Another Year, Another Nail in the CAGW Coffin (Now Includes December Data)

WoodForTrees.org – Paul Clark – Click the pic to view at source

Image Credit: WoodForTrees.org

Guest Post By Werner Brozek, Edited By Just The Facts

CAGW refers to Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming. Few people doubt that humans have some influence on climate, however the big debate is whether or not we are causing enough warming to have catastrophic consequences decades from now. The best evidence thus far is that climate goes in numerous different cycles and that whatever influence humans have, is minimal. Certainly, what happened, and what did not happen, in 2013, does not justify any alarm.

The above graph illustrates the change over the past year for the length of the period of no warming for RSS. At the end of 2012, the Pause was for a period of 194 months. By the end of 2013, this Pause had increased by 14 months to 208 months, namely the 12 months in 2013 and an additional 2 months further back in 1996. Of course, Santer’s 17 years was reached when 204 months of no warming was reached in October. For the year 2013, RSS ranks it as the 10th warmest year.

Since warming did not happen in 2013, what about climate change? Let us consider the polar vortex event at the beginning of January that led to the greatest cold in the United States in 20 years. According to RSS, 8 of the Decembers prior to 2013 were warmer than that of 2013. So neither a warm 2013 nor a warm December can be blamed for the polar vortex activity. Extra CO2 could potentially cause some things to happen via the mechanism of an initial warming. But if warming has not been occurring, then there is no way that man-made CO2 can be blamed.

At this time, I would like to address another topic that sometimes comes up. Occasionally, the view is expressed that the anomalies should not be given to more digits than can be justified. So if temperatures are recorded to the nearest 1/10 degree, the anomalies should also be to the nearest 1/10 degree instead of to the nearest 1/1000 degree for example. I do not consider this a big deal and I would like to illustrate it with a sports analogy. Suppose we were to compare three different soccer or hockey teams and decided that the average number of goals per game is one thing to look at. Suppose that over 1000 games, Team A made 520 goals, Team B made 1040 goals and Team C made 1460 goals. The goals per game would be 0.52, 1.04 and 1.46. So Team B scored twice as many as Team A and Team C scored almost three times as many. However a “purist” would say that since we cannot have a hundredth of a goal, but only a whole number of goals, we need to round off all numbers to the nearest whole number. In that case, 0.52 and 1.04 and 1.46 would all get rounded to 1. As a result, the information is useless. In my opinion, the decimal places are certainly something to keep in the backs of our minds, but for me to change all numbers in the table on Section 3 to the nearest 1/10 C would be a waste of time and about as useful as rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Furthermore, to average 12 numbers after rounding them could give quite different results, depending on whether more numbers were rounded up or down.

Also, I use UAH version 5.5 since that is what WFT uses. Paul Clark might upgrade WTI to version 5.6 and HadCRUT4 if you drop a tip and a note in his Charity Tip Jar. In version 5.5, 2013 is ranked 7th. However version 5.6 has 2013 ranked 4th. In contrast, RSS for 2013 is ranked 10th. Let us assume that the error bars for each data set is +/- 0.1 C. The value of the anomaly for UAH version 5.6 was 0.236. What would be the range of ranks if we assumed the range in the anomaly at the 95% level was from 0.136 to 0.336? The answer is from 3rd to 10th. Now let us do the same for RSS. The RSS average anomaly for 2013 was 0.218. Numbers from 0.118 to 0.318 gives a rank range of 5th to 14th. If we only used UAH version 5.6 and RSS, it would seem that the “real” rank for the satellite data set is 7th or 8th. Do you agree?

In the six data sets I am analyzing, the ranks for 2013 range from 6th to 10th. This really is nothing for the warmists to celebrate. While it varies slightly between different data sets, a rank of about 8 means that the increase in the period of no warming plods along a month at a time. In order to really make a difference in the rankings and significantly shorten the period of no warming, the new rankings need to be 5 or less.

On the table in Section 3, I give the ranks for the six data sets for 2012 in row 1. As it turns out, the average anomaly for each set for 2013 (row 21) was warmer than for 2012 (row 2). So since 2013 was warmer than 2012 and with the year now being over, each 2012 ranking has been updated making it one higher than stated in earlier posts.

It is possible that some rankings in row 22 could still change as adjustments are made to 2013 data in future months. In particular, GISS is in 7th place by only a difference of 0.002.

In Section 2, I give the times for which there has been no statistically significant warming on 5 of the data sets. At this point, I do not want to get into a discussion about NOAA’s statement that starts with “The simulations rule out (at the 95% level) zero trends for intervals of 15 yr or more…”. But I merely wish to point out that NOAA and climate science in general feel that being 95% confident whether or not warming is occurring over a certain interval has a certain amount of significance. I have used the program by Nick Stokes available on his moyhu.blogspot.com to come up with those time periods. The time periods with no statistically significant warming varies from 16 years to 21 years on the five data sets. These times vary, but they are generally at least four years longer than the period for a slope of 0. In my last post, there were questions about the 95% significance. Nick Stokes has agreed to address all questions related to this aspect of the analysis.

In the sections below, we will present you with the latest facts. The information will be presented in three sections and an appendix. The first section will show for how long there has been no warming on several data sets. The second section will show for how long there has been no statistically significant warming on several data sets. The third section will show how 2013 compares with 2012 and the warmest years and months on record so far. The appendix will illustrate sections 1 and 2 in a different way. Graphs and a table will be used to illustrate the data.

Section 1:

This analysis uses the latest month for which data is available on WoodForTrees.com (WFT). All of the data on WFT is also available at the specific sources as outlined below. We start with the present date and go to the furthest month in the past where the slope is a least slightly negative. So if the slope from September is 4 x 10^-4 but it is – 4 x 10^-4 from October, we give the time from October so no one can accuse us of being less than honest if we say the slope is flat from a certain month.

On all data sets below, the different times for a slope that is at least very slightly negative ranges from 9 years and 3 months to 17 years and 4 months.

1. For GISS, the slope is flat since July 2001 or 12 years, 6 months. (goes to December)

2. For Hadcrut3, the slope is flat since July 1997 or 16 years, 6 months. (goes to December)

3. For a combination of GISS, Hadcrut3, UAH and RSS, the slope is flat since December 2000 or 13 years, 1 month. (goes to December)

4. For Hadcrut4, the slope is flat since December 2000 or 13 years, 1 month. (goes to December)

5. For Hadsst3, the slope is flat since December 2000 or 13 years, 1 month. (goes to December)

6. For UAH, the slope is flat since October 2004 or 9 years, 3 months. (goes to December using version 5.5)

7. For RSS, the slope is flat since September 1996 or 17 years, 4 months (goes to December). So RSS has passed Ben Santer’s 17 years.

The next graph shows just the lines to illustrate the above. Think of it as a sideways bar graph where the lengths of the lines indicate the relative times where the slope is 0. In addition, the sloped wiggly line shows how CO2 has increased over this period.

WoodForTrees.org – Paul Clark – Click the pic to view at source

When two things are plotted as I have done, the left only shows a temperature anomaly.

The actual numbers are meaningless since all slopes are essentially zero and the position of each line is merely a reflection of the base period from which anomalies are taken for each set. No numbers are given for CO2. Some have asked that the log of the concentration of CO2 be plotted. However WFT does not give this option. The upward sloping CO2 line only shows that while CO2 has been going up over the last 17 years, the temperatures have been flat for varying periods on various data sets.

The next graph shows the above, but this time, the actual plotted points are shown along with the slope lines and the CO2 is omitted:

WoodForTrees.org – Paul Clark – Click the pic to view at source

Section 2:

For this analysis, data was retrieved from Nick Stokes’ Trendviewer available on his website moyhu.blogspot.com. This analysis indicates for how long there has not been statistically significant warming according to Nick’s criteria. Data go to their latest update for each set. In every case, note that the lower error bar is negative so a slope of 0 cannot be ruled out from the month indicated.

On several different data sets, there has been no statistically significant warming for between 16 and 21 years.

The details for several sets are below.

For UAH: Since January 1996: CI from -0.008 to 2.437

For RSS: Since November 1992: CI from -0.018 to 1.936

For Hadcrut4: Since September 1996: CI from -0.003 to 1.316

For Hadsst3: Since June 1993: CI from -0.009 to 1.793

For GISS: Since June 1997: CI from -0.004 to 1.276

Section 3:

This section shows data about 2013 and other information in the form of a table. The table shows the six data sources along the top and other places so they should be visible at all times. The sources are UAH, RSS, Hadcrut4, Hadcrut3, Hadsst3, and GISS. Down the column, are the following:

1. 12ra: This is the final new ranking for 2012 on each data set after the 2013 ranking has been accounted for.

2. 12a: Here I give the average anomaly for 2012.

3. year: This indicates the warmest year on record so far for that particular data set. Note that two of the data sets have 2010 as the warmest year and four have 1998 as the warmest year.

4. ano: This is the average of the monthly anomalies of the warmest year just above.

5. mon: This is the month where that particular data set showed the highest anomaly. The months are identified by the first three letters of the month and the last two numbers of the year.

6. ano: This is the anomaly of the month just above.

7. y/m: This is the longest period of time where the slope is not positive given in years/months. So 16/2 means that for 16 years and 2 months the slope is essentially 0.

9. Jan: This is the January, 2013, anomaly for that particular data set.

10. Feb: This is the February, 2013, anomaly for that particular data set, etc.

21. ave: This is the average anomaly of all months to date taken by adding all numbers and dividing by the number of months. However if the data set itself gives that average, I may use their number. Sometimes the number in the third decimal place differs slightly, presumably due to all months not having the same number of days.

22. rnk: This is the final rank for each particular data set for 2013. In cases where two numbers are close, future adjustments may change things. For example GISS could easily end up in 6th from 7th. Due to different base periods, the rank is more meaningful than the average anomaly.

Source UAH RSS Had4 Had3 Sst3 GISS
1. 12ra 10th 12th 10th 11th 10th 10th
2. 12a 0.161 0.192 0.448 0.403 0.346 0.58
3. year 1998 1998 2010 1998 1998 2010
4. ano 0.419 0.55 0.547 0.548 0.416 0.67
5. mon Apr98 Apr98 Jan07 Feb98 Jul98 Jan07
6. ano 0.662 0.857 0.829 0.756 0.526 0.94
7. y/m 9/3 17/4 13/1 16/6 13/1 12/6
Source UAH RSS Had4 Had3 Sst3 GISS
9. Jan 0.504 0.439 0.450 0.392 0.292 0.63
10.Feb 0.175 0.192 0.479 0.436 0.309 0.52
11.Mar 0.183 0.203 0.405 0.392 0.287 0.60
12.Apr 0.103 0.217 0.427 0.404 0.364 0.48
13.May 0.077 0.138 0.498 0.480 0.382 0.57
14.Jun 0.269 0.291 0.457 0.431 0.314 0.61
15.Jul 0.118 0.221 0.520 0.483 0.479 0.53
16.Aug 0.122 0.166 0.528 0.496 0.483 0.61
17.Sep 0.294 0.256 0.532 0.517 0.457 0.74
18.Oct 0.227 0.207 0.478 0.446 0.391 0.61
19.Nov 0.111 0.131 0.593 0.576 0.424 0.78
20.Dec 0.177 0.158 0.489 0.475 0.352 0.60
Source UAH RSS Had4 Had3 Sst3 GISS
21.ave 0.197 0.218 0.486 0.461 0.376 0.61
22.rnk 7th 10th 8th 6th 6th 7th

If you wish to verify all of the latest anomalies, go to the following:

For UAH, version 5.5 was used since that is what WFT used.

http://vortex.nsstc.uah.edu/public/msu/t2lt/tltglhmam_5.5.txt

For RSS, see: ftp://ftp.ssmi.com/msu/monthly_time_series/rss_monthly_msu_amsu_channel_tlt_anomalies_land_and_ocean_v03_3.txt

For HadCRUT4, see: http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcrut4/data/current/time_series/HadCRUT.4.2.0.0.monthly_ns_avg.txt

For HadCRUT3, see: http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/data/temperature/HadCRUT3-gl.dat

For HadSST3, see: http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/data/temperature/HadSST3-gl.dat

For GISS, see: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/tabledata_v3/GLB.Ts+dSST.txt

To see all points since January 2013 in the form of a graph, see the WFT graph below:

WoodForTrees.org – Paul Clark – Click the pic to view at source

As you can see, all lines have been offset so they all start at the same place in January.

Appendix:

In this section, we are summarizing data for each set separately.

RSS

The slope is flat since September 1996 or 17 years, 4 months. (goes to December) So RSS has passed Ben Santer’s 17 years.

For RSS: There is no statistically significant warming since November 1992: CI from -0.018 to 1.936.

The RSS average anomaly for 2013 is 0.218. This would rank it in 10th place. 1998 was the warmest at 0.55. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in April of 1998 when it reached 0.857. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.192 and it is now ranked 12th.

UAH

The slope is flat since October 2004 or 9 years, 3 months. (goes to December using version 5.5)

For UAH: There is no statistically significant warming since January 1996: CI from -0.008 to 2.437.

The UAH average anomaly for 2013 is 0.197. This would rank it 7th. 1998 was the warmest at 0.419. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in April of 1998 when it reached 0.662. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.161 and it is now ranked 10th.

Hadcrut4

The slope is flat since December 2000 or 13 years and 1 month. (goes to December)

For Hadcrut4: There is no statistically significant warming since September 1996: CI from -0.003 to 1.316.

The Hadcrut4 average anomaly for 2013 is 0.486. This would rank it 8th. 2010 was the warmest at 0.547. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in January of 2007 when it reached 0.829. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.448 and it is now ranked 10th.

Hadcrut3

The slope is flat since July 1997 or 16 years, 6 months. (goes to December)

The Hadcrut3 average anomaly for 2013 is 0.461. This would rank it 6th. 1998 was the warmest at 0.548. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in February of 1998 when it reached 0.756. One has to go back to the 1940s to find the previous time that a Hadcrut3 record was not beaten in 10 years or less. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.403 and it is now ranked 11th.

Hadsst3

For Hadsst3, the slope is flat since December 2000 or 13 years and 1 month. (goes to December).

For Hadsst3: There is no statistically significant warming since June 1993: CI from -0.009 to 1.793.

The Hadsst3 average anomaly for 2013 is 0.376. This would rank it 6th. 1998 was the warmest at 0.416. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in July of 1998 when it reached 0.526. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.346 and it is now ranked 10th.

GISS

The slope is flat since July 2001 or 12 years, 6 months. (goes to December)

For GISS: There is no statistically significant warming since June 1997: CI from -0.004 to 1.276.

The GISS average anomaly for 2013 is 0.61. This would rank it as 7th. 2010 was the warmest at 0.67. The highest ever monthly anomaly was in January of 2007 when it reached 0.94. The anomaly in 2012 was 0.58 and it is now ranked 10th.

Conclusion:

Everything seemed to go wrong for the warmists this year. The temperatures did not go up; a ship got stuck in huge ice in the Antarctic during their summer; north polar ice made a big come back; and climate change happenings were not significantly different from what can be expected. Can anyone point to anything for warmists to hang their hat on, so to speak, in 2013?

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January 25, 2014 4:25 pm

richardscourtney says:
“James Abbott:
OK. I am now convinced you are trolling”
Yes, this seemed obvious from the start. I like it when misinformed warmists provide opportunities for us to show them why they are wrong.
Why is it that warmists can’t back up any of their positions with empirical data and legit science?

John Finn
January 25, 2014 4:30 pm

Re: Divergence between UAH & RSS
Roy Spencer has already commented on this some time ago. In his blog he writes

Anyway, my UAH cohort and boss John Christy, who does the detailed matching between satellites, is pretty convinced that the RSS data is undergoing spurious cooling because RSS is still using the old NOAA-15 satellite which has a decaying orbit, to which they are then applying a diurnal cycle drift correction based upon a climate model, which does not quite match reality. We have not used NOAA-15 for trend information in years…we use the NASA Aqua AMSU, since that satellite carries extra fuel to maintain a precise orbit.

It would be somewhat ironic if AGW (not CAGW) sceptics preferred to use data which relied on corrections based on climate models

January 25, 2014 4:31 pm

@Just The Facts
LOL at damning a lake.
As a Cal native I was taken back a bit when I had business in Cleveland once and was shown by someone the “border” of a lake effect snow dump. On one block the snow was 3 inches deep and a few blocks over it was a couple of feet. Thus my life has been absent of yearnings to move to Cleveland.

zootcadillac
January 25, 2014 4:32 pm

@NotTheAussiePhilM
I think that you are making a common mistake when wishing to see ‘cherry picking’ in a person’s argument. I have said this many times but I think it bears repeating.
If you set out to determine for how long a period of time the rate of temperature change has remained statistically significant then you must go to the data.
It is only the data that will yield your answer. It’s not possible to ‘cherry pick’ a start date. The start date is the date closest to today that you have reliable data for. Then you work backwards.
At the point at which the data show that your theory starts to fail, i.e. the slope starts to rise rather than remain flat, then that is your end point.
You seem to think that it’s backwards. Not the case. The data can’t lie if you treat them correctly.
As for James Abbott. When the hypothesis is that Carbon Dioxide in the atmosphere and specifically the anthropogenic portion of that is the main driver of surface and atmospheric temperature then there must be a pint at which, when looking at the observations, you accept that this is false. Constantly adding new and invisible, unquantifiable forcings to suggest that warming is happening but it remains elusively hidden because of, well, we just don’t know, strikes me as ridiculous. I much prefer that Occam’s razor has the answer.
And I think you will find that most reasonable skeptics take no issue with the absorbtion properties of CO2 in relation to long and short-wave radiation but that we take issue that it has yet to be quantified and possibly might never be and even more that the anthropogenic component has a negligible effect on temperatures. I also think that not too many are predicting ice ages but that we could find some agreement that we have possibly reached the top of a warming phase, similar in scope to the previously well documented ( despite efforts by the team to disappear them from the record ) warming periods in history and that given what we understand about these natural cycles, indications are that temperatures may well be heading downwards for a period of time.
I think what most skeptics will agree upon is that there is not a damned thing that man can do to affect those future temperatures, either up or down. Only time will tell. I’m just saddened that i probably won’t be around when the alarmists finally accept that they were wrong.

zootcadillac
January 25, 2014 4:39 pm

slight change to my post above. “statistically significant” should of course read “statistically insignificant,
And I thank our friend richardscourtney for continuing to always say things in a much better way than I am able to convey. And for sticking it out at this late hour for us Brits. I imagine his frustration with the reasoning being thrown his way might cut that short soon. Ah well.

zootcadillac
January 25, 2014 4:40 pm

damn, I told you it was late. Please see through my formatting errors. I don’t have the will to fix and repeat.

richardscourtney
January 25, 2014 4:41 pm

James Abbott:
I take severe exception to your comment to me at January 25, 2014 at 4:24 pm which says

Shame you could not admit you got it wrong first time but in any case its still wrong as you are ignoring feedback, particularly related to the oceans in terms of thermal inertia and the feedback from CO2 release from warming.

That is pure trolling at its worst!
I did NOT “get it wrong”. I deliberately exaggerated the effect to demonstrate there is not a problem. Similarly, in the post you pretend to be replying, I deliberately exaggerated the calculation you said you wanted for the same reason.
I preempted your digression about feedbacks in my post to you at January 25, 2014 at 4:17 pm which is here .
Your side-track about “thermal inertia and the feedback from CO2 release from warming” is a real foot-in-your-mouth because it raises the issue of ‘committed warming’. I can give you chapter and verse on that by finding a previous post I made on it.
Suffice it to say that the previous IPCC Report (AR4) said that ‘committed warming’ would induce warming between years 2000 and 2020 at an average rate of 0.2°C per decade. That was an ambitious assertion because the AR4 was published in 2007 and there had been no globalwarming since 2000. There still has not. For that projection to become true global temperature has to rise from now to 2020 by more than it rose over the entire twentieth century.
Simply, the ‘committed warming’ has disappeared. Can you tell me if it has eloped with Trenberth’s missing heat?
Richard

richardscourtney
January 25, 2014 4:53 pm

James Abbot:
I look forward to your answer to my question which is

Simply, the ‘committed warming’ has disappeared. Can you tell me if it has eloped with Trenberth’s missing heat?

There is no urgency because I am about to retire as it is now nearing 1 am here. I will respond to your answer in the morning but not before.
Richard

James Abbott
January 25, 2014 4:54 pm

richardscourtney
You say
“Obviously, James Abbott, this science thing is hard for you to understand so allow me to introduce you to the Null Hypothesis.”
I have a science degree.
And you say
“In the case of climate science there is a hypothesis that increased greenhouse gases (GHGs, notably CO2) in the air will increase global temperature. There are good reasons to suppose this hypothesis may be true, but the Null Hypothesis says it must be assumed the GHG changes have no effect unless and until increased GHGs are observed to increase global temperature”
But temps have risen so the system is not static. By 0.6C in the past 40 years. Now its true there are many other forcing mechanisms, but the scientific conclusion – by qualified scientists – is that there is a high degree of probability that the observed warming is largely due to the rise in GHGs of which CO2 is the most important in the recent warming. So the NH is of limited help in this debate.
And you say
“The feedbacks in the climate system are negative”
No they are not – what are you talking about ? They can be +ve or -ve depending on what they are. Release of CO2 from warming oceans and reduced albedo in the northern polar regions due to melting ice (accepting that currently the south is not losing ice area) are positive feedbacks that amplify temperature increases.
And you say
“Empirical – n.b. not model-derived – determinations indicate climate sensitivity is less than 1.0°C for a doubling of atmospheric CO2 equivalent”
So how do you explain the planet being 8C colder when CO2 was half the current level ? As I asked wbrozek, lets see the science that backs that up – you must be able to produce a function between CO2 and T that demonstrates such a relationship, not wishful thinking. The scientific community has worked on this for decades (in fact over a century if you go back to when CO2 was first identified as a GHG) and the functional relationship they derive says that doubling pre-industrial CO2 will produce 2C or more of warming. There were papers published over 30 years ago coming to a similar conclusion.

Konrad
January 25, 2014 5:04 pm

Another nail in the coffin? Maybe.
The problem here is that the lid of the coffin is more nail than pine now, and you are still no closer to burying it or its festering contents.
Ultimately there is no way forward that involves claiming ManBearPig is not real while claiming ManBearPigglet is.

January 25, 2014 5:04 pm

The Logarithmic Effect of Carbon Dioxide
Guest post by David Archibald
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/03/08/the-logarithmic-effect-of-carbon-dioxide/

Gail Combs
January 25, 2014 5:09 pm

ThinkingScientist says:
January 25, 2014 at 12:21 pm
Is there a clear description/reference on how the statistical significance is computed. I am particularly interested in how you decide the effective number of samples, n.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
For land based measurement n=1.
You only take one temperature at one time in one spot. There is no duplication as can be done in a factory, therefore n has to be one because each measurement is unique.
She spins, ducks and runs…

Gail Combs
January 25, 2014 5:15 pm

NotTheAussiePhilM says:
January 25, 2014 at 12:30 pm
Isn’t that called ‘Cherry Picking’ where for each of 6 datasets you choose a different start point in order to give the result you want (i.e. Slope of zero)?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
No
The Warmists picked the falsification criteria we are just counting backward from the present.
1. Prof. Phil Jones saying in the Climategate emails – “Bottom line: the “no upward trend” has to continue for a total of 15 years before we get worried.” Also see: interview with Judith Curry and Phil Jones
2. Ben Santer in a 2011 paper “Our results show that temperature records of at least 17 years in length are required for identifying human effects on global-mean tropospheric temperature.” link
3. The NOAA falsification criterion is on page S23 of its 2008 report titled The State Of The Climate

ENSO-adjusted warming in the three surface temperature datasets over the last 2–25 yr continually lies within the 90% range of all similar-length ENSO-adjusted temperature changes in these simulations (Fig. 2.8b). Near-zero and even negative trends are common for intervals of a decade or less in the simulations, due to the model’s internal climate variability. The simulations rule out (at the 95% level) zero trends for intervals of 15 yr or more, [Maybe THAT is the 95% the IPCC is now talking about.] suggesting that an observed absence of warming of this duration is needed to create a discrepancy with the expected present-day warming rate.

So the falsification criteria is 15 years to 17 years. That is why we start at the present and count backwards. Once we hit 17 years The Goose is Cooked. Unfortunately the Goose seems to be a zombie and keeps rising from the dead.
Anyone have silver bullets, garlic and a wooden stake?

January 25, 2014 5:17 pm

zootcadillac says: January 25, 2014 at 4:32 pm
“The data can’t lie if you treat them correctly.”

Well, that means looking at all the data. That’s where the possibility of cherry picking comes in.
Suppose you are tossing a coin to see if it is fair. You toss five times – five heads. On the null hypothesis of fair, the chance is 1/32, or about 3%. So you’d reject. There is a sub-argument about whether you should look at the chance of all the same (H or T) which is 1/16. Even so, close to reject.
But suppose you toss ten times, and the last five are heads. That’s different, because you have more information. You have much less basis for rejecting the null, assuming there was no major bias in the first five.

TRBixler
January 25, 2014 5:24 pm

Warmists still control the White House and its EPA. Facts do not mean anything.

January 25, 2014 5:28 pm

James Abbott says:
January 25, 2014 at 4:54 pm
By 0.6C in the past 40 years.
 
Take a look at the following. The temperature went up 0.5 C from 1910 to 1950 and 0.7 C over the last 40 years. So how much affect does CO2 have? Could it have catastrophic consequences?
http://www.woodfortrees.org/plot/hadcrut4gl/from:1910/to:1950/trend/plot/hadcrut4gl/last:480/trend/plot/hadcrut4gl/from:1910

cnxtim
January 25, 2014 5:32 pm

Hi ‘Joe Friday’,
” There are so many more variables involved than just the sun” very true.
you can continue to list a never ending multitude of variables (but please, don’t insult both our intellects by including minute traces of CO2 in the upper atmosphere) SO in the words of Mick Dundee;
” that’s not a variable son, THIS is a variable”.
The rest are absolutely inconsequential whenever;
a sunspot larger than our planet erupts, the earth tilts on its axis, a huge blizzard shuts down an entire country, a monstrous cyclone smashes into land, an earthquake triggers a 200 km wide tsunami or a volcano erupts – AKA? “don’t sweat the small stuff”.
Mankind is really not that influential.

RACookPE1978
Editor
January 25, 2014 5:46 pm

A…
James Abbott says:
January 25, 2014 at 4:54 pm

Release of CO2 from warming oceans and reduced albedo in the northern polar regions due to melting ice (accepting that currently the south is not losing ice area) are positive feedbacks that amplify temperature increases.

Please show me, by calculations, exactly what this “reduced albedo” in the Arctic is supposed to do to the planet’s heat balance. The values I find in actual albedo measurements on the actual ice show that, reduced Arctic sea ice area from today’s sea ice extents at time of minimum sea ice in September and October actually cools the planet. Worse, increased Antarctic sea ice at any time of the sea DOES increasingly reflect the sun’s energy and DOES cool the planet. Your concerns are ice-backwards!
B…
James Abbott says:
January 25, 2014 at 4:54 pm

The scientific community has worked on this for decades (in fact over a century if you go back to when CO2 was first identified as a GHG) and the functional relationship they derive says that doubling pre-industrial CO2 will produce 2C or more of warming. There were papers published over 30 years ago coming to a similar conclusion..

I would remind you that, writing a “paper” thirty years ago does NOTHING to verify a “true” theory, nor does writing a paper thirty years validate a “false” theory. Rather, the FACTS and MEASUREMENTS between a paper written thirty years ago and today establish the veracity of that 30-year-old paper.
And, in the many years between the steadily increasing CO2 levels between 1935 and today have seen:
10 years of steady temperatures (1935-1945)
28 years of decreasing temperatures (1945 – 1965)
10 years of steady temperatures (1965 – 1975)
23 years of increasing temperatures (1975 – 1998)
and
17 years of steady temperatures (1998 – 2013 … And add perhaps 2014 for good measure; but one could go back to 1996, because today is no warmer globally than 1996 …) Papers in error are worthless. Well, no.
Your much-vaunted “papers” are., in fact, worth less than the toilet paper the wood they were printed on could have been used for ..)

Chad Wozniak
January 25, 2014 6:06 pm

Man’s activities do affect climate locally, witness the UHI effect and the effects on precipitation of reforestation. But globally – no way, Jose!
Some scientists are predicting the soon onset of another Little Ace Age, among them Habibullo Abdussamatov, of the Pulkovo Observatory in Russia, who bases his argument on the apparent descent of solar activity into another Maunder Minimum-type low period. While folks may argue about temperature data sets, there is a good deal of anecdotal observational evidence from both hemispheres since 2000 that this descent has already begun, from severe winters and poor summers in the UK to the record expansion of Antarctic ice.
Any argument that 2013 was anywhere among the 50 or so warmest years of the last century is ludicrous, given first-ever May snow in Little Rock, Arkansas , the chill that same month at the Bonn climate conference, the earliest-ever blizzard of October in the US Midwest, the record cold in many places in Australia and New Zealand as well as in the high Arctic and Antarctic.

Konrad
January 25, 2014 6:25 pm

@Gail
“Anyone have silver bullets, garlic and a wooden stake?”
No, but I have a M18 Claymore with silver shrapnel and a Weedwacker that has been dipped in holy water 😉
The problem here is lack of precision. It would be pink mist time for both ManBearPig and ManBearPigglet as well. Sadly many sceptics think the pigglet is cute….

Reply to  Konrad
January 27, 2014 9:30 am

@Konrad – a Weedwacker that has been dipped in holy water 😉
PLEASE do not tell us how you managed that feat! 😉

zootcadillac
January 25, 2014 7:00 pm

Stokes. I’m not sure I’m over keen on your analogy but I understand what you are saying. However in order to obtain more data in the instance I’m speaking of then we’d have to be able to see into the future.
Sadly we can’t, which is kind of why I ended with “time will tell”.

rogerknights
January 25, 2014 7:38 pm

James Abbott says:
January 25, 2014 at 3:39 pm

Mike Maguire
“Please clarify on your claim that many skeptics are predicting a new mini ice age”.

Try this
http://www.thegwpf.org/sun-gone-sleep-temperatures-plunge/

Those making the “new mini ice age” claim were not “skeptics” but solar physicists not (I presume) involved in the AGW debate.

Adam
January 25, 2014 7:41 pm

The babies are now crying that because you include the 1998 spike, it makes it appear that there is no trend in the following data when there is. We all know that is BS – because we have eyes! Anyway, please start to quote the slope beginning in 2000 just to shut up these cry babies.

January 25, 2014 7:46 pm

After reading his comments, I am beginning to think that James “I have a science degree” Abbott is nuts. His total lack of understanding of the non-effect of “carbon” is risible.
How many times does Abbott need to be asked where the non-existent global warming attributable to CO2 is, before he responds? Ignoring the question will not make it go away.
There is no difference between past global warming prior to the rise in CO2, compared with the current warming. Therefore, CO2 has no measurable effect at all. That is just common sense.
But some folks have their Belief, and common sense doesn’t apply to them.