Al Gore / Trump Meeting – Gore Promises More Activism

Al Gore and Donald Trump

Al gore By Crop by Gralo of original image by Brett Wilson (brettw AT gmail DOT com) [CC BY-SA 2.5], via Wikimedia Commons. Donald Trump by Gage Skidmore [CC BY-SA 3.0], via Wikimedia Commons

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

What happened in the meeting? Nobody knows for sure – but in the wake of a one hour meeting between Al Gore and Donald Trump, Gore has promised an “unprecedented” surge in climate activism, to protect a renewable energy revolution which he also claims will “happen anyway”.

Al Gore: climate change threat leaves ‘no time to despair’ over Trump victory

Former vice-president expects backlash from environmentalists against Trump and hopes Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton will join fight.

The urgent threat of climate change means there is “no time to despair” over the election of Donald Trump, according to former vice-president Al Gore, who hopes that Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton will join an escalated climate campaign against the president-elect.

Gore told the Guardian he remained hopeful Trump would reverse some of his positions on climate change but predicted an unprecedented backlash from environmentalists over the next four years.

Trump, who has called climate change a hoax, has pledged to withdraw the US from the Paris climate accord, dismantle the Clean Power Plan, slash renewable energy funding and somehow prop up the ailing US coal industry.

His advisers have also advocated cutting climate research at Nasa and completely exiting the international climate effort.

Gore said such threats mean there will “likely be a huge upsurge in climate activism. I’m encouraged that there are groups that are digging in to work even harder. Those groups working in the courts are even more important now; those organizing on campuses are even more important now.

“My message would be that despair is just another form of denial. There is no time to despair. We don’t have time to lick our wounds, to hope for a different election outcome.

“We have to win this struggle and we will win it; the only question is how fast we win. But more damaged is baked into the climate system every day, so it’s a race against time.”

On Monday, Gore spent around an hour meeting with Trump and his daughter Ivanka, who reportedly plans to speak out on climate change despite her father’s skepticism of the issue.

“I had a lengthy and very productive session with the president-elect,” Gore said, after emerging from the meeting at Trump Tower in New York City.

“It was a sincere search for areas of common ground. I had a meeting beforehand with Ivanka Trump. The bulk of the time was with the president-elect, Donald Trump. I found it an extremely interesting conversation, and to be continued, and I’m just going to leave it at that.

“Regardless of what he does, a sustainable energy revolution is under way.”

Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/05/al-gore-climate-change-threat-leaves-no-time-to-despair-over-trump-victory

My guess is Trump wants to find a way to defuse climate opposition, but I don’t think there is any room to manoeuvre. Any serious concessions to the climate movement would be treated by many of Trump’s supporters as a sell-out. The entrenched positions are simply too polarized.

You don’t “drain the swamp” by hiring swamp critters.

The assertions of the “inevitability” of the renewable energy revolution juxtaposed with promises of “unprecedented” climate action are noteworthy. If the green revolution is so “inevitable”, why the need for a hysterical activist response should the Trump administration cut federal support?

Advertisements

  Subscribe  
newest oldest most voted
Notify of

If Trump removes federal support, including tax provisions, supporting “renewable energy”, such as required purchase agreements as well as outright subsides, much of the “industry” will collapse. Doing away with the Obama “Clean Power Plan” and the rest of the green atrocities instituted since 2008 would have quite an effect as well.
Appointing Ebell and the rest of the group at EPA would seem inconsistent with giving Al Gore anything more than polite conversation (I hope !).

Paul Westhaver

Tom, you are correct.
Trump will sign a funding bill from congress that guts the green gravy train. Congress controls the purse.
Simply put, its going to be a green blood bath…There will be a lot of under employed ex greenies causing havoc protesting since they will have nothing else to do..

If you have to cut the budget to slow the rise of the deficit, then cutting climate research is a good place to start and nothing interesting, alarming, or dangerous is going on. There have to be millions dead in the streets by now, based on earlier predictions.

Eric Simpson

Donald Kasper “There have to be millions dead in the streets by now, based on earlier predictions.”
Exactly. And remember this bit of IPCC advice:
“We have to offer up scary scenarios… each of us has to decide the right balance between being effective and being honest.” -Stephen Schneider, lead IPCC author, 1988
So that’s just what the fearing mongering Prophets of Doom set out to do, to present their bs “scary scenarios” as:
“Entire nations could be wiped off the face of the Earth by rising sea levels if the global warming trend is not reversed by the year 2000.” -Noel Brown, ex UNEP Director, 1989
“A billion people could die from global warming by 2020.” -John Holdren, Obama’s current Science Czar, 1986
“[Inaction will cause]… by the turn of the century [2000], an ecological catastrophe which will witness devastation as complete, as irreversible as any nuclear holocaust.” -Mustafa Tolba, 1982, former Executive Director of the United Nations Environment Program
“In twenty years (2008) the West Side Highway [and thus much of Manhattan] will be under water.” -James Hansen, 1988, NASA
But what’s actually happened is … nothing. Nada. Zilch. It’s all just the same as it was. The Chicken Littles have been Crying Wolf for decades. Their bs … ain’t . going . to . happen!

2hotel9

I see an upsurge in part time day laborers with useless college degrees. They will need A LOT of supervision since they have no form of work ethic and you won’t be able to leave them alone shoveling gravel or clearing brush. And you damned well won’t be able to give them any form of power tools!

OB

I just hope you are right but that all remains to be seen; I just hope this leopard does not “change his spots”.

Bryan A

Look, Al, Baby,
First off, what have You done personally to reduce your size Goregolplex carbon footprint?
Do you still live in an energy intensive carbon spewing Mansion?
Do you still trot around the world in a carbon spewing Private Jet?
Secondly, if you are so certain that renewables (ala solar and wind) are the way forward, then the technology shouldn’t require subsidizing by government money. No one is stopping anyone from placing solar on their rooftops or on their private land, the government simply will not be footing the bill.
There is nothing that President Elect Trump can do to make these installations illegal thereby eliminating them, they will always be an option. There will only be a change in how they are invested in.

BCBill

A green bloodbath. Not another assault on Vulcans. After their home world was destroyed by the Romulan Nero, they can’t take much more.

Samuel C Cogar

Me thinks that Trump probably told Gore to “clean-up his act” or he will “seek” the Judicial Dogs on him come Jan 2017.

RH

I think Trump only met with Gore to keep him away from his daughter.

Paul Westhaver

Keep you friends close,,,keep your enemies closer.

vboring

Most renewables are built because of state level mandates. Nothing the Federal government can do about them.
The subsidies for renewables just reduce the cost of complying with the mandates. Removing them would just makes states that want renewables have to actually pay their full cost.

A large number of the state requirements and mandatory purchase agreements are in place to meet federal clean air standards, or really, to suck up to federal regulators. Removing the federal requirement would tend to remove many of the state rules.

Paul Westhaver

Tom,
Now your are contemplating the tactics. To dismantle the state requirements, you hit upon the tangle of self energizing federal requirements.
It appears to me that you are capable of laying out the key steps to identify the key JENGA blocks to remove such to efficiently drop the whole mess.
Tom, I have read a great deal of your posts/thoughts. You should conspire to lay out an action plan and communicate it. Maybe each state needs a template? Time for you to write a plan, send it to the right people. I would not publish it here. Why inform your enemies?
Seriously.

“vboring December 6, 2016 at 6:18 am
Most renewables are built because of state level mandates. somebody’s friend or family member got a chance to get their hands on a lot of taxpayer money.
There, fixed it.

Griff

Except where commercial companies buy/install them for commercial/cost reasons.
See google’s statement today that it will move to 100% renewable electricity – and its reasons why (climate change is not top reason)

Removing them (federal subsidies) would just makes states that want renewables have to actually pay their full cost.
===============================
There is nothing quite so effective in changing policy as hitting a politician in the pocketbook.

MarkW

Griffie, of course commercial/cost reasons, includes all of the state and federal subsidies and mandates.

Bryan A

Griff,
Do you have a link to that particular Google article?
The last thing I read regaring Google and Renewables was that they tried to prove them as a viable replacement but couldn’t make the technology function in the manner necessary to produce 100% of their needs and still be cost competative with conventional energy sources.
I looked into Solar for my house and discovered that with sufficient battery back-up and all the necessary infrasturcture (It can’t be mounted on my roof), the installation would run over $80,000 and panels would begin to degrade and require replacement before the initial expence was recovered in energy bill elimination.

Griff: So you are saying Google will be completely off-grid, no line to grid.

mothcatcher

Let the states do what they will with regard to renewables. Great if it isn’t a federal matter. If California wants to burden its citizens with a fossil-fuel free future, fine. People have a vote, and they also have feet to vote with. Maybe they won’t find the equable (=warm) climate on the west coast is sufficient to keep them there any more.

One can hope Tom.
The point to make here is that “climate change” and its motives and operations go far beyond Green activism and fantasy. The remains of globalist expansion socialism rooted from the Soviet and beyond are compounded and invested in the phrase and what it represents.
As with “fake news”, “climate” is a massive echo chamber to control debate, academic/educational conformity along strict PC to achieve the desired political result. It goes far beyond rent seekers, hipsters and grifters. Aside from the hack MSM itself it has been a primary tool of agenda setting for the armchair western socialist culture.
Defunding is a positive but the entire background ideology of climate, settled science and fake news should be targeted for what it is since the support Trump received was directly related to the rejection of globalist totalitarian inclinations that are so well represented in all of these terms and the people who promote them. If he does half a job and allows teachers (as one example) to control the ground game of leftist/green indoctrination then the long game will be lost. I a

“If he does half a job and allows teachers (as one example) to control the ground game of leftist/green indoctrination then the long game will be lost.”
This is one of my major beefs. In the UK this unevidenced climate woo is taught as fact. It is literally rammed down the throats of our children as is a lot of other politically correct leftist garbage. Our children are being ritually abused and no one is doing anything about it. I think some kind of legal challenge is going to be required to stop political propaganda forming a major part of the school curriculum.

mothcatcher

Cephus, you flag up a very important point.
The educational establishment in the UK is 95%+ liberal and green, and I suspect it is so in many western nations. Of course, teachers have always indoctrinated their pupils, whether it was with deep-rooted and sometimes militaristic nationalism a century ago, or religious conformity before that (and some places, e.g. Ireland, more recently as well). What has changed in the UK is the rapid and complete takeover by the left of teacher training in the 1960s and 1970s. The result was utterly devastating, and more than one generation of kids was lost to prejudice and PC – and indeed core learning was downgraded, with hundreds of thousands leaving school without ability to read or write properly.. We are still suffering the massive consequences of those terrible years today, for the brighter kids that went through it are now in charge. Unlike nationalism or religion, the new memes handed down work their way into every corner of every life, whether it be the near-universal acceptance by the kids of the climate change agenda, or the absurd obsession with ‘recycling’ as a good in itself.
It is going to take some changing. Neither Trump or Brexit is sufficient and since, in both cases, the downside may come before the upside, the revolution may easily be reversed. Keep working!

Jeff Alberts

” It is literally rammed down the throats of our children”
Literally? Really?

Paul Westhaver

Avail yourselves to this administration as a resource.
WUWT is no longer a dissenting voice, railing against a sick system, It is a resource of brilliant people and capable thinkers who can do something different now. I suggest offline activities wherein you smart people assemble intellectually to service a new administrative arm for the Trump administration. He is going to need ideological help from smart people. This site is a resource of such people.
It is fun to revel in the joy of the destabilized green tower of sh1t, but governance is serious and we need to help.
Where is the Trump admin going to get a reliable work force of 100s of people to get things done in the next 4 years?
Right here.
WUWT is more than Anthony’s blog, it is an effective resource to a friendly government. Let’s help Anthony do construct actions that will be durable and fundamentally toxic to the anti-human socialist operatives.

Ivan Loyes

Trump has said he would remove all energy subsidies. Without a definition of subsidy, that could apply to oil/gas extraction tax breaks etc. 200k are people employed fitting solar panels and in the same demographic as coal workers. (source:BLS). I can’t see them being laid off by the next POTUS.
Trump clearly has a short attention span, and no problem switching position so the real question is who has his ear most frequently. I would guess that in a contest of courtiers, Ivanka will win. I also imagine that there will be many dismissals as the line between reality and reality show blurs.

Letting an operation write off production expenses in only a “subsidy” to a True Believer green referring to the evil fossil fuel industry.

RockyRoad

Are you talking about the depletion allowance all resource-extracting companies (which includes mining as well as petroleum and gas producers) have been utilizing like, forever?
You realize when you’re working with a finite resource the only way to get to the next project economically is to have some tax relief. What Trump will eliminate is the actual subsidies that have been required to bring uneconomic sources of energy (primarily wind and solar) even close to the low rates offered by base-load fossil fuel sources.
Who are you going to rob to make uneconomic energy sources look viable? The tax-payer, again? It’s a signature of the Progsoc movement to ignore economic reality and live in an energy Safe Place.
Lets hope the current political correctness toward energy sources that must rely on creative accounting and rate redistribution to even begin to compete is fully exposed and eliminated.

Geoff

The simplest thing to do is innovate. Hydrocarbons can be separated from carbon sources using solvents at a lower cost per barrel than any other current method. The remaining carbon can be used to make very large batteries. Such batteries make base load from any power source possible. A carbon battery can be used to make hydrocarbons derived from carbon emissions.
All this stuff is “in the lab” now, no subsidy, tax or government involvement was necessary.

Phil

The hockey stick graph itself is clearly a hoax. It was the center piece of Gore’s movie. ‘Nuff said.

The second major mistake Al Gore made was using data of Arctic sea ice versus time. Times series are not predictive graphs as time and climate are independent variables whose relationship can change at any point in time. Al never had the ability to reflectively look at why his 2014 prediction of no summer Arctic ice failed. It failed because time and ice are independent variables such that least squares trend fits do not predict outcomes. Least square works on dependent variables. As time does not make ice, those graphs were baseless. This is what Al failed to understand, and still does not understand. PIOMASS continues that tradition, predicting negative sea ice volume in the coming years with their trend fit of Arctic ice mass vs time.

Al Gores understanding is limited to money …

sasal: compounded by his statement; “Those groups working in the courts are even more important “

Griff

Yes, but the trend in arctic sea ice extent and/or volume is still down, isn’t it?
At a record low for both now, even in this winter season.
The ‘ice free arctic’ is difficult/impossible to predict precisely, you are right, but it surely is coming, alas…

Kamikazedave

The ‘ice free arctic’ is difficult/impossible to predict precisely, you are right, but it surely is coming, alas…
Sure it’s coming, Griff. Just like the time before and the time before that.

Tom O

The think that Al gore understands is power. Money is one avenue to power. Getting a lot of deluded fools pushing an idea that you support is another. Gore doesn’t see a planet for humanity, he sees a planet for people like himself being supported by the servants and serfs that he will need to maintain his life style.
Griff, there never will be an “ice-free Arctic” so you really out to stop drinking the koolaid and go find a real job.

MarkW

Every time the statistics move in Griffies direction, it’s proof that he’s right.
Every time the statistics don’t move in Griffies direction, it’s just weather.

Bryan A

Tis certainly a good thing that those cuddlie wuddlie furry wurrie Seals can birth on land and that those Rolley Polley Bears can also birth on land and hunt on land. Arctic survival for local species has definitely proven to be adaptable to ice free conditions in the past.

Probably true enough Griff but, so is the earth’s exit from this interglacial.
We cannot predict when.

MarkW

Over the next few billion years, the sun is going to continue to get brighter.
So eventually, Griffie will be right.

Mario Lento

Let the old come in as the funding subsides…
then they can blame global cooling on Trump.

Amber

I am surprised Gore didn’t invite Podesta and Steyer along for the meeting but maybe they were just to busy
working on the recounts with the Green Party .
Well maybe next time . How long do you think it took Al Gore to fill in Steyer and Podesta .
Podesta did say it isn’t over . The familiar pattern will emerge … the soft sell followed fairly quickly with the
trash talk . Deniers and Deplorables have been used …. maybe something new and catchy .
Stay away from Krypton superman they ain’t never ever going to be you or your daughters friends .
But you already knew that .

joelobryan

Podesta is getting ready for the black Sabbath at Palm Springs with his fellow dark angels.
Dems are still running with the Soros-Steyer billionaire’s money to control the Democratic Party.
Anyone who believes the DNC or Dems have changed due to their 2016 election shellacking can look no further than the re-election by House Dems of 76 yr old Nancy Pelosi as their minority leader.
http://dailycaller.com/2016/11/02/revealed-liberal-moneys-longterm-strategy-to-control-public-opinion-and-secure-advantageous-demographics/

Sommer
Claude Harvey

If the solar cells, themselves, were free, central solar plants still could not be built without subsidies. That’s how bad it really is. Take a hard look at the Ivanpah plant near the California-Nevada border. Despite monster construction tax credits and accelerated depreciation tax benefits plus a guaranteed power sale rate 4 to 5 times the current national wholesale average, that plant appears to me to be doomed to bankruptcy shortly after its five-year depreciation period has ended. At that point, taxpayers get to pick up the tab for Ivanpah’s federally guaranteed construction loan.

Paul

“If the solar cells, themselves, were free…Take a hard look at the Ivanpah plant”
Ivanpah is solar thermal, not solar PV.

RockyRoad

And let me guess who gets to foot the reclamation bill to clean up the bone yard after it fails. The tax-payer, of course.

Hu

What a snake oil salesman. Still waiting for algores 7 meters of sea level rise. Things are going to have to speed up quite a bit.

I guess the people in the Eastern States and the Mid West just love the current “Global Warming”
Waiting for Griff’s lack of sea ice in the Arctic “statement”.

John

He will only have another month for that, if he is lucky. Might be less. Although, you will then need to hear about how low it got for the next year or so.

Alan Robertson

He’s off the clock.

2hotel9

He did not like it when I linked him the current ice extent image, javascript://

2hotel9

Well, that didn’t work. Why am I having so much trouble linking that image from NSIDC? Almost like they suddenly don’t want people to easily share that particular image. Wonder why?

Griff

I posted it below!
There’s a distinct lack, alackaday!

What a snake oil salesman

My sources tell me Gore is so anxious and depressed following Clexit (Trump 16) that he’s taken up selling cigarettes again—with a vengeance. I mean, like two or three packs a day.

Monna Manhas

Oh my goodness. I just read the interview. Get a load of this:
What one piece of advice would he give the legitimate scientists? [I guess “legitimate” is a relative term.]
“Listen guys, the world has changed. You can’t afford to just, quote-unquote, stick to the science any more,” says Gore.
They need to get better at defaming and delegitimising skeptics, he argues.
As if what happened to Roger Pielke Jr and Willie Soon wasn’t enough.

Pierre DM

It won’t work the same without Obama in the WH. The greens are apt to actually trigger that debate out in the open without being able to control the narrative. The true debate will be the big change that we see.
I suspect the personal heat will be higher for individual on our side with the possible need for physical and financial protection. The greens are going to invest heavily in the politics of personal destruction without the overhead WH shield.

Just drain Subsidies Swamp. Then let the markets prevail.

John Gundersen

I like that one😀

Resourceguy

The financially fragile companies run by former politicos will be the first to collapse. But Tesla will not be far behind with its cash burn timeline.

Griff

I’ve checked and Tesla itself gets no subsidy whatever for its operations from government.
I don’t think that any subsidy removal on its products will affect it… not least because it is selling to markets outside the US.

Check again. When the government is subsidizing the purchase, it is subsidizing the company. Otherwise, no sales, no company. Econ 101.

pbweather
pbweather

$2.391 Billion subsidy for Telsa component out of 4.9 billion US $ for all his companies. Definitely no subsidy here worth noting.
https://www.quora.com/How-much-government-subsidies-did-Tesla-Motors-receive-by-2015

Monna Manhas

What do you consider to be a subsidy, Griff?

pbweather

Once the Dot.com like hype of Elon Musk companies subsides this will become one of the biggest corporate collapses in modern times…..there are many in market circles who think this. I guarantee you that Elon Musk will stay rich though.

MarkW

As has been pointed out before, the subsidies don’t go directly to Tesla, but instead go directly to anyone who buys one of Tesla’s cars.
You know the difference Griffie, too bad you don’t have sufficient intellectual integrity to acknowledge it.

As Elon Musk said today, without subsidies, his competitive position vs. other electric car makers would be better. He fails to mention that without subsidies, far fewer electric cars would be sold, because the delta with IC engine cards would balloon. So, Tesla would have a larger share of a much smaller market.
Another subsidy that could disappear is Tesla selling its Zero Fuel Vehicle credits to help other car makers with their CAFE and electric mandates. No more mandates would mean no more income stream.

Bryan A

Mark,
Sounds to me like it is still going to Tesla just via their customres.
Customer buys an electric vehicle for $90,000
Government gives the customer a check for $10,000
Customer effectively buys the car for $80,000, manufacturer still makes $90,000
How is this different from
Customer buys a $90,000 electric car for $80,000
Government gives the customer a check for $10,000 payable to the manufacturer.
Customer effectively buys the car for $80,000, manufacturer still makes $90,000
Car is still sold for $90,000
Manufacturer still makes $90,000
Customer still spends $80,000
Government’s $10,000 still goes to the manufacturer

MarkW

I was responding to Griffies claim that Tesla doesn’t get any direct government subsidies.

DonM

Monna,
He’s not likely to answer, so I’ll give it a shot and answer for him”
“subsidies are what the people on the other side get.”

Bryan A

Got it 😉

After having endured the extremism of the leftists and the whole CAGW scam, I, as a conservative skeptic, as with most conservatives naturally, do not wish for ‘revenge’ or “turn around is fair play” against the lefties, even though they would surely relish revenge upon conservatives… But I, at this point, believe it is time to go all out against their whole agenda and crush as much of the BS as can be eliminated. It is sickening to see the damage they have done and the money they have stolen from us in the name of “progress”. History is full of ‘do gooders’ who eventually in their ‘do gooding’ murdered millions of people in their zest for doing good and ‘political correctness’, such as the religion of climate change. It must be eliminated as a call to do good and exposed for the fraud it is.

John Gundersen

A big amen to that!

Pierre DM

But going after them keeps them busy and spends their resources on defense. They would compliment the nice gesture of no backlash with total contempt. You invite a second wave even bigger than the first.
Nothing convinces “Joe Six Pack” quicker than revealing corruption, collusion and conspiracy. The fight is still with the voter whom does not pay attention to science.

Pop Piasa

Once the general public is properly informed, there won’t need to be any fighting them. There will be no traction for their science-masked global political coup.

Paul Westhaver

Dahlquist,
Eliminating polio was not an act of vengeance. Ending the cold war a la Reagan, Thatcher & JPII, was not vengeance. So let us proceed to kill the green infection at its philosophical roots.

+100

Drain it

joelobryan

“protect a renewable energy revolution which he also claims will “happen anyway”.”
Good. Let’s completely phase-out/remove the Federal tax breaks and energy mandates and see how renewables compete in an open energy marketplace. If they are as inevitable and reliable as claimed, they will hold and increase market share on their own.

Agreed. Plus, eliminate mandated feed in tariffs. Let the electric companies decide what having your solar panels attached to the grid is worth. I’m not sure if they’d willingly connect or pay you anything.
And no federal rebates or tax incentives.
I’m a Fair Tax https://fairtax.org/index kind of guy.

Agreed. The pricing on intermittent, nondispatchable power should be deeply discounted if salable at all.

Knute

I dont KNOW shit but these seem highly probable
1. He’ll pull out of Paris
2. Clean Power Plan stalled so he’ll toss that in the circular file.
3. Man Bear Pig (MBP) threatened campus protests (a la Open Society funded style)
and lawsuits. Trumpie peeps should ease into a full blown Supreme Court daubert style throw down
over the CO2 endangerment determination. They soft stepped that last time. Have at it. Scientists will need something to do. Take a few years if you need to
4. USA is gonna drill it suck it dig it and transport it like you never seen before.
Its going to build some wealth. Break a few eggs and make alot of jobs and alot of growth.
Maybe even build new gen nuclear. Expand other mining.
Subsidies likely will be drastically cut for renewables.
Its about the wealth creation .. the jobs .. will be about full bore making money.
5. Scale back the EPA to a truncated version of its current mission so that it minimizes itself as an obstacle to the above growth. It was never meant to be involved in energy management. CO2 was just a creeping marxist ruse to control the energy base. Betcha there are some MORE important environmental issues that have been ignored such as drinking water quality or even waste water treatment plants … the basics.
Its gonna get a tad dramatic. Ivanka is gonna whine that her brand is impacted cause her chic clientele will uninvite her stuff. MBP will become this crazed green figurehead and Michael Moore will make a documentary. Maybe HRCs core feminists will paint themselves as dying planets are chain themselves to the Washington Monument. La Raza Antifa BLM and an assorted of NGOs will throw down and make protesting a full time job.
The adults who want to have a country will ignore that noise because we want secure borders and a growing economy where we harvest our resources and rebuild an upwardly mobile society.
Fun times. As malcontents see sizable chunks of the population get nice houses new cars and happy families they’ll abandon MBP. Its all about the jobs. The rest of this nonsense will go the way of the Edsel when good jobs start to happen.
I learned alot from the Trump campaign. We have a shot to regain America. If we blow it this time we probably dont deserve it anyway. Electing DJT gave freedom a chance. We’ll see if we blow it or seize it.

rapscallion

As a Brit could somebody translate this “daubert style throw down” into something I understand.
I get the Trumpie peeps and the Supreme Court bit, but the rest . . . . . . .

Menicholas

I’m still wondering what ManBearPig, mpb, means.

rd50

The four Daubert criteria for evaluating the admissibility of expert testimony are: (1) whether the methods upon which the testimony is based are centered upon a testable hypothesis; (2) the known or potential rate of error associated with the method; (3) whether the method has been subject to peer review; and (4) whether the method is generally accepted in the relevant scientific community. Given the rest of the opinion, it seems appropriate that the first two of the Court�s four criteria amount to asking whether the techniques upon which the testimony is based are grounded in the scientific method. It is no less appropriate that virtually no expert testimony will satisfy the last two factors unless it satisfies the first two.
The above is a brief summary of the US Supreme Court decision regarding expert testimony in federal court.

Owen in GA

Menicholas,
Manbearpig is Southpark’s (animated television program aimed at younger adults) name for Al Gore. In the show he was something like bigfoot and about as intelligible. The producers are liberals, but they skewer nonsense from anyone. My favorite is their name for the Toyota Prius – The Pious because the car is the ultimate virtue signal on environmentalism.
Rapscallion,
I believe the “daubert style throw down” may have to do with the Daubert case where the Supreme court on a 7-2 ruling set the standards for a trial judge to use in evaluating scientific evidence and witnesses. Why that would be a “throw down”, I don’t know, but a 7-2 ruling is a rare occurrence in the modern court.
From Cornell’s Legal Information Institute definition of the Daubert standard:

Standard used by a trial judge to make a preliminary assessment of whether an expert’s scientific testimony is based on reasoning or methodology that is scientifically valid and can properly be applied to the facts at issue. Under this standard, the factors that may be considered in determining whether the methodology is valid are: (1) whether the theory or technique in question can be and has been tested; (2) whether it has been subjected to peer review and publication; (3) its known or potential error rate; (4) the existence and maintenance of standards controlling its operation; and (5) whether it has attracted widespread acceptance within a relevant scientific community. See Daubert v. Merrell Dow Pharmaceuticals, Inc., 509 U.S. 579 (1993). The Daubert standard is the test currently used in the federal courts and some state courts. In the federal courts, it replaced the Frye standard.

Matt Bergin

Menicholas you would need to watch the show “South Park” to understand. The show is rude but very funny.

MarkW

The court order that stopped Al Gore’s recount of just some Florida counties using new rules was 7-2.
The 5-4 decision was on whether there was still enough time to order a state wide recount using Gore’s special rules.

Menicholas

Oh, OK. Thanks.
I have seen South Park, just not very often.
It is funny, sometimes hysterically so.

From an episode of South Park featuring Al Gore. In the episode Gore is depicted as a paranoid guy who believes in a non-existent monster–“Manbearpig”–that is part man, part bear, and part pig. He believes the Manbearpig is a great threat.
South Park’s creators, Trey Parker and Matt Stone, don’t believe in global warming and the episode “Manbearpig” is their way of saying that when Al Gore talks about the dangers of global warming he is getting all worked up over something that doesn’t even exist.

From an episode of South Park featuring Al Gore. In the episode Gore is depicted as a paranoid guy who believes in a non-existent monster–“Manbearpig”–that is part man, part bear, and part pig. He believes the Manbearpig is a great threat.
South Park’s creators, Trey Parker and Matt Stone, don’t believe in global warming and the episode “Manbearpig” is their way of saying that when Al Gore talks about the dangers of global warming he is getting all worked up over something that doesn’t even exist.

Dodgy Geezer

Bring it on!

indeed … but expect Al G to get a free (and wholly unchallenged) pass from the likes of CNN BBC HuffPo etcetera

As a Brit who was bemused by the alternatives in the US election, I find it encouraging that Donald Trump is prepared to talk to those who hold opposite views to his own, rather than just using character assassination from a distance. Maybe he will, despite his flaws, bring some healing to the anger and polarisation that an elite have used to divide and rule

Gore’s comments after the meeting tell me he’s ready to start moving towards “civil disobedience” which is likely to evolve very fast towards terrorism. The USA is very polarized, the Internet and cable deliver the goodies to increase polarization, and new generations really don’t believe in democracy. Gore plans to build on these conditions and I’m afraid he will both undermine democracy and escalate violence.
If you think I’m being over dramatic try following them in social media. I follow individuals from all extremes and what one sees is really ugly. Since the subject here is energy policy, I’d like to point out their plans appear to be to block construction of new fossil fuel infrastructure, and there’s also an undercurrent which tells me we may see a few nuts starting to attack pipelines at sensitive points. I would also worry about trains carrying oil and oil products. This is a serious matter and Gore may be getting ready (out of ignorance and his own pompous arrogance) to start a cycle of violence.

SMC

“…(out of ignorance…”
Gore isn’t that ignorant, neither are the other Watermelons. He/they know what they’re is doing… They’re just going to get uglier… The Watermelons haven’t learned.

hunter

In America, so far, semi-violent civil disobedience leads to huge political losses of those who indulge in it.

MarkW

I’m pretty sure it will be the case this time, if it does happen.
However radicals never seem to learn. Because they refuse to associate with anyone who disagrees with them, they are constantly surrounded by people who do agree with them. Over time this leads to two things.
Their views become ever more radical, and they start to believe that their views are much more popular than they actually are.
Never a good combination.

TA

“I’d like to point out their plans appear to be to block construction of new fossil fuel infrastructure, and there’s also an undercurrent which tells me we may see a few nuts starting to attack pipelines at sensitive points. I would also worry about trains carrying oil and oil products.”
You are correct about a few nuts getting out of line. This always happens when the rhetoric gets heated. Some people, of diminished mental capacity, take such rhetoric to heart, and feel justified in lashing out violently. The is a major problem with the radical left. A lot of their members fit in this category. Rabblerousers and mentally challenged people don’t go very well together. An example: Black Lives Matter members chant “kill the police” and some nut hears that and thinks that gives him permission to do just that. Be careful what you call for, you just might get it. Not everybody can sort out all the nuances.
But, the American people are not going to stand for widespread violence in the streets, certainly not, with a Republican president in Office. Law enforcement will crack down on the violent ones, and the American people will approve of the crack down.
Don’t be tearing down our streets. The first groups might get away with doing some violence. But those that follow in their footsteps are going to pay the price for their criminality.

Mike

…”This is a serious matter and Gore may be getting ready (out of ignorance and his own pompous arrogance) to start a cycle of violence…..”
You mean re-focusing the Soros/Steyn funded Black Lives Matter/AntiTrumper Brownshirts already in place just waiting for the ‘nod’?
Bahamamike

JMH

This is what I would do with Gore. String him along for a bit, via Ivanka, to keep him quiet. When he realises he’s being stalled, give him an environmental job not related to climate that will keep him busy but without real power, influence or money. Turf him out now and he’ll just double-down on global warming propaganda while the current players are still in power and holding budgets, probably doing more harm. Trump’s no pushover – whatever he’s doing, he’s doing it for a reason.

Owen in GA

I don’t know JMH, that strategy didn’t work well for Lenin in his attempt sideline Stalin by giving him a podunk job to nowhere.

Trump is reaching out to political opposition as he had called Al Sharpton recently as well. It means he will talk to and listen to the opposition, but does not mean he is going to make policy changes just because he did so.

That too is encouraging. It is harder to hate and despise someone you have actually met in the flesh

James Loux

It is likely Trump is following a wise plan to keep his friends close but his enemies closer. Plus, it also looks good from a PR perspective to engage with all parties. Trump clearly
knows that he needs to be very aware of all of the threats as he moves forward. Developing large construction projects certainly had to have taught him how to best navigate though political minefields.

Bill Murphy

RE: ” It means he will talk to and listen to the opposition, but does not mean he is going to make policy changes just because he did so.”
Exactly. DT did not get where he is by being soft or a fool. This is all about: “Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.”

“But more damaged [sic] is baked into the climate system every day, so it’s a race against time”. Now there speaks a real scientist. Remind me of Gore’s scientific qualifications please.

Analitik

Remind me of Gore’s scientific qualifications please.

fixed

Alan Robertson

Thank your lucky stars that you have the internet, brought to you by Al Gore.

Menicholas

He took exactly o e science class in his whole life.
He got a D.
How about them apples?

MarkW

Was “o e” supposed to be “one”?

Menicholas

Yes. Sorry.
Was using my phone before.

MarkW

First time I read it, I mistook the ‘o’ for a zero, and I was trying to figure out how he got a ‘D’ on a course he hadn’t taken.

Bryan A

It takes a really smart person to get any grade greater than FAIL in a course they don’t take (even the FAIL is tricky)

Jerry Howard

The sum total of Al Gore’s scientific qualifications consists of one freshman level (101) course under the actual father of the current CO2/Temperature connection possibility. (There were some earlier scientific papers around 1907 or so, but they didn’t gain traction. (Apparently that was before the peer review/government grant corruption method replaced the experimental method of scientific research.)
The professor Roger Reville co-authored a 1957 paper with Hans Suess suggesting the possibility. Al Gore reportedly made a “D” in the course…. Al Gore called Reville his “mentor” but when Reville later recanted and expressed his regrets that his research had led to such a derailing of climate science, Gore alleged that Reville had become “senile.”

Joel Snider

Don’t forget flunking out of Divinity school
That’s why he had to create his own religion.

Owen

Not being an American and understanding the rather convoluted procedures involved in governing makes any detailed comment risky however it seems that President-elect Trump should not spend time taking on the climate change extremists but rather simply work with Congress to cut funding. It has been apparent that it has been endless budget funds that has allowed the warmists unfettered ability to pump out ill-conceived “science” and publish their idiocy ad nauseam.

Owen, what I hope Trump is doing in meeting with Gore is building political cover for the squishier members of his own party. He can claim that he gave the other side a fair hearing, and still rejected their agenda. There are all too many squshy Republicans in Congress.

Samuel C Cogar

And what I think Trump is doing in those “short” meeting with Gore and other “trumphaters” is to politely tell them that …… the golden-haired bear is going to be “defecating in the buckwheat” where ever he chooses, ………. beginning January 20th, 2017, ……. and for them to be mighty careful iffen they decide to “irritate” him when he is doing his “business”.

TA

“There are all too many squshy Republicans in Congress.”
Good point, Tom.
I’ll be interested to watch how Trump handles the first real opposition he gets in Congress, and it could be from Democrats or Republicans. I’m prone to think if Trump really wants something, he is going to find a way to get it, even if it means taking on some members of Congress by name.
I could see Trump traveling to a recalcitrant Republican member of Congress state to browbeat the member over his opposition. Just the threat of Trump doing something like that, might get him what he wants. Do *you* want to take on Donald Trump right now? I didn’t think so. 🙂

My own Senator Lindsey Graham once commented that he became concerned with the “Climate Issue” when in Hong Kong he watched CO2 spew out of the motorcycle ahead of him. (paraphrase).
Where do you start with dumb like that?
Unfortunately, because of the massive brainwashing of the American public (and some in congress) Donald will have to beware of uninformed public backlash if he moves TOO fast on this issue; it is very easy to create false narratives (the DA pipeline is just one example where rationality has gone out the window and emotional thinking takes over).

MarkW

TA, a lot depends on how the representative/senator did vis-a-vis Trump in their district/state.
A lot of them finished well ahead of trump in 2016.

G Franke

Owen,
Your two comments are spot on with respect to actions that could have near immediate effect on slowing or stopping the implementation of existing regulations.
With respect to your “convoluted procedures” comment, I doubt that one American in a thousand understands how convoluted our system is. Most think that it is simply passing a law and that is it……cursing or praising the legislators who invented the law. After the Congress passes the law and the President signs it, the convolution begins:
Most laws have a clause(s) that require the executive branch (the President and his minions) to write the appropriate regulations to implement the law. What follows describes how nasty the convolution can get:
1. Initially, the responsible agency drafts the regulations and offers the draft to the public for comments. The draft regulation may be amended as a result of comments. This can take months. Ultimately the regulation(s) are put in final form and implemented.
2. Unfortunately, unless repealed or amended, the law is forever. The federal agencies can (and do) reinterpret the law years later and draft additional regulations.
3. The President can issue executive orders that bypass the regulation drafting and review process.
4. There is anecdotal evidence that federal agencies have colluded with advocacy groups whereby the advocacy group actually writes the draft regulation.
5. One of the most pernicious corruption of the regulation generating process is the “sue and settle” strategy used by advocacy groups in collusion with a federal agency. Simple: An advocacy group sues the federal government agency to overturn or amend a regulation or judicial ruling. The case is brought before an administrative judge where the complicit federal agency agrees to settle the case in favor of the advocacy group. The judge has no choice but to accede to the federal agency’s wish to settle with the “aggrieved” party.
Although I might ascribe the term “pernicious corruption” to the sue-and-settle strategy, the strategy can be used as a counter by those opposing the advocacy group. “But”, you say, “how can you get the federal agency to collude with you?” Just have the head of the agency threaten the bureaucrats with a stint in Alaska counting polar bears.

Leo Smith

When the Daly Telegraph sacked Louise Gray and Geoffrey Lean, their two ‘environmental’ commenters (cutnpasters) they were perfectly frank. The Green advertising revenue had dried up.

commieBob

I can think of two relatively recent protests.
Demonstrations against invading Iraq. link
Occupy Wall Street. link
We know how much effect those had. I say, let the alarmists protest.

The demonstrations against invading Iraq didn’t have much effect because it took less than a year between the time when Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz made the decision and the invasion took place. We must also consider the invasion was instigated by USA elites from both parties, had the support of the Israel lobby, and center left media backed it all the way. The democratic establishment was very pro war, and Hillary Clinton voted for the war.
I’m very familiar with the circumstances because I’m in the oil business and the private intelligence sources I could access made it clear there were no WMD and the whole thing was a neocon adventure. Unfortunately the American people learned very little from this blunder because the media, which had cooperated to start the war, simply fogged up the lessons. Today we see even more dangerous coming from the war (neocon) party about Russia and Iran. And I’m afraid they won’t stop until we find ourselves in another war USA politicians won’t know how to win.

Menicholas

Trump spoke at length about six trillion spent on war and nation building, and the Middle East now in worse shape than ever, by far.
War party?
Neocons?
Democrat establishment?
Maybe you did not notice, but Trump just obliterated the Bushes, Clintons, and both party establishments, and is calling for working with the Russians.
Trump is a clear eyed pragmatist, not an insane ideologue war monger.

Greg Woods

The Truth is strong in this one…

commieBob

Some folks worried that Reagan was going to cause WW3. There was the sound check where he declared Russia illegal and said the bombing would start in five minutes. The Soviets believed Reagan would actually punish them hard and they behaved. On the other hand, everyone knew they could walk all over Carter because he was a man of peace.
Trump has said that you don’t show your cards when you’re negotiating. Keep them guessing. They have to ask themselves if they’re feeling lucky. On the other hand brinkmanship is a dangerous game.

TA

“Today we see even more dangerous coming from the war (neocon) party about Russia and Iran. And I’m afraid they won’t stop until we find ourselves in another war USA politicians won’t know how to win.”
It’s not the neocons (whoever they are) who are making the dangerous moves in the Middle East, it is Russia and Syria and Iran. What’s your solution, allow these totalitarians mass murderers to have their way? How many more innocent people should we allow them to murder before we say “Enough!”?
The first thing one has to do is figure out who the good guys are, and who the bad guys are.

On the other hand there is the Dakota Access Pipeline, which is more to the point.
Emotional protests like the DAP bring out the useful idiots in huge numbers.

David C.

Go Donald! Blow the alarmists out of the water

Go, Donald! Blow the alarmists out of the water!

charles nelson

It’s been a long wait…I’m glad I’ve lived long enough to see the tide turn and the ‘scum’ be washed out to be lost in the ocean…where it belongs.

Menicholas

They have not gone anywhere yet. Best not to count them chickens until the foxes are routed out if the henhouse.
Excuse me, I have metaphors to mix…

Actually, it’s a very good metaphor on its own.
Most appropriate.

Roger Knights

My guess is Trump wants to find a way to defuse climate opposition, but I don’t think there is any room to manoeuvre. Any serious concessions to the climate movement would be treated by many of Trump’s supporters as a sell-out. The entrenched positions are simply too polarized.

Here’s what i submitted on Decide. 1 to Trump’s online suggestion box at https://apply.ptt.gov/yourstory/

I’ve read that scientists and others are calling on you to walk back your skepticism 1) about climate change becoming a major problem, and 2) about “renewables” being the way to solve it.
I suggest the you respond thusly: 1) “You alarmists make a good-sounding case, but so do climate-change skeptics. I’m therefore going to make my decision based on a series of televised debates between you and them.” (Those shows will draw big audiences.)
2) Say, “I’m going to hire James Hansen (Gore’s main climate advisor) to head an agency devoted to promoting the installation of innovative nuclear power plants as my ‘no regrets’ carbon-mitigation strategy.” And say, “this path will cost half as much as renewables, and cut CO2 emissions twice as much.” This will split off the majority of the populace who are worried about global warming to your side.
There are three other leading greens (one of them Stewart Brand of The Whole Earth Catalog) who signed Hansen’s open letter advocating nuclear power as the only realistic carbon-reduction option. Their standing by your side on stage when you make this announcement will give your position credibility. Probably many more will jump on the bandwagon after a month or two.
You can float a trial balloon by inviting Hansen to a long meeting with you, which will set everybody a-tingle about what it means. It will prepare people for the shock.
It is only about 20% of the worriers about global warming who are strongly anti-nuke, Most worriers will be glad to take the half-a-loaf deal you offer them. (Actually, 3/4 of a loaf.) I suspect many alarmists are secretly irritated by the anti-nukers in their midst, but don’t say so publicly, in order to maintain the unity of the movement.
If you can pull this off—and it shouldn’t be THAT hard—you’ll be hailed for decades as the statesman who broke the logjam. It’ll be a major (maybe THE major) accomplishment of your administration.
Just make warmist politicians an offer they can’t refuse. And if they DO refuse it, then the fault for your administration’s inaction on reducing emissions will be theirs not yours. After a year or two, at most, their obstructionism will crumble, and congressional Democrats will be willing to make a deal.

Roger Knights

Oops: My text should have begun, “Here’s what I submitted on Dec. 1 . . .”

Harry Passfield

You can float a trial balloon by inviting Hansen to a long meeting with you

Yeah, and make sure the room is freezing cold so that Hansen can get a feel for the future. He kinda supports such tricks…

AndyG55

Gavin Schmidt v Roy Spencer..
Watch Gavin RUN. !!

Toneb

Yes Andy all he has to do is give Gavin his thesis on how the world is just 6000 years old and we are all part of a grand design.
My eyes would glaze over at that.
And, frankly, I’d run to.

It doesn't add up...

I always think that he lives in his own world with his own interpretation of the climate: after all, ClimateofGavin is his twitter handle. It’s not the climate that the rest of us experience – just his own invention.

AndyG55

Gavin will RUN and HIDE just like he did last time.

AndyG55

Gavin is like you, toneb… he cannot debate on climate.

hunter

The climate extremist trolls confuse one’s religious beliefs with their professional work which is actually very ironic when one looks at the quality of most troll posters.

MarkW

Toneb, do you ever have anything relevant to say?

If the climate guru genie were to grant me but a single wish I’d wish for Dr. Spencer to wake up and drop that sh1t.

Hansen isn’t qualified for such a position. You would need a 50 year old who has managed at least the early phases of a $10 billion plus project which finished on time and on budget.

Menicholas

I agree, and why even consider rewarding and giving power to Hansen or any of his despicable ilk?

TA

Excellent suggestions, Roger! I hope Trump listens to you.

Roger Knights

I think he may already be doing so. He hasn’t talked to Hansen yet, but Hansen and Gore are as tight as an organ grinder and his monkey, so there’s only one degree of separation there.
(My other suggestion to Trump is to hire Dr. Judy (“What, me Curry?”) for some top climate-related job. She’d be a perfect choice. If he picks her I’ll start thinking of myself as an eminence gris!)

ghl

Very First thing, audit the temperature data, all adjustments to be justified by their authors or be discarded. If records are lost, changes discarded. Non-cooperation to be treated as some kind of fraud.

CheshireRed

If Trump removes subsidies ‘renewables’ will face as certain a death as a comatose patient being unplugged from life support. Gore’s hissy-fit will therefore be irrelevant.

Roger Knights

That will require Congress to repeal the 5-year subsidy law it passed last year.

phaedo

Why do I get the impression that Al Gore invited himself to a meeting with Trump.

Menicholas

He publicslly volunteered his services last month.
I still think Gore is well suited to running the White House snow removal crew. After all, it hardly ever snows much in D.C.

Unless the Gore-Effect…

He volunteers his services in hopes of enacting the policies that will prop up the value of his Green portfolio. Not exactly free.

Brian of Oz

Remember that until the electoral college vote on the 19th of December, Trump has to stay calm and not piss too many people off from either side. Once he’s confirmed as Pres, all bets are off. I think he’s just biding his time.

MarkW

There’s already one “Republican” electoral college delegate who has publicly stated that he can’t vote for Trump.
In most of the world, people who find themselves incapable of performing their sworn duty, resign and allow the appointment of someone who can.

TA

Yeah, I imagine that fellow is in for some backlash.
His arrogance and his holier-than-thou attitude are sickening. He has taken it upon himself to thwart the will of the American people.

Herbert

Al Gore is hopeful that Barack Obama and Hilary Clinton will join him in ” an escalated climate campaign ” against the President elect. These two spent the 2012 and 2016 elections barely mentioning climate change.
President Obama may have other plans including working on his golf handicap. Hilary might be more interested in hiking than joining Al Gore on podiums round the country.

Menicholas

I think Hillary has been and will remain very busy inspecting the bottom of every wine glass in Chapaqua.
And Obama is too politically savvy to associate publically with Gore.

Toneb

“You don’t “drain the swamp” by hiring swamp critters.”
Hasn’t it dawned yet?
Trump says lots of things he doesn’t either mean or doesn’t follow through on.
Good look with that.

Khwarizmi

Trump has extremely limited power during the transition period. And yet, he appears to have already saved a token small number of high-profile jobs, exactly as he promised to do. Obama mocked him for it…
******
Flashback: Obama Mocks Trump for Promising to Keep Carrier Plant in U.S.
https://news.grabien.com/story-flashback-obama-mocks-trump-promising-keep-carrier-plant-us
*****
I thought the word contract was an interesting choice for a businessman to use in an election campaign.

DC Cowboy

Have you ever known a politician that doesn’t ‘say lots of things they don’t mean’? I haven’t.
I guess we’ll have to wait to see if his ‘private’ position varies from his ‘public’ position.

Menicholas

Trump is no politician. In case you did not notice that is exactly why lots of us voted for him.
And I think Trump said exactly what he is going to do, and exactly what he thinks. Washington DC is a corrupt and stinking cesspool, a swamp of kleptocracy and cronyism. The people running the country have been pursuing insane policies, and wasting all our money, and getting nothing done.
I think you can take it to the bank the Trump means to do all of the things he said he was going to do in the campaign. All the major policy points anyway.
He is a person who was fed up with the way the country was being run, and the direction that we were heading, and decided to personally do something about it.
What remains to be seen is what the final details will be and what he can get through Congress, because he is not a dictator in spite of what his detractors want everyone to believe.
I wouldn’t spend five seconds listening to the people who have gotten everything wrong for the past year-and-a-half, told us Trump could never win, and now want to explain to those of us who got it right, all about how we were duped.

BruceC

Have you ever known a politician that doesn’t ‘say lots of things they don’t mean’?

Prime example:
There will never be a carbon tax under a Govt. that I lead
Julia Gillard – ex Aust. Prime Minister

Alan Robertson

C’mon guys, cut Toneb a tiny bit of slack. After all, he’s still grief stricken from the death of his beloved Fidel.

TA

“Trump says lots of things he doesn’t either mean or doesn’t follow through on.”
You hope. I think it is going to be you who is disappointed, not Trump’s supporters.

highflight56433

@ Toneb; And you have some meaningful examples of not following through to share?

Robertv

If all the money spent on the climate hoax would have been spent on infrastructure i’m sure the country would be in a far better economic health. Now the infrastructure needs urgent ‘Trump Care’.
The problem is the money has already been spent and there are no savings left. The country is broke and most american live from paycheck to paycheck.
The recovery will take much longer than most people anticipate. To undo 100 years of progressive power is more like draining the Great lakes and the Hudson Bay and will take much longer than 4 years.
“My message would be that despair is just another form of denial. There is no time to despair. We don’t have time to lick our wounds, to hope for a different election outcome.
“We have to win this struggle and we will win it; the only question is how fast we win. But more damaged is baked into the climate system every day, so it’s a race against time.”
To me this seems a threat. There is nothing more dangerous than people that have everything to lose.

Mick

“unprecedented climate action”
Hmmm… that is not a promise. It’s a threat. The Left/Progressive knows how to create anarchy to achieve they goal. He has something on Pres. elect Trump…so Pres. elect Trump had to meet him. Clearly it’s a political ultimatum. Nut sure how the Trump administration can handle a major unrest, but lets assure he’s adversaries planing big…till he and he’s family, friends and followers subjugate. He need to talk softly, but carry a big stick… club… whatever he can master to counteract the Leftoid’s ‘Coulter-War’ …I wish him and America well.
He is our last hope 🙁

Menicholas

Gore has nothing on Trump.
Do you think the left saved some damning revelations during that past campaign?
No chance.
Trump is doing what he has done for the past year-and-a-half, which is play his opposition like a cheap fiddle. He’s so far ahead of them, that they do not even know how stupid he is making them look.
I would not be surprised if what Trump is finding out from each one of these people he is meeting exactly what they will do if he gives them a big job. He is thus finding out exactly what they have up their sleeves, and he will use this information to his advantage. He is data mining, and finding out from friend and foe alike just what kind of ideas they have and what kind of ammunition they would use.

TA

“Not sure how the Trump administration can handle a major unrest,”
Well, let’s see, Trump can quell any violent demonstrations using the police and military available to him, and then he can prosecute the Leftist billionaires that are funding this violence, and take their money away and throw them in jail.
And then he can root out the rest of the Leftist Fifth Column, in and out of government, that is trying to undermine the United States.
It does mention “domestic enemies” in the U.S. Constitution.
The U.S. has a lot of Leftist domestic enemies. Some of them are U.S. citizens, and some of them are not. All of them are harmful to the rest of us.

MarkW

The only police Trump has available to him are the Capital Police, and I believe they technically report to congress, not the President.
The military is forbidden from getting involved in domestic situations under Posse Comitatus (spelling?).
It really amazes me how some conservatives want to out fascist the leftists.

Well, MarkW, as a Canadian, I can tell you how quickly “rules” can be changed. Look up Trudeau Senior’s implementation of the “War Measures Act” to bring the military into play during the “October Crisis”. Also look up Oka. Canada is not unique given actions in the US where use of military units were invoked. Also note that the “War Measures Act” was invoked by a left wing Liberal who had Fidel Castro as one of his pall bearers.
Negotiations were used to finalize both issues so I expect “negotiation” will be the way things are settled although negotiation from strength is always a good policy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_Crisiscomment image&f=1
Not being critical Mark, just pragmatic. There are many processes available to POTUS.

Peter

A lot of people under estimate the amount of money at stake. It’s huge, according to past statements by Gore.
Here in Australia Trump’s effect on the Green industry is expected to have a huge effect with loss of leakage funds out of the US. There are already noises.
I expect the Green groups to fight bitterly for there free money.

Menicholas

They can fight bitterly all they want, but the man holding the purse strings is no longer on their side.
Period.
End of story.
As noted Trump is no pushover. He’s a hard-nosed businessman.
Trump is not known for handing out money to people who he has vanquished. Everyone paying attention knows how much money is at stake, that is why this election was so important.
It’s all about the money.
It’s always been all about the money.
And that’s all it is about, the money.

Griff

There is a lot of money and jobs to be gained in the US if the wind industry is supported (I expect it to continue Trump or no Trump, but an opportunity for more jobs will be missed)
https://cleantechnica.com/2016/12/05/trumps-lies-threaten-wind-techs-fastest-growing-us-job/

Griff, your “lots of jobs” is from an industry that is parasitic on the rest of the electric power industry. “Renewable energy”, judging from the experience reported in WUWT with Europe and Australia, which have gone down the green rabbit hole much farther than the US, disrupts and perversely depends on more conventional power. Germany and Dennmark require Norway and hydro, France and nuclear, and Poland and coal, as well as the remnants of their own conventional.
Green jobs are like an exercise in farming vampire bats for wool.

highflight56433

@ Griff: Last time I checked, subsidizing is redistribution, as in some totalitarian taxing authority takes money from successful people and distributes it to companies like Solyndra who received a $535 million U.S. Energy Department loan guarantee. Other investors were con artists as well, such as Virgin Green. Where did the billions go? Answer: Welfare for the insiders and wealthy.

Robert Austin

Griff,
How did that “pie in the sky” renewables mantra work out for Spain?

MarkW

Sure thing, when you steal money from one group of people in order to subsidize an industry, that industry often does grow.

MarkW

Tom, you don’t understand, just like socialism, this time renewable energy is going to work.

catweazle666

“There is a lot of money and jobs to be gained in the US if the wind industry is supported”
There IS NO MONEY to be made in the wind industry, nor the solar, come to that,
Stop making stuff up.

If it has to be supported it’s not really a job.

Like Solyndra jobs?
If the technology is viable, the market will support it. There is no need for government intervention. Go get yourself a Trabant if you want to see how government intervention works.

vieras

Well, if Gore talks about ramping up activism, that meeting must have been a pretty bad one for him. That’s great.

AndyG55

Yep… Gore almost certainly got told that his SCAM IS OVER. !!

Alan Robertson

Al Gore made those remarks before he met with Trump.
Crickets, since.

Peta in Cumbria

On swamp draining/subsidies, 2 examples from the UK
When solar panels were first subsidized, they were given a *very* generous rate – 45 pence per kWh, free electric and no tax on the income.
Not long into that, Govm’nt realised it was a bit too good and went to slash the subsidy rate – halving it in one fell swoop.
And how the installers & suppliers wailed and cried and pleaded about going out of business, killing jobs/investment/children/polar bars/The World. We know the rest. (How’s the ice going Griff?)
The subsidy cut went ahead and guess what, overnight the installed price for sunshine panels halved. Those of us with a mathematic inclination revealed that the financial ‘return’ for consumers investing in sunshine panels stayed exactly the same, circa 9 or 10% (over the 25 year expected lifetime of the panels)
Now, how did that happen if the suppliers had not been fixing their prices and effectively creaming off the subsidy in one lump sum of cash when the panels were installed leaving the punters with a 25 year gamble?
Cronyism in full swing.
Then, off-shore wind was determined to be the best thing ever and UK Gov decided to buy some turbines. Of course they shopped around for ‘the best deal’ and got some turbines at the bargain price of £10M each.
Sadly the Gov’s timing was a bit off and unfortunately the price of steel (it had to be something) increased by 25% just a few weeks after ‘the ink had dried’
So, to reflect this and as Gov had committed itself, the price of the turbines went out to £14M each.
I ask, what fraction of the cost of a turbine is the actual steel and when that small part goes up by 25%, why does the finished thing ramp up by 40%?
Nice work if you can get it….

Menicholas

Probably about the same percentage as the labor cost is of a Carrier Air Conditioner.

Griff

The ice is in a terrible state, since you ask – latest volume figures incorporating Novmeber data show that…
http://psc.apl.uw.edu/research/projects/arctic-sea-ice-volume-anomaly/
“November 2016 sea ice volume was 7,800 km3 , about 2500 km3 below the 2015 value and the lowest for any November on record exceeding the prior record set in 2012 by about 400 km3 . This record is in part the result of anomalously high temperatures throughout the Arctic for November discussed here. 2016 November volume was 61% below the maximum November ice volume in 1979, 48% below the 1979-2015 mean, and about 1.1 standard deviations below the long term trend line.
Average ice thickness in September 2016 over the PIOMAS domain was also one of the lowest on record…”
Extent remains a record low for December, with ice yet to reach Svalbard or cover Hudson Bay
https://seaice.uni-bremen.de/amsr2/index.html

Robert Austin

Griff seems to believe that Gaia’s ideal Arctic ice extent occurred in 1979 and that any significant deviation from that 1979 ideal is a “terrible state”.

MarkW

Griff believes whatever it is necessary for him to believe.

AndyG55

“The ice is in a terrible state,”
NO, it is not.
It is still massively above the levels of most of the first 3/4 of the Holocene.
1979 was the EXTREME.. almost up there with levels of the Little Ice Age.
What we have been seeing since 1979 is a recovery from that extreme a little bit towards more normal levels.

catweazle666

“The ice is in a terrible state”
Bollocks.

Bryan A

Wow 7800 km3…that is like greater than 3 times the volume of Mt Everest that is still a hellovalotta ice

And the value of the sea ice is?

2hotel9

How much you willing to pay? I’ll sell it to you by the bag, if you gots da cash!

jpatrick

When Warren Buffett and George Soros start buying coal mines and oilfield service companies, believe it.

Buffett owns BNSF Railroad, which is making good money hauling crude oil, in part because pipeline construction has been stalled by Soros-funded ‘enviro’ groups. Buffett goes where the money is. Soros goes wherever he can kick the American dog.
/Mr Lynn

I read that Soros bought Peabody’s coal interest for pennies on the dollar.

Andrew

Sorry I must have missed the bit where the article mentioned that al-Gore has massive business interests that depend absolutely on govts tipping $trillions into renewables whether they’re viable or not.

Power Engineer

How to double our national debt for no benefit–
Rooftop residential solar costs 35-40 cents per kWh for a commodity one can buy from the ISO power market for 7-8 cents. So what’s a few cents? Well we consume one heck of a lot of kWh- 4 trillion for the US alone. A 25 cent/kWh premium for solar would add $1Trillion to our costs per year. Over the 20 year solar mortgage/life we would double our national debt. All these costs for a kWh which does exactly the same amount of work independent of where it was generated.
Most of the solar subsidies are federal. 30% investment tax credit and accelerated depreciation that is almost as large.
More trees….And all the solar costs for questionable CO2 benefit. The state says that a 5 kW rooftop solar is equivalent to planting an acre of trees (or not cutting down a half acre or less)….and the trees would have the added benefit of reducing the air conditioning load.
More gas turbines will reduce 10 times the amount of CO2 as solar
ISO studies show that you can reduce CO2 for about 1/10 the capital cost per tonne of CO2 by replacing existing inefficient older plants with modern gas turbine plants.
If you’re really interested in the environment, then upgrade with gas turbines for 10 times the reduction of CO2 per dollar spent than with solar….but maybe the agenda is not reducing CO2…….
And ISO statistics show that emission improvements are due to gas turbines, not solar.

But of course there’s no reason to reduce CO2 emissions, and good reason to increase them: more green plants, and just maybe slight amelioration of oncoming cold?
/Mr Lynn

Robertvd

but maybe the agenda is not reducing CO2……. Exactly, the agenda is one world government under Big Brother.

DC Cowboy

Climate alarmists certainly love that word ‘unprecedented’. It’s like they’re using those vocabulary card deck and they have to use the word in a sentence at least five times during the day.

hunter

The way to defuse the climate change social mania is to expose the the self dealing, rent seeking, shoddy papers, censorship, and plain old corruption that dominates the climate change movement.

NavarreAggie

The problem is and will continue to be RINOs sabotaging Trump’s every move. They are going to do everything they can to prevent President Trump from enacting his campaign promises.

Resourceguy

Bring it on. That’s what the working class needs to see up front and personal. They’ve already seen over reach government, now they need to see over reach opposition and mass protest….daily.

They’ve got two years to get behind Trump or he might just campaign in their district to find a suitable replacement. I’m sure the press would be all over that one.

MarkW

You seem to believe that Trump is as popular everywhere, as he is in your household.
There are lots of districts where standing up to Trump will improve your re-election chances. Even Republican districts.

Menicholas

If Trump is successful and the economy improves and people are better off, he will have more support in four years, not less.
A lot of the people who were on the fence or who bought the liberal lies about him will see how what has occurs compares with what they feared, and will vote for him.
If he is successful, he will have huge support.
And considering how the economy has been artificially held back, it seems likely that he will be.
That is how I see it.
Time will tell.

MarkW

While the economy has been held back artificially, it’s yet to be determined how quickly Trump will be able to get major reforms through congress.
Some of the things he’s for will help the economy. Some will hurt the economy.
His tax cuts can help the economy, however the increased debt will bring on the coming debt collapse that much more quickly.
Beyond that the Obama economy is already showing signs of being ready to roll over into another recession, which will of course be blamed on Trump since he’s president.

Bruce Cobb

Boy would I have loved to be a fly on the wall for that “meeting”. Gore was awfully tight-lipped about it, and brusque, so I don’t think it went all that well for him. String him along I guess is the tactic here.

Roger Knights

I suspect the possibility of cutting CO2 emissions by going nuclear was discussed. Hansen favors that route.

Harry Passfield

It’s difficult to remember that your prime objective is to drain the swamp when the Al-i-Gore-tors are snapping at your ass.
But, methinks that Gore is in a hurry to rescue his doomed AGW scam because pretty soon old Mother Nature is going to do it for him. When the people are shivering they won’t want to listen to his AGW crap.

Harry Passfield

OK mods…I should have said @ss. Or was it the cr@p? 🙂

As the democrats (and many republicans) are slowly finding out, Trump is a businessman, not a politician. Trump has not really had to deal with fanatics as a businessman, and of course politicians have never known how to react with an equal who is not in politics, so it is a learning curve in that respect on both sides.
However, I doubt algore or his minions are going to go quietly, and Trump is going to find out that you do not deal with SJWs. You either ignore them or cave to them. Trump does not cave. If the election showed nothing else, it showed us that aspect of Trump.

Tom in Florida

Or Trump may have been only interested in how Algore made millions off the AGW scam. A true businessman is always looking to increase the bottom line.

2hotel9

“promised an “unprecedented” surge” in activism tells me DJT told Algore:Thegoreacle that his environwacko crap ain’t gonna go no more. So, more hysterical screeching is all Algore:Thegoreacle has got.

Without an unprecedented rise in temperature, sea level, tornadoes, hurricanes etcetera, Gore has to try for an unprecedented rise in his ability to inflame people of faith.
Don’t underestimate him; for 15 years he has managed to indoctrinate children. Ask the college graduates now entering the work force what they think.

Griff

er… we already had the unprecedented rise in temperature (and a local one in the arctic following this summers record)

TA

“er… we already had the unprecedented rise in temperature”
2016 was one-tenth of a degree hotter than 1998, at its hottest point, according to the UAH satellite record. I guess one-tenth of a degree can be technically called “unprecedented”, if limited to the satellite record. Of course, it’s cooler now than then, so we are out of “unprecedented” territory. You can relax.
To put “unprecedented in perspective: The years 1998 and 2016 are tied for the hottest year in the satellite record (1979 to present). Nothing unprecedented here. Business as usual. Next question to answer: How low does the temperature drop from here?

Pethefin

The trolls become weaker every new round, a sure sign of a cult in decline. Griff sure is the weakest that I have ever seen, not even entertaining, a perfect example of someone having been raised within a safe space…

How about some data and graphs with error bars.
Start it a few thousand years before entering the current interglacial.
Please do the same with Arctic Ice and sea level.
Don’t forget the references.
No can do, eh?
I’m not surprised.

MarkW

According to Griffie, a few dozen ships logs over 100+ years is as viable a record as daily satellite measurements.

David in Michigan

I believe that many comments are missing two important points.
First, and most important, is that Al Gore has “invested” so much of himself in Global Warming that it is now personal. He’s human. He can’t ever concede that he overstated the issue without tremendous loss of prestige and self worth. The battle for Al Gore’s self respect must continue!!
Note on other fanatics: Hansen has taken some, a few, steps back from his former apocalyptic self but lost some of his prestige with the greenies in doing so. Creepy Suzuki has gradually faded into the background without much ego bruising.
Second, regardless of how Pres elect Trump feels about Global Warming, he recognizes that eliminating employment is not beneficial to his agenda. Consequently, any changes will be governed by their effects on the economy. This probably means gradual rather than abrupt change.

Menicholas

Eliminating the employment of highly paid leeches, who spend countless billions re-researching a so-called settled science, and then using the results to recommend and implement policies which have the net effect of killing jobs and squelching economic growth, is not only beneficial but way overdue and a necessary first step in putting an end to this insanity once and for all.
Defunding every single red cent of what these clowns have been sucking out of the government teat is already on the table, and being openly discussed.
First step is identifying and enumerating the programs and agencies and amounts.
That has been done.
Next step…YOU’RE FIRED!
I am pretty sure Trump knowns exactly how to say those words.
He knows what has been holding back the economy…it is no mystery. It has been the industry crushing regulations, coupled with business leaders not being willing to invest with a regime in charge that actively wants to punish profits and job creation.
Things can turn around very quickly once these brakes are removed.

Bruce Cobb

Yup, the greenie leeches have this to look forward to:

Sorry for the off-topic, but it is exciting: ExxonMobil has informed AGU that they do not intend to sponsor the Student Breakfast at the 2016 Fall Meeting (per AGU), and probably other AGU activities. Just what the AGU management asked for.

hunter

That’s a very old article, referring to the already held 2016 conference. But if you want insight into how AGW fanatics have corrupted the AGU and by implication their employers,, read the amazing comments below the article.

Menicholas

Hunter,
Just read a little of that comment section you mentioned.
Those comments sound like they could have been made by the DAPL protesters.

It isn’t clear what – if anything – is to be done about this. Virtually every major Western institution has been completely taken over by watermelons and were we to be in an express elevator heading directly for a new Dalton minimum the agw fanatics would be claiming co2 as the cause. They are all way too deeply entrenched and there is no hope at all that they can ever u-turn on this issue. Academia is now every bit as swampy as DC.

Gore should start his renewed activism by selling his mammoth houseboat, moving to a smaller house with a teleconference setup in his home office, and flying only when strictly necessary in Economy Plus (he’s a big guy) at best. Walk it like you talk it for a change, Mr. Gore.
Keep in mind, I have nothing against the wealthy living high on the hog with their own money; just don’t be like Leo, who flew his posse halfway around the world in his jet to hear him hector the rest of us, or that rich fool who flew his entire brood, including nanny, to Davos in two jets, just to tell us we all need to shrink our footprint. Money talks, and BS walks.

Monna Manhas

Actually, Doug Wenzel, per your examples, BS flies first class or private – everywhere. Or it takes limos. BS would NEVER condescend to walk.

MarkW

A few years back, when introducing his Climate Fantasy “An Inconvenient Truth” at the Cannes Film festival, Gore took a limo for the 1/4 mile ride from his hotel to the convention center. Kept the limo running the entire time he was giving his speech, then rode it back to his hotel when done.

Berényi Péter

I’m encouraged that there are groups that are digging in to work even harder.

Excellent. If they want to dig in to work, they can start collecting voluntary donations to support their cause. That’s the way to do it.

What Gore laughingly refers to as “research” amounts to nothing more than Federally funded college sophmores imagining new horrors as a result of global warming.
Good point : ifGore is certain that “the science is settled” exactly why is there any need for research. And his claim that “renewables” will take over is predictablt stupid. I will argue that low carbon energy production wil take over, but it won’t be from renewables, but from nuclear molten salt reactors. Is it just me, or does everyone feel the same as I do : that every word that comes out of Al Gore’s mouth is pure stupidity? I will also argue that we are not far away from practical electric cars – when GM claims they can buy lithium batteries for $150 per kWhr for their electric car (which they did a month ago), then we are very close. And I will argue that for small vehicles, such as the upcoming Elio three wheeler, we are there. My back of the envelope calculations estimate an electric Elio with over 250 miles of driving range, a recharge time of 80% in less than 20 minutes will cost roughly $10,000 to $14,000 at current battery prices, less in a few years.

Bruce Cobb

There’s no reason why “low carbon energy” should take over any time soon, either in MSRs or otherwise. It could be decades before those are viable. And as for “practical electric cars”, don’t make me laff. There’s a reason why, even with generous subsidies the EV market is pathetically small, and not likely to expand much any time soon – maybe in 40 or 50 years, who knows.

Berényi Péter

Molten salt reactor, yes. It operates on atmospheric pressure, chemicals involved are inert, it has a negative temperature coefficient of reactivity, so it can neither blow up nor burn. Fissionable material in core is small at any one time, so even a direct meteorite impact has limited consequences. It does not need active cooling on shutdown, does not produce long half life radioactive waste, uses all the energy in fuel, not only one percent of it, meaning two orders of magnitude less waste for a given energy output, than in our current Cold War Plutonium factories. It is resistant to nuclear weapons’ proliferation. A ton of ordinary granite, the default stuff continents are made of contains as much recoverable energy as fifty tons of coal, but we have much better ores than that for a long time, so mining footprint should drop dramatically. What is more, the technology is proven, in fact the experiment was done fifty years ago.
That said, we do not really need it until we run out of coal, that is, for another century or two.

Resourceguy

Gore may just walk into the trap of opening working against average American working class stiffs and crystallizing that for all to plainly see. Hillary already made that mistake and Gore is a lot dumber than she is.

Resourceguy

openly

Martin A

As somebody pointed out, Trump is playing chess while the opposition is playing checkers:

2hotel9

No, the opposition is playing tictactoe.