Dr. Mann runs his mouth again, and this time I think he’s made a huge mistake. Personally, with what knowledge I have of libel law, I think this is actionable under Canadian law as well as US law, and I hope that Steve McIntyre takes Dr. Mann to task legally.
Here is a screencap:
The original Tweet is here.
UPDATE 10/8/19 9:25AM
It seems Mann is a bit worried about potential libel litigation in this new Tweet:
A wise old cop told me once “A person (my addition: even a melvin), is never as dangerous and unpredictable as when a long term “getting away with something big” is evaporating, …. as the investigator’s cruisers pull up to the front window of his/her office. And, you are about to lose everything.
For reference, check out John Brennan’s latest comments on ‘they saw I’m going to be interviewed in this ‘non-investigation’. The big cheese is always interviewed last, John
Much as I dislike Michael Mann and all that he stands for, this strikes me as just opinion, not libel.
Of course, like most readers here, I’m not a lawyer. My opinion of Mann is unprintable for other reasons, but we’ve all seen what does and does not fly in court. No way is this actionable with any reasonable chance of success.
But others’ opinions about him, he has sued over over less. And sued out of malicious attempts to destroy them personally. (As long as he had financial backers to pay his bills.)
Having said that, I can understand why Mcintyre would choose to let it pass.
Mickey has been hoist on his own Stick already.
To sue might not be worth the effort for him.
I’m not so sure about that (no cause for action). Mann’s accusation is that McIntire is paid to lie. That is a fact that is provable or disprovable and I suspect that Mann not only has no evidence, he knows its false. That’s libel, even if Steve is a prominent person.
Ditto.
My reading of it, is that the courts would want to see a “Macintyre did W to X at time Y in place Z, with the candlestick”. This falls a long way short of that.
I believe one has to show injury.
As Steve McIntyre is published in the peer-reviewed scientific literature, calling him a gun-for-hire liar is a defamation that could negatively impact the reception of his published work.
It seems possible that the Mann-affirming McIntyre-dismissive tweets are evidence of successful discredit, which may constitute evidence of injury.
Good scientists don’t bother to sue people. Suing people is for slime buckets and pseudoscientists who have something to hide. I don’t think Mcintyre should sue. His work will speak for itself and any real scientist will see that without spending a fortune dragging some insignificant slime ball pseudoscientist through the muck. Where’s the data Mikey????
As a lawyer, I completely agree. Although Mann’s statement is false and defamatory, I can’t see how McIntyre has suffered any real economic damage as a result of its publication. I doubt that he has suffered any emotional damage either.
Libel lawsuits should be saved for cases where the libel injures someone’s livelihood or causes serious humiliation in the eyes of the public. McIntyre should not lower himself to behaving as Mann does.
I’d disagree from the point of view of “the intangibles”. It’s also about reputation. Even if you only win $1.00, defending your reputation has value as well. One never knows what invitations, offers, grants etc. one misses because of the numbers of people who heard and believed “the slur”, but never heard the defense.
Even if you only win the $1.00, the awarding of costs does send a financial phaser blast set on “stun” back at your false accuser. Paying for court costs, and someone else’s lawyer is expensive.
Natalie I’m grateful to you:
“insignificant slime ball pseudoscientist ”
Ker-CHING. Thanks. Outrageous, no?
Methinks the Discovery process will be fascinating!
Read: discovery process will be fairly described as proctological…
If Steve M did sue you could consider it a somewhat different game of squash
Mann’s Paradox: stepping into himself.
Michael Mann living up to the title of Mark Steyn’s book,
“A Disgrace to the Profession”.
Steve McIntyre should consider Mann’s vituperation as the highest of accolades.
Wow.
Got blocked quick.
Post I had responded to referred to skeptic SM as not being qualified to give an opinion on climate, having an inadequate scientific degree.
Then I pointed out this was a war of “statistics” in which Mann was uncredentialed.
Then ZAP! — Blocked!
Thin-skinned lot.
(Never been blocked by anyone before, ’cause, never really ever use twitter … )
I hope Mac has more interesting things to do with his time and money.
I would not want to be in the same building with Mann.
He may not have time for that guy.
He is now also one of the leading and most informative researchers in politics with multiple groundbreaking discoveries and that work is too important to waste any time for mud fights with self made climate warriors.
A serious question. What has Mann contributed to science beyond his debunked hockey stick ?
Well, I’ve been blocked by Mann. At least that’s what it says when I try to see the tweet. It’s weird, because I’ve never been on his feed. Is it possible he blocks everyone and you have to be white-listed by him? I don’t know, but I feel pretty honored to be in the “blocked by Mann” category.
IF you’ve been blocked, try another browser … sessions are tracked per the browser you’re logged in with.
I use Slimjet, Firefox and MyPal (yes, yet another browser) to do these/this trick …
Michael Mann seems like a happy young girl with a bright future. So nice to see!
When you have no case, attack the presenter. We all know that the entire cAGW narrative is a load of hot air, so the warmists must continually up the ante to maintain the big lie. Unbelievable that some people still believe the giant fantasy.
As for Michael Mann, he knows his goose will be cooked when it is revealed the whole thing was a con job, so he and the others that are likely to lose their heads (literally) will be out in force to trumpet their message of BS in hope that idiotic leaders sign up for economic and civilizational suicide. There are not too many options left after the current Extinction Rebellion rubbish.
I intend (on the days I am not at work) to not have a shower and hand out alternate information at their love-ins. As they claim to be non-violent, if they protest the information, perhaps I can persuade them (on punishment of being branded a bigot) to have some home truths revealed , ie, they have been conned.
Mann claimed McIntyre’s peer-reviewed rebuttle to the Hockeystick paper was ‘pure scientific fraud’. In other words, anyone who points out the flaws and weaknesses in Mann’s work. The guy can’t take constructive criticism.
This rebuttle ultimately led to withdrawal of the hockeystick from future IPCC reports, so many at the IPCC obviously didn’t think it was ‘pure scientific fraud’, so according to Mann they are all ‘pure scientific fraud’ as well.
And also the reviewer who concluded ‘McIntyre’s criticism is valid’ or another hockeystick paper which Mann backed. That’s an awful lot of instances of people who think McIntyre isn’t ‘pure scientific fraud’.
McIntrye’s background is auditing dodgy mining claims. Mann is the kind of person in the investment world who would trumpet his claims loudly, but eventually nobody would invest in his schemes because they bare no relation to reality; he wouldn’t last long in the real world. There are plenty of such dodgy promoters around, it’s just that Mann is unusual in that he doesn’t know he is one of them.
I’m not saying Mann is a cretin, but arguing with him might be described as class warfare with an unarmed opponent.
I’m not saying he’s uncouth, but at my kids’ school they renamed the Monday of a long weekend “Mannday”, since nobody has class.
I’m not saying there’s a gaping defect in Mann’s personality, but it’s hard to forget the sight of farm animals, unsuspecting tourists and light beams being sucked into his cl________.
I’m not saying Mann is an obnoxious boor, but Mickey Rooney would be unduly dignifying him if he reprised his cringe-worthy yellowface from Breakfast at Tiffany’s and said “ah Mr Mann, you put the ‘crass’ in crass!’
Book sales dropping a bit low, Michael?
It’ll be a classic one day. A prescribed text for psychologists.
In the fullness of time, Steve McIntyre and Climate Audit will be used as type examples of the growing influence of the blog as a means of scientific communication. Historians would be hard pressed to find a better example.
Geoff S
To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether ’tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them:
Steve McIntyre
If you want to sue the prat I’m in with $Cdn 100. When you are ready
MM. Is Nobel laureate lol! :))
It is very obvious that any scientific training the Micky Mann ever had has completely evaporated from his consciousnesses as he is currently only acting as political advocate.
It is also obvious that science is now not his strong point (was it ever?), as he twits away with heartfelt missives deriding anyone he feels is against him, usually just because people like Steven McIntyre had the temerity to analyzed and openly displayed evidence that M. Mann’s version of science is badly flawed. M. Mann has become someone who can no longer argue his corner scientifically because now it is obvious that science is beyond his mental abilities.
It looks and sounds to me very much like Michael F. Mann is not only a loser but a bad loser.
Michael Mann’s eyes are too close together. They make him look like a pig! So funny! He’s got one of those pudgy know-it-all faces you sometimes see on stupid people who think they are smart. He also looks a bit like a sex offender! Just saying!
Round-faced “Greta” comes to mind ….
to paraphrase Disraeli[blockquote]Michael Mann appears to lack a single redeeming defect[/blockquote]
To do a blockquote here, you need to use the “greater-than”, “less-than” signs, not brackets.
Here’s how you meant your comment to appear. (unless I screw it up!)
Gras Albert
to paraphrase Disraeli
So Mann brings “Climate Science” and Penn State “University” into disrepute.