This is a news story from Germany outlining another Arctic ice measurement expedition. This one was conducted by flying the scientists across the north polar ice cap using the WWII era workhorse Douglas DC-3 airplane equipped with skis, and towing an airborne sounder twenty meters above the ice surface. It makes the Catlin Arctic Ice Survey look rather pointless, but then we knew that. BTW “Eisdicken” translates to “ice thickness”. – Anthony
From Radio Bremen. Translated from German by Google web page translator: Original | Translated
Surprising Results
At the North Pole ice sheet is thicker than expected
![Das Forschungsflugzeug "Polar 5" in Bremerhaven [Quelle: AWI]](https://i0.wp.com/www.radiobremen.de/wissen/nachrichten/polarfuenf100_v-slideshow.jpg?quality=83 "The research aircraft Polar 5 \"in Bremerhaven [Source: AWI]")
The “Polar 5” in Bremerhaven
The research aircraft Polar 5 “ended today in Canada’s recent Arctic expedition. During the flight, researchers have measured the current Eisstärke measured at the North Pole, and in areas that have never before been overflown. Result: The sea-ice in the surveyed areas is apparently thicker than the researchers had suspected.
Normally, ice is newly formed after two years, over two meters thick. “Here were Eisdicken up to four meters,” said a spokesman of Bremerhaven’s Alfred Wegener Institute for Polar and Marine Research. For scientists, this result is still in contradiction to the warming of the seawater.
Besides the Eisdicken was also the composition of the air are investigated. With the help of a laser, the researchers reviewed how polluted the atmosphere by emissions from industrialized countries. On the expedition, some 20 scientists from the U.S., Canada, Italy and Germany.
Here is the route map:
See the press release announcing the expedition from Alfred Wegener Institute for Polar and Marine Research here. Note the lack of “live” biometrics.
But they do have a nifty aerial ice thickness probe, shown above.
An ice thickness probe, the so-called EM-Bird, which is usually dragged below a helicopter, is now operated for the first time by a fixed-wing aircraft. The EM-Bird is towed under the hull of the aircraft by means of a winch for take-off and landing. For the surveys, the probe is towed on an 80 m long rope twenty metres above the ice surface. More extensive areas can now be investigated due to the longer range of the aircraft in comparison to a helicopter.
UPDATE: more on the EM-Bird probe (h/t to Ron de Haan)
EM-Bird
Electromagnetic (EM) induction sounding for ice thickness measurements is a technique that can achieve long profiles of some kilometer length. The accuracy and robustness of the EM method has been evaluated by comparing coincident drill-hole and EM measurements. Read more (Poster, pdf, size: 156 kB)
Sure beats hauling a sledge and a broken home-built ice radar around doesn’t it?
h/t to “yddar” and Lubos Motl
Ron de Haan (17:29:23)said :
However, during a recent documentary about Antarctic, a broad cast by ZDF, the scientist in charge dismissed any link between CO2 driving our climate and said that AGW was a political hoax.
He also said that he was doing his job as a scientist and he would not allow politics to interfere with his work or his reporting.
Fortunately there are many scientists who share a similar opinion and their numbers are growing.
I am shocked, shocked to hear a climatologist actually doing his job, that is, REAL SCIENCE.
Perhaps, towards the end of this leftist political drama, all the AGW foolishness will have actually stimulated a renewed interest in the collection of real data and honest analysis without a preconceived agenda.
Maybe, if you will, AGW will be the “Sputnick” for climatology. That would be cool. So to speak.
Oh, and that aeroplane is one of the prettiest things I have ever seen. Old man Douglas would have been quite proud I think of this hot-rod version of his Gooney Bird. Simply stunning.
I’ve heard a “rumor” that the Antartic has had -100 F temperatures. Is this true? Is it really 2 months early?
With the enlargement of the Antartic ice and the parallel enlargement of the artic Ice, could this bode for VERY COLD AND LONG WINTERS FOR THE NEXT FEW YEARS?
Herzlichen Glückwunsch zu diesem feinen Expedition!
(congratulations to this fine expedition!)
50 bucks says Catlin will report a diametrically opposed conclusion to this study. (shockingly thin ice will be everywhere….and maybe a few dead polar bears 🙂
I was amazed to see they were using a DC-3/C-47. I flew in one in Nepal in 1968, a C-47 with school bus seats. When I looked at the props in the pictures, and saw they were way forward of where they should have been, it was obvious the engines had been replaced. From there to Basler to read about the conversion.
I’m curious about metal fatigue, after all these years. Here’s what Basler’s FAQ says:
Not sure I understand that.
/Mr Lynn
Great job indeed!!. Hope to see their data here in WUWT.
A light at the end of the dark tunnel, the sun shining through the soot fog of New Age Science!!
The greenies thought that the Arctic had little attention but failed to realize the significance to the military. The ice is getting much more attention both now and in the distant pass then they failed you check. Gotcha!
Sorry spell check needs to proof reading.
hareynolds (18:39:43) :
Ron de Haan (17:29:23)said :
However, during a recent documentary about Antarctic, a broad cast by ZDF, the scientist in charge dismissed any link between CO2 driving our climate and said that AGW was a political hoax.
He also said that he was doing his job as a scientist and he would not allow politics to interfere with his work or his reporting.
Fortunately there are many scientists who share a similar opinion and their numbers are growing.
I am shocked, shocked to hear a climatologist actually doing his job, that is, REAL SCIENCE.
Perhaps, towards the end of this leftist political drama, all the AGW foolishness will have actually stimulated a renewed interest in the collection of real data and honest analysis without a preconceived agenda.
Maybe, if you will, AGW will be the “Sputnick” for climatology. That would be cool. So to speak.
Oh, and that aeroplane is one of the prettiest things I have ever seen. Old man Douglas would have been quite proud I think of this hot-rod version of his Gooney Bird. Simply stunning.
hareynolds,
It very well could be that you are “shocked” about a scientist (I never said the guy was a climatologist) taking a non biased point of view, but that was not the subject.
You know and I know that the current media (especially the ZDF in Germany, comparable to the BBC and CNBC) filter out every scientific information or data that could damage the green dream AGW doctrine.
For this purpose they interview biased scientists and lecture their public about all possible AGW/Climate Change scares.
So if ZDF, broadcasts the non biased opinion of a scientist these days, this certainly is rare event.
May I point out to you that I wrote down my experience in response to this posting that related to the original article about the thick ice at the Arctic:
Alexej Buergin (16:50:21) :
“Bremen is the smallest German state, consisting mainly of the towns of Bremen and Bremerhaven. It is governed by a red-green coalition.
Radio Bremen ist the public Radio- (and TV-) station.
That Radio Bremen publishes this news is astonishing”.
In short, the subject in this posting was not about scientists doing their work but German media putting a non biased AGW message on the air.
Next time read a posting twice before you express your mental condition.
I am glad you are pleased with the plane though.
The 3 Caitlteers have to make it out alive first.
Along with the rescue plane (should it actually find a place to land), they should send some goons to escort the dementia suffering explorers, who should have known better than pull a publicity stunt in a place like that.
This is twice for Pen Hadlow.
I call it tired of living.
@David Ball (15:44:08) :
“Reminds me of a discussion on here regarding the Lord of the Rings plot hole. The question as to why they just didn’t take the golden eagles to the volcano and drop the ring in.”
One word answer David – Nasgul
JRR didn’t do plot holes. ; )
4 meter thick “melted ice” = cap and trade paying me to drive my SUV! (?)
Not hardly.
AGW = taxes!
Physical proof isn’t enough; at the polls, beliefs count. The Reagan revolution cut off direct taxation to fund social agenda. Alternatives had to be found!
Elected officials do respond to ground swells, however. The key is changing beliefs.
Jack Green,
That’s true. The ice is thin because… who’s gonna check up on them? Also it seems like GISS usually has the hottest parts of the earth where there are not as many people. Remember the Siberian debacle? Then they pushed the heat into the NWT of Canada and parts of Australia. Its the same with AGW proponents everywhere. No one around the polar bears so they, obviously, are the victims… Who’s going to check up on them?
The GCMs said that the extra heat would manifest itself in the tropical tropospheric temperatures, but guess what it’s not there… sooooo it must be hiding in the deep ocean!!! Yeah, that’s the ticket!
The ice is thinning!!! Horror of horrors!! Oh wait… Actually it’s not!
It’s time to stop this idiotic game of hide and seek… It’s time for some real science for a change.
When can we all finally say, “Alle, alle auch sind frei!”?
As an environmentalist, I am concerned that if they cut off all the eisdicken, how will they ever produce enough baby ice to stymie next year’s failed arctic expeditions?
I just submitted this “eisdecke” item to Drudge-lets see if we can get a little more space in spite of the huge H1N1 scare !!! With 22 Million hits a day Drudge can get our message out very effectively.
Is there any info somewhere about the resolution of this equipment? I mean, if they have a resolution of 1 m it would not be anything to get excited about!!! But it would have been nice to fly over the Catlin group to measure the same spots… I suppose the Catlin Expedition have a resolution of a mm.
David Ball (15:44:08) :
Reminds me of a discussion on here regarding the Lord of the Rings plot hole. The question as to why they just didn’t take the golden eagles to the volcano and drop the ring in.
Dude, because Sauron would have seen them coming, with horrible results.
Mr Lynn,
infinitely repairable=disassemble and replace
Those rebuilt aircraft may have NO original air frame or much else that is stressed or wearable!!!
On another issue, pity all those folk making plans to exploit the Arctic without an Ice Cap in the summer!!! (especially the Russians)
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Mr Lynn (18:52:26) :
Q. What about fatigue?
A. The DC-3 airframe is infinitely repairable as related to fatigue damage.
Not sure I understand that.
/Mr Lynn
Mr. Lynn,
The aluminum airframes of the C47 (which does not have a pressured air cabin) have a very long life cycle.
The entire fuselage and wing sections are produced from sheet metal, attached on a frame by rivets.
The only threats to the construction of an aluminum air frame is corrosion which could cause metal fatigue.
Therefore they perform a thorough inspection.
If they modify a C47, they drill out all the old rivets that hold the aircraft together and inspect the aluminum parts.
They look for corrosion and cracks, they replace effected parts, apply new corrosion protection and put in new rivets.
This a time consuming job.
But when it is finished the plane is like new with ZERO hours.
Have a look at this Word File providing more insight:
http://www.rv7-a.com/builder_docs/Repairing%20Sheet%20Metal.doc
pwl (18:25:28) :
Well it looks like the Catlin Survey are the ones Eis-dick-en pointlessly but not with the ice. I suppose that is their tribute to the current Tea Bagging craze going on.
It does seem that “swimming with the ice” is a rather strange way to measure ice thickness. I suppose it’s the way that tree huggers would use.
Airplane seems a wee bit hugely better approach… and a lot more efficient than swimming and eis-dick-en with the ice, not to mention much safer although still riskier than a satellite.
You think a plane is safer, any idea where and how Amundsen died? Hint it wasn’t schlepping across the ice towing a sled.
In the ‘small print’ note that the airborne device was calibrated by drilling ice, so some poor sod did schlep across some ice somewhere drilling holes!
“BTW “Eisdicken” translates to “ice thickness”. – Anthony”
This is the first time I’ve read an article on arctic ice where it’s made me feel dirty.
I get the sense that most of you are wondering what in the world is the Catlin Survey doing Eisdicken-around in the Arctic.
Here is my translation. “Dicken” is a plural, so I have translated it to “thicknesses”. The plural means the thickness at various different locations, obviously.
My translation – unfortunately – doesn’t have some of the humorous surprises that Google translator produces, but I figured maybe someone may want to know exactly what it says in German.
===========
The research aircraft “Polar 5” is finishing its latest arctic expedition in Canada today. During the flight, scientist have measured the current strength of the ice at the North Pole, in particular in regions that have never before been flown over. Result: sea-ice in the studied areas is apparently thicker than the scientists had suspected.
Normally, newly formed ice is roughly two meters thick after two years (according to the scientist mentioned next – this is a transcribed quotation as the German uses the subjunctive – “sei” instead of “ist”). “But here, the ice thicknesses were measured to be up to four meters, ” said a spokesperson of the Alfred-Wegener-Institute for Polar Research and Oceanography in Bremerhaven. For the scientists this result is presently still in contradiction to the warming of the seawater.
Besides the ice thicknesses, the composition of the air was also studied. With the help of a laser the scientists checked how polluted by exhaust gas from industrial contries the athmosphere is. The results will be analyzed in the coming weeks. Around 20 scientists from the US, Canada, Italy and Germany participated in the expedition.
Joe Papp (18:41:53) :
I’ve heard a “rumor” that the Antartic has had -100 F temperatures. Is this true? Is it really 2 months early?
—————————-
Get with the program Joe. Whether it’s true or not, it’s the man-made ozone hole’s fault. Peer-reviewed and all that, so it must be true.
…. and, back on-topic to the other pole, can we get the news up there that they’ve been scooped by the Germans, then the eisdickenheads can come home ???
“Result: The sea-ice in the surveyed areas is apparently thicker than the researchers had suspected. Normally, ice is newly formed after two years, over two meters thick. “Here were Eisdicken up to four meters,” ”
Thicker ice means a slower summer melt than suspected too.
Here’s JAXA today–still clearly behind last year :
http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/en/home/seaice_extent.htm
I love the smell of slower melting ice in the morning….
And this brings this winter’s Arctic ice season to a close!
Thanks for staying for the finale, and watch for the DVDs with staff commentary and extra surprises!
Everyone please leave in an orderly fashion, pick up free sunscreen in the lobby, and we thank you for all the food and clothing donations in the Caitlin barrels. We’ll airdrop those next week, and everyone come back in the fall for an update on their progress!