Haigh Anxiety: a psycho-comedy of errors

Guest post by Alec Rawls

In an interview with NewScientist magazine, Imperial College professor of atmospheric physics Joanna Haigh scoffs at the idea that late 20th century warming could have been caused by the sun:

Haigh points out that the sun actually began dimming slightly in the mid-1980s, if we take an average over its 11-year cycle, so fewer GCRs should have been deflected from Earth and more Earth-cooling clouds should have formed. “If there were some way cosmic rays could be causing global climate change, it should have started getting colder after 1985.”

What she means is that the 20th century’s persistent high level of solar activity peaked in 1985. That is the estimate developed by Mike Lockwood and Claus Fröhlich. The actual peak was later (solar cycle 22, which ended in 1996, was stronger than cycle 21 by almost every measure) but set that aside. Who could possibly think that cooling should commence when forcings are at their peak, just because the very highest peak has been passed?

Haigh’s argument against solar warming was in response to my suggestion that one new sentence in the leaked Second Order Draft of AR5 is a “game changer.” That is the sentence where the authors admit strong evidence that some substantial mechanism of solar amplification must be at work. The only solar forcing in the IPCC’s computer models is Total Solar Irradiance so if some solar forcing beyond TSI is also at work then all their model results are wrong.

No, no, no, Haigh told the NewScientist, it is “the bloggers” who have it all wrong:

They’re misunderstanding, either deliberately or otherwise, what that sentence is meant to say.

Look whose accusing people of misunderstanding. This woman thinks that warming is driven, not by the level of the temperature forcing, but by the rate of change in the level of the forcing. When a forcing goes barely past its peak (solar cycle 22 nearly identical in magnitude to cycle 21), does that really create cooling? Haigh should try it at home: put a pot of water on a full burner for a minute then turn the burner down to medium high. Does she really think the pot will stop warming, or that it will actually start to cool?

“Deliberately or otherwise,” this is an astounding misunderstanding of the very most basic physics, and Haigh is not the only consensus scientist who is making this particular “mistake.” Hers is the stock answer that pretty much every “consensus” scientists gives when asked about the solar-warming hypothesis. I have collected examples from a dozen highly regarded scientists: Lockwood, Solanki, Forster, Muscheler, Benestad, and more. Not surprisingly, it turns out that they are all making some crucial unstated assumptions.

Solar warming and ocean equilibrium

To claim that the 20th century’s high level of solar forcing would only cause warming until some particular date such as 1970, or 1980, or 1987, one must be assuming that the oceans had equilibrated by that date to the ongoing high level of forcing. That’s just the definition of equilibrium. After a step up in forcing the system will continue to warm until equilibrium is reached.

When I asked these scientists if they were making an unstated assumption that the oceans must have equilibrated by 1980 say to whatever forcing effect high 20th century solar activity was having, almost all of them answered yes, each giving their own off-the-cuff rationale for this assumption, none of which stand up to the least bit of scrutiny. Isaac Held’s two-box model of ocean equilibration is better than Mike Lockwood’s one-box model, but just move to the next simplest model, a three-box model of ocean equilibration, and any idea that longer term forcing won’t cause longer term warming collapses.

The well mixed upper ocean layer (the top 100-200 meters) does equilibrate rapidly to a change in forcing, showing a response time of less than ten years, but that isn’t the end of the story. As the top layer warms up it transfers heat to the next deeper ocean layers. If the elevated forcing persists then these next deeper layers will continue to warm on the time scale of multiple decades to multiple centuries. This warming will reduce the temperature differential between the upper and deeper layers, causing there to be less and less heat loss over time from the upper to the deeper layers, causing the upper layer to continue to warm on the time scale of multiple decades to multiple centuries.

This accords with what we actually see. Since the 50 year absence of sunspots that coincided with the bottom of the Little Ice Age, 300 years of uneven warming have  coincided with an uneven rise in solar activity. Any claim that these three centuries of natural warming had to have ended by a particular 20th century date (never mind right when solar activity was at its peak), is at the very least highly speculative. To claim that we can be confident that this is what happened is borderline insane.

Or maybe it’s that other thing that Joanna Haigh insinuates about. Maybe there is an element of deliberateness to this “misunderstanding” where scads of PhD scientists all pretend that warming is driven by the rate of change of the temperature forcing, not the level of the forcing. How else to blame late 20th century warming on human activity? Some rationale has to be given for why it can’t have been caused by the high level of solar activity that was still raging. Aha, what if temperature were driven by the trend in the forcing rather than the level of the forcing? That would do it. Let’s say that one. Let’s pretend that even peak forcing will cause cooling as soon as the trend in the forcing turns down.

It’s one psycho-drama or the other: either Haigh’s insinuations about dishonesty are projection, accusing others of what she and her cohorts are actually doing, or she’s just dumber than a box of rocks.

Haigh also channels Steven Sherwood, pretending that the highlighted sentence is just about GCR-cloud

The draft report acknowledges substantial evidence for some mechanism of solar amplification and lists Henrick Svensmark’s GCR-cloud theory as an example of one possible such mechanism (7-43 of the SOD):

Many empirical relationships have been reported between GCR or cosmogenic isotope archives and some aspects of the climate system (e.g., Bond et al., 2001; Dengel et al., 2009; Ram and Stolz, 1999). The forcing from changes in total solar irradiance alone does not seem to account for these observations, implying the existence of an amplifying mechanism such as the hypothesized GCR-cloud link.

Haigh claims that the evidence about cloud formation being induced by cosmic rays points to a weak mechanism, then simply ignores the report’s admission of substantial evidence that some such mechanism must be at work:

Haigh says that if Rawls had read a bit further, he would have realised that the report goes on to largely dismiss the evidence that cosmic rays have a significant effect. “They conclude there’s very little evidence that it has any effect,” she says.

Rawls says that if Haigh had read the actual sentence itself, she would have realized that it isn’t about galactic cosmic rays, but only mentions GCR-cloud as one possible solar amplifier.

Aussie climatologist Steven Sherwood did the same thing, claiming (very prematurely) that the evidence does not support GCR-cloud as a substantial mechanism of solar amplification, then pretending away the report’s admission of clear evidence that some substantial such mechanism is at work:

He says the idea that the chapter he authored confirms a greater role for solar and other cosmic rays in global warming is “ridiculous”.

“I’m sure you could go and read those paragraphs yourself and the summary of it and see that we conclude exactly the opposite – that this cosmic ray effect that the paragraph is discussing appears to be negligible,” he told PM.

As JoNova and I blogged last weekend, this ploy inverts the scientific method, using theory (dissatisfaction with one particular theory of solar amplification) as an excuse for ignoring the evidence for some mechanism of solar amplification. Using theory to dismiss evidence is pure, definitional anti-science. Unfortunately, NewScientist gives this slick anti-scientist the last word:

“The most interesting aspect of this little event is it reveals how deeply in denial the climate deniers are,” says Steven Sherwood of the University of New South Wales in Sydney, Australia – one of the lead authors of the chapter in question. “If they can look at a short section of a report and walk away believing it says the opposite of what it actually says, and if this spin can be uncritically echoed by very influential blogs, imagine how wildly they are misinterpreting the scientific evidence.”

Sherwood and Haigh are flat lying to the public about what a simple single sentence says, pretending the admission of strong evidence for some substantial mechanism of enhanced solar forcing was never made, then trusting sympathetic reporters and editors not to call them on it. This is why the report had to be made public. After my submitted comments showed how thoroughly the new sentence undercuts the entire report it was obvious that the consensoids who run the IPCC would take the sentence right back out, and here Sherwood and Haigh are already trying to do exactly that.

Too late, anti-scientists. Your humbug is on display for the whole world to see.

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lgl
December 22, 2012 1:32 pm

Leif
“peak warming ca. AD 950–1050” does not mean the MWP ended in 1050, what’s your source for such claim?
We have been through this before. The drop around 1100 was caused by 5 VEI5 eruptions, but it didn’t end the MWP. Temperature was still at ~1900-level.

December 22, 2012 1:42 pm

lsvalgaard says:
December 22, 2012 at 12:53 pm
………….
No usual objections from Svalgaard of Stanford !
In that case the North Atlantic’s Natural Variability has to be a must read for all the AGWs aficionados and skeptics alike
http://www.vukcevic.talktalk.net/NaturalVariability.htm
Dr. Svalgaard inquires
At the South Pole, you claim…
I’ve started from the North working my way to the South, eventually will get there too.
Looking at the circumpolar temperature wave and its possible link to the geomagnetic oscillations; it appears to be the second harmonic (twice the frequency) from Jackson-Bloxham data, which is a bit odd.
http://www.vukcevic.talktalk.net/TMC1.htm

December 22, 2012 1:48 pm

lgl says:
December 22, 2012 at 1:32 pm
We have been through this before.
And you are as wrong as ever.
vukcevic says:
December 22, 2012 at 1:42 pm
In that case the North Atlantic’s Natural Variability has to be a must read
DK-effect strikes again.
it appears to be the second harmonic (twice the frequency) from Jackson-Bloxham data, which is a bit odd
Spurious correlations eventually turn up ‘odd’.

Carter, David
December 22, 2012 1:55 pm

[snip – quoting potholer54 is not only off-topic, but irrelevant. Good try at ducking the issue though – Anthony]
How is potholer irrelevant? Look at who is try to duck the issue now? Why does potholer frighten you so much? I can only guess. Is it because he busted Monckton?
REPLY: Nope, its because A, it is irrelevant to this thread, B, he’s been given a full right of response here to Monckton http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/01/11/monckton-responds-to-potholer54/ making it old news, and C, your comment history here shows that every time you get into a difficult discussion that doesn’t go your way you throw this out instead of actually debating the topic at hand.
For all I know, “Carter, David” is just another fake name for “potholer54”, since both are from England and that’s where your comments originate from. So far, you’ve demonstrated no integrity, only noisy denigration in place of real debate.
So, I don’t let you get away with it. Be as upset as you wish, and Merry Christmas. – Anthony

Shawnhet
December 22, 2012 2:11 pm

Leif:”It was not about TSI itself being increased but the effect of TSI. ‘In tandem’ means then in addition to, not an ‘amplification’ of the original TSI effect.”
There is no distinction here to be drawn. Check out the IPCC quote at the top of the page. Quite clearly Bond and the other papers are talking about amplifications, Bond *specifically* talks about one and the IPCC accepts that the GCR-cloud link would be (were it true) one mechanism that could account for such an *amplification*. I don’t know what point you are trying to argue, but you are wrong about this.
“Note the section which states the variations are coherent with the estimates of solar variability.
In ‘sections’, but not overall.
You can always find ‘sections’ where wiggles agree with any two time series. The image remains of a much less clear correlation than in Bond et al. 2001 [perhaps IPCC should not even reference Bond 2001].”
That is not how I read the abstract but as I said previously I do not have access to the paper. I think it is more likely that outside of the recent Holocene we do not have good enough data to make the same sorts of claims for older periods that we do for recent periods. My understanding is that we do not have finegrained enough proxies for that. It would be pretty peculiar to state that recent timeframes were consistent with solar driven effects when such solar driven effects were contra-indicated in your own study.
Cheers, 🙂

December 22, 2012 2:19 pm

Shawnhet says:
December 22, 2012 at 2:11 pm
Quite clearly Bond and the other papers are talking about amplifications, Bond *specifically* talks about one and the IPCC accepts that the GCR-cloud link would be (were it true) one mechanism that could account for such an *amplification*. I don’t know what point you are trying to argue
I’m making the point that if there are two mechanisms working independently of each other, one is not an amplification of the other. And that IPCC is rightfully ignoring unknown mechanisms.
That is not how I read the abstract
Of course not, given your a priory disposition, but have already put in a request to Hiroko for the paper, the we can see.
with solar driven effects when such solar driven effects were contra-indicated in your own study
I have not made any such studies for anything else but solar activity.

lgl
December 22, 2012 2:42 pm

Leif
I asked for your source of MWP ending in 1050.
You can find the five VEI5s here: http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/largeeruptions.cfm

Carter, David
December 22, 2012 2:48 pm

[snip. Despicable, off topic, ad-hominem attack. — mod.]

REPLY:
There’s an old saying, demonstrated here by you. “Never mud wrestle with a pig, you get dirty, and the pig likes it.” That pretty much sums up your appearances here, as well as many other potholer54 proponents. It wouldn’t matter what I say, what Monckton would say, or anyone else would say for that matter, if it disagrees with you, you’ll trot out the (pick one) “hidden agenda, big oil, conspiracy, denier, afraid”, etc. It’s stock in trade these days. There’s a huge difference between “chickening out” and learning when it is a complete waste of time to try communicating any further. You’ve aptly demonstrated here what a complete waste of time your off-topic arguments are. This thread has nothing to do with either of these personalities or your opinions of them. You won’t answer questions directly, and like I said, you may very well be “potholer54” trying to stir the pot again, since just as Matt Ridley from the UK is in the USA now (from England on holiday) who knows where “potholer54” is right now. You’ve not provided any evidence of who you really are, so I’ll just leave it at that.
Aethist? OK. Have a Merry Christmas, and may Gaia have mercy on your soul. We’re done here as your thread disruption is now at an end. – Anthony

Shawnhet
December 22, 2012 3:17 pm

Leif:”I’m making the point that if there are two mechanisms working independently of each other, one is not an amplification of the other. And that IPCC is rightfully ignoring unknown mechanisms.”
I really don’t understand you at all. No one is talking about two things that independent of one another. You claimed that the GCR link was not an amplification of solar effects but it is clearly not independent of them.
“That is not how I read the abstract
Of course not, given your a priory disposition, but have already put in a request to Hiroko for the paper, the we can see.”
Since you are apparently having huge problems with what it even means to be anplified, I would not so glib in assuming that you understand what my a priori views on solar amplification are.
“with solar driven effects when such solar driven effects were contra-indicated in your own study
I have not made any such studies for anything else but solar activity.”
This was a bit confusing so I’ll rephrase: It would be pretty odd for Obrochta et al. to reference a coherence between solar effects and ocean changes for one period if such coherence was effectively contra-indicated in their paper.

December 22, 2012 4:30 pm

lsvalgaard says:
December 22, 2012 at 10:35 am
“thisisnotgoodtogo says:
December 22, 2012 at 10:29 am
You’re a believer, not a thinker.
Now, this is good to go: 95% of the commenters here are believers, too.”
You may be correct about the 95%, although I would put it a bit lower than this. Certainly this site welcomes a higher proportion of thinkers than most. On this subject, one must guard against becoming fossilized in his thinking – defending one’s old ideas unto death, permitting nothing of the stream of evolving science into the sanctuary. A thinker who stops thinking is no longer a thinker. It would be terrible if it were to be discovered that the sun is more important in earthly affairs than you are prepared to think.

Richard D
December 22, 2012 4:31 pm

I’m a long-time wuwt non-technical reader – liberal arts, with general physics, chemistry and mathematics. Can anyone suggest a great wuwt article or three that I absolutely must read over the holidays?

December 22, 2012 4:45 pm

lgl says:
December 22, 2012 at 2:42 pm
You can find the five VEI5s here: http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/largeeruptions.cfm
Which also includes the ones that [supposed by some] started the LIA and [certainly] the dip at the Dalton Minimum.
With enough variables in play you can fit anything.
Shawnhet says:
December 22, 2012 at 3:17 pm
I really don’t understand you at all. No one is talking about two things that independent of one another. You claimed that the GCR link was not an amplification of solar effects but it is clearly not independent of them.
Perhaps it is because I think as a physicist and do not conflate effects from different causes. But it seems that we cannot get out of that grove [beginning to sound like broken records] so suffice it to say that it is reasonable that IPCC does not wish to include unknown mechanisms in their considerations, which I agree with. The corollary of that is that they are not ‘sneakily’ [Rawls: ‘snuck in’] suggesting that their refusal to do so is a ‘game-changer’; they are playing their standard game of only referring to documented and plausible specific causes, which I also agree with [although many of their other actions and procedures are disagreeable].

herkimer
December 22, 2012 4:53 pm

“If there were some way cosmic rays could be causing global climate change, it should have started getting colder after 1985.”
I cannot say that cosmic rays are behind all this cooling, Joanna Haigh, but you would be surprised at the cooling that has taken place after 1985 especially during the winters.
Here is a paper that actually confirmed that cooling was taking place starting only a few year after 1985
Paper called Arctic waming, increasing snow cover and widespread boreal winter cooling
by Judah L Cohen, Jason C Furtado, Mathew A Balow, Vladmir A Alexeev, and Jessica E Cherry, published in Environmental Research Letter, December 2011
Yet, while the planet has steadily
warmed, NH winters have recently grown more extreme
across the major industrialized centres. Record cold snaps and
heavy snowfall events across the United States, Europe and
East Asia garnered much public attention during the winters
of 2009/10 and 2010/11 (Blunden et al 2011, Cohen et al
2010). Cohen et al (2009) argued that the occurrence of
more severe NH winter weather is a two-decade-long trend
starting around 1988. Whether the recent colder winters are a
consequence of internal variability or a response to changes in
boundary forcings resulting from climate change remains an
open question.
I did some checking to see if there really was some global cooling in the post 1985 era
. 1]The winter temperatures for Contiguous United States has been dropping since 1990 at -0.26 F per decade [per NCDC]
2]8 of the 11 climate regions in other parts of Canada showed declining winter temperature departures for 15 years since 1998
3] The winter temperature departures from 1961-1990 mean normals for land and sea regions of Europe have been flat or even slightly dropping for 20 year or since 1990
4] I have not checked all of Russia but Moscow winter temperatures have been declining since 1988
Personally I believe there is much more coming as solar sunspots decline even further to the next solar minimum and possibly for the next two solar cycles.

December 22, 2012 5:01 pm

Gary Pearse says:
December 22, 2012 at 4:30 pm
It would be terrible if it were to be discovered that the sun is more important in earthly affairs than you are prepared to think.
Actually not. I’m hoping, praying that I’m wrong, as that would increase funding for my branch of science [perhaps even for me] considerably.
herkimer says:
December 22, 2012 at 4:53 pm
but you would be surprised at the cooling that has taken place after 1985 especially during the winters.
You are running up against folks like lgl and Rawls who preach that there are enormous lags and thermal inertia involved, so no way can the ‘sun begin to cool’ the Earth yet [as some commenters put it].

John West
December 22, 2012 5:52 pm

Richard D
Ric Werme maintains a categorical index here:
http://home.comcast.net/~ewerme/wuwt/categories.html

mpainter
December 22, 2012 6:17 pm

Carter, David says: December 22, 2012 at 2:48 pm
[snip. Despicable, off topic, ad-hominem attack. — mod.]
============================
take away those, and his propaganda videos, and -.. no more carter

john robertson
December 22, 2012 8:08 pm

Anthony thanks for dumping Carter, those thread bombing warbles of his make following the more rational arguments difficult .

john robertson
December 22, 2012 8:15 pm

The modification by Hansen and company from a reference global average temperature of 15C to 14C would indicate a cooling of 0.5C in their own words; no?
What year did this change slip in play?
This climatology is hard, what with the shifting goal posts, various nonstandard references, undefined periods of time and Alice in wonderland language.

Shawnhet
December 22, 2012 8:37 pm

Leif:I really don’t understand you at all. No one is talking about two things that independent of one another. You claimed that the GCR link was not an amplification of solar effects but it is clearly not independent of them.
Perhaps it is because I think as a physicist and do not conflate effects from different causes.”
Respectfully, I think it is just that you are/were confused about what the IPCC is talking about. You claimed that the GCR cloud link would not be an amplification when the IPCC explicitly claimed the opposite. This does not make it easy to communicate on this issue with you at all (since what an “amplification” means to the climate is at the core of this issue).
From my POV, very early in this thread you laid down the real reason you have for dismissing the proposed solar amplification(as the IPCC uses the term) effect. IYO, 1.the GCR link has been disproved and 2.that hypothesis is the last one standing. As I said, way back then, you have never given any evidence for 2. without which the proper response is to keep an open mind about solar amplification. With sufficiently good evidence, it would be perfectly acceptable to conclude that a solar amplification takes place even without *any* knowledge of the specific mechanism. We do not have that evidence yet IMO, but there is a great deal of highly suggestive stuff out there IMO including the three papers listed explicitly by the IPCC.
Cheers, 🙂

December 22, 2012 9:40 pm

Shawnhet says:
December 22, 2012 at 8:37 pm
From my POV, very early in this thread you laid down the real reason you have for dismissing the proposed solar amplification(as the IPCC uses the term) effect. IYO, 1.the GCR link has been disproved and 2.that hypothesis is the last one standing.
You keep saying that, but saying it often still does not make it true.
My reason is as follows: the GCR-cloud link is specific and has some physical background, all the other ones that I know of [and which may be mentioned in the papers] are nebulous, unknown, unspecified, and mysterious ‘triggers’ or ‘amplifiers or feedbacks’ and as such cannot be seriously considered or quantified [given that we discount TSI for being too weak]. For that reason it makes sense to adopt the stance that IPCC has.
As I said, way back then, you have never given any evidence for 2. without which the proper response is to keep an open mind about solar amplification.
Science does not operate with an ‘open mind’, but with a ruthless culling of nebulous thought.
With sufficiently good evidence, it would be perfectly acceptable to conclude that a solar amplification takes place even without *any* knowledge of the specific mechanism.
The evidence is in my opinion not good. An example is the Bond 2001 ‘evidence’ that when examined critically seems to evaporate into artifacts, dating errors, and uncertainties, with little of the original certitude left.
We do not have that evidence yet IMO, but there is a great deal of highly suggestive stuff out there IMO including the three papers listed explicitly by the IPCC.
As I understand the two non-Bond papers, no other mechanisms are suggested. The Ram and Stoltz paper, for example, is quite specific about that ( http://www.leif.org/EOS/1999GL900199.pdf ) “In summary, our work, and that of Svensmark and Friis-Christensen (1997), seems to show that changes in cloud cover due to solar influences affects terrestrial precipitation patterns and, as a result, the aridity of the Greenland dust source areas”. no invocation of ‘amplification’ or the like. You are presuming too much.

December 22, 2012 9:43 pm

We do not have that evidence yet IMO, but there is a great deal of highly suggestive stuff out there IMO including the three papers listed explicitly by the IPCC
As I understand the two non-Bond papers, no other mechanisms or different ‘amplifications’ are suggested. etc…

December 22, 2012 9:47 pm

As Muscheler (2007) and many other papers point out, differences between 10Be records from Antarctica and Greenland indicate that climatic changes have influenced the deposition of 10Be during some periods of the last 1000 yr and that a significant part of the record does not reflect production [i..e solar activity], but deposition [i.e. climate].

F. Ross
December 22, 2012 9:57 pm
John West
December 22, 2012 10:48 pm

Just to be clear: I don’t know what caused the late 20th century warming and I don’t even know what all the possibilities might be. The fact remains that those who are already convinced that increases in CO2 caused most if not all of the late 20th century warming have presented only two reasons why solar activity has been (or should be) ignored as a contender: 1) the variation in TSI is too small to explain the warming, and 2) any solar variation that correlates to or is proxied by sunspots would have had to peak prior to the peak in warming. Those of us that remain unconvinced that CO2 caused the late 20th century warming reject these two reasons on the grounds that 1) the variation in TSI does not fully encapsulate the variation in solar output traits capable of influencing Earth’s climate, 2) that in all well known and understood warming cycles the temperature peak lags the peak of the warming’s cause, 3) the potential for amplifying mechanisms to enhance aspects of solar variation, and 4) the possibility of solar variations which do not correlate to sunspots; and implore climate science to fully investigate solar variation as a possible cause of the late 20th century warming.

December 22, 2012 10:54 pm

John West says:
December 22, 2012 at 10:48 pm
How are these two different:
2) any solar variation that correlates to or is proxied by sunspots would have had to peak prior to the peak in warming.
and
2) that in all well known and understood warming cycles the temperature peak lags the peak of the warming’s cause

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