UPDATES below – some confusion afoot by differing newspaper versions has been discovered. The print version appears to be online.
=================================
Letters to the editor are one of the oldest free speech venues for public opinion in the United States. They go back to the times of the revolutionary war. The Chicago Tribune aptly calls Letters to the Editor “Voice of the people“.
This morning my interest in a letter to the editor was piqued when I read at Tom Nelson’s website, this headline: Remember when it was really important to leave Michael Mann alone to concentrate on his climate hoax research? Now he’s got time to write a rant for the Vail Daily
Dr. Michael Mann’s letter to the editor, a response to a previous letter by Dr. Martin Hertzberg, at the Vail Daily is online here. Excerpts:
It’s hard to imagine anyone packing more lies and distortions into a single commentary. Mr. Hertzberg uses libelous language in characterizing the so-called “hockey stick” — work of my own published more than a decade ago showing that recent warming is unusual over at least the past 1,000 years — as “fraudulent,” and claiming that it “it was fabricated from carefully selected tree-ring measurements with a phony computer program.”
…
Mr. Hertzberg then continues the smear by lying again about my work, claiming that “when those same tree-ring data actually showed a decline in temperature for the past several decades, Mann and his co-authors simply ‘hid the decline’ by grafting direct measurements (inadequately corrected for the urban heat island and other effects) to his flat tree-ring line.”
So I wanted to see what got Dr. Mann into such a tizzy, because sentences like the ones quoted in the paragraphs above are all over the Internet, especially after Climategate broke. I wanted to see the full context in Dr. Hertzberg’s letter.
So I Googled the offending phrase Dr. Mann cites, and got this result:
Imagine my shock when I discovered that the Google link goes nowhere. Dr. Hertzberg’s letter has been deleted from the newspaper.
Wow.
Dr. Hertzberg’s letter appeared on Friday, September 30th, and Dr. Mann’s letter appeared the next day, quite a turnaround:
One wonders if the address given for Dr. Mann is a typo, or a geographic misrepresentation to help get the letter published. Either way, the Vail Daily editor looks pretty darn sloppy since this appears in the last line of Dr. Mann’s letter:
Michael E. Mann is a professor in the Department of Meterology at Penn State University and director of Penn State Earth System Science Center.
Dr. Hertzberg does in fact live near Vail, in Copper Mountain, CO. and he would presumably be served by the newspaper of record for that area, which is why the letter appeared in that newspaper. As far as we know, Dr. Mann does not live in Vail or nearby.
The policy and online form for submission and publication of Letters to the Editor at the Vail Daily is worth noting:
Letter to the Editor
Guidelines
Before you use the online form below to submit a letter or guest column to the editor, please read the guidelines below.
The decision to print any submission is completely at the discretion of the Vail Daily editor. Letters and columns must include the author’s name, hometown, affiliation (if any) and phone number (for verification of authorship only). Form letters and letters considered libelous, obscene or in bad taste will not be printed. Anonymous letters will not be printed. The Vail Daily reserves the right to edit all letters. Because of space constraints, please limit your letters to 500 words. Thank you/kudos letters are limited to 150 words and letters containing long lists of names will not be printed.
So, apparently, the letter from Dr. Hertzberg passed the newspaper’s tests for “letters considered libelous, obscene or in bad taste” and was in fact printed, but when Dr. Mann sends a rebuttal, all of the sudden Dr. Hertzberg’s letter no longer passes those tests? I suspect that maybe Dr. Mann may have offered some legalese in some form to go with that letter, and the editor caved to censorship demands rather than upholding free speech.
The Wikipedia definition for freedom of speech:
Freedom of speech is the freedom to speak freely without censorship. The term freedom of expression is sometimes used synonymously, but includes any act of seeking, receiving and imparting information or ideas, regardless of the medium used. In practice, the right to freedom of speech is not absolute in any country and the right is commonly subject to limitations, such as on libel, slander, obscenity, incitement to commit a crime, etc.
It may be possible that libel was committed by Dr. Hertzberg (whose credential Dr. Mann doesn’t even acknowledge in his rebuttal letter), but without the original letter from Dr. Hertzberg, how would any independent observer be able to judge?
And, in choosing the headline for the rebuttal: Vail Valley Voices: Global warming denier’s claims are falsehoods did the Vail Daily in turn libel Dr. Hertzberg by labeling him a “global warming denier”?
Clearly then, this is a matter best settled by the courts.
I encourage Dr. Mann to file a lawsuit, so that we can finally get complete discovery (something not done by the “independent reviews” Dr. Mann cites frequently) and find out once and for all if Dr. Mann’s work holds up when all of the data, math, methods, and correspondence are laid bare for scrutiny.
Likewise, Dr. Hertzberg may have a court case for denial of free speech, along with libel by the use of “global warming denier”.
The questions of “who libeled who?”, and “was free speech denied?”, can only be answered in a court of law.
UPDATE: As we all know from vast experience, the Internet has a memory. I’ve discovered what appears to be Dr. Hertzberg’s letter to the editor on a website called “pastebin” which you can see and read here. Dr. Hertzberg’s letter was apparently a response to a previous letter, five days earlier:
Since I am a long-time denier of human-caused global warming and have been described as an “inaccurate” and “irresponsible” “fool” by Scott Glasser’s commentary in Monday’s Vail Daily, I feel compelled to respond.
Since Dr. Hertzberg describes himself as a “doubter” (in the original I saw) it seems the bias of the Vail Daily editor in choosing “denier” for the headline was in fact an editorial decision.
I wonder how long the letter will exist on “pastebin”.
UPDATE#2: It appears that at the same time as I was writing this essay, the Vail Daily decided to reinstate the letter from Dr. Hertzberg. Note the out of sequence date at time for the title:
From this page: http://www.vaildaily.com/SECTION/&profile=1065
Before I made this story I did quite a bit of checking, and the removal was also noted by other websites, for example:
Rabbet Run: Ethon flew in from Colorado with news from one of the bunnies. It appears that the Vail Valley Daily had published a now defunct letter from one Dr. Martin Hertzberg, who appears to live thereabouts. The article which, as the saying goes is no longer to be found, must have been a doozy,
And I looked for it myself by searching the Vail Daily website. I could not find it. For example, it does not show up in search:
UPDATE3: The plot thickens. It appears the restored version on Vail Daily here:
http://www.vaildaily.com/article/20110930/EDITS/111009984/1021&parentprofile=1065
Is missing some key sentences found in the version on pastebin here:
The name of Dr. Mann has been scrubbed from the letter as are the sentences Dr. Mann objected to in his rebuttal letter.
There’s no mention of this edit in the restored version of the letter. It is still dated Sept 30th. Perhaps Dr. Hertzberg was told to revise it?
Now he claims he’s a “denier” where before he says doubter? Strange things going on.
UPDATE4: Larry (Hotrod) points out in comments that the original print version is still archived by the newspaper here.
UPDATE5: It appears we are witnessing the real time editing of this article in online archives. The original with the phrases Dr. Mannobjected to are disappearing from the main web page and archives and are being replaced with edited versions.
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Anthony
You should try a contact Dr Hertzberg and see if he will supply you a copy of the actual letter he sent…
TheFreeDictionary
fraud
1. A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain.
2. A piece of trickery; a trick.
3.
a. One that defrauds; a cheat.
b. One who assumes a false pose; an impostor.
I think that sums it up rather well.
“Dr. Mann should demand a debate with his detractors. He should challenge the “deniers” to get on a stage with him in front of TV cameras and look at all the data! Why would he not want to do so?”
Take one wild guess.
Mann seems to be a bit angry.
I never read the daily vale, or even the Sunday vale
maybe I should
It is Vail, Colorado, Anthony –
by all accounts Vail is a suburb of Hollywood, California.
Not a good place to look for logic, sanity, and common sense.
I just want to thank everyone for keep figting and investigating matters like these. It is appreciated beyond words, thankyou.
K.R. Frank
@Pokerguy
“This really does strike me as a form of denial.”
You think so? You should read Postma and Nahle, among others.
I’m no physicist. I’m not even very bright. But if this really violated the “2nd law of thermodynamics” the whole ridiculous AGW hypothesis would have been discredited long ago. Use your common sense.
Anthony, why don’t you ask Mr. Hertzberg for a copy of the original letter he send to the newspaper and his permission to publish it at WUWT.
That would teach them.
kind of reminds you of the EAU/CRU data debacle… now you see it now you dont..
and then again maybe you do but we wont share how we got it…
I left this comment at RealClimate and it’s being held up for moderation. A comment made 4 minutes after mine has cleared already. I’m sure they want to make some kind of reply before releasing my comment (if they do at all).
Laurie says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
2 Oct 2011 at 2:07 PM
Regardless of the issues disputed at the Vail Daily Letters to the Editor, Dr. Mann should acknowledge the credentials of his opponent. Failing to do so is unprofessional. He is not “Mr. Hertzberg”.
Dr Hertzberg has a Ph D in Physical Chemistry from Stanford, earned his B A degree, cum laude, from the Heights Campus of New York University, and was trained as a meteorologist at the U. S. Naval Postgraduate School.
28WebHubTelescope says:
2 Oct 2011 at 2:11 PM
I should say “officially” discredited (whatever that means exactly). It’s been discredited enough for me for a long time now…
pokerguy says:
October 2, 2011 at 12:39 pm
“Dr. Mann should demand a debate with his detractors. He should challenge the “deniers” to get on a stage with him in front of TV cameras and look at all the data! Why would he not want to do so?”
Take one wild guess.
_______________________________________________
Lets do it court room style.. each is submitted as evidence and then both are given a chance to rebut or support their findings… but strict rules of evidence are kept…
The greenhouse effect violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics? LOL!
Obviously the editor is an AGW dupe and that newspaper has no credibility.
Every time these stooges do things like this they just make things worse for their cause.
looks like there is a huge amount of creative journalism going on… there are about 9 different versions of the letter now… we really need to get a hold of the good doctor and have him supply us with the original..
its like there trying to discredit a denier of AGW..
It appears my comment at RealClimate has been tossed into the dumpster as it is neither posted or in moderation.
Same Martin Hertzberg?
http://www.kobobooks.com/ebook/Slaying-the-Sky-Dragon-/book-Jtl9Lip1A0KPgqrF3aeyEQ/page1.html?utm_source=indigo&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=retailer&ikwid=dr+tim+ball+dr+claes+johnson+dr+martin+hertzberg+joseph+a.+olson+alan+siddons+dr+oliver+k.+manuel+dr+charles+anderson+hans+schreuder+john+o%27sullivan&ikwsec=Books
Laurie says:
October 2, 2011 at 12:58 pm
It appears my comment at RealClimate has been tossed into the dumpster as it is neither posted or in moderation.
———————————————————————————-
POSTING THE DOCTORS RESUME WAS NOT IN THEIR PROPAGANDA INTERESTS. cant have someone with excellent credentials disagreeing with them..
I’m getting a little weary of the interminable food fights between various individuals on opposing sides of this. I wish formal dueling was still legal. It would settle the issue, and would be far more entertaining than current practices if it were live streamed on the net.
Michael Mann it is you who are the [snip ]
From Dr Martin Hertzberg’s article:
“There is a simple way to tell the difference between scientists and propagandists. If scientists have a theory, they search diligently for data that might actually contradict their theory so that they test it rigorously or refine it. If propagandists have a theory, they carefully select only the data that might agree with their theory and dutifully ignore any data that might contradict it”
better yet is to have Mann and Hertzberg duel it out here in a moderated forum… (evil grin)
chances of that are less than Zero however…
Winston Smith over at the Ministry of Truth is hard at work. As usual.
Great stuff, Anthony. In any case however, the actual version is relatively unimportant – what is important is Mann’s reaction to an out of the way letter few have ever read nor would have ever known about but for Mann. Thanks Mann!
At the same time we may not like this guy – BUT – he’s managed to turn himself into a virtual industry affecting the lives of countless millions worldwide, perhaps most responsible for trillions of dollars spent on AGW project, and affected almost all government budgets plus the UN from an office most of us have never seen. That’s naked power in its purest form. No one on this side can even imagine this kinda clout. And all at the same time removing science from the equation, frightening scientists worldwide into helpless bystanders and forcing them to play ball or perish. Until science itself turned inward onto itself and is in the process of destroying itself. That’s Power folks! Pure, naked, power no human, not even the might of the Catholic church itself could match this guy.
You may not like this description and I don’t blame you all, I don’t like it myself. But this is the hard, cold facts as they are here in real life. Mann is no old dude – he merely has to sneeze and we all know. Or write a letter in a newspaper few of us even know existed. See how that newspaper folded? That’s exactly what I mean – 70 odd years old and past the age of retirement and the dude’s still there. Get arrested time after time and still keeps his job. Acts as a public advocate and NO government official has the gonads to fire the guy. What more do you want to prove his power?
Pretty astounding. I didn’t find anything in Dr. Hertzberg’s letter that was libel. Truth is a defense.
http://pastebin.com/L288rdZ7
for Dr. Hertzberg’s letter.