Some people cite scientists saying there is a “CO2 control knob” for Earth. No doubt there is, but due to the logarithmic effect of CO2, I think of it like a fine tuning knob, not the main station tuner. That said, a new data picture is emerging of an even bigger knob and lever; a nice bright yellow one.

A few months back, I found a website from NOAA that provides an algorithm and downloadable program for spotting regime shifts in time series data. It was designed by Sergei Rodionov of the NOAA Bering Climate and Ecosystem Center for the purpose of detecting shifts in the Pacific Decadal Oscillation.
Regime shifts are defined as rapid reorganizations of ecosystems from one relatively stable state to another. In the marine environment, regimes may last for several decades and shifts often appear to be associated with changes in the climate system. In the North Pacific, climate regimes are typically described using the concept of Pacific Decadal Oscillation. Regime shifts were also found in many other variables as demonstrated in the Data section of this website (select a variable and then click “Recent trends”).
But data is data, and the program doesn’t care if it is ecosystem data, temperature data, population data, or solar data. It just looks for and identifies abrupt changes that stabilize at a new level. For example, a useful application of the program is to look for shifts in weather data, such as that caused by the PDO. Here we can clearly see the great Pacific Climate Shift of 1976/77:

Another useful application is to use it to identify station moves that result in a temperature shift. It might also be applied to proxy data, such as ice core Oxygen 18 isotope data.
But the program was developed around the PDO. What drives the PDO? Many say the sun, though there are other factors too. It follows to reason then the we might be able to look for solar regime shifts in PDO driven temperature data.
Alan of AppInSys found the same application and has done just that, and the results are quite interesting. The correlation is well aligned, and it demonstrates the solar to PDO connection quite well. I’ll let him tell his story of discovery below. – Anthony
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Climate Regime Shifts
The notion that climate variations often occur in the form of ‘‘regimes’’ began to become appreciated in the 1990s. This paradigm was inspired in large part by the rapid change of the North Pacific climate around 1977 [e.g., Kerr, 1992] and the identification of other abrupt shifts in association with the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO) [Mantua et al., 1997].” [http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/regimes/Regime_shift_algorithm.pdf]
Pacific Regime Shifts
Hare and Mantua, 2000 (“Empirical evidence for North Pacific regime shifts in 1977 and 1989”): “It is now widely accepted that a climatic regime shift transpired in the North Pacific Ocean in the winter of 1976–77. This regime shift has had far reaching consequences for the large marine ecosystems of the North Pacific. Despite the strength and scope of the changes initiated by the shift, it was 10–15 years before it was fully recognized. Subsequent research has suggested that this event was not unique in the historical record but merely the latest in a succession of climatic regime shifts. In this study, we assembled 100 environmental time series, 31 climatic and 69 biological, to determine if there is evidence for common regime signals in the 1965–1997 period of record. Our analysis reproduces previously documented features of the 1977 regime shift, and identifies a further shift in 1989 in some components of the North Pacific ecosystem. The 1989 changes were neither as pervasive as the 1977 changes nor did they signal a simple return to pre-1977 conditions.”
[http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V7B-41FTS3S-2…]
Overland et al “North Pacific regime shifts: Definitions, issues and recent transitions”
[http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/foci/publications/2008/overN667.pdf]: “climate variables for the North Pacific display shifts near 1977, 1989 and 1998.”
The following figure from the above paper show analysis of PDO and Victoria Index using the Rodionov regime detection algorithm. A regime shift is also detected around 1947-48.

The following figure shows regime shift detection for the summer PDO, showing shifts at 1948, 1976 and 1998.
[http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/data/Images/PDOs_FigRegime.html]

(For detailed information on the 1976/77 climate shift,
see: http://www.appinsys.com/GlobalWarming/The1976-78ClimateShift.htm)
Regime Shift Detection in Annual Temperature Anomaly Data
The NOAA Bering Climate web site provides the algorithm for regime shift detection developed by Sergei Rodionov [http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/regimes/index.html]. The following analyses use the Excel VBA regime change algorithm version 3.2 from this web site.
The following figure shows the regime analysis of the HadCRUT3 annual global annual average temperature anomaly data from the Met Office Hadley Centre for 1895 to 2009 [http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcrut3/diagnostics/global/nh+sh/annual].
The analysis was run based on the mean using a significance level of 0.1, cut-off length of 10 and Huber weight parameter of 2 using red noise IP4 subsample size 6. Regime changes are identified in 1902, 1914, 1926, 1937, 1946, 1957, 1977, 1987, and 1997. Running the analysis based on the variance rather than the mean results in regime changes in the bold years listed above.

Regime Shift Relationship to Solar Cycle
The NASA Solar Physics web site provides the following figure showing sunspot area.
[http://solarscience.msfc.nasa.gov/SunspotCycle.shtml]

The following figure compares the Hadley (HadCrut3) monthly global average temperature (from [http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcrut3/diagnostics/global/nh+sh/]) overlaid with the regime change line (red line) shown previously, along with the sunspot area since 1900. The sunspot cycle is approximately 11 years. The sun’s magnetic field reverses with each sunspot cycle and thus after two sunspot cycles the magnetic field has completed a cycle – a Hale Cycle – and is back to where it started. Thus a complete magnetic sunspot cycle is approximately 22 years. The figure marks the onset of odd-numbered cycles with a vertical red line, even-numbered cycles with a green line.

From the figure above it can be seen that the regime changes correspond to the onset of solar cycles and occur when the “butterfly” is at its widest. The most significant warming regime shifts occur at the start of odd-numbered cycles (1937, 1957, 1977, 1997). Each odd-numbered cycle (red lines above) has resulted in a temperature-increase regime shift. Even-numbered cycles (green lines above) have been inconsistent, with some resulting in temperature-decrease regime shifts (1902, 1946) or minor temperature-increase shifts (1926, 1987).
An unusual one is the 1957 – 1966 cycle, which in the monthly data shown above visually looks like a temperature-increase shift in 1957 followed by a temperature-decrease shift in 1964 but the regime detection algorithm did not identify it. This is likely due to the use of annually averaged data in the regime detection algorithm.
The following figure shows the relative polarity of the Sun’s magnetic poles for recent sunspot cycles along with the solar magnetic flux [www.bu.edu/csp/nas/IHY_MagField.ppt]. The regime change periods are highlighted by the red and green boxes. Each one occurs on as the solar cycle is accelerating. The onset of an odd-numbered sunspot cycle (1977-78, 1997-98) results in the relative alignment of the Earth’s and the Sun’s magnetic fields (positive North pole on the Sun) allowing greater penetration of the geomagnetic storms into the Earth’s atmosphere. “Twenty times more solar particles cross the Earth’s leaky magnetic shield when the sun’s magnetic field is aligned with that of the Earth compared to when the two magnetic fields are oppositely directed” [http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/themis/news/themis_leaky_shield.html]

The following figure shows the longitudinally averaged solar magnetic field. This “magnetic butterfly diagram” shows that the sunspots are involved with transporting the field in its reversal. The Earth’s temperature regime shifts are indicated with the superimposed boxes – red on odd numbered solar cycles, green on even.
[http://solarphysics.livingreviews.org/open?pubNo=lrsp-2010-1&page=articlesu8.html]

The Earth’s temperature regime shift occurs as the solar magnetic field begins its reversal.
Solar Cycle 24
Solar cycle 24 is in its initial stage after getting off to a late start. An El Nino occurred in the first part of 2010. This may be the start of the next regime shift.

Climate Regime Shifts
[last update: 2010/07/04]
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“The notion that climate variations often occur in the form of ‘‘regimes’’ began to become appreciated in the 1990s. This paradigm was inspired in large part by the rapid change of the North Pacific climate around 1977 [e.g., Kerr, 1992] and the identification of other abrupt shifts in association with the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO) [Mantua et al., 1997].” [http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/regimes/Regime_shift_algorithm.pdf]
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Pacific Regime Shifts
Hare and Mantua, 2000 (“Empirical evidence for North Pacific regime shifts in 1977 and 1989”): “It is now widely accepted that a climatic regime shift transpired in the North Pacific Ocean in the winter of 1976–77. This regime shift has had far reaching consequences for the large marine ecosystems of the North Pacific. Despite the strength and scope of the changes initiated by the shift, it was 10–15 years before it was fully recognized. Subsequent research has suggested that this event was not unique in the historical record but merely the latest in a succession of climatic regime shifts. In this study, we assembled 100 environmental time series, 31 climatic and 69 biological, to determine if there is evidence for common regime signals in the 1965–1997 period of record. Our analysis reproduces previously documented features of the 1977 regime shift, and identifies a further shift in 1989 in some components of the North Pacific ecosystem. The 1989 changes were neither as pervasive as the 1977 changes nor did they signal a simple return to pre-1977 conditions.” [http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V7B-41FTS3S-2…]
Overland et al “North Pacific regime shifts: Definitions, issues and recent transitions” [http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/foci/publications/2008/overN667.pdf]: “climate variables for the North Pacific display shifts near 1977, 1989 and 1998.”
The following figure from the above paper show analysis of PDO and Victoria Index using the Rodionov regime detection algorithm. A regime shift is also detected around 1947-48.
The following figure shows regime shift detection for the summer PDO, showing shifts at 1948, 1976 and 1998. [http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/data/Images/PDOs_FigRegime.html]
(For detailed information on the 1976/77 climate shift, see: http://www.appinsys.com/GlobalWarming/The1976-78ClimateShift.htm)
|
|
Regime Shift Detection in Annual Temperature Anomaly Data
The NOAA Bering Climate web site provides the algorithm for regime shift detection developed by Sergei Rodionov [http://www.beringclimate.noaa.gov/regimes/index.html]. The following analyses use the Excel VBA regime change algorithm version 3.2 from this web site.
The following figure shows the regime analysis of the HadCRUT3 annual global annual average temperature anomaly data from the Met Office Hadley Centre for 1895 to 2009 [http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcrut3/diagnostics/global/nh+sh/annual].
The analysis was run based on the mean using a significance level of 0.1, cut-off length of 10 and Huber weight parameter of 2 using red noise IP4 subsample size 6. Regime changes are identified in 1902, 1914, 1926, 1937, 1946, 1957, 1977, 1987, and 1997. Running the analysis based on the variance rather than the mean results in regime changes in the bold years listed above.
|
|
Regime Shift Relationship to Solar Cycle
The NASA Solar Physics web site provides the following figure showing sunspot area. [http://solarscience.msfc.nasa.gov/SunspotCycle.shtml]
The following figure compares the Hadley (HadCrut3) monthly global average temperature (from [http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcrut3/diagnostics/global/nh+sh/]) overlaid with the regime change line (red line) shown previously, along with the sunspot area since 1900. The sunspot cycle is approximately 11 years. The sun’s magnetic field reverses with each sunspot cycle and thus after two sunspot cycles the magnetic field has completed a cycle – a Hale Cycle – and is back to where it started. Thus a complete magnetic sunspot cycle is approximately 22 years. The figure marks the onset of odd-numbered cycles with a vertical red line, even-numbered cycles with a green line.
From the figure above it can be seen that the regime changes correspond to the onset of solar cycles and occur when the “butterfly” is at its widest. The most significant warming regime shifts occur at the start of odd-numbered cycles (1937, 1957, 1977, 1997). Each odd-numbered cycle (red lines above) has resulted in a temperature-increase regime shift. Even-numbered cycles (green lines above) have been inconsistent, with some resulting in temperature-decrease regime shifts (1902, 1946) or minor temperature-increase shifts (1926, 1987).
An unusual one is the 1957 – 1966 cycle, which in the monthly data shown above visually looks like a temperature-increase shift in 1957 followed by a temperature-decrease shift in 1964 but the regime detection algorithm did not identify it. This is likely due to the use of annually averaged data in the regime detection algorithm.
The following figure shows the relative polarity of the Sun’s magnetic poles for recent sunspot cycles along with the solar magnetic flux [www.bu.edu/csp/nas/IHY_MagField.ppt]. The regime change periods are highlighted by the red and green boxes. Each one occurs on as the solar cycle is accelerating. The onset of an odd-numbered sunspot cycle (1977-78, 1997-98) results in the relative alignment of the Earth’s and the Sun’s magnetic fields (positive North pole on the Sun) allowing greater penetration of the geomagnetic storms into the Earth’s atmosphere. “Twenty times more solar particles cross the Earth’s leaky magnetic shield when the sun’s magnetic field is aligned with that of the Earth compared to when the two magnetic fields are oppositely directed” [http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/themis/news/themis_leaky_shield.html]
The following figure shows the longitudinally averaged solar magnetic field. This “magnetic butterfly diagram” shows that the sunspots are involved with transporting the field in its reversal. The Earth’s temperature regime shifts are indicated with the superimposed boxes – red on odd numbered solar cycles, green on even. [http://solarphysics.livingreviews.org/open?pubNo=lrsp-2010-1&page=articlesu8.html]
The Earth’s temperature regime shift occurs as the solar magnetic field begins its reversal.
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Solar Cycle 24
Solar cycle 24 is in its initial stage after getting off to a late start. An El Nino occurred in the first part of 2010. This may be the start of the next regime shift.
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tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 12:21 am
Genuinely, I’d be extremely interested to see that.
The calculations are complicated and are mostly done for interplanetary dust grains of a typical diameter of a millionth of a meter (here are two references: http://www.leif.org/research/50060545.pdf and Encyclopedia of the solar system page634 ff). The drag forces [there are several] for particles of 1 micron are around 10^-18 N[ewton] at 1 aU. For the precise calculation of this number see the references [we can go through those line by line, if you wish – but I doubt that you do, once you see which way it is going]. The drag forces depends on the size of the particle. A typical planet is 10,000 km or 10^13 times larger than a dust particle. The force scales [page 634] somewhere between linearly and quadratically with the size, so we get 10^-18 * 10^13 = 10^-5 N for the linear case, and 10^-18 * (10^13)^2 = 10^8 N for the quadratic case. Now, the gravitational force that holds the Earth in its orbit is 4*10^21 N, against which both 10^8 and 10^-5 are negligible over time scales of interest.
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 1:28 am
Now, the gravitational force that holds the Earth in its orbit is 4*10^21 N
Haste is waste. It is 4*10^22 N, ten times larger.
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 12:15 am
the orbits of the planets to decay (as they must, see the law of entropy),
Well, that law is about billiard balls, etc.
In reality, the planets will recede from the Sun with time, as the Sun is losing mass by nuclear fusion [4 million ton/second]. But this is completely different process from ‘drag’.
tallbloke asked, “Could Stephen be referring to the combined shift of the northern and southern jet streams?”
He did not state a “combined shift of the northern and southern jet streams”. And what documentation is there that there was a “combined shift of the northern and southern jet streams” from the MWP to the LIA of 1000 km?
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 1:36 am (Edit)
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 12:15 am
the orbits of the planets to decay (as they must, see the law of entropy),
Well, that law is about billiard balls, etc.
That law is about billiard balls and the universe as a whole. Of course there can be local pockets of negentropy. These are usually found where there are living things busy organising their local environment to suit their lifestyle.
Thanks for the calcs and the link, I’ll do some studying and report back.
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 1:28 am (Edit)
Now, the gravitational force that holds the Earth in its orbit is 4*10^21 N, against which both 10^8 and 10^-5 are negligible over time scales of interest.
True but irrelevant. How much power does the sliding collar on a James Watt planetary governer need to control the output of a 100 horsepower steam engine?
“Bob Tisdale says:
July 15, 2010 at 6:10 pm
Stephen Wilde wrote, “Just shift all the air circulation systems 1000 miles or so poleward or equatorward as observed MWP to LIA to date.”
1000 miles? Weren’t you discussing a paper above that showed the ITCZ moved 500km? 500km is 310 miles the last time I checked.”
The shift in the ITCZ does not match the average shift of all the air circulation systems. I clearly referred to the latter.
For example in the depths of the LIA the northern mid latitude jets ran more often into the Mediterranean whilst in the late 20th Century they ran most commonly north of Scotland.
On average globally the shift would appear to have been 1000 miles or more.
May I recommend that you think a little more before firing off ?
@Geoff Sharp says:
July 15, 2010 at 8:54 am
“Your knowledge is paramount,”
why thanks !
“predicting SC24 will be higher than SC23?”
At the end of 2007 I left my pitch at 120-140. As sunspots are not the dominant solar regime that drives Earth`s climate, it is not a vital issue as regards this discussion.
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 3:39 am
True but irrelevant. How much power does the sliding collar on a James Watt planetary governer need to control the output of a 100 horsepower steam engine?
Your comment shows your science illiteracy. To determine the change of the movement of a particle, planet, steam engine [from point A to point B], you add up all the forces [as vectors] acting upon the particle, then divide by its mass. The change of orbit of a dust particle will be large, because you divide by its small mass. The change for a planet is negligible because you diviede by the huge mass of the planet.
Geoff Sharp says:
July 16, 2010 at 12:17 am
the streams migrate slowly, over a period of 17 years, to the equator, and are associated with the production of sunspots once they reach a critical latitude of 22 degrees.”
This should settle the matter. The 17 year pattern/duration/cycle is waiting for us resolve.
You are misrepresenting their work. The equator-ward movement is 17 years, but the whole TO including the polar branch is 22. There has been progress though, as you are beginning to say ‘duration’. To repeat, there is no cycle of 17 years, as was the original point. Remember I said “there is no 17-yr cycle in anything solar”. This you finally concede. It is just a bit sad [perhaps telling], that you cling to the false notion for so long.
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 6:53 am (Edit)
You are demonstrating your lack of understanding of the gain on cybernetic control loops. But apart from that, we haven’t accounted for all the vectors yet. I’ll have some time to look at the link and your numbers in more depth this weekend. Bye for now.
Van de Graaf spins as to fly off the handle.
==============
Stephen Wilde: You replied, “For example in the depths of the LIA the northern mid latitude jets ran more often into the Mediterranean whilst in the late 20th Century they ran most commonly north of Scotland.”
Please provide documentation of this. Thanks. Also, you’re assuming the jets over the Mediterranean and Scotland are represntative of global changes.
You commented, “May I recommend that you think a little more before firing off ?”
Nope. Can you document a variability of “all the air circulation systems 1000 miles or so poleward or equatorward as observed MWP to LIA to date”? Observed is the key word in your sentence.
Leif, maybe the link to the doc is broken?
http://www.leif.org/research/50060545.pdf
404 Not Found.
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 7:05 am
You are demonstrating your lack of understanding of the gain on cybernetic control loops. …
http://www.leif.org/research/50060545.pdf
http://www.leif.org/EOS/50060545.pdf
You have not shown that there are any cybernetic control loops at play here. BTW, I do understand those, in my other life I was constructing real-time control systems, e.g. for automatic telescopes [e.g. The Wilcox Solar Observatory], controllers for drafting machines http://www.scanners4cad.com/news_views/ProCaptura-wide-scanner.htm etc. How many such systems have you designed lately?
Hi Leif,
thanks for the link. I’m not sure how well the dust grains will scale up into planets but we can try if I can’t find anything more apposite to the problem. One of the issues is that dust particles don’t have magnetospheres, so although dust particles are good enougfh model planets in the pebbles universe you prefer to inhabit, they are not much use to me.
Like you I haven’t designed any control circuits recently, but I used to play with home made robotics and learned cybernetic control design at technical college on my HNC course all that time ago. It’s a bit like riding an extended cycle really, you don’t forget once you’ve learned. 😉
Cheers
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 7:55 am
thanks for the link. I’m not sure how well the dust grains will scale up into planets but we can try if I can’t find anything more apposite to the problem. One of the issues is that dust particles don’t have magnetospheres
They scale well enough. Magnetospheres are but a minor effect. Dryer and Fay-Petersen [see reference in http://www.leif.org/EOS/1969SoPh-9-205.pdf ] calculate a drag of 4*10^6 N on the Earth’s magnetosphere, which is nicely between my two outer limits of 10^8 and 10^-5 N, and still negligible compared to the 4*10^22 N of solar gravity. These is a lesson here: when I say something, you can count on it being accurate as far as we know [and I’m not into unknown effects from unknown causes, as so many here].
Bob Tisdale:
I’ve posted such stuff before. Here is some more.
http://www.fs.fed.us/psw/cirmount/meetings/paclim/pdf/li_talk_PACLIM2007.pdf
The climate changes in the C.R. drainage basin between 1,300 and 20,500 yr BP has been strongly influenced by N. American monsoon, whose strength was strong in early Holocene and decreased toward to late Holocene, corresponding to variations of solar insolation and shifts in ITCZ and Westerlies. We have found climatic shifts such as Heinrich-1 event and “Trans US wet period”, and mega droughts around 8.2, 6.2, 4.2 and 2.5 kyr.
http://www.springerlink.com/content/w507537657n5gk77/
A pronounced shift to generally wetter conditions with less severe droughts of shorter duration occured at A.D. 1200. This abrupt change coincided with the end of the ”Medieval Warm Period” (A.D. 1000–1200) and the onset of the ”Little Ice Age” (A.D. 1300–1850).
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6VBC-4YCGKYV-1&_user=10&_coverDate=04%2F30%2F2010&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=33381962d9f0151502d1fb38e196d6fd
The high- and low-resolution data all show that, over the past millennium, ACA has been characterized by a relatively dry Medieval Warm Period (MWP; the period from 1000 to 1350 AD), a wet Little Ice Age (LIA; from 1500 to 1850 AD) and increasing moisture during recent decades. As a whole, the LIA in the ACA was not only relatively humid but also had high precipitation. Over the past millennium, the multi-centennial moisture changes in ACA show a generally inverse relationship with the temperature changes in the Northern Hemisphere, China, and western central Asia. The effective moisture history in ACA also shows an out-of-phase relationship with that in monsoon Asia (especially during the LIA). We propose that the humid LIA in ACA, possibly extending to Mediterranean Sea and Western Europe, may have resulted from increased precipitation due to more frequent mid-latitude cyclone activities as a result of the strengthening and equator-ward shift of the westerly jet stream, and the predominantly negative North Atlantic Oscillation conditions, coupled with a decrease in evapotranspiration caused by the cooling at that time.
And you want to quibble about the precise distances invoved ?
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 7:03 am
You are misrepresenting their work. The equator-ward movement is 17 years, but the whole TO including the polar branch is 22. There has been progress though, as you are beginning to say ‘duration’. To repeat, there is no cycle of 17 years, as was the original point. Remember I said “there is no 17-yr cycle in anything solar”. This you finally concede. It is just a bit sad [perhaps telling], that you cling to the false notion for so long.
Quite comical really…do you ever give up?
Stephen Wilde: You replied, “And you want to quibble about the precise distances invoved ?”
Of course. If you list a specific number, you should be able to document it. This is a science blog. Of the links you provided me, not one quantifies a 1000-mile latitudinal shift of the jet streams. Also, there is no mention of latitudinal shifts in the jets or ITCZ in the abstract of Laird et al (2004), just an agreement of the timing of climate shifts with changes from the MWP to the LIA. And the links you provided are only discussions of the Northern Hemisphere. Is your NCM limited to the Northern Hemisphere?
@Geoff Sharp says:
July 14, 2010 at 5:45 am
“On the climate front I am not sold on the solar wind argument yet, it does not seem to vary in speed all that much over a cycle. Whats in that wind might be a different story. At present the solar wind is low but not all that different to the up slope of SC23, after Sc23 max the solar wind took off, while the Earth cooled?”
http://www.landscheidt.info/images/Sc23wind_rz.png
Nice graph, if you look at the detail, it is easy to see warmer and cooler months.
Ulric Lyons says:
July 16, 2010 at 7:31 pm
@Geoff Sharp says:
July 14, 2010 at 5:45 am
Nice graph, if you look at the detail, it is easy to see warmer and cooler months.
Thanks, it took me ages. We have a perfect opportunity to test your theory, we can pick a reliable temperature record and match it with the wind speed data. If you want the spreadsheet just ask.
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 16, 2010 at 8:20 am (Edit)
tallbloke says:
July 16, 2010 at 7:55 am
thanks for the link. I’m not sure how well the dust grains will scale up into planets but we can try if I can’t find anything more apposite to the problem. One of the issues is that dust particles don’t have magnetospheres
They scale well enough. Magnetospheres are but a minor effect. Dryer and Fay-Petersen [see reference in http://www.leif.org/EOS/1969SoPh-9-205.pdf ] calculate a drag of 4*10^6 N on the Earth’s magnetosphere, which is nicely between my two outer limits of 10^8 and 10^-5 N, and still negligible compared to the 4*10^22 N of solar gravity. These is a lesson here: when I say something, you can count on it being accurate as far as we know [and I’m not into unknown effects from unknown causes, as so many here].
Hi Leif, thanks for that interesting paper. I find the older stuff more accessible and easier to read. Do Dryer and Faye-Petersen’s estimates for the effective magnetic diameter of Earth’s magnetosphere and their particle density for the solar wind still hold good with space age measurements?
If we did the same calculation for Jupiter, what would that force be? And Venus?
I know you think I’m wasting our time on this stuff, but I still think it’s worth investigating the proportions of the forces between the important planets, to see if that might help with allotting strengths to the alignment values. Signals, no matter how tiny, are of interest to me. They might not be directly causal, but could be a proxy for something else.
I’ve been asked not to show the whole record yet, but my correspondent won’t mind if I show you the relationship of the planetary alignments as he has calculated them to sunspot activity over a few cycles from the earlier historical record. Here it is:
http://tallbloke.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/partial-planet-ssn.jpg
Interesting?
tallbloke says:
July 17, 2010 at 1:29 am
Do Dryer and Faye-Petersen’s estimates for the effective magnetic diameter of Earth’s magnetosphere and their particle density for the solar wind still hold good with space age measurements?
1966 was in the ‘space age’. Their values V=400 km/s and n=6.3 protons/cm^3 are still right on. For 2010 [so far] we have V=398 km/s and n=5.4.
If we did the same calculation for Jupiter, what would that force be? And Venus?
Venus doesn’t have a real magnetosphere, so even smaller effect, and Jupiter is 5 times further out, where the solar wind is 25 times weaker [plus Jupiter is heavy], so if anything the relative effect would be smaller.
he has calculated them to sunspot activity over a few cycles from the earlier historical record. Interesting?
I can’t [and won’t] comment on hidden stuff like this.
Leif Svalgaard says:
July 17, 2010 at 5:01 am
I can’t [and won’t] comment on hidden stuff like this.
Fair enough Leif, I’ll keep working at it alone for now.