
by Steven Mosher
In the last episode of “Craven Attention” I recounted some of the things Greg Craven said during a panel discussion after Oppenheimer’s lecture of the role of scientists. [GC33D The 2010 Stephen Schneider Global Environmental Change Lecture (Webcast)Moscone South, Gateway Ballroom, Room 103, 1345h–1440h Scientists, Expert Judgment, and Public Policy: What is Our Proper Role? Presented by M. Oppenheimer, Geosciences, Princeton University]
Greg seemed to take issue with my characterization of some of his comments.
I have no problem with analysis and criticism of my presentation, but I do feel strongly that the facts of it be correctly conveyed, as I have already been significantly misquoted. I expect that you do not appreciate having your statements mischaracterized or misquoted either…
But I believe some of your characterizations of what I said to be misrepresentative. You are of course free to give your assessment of my presentation, demeanor, or state of mental health. But everyone in the debate says “look at the facts and let them speak for themselves.” I ask that you do the same thing and limit yourself to quoting my actual words, criticizing them and myself as you will, without taking upon yourself to characterize what I said. I am painfully aware that I am a pathological overtalker and can’t be succinct to save my life.
I do not expect you to agree with my words or me. But I do expect you have the discipline and principle to convey the speech accurately, rather than settling for your interpretations and summaries of what I said (as you did in the “Basically it goes like this…” set-out). I’m sure that you’ll agree that characterizing your opponent’s words yourself does no service to forwarding the discussion.
And he seeks to vindicate himself by posting a transcript of the episodes.
And my remarks have already been mischaracterized and misquoted, to further malign the AGU. In the interests of accuracy and truthful reporting, I will post an audio file and transcription of my presentation as given at www.gregcraven.org as soon as I can.
He has now posted a transcript of a different presentation he gave earlier in the day. Huh? Strangely the audio that produced that transcript is still not available. The problem is my piece covered a different episode. He posted a transcript of the meeting at 1020 AM on the 15th and I covered the panel that followed Oppenheimer who spoke at 13:40-14:00. Still, we can note some things and see if it’s possible that I got the gist of what Craven was saying correct. That is, by looking at the first transcript we can see that my characterization of the second speech is not implausible. Let’s just say the second presentation was a good model for the first.
First lets note this. The Craven who cares about being misquoted had this to say; take special care to note his definition of the meaning of communication below:
my message to you now is that you must stop communicating as scientists. You must begin communicating as citizens, as a father, as a mother, with whatever feelings are in your heart, with your fears, speak to them of your hopes, let them know about your befuddlement at the divergence. And tell them frankly, forthrightly, sincerely, about any terror that you are ignoring…..
You say you want to have an effect on the public? If you trod a journey at all similar to mine, think, visualize, take five minutes to meditate on the impact it would have if you took off your goddamned scientist hat for just a moment, and put on your citizen hat. And said frankly to the public through the largest mouthpiece you can: “As a scientist, here’s my understanding. As a citizen, here’s my hope, my vision. And as a mother, here’s my contingency plan, here’s my lifeboat.”….
If you obliterated your comfort zone and the hard line of purity of your scientific sensibilities–that you do cling to, with the faith of a god–and you actually went forth as an actual advocate, a sentiment normally anathema to the constitution of a scientist, imagine if you went out into the fray bearing your heart, with your emotion and the authority of your understanding as your weapon. For what you’ve been giving them as a scientist up to now is information, and with that increasing divergence between public and scientific opinion…
You must stop selfishly pursuing your pleasure in finding things out. To be frank: f*** your research. We. Need. You. I know I am almost certain to outrage you with my impertinence and the audacity of my message. And my word choice, for substituting ‘f*** for ‘screw’. [Mild laughter.] And that’s the lesson you must absorb into the fiber of your being, for the meaning of communication is not what you intend, or the information. The meaning of communication is the response it elicits in the listener. And that’s where we have failed. So while you may be likely to forget the details of my rant, you will always feel the emotional aftertaste of it. And that is the purpose of communicating the science of climate change to the lay public. To give them an emotional aftertaste.
Your role, your job–the one we have assigned you and gladly supported–has always been to stand on the hill overlooking the bloody battlefield and give reconnaissance and convey information about what’s ahead. But there comes a time in the last stand for every single support troop, no matter how far removed, to pick up a weapon, come down into the fray, and fight to the death for what they stand for. To charge into the face of annihilation itself and fight with their teeth, tearing out the jugular of their enemy with their bloody mouth if they have no weapons left. That time is now.
If you do not believe that, if you do not feel that, I challenge you to be intellectually honest–that part of you that you hold up as better than any other profession, and I support you in that opinion–you are the only rational thinkers on the planet. Beware, psychological research shows that people don’t generally make decisions rationally. If you don’t agree with this–that this is the time to radically challenge your comfort zone, and your traditional mores of never letting feelings or opinions on policy pass your lips–I’m not going say “If not now, then when?” I’m going to say: detail an operational definition of a test to test whether a situation would merit that extreme action or not. Come up with the characteristics. And then I defy you to compare them to the situation now. If you do that, forget everything I’ve said. I absolve you. That’s all I ask. But if your intellectually honest operational definition tells you that the time is now. . . .
These snippets are from his earlier speech. However, in the panel after Oppenheimer’s talk he gave a similar version of the “comfort zone” challenge. The “emotional aftertaste” I was left with after I forgot the details of his second rant was this:
Craven took charge again and argued the “if not now, when” argument.Basically, it goes like this. As a scientist you have to decide at some point that enough is enough. You have to put your scientific commitment to the discipline of doubt aside and “blow past” your boundaries. Say what you feel, not what you can prove….
Steve Easterbrook, thankfully, asked the only intelligent question. On one hand we have Oppenheimer telling us take care when going beyond our expertise. On the other hand we have Craven, saying “blow past” your boundaries. Oppenheimer tried to paper over the difference, and Oreskes, who seemed to be shooting me looks as I sat there laughing, agreed that there was a difference between these views. Craven, breaking his promise again, read what he had been scribbling. Some sort of challenge to climate scientists that he promises to post.
I apologize if I got it “wrong,” but on Greg’s view my emotional “aftertaste” IS the meaning of what he said. I guess those years of studying Stanley Fish and Roland Barthes came in handy. Personally, I want scientists to keep their science hat on at all times. Others can panic without any practice or education. To be fair to Greg and to present his argument a bit more precisely and rigorously he seems to want scientists to speak emotionally about policy while retaining their objectivity in science. Except, for the ” f*** your research part” which is a bit hard to square with things. Craven thinks scientists research because they take pleasure in it. Removing doubt and uncertainty is an equally likely motivation. So there he seems to be saying they should put their desire to remove doubt and uncertainty aside in favor of passion. Oppenheimer’s point, on the other hand, was this: as an expert you have a problem. People make take your positions on policy to be expert scientific opinions, when they are not. And my point would be this. The passion for policy is part and parcel of the problem of trust in climate science. For Craven, the “understanding” drives the passion. But for many of the people that need to be convinced the displays of passion undermine trust in the science. That’s their emotional aftertaste.
Steven Mosher says:
December 30, 2010 at 10:53 am
I think I can make the case that if you start down the path Oppenheimer lays out, you end up with a good possibility of increasing the number of Cravens. But Cravens with credentials. So the precautionary principle would dictate that people should go down the oppenheimer path.
But I’m giving you a glimpse of where I would take this
—————————
Fair nuff. Proceed.
The facts were known,
Hundreds of WMDs Found in Iraq (Fox News, June 22, 2006)
WikiLeaks Show WMD Hunt Continued in Iraq – With Surprising Results (Wired, October 23, 2010)
Steven, it is very important that you do focus on Craven as the insanity of having a high school teacher who is famous for wearing a jester hat in an idiotic YouTube video at an AGU meeting shows the utter desperation of the alarmists. It also demonstrates that organizations like the AGU have no interest in objective science. I still cannot believe this is happening.
Dear Greg: I hope you make your way to this message.
I am reminded of the replay of the cockpit record of UA flight 585 which crashed just before landing in Colorado Springs. The cockpit voice recorder revealed tremendous restraint of emotion from the Pilot and Co-Pilot. Terse commands were issued, and executed. All for naught. In the last moments, there were expletives, as both fought to regain control of the doomed aircraft. Then silence.
The passengers of this flight, and the public at large, depend upon the rational, calculated execution of protocol from those guiding our fate. Even in the face of certain disaster.
Yet, I understand…
Who can find fault with those who yelled “FIRE!” when in fact, a fire was underway?
EVERYTHING depends on being right. And you are hopelessly wrong.
Particularly given the fraud in the temperature record and the utter absence of certainty in the outcome of the climate, YOUR CALL for alarm is akin to a pilot who sees visions of monsters among the clouds, screams into the intercom, and plunges the aircraft into the sea to escape them.
So, in summary:
Maintain composure.
Get on the right side of this issue – The temp records are fraudulent.
Get rid of the hat – It reveals who you really are.
Does anybody have Craven’s actual resume or specific degree? I suspect he at best minored in Computer Science, since Asian Studies is clearly a B.A. degree and I doubt he got a true B.S. in Computer Science too. I will bet his degree says Asian Studies and he is using a minor computer science to pad his science credentials. Because I have never met a true 38 year old computer science major who only got high speed Internet in 2007.
All I can find online is this,
“Greg holds a bachelor of science with two majors – Computer Science and Asian Studies – as well as a Master’s of Teaching.”
I am skeptical because it does not appear anywhere else online, least of all his own website.
Jeff Alberts says:
December 30, 2010 at 7:54 am
==================
Your comment leaves me wanting:
Thrall us with your acumen.
Craven’s point is a verbose version of the frequented excuse by the left.
“We’re not sending the right message”.
or “Our message isn’t getting heard”.
or “We need to express our message better or differently”
It couldn’t possibly be that the masses heard their message perfectly clear and rejected it.
Craven, the innocent high school teacher, went wading too far into the sea.
Any critisism aimed at him is really no more than yelling at him, “Hey fool, you can’t swim.”
And that hat is not a floatation device.
Craven has no degrees in the physical sciences (BA in Asian Studies and Computer Science) and , as of the past Fall semester, apparently was only teaching one period of Physics, Chemistry and Algebra II.
http://www.chspanthers.org/academics/staffpages/craven/index.htm
I’m quite happy no one this unqualified was teaching my kid physics or chemistry. My condolences to the parents residing near Central High School of Independence, Oregon.
[1] Hey look, why not let that craven clown continue the way he does? Surely the AGU members may become aware of it and convey their disapproval? (or resign in embarrassment?)
[2] Mike wrote in part at:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/12/30/craven-attention-the-sequel/#comment-562482
Hansen’s scientific work is very valuable.
Oh Really? Was that intended to be with a /sarc off?
If not, and just for an example, his gradual “it’s worse than we thought corrections” to global temperature data including to stuff way-way before his birth, and in contradiction to all the other records, are simply outrageous. Check-out this WUWT thread:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/08/29/gisstimating-1998/
The video overlay of 1999 and 2009 flip-flopped is particularly appalling.
The anti clockwise rotation of data since 1880, and diminution of the so-called 1998 “super El Nino” is beyond credibility. I guess Hansen was not pleased by everyone else, (including travesty Trenberth), noting a plateau or cooling or lack of warming, in the last decade or so. Thus, it was a good GISS-idea to chill-off 1998 to diminish that well observed plateau.
“…high school teacher who is famous for wearing a jester hat in an idiotic YouTube video at an AGU meeting…”
I didn’t watch the video and thought the photo was photoshopped.
As a scientist, the emotional aftertaste this guy leaves me with is revulsion. You can actually say this sort of stuff at an AGU meeting?
Hey it’s not like the Cravens aren’t all over the place.
We had one as the Oregon Secratery of State.
While SoS Bill Bradbury traveled the state giving Al Gore’s power point bit to groups and school kids. He even embellished it with some tall AGW tales on how Oregon as been changed.
So Craven ending up on the team with AGU in Cancun is hardly remarkable.
It’s the new norm.
I call it the revenge of the nitwits.
This Craven chap is a nutcase. To suggest abandoning logic, reason and “F%^& your research” is deeply unscientific. But then so is the whole AGW theory- it has absolutely no real basis in the physical sciences whatsoever.
Craven is advocating propaganda and emotion over reason and facts. The truth always wins out in the end.
John in L du B says:
December 30, 2010 at 9:02 pm
As a scientist, the emotional aftertaste this guy leaves me with is revulsion. You can actually say this sort of stuff at an AGU meeting?
Exactly, it’s flat out amazing! And how did Craven, a mere high school science teacher apparently without even a Bachelor of Science college degree, manage to get on the same stage as Hansen, Clum, and Oreskes? Hey, wait a minute! How did those three confirmed anti-science Climate Science lunatics even get on the AGU’s stage?……Oh oh, Houston, I think we have a problem….oops, better not call Houston! By now, thanks to Hansen, and Obama, enc., Mecca could be “the center of the World” at NASA, with Craven’s instructions intercepting all calls so as to get us up to speed on the new, “transformational” role of raw feeling-based “science” in the oh so progressive Post Normal World of Totalitarian thought control.
My Dear Mr. Mosher:
Hm… in other words, the second presentation was a good proxy for the first.
(sorry, couldn’t help it…)
Wouldn’t that require an ability to recognize (and admit) that there is no bus coming…?