea level.

June 10, 2014 6:29 am

Another thought. The terrific weight of the ice that presses the land surface down should tend to force the magma seaward. There are volcanoes on the sea floor in this area. Any fracturing of the rocks (fault zone) under the glacier would however result in magma directed into the ice. There are a number of upside down wash basin-shaped volcanoes known as tuyas in Iceland, northern British Columbia and in a few other places that formed as a result of sub ice eruption.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuya

Resourceguy
June 10, 2014 6:34 am

See Iceland if there are additional questions.

June 10, 2014 6:52 am

Brendan Robinson says:
June 10, 2014 at 2:49 am
“I wouldn’t believe a word from the University of Texas as they get massive funding by the Oil and gas industry.”
Don’t worry Brendan, Chevron probably has it wired, since they are the biggest Geothermal energy producer in the world. When we are all forced to flee our continents due to global warming, we can settle in Antarctica and let Chevron supply us with the readily available green energy.

jaffa
June 10, 2014 7:28 am

fools – it’s not geothermal heat, it’s the hidden heat in the deep ocean. That’s why no-one can find it – it actually hid in the ice and the ice melted. Mystery solved.

mickeycz2014
June 10, 2014 7:44 am

I remember at least a decade ago that there was ice core sampling done in Antarctica and they found a slush at the bottom of the glacier, which was on a slope, and gravity being what it is the glacier tended to slide seaward because ……………………
It was on a slippery slope!
(That was fun)

Taphonomic
June 10, 2014 8:13 am

Oh no, Al Gore’s several million degrees interior of the earth is beginning to break through to the surface.
Gorebull warming strikes again!

markx
June 10, 2014 8:14 am

Nick Stokes says: June 9, 2014 at 7:53 pm
…With things like geothermal, the natural question is, if it is having a big effect now, why not before?…
I do believe that is exactly what the citizens of Pompeii said!

June 10, 2014 8:15 am

this layman commented a few years ago that it was most likely undersea volcanic activity causing any melting……..since the air temp rarely goes above freezing there, it had to be something other than air warming.

richard verney
June 10, 2014 8:25 am

Nick Stokes says:
June 9, 2014 at 7:53 pm
“…With things like geothermal, the natural question is, if it is having a big effect now, why not before?
///////////////////////////////
Nick
Bill answers your question:-
Bill Illis says:
June 9, 2014 at 7:56 pm
Most glaciers are melting from below through geothermal heat, either volcanic or simple bedrock temperatures….That is why the oldest ice on Antarctica is only 800,000 years old yet the location where this old ice formed has been glaciated for over 42 million years….”
///////
It has happened before, Heck that is the reason why the ice of 42 million years ago is no longer there, Ditto the ice of 41 million years ago, 40 million years ago, 39 million years ago, 38 million years ago etc etc. It has all calved away.
The planet is in constant flux. We are merely witnessing nothing more extraordinary than business as usual.

Leo Geiger
June 10, 2014 9:12 am

Gary Pearse says: Leo, the ocean erodes along a linear strip (around the whole world even) and in this case the geothermal energy is also warming the ocean doing the eroding- did you miss that?
Where in the press release or the paper itself does it suggest the geothermal energy is warming the ocean and therefore causing grounding line retreat (“doing the eroding”)? It doesn’t.
That is the issue. There is what the research says, and then there is what you think it says and how it gets portrayed here. Those two things are seldom the same.

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