![Dr-Moore-Photo-2010-120x180[1]](https://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/dr-moore-photo-2010-120x1801.jpg?quality=83)
Patrick Moore, a Canadian environmentalist who helped found Greenpeace in the Seventies but subsequently left in protest at its increasingly extreme, anti-scientific, anti-capitalist stance, argues that the green position on climate change fails the most basic principles of the scientific method.
“The certainty among many scientists that humans are the main cause of climate change, including global warming, is not based on the replication of observable events. It is based on just two things, the theoretical effect of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions, predominantly carbon dioxide, and the predictions of computer models using those theoretical calculations. There is no scientific “proof” at all.”
Moore goes on to list some key facts about “climate change” which are ignored by true believers.
1. The concentration of CO2 in the global atmosphere is lower today, even including human emissions, than it has been during most of the existence of life on Earth.
2. The global climate has been much warmer than it is today during most of the existence of life on Earth. Today we are in an interglacial period of the Pleistocene Ice Age that began 2.5 million years ago and has not ended.
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Dr. Patrick Moore will give a keynote address at ICCC9, and I will be on a panel. There is just one week left to register. Go here if you want to attend:
http://climateconference.heartland.org/
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It is a real pity that so much intellectual effort is being expended – (along with taxpayers real cash) on the false god of CAGW. But without the efforts of intelligent argument from the likes of Patrick Moore we would all be victims of this monstrous lie, thanks.
Greenprice is not anti capitalist, for themselves, its just an evil system when they do not have the money of the marks who give.
Standard snow job, whatever the client needs to hear, to part them from their property.
I predict one of the finest aspects of the coming /continuing collapse of the Cult of Calamitous Climate (A certifiable Death Cult), will be the rising anger and open hostility toward the organizations who orchestrated the spread of this mass hysteria over plant food.
For the damage is legion and now writ large in our economies, the stagnation in lifting the worlds poor out of poverty, the deliberate push to maintain poverty or even expand its reach.
All the pious chatter of the faithful has been used to produce action/regulations that are truly evil in action.
And the green movement has become a …………… religious fundamentalism
Humans are funny animals…….they tend to always have some sort of religion….something to believe in
Of course climate change is bunkum, you can not heat water through its surface by convection. Surface tension blocks the heat transfer. It is not possible to add additional heat to that provided by the sun’s rays. And you cannot boil the ocean away either.
The fresh breeze of sanity…thanks, Dr. Moore. In the early 1800’s no one knew about ice ages. As older scientists passed on the new discoveries took root and were accepted as fact. For over a hundred years we have known we are in the grip of a brutal ice age, thankfully, in a warm period thereof. I suggest this is not common knowledge among the populous. Maybe it will take a trip to Greenland or Antarctica to make the ice age real. It is there to go see which I did many years ago. I can think of nothing good about continental ice sheets.
I don’t like the way the word, fundamentalism, is often and disparagingly bandied about. It’s often equated with blind faith, meaning belief without any evidence. And most religious people are not like that. And one person’s fundamentalism is another persons deep and sustained commitment to principle. Humans are built to be religious, to organize their lives around some primary principle – natural theology builds on this fact of human existence. It’s only when we organize our lives around self-blinding death cults and other sorts of idiocies – like CAGW – do we get into real trouble.
“The certainty among many scientists that humans are the main cause of climate change, including global warming, is not based on the replication of observable events. It is based on just two things, the theoretical effect of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions, predominantly carbon dioxide, and the predictions of computer models using those theoretical calculations. There is no scientific “proof” at all.”
yes..and that s enough to say even 100 % of scientist belived in this theory…it is only a theory…
in parallel you can read judith curry’s post..”can we trust climate model?”..
I recently read a similar commentary from David Bellamy (UK botanist, climate sceptic) who make an interesting point. Environmentalists (at least in the UK) used to campaign against roads because of the (genuine) damage done to wildlife by cars and trucks. Now all that seems to be forgotten, nobody cares anymore about cars, except for the harmless gases that come out of the exhaust.
Michael Babbitt says:
June 21, 2014 at 9:07 am
Exactly.
Add the element of lazy…as in too lazy to think for ones self. Rather than spending some energy in seeking the truth concerning philosophy, religion, politics, ethics, economics, sociology, law, and history, most just blindly follow a particular systematic body of concepts (i.e. an ideology) which “feels right to them.”
MikeUK is right. “Climate Change” is the mother of all excuses for politicians, power-merchants, egotists and various vested interests to do anything or nothing, as it suits them. Who needs terrorism, when you have climate terror as your bogyman?!
Michael Babbitt. I think we might have to agree to disagree about evidence for any religious belief and even if it is true that humans are built to “organize their lives around some primary principle”, that doesn’t mean that the principle has to be religious.
In any case, I would say that the term “fundamentalism” is not typically used when there is merely a lack of evidence for a devout belief. It tends to be applied when there is refusal to contemplate any contrary evidence and the ruthlessly intolerant, often violent, attempt to squash both internal dissent and other beliefs
.
The term “fundamentalist” is rarely, if ever, popularly applied to even the most devout believer in a religious belief, however apparently bizarre, if they aren’t harming anyone else and are reasonably tolerant of people with different points of view..
This calls for a parable. A salesman knocks on your door, and informs you that you need new windows for your home. You politely decline, but day by day, he keeps coming to your house and telling you how worthless your windows are. He points out that they are “dirty.” But your windows are just fine – they perform beautifully, they are paid for, and they are easy for you to care for and use. So, you tell him resolutely to leave.
This same salesman then leaves and goes to your city council and mayor, and they all determine that the windows in peoples’ homes are “dirty.” While you are working, they pass a law banning the use of your windows, and requiring brand new triple pane gold plated lightning repelling doped glass windows, which accelerate ions into the home for improved energy efficiency. They hire window smashers and claim in flyers they have improved employment in your town, and then promptly bust out your windows. They congratulate themselves at dinner parties that they have increased the economic activity by selling so many windows. No one is surprised to learn that only a few select companies make the kind of windows they have mandated.
Anti-coal and anti-fossil fuel activists will cost you money, no matter how they go about it. I simply cannot afford paying for all new nuclear plants when the hydro and coal plants are working beautifully and are paid for. Please read Bastiat.
Emperor Obama and his band of green sycophants are bent on “saving” us from our fossil-fuel folly, whether we like it or not. Men and women of good character have but one choice, vote.
Michael Babbitt says:
June 21, 2014 at 9:07 am
“I don’t like the way the word, fundamentalism, is often and disparagingly bandied about. It’s often equated with blind faith, meaning belief without any evidence. And most religious people are not like that.”
I agree.
A person who believes in a proposition without evidence will not participate in a rational discussion of the evidence. They usually display a personal dislike of any who disagree with their position and resort to name calling instead of presenting a rational defense of their belief. I suggest such people be referred to as irrationalists instead of fundamentalists.
Christian fundamentalists (the source of the word “fundamentalism”) do not usually resort to name calling, displaying a concern for others’ well being instead, and are very willing to rationally discuss the basis for their beliefs. 1 Peter 3:15
Hydrocarbons in Fossil Fuels in the family most consumed when oxidized produce H2O 2:1 over CO2 and/or CO. H2O vapor doubles CO2 in specific heat capacity, however to the CAGW fanatics CO2 somehow at 400 ppm of atmosphere content is dangerous to our survival.
methane CH4 -164 gas
ethane C2H6 -89
propane C3H8 -42
butane C4H10 -0.5
pentane C5H12 36 liquid
hexane C6H14 69
heptane C7H16 98
octane C8H18 125
nonane C9H20 151
decane C10H22 174
undecane C11H24 196
dodecane C12H26 216
“Patrick Moore, a Canadian environmentalist who helped found Greenpeace in the Seventies but subsequently left in protest at its increasingly extreme, anti-scientific, anti-capitalist stance,”
http://notrickszone.com/2014/06/16/casino-capitalism-at-greenpeace-blows-millions-from-donations-in-currency-speculation-rocked-by-finance-scandal/
“An employee at Greenpeace Central in Amsterdam lost a total of 3.8 million euros in currency speculation. According to Spiegel information, the money comes from donations transferred to Amsterdam Central from financially sound Greenpeace regional organizations like those in Germany…”
The Westborough Baptist Church would be a notable exception.
Lest we forget, almost all politicians attend church services on a regular basis with regular public profession thereof. Much good does it do them for their “principles” not to mention the irony therein?
RMB again claims: “Of course climate change is bunkum, you can not heat water through its surface by convection. Surface tension blocks the heat transfer.”
…willfully ignoring my former experimental falsification of his preposterously bizarre claim, one that helps tarnish the reputation of skepticism, probably willfully.
http://youtu.be/fbexOCVcfi8
He is very correct. I have seen environmental efforts that had measurable effects, risks and outcomes, get shut down and money diverted for….kindergarden color books, etc.
Remember the Rio Bravo encephalitic babies? The cultists had us running around testing water because “its the evil corporistas dumping hazmat in the water.” Meanwhile, babies kept dying…because Hispanic mothers were not getting enough folic acid. but no one was listening to fact and science….let babies keep dying and chase down propaganda fodder.
Time after time, I am seeing this happen over and over. Many of us who used to work at EPA and glad we are out…especially those who spent 30 years trying to get mercury down and those of us who worked superfund sites.
Further to MikeUK’s David Bellamy quote, there was even, back when Patrick Moore was founding it, a perfectly good and valid purpose for Greenpeace. While they were finding and showing us streams filled with foaming, bright orange grot, or landscapes gloss black with oil from here to the horizon, there was clearly plenty needing attention. No problems with supporting that sort of stuff. Good work.
Back then, of course, they acted to check the most offensive of pollution emitted by corporations, with genuine public support. Now, they’ve established a comfortable working relationship with the corporations, and in exchange for generous support from them seem mainly to be helping to work out new ways to “tax” the public’s ordinary life – along with too many other zealots. (Thanks to John Brignell for an excellent, if depressing, read.) Russia and India have the right idea on the modern Greenpeace and other NGOs, and should be widely followed.
Agree too about “fundamentalism / ist” having been given a Newspeak meaning which spoils its proper use. I’ve known plenty of people with firm religious views, and all would cheerfully argue you to death rather than using any other method, no matter which particular “fundament” they represent. Sadly, even being aware of the “switch” doesn’t prevent the crazed nutter from coming to mind when you hear the word.
Watermelons ! Green on the outside, red on the inside…
The term, or anyway a term, that is used in political science for what you are describing is “extremism,” or an “extremist mentality.” It afflicts different people in varying degrees, and it afflicts the same people in varying degrees at different times. It is equivalent to the “lunatic fringe”–and some movements are fringier than others.
Jeff Alberts says:
June 21, 2014 at 11:37 am
Jeff, your are correct to use the word “exception”. Not all who claim to be something actually are, regardless of whether they claim to be fundamentalists (Mathew 7:18-23) or believers of CAGW. Leaders of various groups of people, whether religious or political, sometimes profess a particular belief for the purpose of personal financial benefit.
Since the evidence for CAGW is so meager (non-existent?), it seems that leaders of the CAGW movement are primarily motivated by personal gain, coupled with extreme political ideology, and some politicians have adopted the cause for the same reasons.
However, just as not all scientists and politicians should be linked with CAGW proponents, neither should irrationalists (see my post at 10:55 am) be linked with Christian fundamentalists. The claim that Christian fundamentalists are blind believers is on a par with the claim by CAGW proponents that skeptics of CAGW are (the D word).
This on top of us finding out Russia has infiltrated and is probably funding the anti-fracking movement. Well, Russia doesn’t want the fracking technology to expand of course.
I saw a news report this morning about an environmental activist/protester who was getting paid to protest against Barrick Gold by Australian gold companies (fronted by a “green” fund).
The religious fundamentalists/activists are getting funded in addition to being fundy mental persons (sometimes by the business competition). Its crazy as well as mental that we allow this to go on.