Or in other words, we’ll all drive “taxis”, except for the chosen exempt few.
Obama admin. floats draft plan to tax cars by the mile: ‘A vehicle miles traveled tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven’
…
The plan is a part of the administration’s Transportation Opportunities Act, an undated draft of which was obtained this week by Transportation Weekly.
It is so spectacularly stupid, I kept waiting for it to show up on snopes.com yesterday. I just couldn’t believe it to be something under consideration. At 500 pages, the idea is one of many in the proposed bill.
Today at 10:15AM EST, the story was updated, and now the White House says this:
“This is not an administration proposal,” White House spokeswoman Jennifer Psaki said. “This is not a bill supported by the administration. This was an early working draft proposal that was never formally circulated within the administration, does not taken into account the advice of the president’s senior advisers, economic team or Cabinet officials, and does not represent the views of the president.”
Translation:
…we are shelving the idea until after the 2012 election.
The plan was to put GPS devices on cars that would report the mileage. The Hill writes:
Among other things, CBO suggested that a vehicle miles traveled (VMT) tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven; payment could take place electronically at filling stations.
I could see a huge black market for “patches and hacks” and other circumventions developing out of this. It would turn millions of people into criminals.
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Beyond absurd.
When Canadians cross the boarder, will they note the odometer reading and again when we get out and ask us to pay if we want to get out of the USA? One word… extortion.
Absolutely outrageous. The tax is in place already – the tax on gas. Absolutely no justification whatsoever for the tracking of vehicles. This is just the sort of thing that the the old USSR would love. If Americans love their freedom, the battle is not in Iraq or Afghanistan – it’s right in your own backyard. How much did you give up with ‘Homeland Security’? You see things like this and begin to wonder if the conspiracy nutters are right.
Don’t forget that with the in-built GPS tracking your distance, they will also record your speed and send the Speeding Infringement Notices later. Naturally tampering with these devices will also be a crime. Breaks into song, “Money, money, money – it’s a tax man’s world”
Welcome to the wonderful world of road charging. In 2005 the (then) UK government also announced plans for satellite-based charging, but then (a) worked out that you can’t levy taxation off the back of infrastructure belonging to another state (the US GPS system) and (b) found that the EU Galileo system which were contributing to (so could use to tax the good citizens of the this country) had turned into the usual EU graft-ridden shambles. We have therefore thankfully heard no more about it!
But I’m sure we could offer you good folks in the US a dollar or two if you allowed our govt to levy road charges off your GPS system. Mind you, for this to work you would have to promise not to switch it off and that you would maintain the system in working order for at least 20 years so that we could then base all our budgets on it, and all the relative charging rates for motorways, rush hours, school runs, evening travel and so forth.
Buddy, can you spare a dime (we’ve got a certain wedding still to pay for)?
My car insurer (AAA) asks for the mileage on my cars every year. Low mileage gets me a break on rates.
“Stephen Rasey says:
May 6, 2011 at 9:38 am
The poster “Anything is possible” is right-on.
Every state in the union has a vehicle inspection sticker for checks on safety. IF tax on miles driven should be applied, this is clearly the cheapest mechanism.
So the proposal for a GPS in every car is a fascist attempt to force everyone to buy new GPS devices from industriaists in bed with an administration who wants ever more control over its subjects. I vote no.”
No, every state does not have a vehicle inspection sticker. I have never had to have my van, which I bought right here in Kansas, inspected. Only the car I brought with me from Texas, and then they only checked for the catalytic converter and the mileage, once.
We are already taxed for every drop of gasoline we buy, why tax us for just driving? This type of tax will put massive financial burdens on those that do not live in urban areas, not to mention the trucking industry. It is a bad idea and will always be a bad idea.
Something like this has been talked about in the UK, speculation is rife that the EU Galileo SatNav project is really intended to make this viable. A variation is also being trialled for young drivers to reduce their horrendous insurance costs. This involves a GPS logger which records where and at what times of the day they drive. If they avoid heavy traffic and driving at night they get reduced premiums.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/feb/12/pay-as-you-go-car-insurance
As the WSJ editorial notably commented (don’t remember the quote verbatim):
Whatever is Obama’s and his sponsors’ spin about “the rich paying their fair share,” in the end, to finance their ideological agenda, they will rob the hard-working American middle class, for the same reason that Willie Sutton used to rob banks.
Norway used to have a per kilometer tax for diesel cars, but they removed it and increased the fuel tax instead. From the AGW perspective, I would think that a fuel tax makes much more sense, since it favors efficient cars.
These states have no emission or safety inspection.
Arkansas
Florida
Iowa
Kansas
Kentucky
Michigan
Minnesota
Montana
North Dakota
Oklahoma
South Carolina
South Dakota
Wyoming
After then it gets really fun as some states only require inspections upon title transfers, or based on age of the vehicle, or depending where you live, i.e. urban versus rural, so on and so forth. The Fed would have to step in and further erode states’ powers and considering the fuss caused over Obamacare and states being more inclined to fight the EPA, this tax is a non-winner.
jorgekafkazar says:
“One thing you can be absolutely sure of: the President’s appointees fully represent the Marxist views of the president, or they wouldn’t be there. Out with them all!”
When in the course of human events… whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it… all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government… He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance… He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our Constitution… imposing Taxes on us without our Consent… altering fundamentally the Forms of our Government… declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever… He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us… In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.
Throw the bums out.
Well, they already do. The heavier the vehicle, the lower the gas mileage, all other things being equal. Burn more gas per mile, pay more taxes. See, already done. I’ve seen the little stickers/placards on the sides of tractor-trailers; “This vehicle pays XXXX per year in taxes.” The sum represented by “XXXX” has never been less than US$7,000.
These are very interesting reactions!
In Europe we all assume that eventually “road pricing” will come. It’s inevitable because fuel economy continues to improve and of course there’ll be more and more electric vehicles on the road. So fuel tax will decline and will have to be replaced (supplemented?) with something else.
Of course GPS is the obvious answer. “They” will know where you’ve been, but they do already from the CCTV that’s everywhere and your phone that allows telcos to provide even more detail on request. And don’t forget “if you’ve nothing to hide you’ve nothing to fear”.
As for you paying tax on your gasoline already — well we’d love your tax levels over here :).
Hoser says:
May 6, 2011 at 8:54 am
More about tracking people than taxation. Plan first floated in Oregon a few years ago. If they really wanted money, they’d just raise the gas tax.
###
BTW, did you know that Oregon was the state that “invented” the gasoline tax.
Yesterday on “The Hill” they reported this story:
Obama admin. floats draft plan to tax cars by the mile: ‘A vehicle miles traveled tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven’
…
The plan is a part of the administration’s Transportation Opportunities Act, an undated draft of which was obtained this week by Transportation Weekly.
It is so spectacularly stupid, I kept waiting for it to show up on snopes.com yesterday. I just couldn’t believe it to be something under consideration. At 500 pages, the idea is one of many in the proposed bill.
Today at 10:15AM EST, the story was updated, and now the White House says this:
“This is not an administration proposal,” White House spokeswoman Jennifer Psaki said. “This is not a bill supported by the administration. This was an early working draft proposal that was never formally circulated within the administration, does not taken into account the advice of the president’s senior advisers, economic team or Cabinet officials, and does not represent the views of the president.”
Translation:
…we are shelving the idea until after the 2012 election.
The plan was to put GPS devices on cars that would report the mileage. The Hill writes:
Among other things, CBO suggested that a vehicle miles traveled (VMT) tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven; payment could take place electronically at filling stations.
I could see a huge black market for “patches and hacks” and other circumventions developing out of this. It would turn millions of people into criminals.
Anything is possible says:
May 6, 2011 at 9:00 am
Here in the UK, every car over 3 years-old has to undergo an annual MoT test to check its’ roadworthyness. The mileage is faithfully recorded.
AIP’s comment shows how easily those claiming to be democratic and free slip into authoritarian states in which the government can track anyone they choose to. The 1984 future is already here, but it was sold to us by McDonalds and we didn’t notice.
To even float the idea of putting GPS on ever car shows that some large group (eco-green thinkers) believe that all our freedoms are available if the “threat” is great enough. The Patriot Act, Homeland Security, airport screening are all infringements on the average American’s freedom that the WWII veteran would have felt unacceptable even during war. There is no end to what our governments will seek, all in the name of “our” best interests.
Once you create a bureaucracy, it will develop to protect and enhance its own existence. Those working in it will work hard and legitimately for we all wish to be validated and effective in our efforts. It is the Achilles heel of the Western philosophy of over-achievement: tomorrow I wish to do more than I did today, and I will invent ways to do more if I can’t do so as it stands.
All of us need more reflection on what is being done, not just how it is being done or how fast it is being done. But is not that the basic problem of the AGW scare? That the rhetoric is about methods and speed of “fixing” something that does not need repair?
Selling: RF-attenuating boxes, all sizes all shapes. Suitable for shielding unwanted GPS receivers. Make it look like your car is always in a parking garage.
Do it Obama, I’m going to be rich.
← Stanford claims farmers “dodged impacts of global warming” in the USA, but you have to find it first.
The “Taxing your car by the mile” plan
Posted on May 6, 2011 by Anthony Watts
Or in other words, we’ll all drive “taxis”, except for the chosen exempt few.
All private cars to be yellow in the future?
Yesterday on “The Hill” they reported this story:
Obama admin. floats draft plan to tax cars by the mile: ‘A vehicle miles traveled tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven’
…
The plan is a part of the administration’s Transportation Opportunities Act, an undated draft of which was obtained this week by Transportation Weekly.
It is so spectacularly stupid, I kept waiting for it to show up on snopes.com yesterday. I just couldn’t believe it to be something under consideration. At 500 pages, the idea is one of many in the proposed bill.
Today at 10:15AM EST, the story was updated, and now the White House says this:
“This is not an administration proposal,” White House spokeswoman Jennifer Psaki said. “This is not a bill supported by the administration. This was an early working draft proposal that was never formally circulated within the administration, does not taken into account the advice of the president’s senior advisers, economic team or Cabinet officials, and does not represent the views of the president.”
Translation:
…we are shelving the idea until after the 2012 election.
The plan was to put GPS devices on cars that would report the mileage. The Hill writes:
Among other things, CBO suggested that a vehicle miles traveled (VMT) tax could be tracked by installing electronic equipment on each car to determine how many miles were driven; payment could take place electronically at filling stations.
I could see a huge black market for “patches and hacks” and other circumventions developing out of this. It would turn millions of people into criminals.
Welcome to the future of the ‘Motor Voter’ concept.
One stop shopping for all the Government needs:
Register to vote
Register your car
Download automobile GPS tracking information
Download Cell Phone archive information
Register your guns
Declare barter income
And then all of this information becomes available to law enforcement, insurance companies and ultimately the marketing companies.
Law enforcement will want to know why an individual’s car was in the vicinity of a crime. Insurance companies will want to increase an individual’s rates for going to a “bad” section of town. The marketing companies have their uses too.
The detailed tracking information will be far more valuable that any taxes collected.
Kevin_S says: “…It was, is and always will be an absolute idiotic idea.”
That’s why absolutists like Obama like it so much.
The aptly-named ‘Progressive’ car insurance company (in the US) is now openly touting the placing of a tracking device in your vehicle in order to ‘save you money’.
Maybe my tin foil hat is almost wearing through, but I am sure that one of the facets of the EU Galileo project was to fit all cars in EUSSR with a device that would achieve the aims of the post.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_pricing
Well something of this type is coming to Europe in the future, as the GALILEO and EGNOS Projects (GPS system for Europe) continue to move forward. Road pricing of some type is inevitable over here… Clever systems based on time of travel, distance, type of roads, type of vehicle etc. have the potential to really change our way of life.
I have little doubt it will coming to the US in the future too.