Gore and Nazis

Gore / Nazis – two words I thought I’d never see together, and never wanted to. Yet here it is in a story in the Times Online. Surprisingly, Hollywood has been exploiting this linkage for years. I suppose the appearance of a proof of Godwins Law was inevitable, given how long the global warming discussion and Gore have gone on.

Does anyone else besides me get the impression that Al Gore is really reaching now? At the end of this post, Mr. Gore listed only two possible future questions, I’m sure our readers can fill in some of the missing ones. – Anthony

Addendum: I wonder, did Gore get paid for this speaking engagement “sponsored by The Times” and if so, is The Times responsible for creating this “news” where there would be none otherwise?  – Anthony

UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE:

Times_Gore-Nazi-headlineTimes_Gore-switched-headlineGore-nazi-thetimes-before-after

The Times : before and after – click for larger images – thanks to Kate for the 3rd one

Apparently reacting to criticism, The Times has changed the title of the article to remove the word Nazi, and the title takes an entirely different meaning. See the before and after screencaps above. (thanks to Bishop Hill) There is no mention of why. But they forgot to change the base HTML which still has the original title.Times_Gore-Nazi-html-source

At right  is The Times story headline now and the HTML source of the page showing the original title intact. Click thumbnails.

Here below is my original link to the story, unchanged:

Al Gore likens fight against climate change to battle with Nazis

Al Gore at The Times World Forum On Enterprise & The Environment at Keble College, Oxford

by:  Ben Webster, Environment Editor and Robin Pagnamenta, Energy Editor

Al Gore today compared the battle against climate change with the struggle against the Nazis.The former US Vice President said the world lacked the political will to act and invoked the spirit of Winston Churchill by encouraging leaders to unite their nations to fight climate change.

He also accused politicians around the world of exploiting ignorance about the dangers of global warming to avoid difficult decisions.

Speaking in Oxford at the Smith School World Forum on Enterprise and the Environment, sponsored by The Times, Mr Gore said: “Winston Churchill aroused this nation in heroic fashion to save civilisation in World War II.”

He added: “We have everything we need except political will but political will is a renewable resource.”

Mr Gore admitted that it was difficult to persuade the public that the threat from climate change was as urgent as the threat from Nazi Germany.

“The level of awareness and concern among populations has not crossed the threshold where political leaders feel that they must change.

“The only way politicians will act is if awareness raises to a level to make them feel that it’s a necessity.”

Mr Gore, who brought the issues around climate change to a mass audience with the 2006 documentary An Inconvenient Truth, said the great hope for the future lay in a high level of environmental awareness among young people.

He said sceptics who refused to believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered should consider the example of the young scientists in the NASA team which put a man on the moon on 1969.

“The average age of scientists in the space centre control room was 26, which means they were 18 when they heard President Kennedy say he wanted to put a man on the moon in 10 years. Neil Armstrong did it eight years and two months later.”

He said future generations would put one of two questions to today’s adults.

“It will either be ’what were you thinking, didn’t you see the North Pole melting before your eyes, didn’t you hear what the scientists were saying?’ Or they will ask ’how is it you were able to find the moral courage to solve the crisis which so many said couldn’t be solved?’.”

Read the rest of the article here at the Times

NOTE TO COMMENTERS: KEEP IT CLEAN, MODERATORS, SNIP AT WILL

I had to take the word “Nazi” out of our spam filter, since so many comments were getting caught by it.

I had never ever, wanted to have Nazism be a discussion on this blog, and had deleted such references in the past so as to not incite further. But when Gore makes it headline news, what choice do I have?

– Anthony

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331 thoughts on “Gore and Nazis

  1. I sense the AGW folks are getting desparate because of their lack of traction. Paul Krugman’s recent column in the NYTimes [http://iamyouasheisme.wordpress.com/2009/06/29/krugman_deep_end/] is an example…and I am a FAN of Krug’s!
    This is an interesting moment for students of democracy and policy.

  2. Just ask this of Mr. Gore every time:
    Al, you’ve enriched yourself on climate change. Why should we believe anything you say?
    Oh yeah, that’s right. He doesn’t take questions.

  3. Nazi climate change!
    Zis is terrible, ve must stop it at all cost.
    You vill use CFL light bulbs! You vill unplug
    your T.V.s. You vill not eat zee methsane farting
    meat. Oh yeah, I blame za Jews; now pass me
    two strudels.

  4. Three remarks to the subject:
    1. Gore and Co. will go in extremes to get the climate legislation in place.
    2. They are losing the arguments, otherwise the NAZI link would not be used.
    3. The USA has been blessed that this hypocrite lost the Presidential elections.
    Unfortunately with Obama we have run out of luck.

  5. Robert (09:05:12) :
    So I guess that would make Al Gore the Swiss, who also profited mightily.
    Or the Swede for that matter.

  6. If he is equating the fight of CO2 emmissions to nazis, then he does realize, doesn’t he, that with his big energy hog of a house, that he is “putting a few folks in at a time in a gas chamber” himself???
    Anthony, IMO, you should never show Gore’s face again on your blog….he is an attention whore….and that’s it!! [snip]

  7. I hope I’m not the only one who rolled their eyes when I read this! Desperation, thy name is al gore!

  8. “Mr Gore admitted that it was difficult to persuade the public that the threat from climate change was as urgent as the threat from Nazi Germany.” It was actually the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor that plunged the U.S. into WWII. So sticking to his flawed analogy here, it won’t be global warming that will persuade us to fight climate change. It will be something else – probably global cooling.

  9. Its not just Gore. This kind of rhetoric has been around for years. If a skeptic cannot be portrayed as stupid or misinformed, then evil will do nicely. Its like a left-wing version of McCarthyism.

  10. Yes, desperate pronouncements from a desperate leader. I guess he already senses the change in public attitude, that more people are becoming more “skeptic”. What will happen now to the several billion dollars business he put up based on carbon cap and trade, carbon sequestration and credits, etc., if more people and more government leaders will not listen to him and the warmers?

  11. I believe standard internet protocol states that the first person to refer to another as a Nazi has lost the argument. Having said that, one might be tempted to compare Gore to Hitler; both failed in the political arena at one point or another, both were loved or hated by large groups of people, both embraced bad science and sought to carry their horrific conclusions forward with implemented policy. Also you never saw Hitler and Al Gore at the same time… might they be the same person? Just pointing out how this sort of comparison has no valid point in a rational discussion. VP Gore should be silenced to join other former leaders such as Al Barkley, Spiro Agnew and Walter Mondale, such is his importance.

  12. “The former US Vice President said the world lacked the political will to act and invoked the spirit of Winston Churchill by encouraging leaders to unite their nations to fight climate change.”
    As a Churchillian, I find this incredibly offensive. Mister former veep, Winston would sock you if he could.
    By the way, Gore has previously referred to his critics as “digital brownshirts”, so this is hardly surprising.

  13. It would sreve Mr. Gore well to bone up on what the Nazis (National Socialists) actually did . Has he read through the freedom depriving minutiae in the C&T bill ? How far are we from green-shirted energy police in this country ? I’ll end this rant before I get started .

  14. Right war, wrong threatre: I will once again use the analogy of Gore and friends resorting to Kamikaze attacks. It’s their only hope in the face of the Truth.
    The desperation of the Alarmists is no longer a rush to “save the planet”. It is a rush to pass their taxes and regulation before the earth gets any cooler.

  15. “He also accused politicians around the world of exploiting ignorance about the dangers of global warming…..”
    If that isn’t the pot calling the kettle black I just don’t know what is!

  16. Another point-Gore is making money off of promoting AGW-Churchill not only didn’t profit from from warning of the Nazi’s, he was ostracized by the Tories.

  17. Future generations will put one of two questions to today’s adults.
    “It will either be “How did you find the courage to fight against those who would bring poverty to the earth?” Or they will ask “Please, sir, may I have anther bowl of gruel??

  18. Knowing a little bit about British history & WWII, I have a suspicion that Winston Churchill would have had this lunatic put up against the nearest available wall, & shot! After all, the great dictator Adolf Hilter was also once described as confident, charming, intelligent, witty, exuding enthusiasm, & quite quite MAD! After all AH believed in a repressive & authoritarian government of excesses, whereas WC believed in the absolute opposite so a rather strange choice of persona for AG to invoke in the name of such a regime. Brown Shirts, Black Shirts, Green Shirts, they all carry out their duties with smiles on their faces & just follow orders, it’s all the same to me! Now then, as I have come in from the exercise yard after my daily 15 minutes compulsory walk around it, as I sit here typing from the only available computer in the camp, (I get 10 minutes a month) it’s rather old & slow, we’re not allowed anything too modern, & I am watched constantly, I am sentenced to 5 years reconditioning until I join Group Think, the beatings aren’t too bad but the daily bread & water is atrocious (& my cell mate has gone missing, apparently he has been “rehabilitated”), what colour shirt will your thought police wear I wonder?

  19. He is so worried about his ass. If the Senate shoots down the Climate Action bill, it puts a serious road bump in the time frame for Kleiner Perkins green investments. I wonder if he’ll “resign” from the board if it does. They can’t be justified without legislative help and additional subsidies. The “World will End” risk has an Net Present Value of Zero.

  20. So, Al addresses a group of fellow travelers consisting of government employees (“climate scientists”) and third world politicians whose interest is in conning big money out of the west in the name of global warming, and we are supposed to….what?

  21. I do not like the analogy. Most will agree the Nazi’s were evil. (perhaps not the worst ever, but very high on the list) I would like to think Gore & Co. are just misguided. (some may say ignorant or stupid) The Skeptics are not trying to impose their will on the world, just working to prevent the Warmers from doing so.
    In the eternal struggle between Good and Evil, I realized Good threw in the towel a long time ago. The real struggle is now between Evil and Stupid.
    While Evil has better organization, Stupid has a preponderance of numbers.
    If they join forces, we are doomed. {and a few snips as well}

  22. “He said sceptics who refused to believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered should consider the example of the young scientists in the NASA team which put a man on the moon on 1969”
    Where did Werhner Von Braun, Ernst Stuhlinger, Konrad Dannenberg and the other boys come from?

  23. The spirit of Winston Churchill would tell Gore to get stuffed. He was nothing if not pragmatic; something that Gore could never be in a gazillion years.

  24. Now that’s what I call pounding the table. When you have nothing left, take your hyperbolic rhetoric from the ridiculous to the ludicrous (and perhaps, even insulting).

  25. And all of this hyperbole surfaces in the face of global temperature anomalies pegged at the 20th Century benchmark and polar ice within one SD of historical norms. How can it be that such statements can be made in the absence of empirical proof?
    Such absurdities lend me to become increasingly suspect that the Cloward-Piven Strategy of manufactured crises is at play here. Perhaps the argument needs to shift from discussing the climate data per se to revelations of the disingenuous political strategies at work that intend to radically change the fundamental socio-economic structure of the country.

  26. He must realize the enforcement of any CO2 reduction programme, will have to involve a “green police force” that checks to make sure we are not emitting GHGs without paying the piper. It will start with the energy companies, and from there expand into every activity that people associate with modern living.
    I don’t know how any rational human being could think that is comparable to fighting the nazis. It is much more like inviting the nazis to run our lives, and do so in a way that “benefits the collective, while crushing a few non-conformers”.
    He compares this to “fighting nazis, and landing a man on the moon”, but forgot to compare it to “The War on Poverty” or “The War on Drugs”. I wonder why???

  27. As an aside, there’s no indication that Churchill was ever an environmentalist. Hitler, however, was and just look what HE did. Just thought I’d mention that little factoid.

  28. John B (09:23:25) :
    …………………
    ” one might be tempted to compare Gore to Hitler”
    How about comparing him to Stalin?
    Both flunked divinity school, both globally influential politicians and both where great fans of Lysenkoism.

  29. Sorry – cannot type… …am laughing (and crying) too hard.
    Am surprised Gore did not invoke the “Dark Side of the Force”.
    My neighbour and my friend! My poor dear America! What will become of you?

  30. Seems to that the warmenist’s “we-must-do-something-just-in-case” logic is a parallel of Pascal’s Wager, with “climate change” taking the place of God:
    The existence of God can’t be proved/disproved.
    Human causes for climate change can’t be proved/disproved.
    Reasonable men should act as though God exists, there is nothing to lose.
    Reasonable men should act as though humans are to blame, there is… waitaminute.
    Well, at least the first part is applicable.

  31. If you see a downward slope in temperature-trends its weather.
    If you see record breaking snowfall its weather.
    if you see nothing happening its Global Warming.
    From a rather famous German joke during the later stages of the War.
    If you see a green plane, its British.
    If you see a silver plane, its an American.
    If you see nothing, its our mighty Luftwaffe.

  32. Dear Ron de Haan, indeed, it is just a coincidence that I wrote the polar bear story and added the logo. It is not just a swastika – it is a swastika superimposed on the Greenpeace logo, and they seem to be rotating in the same direction which is surely a coincidence, too. 😉
    I am just reading Anthony’s article for the first time.

  33. Actually, Gore is probably right for once: I bet future generations will indeed be asking, “What were you thinking?” Only they’ll be asking it of Gore, Hansen, Obama, Pelosi, Waxman, Mann, Monbiot, Greenpeace, the IPCC…

  34. The only similarities I see between the Nazis and Global Warming are in the rhetoric and propaganda used by Hitler and Gore to mislead the masses and in the crimes against humanity that both the Nazis and Albert Arnold Gore Jr. are responsible for. Al Gore should be held responsible for the impact of every dollar that should have been spent on development aid for food, clean water, vitamins, medical services, farming instruction, disaster relief, etc. and was instead funneled into his phony fight against global warming. Furthermore, if Earth continues to cool and significant crop failures occur, Al Gore should be held responsible for every starving person, because he has led the world to waste immense resources preparing for global warming, while Earth has entered a period of cooling.
    Al Gore has positioned himself to become one of the most disgraced figures in human history and hopefully he will live out his life in a prison cell.

  35. Time out Algore. We are an organic economy. We metabolize and consume water, O2 and Carbon. From what i can tell, we have never had inorganic life cycles. Maybe algore misunderstand biology. If Algore shed some blubber, it would not feel so hot. Putting on the pounds is what bears do for winter. His subconscious mind tells him it is going to get cold and stock up on the carbs or freeze.

  36. oakgeo says:
    ‘Its like a left-wing version of McCarthyism.’
    This is a great analogy since the ‘science’ of McCarthyism was settled when the Russians opened the KGB files in the 1990’s. McCarthy was largely proven correct. Many of his targets really were foreign agents funded by the KGB . Even with ‘settled science’ on his posthumous side, McCarthy is still a liberal chew toy.
    Will ‘science’ be any more relevant in this liberal grab for power and wealth?

  37. Gore’s comments are totally irresponsible.
    Some unbalanced “true believer” is going to take these comments as justification to destroy property or harm individuals.
    Mark my word. It will happen and it will be “glamorized” by the Main Street Media.

  38. What a pathetic desparate little man Gore has become.
    His comparason on the Nazi to AGW is absolutely correct but as usual he is hidding the truth. It is known that just like for AGW, bankers, industrialists and some politiciens helped Hitler rise to power. They promoted him in order to make lots of money off the world. Also, the Socialist Party was probably the first ever Green Party ever created. They were the first ones to have created environmental protection area.
    But Mr. Gore should remember then end of WWII… those that helped and supported Hitler were put on trial and executed. When is Nuremberg II ?

  39. Gore’s analogy should be turned on its head.
    He says, “the threat from climate change was (sic) as urgent as the threat from Nazi Germany,” when the inverse is true. It is the monetization and regulation of carbon that invokes Nazi Germany.
    I was inputting numbers into a carbon calculator I found on the internet and was shocked by this declaration:
    The average footprint for people in United States is 20.40 tonnes
    The average for the industrial nations is about 11 tonnes
    The average worldwide carbon footprint is about 4 tonnes
    The worldwide target to combat climate change is 2 tonnes
    The average footprint in Canada is 20 tonnes. My footprint came in at under 10 tonnes, less than half the average, but I can scarcely imagine how restricted my life would become in order to reduce to 2 tonnes annually. It would not be unlike a hunterer-gatherer lifestyle; a stark contradiction to the material world we currently enjoy.
    Also, being curious I inputted Gore’s known electricity consumption from 2006 of 191,000 kwh. His carbon footprint from electricity alone (with no consideration of plane trips, vehicle usage, heating bill, steak dinners, or clothes shopping) totalled 112 tonnes.
    It is not difficult to deduce Gore’s motivation as it most certainly cannot be saving the world from climate change. His moral adjudication of us “have nots” is not only hypocritical, it is despicable.
    http://www.carbonfootprint.com/calculator.aspx

  40. John Silver – good point . How long had the V2 technologr been around before we got to the moon ? How long have wind and solar technology been with us . Surely , in that time , someone would have found a way to make them viable as a large -scale power source without government mandates and subsidies . ( Yeah , I know , but space tech was part of an overall weapons development program ).
    UK Sceptic – another good point .

  41. My favorite from the “Hollywood” list is Tras el cristal (1987) where a former Nazi doctor turned pedophile.
    Well, gosh, what could be worse than a being a former Nazi doctor? Being a pedophile, of course. So does that mean Gore is pulling his punches?

  42. This is the same Dr. King:
    “Andrei Illarionov, former chief science adviser to President Putin:
    … in respect to the presentation made by representatives of the so-called official team of the British government and the official British climate science, or at least how they introduced themselves at the seminar. I personally was surprised by the exceptionally poor content of the papers presented…
    Simultaneously, they revealed an absolute—and I stress, absolute inability to answer questions concerning the alleged professional activities of the authors of these papers. Not only the ten questions that were published nine months ago, but not a single question asked during this two-day seminar by participants in the seminar, both Russian and foreign, were answered.
    When it became clear that they could not provide a substantive answer to a question, three devices were used… The British participants insisted on introducing censorship during the holding of this seminar. The chief science adviser to the British government, Mr. King, demanded in the form of an ultimatum at the beginning of yesterday that the program of the seminar be changed and he presented an ultimatum demanding that about two-third of the participants not be given the floor.The participants in the seminar who had been invited by the Russian Academy of Sciences, they have been invited by the president of the Academy of Sciences Yuri Sergeyevich Osipov. Mr. King spoke about “undesirable” scientists and undesirable participants in the seminar. He declared that if the old program is preserved, he would not take part in the seminar and walk out taking along with him all the other British participants.
    He has prepared his own program which he proposed, it is available here and my colleagues can simply distribute Mr. King’s hand-written program to change the program prepared by the Russian Academy of Sciences and sent out in advance to all the participants in the seminar.
    A comparison of the real program prepared by the Academy of Science and the program proposed as an ultimatum by Mr. King will give us an idea of what scientists, from the viewpoint of the chief scientific adviser to the British government, are undesirable. In the course of negotiations on this issue Mr. King said that he had contacted the British Foreign Secretary Mr. Straw who was in Moscow at the time and with the office of the British Prime Minister, Blair, so that the corresponding executives in Britain should contact the corresponding officials in Russia to bring pressure on the Russian Academy of Sciences and the President of the Russian Academy of Sciences to change the seminar’s program.When the attempt to introduce censorship at the Russian Academy of Sciences failed, other attempts were made to disrupt the seminar. At least four times during the course of the seminar ugly scenes were staged that prevented the seminar from proceeding normally. As a result we lost at least four hours of working time in order to try to solve these problems.
    During these events Mr. King cited his conversations with the office of the British Prime Minister and had got clearance for such actions.
    And thirdly, when the more or less normal work of the seminar was restored and when the opportunity for discussion presented itself, when questions on professional topics were asked, and being unable to answer these questions, Mr. King and other members of the delegation, turned to flight, as happened this morning when Mr. King, in an unprecedented incident, cut short his answer to a question in mid sentence realizing that he was unable to answer it and left the seminar room. It is not for us to give an assessment to what happened, but in our opinion the reputation of British science, the reputation of the British government and the reputation of the title “Sir” has sustained heavy damage.”
    It’s the mad hatter’s tea party

  43. Shanta (10:00:33) :
    Interesting article. So basically,
    1. If there is cooling trend , it’s all natural.
    2. If there is a warming trend, human’s contribution is written ALL OVER IT!!!
    Neither can be proved or disproved. But it doesn’t matter, just shut up and pay your carbon tax as we advance our one-world socialistic agenda.

  44. The article provided does not actually put the word “Nazi” in Mr. Gore’s mouth, let alone suggest that skeptics of AGW would be those Nazi’s in that formulation. If anything, if one wants to push that icky analogy, skeptics would be Baldwin, Chamberlain, and the America First Committee!
    Have we really gotten to the point where you can’t slather love on Churchill’s leadership abilities and political courage without being accused of calling political opponents Nazis? Really?

  45. How a world leader can disgrace the public trust with lies [those two last questions]….is beyond me.
    Begs the question. Is it mental illness? Or is he just not that bright??
    Could he be stricken with the same madness that Hansen and his Nazi illusions to the coal trains??
    NO Mr. Gore. Future generations will be asking THIS question:
    How was the greatest scientific hoax since the days of the Inquisition, propagated for so long, with so much boldface and blatant deception, and with such blatant disregard to so many dissenting scientists, physicists, and specialists throughout the world??
    THAT is the question they will be asking.
    In the meantime we will sit back and watch Gore, Hansen, Waxman and others continue to trip on their words and shake in their boots…as their new world religion slowly starts to fall apart.
    Chris
    Norfolk, VA, USA

  46. So which is worse; having a bunch of “science realists” acting like “nazis” to imperil mankind and the planet by ho-humming climate change; or to have a bunch of borderline criminally insane “control freaks” frantically trying to do real damage to the planet, and its people; just to feather their own political nests ?
    I hope the warmists are covering their rear ends, to prepare for the contingent liability they will face; when their whole phony house of cards finally comes tumbling down; and it will come tumbling down. And if you are a “scientist” who is aiding and abetting this bunch, because they pay for your research funding (using our money); get used to the ridicule that will be your legacy.
    I can’t believe some of the clap trap that passes for science, in that discipline called “Climatology”.
    George

  47. Hansenitis seems to be spreading. However, Gore at least only equates the perceived problem to Naziism, and doesn’t explicitly equate his opponents to Nazis. They, by implication are more like Chamberlains than Goerings.
    Paul Krugman, on the other hand (see link to NYT column in the first comment above, by Lichanos), equates dissent itself to “treason” (to the earth). So when do we lock the traitors up?
    “Greenshirts” is a great term for Hansen and his accomplices!

  48. It’s interesting that Big Al feels he has to remind his followers that his implied use of the label “deniers” (e.g. Holocaust deniers) is to be understood as synonymous with the label, “Nazis.”

  49. “”” P Walker (10:22:42) :
    John Silver – good point . How long had the V2 technologr been around before we got to the moon ? How long have wind and solar technology been with us . Surely , in that time , someone would have found a way to make them viable as a large -scale power source without government mandates and subsidies . ( Yeah , I know , but space tech was part of an overall weapons development program ).
    UK Sceptic – another good point . “””
    It’s very simple; the “solar constant” is about 1366 Watts/metre squared, which translates to about 1000 W/m^2 on the ground (best case peak) but averages onl;y 168 W/m^2 long term.
    So no matter the technology that translates into simply huge areas of land required to be dedicated to renewable green energy collection. It’s a little more efficient than clambering around in fig trees gathering figs; but not by much.
    Remove ALL of the subsidies for these green energy revolutions, and see how many of them remain viable; they aren’t even viable with the subsidies (which come at the cost of a whole lot of fossil fuel energy profitable private enterprise.

  50. Gore’s plan….
    Shut down our energy production, shut down our factories, everyone go on welfare and live off of the Gov. Hum, wait a minute, who is going to pay the taxes to support that?
    I bet China will like that very much, they will gladly use all the oil and all the coal and take all the production they can get.
    Fire up the windmills boys…we need to see the light! But captain, the wind, she’s a not blowing. Well than, turn on the solar panels, we can’t see in here. But captian, it’s night time. Well than, turn on the batteries. But captian, they are banned due to all those heavy metals. Well than, just start a fire and burn some wood.

  51. Gore is right about his two questions, but incomplete. There are two more in play “3) You spent HOW MUCH on a problem that didn’t really exist?! You couldn’t wait for the evidence to become more conclusive as to what whas happening and what was causing it?” and “4) Those guys wanted to spend HOW MUCH on a problem that didn’t really exist!? Thank god you stopped them.”
    But one or the other of those sets of two questions will be in play fifty years from now, make no mistake. Either the skeptics go down as snivelling appeasers who weren’t willing to make hard choices when history called, or as heroes who saved untold treasure to be spent in better pursuits. Either the AGWers go down as the worst black eye ever self-inflicted in the history of science, or as heroes.
    It WILL be one or the other.

  52. GerryM,
    Do you have a link to the article?
    A sad yet succinct commentary on the “science” of climate change.

  53. I barely use any energy compared to most, live quite a simple existence, eat once or twice a day (I have a couple of protein shakes to make up for it), don’t drive, walk everywhere. These online carbon calculators say I use 3 tons of CO2 annually and that I need to reduce that by a third to get rid of my “guilt”. In order to eliminate that third I would have to literally do nothing, stay in bed and hardly ever eat or wash. Some economy we would have if everyone did that. Within a year or two, millions of people would lose their incomes from the diminished consumer market and across the poorest parts of the world there would be incredible amounts of famine and violence.
    Sounds like green heaven. The New York and Los Angeles rich live, the poor die off, and the world’s population is reduced to just enough to sell crap movies and shite music to.

  54. This use of the term Nazi belittles the fact that we USA,Britain,Australia,and New Zealand,all fought to destroy militant Fascism. My own late Father-in-Law:
    Normandy,Battle of the Bulge,the Brige at Remagen,Aachen-and Dachau. Dachau.To have someone throw the term Nazi out should tour the Holocaust Museum.Or set down with an old fading vet and hear the story first hand.Any one who uses that phrase or tactics has no idea what the real Nazis were like.Unless they might be jealous…

  55. Very clever propaganda. He doesn’t actually call us deniers/skeptics/climate realists Nazis, but the implication is certainly there. This ties in very nicely with the statement by Grist Magazine’s staff writer David Roberts, who wrote on September 19, 2006, “When we’ve finally gotten serious about global warming, when the impacts are really hitting us and we’re in a full worldwide scramble to minimize the damage, we should have war crimes trials for these bastards — some sort of climate Nuremberg.” Then, we have Hansen with his recent statements “The trains carrying coal to power plants are death trains” and “Coal-fired power plants are factories of death”, thus invoking the Holocaust, and even the “denier” label they use for us equates us with Holocaust deniers”. Yes, indeed, a definite pattern. And these are but a few examples.
    Yes, they are indeed getting desperate, but even more dangerous to humanity.

  56. Churchill is rolling over in his grave.
    How dare this charlatan invoke the name of that hard-nosed realist who’d have dismissed this nonsense with a shrug and left the AGW’ers tearing and choking in a cloud of cigar smoke as he proceeded to face the real threats to civilization.

  57. KLINK
    Prisoners. From time to time, as commandant of Camp Thirteen, out of my own free will I bring you news, of the war of which you are no longer a part. (pause) Things continue to go well for the all-victorious 3rd Reich.
    There is some muttered reaction from the prisoners, which the guards attempt to repress. Klink raises a tolerant hand.
    KLINK
    (continuing) You would wish it otherwise, but it is necessary to deal with facts. New and powerful weapons [of fear] continue to pour from our factories — I have just returned from a nearby Panzer division, completely equipped with the new and secret “Hurricane tanks,” which will crush resistance like an eggshell.
    There are WHISTLES of derision from the POWs, which the guards seek to quell. Klink becomes a litle angry.
    KLINK
    (continuing) The Allies would love to get their hands on one, believe me!
    Klink then composes himself, and goes on:
    KLINK
    (continuing) However. As prisoners, you should look upon this latest weapon of the invincible Third Reich as another guarantee that the war will soon be over. Dismissed!
    Hogan steps forward and salutes Klink.
    HOGAN
    Colonel Klink.
    Klink returns the salute.
    KLINK
    Yes, Colonel Hogan.
    HOGAN
    This panzer division, with the new Hurricane tanks… you said they were west of here?
    KLINK
    North. (immediately, suspicously) What is that to you?
    HOGAN
    Just – asking.
    In this exciting episode, Algore IS Colonel Hogan! Adapted from “Hold that Tiger!” Written by: Richard Powell, June 4, 1965.

  58. D. King (09:11:25)
    I about spit out my Diet Coke on that one.
    what were you thinking, didn’t you see the North Pole melting before your eyes?
    Is he speaking for future generations or Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer?

  59. Al’s doing a lot of flying lately, and soon to be in Melbourne, Australia, that’s a lot of nasty CO2 (In Australia, the NSW gummint shows us CO2 are little black balloons, floating up into the sky to kill the earth. No hang on, the Sun will do that, eventually).
    Oh but wait, he owns a UK based “carbon trading” company, he’ll buy his own offsets, from himself and offset that cost against, well, tax. He’s rich too, bring on that wealth tax, that’ll shut him up (One can only hope).

  60. It’s interesting that Mr. Gore feels he has to remind his followers of the implied use of the label “deniers” (e.g. Holocaust deniers). After all, even the Nazi Holocaust would appear to be a lesser crime against humanity than the unspeakably evil alleged destruction of the entire Earth by manmade global warming.

  61. But it won’t be the climate scientists that will pay is it? They will be long retired. As usual, just like with the bwankers, it will be the little people to pick up the pieces and have a 10% rise in income tax, as a result of their fraud.

  62. Shawn Whelan (10:38:22) :
    Hopefully this is the, “End of the beginning” for the global warming scam.

    We’ll know soon if it will beginnning a new beginning or just ending.
    If they succeed then we’ll know its true face.

  63. Gore likens himself to Winston Churchill fighting the Nazis. In reality, the more appropriate WWII leader analogy would be Joseph Stalin through the autocratic methods he’d implement.

  64. Probably this will be as costly as WWII, so it isn’t surpricing that Gore make this comparison. This is the logical continuation of this insanity, but isn’t he realize that a climate realist then can be regarderd as immoral as a nazi?
    A bit offtopic: A talk show interview with prof Lindzen, where he mention his problem recently as eine Denier to get a rug appraiser:
    http://audio.wrko.com/m/audio/24111309/richard-lindzen-global-warming-denier.htm
    An oriental rug site mentions this important event:
    http://www.rugrag.com/post/Burnt-Rug-Appraiser.aspx
    It’s good to see that the awareness about slandering of realists penetrates through our rug society. First they come to deny our burned rugs…
    Politicians have to be a bit brave now and stop this CO2 mania!

  65. For Al Gore to make any kind of comparison between the potential hazards of global warming and the real war against Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany during World War II can only mean one thing –

    Although I think Al would make a much better Potsie than the Fonz.

  66. It seems to me that when Al lost his bid for the presidency, he got his feelings hurt. He may have felt that the whole world hated him. He went off to hug some trees and after quite some time came up with a plan to pay everyone back for the disgrace he felt he had suffered. What better plan than AGW. This way he could pay everyone back for the anguish he felt at losing the presidency and also make a considerable amount of money. It always comes down to power and money. I think this may be why it seems he is going through life not listening to anyone except the people that are also proffiting from this scam.

  67. That corpulent (deleated alliterative participle) clown has sunk lower than whale (deleated noun). Never underestimate the self-righteous stench of a megalomaniacal con man.
    Perhaps if he is made to eat enough of the (deleated noun) he is still trying to sell, he will collapse into a singularity–thereby supplying us with an inexhaustible power source we could actually use.
    “Save the Planet–Feed Al Another Bearclaw” Perhaps that should be polar bear claw?

  68. I don’t know which is more abhorrent: the fact that Gore is implying that skepticism over AGW is equivalent to Nazism or the fact that he is casting himself in the role of Churchill.

  69. Unfortunately, many in our congress have already swallowed this [bait], hook, line and sinker. Dems in the senate will feel compelled to offer SOMETHING in response to Obama’s call for a climate bill. There seem to be only a handful of conservatives who have realized that the “crisis” is in fact, a fantasy.

  70. This is “called psychological projection”, where the unconscious mind reveals itself to external observers without noticing it.
    as Max said above: Keep talking, Al.
    “The Fish Is Caught From Its Mouth”

  71. Godwin’s law should be fleshed out in the details of evolutionary nature. Many posts ago, I suggested an antemortem to the AGW debate made up these parts:
    1) Honest scientists investigate a rise in CO2 and temperature having conceived of the idea from the atmosphere of Venus’s CO2-temp. An investigation on earth gives some support to a theory of C02 rise creating temp rise.
    2) Broad interdisciplinary studies are done and funds seem to be available for more and more, creating a motive for drowning out dissenting science.
    2) The theory shows signs of unravelling when dissenters start amassing scientific facts that refute the theory
    3) When the theory begins to be falsified, scientists of integrity begin to step over to the other side.
    4) Only the shrill residue, who have made extravagant claims: 100months to save our planet; new world high temp record within 3 years (two years ago), Ice gone in five years, the Maldives underwater by 2100 (or earlier?), etc. remain. No new science is done. No refutation of new science. Just shrill hyperbole, personification of those holding apposing view as evil, nazis etc and a desperate rush to push politicians to reverse CO2 (get rid of the evidence) to hide the truth that AGW theory is dead.
    I believe their argument had invoked Godwin’s law from the beginning by using the term “deniers” when the first dissent began to emerge.

  72. “Most men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up and continue as if nothing happened.”
    Winston Churchill

  73. Gore gets away with saying silly things because almost none of us know the real history of WWII (we do know the equipment, the battles, the officers, etc.) or WWI for that matter. Hitler was not bankrolled just to make money for the industrialist/banker classes as the shallow excuse goes. Like AGW it’s the media that makes it all possible.
    The addendum query is spot on.

  74. Algore suffers from a common problem on the left- they fall for their own propaganda, in this case the myth propagated by the education industry, that the the Nazis were a “party of the right.” Not to belabor the point with this group, but does “National Socialist German Workers Party” sound like a bunch of conservatives? The only politician of that era entitled to call the Nazis “right wingers” was Stalin. He despised them not because they were ideological opposited, but because they were dangerous rivals for leadership of the far left.
    Today liberals still make the same claim and, for once, they’re telling the truth about themselves. They are somewhat left of Fascism

  75. Mr. Gore has it backwards. Fighting climate change believers is like fighting the Nazis because both are narrowminded and hate filled. Both believe propaganda without proof. It is the skeptics who are asking for proof all the while showing how wrong you are.
    I just wish I had 5 minutes to question Mr. Gore. I would ask him one simple question: would you be willing to stand before an impartial panel to debate with a skeptic? Of course the answer would be no, because facts are a climate change advocate’s worst nightmare. The skeptic would. The Nazis would do no such thing like Mr. Gore would not. The parallels are clear between the AGW crowd and Nazis, yet somehow it is the skeptic crowd who is nothing like Nazis who are the Nazis. Go figure.

  76. It is nice to see that several posters have picked up the irony, probably unknown to Gore, that Hitler was himself an environmentalist. On paper, you couldn’t do better.
    Resume A. Hitler: Hitler is a visionary leader, who is working hard to improve local environments for (most) Germans to enjoy. His latest project is a blanket conservation area surrounding the Black Forest region of Germany, in which all commercial development is banned. He hopes to improve this still more by continuing to relocate manufacturing into regions further east. Hitler is also a strict vegetarian and non smoker.
    When you throw mud, be careful none sticks to yourself.

  77. [snip- the parallels you make are just too ugly for discussion here, sorry – Anthony]

  78. From above: “Greenshirts” is a great term for Hansen and his accomplices!
    I like the term “Gang Green”, that someone used here in a previous post.

  79. I had to take the word “Nazi” out of our spam filter, since so many posts were getting caught by it.
    I had never ever, wanted to have Nazism be a discussion on this blog, and had deleted such references in the past so as to not incite further. But when Gore makes it headline news, what choice do I have?
    – Anthony

  80. I am sorry to say that the only reason there is such a push on the man made Global Warming front is that it has become nothing more than a grab by individuals for money, by scientists for funding, and by governments for power and control. They have to pass Cap and Trade in the U.S. before it gets colder and the hoax is exposed.
    My background was chemistry so I am more of a scientist than Al Gore. Whenever I tried to have a reasonable discussion with the Global Warmers I was taken aback by the degree of vitriol these people spew in your direction when they determine you are not onboard. So, instead of the discussions I am used to when talking about science where people actually put their heads ‘together’ to arrive at the TRUTH, it turns into an adolescent food fight. I can only say that the experience is similar to discussions with religious fundamentalists. They have all the answers, don’t bother them with the facts, the debate is over.
    I know this sounds farfetched but is it possible they may make us “Global Warming Deniers” outlaws? If you had told me that CO2 was going to be classified as a pollutant 5 years ago I would have thought that was farfetched.

  81. To follow the WW2 analogies and to cast an eye to the proposed cap-and-trade legislation:
    US Cap-and-trade proposal:
    “Never before in history have so many given so much to so few for so little benefit.” (with apologies to Sir Winston Churchill)

  82. Realising that pseudo-science only worked for a limited time they use what works best in politics… a strong emotional reaction. Cute polar bears and all those other “nature” pictures did not work so what else is left… The Crusifixtion? naaa.. only a small fraction of humanity believe that.
    They use the same sort of tactique in Quebec when they talk about separation. Logic tells people they should not separate but when they use strong emotions with almost-racist terms, yeah they get a few more people.
    The use of strong emotions in political statments has always and will always get people on-board. Soldiers die all the time because they got “called” by emotional speeches.

  83. Desperation time … The snows of winter, piling up it seemed like forever, doomed the AGW hoax. And it looks like we are in for a repeat. The sun will not be denied no matter what name calling Al Gore uses.
    Here is another truism worth noting — the ticking time bomb of unemployment will detonate when it’s ready.

  84. By his analogy… all those who beleive in AGW are then the “Collaborators”. Well, the WW2 collaborators were also put on trial and executed.

  85. L, I think the NAZI party ended with the Night of the Long Knives. They just kept the name and Hitler in place. Mussolini described fascism and fascism it was. Lose the Left-Right dichotomy; it’s a false creation to keep good people at each others’ throats. Every regular “leftist:” I know (they are my friends) is a great person who wants the best for themselves and for others. Every regular “rightist” (they are my friends) is exactly the same except they don’t want to pay quite as much for it. Both sides are completely mislead by their leaders who are the winkers and the nodders in this case.

  86. July 05, 2009
    Black Ribbon Protest of Cap-n-Trade
    Dana Mathewson
    Received from a friend in Virginia.
    1.) BLACK RIBBON PROTEST AGAINST CAP AND TRADE BILL
    (Black Ribbon for certain “death of American Economy”)
    A nation-wide silent protest has started against the Cap and Trade
    legislation that was rammed through the House of Representatives on June
    26. This 1200 page bill was passed 219-212 after Representatives were
    given less than 24 hours to read its contents. There is not a single
    person in Congress who could have digested all 1200 pages in such a
    short period of time. Below is a link to a great article on the bill and
    how it will destroy our nation’s economy. It is all about control and it
    is time for us to peacefully resist the tyranny.
    ACTION ITEM
    This protest is easy yet very visible and effective. Tie a black ribbon
    made of any material available (strip of fabric, black garbage bag or
    other material) on trees, streetlight poles, antennas and anything else
    that you choose to decorate, or an armband, hairband or lapel ribbon.
    The black ribbon represents the certain death of the American economy
    that this bill will bring if passed. This will travel fast and will send
    an extremely powerful message to all 100 senators that “We the People”
    do not support this bill. We must not allow this legislation to reach
    the President’s desk. Spread the word and let’s decorate the whole
    country with black ribbons! (to be removed, of course, after the vote)
    If you don’t know enough about how Cap and Trade will destroy the
    American economy go here to read more.
    http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102627535330&s=2463&e=001yI3Qj3jYIEfF1GGNiMnkz_KMMnDybsAPsXQ_jpM5cYug7Ugd1PQjDtSOHXIk6D6dO19nRp09GWjlW9lZC2BFConfn7ta3lWey8tQM7tlIeyHCFJCFmDTR_iFJyd6ZWAjxeySSC3hHWZSHJVBQ2CxVaB0qVA7WUdgALDf8x2TYOofFMp3t-Sb-QSj_OK1ZrW8_DlSOctAgIw=
    If this legislation reaches the President’s desk, he will change our
    lives forever and sign away millions of American jobs with one stroke of
    his pen. We can’t allow that to happen.
    From http://tbirdnow.mee.nu/black_ribbon_protest_of_cap-n-trade

  87. A little OT:
    This report:
    http://www.scienceblogs.de/primaklima/G8_Scorecards_2009.pdf
    prepared jointly by the WWF and the Allianz insurance giant, and distributed to the media and policy makers, compares CO2 emissions and progress on mitigation for the G8 countries. When noticing France AND Germany in similar places on the list, I looked a little further. France, according to this report, has still fairly high emissions from electricity production. A small footnote under one of the graphs though explains why:
    “WWF does not consider nuclear power to be a viable policy option. The indicators “emissions per capita”, “emissions per GDP” and “CO2 per kWh electricity” for all countries
    have therefore been adjusted as if the generation of electricity from nuclear power had produced 350 gCO2/kWh (emission factor for natural gas). Without the adjustment, the
    original indicators for France would have been much lower, e.g. 86 gCO2/kWh.”
    So basically, France’s CO2 emissions from electricity production are produced by ideological bias, not by fossil fuel combustion.
    This “new scientific method” seems to become more and more accepted practice. If your data does not fit your ideology, change the data.
    That they even blantantly admit it shows how acceptable this process now is in certain quarters.

  88. Conservative&denialist (11:46:09) This is “called psychological projection”, Agreed! but further, it is a common political ploy being used more often in the past couple of years, it seems to me. Label your opponent with the worst that descibes your own tactics, so the label can’t be used on yourself first.

  89. If you assume that a war to save the planet from CO2-driven warming is analogous to the war against Nazism, then the strategy of Taxman/Malarkey is equivalent to a D-Day invasion of Bermuda.

  90. Just thank your lucky stars he didn’t use the analogy of Galileo and the unbending Catholic Church.
    “Mr Gore, who brought the issues around climate change to a mass audience with the 2006 documentary An Inconvenient Truth, said the great hope for the future lay in a high level of environmental awareness among young people.”
    How about just continuing to do some good f—— science instead and let people decide for themselves, Al?

  91. Tried to look through the thread to see if anyone had noted this, didn’t see it…maybe it happened just a bit ago…
    It seems they’ve changed it over at the Times…
    It now reads:
    Al Gore invokes spirit of Churchill in battle against climate change
    Al Gore invoked the spirit of Winston Churchill today by encouraging political leaders to follow the example of Britain’s wartime leader and unite their nations to fight climate change. …”
    Still shows up in Google with the original headline:
    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=al%20gore%20nazis%20site%3Awww.timesonline.co.uk&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

  92. The “average age in the Mission Control Center” was 26?
    Maybe, if you had 100 “meter readers” with specific functions, watching a gauge, and flipping a switch to respond to something. Remember, the “RAM” on the Lunar lander was like 80 KB in size. (So a LOT of functions were performed by HUMANS not machines.)
    However, if one talks the DEVELOPMENT group, the 70 plus GERMAN rocket scientists who were CRUCIAL to this effort, were all in their 40’s and 50’s.
    Speaking about the term “Naught-Sies” (notice the side step on the filter, Anthony!), the developers of the system to do Apollo probably included quite a few who bore that identity about 25 years previous.
    Evidently A.G. doesn’t believe people can (and do) change. Climate change, but NO personal “change”.
    Of course, then A.G. gives a good example of a personality set in “stone”.

  93. The skeptics are not the one “burning the books” here. It is they who take previous records and expunge or alter them, replacing as if nothing had changed. Had it not been for the work of Anthony and others exposing the station mess, I would never have known what was happening. Nor would I have taken a hard look at weather records.

  94. Looks as though they’ve missed changing the title of the html page to match new headline for the time being, as well.

  95. Is it just my imagination, or has the title of the Times piece changed to delete “Nazis” from it? And, looking at the video, if it is complete, the word “Nazi” never passed Gore’s lips.
    Old sensational fighting words title: “Al Gore likens fight against climate change to battle with Nazis”
    New title actually having some resemblance to what the man said: “Al Gore invokes spirit of Churchill in battle against climate change”
    Does Gore really need to be pummelled here, or the Times?

  96. Yes. Under it’s previous editor the Times of London was only slightly green, he would publish articles from such as David Bellamy, one a green icon, who argues that it’s just weather.
    Furthermore he would publish letters that debunked various scare stories: such as the one that global warming would stop the Gulf Stream.
    The new editor is relentlessly green and seems to have appointed endless numbers of eco reporters, editors etc: see the above credits.
    So we unfortunate readers are treated to an endless diet of eco bunkum, some of which is so hilarious it’s almost worth the price. And as a Times reader all my life I know editors and fashions come and go so I may be prepared to sit this one out.
    Naturally whenever some piece of utter eco balderdash is given the full half or even full page treatment I write them a simple letter, short and sweet and confined to demonstrable facts. I am up to about two or three a month now.
    Naturally they never publish my letters: I do not expect them to but nevertheless a protest must be made.
    The current amusement is a half page on how the Great Barrier Reef will be dead within twenty years: according to the former chief scientist of the Australian Institute of Marine Science: one Charlie Veron. Naturally this scenario is endorsed by various worthies.
    The article, a full half page, goes on to explain how the corals will suffer as the oceans warm and how acidifation of the oceans due to higher CO2 levels in the atmosphere will further damage them. What utter stuff and nonsense.
    Given the difficulties that the Australian government is having in getting it’s pet cap and trade bill through it’s Senate the timing and the awful warning, which as I need hardly explain to readers here is total bunkum, I thought the timing somewhat convenient.
    So I have written to the Times pointing this out.
    But don’t expect them to print it: I am sure my immortal prose is destined for the spike. But as aforesaid a protest must be made.
    Kindest Regards

  97. Lubos Motl (10:11:13) :
    Dear Ron de Haan, indeed, it is just a coincidence that I wrote the polar bear story and added the logo. It is not just a swastika – it is a swastika superimposed on the Greenpeace logo, and they seem to be rotating in the same direction which is surely a coincidence, too. 😉
    I am just reading Anthony’s article for the first time.
    Thanks Lubos for the explanation.
    The WWF initials would be more appropriate.
    I love your blog, your keen spirit and visit on a regular basis.
    Keep up the good work.

  98. Pierre Gosselin (12:37:56) :
    No, the people supporting the idea of AGW are the collaborators since AGW is analogue to Nasi. If you support the Nasi you are a collaborator… is you support AGW you are a collaborator.

  99. “Green Shirts”…perfect. That may be a moniker that helps nail shut the coffin on what has become a worldwide homeowners association from hell: Environmentalism.

  100. More Gore reference, this time to a US Senator.
    Jul 06, 2009
    Open letter to Senator Mark Begich
    By Robert Felix
    6 Jul 09
    Dear Senator Begich,
    As someone who loves my country, I urge you to vote NO on the upcoming Control-and-Tax bill, a bill purportedly designed to fight “global warming.”
    What global warming?
    Senator Begich, are you aware that glaciers are growing in your own state?
    Yes, glaciers are growing in Alaska.
    According to the US Geological Survey (USGS), glaciers are growing in Alaska for the first time in 250 years. In May, Alaska’s Hubbard Glacier was advancing at the rate of seven feet per day – more than half-a-mile per year. And in Icy Bay, at least three glaciers have advanced one-third of a mile in one year, said Chris Larsen, a scientist at the Geophysical Institute at the University of Alaska Fairbanks.
    Senator Begich, I wish you would ask the USGS for a list of glaciers in Alaska, and ask them to tell you – honestly – which ones are growing. I have a feeling that there are more glaciers growing in Alaska than any of us have been told.
    My fear is that that there is a giant cover up going on, especially given the fact that glaciers are also growing in California (Mt. Shasta) and Washington (Mt. Rainier, Mount St. Helens, and Glacier Peak).
    Every time I read about another growing glacier, I’m told that it’s “the only glacier in the world that is bucking the global warming trend.”
    But that’s not true.
    Perito Moreno Glacier, the largest glacier in Argentina, is growing. Pio XI Glacier, the largest glacier in Chile, is growing. Glaciers are growing on Mt. Logan, the tallest mountain in Canada. Glaciers are growing on Mt. Blanc, the tallest mountain in France.
    Glaciers (230 of them) are growing in the Western Himalayas. Glaciers are growing in Norway. Recently, all 50 glaciers in New Zealand were growing. Glaciers in Greenland are growing thicker. And contrary to what we’ve being told, the Antarctic Ice Sheet is growing, not shrinking.
    More than 90 percent of the world’s glaciers are growing, but all that we hear about are the ones that are shrinking.
    Not only are glaciers growing around the world, temperatures are dropping precipitously.
    Are you aware that low temperature records were set in 46 states during the month of June? According to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), some 538 low temperature records were set in June alone.
    This temperature drop is not restricted to the United States.
    According to Dr. Roy Spencer, climatologist and former NASA scientist, satellite data for June shows that the earth has cooled an astounding 0.74 degrees F since former Vice President Al Gore released his propaganda piece “An Inconvenient Truth” in 2006.
    Again, I urge you to vote NO on any Control-and-Tax bill.
    As author of the book Not by Fire but by Ice, and publisher of Ice Age Now, I can provide corroboration of the facts that I am presenting to you today, including links to do just that in this PDF.
    Respectfully,
    Robert W. Felix
    Submitted by Hans Schreuder
    Darsham, UK
    I Love My Carbon Dioxide
    Technical Submissions
    Ignorance is temporary. Stupid is forever. Stop the insanity over man-made climate change – it does not exist.
    From Icecap.us

  101. John Silver (09:51:42) : “He said sceptics who refused to believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered should consider the example of the young scientists in the NASA team which put a man on the moon on 1969″ Where did Werhner Von Braun, Ernst Stuhlinger, Konrad Dannenberg and the other boys come from?
    Well noted, John Silver.
    UK Sceptic (09:59:38) : As an aside, there’s no indication that Churchill was ever an environmentalist.
    There’s a great story about him from his house at Chartwell. His secretary brought in a bunch of flowers from the garden, and was told to take them away. “I thought you liked flowers” she said. “I like children. But I don’t want their heads chopped off and put in a vase” he replied.
    Elizabeth (10:22:19) :
    The average carbon footprint for people in United States is 20.40 tonnes…
    The worldwide target to combat climate change is 2 tonnes…
    I inputted Gore’s known electricity consumption from 2006 of 191,000 kwh. His carbon footprint from electricity alone (with no consideration of plane trips, vehicle usage, heating bill, steak dinners, or clothes shopping) totalled 112 tonnes.

    What’s Gore’s full footprint? Anyone able to compute it?
    AG said future generations would put one of two questions to today’s adults.
    “It will either be ’what were you thinking, didn’t you see the North Pole melting before your eyes, didn’t you hear what the scientists were saying?’ Or they will ask ’how is it you were able to find the moral courage to solve the crisis which so many said couldn’t be solved?’.”

    No. The questions are, rather, Were you a scientist? Did you know what was really going on? Where were you when brownshirts and fanatics insinuated themselves into all the positions of leadership in Science? Did you stand by and say nothing, when you knew they were usurpers and shrill accusers, debasing trust, prostituting Science, selling lies, and selling people into poverty for personal gain?

  102. The Times Changed the title and wording of the article!
    Does anybody have an open browser window with the original story headline? If so screencap it (Alt-PrintScreen and paste into paint program, save) leave a note in comments, and upload to Flickr or similar service and I’ll post here.
    GOT IT – Thanks to Bishop Hill
    -Anthony

  103. Looks like we have another modern idiom.
    The old chestnut used to be: ‘what is a racist?’ – someone who disagrees with a Liberal.
    The new truism appears to be: ‘what is a Nazi?’ – someone who disagrees with a Greenie.

  104. Anthony – if you look at the source of the article with the new title, you can see that the title is still there.

  105. Just The Facts (10:13:25) :
    “………Al Gore should be held responsible for the impact of every dollar that should have been spent on development aid for food, clean water, vitamins, medical services, farming instruction, disaster relief, etc. and was instead funneled into his phony fight against global warming…………
    Al Gore has positioned himself to become one of the most disgraced figures in human history and hopefully he will live out his life in a prison cell.”

    Isn’t it the truth.

  106. funny.. I just posted the code above and the original title appeared.


    Video: Al Gore likens fight against climate change to battle with Nazis – Times Online

  107. If you look at it, what were the primary rules of Hitler?
    Never allow the public to cool off
    Never admit a fault or wrong
    Never concede that there may be some good in your enemy
    Never leave room for alternatives
    Never accept blame
    Concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong
    People will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.
    Are Gore & co. really taking on that platform, or is this merely a case of the pot calling the kettle black? Much of the above list has been used prior to the Nazis, only they did it with deadly ferocity. Politics is oft an exercise in the mud. As long as I have my freedom of speech and can disagree, the threshold of Nazi has not yet been crossed.
    Monkeying the data and cooking the results are nothing new. Fixing the intelligence to fit the policy and innovative bookkeeping are wrong, but they are not proprietarily National Socialist. Al Gore gets more unbelievable as the days go by. Winston Churchill? Al Gore is no Winston Churchill, and the growing number of skeptics are not preparing the Luftwaffe and Wehrmacht to overrun Europe. We have not made deals with nefarious dictators to slice up whole continents.
    There is good to be found in most, and all it takes to reveal the truth is to get people to look for themselves and stop being spoon fed.
    It all starts with looking out the window.

  108. Russ R. (09:56:29) :
    He must realize the enforcement of any CO2 reduction programme, will have to involve a “green police force” that checks to make sure we are not emitting GHGs without paying the piper.

    Actually, I may end up being a verifier. Ach Exkrementen!! Bezahlen sie mir die bribe jetzt.
    June 10, 2009
    House Agriculture Committee to Hold Climate Hearing
    The House Agriculture Committee will hold a hearing on climate change legislation on Thursday, June 11. NACD will testify regarding recent legislation and the current role of conservation districts as verifiers of carbon sequestration contracts. The House Energy and Commerce Committee finalized their action on the American Clean Energy and Security Act (ACES) in May and now several other committees will review the legislation prior to a June 19 deadline imposed by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. ACES creates a cap and trade program which includes the potential for carbon offsets on agriculture, grassland and forest land. NACD has advocated a leadership role for the Department of Agriculture in developing an offsets program, and that conservation districts verify conservation practices under such a program.

  109. I wish Al would wear a carbon capture device to store all the CO2 he emits. Maybe attachments for all his orfices.

  110. ““Naught-Sies”, “Not-sees”, “Knot-seas”, “Knot-seats”, any combination works.

  111. Hang on!!! weren’t skeptics said to have a ‘mental disorder’ not too long ago??? and now we are Nazis!!!!
    oh… the school yard name calling is climbing up another notch…
    sad…

  112. ralph ellis.. Then, who is he who disagrees with a Greenie Liberal? a Nasty?

  113. Magnus (11:32:44) :
    Probably this will be as costly as WWII, so it isn’t surpricing that Gore make this comparison. This is the logical continuation of this insanity, but isn’t he realize that a climate realist then can be regarderd as immoral as a nazi?
    A bit offtopic: A talk show interview with prof Lindzen, where he mention his problem recently as eine Denier to get a rug appraiser:
    http://audio.wrko.com/m/audio/24111309/richard-lindzen-global-warming-denier.htm
    An oriental rug site mentions this important event:
    http://www.rugrag.com/post/Burnt-Rug-Appraiser.aspx
    It’s good to see that the awareness about slandering of realists penetrates through our rug society. First they come to deny our burned rugs…
    Politicians have to be a bit brave now and stop this CO2 mania!
    Magnus,
    This will be much more costly than WWII
    Alan Caruba made a nice graph and an article about the costs aspect.
    It is mind boggling.
    http://factsnotfantasy.blogspot.com/2009/05/die-global-warming-die.html

  114. i saw the movie with al gore and the first i thought was, he is like a nazi.
    why?
    he knewed very well, that this kind of propaganda he did, would be very likely sawn by that what it is. It is the same material, all nazis or other regimes like that used and use today.
    gore is not stupid, he was thinking one step forward, he claims all sceptics are like nazis. look at vazlav claus, the president of the chech republik and head of the EU governance at time. he says, that has nothing to do with climate science.
    ok, atnony, its necessery and usefull that you bring up this stuff, thank you!

  115. It will either be ’what were you thinking, didn’t you see the North Pole melting before your eyes, didn’t you hear what the scientists were saying?’ Or they will ask ’how is it you were able to find the moral courage to solve the crisis which so many said couldn’t be solved?’.”
    – I was thinking for myself, what were you doing?
    – I watched the satellite data, the webcam at the North Pole, 3 dummies in the Arctic, Cyrosphere today and talked to people who visit the Arctic. It wasn’t melting.
    – I heard what the scientists were saying since the mid 60’s. I watched as the climate changed twice. One agenda failed and off it went to another one.
    – What crisis? The abandonment of good sense and things that were working like Superfund cleanups. The destruction of our forest sustainablity by clear cutting followed by total shutdown giving way to dangerous overgrowth. The constant blowing of economic bubbles and the displacement of wealth for export by the few at the expense of the many. We cleaned up our air radically but the worst offenders moved thier marbles overseas where human life and the environment are cheap. AGW agenda addresses none of the above. Was that the best you could do, Mr. Gore?

  116. Invoke the “spirit” of churchill. Churchhill is dead. So i agree a dead Spirit would fit.
    Churchill didn’t die of gang green.

  117. Bishop Hill (13:29:51),
    Thanks for that interesting link.
    Also, the time is ripe for a book on Caspar Amman, Michael Mann, and the gaming of the climate peer review process. It would be a ‘hot’ seller!
    Why should Al Gore make all the money on the climate change scam?

  118. It still surprises me how often the authoritarian wanna-bes directly or indirectly invoke the Nazis to characterize their opponents. You would think they’d have figured out by now, how accurate a ‘tell’ it is — it points just the opposite direction they think it does. And here’s another infallible ‘tell’: Anybody who won’t debate in an honest forum is a fraud.
    I wonder what happens to Gore’s contracts with his investors if he can’t pull off the heist? Although not normally one to wish ill upon others, I confess I’d feel a certain Schadenfreude at seeing him turfed out of that ridiculous barn of his.

  119. Mr Gore is indeed quite right to invoke Churchill in “fighting” the climate war. According to the “greatest Briton” himself,
    “One day President Roosevelt told me that he was asking publicly for suggestions about what the war should be called. I said at once ‘The Unnecessary War’.”
    WWII is unnecessary. So is the “fight” against climate change.

  120. I can just see it…
    “We shall fight them on the beaches…
    We shall fight them on the seas and oceans…
    We shall never surrender.”
    What a joke. [snip]
    Duck n cover AL Here come the logic bombs.

  121. Would not Mr Gore be more comparable to Goebbels. Was not Goebbels the master of propaganda. Perhaps future generations will bracket “An Inconvenient Truth” with Leni Riefenstahls “Triumph of the Will”.
    40 Coats

  122. Anthony, you could also update the code changes…
    Before:
    Code to display title of the HTML page –>
    title> Al Gore likens fight against climate change to battle with Nazis – Times Online /title>
    meta name=”Description” content=”
    Al Gore today compared the battle against climate change with the struggle
    against the Nazis.”
    After:
    as your picture up there…

  123. I think, realistically, that we had all better understand that this entire business, especially the upcoming Copenhagen meeting, has a great deal of momentum ( and political power ) behind it. I hope, like many others, that this scam dies.
    Copenhagen is a rigged game, and to be honest I think the outcome will be an absolute disaster for the US economy and the world in general. So much so, that in the interest of self preservation, I intend to plan my investments for the near term accordingly. 20% in green crap, and the rest in arms manufacturers and basic commodities.

  124. It looks to me that he did not liken climate change/AGW to the battle with the Nazis but that political will was needed to fight both the second world war and climate change/AGW. That is a big difference imo.
    REPLY: No argument about there being a difference. The question remains however. How did the word NAZI get used in The Times article? Was it an off-the cuff remark by Gore? Was it part of an interview answer, or the reporter’s take on it? Or, did Gore originally use it in the speech and it has been edited from the video The Times now presents?
    It is difficult to determine, and since The Time crossed a journalist line by sponsoring an event that they then write about, followed by a fast paced switheroo of their headline, we will probably never get the true story. The Times credibility is at question. – A

  125. OT: A strong earthquake with a preliminary magnitude of 6.2 has struck the North Pole, the Tsunami Warning Center reports.
    I wonder if it’s due to volcanic activity.

  126. As Mr. Gore has chosen to invoke the name of the Greatest Englishman of the Twentieth Century, I thought it appropriate to append a few quotes from Sir Winston Churchill which I considered appropriate to the quandry in which our cousins across the pond now find themselves. The best is the last, delivered to a Member of the Opposition in the House of Commons. It should be delivered to Mr. Gore.
    The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is.
    There is no such thing as a good tax.
    This report, by its very length, defends itself against the risk of being read.
    True genius resides in the capacity for evaluation of uncertain, hazardous, and conflicting information.
    A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.
    Courage is rightly esteemed the first of human qualities… because it is the quality which guarantees all others.
    It is always wise to look ahead, but difficult to look further than you can see.
    The answer, sir, is in the plural. And they bounce.

  127. To quote Winston Churchill
    “Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few”
    Maybe when AGW theory has been defeated we will remember the few who saved us from the consequences.
    This is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning”.
    Winston Churchill after Rommel’s defeat at El Alamein.

  128. George E Smith ,
    That was my point . As far as my fig tree goes – if it produced fruit , clambering about in it would do little good . Most of it’s limbs wouldn’t support my weight .

  129. Steve Keohane (12:24:35) : Conservative&denialist (11:46:09) This is “called psychological projection”, Agreed! but further, it is a common political ploy being used more often in the past couple of years, it seems to me. Label your opponent with the worst that descibes your own tactics, so the label can’t be used on yourself first.
    Right on Steve. I’ve become aware of this one too. Along with Appeal To Authority, Ad Hom, Straw Man, Suppress, and Distract, comes Project.
    rbateman (13:19:12) : rbateman (13:33:44) : Well said, both times.

  130. “So I guess that would make Al Gore the Swiss, who also profited mightily.”
    Robert
    Not really – he can stay an American. They profited the most out of WW2, as the major European powers, UK, France and Germany were all broken. It has taken them over 50 years to recover….

  131. Al Gore is quoted as saying, “Sceptics who refused to believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered…”
    Al is wrong once again. Skeptics don’t doubt that CO2 can be drastically reduced. All it takes is drastically reducing everyone’s standard of living — something that Al Gore personally refuses to do. If Gore actually believed that CO2 is such a great danger, then his profligate waste of resources would make him a traitor to the human race. But in reality, he’s only being a hypocrite.
    voodoo (10:19:43) :

    …the ’science’ of McCarthyism was settled when the Russians opened the KGB files in the 1990’s. McCarthy was largely proven correct. Many of his targets really were foreign agents funded by the KGB.

    Yes; google “Venona”. [Don’t just read the sanitized Wikipedia version if you want the true story.]
    After the Berlin Wall came down thousands of decrypted cables were released from KGB archives, proving among other things that Sen. McCarthy was correct about the State Department being run by agents in the service of the Soviet Union. When the Soviet documents were released, the U.S. opened many of its own Venona files.
    The Venona documents showed conclusively that the author of the UN charter, Alger Hiss, was a long time Soviet agent. [Senator Moynihan’s committee also concluded that Alger Hiss was a Soviet spy.] Before Hiss was tried, convicted, and sent to the federal penitentiary for perjury, he had been nominated by Russia to be the UN’s first Secretary General. Upon becoming UN Sec-Gen, Hiss immediately appointed 494 fellow travelers to top UN positions.
    So we can see why the UN is so anti-American; that seed was planted by its founders and nurtured through the Cold War, and right up to today. We can see why the UN/IPCC is at the forefront of the drive to designate CO2 as a “pollutant” and demonize one of the most beneficial gases in existence, thus hobbling its hated enemy, and in promoting the use of carbon credits to extract $trillions from America and the West in the biggest scam in history: CO2=AGW.
    What the Soviet Union was unable to do militarily, it is accomplishing through its understanding of human nature, and with the connivance of the greedy and corrupt UN kleptocrats.

  132. @ Bishop Hill (13:02:17) :
    In your link about Sir David King there is a link to a letter reportedly from R. Wyndham to the Master of University College, Oxford explaining that he will not be donating to the College, as he had done several times previously, because he objected to the appointment of Sir David King to what he describes as a sinecure as Director of the Smith School of Enterprise and the Environment at the University of Oxford.
    This is the way to go.
    I have donated a modest amount monthly to Oxfam for the past thirty years or so. A few weeks they sent a thick package to me to tell me that they were now campaigning to stop AGW. I have no objection to making donations to support poor people adversely affected by climate change, but I object most strongly to giving my money to people who squander it tilting at windmills.
    I cancelled my standing order and now send the same money to another charity which, so far as I am aware, does not throw my money away and will use it properly. I also wrote to tell Oxfam why.

  133. Seems he never said “Nasi”. Here there is an audio of the speech: http://blogs.nature.com/news/thegreatbeyond/Al%20Gore%2007-07-2009.WMA
    However, the numbers of inaccuracies are to many to start with.
    Just the part about system efficiencies… it seems he wants the be the one that thought about making more efficient systems… sorry Al, lots of people do that for a living, and I’m one of them. Making more efficient systems has never been part of any climate crisis strategy, it’s a normal part of building things. It’s a normal engineering process of making things more efficient. Like usual, you distort the truth to get to you means.
    And this whole thing on soils… what a bunch of fase science… It’s clear that even poor countries will have to pay him based on his soil project.
    It’s clear also that he is not going to Australia for a pleasure trip… it corresponds to their Senate vote on their climate bill that Senator Steve Fielding will kill. I could bet good money that Climate Change Minister Penny Wong managed to delay the vote to August in order to get Gore down there to work on some people and have their vote change. Political intervention never ends with these people.

  134. (Slightly offtopic/conspiracy style:
    Another thing about Times Online: I’ve seen at least two articles in Times Online disappear. One article where Jeremy Clarkson says that there is no free speech on global warming issues, and sais that Prius is useless car. It’s also an article with a nobel prize winner’s harsh criticism on wind power, which disappeared quite rapidly.
    What appears is a Times Online page with the text “Error 404”, that there is no such page. When I’ve e-mailed Times about it, they answer that I should change browser, despite the given information excludes that problem.)

  135. I took a look at your Firefox screen shot and noticed that in your Google search box the word “shrinkage” was still visible. Did someone go to a cold pool today?

  136. Al Gore : “Sceptics who refused to believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered…”
    In one retorical statement, Gore manipulates 2 times:
    1) “Refuse to believe”.
    Sceptics are not “refusing to believe” like a naughty silly child.
    No Sceptics “has another opinion”.
    2) “.. believe dramatic cuts in carbon emissions could be delivered…”
    Most sceptics dont believe much in the benefit of cutting in CO2.
    The 1933-45 German propaganda machine where world champions in developing the most retorical and manipulating writings.
    I hope everyone will soon see that what Gore does is similar.

  137. @Elizabeth (10:22:19) :
    “[…] I was inputting numbers into a carbon calculator I found on the internet […]”
    I followed your link to the calculator. What a hoot! My brain feels cleaner already from the washing, rinse, and blow dry it received there.
    The ‘Secondary’ usage section had the most wonderful leading and loaded choices I’ve seen in quite some time. I was looking for my carbon footprint for ritual sacrifices of water buffalo but they don’t seem to have a check box for that one. Not that I ritually sacrifice water buffalo, mind you, but I’d certainly want to take my carbon footprint into consideration if I was mulling over taking up the practice ;o)
    Thanks for the link!

  138. Ah, I see you captured the pics of the headline change.
    You can also see it by going to the google news page and putting in “al gore nazi”. It’s near the top.
    http://news.google.ca/news?pz=1&ned=ca&hl=en&q=gore+nazi
    Once google refreshes their story cache this might change.
    I also tried archive.org but that didn’t work as the Times has their pages blocked to robots.
    Who is watching the watchers?

  139. If we’re going to toss out appropriate-to-the-moment Sir Winston quotes, then I’ll offer this one.
    Winston is in the WC at parliament, taking care of business at the trough. A well known socialist-leaning MP walks in, stands close to him, and begins to do the same. Winston sidles away from him at the trough. “What’s the matter Winston, feeling a bit standoffish today?” Replied Churchill, “Not at all –it’s just that whenever you see an enterprise as large and well-run as this one, you always try to nationalize it!”

  140. In that photo of the Manbearpig Elmer Gantry, it appears that he is giving the Papal benediction. He is the Pope of the new religion.

  141. It seems that a flight to Australia and back will amount to about 22.9 tonnes of CO2 according to that carbonprint calculator. But the really funny part is that Radiative Forcing bit if you decide to click that box. See the text below. So, your flight might have a greater global warming effect if you click that box… well then, I won’t click it and that will help the planet.
    Carbon emissions from planes at high altitude have an increased effect on global warming. Tick the box if you would like to multiply aviation emissions by DEFRA’s recommended Radiative Forcing factor of 1.9.

  142. Lucy Skywalker (15:01:09) :
    There is something to be said for not sinking to the level of polyscience agendas. Dubya outfoxed him with values. If Bush could do it and send him packing, so can we.
    Al Gore wants to save the planet by sacrificing freedom, properity and sovereignity.
    If you value any of the above, AGW is an end justifies the means agenda.
    The price tag of his utopian dream is for the West to fling itself on it’s sword.
    Too much already has been ceded to cruel regimes. No more.

  143. Hey the British Royal Family regularly gets caught dressing up as or talking to Nazis. At least this is just talking about it.

  144. Well big Al has a lot of Gorl to invoke Sir Winston Churchill; a man whose shoes AlGORE is unfit to shine, let alone fill. And what a pansy Vee for Victory that is Al, better stick to flash cards.
    When Churchill finally stood up to “those folks”, they had already killed hundreds of thousands, on their way to many millions; mostly civilians.
    How many will you be responsible for Al, when the food runs out ? Rachel Carson killed millions by promoting the silly ban on DDT; and her rabid book continues to kill to this day; but AL is working on “the final solution” to the world’s population problem.
    Just talk to some Canadian farmers in Saskatchewan Al, about how global warming is increasing their wheat yields this year; you will become the Guy Fawkes of the 21st Century AL, and take your place alongside history’s other megalomaniacs; just my humble opinion of course.

  145. Someday people around the world will know what Tennesseans have known for a long time…that Al Gore is a fraud.
    P.S. If he had carried his own state in 2000, he would have been President and would not have had to worry about Florida…he even lost his old congressional district!

  146. As someone who has actually investigated the Holocaust for myself and visited a concentration camp, I cannot really express my revulsion clearly enough against anyone who seeks to compare climate change with the battle against Nazism. It appears that some alarmists have no shame.
    Many millions of people, mainly Jews and Poles, were wantonly and systematically slaughtered at the behest of a madman by a first-world country unhinged by economic collapse. If their deaths had any meaning at all, it was certainly not to dignify the appalling rhetoric of shameless hucksters like Al Gore in order to try to win an argument over matters which are clearly disputable.
    I actually liked Al Gore at one time. I certainly preferred him to George W Bush in 2000. I still don’t rate GWB but neither do I rate Al Gore any more.
    My perception is that those who rush to make arguments comparing some scientific concept to fighting Hitler have never seen a concentration camp, never seen the evidence of slaughter with their own eyes, never been haunted by the pictures made by 7, 8, 9, 10 year old children who were shortly afterwards sent to Auschwitz and gassed.
    Every time this sort of extreme rhetoric is employed to try to win an argument, I find it difficult to speak, difficult to express my revulsion or the inner conflict that I feel. It is the argument of people who have lost the argument and lost all perspective about what is important.
    I may go quiet for a while. I’m sorry.

  147. “”” John Edmondson (14:58:06) :
    To quote Winston Churchill
    “Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few”
    Maybe when AGW theory has been defeated we will remember the few who saved us from the consequences.
    This is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning”.
    Winston Churchill after Rommel’s defeat at El Alamein. “””
    A bit of a mixed metaphor there John. That first line there about the few, was uttered after the Battle of Britain, referring to the few Hurricane, and fewer Spitfire RAF pilots (from all countries) who fought and won the Battle of Britain in the skies over the British Isles, and the Channel. The El Alamein Victory came later.

  148. Ron de Haan (13:31:13).
    Now Caruba don’t mention the cost of WWII, does he?
    When I say that that WWII, which laid Europe in ruins, is a decent comparison to the harm that an American and European cap and trade (a.k.a. emission trade scheme) it’s funny that someone thinks that comparison isn’t strong enough…
    I think that comparison is how Gore’s trying to scare us (I remember he uses that comparison briefly in his movie too), but I didn’t say that it’s exactly what the cost will be. WWII costed about 1 trillion dollar per year…
    http://upanizza.blogspot.com/2008/09/cost-of-war.html
    …and the EPA may cost 7 trillion (or 2 trillion) dollars until 2020…
    http://www.heritage.org/Press/NewsReleases/nr041709a.cfm
    …thus less than 1 trillion dollars a year.
    But I don’t know if these values can be compared (are they fully normalized?). Copenhagen may produce at least twice that cost for the world, or? (I don’t know, but I think that Nicholas Sterns suggests a few percent of the worlds GDP, where a triggered economic crisis I guess will make it worse.)
    A scary thing is also that the carbon focus implies regulation on everything. A text about that by Robert Brinsmead (formerly active in a church, but now obviously evolutionist) :
    http://www.tech-know.eu/uploads/THE_VINDICATION_OF_CARBON.pdf
    I think this also may lead to a serious society control issue. People (and politicians) have to understand that CO2 is something we breath! They have to be informed that CO2 isn’t stay in the atmosphere very long…
    http://folk.uio.no/tomvs/esef/ESEF3VO2.htm
    …which is another thing IPCC lies about, etc etc.
    The absurd thing is that a carbon cap is completely unnecessary, and it’s a shame that politicians dosn’t responsibly get information on this issue. the propaganda says 97% of the scientists belive in an AGW catastrophy. But Doran and Kendall Zimmerman’s study has a poll asking if humans can have anym even extremely small effect on climate. (I answer yes too!) Bray and von Storch’s study says almost 50% of climate scientist does not think humans is mostly to blame for recent climate change.
    But politicians don’t seem to listen to this. It’s easy to follow dogma, or what? We have to tell them again and again.
    Gore probably want to be rich from emission trade, which is an incentive for him. But it’s a scam that he uses scare propaganda and the WWII comparison to drive his case forward.

  149. “No senior British politician had taken up his invitation to address a conference attended by the world’s top climate scientists, senior business leaders and the presidents of the Maldives and Rwanda.”
    Why is that Alberto ?
    Can it be that you are just too extreme ?
    Do you know the reason why Smith is the FORMER chief scientist ?
    Can it be that he gave some misleading advice ?
    Could this misleading advice amount to Fraud
    under the 2006 UK Statute Law ?
    Invoking the Dead Spirit of British Uber Hero, Winston Churchill ?
    Oh Dear, desperate stuff. This will turn the British right off you.
    Go away Albert Gore, not wanted on voyage.

  150. So what do your kids go dressed as, for Halloween; the Easter bunny and the Tooth Fairy?
    It seems that at least one of the royal Princes, did serve in military service; despite having a bullseye painted on his back.
    But I do agree it is not a wise choice for a fancy dress party.

  151. Gore and Nazis,
    NOAA and Volvo!
    Read all about corporatism (facism) all collaborating to push the climate treaty through our noses. This is change we did not ask for.
    Tomorrow I will scrap my Volvo.
    Jul 07, 2009
    The Unwisdom of Solomon (and NOAA and Volvo)
    “Note: NOAA in a press release announced: The 2009 Volvo Environmental Prize Foundation has named NOAA Senior Scientist Susan Solomon as the recipient of its 2009 environmental prize. The Volvo Environment Prize is awarded for “Outstanding innovations or scientific discoveries which in broad terms fall within the environmental field.” “This prestigious award recognizes and honors Dr. Solomon’s distinguished work in the Antarctic as well as her exemplary leadership during the last Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change assessment,” said Richard W. SPINrad, NOAA assistant administrator for oceanic and atmospheric research”.
    Read the rest of this remarkable posting at http://www.icecap.us

  152. “”” Mark N (16:56:55) :
    Hey the British Royal Family regularly gets caught dressing up as or talking to Nazis. At least this is just talking about it. “””
    This belonga above that up there !

  153. Even if the doubts expressed here make it to enough Senators to block C&T, the EPA will deliver what Congress does not.
    algore will win this round. We may get another chance in 2010. Undoing a bad deed is much harder when the deed is the goal of POTUS.
    If it cools off a bit more (Gray says it will) the AGW’s can claim success. Which will be much harder to overturn.
    I do not see a happy ending.

  154. With the AGWers working on “the final solution” with their GCMs, Gore’s remark is supremely ironic.

  155. My favorite Sir Winston Churchill putdown involves his exchange with GBS; George Bernard Shaw.
    It seems that Shaw sent two tickets to Churchill for the opening night of his new play, with a note that read; “My dear Winston, here are some tickets to the opening night of my new play; please do come, and bring a friend; if you have one !”
    Churchill returned the tickets with his note; “Dear George, I am unable to attend the opening night of your new play; please send me two tickets to the second night; if there is one!”

  156. Al Gore today compared the battle against climate change with the struggle against the Nazis.

    Vatt can ve say? Ve haff been discoffered! Und now… ve haff vays of makingk does namby-pamby global-varming people to see things our vay.

  157. geo (12:45:29): Does Gore really need to be pummelled here, or the Times?
    The answer is, yes.
    wattsupwiththat (17:06:17) I saw that silly article. I learned in biology that smaller-in-size mammals of the same species lose less body heat, thus people in northern climes tend to be shorter than those at low lattitudes. Smaller sheep=cooling.

  158. This is hilarious:

    HOUSTON — Plans for the world’s largest wind farm in the Texas panhandle have been scrapped, energy baron T. Boone Pickens said Tuesday, and he’s looking for a home for 687 giant wind turbines.
    Pickens has already ordered the turbines, which can stand 400 feet tall — taller than most 30-story buildings.
    “When I start receiving those turbines, I’ve got to … like I said, my garage won’t hold them,” the legendary Texas oilman said. “They’ve got to go someplace.”

    That’s all, folks!

  159. Wow we went from holocaust deniers to nazis huh?
    Well I would have Mr Gore know that my grandfather left Germany before Hitler gained total control because he saw the signs of the oncoming trouble. He became and American Citizen to avoid the Nazis and I for one think Al Gore is a (snip!)
    Guess what Mr Gore. We are going to fight you tooth and nail. We are going to win! That is American spirit sir. No matter what spin you try to put on it. It is the reality. Soon you will be in jail along side madoff and Enron execs. disgraced and a mockery. It will serve you right.

  160. Two questions that ALGORE needs to answer:
    Why is his carbon footprint so large when he advocates others to reduce theirs?
    How much money will he make from trading carbon credits?

  161. This man is out to become the world’s first trillionaire on the backs of the people. How can he be stopped?

  162. Hansen and Gore have big, big plans!
    See this rare video of Gore in Hansen’s lab….Scheming!

    stops near the end

  163. PHIL GREEN, the former boss of the collapsed finance empire Babcock & Brown, has been ousted from the board of the SCG Trust, replaced by the former Australian cricket captain Steve Waugh.
    a 2 gigawatt wind farm energy scam imploded. This sucks and blows. They have gobbled hundreds of millions in subsidies. There are billions of dollars in lost moneys invested in wind energy. all on a fabricated fear of warming. The structures cost millions, they are slow to be built and they have high maintenance problems the first year. Green jobs of course but the dark back side of this is scam and insolvency.
    Big air is giving a lot of blow back.

  164. Al Gore is positioning himself to be the global leader in the fight against climate change. With every move he makes, he is getting closer to being the head of whatever climate dictatorship is being built.
    My Prediction….
    The UN creates a special organization to battle climate change as soon as this G8 thing is over. Al gore is appointed head of this organization, and becomes the single most powerful man in the world. New global legislation is passed to all countries. Al Gore is hailed by all MSM as our savior….. Then our ice age hits and all hell breaks loose.
    Oh Ya….. Dear Al, I fart in your general direction.

  165. I will admit, I was stupid enough to vote for this guy to be president – more the fool I.
    Now, he’s comparing me to the dregs of the holocaust because I don’t buy his line of malarkey.
    The years force a little wisdom on you.
    Al? Take a hike, huevon!

  166. Algores friends need money.
    T Boone Pickens orderd 667 windmills. GE (big juice) is pumped up. Boone gave a lot of $$$ to OSU and then his little portfolio sagged. Now he still has mega mesa dollars but GE won’t finance his windmills. Does GE really see wind farms as a bad investment?
    Question for algore? what is up with tilting to the windmills and they tip over?
    Algore: can you name and explain several billion dollars of wind energy deals that are coming unraveled or do you want me to name them?
    I can allso name people and companies that unraveled in ethanol.
    Do you want me to describe an alternative energy lending bubble and including carbon scamming, how big it will be before it bursts?
    Energy lending will by definition have to be enterprises that are not sarbanes Oxley compliant.

  167. Like the “Hear No Evilil, See No Evil, Speak No Evil” monkeys, I suggest someone manufacture and market a trio of Al Gore statuettes with either the caption “Hear No Science, See No Science, Speak No Science”, or the caption “Arrogance, Stupidity, and More Stupidity”.

  168. John A (17:03:43) :
    I’m sorry.

    Don’t be. Even an overly-facetious & sarcastic character like me took a moment to pause after reading that. What Gore did just waters down the significance of a horrific historical event which should never be forgotten. And all in the name of politics, personal greed (my opinion), and science fiction (not my opinion), no less.

  169. Forests have been living under stress by low concentrations of atmospheric carbon dioxide during the last 2000 years (Science. 29 May 2009). Lowering the emissions of carbon dioxide, which until now have been a palliative against photosynthesis stress, will impact severely all biomes around the world (Science. 29 May 2009). If Al Gore likes cold and sterile sand… let him put himself ice in his “iss”. What does that … person… knows about the suffering of the Hebrew People? Al Gore must be processed for abusing on the Sho’ah horrors for attaining his personal goals.

  170. Bessie Braddock: “Sir, you are drunk.”
    Churchill: “Madam, you are ugly. In the morning, I shall be sober.”
    What will you be Mr Gore?

  171. Notice that, though they changed the name of the Article, they have failed to change the title of the web page to the new name.

  172. John A (17:03:43) :
    Well said Sir.
    When I first read of Gore and The Times likening the ‘fight against global warming’ to the war against the Nazis I was offended. My father fought in WW2 – he was 21 when the war started. He was in the 8th Army in North Africa fighting Rommel and then went through Sicily and Italy. He could speak German and he was involved after the war ended helping to translate some of what the survivors of the concentration camps went through.

  173. Meanwhile, this all leads to things like “The agency is creating a unit of about 50 auditors and inspectors, complete with warrant cards and the power to search company premises to enforce the Carbon Reduction Commitment (CRC), which comes into effect next year.” … all the while, one U.S. State has exactly 7 Dam inspectors for more than 1,790 that are 50 years and older, most of which are way past their expected lifetimes and are coming close to critical state. Dam’s across the country will become a HUGE problem long before CO2 ever does. So, what are we doing about that? We are laying off even more inspectors and ignoring the problem.
    Brilliant!

  174. Richard (19:43:02) :
    Say what you like about Bush, Gore would have been worse!

    But instead, all we got was Obama … now, which is the worse of those evils?

  175. Excellent! We’re being demonized by a so-called authority figure and government insider. Where there’s smoke, sometimes there’s also a mirror.
    Thanks, Al, for removing any tiny, remaining vestiges of doubt.

  176. Taphonomic (18:14:33) :
    Why is his carbon footprint so large when he advocates others to reduce theirs?

    My wife doesn’t understand why I get so riled up about all of this global warming thing, but she fully understands that question. She even got riled up about it.
    I thought that was insightful because she doesn’t follow this stuff like many of us do.

  177. Squidly (20:44:51) :
    Meanwhile, this all leads to things like “The agency is creating a unit of about 50 auditors and inspectors, complete with warrant cards and the power to search company premises to enforce the Carbon Reduction Commitment (CRC), which comes into effect next year.” … all the while, one U.S. State has exactly 7 Dam inspectors for more than 1,790 that are 50 years and older, most of which are way past their expected lifetimes and are coming close to critical state. Dam’s across the country will become a HUGE problem long before CO2 ever does. So, what are we doing about that? We are laying off even more inspectors and ignoring the problem.
    Brilliant!

    It did already happen in 2005, engineers had been warning for New Orleans for decades, that a direct hit by a level 5 hurricane would boost water levels so much that the concrete walls and dikes would not be able to cope and that the city would flood.
    Eventually the engineers got it almost right, but it only needed a level 3-4 hurricane with a glancing blow on the city.
    In the meanwhile, mr. former VP Al Gore, where are those ever increasing numbers of hurricanes?

  178. JimK,
    Although I should probably ignore you since you’re just an attack dog sent over from a ghost town of a website, Anthony Watts prompty responded to the NOAA’s rebuttal:
    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/06/24/ncdc-writes-ghost-talking-points-rebuttal-to-surfacestations-project/
    Please show some respect to the folks who run this site. They don’t sic their readers on other sites, and you make your side look ridiculous when you use such blatent ad hominems.

  179. “Al Gore is positioning himself to be the global leader in the fight against climate change. ”
    Which is about as futile as the “fight against the march of time”. Climate changes. Always has, always will.

  180. Slightly OT, but there are only 4 comments on the original timesonline web page. All critical of Mr. Gore, as one would expect. Maybe they got so much negative comments that they have all been censored?

  181. tj: This is neither the time nor the venue for discussion of arcanae of the thirties but, the “Night of the Long Knives” was hardly the end of the NASDP. It was the moment when the leaders of the movement, having attained power through the thugishness of the brown shirts decided they were no longer useful and liquidated them. The party went on to achieve absolute power that the brown shirts had provided them, and attempted to leave behind the memory of what had gotten them into power. ACORN, watch your backs!
    Now tj, if you have “progressive” friends and “conservative” friends that all want the same thing (conservatives being cheaper, of course), then I would suggest to you that you don’t have any conservative friends. Kumbaya, friend.

  182. On the other hand, having a bit of fun with this pathetic new low…
    Al Gore Likens Fight Against Climate Change to Battle with Nazis
    Today, in a stunning move, Al Gore renounced the climate change movement and admitted that he has had the science all wrong. He now considers the effect of increasing CO2 levels in the atmosphere to be miniscule as far as temperature changes. He also announced that, as a result of the increasing levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, the biosphere is the healthiest it has been in many millennia. He further stated that he now considers the greatest danger facing mankind to be cooling in the form of a new Little Ice Age.
    In the spirit of his conversion, he said that the climate change movement is a greater danger to mankind and freedom than anything nature can throw mankind’s way. He even went so far as to liken the climate change movement to Nazism and that we must marshal all our moral, legal, and intellectual forces to defeat this insidious belief system lest the world’s interconnected economies are ruined for naught.
    Spokespersons for WWF, Greenpeace, Friends of the Earth, and the Obama administration had no comment to this stunning development.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++
    as if the media would cover such an event…

  183. K. I spent 6:10 watching the video on the link provided above, then a bemused 20 minutes ripping through the comments.
    Hands up those that actually watched. If Nazi was invoked, it wasn’t during the broadcast piece. Nothing has cited that except the headline.
    I urge all of you to jump to the top and listen to what the Great Gazoo has to say. Bafflegab. Sorry, you decide. He reminded me of Paula Abdul on American Idol after too many muscle relaxants.

  184. >>Plans for the world’s largest wind farm in the Texas
    >>panhandle have been scrapped
    He might have just discovered that Texas can generate some mighty big anticyclones that hang around for ages. Anyone got an annual wind graph for Texas??

  185. Its a concert effort, death trains, hollocaust denier, Nazi, and put on trial for crimes against humanity have all been the mantra of global warming, designed to make us feel guilty or not pc. Also used as get out of jail free cards when you don’t really have anything new to say in the way of proof and don’t dare take open questions.

  186. pwl (16:28:24) :
    Ah, I see you captured the pics of the headline change.

    Since Gore fancies himself as Churchill maybe someone should photoshop a big fat cigar between his fingers in the photo.
    Something Al should remember about Churchill is that the the Great British Public voted him and the Tory party out of office as soon as the polls opened after the second world war.

  187. >>Slightly OT, but there are only 4 comments on the
    >>original timesonline web page.
    That’s because they have disabled posting to that page – I have tried several times. Comments probably got too rancorous and unprintable.
    .

  188. It still reads
    Video: Al Gore likens fight against climate change to battle with Nazis – Times Online
    (O_o) Clearly someone within the editorial staff who has no clue that changing content with your CMS does not censor all incriminating evidence on that page. Better pick up the phone to call err…. no let them be clueless.

  189. Comming to think of it, i think this is a bug in the CMS that “Times Online” is using. For creating an entry like this the editor has to come with a title, the battle with ze germans for example. CMS then creates an HTML-page with the title in the meta-data and the editor continues filling it with content, again with said title of “the battle with ze germans”.
    Later on the editor decides that it is perhaps a good plan to change the title to something less provoking, but it is only the content that gets changed not the meta-data.

  190. Is that supposed to be the famous “Vee” sign Winston used? I guess the history of “finger signs” is settled. Al, it’s the *other* way around, go and do a bit of research and find out why your are wrong.

  191. thanks, I always like to hear and mostly agree with what al gore has to say, and I would have missed it if you hadnt posted it on your site, keep up the good work
    [link deleted]
    [Your sukiho website is porn, and the post is traffic trolling, so I’m pleased to announce that you are now PERMANENTLY BANNED]

  192. John A,
    Will you agree with me that Al Gore did not use the word Nazi or compare the challenge of AGW/CC to Nazism (a madman’s work the evil of which I absolutely agree with you about) but was talking of the reality that political will was/is needed to address both?

  193. The only nazi’s out there are the global warming alarmists:
    – They are the ones telling people how to run their lives
    – They are the ones suggesting that our population needs reduced
    – They are the ones that have subjected the media, entire governments and bureaucracies to their extreme views
    I never thought that after the exposure of the evils of nazism and other totalitarian regimes in the 20th century that we could ever see regimes like that again. But if we see a totalitarian regime again in the western world it will be a regime based on green nazism, not any dissent of it.

  194. >>I urge all of you to jump to the top and listen to what
    >>the Great Gazoo has to say.
    And the prime buzzwords were ‘Global Governance’ and ‘Global Leadership’.
    .
    Plus, car engines are not 10% efficient (perhaps in the US?). In Europe, a good diesel is 35% efficient. And, the idea that you can make a vehicle that does not have to carry the weight of its own engine is nuts.
    Yes, the constant transfer of energy states is hugely wasteful. So why are Greenies proposing to make electricity from wind, change that electricity into chemical or potential energy, and then transfer it all back into electricity again?? Doesn’t make sense, does it, Mr Gore.
    Perhaps, if we could liberate the energy of an atomic nucleus exactly when and where we needed that energy, this might solve all our problems. What’s that you say – we can already???
    .

  195. The Maldives in the Indian Ocean have a fine new airport completed in the nineties occupying one whole island of the 1,100 island plus archipelago. The Maldives are much visited by honeymooners from the UK. They are a little over 5000 miles, or 10 hours’ flying, from London.
    Mohammed Nasheed, the President of the Maldives spoke, at the invitation of Sir David King, on 5th July at The Times World Forum on Enterprise and the Environment at the University of Oxford.
    It’s such a pity that the vast majority of the 500,000 tourists each year, on whom the economy of the Maldives depends, fly in. Under AGW dogma, the islands are being inundated by their own carbon footprints. There is clearly a serious flaw in the President’s position. He needs a good PR adviser. Maybe he already has one.
    Below are some quotes from the Timesonline article of 6 July (see http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6643750.ece – thank you Galloyd).
    Mohammed Nasheed, the President of the Maldives, told The Times that defending his island nation against rising sea levels was a humanitarian challenge as critical as defending Poland against Nazi Germany in 1939.
    President Nasheed announced in March that his country would spend $110 million (£67 million) a year to become the first in the world with a zero-carbon economy by 2019.”
    “The zero-carbon initiative, he said, would set an example to the rest of the world, but was also the best answer to the Maldives’ energy and development needs. “We know that the Maldives becoming carbon neutral is not going to decarbonise the world and stop us from annihilation. We know that. But at least we could die knowing we’ve done the right thing,” he said.
    He accepted that zero-carbon status would not take into account the emissions from 500,000 tourists who fly to the islands each year — outnumbering the population of 385,000. However, they would use less carbon while in the Maldives than they would have done at home.
    “If you spend this minute in England you are using more carbon than you would if you were spending it in the Maldives,” President Nasheed said. “Therefore your travel will be offset by the time you spend in the Maldives.”

  196. what is wrong with you people?! gore is 100% right. the analogy with nazis is SOOO simple: they would have meant the end of civilization, now the threat is global warming! not even ONE positive comment? but of course, you only care about getting stuffed tonight and using all the energy this planet has to offer! you don’t really care about the future of your children! continuing with the analogy, I would say that YOU’RE the nazis!

  197. Gore’s reference to the Apollo moon program is a bit ironic, bearing in mind that the second man to walk on the moon is an AGW sceptic.
    His comments in general are pretty insulting. But these increasingly shrill comments from him and some scientists such as Hansen may indicate that, deep down, they know they are slowly losing the argument.
    Chris

  198. The right wing critics are out again, what can we say about Gore now, maybe when he talks about saving the next generation, the headline on WUWT would be “Gore to eat children”.
    I would be tempted to say that he might be compared to communism but that’s already been done !.
    Lets get this straight, Gore never mentioned the words Nazi, Fight, battle etc.
    He talked about Political Will, nothing more, nothing less.

  199. As too self absorbed I quote myself: “I think this also may lead to a serious society control issue.”
    A study published by National Academy of Sciences suggests individual emission control.
    http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N06427635.htm
    Two arguments:
    * Rich people emits more CO2. (Oh, no! That lethal CO2. And growth doesn’t make anything more efficient anymore, or how do they put it…)
    * The population growth is different in different countries.
    Why not abolish money to get rid of “these (wealthy) individuals”, these environment harming rich people, and only have government controlled individual consumption ration books in a wonderful brave new world?

  200. Oh goodie! This means he loses, right?
    I don’t know how many of you read the latest Matt Taibbi article (“The Great Bubble Machine”) in Rolling Stone but he mentions carbon trading as the next planned economic bubble after the housing/derivatives bubble. I wrote about it at my site (“The Formula”) but don’t want to be a blog-ho so no linky link.
    I think the cap and trade Master Plan has FAIL stamped all over it but the Powers That Be are going to use the power of the State to ram it down our throats anyway. When cap-and-trade fails they will have one final plan, the one so crazy it might work: Their last-ditch hoaxed threat from outer space. Shall we start taking bets now? Will the next call to world government be attributed to the Magnetosphere Collapse, a Killer Comet, the 2012 Alignment, or Little Green Men?
    Then, after all the media hoopla fails to get the plebes begging the UN for world government – excuse me “global governance” – The Powers will have nothing left. It will be over. Our economy will be in shambles and we might be eating our front lawns to survive, but at least we’ll have the Powers That Be off our backs. At least that’s my hope.

  201. The AGW elites have openly abandoned the science by the looks of this. It is now pure politics.
    If you had to draw comparisons…. It would be Gore who would be the Nazi.

  202. Because I know Gore is a charlatan with financial motives behind his global warming claims, I’ve stopped reading news reports about him.
    However, I’m commenting on this because I think it’s over the top to compare his dishonesty to Nazism.
    That is what this is about isn’t it?

  203. Thanks for the babble Algore. We have had in Paupau New Guinea several scams start selling 500 dollar memberships to farmers to be signed up to get carbon offset money. The sellers disappear and the money is wasted.
    Like I posted last week and another above posted. carbon trading is the next bubble. Algore, let’s put money in this. You first.

  204. I posted two comments on that Gore article on The Times’ website, both challenging the AGW mantra; neither got published. Over here in the UK it’s getting ridiculous, Guardian, Independent and the BBC are simply propaganda sheets for AGW, without any sense of balance or reason.
    BTW Anthony, I’ve been following WUWT for a while now; its taught me more in a few months than any other AGW site. Great work and please do maintain impartialibilty. Cheers.

  205. Gore is the Nazi. Does anybody think that this government cares even a little bit about the environment? It is about control. You must have some affluence to even care about the environment. Our governments Cap-n-Trade energy bill will make the climate worse because people are going to be taxed until the government owns every aspect of production is some form or the other. It is about serfdom where Al Gore, government, and huge corporations are exempt from paying full taxes. They are at the top and everyone else is on the bottom licking their boots. That is what it is about. Not the environment.

  206. The Iceberg (05:35:34) :
    If you care to follow this link to the original Timesonline story you will see that Mr Gore was reported to have used the word Nazi. The President of the Maldives also used the word at the same conference.
    http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6658672.ece?FORM=ZZNR4
    BTW I am a UK liberal who enjoyed a great scientific education which taught me to be sceptical and to question bullshit. Please stop dismissing AGW sceptics as right-wing

  207. The Iceberg (05:35:34) :
    The right wing critics are out again, what …

    Certainly only one man’s opinion …
    .
    .

  208. Al’s a bit of a fluorescent bulb. Maybe he’s confusing Winston Churchill with Ward Churchill?

  209. The Times didn’t just change the title, they completely rewrote the first paragraph materially changing the context.

  210. AGW skeptics(flatlanders) should all buy homes (or trade homes) with those people living at sea level around the globe. Just think of it, lovely ocean front homes in exchange for Kansas farms! What a concept!

  211. Stoic–
    No, not even the original quotes Gore using “Nazi”. The only quote actually from Gore says “WWII” and that he was in the context of the need today for Churchillian leadership and courage.
    Now, I don’t happen to agree with Mr. Gore. Or to the degree I do, I would like a few more leaders with Churchillian courage to say “No, you haven’t proved your case yet that the warming we’ve seen is caused primarily by C02 rather than having a large natural variation component, and you certainly haven’t proven the case on the degree of future warming dependant in your models on a large positive feedback mechanism”. But he is entitled to his view, as I am to mine, and I certainly don’t feel like there is any proof in either the original article or the revised that he called me a Nazi for mine.
    Gore is not responsible for sensationalism by the Times reporter or the Times headline writer.

  212. Wow, the AGW trolls are out in full force on this one. Do they have some sort of silent alarm that gets pushed anytime their Beloved One is getting what he deserves?
    They’re like the zombies in “Night of the Living Dead”. Must-Protect-Master!

  213. The second and more anodyne version of this report was in the Times itself today. I have of course written a letter to the editor.
    But don’t hold your breath, they won’t publish it.
    Kindest Regards

  214. “ralph ellis (01:32:26) :
    >>I urge all of you to jump to the top and listen to what
    >>the Great Gazoo has to say.
    And the prime buzzwords were ‘Global Governance’ and ‘Global Leadership’.
    .
    Plus, car engines are not 10% efficient (perhaps in the US?). In Europe, a good diesel is 35% efficient. And, the idea that you can make a vehicle that does not have to carry the weight of its own engine is nuts.
    Yes, the constant transfer of energy states is hugely wasteful. So why are Greenies proposing to make electricity from wind, change that electricity into chemical or potential energy, and then transfer it all back into electricity again?? Doesn’t make sense, does it, Mr Gore.
    Perhaps, if we could liberate the energy of an atomic nucleus exactly when and where we needed that energy, this might solve all our problems. What’s that you say – we can already???”
    While an ICE can be between 35%-45% efficient, I believe these figures only represent the efficiency of burning the refined fuel in the tank alone and do not factor in the energy consumed in extracting the raw fuel, transporting it, refining it, transporting it and using it etc. If we factor these in then an ICE is about 10% efficient, about that same as a steam engine.

  215. Schedule the witch hunts. We are getting some utilities switched to radio transmitted meter readings on the electric meter. Then they can monitor you and knock on your door if you get a little too enthusiastic on lights and appliances. What will you do if they catch you heatting a large kettle of water for 1 cup of tea?
    In the US Kansas University has installed generators on a few work out machines to generate juice when peddling the Stairmaster. Maybe you could attach a treadmill to the washing machine. Take punishment in stride.
    http://www.cjonline.com/news/state/2009-07-06/ku_to_harness_sweat_power
    LAWRENCE — Some college students have the drive of the Energizer Bunny, and the University of Kansas plans on tapping into them as a power source.
    KU students returning to campus this fall will find the David A. Ambler Student Recreation Fitness Center has retrofitted 15 of its elliptical machines with devices that convert their pedaling into electricity that will help power the building.
    The devices are made by ReRev.com, a subsidiary of Florida-based SunQuest Energy, which says a typical 30-minute workout produces 50 watts of clean energy, enough to power a laptop computer for an hour, a television for 15 minutes or a compact fluorescent light bulb for 2 ½ hours.
    How about this. Sentence carbon abusers like algore to 45 minutes on the machine. Win/win economics. He would loose/loose weight and hostility.

  216. geo (09:19:24) :
    Well I wasn’t there. Were you? I don’t think he called you a Nazi. He compared his struggle to push his AGW dogma to fighting the Nazis in WW2. I presume the lads from the UK Daily Mail and the Scotsman were there as well as The Times reporter. This is what they reported:
    Daily Mail
    Mr Gore, who won the Nobel Peace Prize for the climate change film An Inconvenient Truth, said the greatest challenge would be to convince people that the threat from climate change was as urgent as the threat from Nazi Germany.
    The Scotsman
    CLIMATE change poses as great a threat to civilisation as the Nazis did during the Second World War, former US vice-president Al Gore said yesterday.
    My own view is that his claim is absurd and that his own behaviour flying round the world to conferences, for example, is hypocritical and diminishes him if he really believes what he preaches.

  217. Censorship at the Times
    The Times story was listed among their four “Most Read” stories for the past day or so. Hence there must have been many comments on the story submitted. Some Times stories have hundreds of comments posted; yet this story one only has nine. Why?
    DG (06:31:41) says that he submitted two comments, and neither was posted.
    I submitted three comments, also none posted. My second comment was submitted several hours after the first (when it was clear that the first would not be posted), using a different name and internet address. Similarly for the third comment. All three comments were polite, and none referenced “Nazi”.
    I have previously submitted many comments to The Times, about non-AGW topics. Almost all have been posted.
    So this appears to be an active attempt to materially misrepresent what their readership thinks about AGW.

  218. “If it cools off a bit more (Gray says it will) the AGW’s can claim success.”
    Not if it cools within five years, or anytime before the CO2 levels turn down–which won’t be for decades. And even then there’d be a long lag between lowered CO2 and lowered temperature.

  219. Times Reader (10:21:30) :
    So this appears to be an active attempt to materially misrepresent what their readership thinks about AGW.
    Maybe a decision has been taken that there is money to be made?

  220. Mike Bryant (09:39:51) : “‘Please, sir, may I have anther bowl of gruel??'”
    Ach! Gruel causes release of greenhouse gases! Gruel ist verboten!!

  221. geo (09:19:24) :
    “Now, I don’t happen to agree with Mr. Gore. Or to the degree I do, I would like a few more leaders with Churchillian courage to say “No, you haven’t proved your case yet that the warming we’ve seen is caused primarily by C02 rather than having a large natural variation component, and you certainly haven’t proven the case on the degree of future warming dependant in your models on a large positive feedback mechanism”. But he is entitled to his view, as I am to mine…. ”
    My problem is the way he projects his views. I attended the National Association of Pension Funds Investment Conference in Edinburgh in March 2007. Mr Gore flew in made a presentation and flew out again. When he was questioned by the audience he made an ad hominem attack on the maker of The Great Global Warming Swindle. Not very edifying or persuasive. No science at all.
    I don’t know where you are from, but Nigel Lawson, former UK Chancellor of the Exchequer has written an excellent book “An Appeal to Reason – a Cool Look at Global Warming”. The trouble is that, so far as I am aware, all the active politicians are running scared and keep their true views hidden. You are correct that we need a Churcillian figure because the cost to the world’s poor of going down the Gore route will be horrific.
    Regards

  222. For closure’s sake I think it would be helpful if we could get to the bottom of the source/root cause of the Nazi references in The Times Online article. The Times Online appears to be on a little Nazi kick, as a Google News search finds 33 Time Online articles that used the word Nazi in the last month :
    http://news.google.com/news?pz=1&ned=us&hl=en&as_q=nazi&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_drrb=b&as_minm=6&as_mind=8&as_maxm=7&as_maxd=8&as_nsrc=times+online&as_nloc=&geo=&as_author=&as_occt=any
    Including this incisive piece:
    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6586526.ece
    However, today the Mail Online seems to infer that the word Nazis came out of Gore’s mouth, as they used quotation marks in the title of their article:
    ‘Battle against climate change is like fighting the Nazis’: Al Gore urges world leaders to unite
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1198150/Battle-climate-change-like-fighting-Nazis-Al-Gore-urges-world-leaders-unite.html
    So the question remains, did Al Gore invoke the Nazis during his speech at the Smith School World Forum on Enterprise and the Environment? The Times and the Smith School should answer this question by releasing the full video and transcript of Al Gore speech. Or maybe we will just have to wait until we subpoena the video for use during Al Gore’s trial…

  223. Responding to Al’s speech at Oxford published by Nature the Great Beyond online
    http://blogs.nature.com/news/thegreatbeyond/2009/07/big_al_speaks_on_climate_and_n.html
    We submitted this comment – as yet unpublished:
    This is the first time I’ve read Al and thought he might be on to something. What Al et al, may have come to know is the “fright and flight” instinct in modern man has diminished. Where once, external forces could readily coerce man’s reactions by instilling fear – there is now a far more measured, pragmatic response. In the Dark Ages a king could command the obedience of the peasants by guaranteeing safety from marauders. Fear of catastrophe was the authoritarian’s friend.
    This is no longer true. Al et al have learned that faced with a global “catastrophe” the human race will start to scramble in the desired direction and then pause. To look hard at the facts. And when the facts indicate a sham is at work – the scrambling will end. Sober thought takes hold and the shamers regardless of original intent – will be outed.
    Had the science relied on in this exercise been sound – human response would be different. Had we incontrovertible evidence that we were under attack, response would be different. To answer Al’s question – YES. An opposable thumb and neocortex are a good combination. A successful combination ready for full admittance.
    As to the emergency induced emotion? The human heart responds to real suffering. It does not and will not respond to simulated suffering. In an artificial world one can little expect more than artificial emotion.
    Artifice can never replace original being.
    IB

  224. The link to Nature above includes an embedded link to the entire audio track of Gore’s speech (scroll down). No need for a subpoena. You can hear it for yourself.
    IB

  225. Indiana Bones (11:18:42) :
    The link didn’t work for me. Can you tell me how to make it work please?

  226. …Wow. But it seems like he’s trying to go more for the ‘ignorance is bad’ approach than the horrible, overblown ‘climate change is the Holocaust’ claim that people assume when they see the word ‘Nazi.’
    There was satellite footage of what the Nazis were doing even while Europe was set firmly on appeasement. I think Gore’s comparison was poorly chosen, but it seems like a valid point to say that countries know what’s going on and are choosing to avoid it.

  227. neurotype – wasn’t aware that satellites were in orbit during the thirties . That’s what so great about this site – you learn something new every day . Oops , I forgot that FDR went onTV and told us we had nothing to fear but “fear itself “.

  228. Indiana Bones (11:18:42) :
    And of course Al Gore has to use the term “Climate Crisis” now.
    From AGW to Climate Change, to Climate Chaos and now of course it’s finally a “Climate Crisis.” I suppose “Climate Catastrophe” is next on the menu. While they are using their opposable thumbs to go through the dictionary for the latest soupe du jour, the Global temps are dropping. Al is missing his opportunity to state that the mere fact of producing “An Inconvenient Truth” has reversed the Global temperature trend and that he has single-handedly saved the planet.
    Hey, Al. You forgot that along with the opposable thumb and neocortex combination that you talked about, there can also be an opposable opinion of your agenda.

  229. To modify the old joke.
    Question: Why did Germany have Adolf Hitler and the United States have Al Gore?
    Answer: Germany had first choice.

  230. Reed – Good one! I was getting more and more depressed. At least there is great awareness of what Al Gore really is on this blog. I’m sure there are others that are cheering him on. It appears Da Leader was unable to get the developing countries to follow his Cap & Tax lead today. Man was I surprised that India and China want to develop their economies without our help. Actually they will get our help in the form of jobs that will be exiting our country. If there are any manuf. jobs left at this point.
    To Big Al – I don’t believe your global warming rants so I guess I’m a Nazi too. It just took a slob like you to enlighten me. Thanks.

  231. ‘A politician needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow, next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn’t happen.’
    Winston Churchill

  232. henrychance (10:15:55) :
    “Schedule the witch hunts. We are getting some utilities switched to radio transmitted meter readings on the electric meter. Then they can monitor you and knock on your door if you get a little too enthusiastic on lights and appliances”
    Get out your tinfoil hat before its too late.

  233. Peter Hearnden:
    Will you agree with me that Al Gore did not use the word Nazi or compare the challenge of AGW/CC to Nazism (a madman’s work the evil of which I absolutely agree with you about) but was talking of the reality that political will was/is needed to address both?
    No I wouldn’t. The implication was clear that Gore wasn’t campaigning for a view of future climate change but was fashioning the campaign as a fight against evil. The subtext that those who opposed Gore’s message was like those who opposed Churchill was certainly not missed by the world’s press.
    There are times when I give leeway to political rhetoric, but this isn’t one of them. Even the Times (until it changed the headline) didn’t miss the subtext of what Gore said.
    I simply reject from whatever side it comes from, any comparisons to Nazis or complicity in those crimes when it comes to climate science. It is beyond the pale for me – I have seen too much.

  234. spiderpoman support Gore
    Reply: I dunno. I just felt like letting this one through. ~ ctm

  235. Peter Hearnden:
    “Will you agree with me that Al Gore did not use the word Nazi or compare the challenge of AGW/CC to Nazism (a madman’s work the evil of which I absolutely agree with you about) but was talking of the reality that political will was/is needed to address both?”
    Having reviewed the audio of Gore’s speech:
    http://blogs.nature.com/news/thegreatbeyond/Al%20Gore%2007-07-2009.WMA
    I have to agree with you on your first point, it does not appear that Al Gore used the word Nazi in his speech. In terms of whether he was comparing the “challenge” of AGW/CC to Nazism, I’d say, not directly, but there is that implication there when one cites the political will of Churchill, just as if had cited the will of Mandela we’d all be questioning the parallels between apartheid and global warming.
    How about I make you a deal on behalf of all the skeptics? If the Warmingists stop using the obviously loaded term “denier” and Hansen retracts his statement: “If we cannot stop the building of more coal-fired power plants, those coal trains will be death trains – no less gruesome than if they were boxcars headed to crematoria, loaded with uncountable irreplaceable species.”, then we will stop wondering if every WW2 reference is sick ploy by the Warmingists to use the Holocaust to try to discredit reasoned skepticism to the flimsy global warming narrative. Deal?

  236. Just little coincidence. Hungarian Nazis, a particularly vicious gang of thugs, were also called green shirts, because that was their trademark uniforms.

  237. I am thinking about the next panic generated by the panic mongers after AGW bites the dust – as it inevitably will-. How about ” spontaneous and uncontrolled eruption of prosperity”. Naw, that does not work. Cap and Trade already took care of that. How about a “pandemic of longevity and good health”?
    Has some possibilities. We may need a health care reform to deal with that one.

  238. The sad part is that he may be right… we have massive economic unrest, disrespect for individual liberties and rights in the name of public safety, a controlled news media/propaganda machine, ‘scientists’ who have less to do with science than the religion of science, and an apparent utter disregard for human life and the facts. Massive inflation, external and internal economic manipulation, a rising deficit, and collapsing industry.
    We’ve passed legislation allowing the president to legislate, and legislation giving him the effective ‘power of the purse’ without oversight. Our enabling acts were for our own Reichstag fires.
    The real question: Is he on the side of the Wiemar Republic, or the side of the National Socialists, with the corporatism, monopoly, greed, and controlled media and ‘religion for and of the Führer’ and eliminating those who are ‘less worthy to live’?

  239. In his case the question will be: “How could you possibly be so clever as to invest in clean energy companies and make such a fortune, taking benefit of your media coverage while supporting a cause you onlye believed in because it could make you rich and famous?”

  240. I’m seeing Al Gore as more a misanthrope who’s bought into, hook, line and sinker, the neo-Malthusian politics of John Holdren, our esteemed Science Czar.
    Well, a misanthrope with a little Mao, maybe.

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