Replicating Al Gore's Climate 101 video experiment shows that his "high school physics" could never work as advertised

This will be a top “sticky” post for a day or two. New stories will appear below this one.

Readers may recall my previous essay where I pointed out how Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 Video, used in his “24 hours of climate reality”, had some serious credibility issues with editing things to make it appear as if they had actually performed the experiment, when they clearly did not. It has taken me awhile to replicate the experiment. Delays were a combination of acquisition and shipping problems, combined with my availability since I had to do this on nights and weekends. I worked initially using the original techniques and equipment, and I’ve replicated the Climate 101 experiment in other ways using improved equipment. I’ve compiled several videos. My report follows.

First. as a refresher, here’s the Climate 101 video again:

I direct your attention to the 1 minute mark, lasting through 1:30, where the experiment is presented.

And here’s my critique of it: Video analysis and scene replication suggests that Al Gore’s Climate Reality Project fabricated their Climate 101 video “Simple Experiment”

The most egregious faked presentation in that video was the scene with the split screen thermometers, edited to appear as if the temperature in the jar of elevated CO2 level was rising faster than the jar without elevated CO2 level.

It turns out that the thermometers were never in the jar recording the temperature rise presented in the split screen and the entire presentation was nothing but stagecraft and editing.

This was proven beyond a doubt by the photoshop differencing technique used to compare each side of the split screen. With the exception of the moving thermometer fluid, both sides were identical.

difference process run at full resolution - click to enlarge

Exposing this lie to the viewers didn’t set well with some people, include the supposed “fairness” watchdogs over at Media Matters, who called the analysis a “waste of time”. Of course it’s only a “waste of time” when you prove their man Gore was faking the whole thing, otherwise they wouldn’t care. Personally I consider it a badge of honor for them to take notice because they usually reserve such vitriol for high profile news they don’t like, so apparently I have “arrived”.

The reason why I took so much time then to show this chicanery was Mr. Gore’s pronouncement in an interview the day the video aired.

His specific claim was:

“The deniers claim that it’s some kind of hoax and that the global scientific community is lying to people,” he said. “It’s not a hoax, it’s high school physics.” – Al Gore in an interview with MNN 9/14/2011

So easy a high school kid can do it. Right?

Bill Nye, in his narration at 0:48 in the video says:

You can replicate this effect yourself in a simple lab experiment, here’s how.

…and at 1:10 in the video Nye says:

Within minutes you will see the temperature of the bottle with the carbon dioxide in it rising faster and higher.

So, I decided to find out if that was true and if anyone could really replicate that claim, or if this was just more stagecraft chicanery. I was betting that nobody on Gore’s production team actually did this experiment, or if they did do it, it wasn’t successful, because otherwise, why would they have to fake the results in post production?

The split screen video at 1:17, a screencap of which is a few paragraphs above shows a temperature difference of 2°F. Since Mr. Gore provided no other data, I’ll use that as the standard to meet for a successful experiment.

The first task is to get all the exact same equipment. Again, since Mr. Gore doesn’t provide anything other than the video, finding all of that took some significant effort and time. There’s no bill of materials to work with so I had to rely on finding each item from the visuals. While I found the cookie jars and oral thermometers early on, finding the lamp fixtures, the heat lamps for them, the CO2 tank and the CO2 tank valve proved to be more elusive. Surprisingly, the valve turned out to be the hardest of all items to locate, taking about two weeks from the time I started searching to the time I had located it, ordered it and it arrived. The reason? It isn’t called a valve, but rather a “In-Line On/Off Air Adapter”. Finding the terminology was half the battle. Another surprise was finding that the heat lamps and fixtures were for lizards and terrariums and not some general purpose use. Fortunately the fixtures and lamps were sold together by the same company. While the fixtures supported up to 150 watts, Mr. Gore made no specification on bulb type or wattage, so I chose the middle of the road 100 watt bulbs from the 50, 100, and 150 watt choices available.

I believe that I have done due diligence (as much as possible given no instructions from Gore) and located all the original equipment to accurately replicate the experiment as it was presented. Here’s the bill of materials and links to suppliers needed to replicate Al Gore’s experiment as it is shown in the Climate 101 video:

====================================================

BILL OF MATERIALS

QTY 2 Anchor Hocking Cookie Jar with Lid

http://www.cooking.com/products/shprodde.asp?SKU=187543

QTY2 Geratherm Oral Thermometer Non-Mercury http://www.pocketnurse.com/Geratherm-Oral-Thermometer-Non-Mercury/productinfo/06-74-5826/

QTY 2 Globe Coin Bank

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150661053386

QTY 2 Fluker`s Repta Clamp-Lamp with Ceramic Sockets for Terrariums (max 150 watts, 8 1/2 Inch Bulb) http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fluker-s-Repta-Clamp-Lamp-150-watts-8-1-2-Inch-Bulb-/200663082632

QTY2 Zoo Med Red Infrared Heat Lamp 100W

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200594870618

QTY1 Empire – Pure Energy – Aluminum Co2 Tank – 20 oz

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190563856367

QTY 1 RAP4 In-Line On/Off Air Adapter

http://www.rap4.com/store/paintball/rap4-in-line-on-off-air-adapter

QTY 1 flexible clear plastic hose, 48″ in length, from local Lowes hardware to fit RAP4 In-Line On/Off Air Adapter above.

====================================================

Additionally, since Mr. Gore never actually proved that CO2 had been released from the CO2 paintball tank into one of the jars, I ordered a portable CO2 meter for just that purpose:

It has a CO2 metering accuracy of: ± 50ppm ±5% reading value. While not laboratory grade, it works well enough to prove the existence of elevated CO2 concentrations in one of the jars. It uses a non-dispersive infrared diffusion sensor (NDIR) which is self calibrating, which seems perfect for the job.

carbon dioxide temperature humidity monitorData Sheet

===================================================

Once I got all of the equipment in, the job was to do some testing to make sure it all worked. I also wanted to be sure the two oral thermometers were calibrated such they read identically. For that, I prepared a water bath to conduct that experiment.

CAVEAT: For those that value form over substance, yes these are not slick professionally edited videos like Mr. Gore presented. They aren’t intended to be. They ARE intended to be a complete, accurate, and most importantly unedited record of the experimental work I performed. Bear in mind that while Mr. Gore has million$ to hire professional studios and editors, all I have is a consumer grade video camera, my office and my wits. If I were still working in broadcast television, you can bet I would have done this in the TV studio.

==============================================================

STEP 1 Calibrate the Oral Thermometers

Here’s my first video showing how I calibrated the oral thermometers, which is very important if you want to have an accurate experimental result.

Note that the two thermometers read 98.1°F at the conclusion of the test, as shown in this screencap from my video @ about 5:35:

STEP 2 Calibrate the Infrared Thermometer

Since I plan to make use of an electronic Infrared thermometer in these experiments, I decided to calibrate it against the water bath also. Some folks may see this as unnecessary, since it is pre-calibrated, but I decided to do it anyway. It makes for interesting viewing

==============================================================

STEP 3 Demonstrate how glass blocks IR using  the Infrared Thermometer

The way an actual greenhouse works is by trapping infrared radiation. Glass is transparent to visible light, but not to infrared light, as we see below.

Image from: greenhousesonline.com.au
Mr. Gore was attempting to demonstrate this effect in his setup, but there’s an obvious problem: he used infrared heat lamps rather than visible light lamps. Thus, it seems highly likely that the glass jars would block the incoming infrared, and convert it to heat. That being the case, the infrared radiative backscattering effect that makes up the greenhouse effect in our atmosphere couldn’t possibly be demonstrated here in the Climate 101 video.

By itself, that would be enough to declare the experiment invalid, but not only will I show the problem of the experimental setup being flawed, I’ll go to full on replication.

Using the warm water bath and the infrared thermometer, it becomes easy to demonstrate this effect.

Since Mr. Gore’s experiment used infrared heat lamps illuminating two glass jars, I decided to test that as well:

==============================================================

STEP 4 Replicating Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 video experiment exactly, using the same equipment – duration of 10 minutes

At 1:10 in the Climate 101 video narrator Bill Nye the science guy says:

Within minutes you will see the temperature of the bottle with the carbon dioxide in it rising faster and higher.

Since this is “simple high school physics” according to Mr. Gore, this should be a cinch to replicate. I took a “within minutes” from the narration to be just that, so I tried an experiment with 10 minutes of duration. I also explain the experimental setup and using the CO2 meter prove that CO2 is in fact injected into Jar “B”. My apologies for the rambling dialog, which wasn’t scripted, but explained as I went along. And, the camera work is one-handed while I’m speaking and setting up the experiment, so what it lacks in production quality it makes up in reality.

You’ll note that after 10 minutes, it appears there was no change in either thermometer. Also, remember these are ORAL thermometers, which hold the reading (so you can take it out of your mouth and hand it to mom and ask “can I stay home from school today”?). So for anyone concerned about the length of time after I turned off the lamps, don’t be. In order to reset the thermometers you have to shake them to force the liquid back down into the bulb.

Here’s the screencaps of the two thermometer readings from Jar A and B:

Clearly, 10 minutes isn’t enough time for the experiment to work. So let’s scratch off the idea from narration of “a few minutes” and go for a longer period:

RESULT: No change, no difference in temperature. Nothing near the 2°F rise shown in the video. Inconclusive.

==============================================================

STEP 5 Replicating Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 video experiment exactly, using the same equipment – duration of 30 minutes

Ok, identical setup as before, the only difference is time, the experiment runs 30 minutes long. I’ve added a digital timer you can watch as the experiment progresses.

And here are the screencaps from the video above of the results:

RESULT: slight rise and difference in temperature 97.4°F for Jar “A” Air, and 97.2°F for Jar “B” CO2. Nothing near the 2°F rise shown in the video.

==============================================================

STEP 6 Replicating Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 video experiment, using digital logging thermometer – duration of 30 minutes

In this experiment, I’m substituting the liquid in glass oral thermometers with some small self contained battery powered digital logging thermometers with LCD displays.

This model:

Details here

Specification Sheet / Manual

USB-2-LCD+ Temperature Datalogger

I used two identical units in the experiment replication:

And here are the results graphed by the application that comes with the datalogger. Red is Temperature, Blue is Humidity, Green is dewpoint

The graphs are automatically different vertical scales and thus can be a bit confusing, so I’ve take the raw data for each and graphed temperature only:

After watching my own video, I was concerned that maybe I was getting a bit of a direct line of the visible portion of the heat lamp into the sensor housing onto the thermistor, since they were turned on their side. So I ran the experiment again with the dataloggers mounted vertically in paper cups to ensure the thermistors were shielded from any direct radiation at any wavelength. See this video:

Both runs of the USB datalogger are graphed together below:

RESULTS:

Run 1 slight rise and difference in temperature 43.5°C for Jar “A” Air with Brief pulse to 44°C , and 43.0°C for Jar “B” CO2.

Run 2 had an ended with a 1°C difference, with plain air in Jar A being warmer than Jar “B with CO2.

Jar “A” Air temperature led Jar “B” CO2 during the entire experiment on both runs

The datalogger output files are available here:

JarA Air only run1.txt  JarB CO2 run1.txt

JarA Air only run2.txt JarB CO2 run2.txt

==============================================================

STEP 7 Replicating Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 video experiment exactly, using a high resolution NIST calibrated digital logging thermometer – duration of 30 minutes

In this experiment I use a high resolution (0.1F resolution) and NIST calibrated data logger with calibrated probes. Data was collected over my LAN to special software. This is the datalogger model:

Data sheet: Model E Series And the software used to log data is described here

Here’s the experiment:

I had to spend a lot of time waiting for the Jar “B” probe to come to parity with Jar “A” due to the cooling effect of the CO2 I introduced. As we all know, when a gas expands it cools, and that’s exactly what happens to CO2 released under pressure. You can see the effect early in the flat area of the graph below.

Here’s the end result screencap real-time graphing software used in the experiment, click the image to expand the graph full size.

RESULTS:

Peak value Jar A with air  was at 18:04 117.3°F

Peak value Jar B with CO2 was at 18:04 116.7°F

Once again, air led CO2 through the entire experiment.

Note that I allowed this experiment to go through a cool down after I turned off the Infrared heat lamps, which is the slope after the peak. Interestingly, while Jar “A” (probe1 in green) with Air, led Jar “B” (Probe 2 in red) with CO2, the positions reversed shortly after the lamps turned off.

The CO2 filled jar was now losing heat slower than the plain air jar, even though plain air Jar “A” had warmed slightly faster than the CO2 Jar “B”.

Here’s the datalogger output files for each probe:

Climate101-replication-Probe01-(JarA – Air).csv

Climate101-replication-Probe02-(JarB – CO2).csv

Climate101-replication-Probe03-(Ambient Air).csv

What could explain this reversal after the lamps were turned off? The answer is here at the Engineer’s Edge in the form of this table:

Heat Transfer Table of Content

This chart gives the thermal conductivity of gases as a function of temperature.

Unless otherwise noted, the values refer to a pressure of 100 kPa (1 bar) or to the saturation vapor pressure if that is less than 100 kPa.

The notation P = 0 indicates the low pressure limiting value is given. In general, the P = 0 and P = 100 kPa values differ by less than 1%.

Units are milliwatts per meter kelvin.

Note the values for Air and for CO2 that I highlighted in the 300K column. 300K is 80.3°F.

Air is a better conductor of heat than CO2.

==============================================================

So, here is what I think is going on with Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 experiment.

  1. As we know, the Climate101 video used infrared heat lamps
  2. The glass cookie jars chosen don’t allow the full measure of infrared from the lamps to enter the center of the jar and affect the gas. I showed this two different ways with the infrared camera in videos above.
  3. During the experiments, I showed the glass jars heating up using the infrared camera. Clearly they were absorbing the infrared energy from the lamps.
  4. The gases inside the jars, air and pure CO2 thus had to be heated by secondary heat emission from the glass as it was being heated. They were not absorbing infrared from the lamps, but rather heat from contact with the glass.
  5. Per the engineering table, air is a better conductor of heat than pure CO2, so it warms faster, and when the lamps are turned off, it cools faster.
  6. The difference value of 2°F shown in the Climate 101 video split screen was never met in any of the experiments I performed.
  7. The condition stated in the Climate 101 video of “Within minutes you will see the temperature of the bottle with the carbon dioxide in it rising faster and higher.” was not met in any of the experiments I performed. In fact it was exactly the opposite. Air consistently warmed faster than CO2.
  8. Thus, the experiment as designed by Mr. Gore does not show the greenhouse effect as we know it in our atmosphere, it does show how heat transfer works and differences in heat transfer rates with different substances, but nothing else.

Mr. Gore’s Climate 101 experiment is falsified, and could not work given the equipment he specified. If they actually tried to perform the experiment themselves, perhaps this is why they had to resort to stagecraft in the studio to fake the temperature rise on the split screen thermometers.

The experiment as presented by Al Gore and Bill Nye “the science guy” is a failure, and not representative of the greenhouse effect related to CO2 in our atmosphere. The video as presented, is not only faked in post production, the premise is also false and could never work with the equipment they demonstrated. Even with superior measurement equipment it doesn’t work, but more importantly, it couldn’t work as advertised.

The design failure was the glass cookie jar combined with infrared heat lamps.

Gore FAIL.

=============================================================

UPDATE: 4PM PST Some commenters are taking away far more than intended from this essay. Therefore I am repeating this caveat I posted in my first essay where I concentrated on the video editing and stagecraft issues:

I should make it clear that I’m not doubting that CO2 has a positive radiative heating effect in our atmosphere, due to LWIR re-radiation, that is well established by science. What I am saying is that Mr. Gore’s Climate Reality Project did a poor job of demonstrating an experiment, so poor in fact that they had to fabricate portions of the presentation, and that the experiment itself (if they actually did it, we can’t tell) would show a completely different physical mechanism than what actually occurs in our atmosphere.

No broader take away (other than the experiment was faked and fails) was intended, expressed or implied – Anthony

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R. Gates
October 19, 2011 12:03 pm

DR says:
October 19, 2011 at 11:47 am
R. Gates said:
They only appear to be similar experiments, but Anthony did a good job of pointing out why one would fail and one would work.
Ok, let’s hear how Anthony pointed out why one would work. Done properly it will never “work”.
The reason why the BBC experiment “worked” is because the Ideal Gas Law was being verified, not the greenhouse effect. Sheesh. This shouldn’t be that complicated to understand.
______
Did the CO2 in both the BBC experiment and the Mythbusters experiment absorb some of the IR radiation and thereby raise the temperature or not? If the IR could not get to the CO2 in the 101 experiment (becasue of the glass and the type of light used), it could not absorb the energy and alter the temperature.
Your comment “done properly, it will never work” seems confusing. What does “properly” mean? Use a plastic container and a light that emits a broad spectrum of radiation?

Jeff D
October 19, 2011 12:09 pm

As for the BBC experiment.
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/12/24/bbc-botches-grade-school-co2-science-experiment-on-live-tv-with-indepedent-lab-results-to-prove-it/
I am tempted to try this one myself using data loggers and a sunny day. Seems the source distance and orientation of the sensors has more to do with outcome then the CO2.

October 19, 2011 12:27 pm

RGates said;
Anthony never doubted the greenhouse effect of CO2 in the atmosphere or that CO2 acts as a greenhouse gas, and their are many skeptics who don’t doubt these basic principles.(sic)
Henry@RGates
I repeat again what I commented earlier:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/10/18/replicating-al-gores-climate-101-video-experiment-shows-that-his-high-school-physics-could-never-work-as-advertised/#comment-771336
now if you have data (measurements) on all 4 variables mentioned,
in Watts/m2 average earth surface /24hours/0.01%CO2/m3 air
and proof that the net effect of more CO2 is warming rather than cooling,
why not just give this to me/us?
I have asked everyone about these data and could not get it.
If you don’t have that data,
then how do you or Anthony or anyone else know for sure that the net effect of more CO2 is warming rather than cooling?

Markon
October 19, 2011 12:29 pm

Orwellian: War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength
Gorewellian: Cold is Hot; Wet is Dry; Calm is Stormy
I believe the AGWers are feeling the heat of truth beaming onto their lies, except that they think it’s man made global warming.

Dave, UK
October 19, 2011 12:39 pm

Gore FAIL?
Gore FRAUD.

Patrik
October 19, 2011 12:41 pm

“4.The gases inside the jars, air and pure CO2 thus had to be heated by secondary heat emission from the glass as it was being heated. They were not absorbing infrared from the lamps, but rather heat from contact with the glass.”
Wouldn’t this “heat” (the one absorbed from contact with the glass) also in large part be IR?

Editor
October 19, 2011 12:41 pm

Anthony; I just wanted to say what a thorough, scientifically accurate piece of research you have carried out.
I think you should send it to a science publication to be peer reviewed and published. If they dare!

Richard Percifield
October 19, 2011 12:45 pm

One has to wonder about those people attacking Anthony over this experiment that he conducted. I realize that the results are devastating for Mr Gore and Mr Nye, however that does not change the results or make them less relevant. The original experiment as presented was obviously flawed when they used heat lamps to provide the incoming energy onto the planet in a jar. Glass reflects most IR energy, as can be seen with a FLIR camera. So the only path available for the energy to get into the jar was by absorption of heat by the glass and a combination of radiation, and conduction, mostly conduction. How could a person with training in science even read the voice over for this and not be concerned? Mr Nye certainly saw the final product, and should not have missed this fatal flaw.
So my point is really this, how many times do you need to prove that IR radiation is reflected by glass jars? This is a well documented physical phenomenon and expertly demonstrated here in Anthony’s experiment and accompanying video. The methodology of the original Gore/Nye is fundamentally flawed, and now proven to have been “dry-labbed”. It is time to stop asking for refinements, controls, straw men, and flawed analogies. Mr Watts has shown a fundamental aspect of true science, “if you make a claim someone else better be able to reproduce it”. If you faked any portion of it you will get exposed and burned.
Great Job!
Nicely Done.

October 19, 2011 12:48 pm

It took me 3+ hours to observe all the experimentation and data that Anthony has provided for Al Gore’s Climate 101 experiment, And I can say without doubt that Gore’s experiment is poorly designed, it doesn’t work under exact replication and that Anthony has shown outstanding evidence of faked results in post production.
This is a bad scientific apparatus for showing the proprieties and/or behavior of trapped gases under an energy source.
Well done Anthony, you should label Mr. Gore’s experiment under the Climate FAIL files where it belongs.

October 19, 2011 12:51 pm

Does this say an audio cassette will record video? Really?

Joe Public
October 19, 2011 12:51 pm

Well done Anthony.
You’ve just saved mankind by proving that there’s no need to reduce CO2 production.

steve
October 19, 2011 12:53 pm

That is fantastic work. Total takedown.
It reminds me of the comment made by a CAGW supporter that, to verify the rising oceans theory, all you had to do was put ice in a full glass of water and watch as the overflow water spilled over the sides while the ice melts…except that ice takes up more space than water, so….no.

John Whitman
October 19, 2011 12:54 pm

Anthony,
Thank you for replication of the Gorethon video’s purported experiment. We now have your actual experimental process with actual results; you have provided completely documented, open and transparent diclosure of your methods, process and results.
If the Gorethon folks have aspects of their purported experiment that were not shown on the Gorethon video, then they should provide the additional documentation and evidence of their purported experiment.
My conclusion is the Gorethon video was a PR piece with propaganda for alarming AGW by CO2 dictating a fabricated result.
Thanks for your WUWT.
John

DirkH
October 19, 2011 12:55 pm

Some European says:
October 19, 2011 at 11:15 am
“OMG! I used to be a CAGW believer. But now it’s clear to me! CO2 does not absorb infrared radiation.[…]”
SomeEuropean, do you think there was IR in the glass jars? You didn’t pay attention.

Ryan Welch
October 19, 2011 12:55 pm

OUTSTANDING!!!! Great work Anthony! I would like to see the same experiment done with full spectrum radiation (Solar radiation) in plexiglass containers with container A at 200 ppm CO2 (pre-industrial revolution), container B at 400 ppm CO2 (current concentration), and container C at 800 ppm CO2 (what the “believers” call doomsday).
Again, great work and this is yet another example of why I love wattsupwiththat.com
Ryan

Gary Hladik
October 19, 2011 12:59 pm

Some European says (October 19, 2011 at 11:15 am): “I can’t believe that thousands of scientists have been led into thinking CO2 absorbed longwave radiation, when it’s so easy to disprove…”
I assume the “/sarc” tag was left off this comment by mistake. But on the off-chance it wasn’t:
Anthony explicitly confirmed that CO2 absorbs IR by using a device that measures CO2 by its–surprise!–IR absorption. All he did was demonstrate–again–that the “experiment” in Al Gore’s presentation was faked, revealing Al Gore as (a) a fraud, or (b) unable or unwilling to check his “facts”. In either case, he obviously can’t be trusted. That’s not news to regular WUWT readers, but not everyone has gotten the memo…yet.

Tim Folkerts
October 19, 2011 1:04 pm

Overall, well done. Your work is MUCH more convincing than the original video from Gore et. al.
A few specific comments/suggestions to Anthony and others.
1) FLIR cameras like that typically pick up ~ 8-15 um. The video of the cookie jar blocking the IR from the warm water shows that the cookie jar blocks these wavelengths. However, the IR from the heat lamp will be almost exclusively shorter wavelengths ( ~ 0.7 – 7 um). The experiment does nothing to show that the IR from the heat lamp would be absorbed by the glass jars.
In fact most glass transmits IR up to a few um, but absorbs beyond a few um. http://www.astro.virginia.edu/~mfs4n/ir/glass.jpg So the IR from the heat lamp almost certainly DOES get into the jars. However, these wavelengths that do get in (up to a few microns) are not the wavelengths that CO2 absorbs, so that IR would not particularly warm the CO2 anyway.
2) As a couple people noted, it would be better to switch around the experiment a bit to eliminate “confounding factors”. For instance, if CO2 is always on the right, and Jar B is always on the right, and thermometer B is always on the right, then the observed differences can just as logically be attributed to any of these three factors. Mixing up the jars, thermometers, and gases would greatly help in attributing the changes in temperature to one specific cause.
3) No matter how thoroughly this particular experiment is debunked, the original experiment does not really show the GHE as applied to the earth and its atmosphere. The bigger fraud is claiming that this experiment does indeed demonstrate the “greenhouse effect” when in fact, even if done right, this experiment is really not that convincing.

Editor
October 19, 2011 1:05 pm

Having thought about this a little, I began wondering what level of controls can be placed over apparently fraudulent video such as these.
In New Zealand, we have the Broadcasting Standards Authority – a watchdog for TV and Radio.
I wrote and asked if they had powers over other “Broadcasts” such as YouTube
Their response is below:

Dear Andy
Thank you for your email.
Under the current legislation, the BSA does not have jurisdiction over internet content that is played on demand, like You Tube (as opposed to being streamed live). For the moment, only content that is streamed live is considered a “broadcast” for the purposes of the Broadcasting Act.
However, the Act is currently under review to address exactly these types of issues.
Regards
BSA Complaints

Fred R.
October 19, 2011 1:15 pm

I have not read all the comments, so maybe this has been mentioned…
An observation:
The duplicated thermometer shown on the green background is not the same kind of thermometer in the glass jars. The thermometers in the glass jars have more hash marks below the 96 degree mark than the ones on the green background. The thermometers you purchased are the same as the green backround thermometers.

October 19, 2011 1:39 pm

someone far up the thread commented that a little cookie jar can’t be compared to the depth of the atmosphere. Based upon my back-of-the-envelope calculation, a 1 ft. cookie jar with pure CO2 is equivalent to over 2,000 ft of atmosphere (from the ground up) containing 390 ppm of CO2.

October 19, 2011 1:40 pm

AndiC says:
October 19, 2011 at 1:05 pm
Having thought about this a little, I began wondering what level of controls can be placed over apparently fraudulent video such as these.
AndiC personally I have no desire for any branch, sector, arm, office, etc. of any government to have any control, say, opinion, review, etc in a free society of decideing maybe fraud on youtube. It is a nose under the tent we don’t need. Anthony demonstrated we don’t need no stinking government help to show fraud. Freemen doing things freely is better.

Editor
October 19, 2011 1:42 pm

Tom L’s question about heat capacity seems important:

What about the heat capacities of air vs. CO2? CO2 has a lower heat capacity than air, so if I remember my P-chem correctly, the same heat addition should cause the temperature of CO2 to rise more than the temperature of air.

I found a list of heat capacities for different gases here:
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/spesific-heat-capacity-gases-d_159.html
CO2 does indeed have a lower heat capacity than air (0.844 vs 1.01), but heat capacity is per kilogram of gas and CO2 is also denser than air. According to this page, CO2 is about 50% denser:
http://www.elmhurst.edu/~chm/vchembook/123Adensitygas.html
Thus the heat capacity of a given volume of CO2 is actually substantially higher than for the same volume of air (1.5 x .844 = about 1.3). Volume of air is constant in these greenhouse gas container experiments, so there is actually more heat trapping going on in the CO2 containers than simple temperature comparison shows. For instance, if the temperature of the CO2 container goes up just a little less than the temperature of the air container, its heat content is actually going up more, so the simple temperature measurement is not just quantitatively misleading but is qualitatively misleading in this case.
In the Mythbusters experiment, if they were using pure CO2, then their finding that temperature went up 1 degree more in the CO2 chamber actually understates the excess heat content. To be accurate, it is 1 degree more temperature increase over a heat capacity that is 1.3 times higher.
So heat capacity is an important factor in these experiments, but unless I am missing something, it does not vitiate any greenhouse heat-trapping confirmation that such experiments happen to find.

October 19, 2011 1:45 pm

AndiC spake, saying thusly:
Having thought about this a little, I began wondering what level of controls
can be placed over apparently fraudulent video such as these.
and went on to speak of regulation-as-cure-or-preventative.
There are some of us who believe that the best cures and preventatives involve the existence of an alert, informed, engaged populace with minimal government (available for purchase) interference and intervention.
Anything else must necessarily lead to what we have in this increasingly regulated (and out of control) environment.
We need focus on our responsibilities, and stop looking to government to provide our rights. (See the Declaration of Independence for a discussion better than I can provide of the sources of rights.

Keith
October 19, 2011 1:47 pm

Almost 100% proof (like Charlie Sheen’s breath) if anybody still needed it, that Al Gore cannot be trusted to present the case for AGW in an honest manner. I guess the ‘problem’ is that it’s very difficult to actually do so, given the lack of material with which to work.
Anthony, if you do manage to find the time to run another 30 mins with the CO2 in Jar A it’ll be absolutely rock-solid.
The fact that anybody still holds Gore up as any sort of leader is laughable. I suppose the real coup de grace of awarding the 2011 Nobel Peace Prize to Muammar Gaddafi was a missed opportunity.

Walt The Physicist
October 19, 2011 1:47 pm

While you guys are trying to do some science here Gavin Schmidt is celebrating a New Award from the American Geophysical Union Recognizes Excellence in Climate Communications. It comes with $25,000 prize. Nice response to the questions regarding Gavin’s communications during his taxpayers funded working hours.

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