Smart meters could soon cost you a whole lot more

From NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THAT

By Paul Homewood

h/t Philip Bratby

I was going to write about this, but Ross Clark has beaten me to it!

What remarkable power climate change has to turn the usual rules of fairness on their head. The poor pay the taxes and the wealthy get subsidised. It has happened with electric cars, where well-off early adopters were handed grants of £4,000 to buy a new vehicle – as well as being excused fuel duty and road tax, essentially freeing them from having to make any contribution to the upkeep of roads. It has happened with heat pumps – whose owners have enjoyed years of subsidies, the latest manifestation of which is £7,500 in upfront grants.

Surge pricing is a desperate solution to manage demand rather than maintain supply

The next phase will be even more painful for the poor and even more rewarding for the wealthy. The Department for Energy Security and Net Zero has put forward proposals to equip smart meters and electric appliances with technology to allow Uber-style surge pricing for electricity, where the price of power will vary on a half-hourly basis. Under the new system, there would be little warning of when prices would change, unlike the Economy 7 tariff, which has been around for decades and offers consumers cheaper electricity at night.

The reason for the new system is the intermittency of wind and solar, which the government and the green energy industry in general have failed to solve. Technologies for storing energy remain horribly expensive, or they have not yet even been proven on a commercial scale. Surge pricing is a desperate solution to manage demand rather than maintain supply. How much will prices have to vary in order to persuade people to turn off appliances when little wind and solar energy is being produced? It would require hugely punitive tariffs. This is the scale of the problem: Britain already has enough wind and solar capacity – theoretically – to meet Britain average power demand of 37 gigawatts. But in some weather conditions – namely calm winter evenings – that can fall away to less than one gigawatt.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/smart-meters-could-soon-cost-you-a-whole-lot-more/#comments-container

Ross hits the nail on the head.

Fiddling around with peak prices won’t make the slightest bit of difference to peak demand. People are not going to rearrange their lives to save a few pence here and there.

To cut demand, prices will need to be punitive.

Moreover, we are not talking about the sort of variable tariffs currently on the market, such as Octopus Agile which offer variable prices for prearranged times of day.

Surge pricing can change every half hour, so very few people will even be aware prices are changing, never mind being able to do anything about it.

We are likely to end up in a situation where people automatically switch all appliances off whenever there is the slightest risk of price hikes.

The days of cheap, reliable energy are over.

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April 18, 2024 2:27 am

Yet another reason not to fit a smart meter.

Reply to  Oldseadog
April 18, 2024 2:56 am

The problem is that you will be on a more expensive tariff all the time if you stay on a standard meter.
I got conned into having Smart meters fitted and I can say that for the cost to the industry (and ultimately the consumer) Smart meters are a waste of time.
Yes you can see what energy you are using in real time but after you have gone around the house turning off all non essential power, turned down the boiler, adjusted the central heating thermostat and timer. What the Smart meter display is telling you is that the energy that you are using is too expensive and the only way to save more is to sit in the dark and cold eating salad. Not the retirement I had planned unfortunately.

bobpjones
Reply to  galileo62
April 18, 2024 5:13 am

I, too, was conned. Years ago, I used to teach datacomms & networking. At that time, telecommunications was undergoing a revolution, new digital services, would enable all kinds of benefits. Such as your gas/electric meters connected to ISDN, thereby disposing of the meter reader guy.

When they revealed smart metering, I thought, that it had finally arrived. However, when configuring my account, I was puzzled by the option for ‘half hour’ readings, which didn’t work.

Now I understand the reason 😠

Reply to  galileo62
April 18, 2024 10:18 am

The problem is that you will be on a more expensive tariff all the time if you stay on a standard meter.

If that is the price I have to pay to prevent them from remotely disabling my heavy-current circuits when they can’t meet demand—smart meters can do that—I will pay it.

(Well that is my defiant claim. I know perfectly well that they will get a warrant to gain entry and install the smart meter when they are ready to actually ration electricity. Me not submitting to it will be a crime akin to hoarding food.)

sherro01
Reply to  galileo62
April 19, 2024 2:50 am

Galileo
did you ever find out who made a killing from secret deals to buy meters bulk at unstated prices to sell at higher prices to a dedicated public? Any smell of a deal for friends?
Geoff S

J Smith
Reply to  Oldseadog
April 18, 2024 5:00 am

We weren’t given any choice in New Orleans.

Reply to  Oldseadog
April 18, 2024 8:16 am

Won’t help. The problem is that during the three winter months there will be, at some point, a week with no solar generation, and wind will be doing two or three percent of faceplate. There will be no power. What kind of meter you have is not going to make any difference.

And refusal will anyway not be an option. It will be essential to keeping the grid going that the operators have the power to shut off demand, so it will be compulsory.

The only thing that will keep your power going will be a special exemption. Or having a backup generator.

Mr.
Reply to  michel
April 18, 2024 4:55 pm

They might then resort to doing something waaay over the top like declaring a “climate emergency” or something.

Oh wait .. . .

Reply to  Oldseadog
April 18, 2024 8:59 am

You won’t have a choice and you will be happy.

The Expulsive
Reply to  Oldseadog
April 18, 2024 9:22 am

No choice in Ontario, as they were mandated by the previous Liberal government (they are really quite left wing, like Justin Trudeau), which also subsidised the purchase of Teslas (well EVs, but there really only were Teslas sold).
We pay the highest rate at breakfast/dinner time in the winter, and during the day in summer. We can’t negotiate, though the current Tory government ended the car subsidies and subsidises some of the rates (to compensate people for the high cost of connecting solar and wind turbines, built during the Liberal (mis)administration of the Province.

Walter Sobchak
Reply to  Oldseadog
April 19, 2024 10:30 pm

You will not be given a choice.

Corrigenda
April 18, 2024 2:30 am

A really classic example of incompetence in business. Just like we saw with Railway Nationalisation in – and after – 1947.

Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 2:43 am

“to allow Uber-style surge pricing for electricity”
People grumble about Uber’s surge pricing. Yet Uber is popular, and thriving. How can that be? Competing taxis offer predictable pricing.

So what happens in busy times. Taxis will not charge more, but there is no incentive for drivers to respond, so you can’t get a taxi at any price. With Uber, you can, and the drivers make good money.

What happens in less busy times? Uber drivers can charge less, and still make a good income overall. And they do, which is why Uber remains popular.

missoulamike
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 2:57 am

Gee, electricity to keep your home medical device functioning or a discretionary cab ride are exactly the same…….moron.

Nick Stokes
Reply to  missoulamike
April 18, 2024 3:24 am

But it is Uber that gives the more reliable supply.

strativarius
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 4:27 am

But it is Uber that gives the more reliable supply.

I thought you were against capitalist exploitation and all that nasty stuff, Nick?

UK: Uber drivers win six year battle over workers’ rights in groundbreaking ruling”https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/uk-uber-drivers-win-six-year-battle-over-workers-rights-groundbreaking-ruling

But then again, knowing you’re a big fan of EVs, renewables etc I should have known you’d have a large blind spot where the gig economy is concerned.

oeman50
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 5:49 am

There are many alternatives to Uber: your own car, walking, bicycles, buses, those little electric scooters for rent, catching a ride with your neighbor, or just staying home. When the conditions in winter lead to dunkelflaute and your government mandated heat pump has to go on back-up resistance heating, what are you going to do? Wind and solar are not giving you a reliable supply.

Reply to  oeman50
April 18, 2024 7:26 am

Nick doesn’t care.

MarkH
Reply to  oeman50
April 18, 2024 4:38 pm

All those heat pumps are going to be used as a vast “virtual power plant”… by not just increasing the price of power during high demand, but by flat out shutting down or at the very least throttling your heat pump (and any other high power devices) through your SMART meter, the government will claim that as “virtual” power generation. I doubt Orwell could have thought of such a scheme.

Once they have a taste for this, it will only increase, particularly as they decide to use access to electrical power to enforce compliance with their edicts.

heme212
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 8:01 am

by bringing more generating capacity online

MarkW
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 11:34 am

Don’t you love how Nick re-defines the governments complete and utter failure to provide power all the time, the way it used to, as merely being problems with supply.

Gee, pay 10 times more than you used to pay and you can keep getting power when you need. How f’ing generous of you.

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 3:02 am

Nick, unfortunately electricity is essential, taxis are not. Managing demand by any mechanism is bad for users and society as a whole.
Demand management to protect the grid is fine but the grid was and still should be designed to meet expected loads.

Nick Stokes
Reply to  Steve Richards
April 18, 2024 3:23 am

The issue is price, not availability. At the wholesale level, price is volatile. You pay a middleman to smooth that out for you. But why? When you pay a monthly or quarterly bill, the volatility has gone. What matters is the average.

Here is how that works out with wholesale pricing here:

comment image

SA and Vic are heavily into wind and solar; NSW and Qld still mostly coal. SA and Vic have more volatility, but the average is much less.

That is wholesale, but not so good at retail. The reason is that we pay retailers to absorb that volatility. They do, but charge handsomely for doing so. I have a smart meter and a supplier with variable charging, so I am a little closer to the raw pricing. My bills are less, though I don’t switch off devices. I just accept the average.

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 5:20 am

You are ignoring the actual problem. It doesn’t really matter how the pricing is passed to the consumer, the problem is that the price being passed to the consumer keeps going up as more wind and solar are introduced into the grid and more reliable fossil power is decommissioned.

The basic economics are irrefutable. Wind/solar have higher investment costs and shorter depreciation schedules than fossil power, meaning higher prices are needed to meet capital ROI requirements.

And it’s all being driven by climate models that are inadequate and wrong.

MyUsername
Reply to  Tim Gorman
April 18, 2024 6:01 am

Europe shows this year that renewables drastically lower the wholesale price.

Capacity addition in the west are almost completely renewable by now, after falling battery prices even gas peaker plants are on their way out.

China is building huge amounts of PV and tries to compete with Europe in wind energy – with wind turbines getting closer to 20 MW and ever higher capacity factors.

India is massivly developing its own PV industry.

This has nothing to do with climate models – what the fossil fuel industry tried to prevent for decades has happened in the last three years. Renewables getting too cheap to compete, and Factories for PV in multiple GW scale are build within two years.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 6:13 am

“with wind turbines getting closer to 20 MW”

Would you like one next to YOUR home? Or favorite vacation beach?

MyUsername
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 18, 2024 6:20 am

If I had to choose between a Wind Turbine and this

comment image

I’ll take the turbine

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 7:22 am

What about the dead owls and eagles? I don’t see any here.

MyUsername
Reply to  karlomonte
April 18, 2024 7:34 am

Dead Birds? How about these:

comment image

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 7:36 am

What is that a picture of?

MyUsername
Reply to  michel
April 18, 2024 7:58 am

Oil spill. For those who think only renewables kill birds.

As do cars, windows, pesticides, cats…but strange enough people don’t seem to mind that. Or think that our current system is in absolute harmony with nature if it wasn’t for renewables.

https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/do-wind-turbines-kill-birds

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 8:10 am

Wind turbines can kill large birds (hawks, eagles, owls) – more so than cats which go after mostly sparrows and other common yard birds.

MarkW
Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 11:40 am

Compare the number of birds killed in oils spills over the last 100 years, vs the number of birds killed every year by windmills.
In addition, we need to increase the number of windmills by a factor of over 100 to make sure there is enough power to fill those mythical batteries, in order to ensure that we still have power even when the wind isn’t blowing.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 7:55 am

A depleted oil field? Tell you what, why don’t you go away and come back when you have some details. Here are a few suggestions:

  • area of the field
  • bbls of oil produced
  • field life span

I’m willing to bet that, even including the time for ramp up and decline over its life, that field produced equivalent energy at a higher intensity than any of your vaunted renewables. Moreover, that oil produced could be easily stored and transported, as well as used in the production of thousands of essential products.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 7:21 am

More paid-for gaslighting.

Dave Andrews
Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 8:07 am

You do like making things up don’t you ?

MyUsername
Reply to  Dave Andrews
April 18, 2024 8:15 am

You have no arguments, haven’t you?

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 8:18 am

Europe shows this year that renewables drastically lower the wholesale price.

It definitely doesn’t show any such thing. But if you really want to make that claim, give the evidence.

As for China: show the proportion of energy generation by source. Then we can all see the significance of the amount of wind and solar it is building. None.

MarkW
Reply to  michel
April 18, 2024 11:42 am

It’s what he was told to believe. LooserName is a good little socialist soldier, he never questions what his superiors tell him.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 9:06 am

If renewables are getting so good then why do they need government subsidies?

MarkW
Reply to  MyUsername
April 18, 2024 11:37 am

Is there anything you believe that is actually true?

Reply to  MyUsername
April 19, 2024 1:59 pm

Europe over the last twenty years already proved that renewables vastly increase the price to consumers, even without accounting for the tax increases paid for by those same consumers.

China is building more new coal plants than the entire planet is building PV. The PV is just because there’s a limit to how fast they can build coal.

The demand for wind and solar is driven by government, not markets. Once government handouts expire or change, PV and wind projects get cancelled.

MarkW
Reply to  Tim Gorman
April 18, 2024 11:36 am

Distraction is nit-pick Nicks primary verbal skill.

Dave Andrews
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 8:01 am

“With the shift to renewables comes an end to the highly controllable and dispatchable power generation of the past. Where electricity supply was previously decided by plant managers and dispatch centres, it will increasingly be influenced by weather conditions”

“as the power system becomes increasingly dependent on variable and often distributed renewables, coupled with electrification of transport, heating and industrial processes, including the growth in demand from loads such as data centres, the complexity also increases”

“For now there is no accepted solution for how a low carbon electricity system will address longer periods of low wind speeds and solar irradiation. often coupled with high demand during cold winter spells. Addressing these long term energy deficits would require technologies capable of storing substantial amounts of energy at CONSIDERABLY LOW COST” (Emphasis added)

Wind Europe / Hitachi Energy ‘Maximising the power of wind through grid flexibility’ (2024)

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 8:03 am

No, the issue in the UK (subject of the head post) is not going to be price, but availability.

The problem is that the party almost certain to assume power in November is Labour. They have committed repeatedly to making UK generation Net Zero by 2030. Not that the Conservatives are much better, they have the same goal but for 2035, which is equally crazy.

When all else fails, lets look at the numbers.

Peak demand in the UK is about 45GW. Installed wind is about 29GW, half on- and half off-shore. Say they manage to get 10GW from legacy nuclear, biomass etc, and gas and coal are turned off.

This leaves 35GW to be got from somewhere in December, January and February. Almost every year in these months there is an episode when wind produces about 1% of faceplate for over a week. You are looking to either supply 35GW peak or reduce demand by 35GW peak during this period.

Over time this demand will increase. The move to EVs and heat pumps will double it. Then we have data center and AI use. You have to be able to provide at least 100GW dispatchable by 2035 to keep the UK going.

Aren’t the lows less than 45GW however? Yes, they are around 25GW. It doesn’t really help. You still have to get through 45GW for several hours a day for a week or more and keep the grid in one piece.

The Royal Society looked at this carefully. Their idea of the most practical solution was to excavate and seal 900 caverns and store hydrogen in them. You would then install enough gas generation to supply peak demand and run it during calms. Calms which, as they point out, can be seasonally long (not as low as the winter calms, but far longer in duration).

If this is the most practical solution, you have an insoluble problem.

This is why the current proposal is to limit demand. The UK political class is finally realizing they have a real problem with intermittency and net zero in generation. The idea is one of two things. One would be to raise peak prices high enough to deter us and drop demand by 35GW. How much of a price rise would it take to do that? The advocates never say, but estimates have been made. This is from perplexity.ai:

Specifically, the search results show that in the short-run, the price elasticity of residential electricity demand is around -0.03, meaning a 1% increase in price leads to a 0.03% decrease in consumption3. In the long-run, the price elasticity is estimated to be around -0.43, so a 1% price increase leads to a 0.43% decrease in consumption3

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/price-elasticity-and-qFU0UYrmR3qZO9eCrSa1iQ

You’re a mathematician, figure out how much of a price rise you would need to drop demand by 75% when elasticity is -0.03. Tell us when you’ve figured it out. Several thousand year old math, this one. This is really not much better than the 900 hydrogen caves.

The other thing you can do, which the UK finally seems to be hinting its coming around to, is use the smart meters to reduce demand. Turn off the EV charging and the heat pumps during the calms. But you’ll have to turn off a lot more than that to make the numbers work.

The problem is not pricing. The problem is constant peak demand and intermittent supply. They are frantically trying to find some way of matching the two, but the numbers are so out of sync that its obvious to any observer the only way to do it is to restrict electricity availability to when the wind blows. This is where smart meters in the UK are going.

Its nothing to do with prices. Its to do with producing the massive changes in society and the economy which are required to match demand to intermittent supply, which is the unavoidable consequence of the net zero plans.

And this, notice, is before they move to EVs and heat pumps, which will at least double peak demand. Hopeless.

Nick Stokes
Reply to  michel
April 18, 2024 11:46 am

No, the issue in the UK (subject of the head post) is not going to be price, but availability.”No, the subject of the head post is, per the headline:
“Smart meters could soon cost you a whole lot more”

Writing Observer
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 1:32 pm

A WHOLE lot more. Like your LIFE.

But, of course, that is the goal of the Stokes, the Manns, the Gores of the world. Just enough peasants to continue to make THEIR lives comfortable – the rest can and should be composted.

Reply to  Writing Observer
April 18, 2024 2:01 pm

That’s always been the goal of Malthusian and Eugenic supporters. Everyone else should vacate the earth to benefit the superior, smarter and more deserving populace.

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 19, 2024 12:59 am

Yes, that is the headline. But the underlying UK problem is not pricing. Variable pricing is only a means to an end.

The underlying problem is availability, caused by intermittency of supply from wind generation. The use of smart meters with variable pricing is to try to use pricing to control demand so that it matches availability.

It is, as I pointed out, pretty much hopeless, since the elasticity of demand is so low. You will have to have impossibly high spot pricing in order to lower demand enough to cope with the fluctuations in supply.

The next step, when this finally dawns on the political class in the UK, will be to make smart meters two way, that is, to enable selective disconnects or power use reduction. This has been discussed, but may not be law yet. It will start with heat pumps and EV chargers, but if they persist with net zero in generation, they will have to extend it to almost all demand sources. Or watch the grid fall over. Some sources say its a requirement already – notice ‘adjusting the charging rate’.

An EV home charger installation will require a Wi-Fi connection (or a reliable 4G network, depending on the charger you choose). This allows the charger to connect with a central server, enabling features such as accepting instructions, adjusting the charging rate, and recording energy consumption. This is especially important for smart chargers that have advanced functionalities and can be controlled remotely via a charging app.

https://www.boxt.co.uk/ev-chargers/guides/ev-charger-installation-requirements-what-you-need-to-know

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 19, 2024 1:03 am

And you don’t answer the basic question.

What is the UK to do, one calm, cold, dark late afternoon in January 2035, when demand is 100GW and wind is supplying less than 5% of its 100GW faceplate, and will be for the next week?

Their current answer is, reduce demand. What would you advise?

MarkW
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 11:36 am

Why should Nick care that the plebes are having to pay 10 times as much as they used to, just to keep what they are used to?

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 4:54 am

Nitpick Nick studiously avoids the main issue…

0perator
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 5:10 am

completely detached from reality.

Steve Smith
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 5:25 am

Can you please explain why you imagine a taxi won’t respond during busy times?
That’s when they make their money, a £20 fare is still worth £20 whether its busy or quite.
It’s called making hay while the sunshines.

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 6:08 am

“With Uber, you can, and the drivers make good money.”

I know several Uber drivers and they do NOT make good money.

Nick Stokes
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 18, 2024 11:43 am

I said they get good money during surge pricing.

Drake
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 10:53 am

Until the big CO2 lies, which YOU support, started, the utilities of modern countries just provided sufficient electricity, period.

You leftists have created the self fulfilling prophesy of an “energy” shortage and now wholly support the restriction of power to PEOPLE and industry based on the intermittent nature of unreliables AND the elimination of reliable generation.

As ot your Uber example, totally illogical since there is NO second source in electrical utilities and to have that second source, a homeowner must go through the expense of installing their own back up generation. How does that work for the POOR Nick, you know, those you HATE so much you will happily support policies that will cause them to pick between being excessively hot of cold, depending on the season, and eating?

rhs
Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 18, 2024 8:40 pm

Except when the drivers are expected to earn a higher minimum wage, Uber leaves town, then who meets the demand?
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/03/15/business/uber-lyft-minneapolis-minimum-wage

Reply to  Nick Stokes
April 19, 2024 1:47 pm

The comparison between Uber and taxis makes a perfect analogy, but not for the reason you think. Uber is able to profit specifically because of huge advantages handed by the government – 1) They do not have to follow the same regulations as taxis for safety, maintenance, or level of service. 2) In less busy times, when fares would be lower, Uber does not have to respond at all 3) In most locations Uber does not have to compensate the drivers as employees.

Put Uber under the exact same rules as taxis, and their profit and availability goes away. Exactly like wind and solar projects getting cancelled once the government interference with the market is removed.

strativarius
April 18, 2024 3:03 am

That sounds very much as expected. We haven’t built a reservoir since the 1970s despite the population zooming upward, so why would they bother about providing cheap energy?

With Parliament you get the rhetoric and a complete lack of any action, whether that’s immigration, so-called smart motorways, or any necessary infrastructure. What you do get is forms of emotional identity driven politics. Top of their list is banning things – that’s easy to do, on paper at least.

The beeeeg problem for the industry is smart meters go dumb.

“How to tell if your smart meter is in ‘dumb mode’ as millions warned to act immediately
The total number of smart meters listed as ‘dumb’ was almost 4 million by the end of 2023.”
https://www.express.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/1881707/Smart-meters-gone-dumb

Presumably, a replacement will be necessary? But would it be worth it? 

“They’ve cost £11billion to install – so far – and are supposed to help us save money on our energy bills. But the vastly expensive roll-out of smart energy meters is being described as a ‘waste of money’ – because the equipment will become obsolete. 

Smart meters currently rely on outgoing 2G and 3G mobile signals to operate. But mobile operators plan to pull the plug on them. When they are turned off, the meters will become ‘dumb’ and be no better than the traditional devices they replaced. 

Smart meters cannot handle 4G or 5G communication technology. 
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-10405685/ALL-smart-meters-need-replaced.html

That isn’t even a consideration in Parliament…

22 March 2024
Department for Energy Security(sic) & Net Zero

“…changes reflect the increasingly important role of local coordination in consumer engagement and ensure greater focus is placed on driving consumer acceptance of smart metering over awareness raising.”
https://committees.parliament.uk/publications/44182/documents/219849/default/

We are [Royally] screwed.

Reply to  strativarius
April 18, 2024 3:57 am

greater focus is placed on driving consumer acceptance of smart metering over awareness raising

Does this have some real world meaning (or even a cartoon world meaning)?

My best guess is that is instructions that someone must somehow force “consumers” to accept something that those consumers are becoming more and more aware is a bad deal, that it is not in their interest.

strativarius
Reply to  AndyHce
April 18, 2024 4:11 am

The Parliamentary dictatorship (Est. 1660) has decreed Net Zero is going to happen – by law.

Does that have a real world meaning for you?

Dave Andrews
Reply to  strativarius
April 18, 2024 8:12 am

Royally screwed. That’s a bit unfair, I don’t think we can lay this idiocy at the feet of the monarchy 🙂

strativarius
Reply to  Dave Andrews
April 18, 2024 8:17 am

Rubber stamps come in all shapes and sizes

Reply to  Dave Andrews
April 18, 2024 11:07 am

No. But after generations of in-breeding, Chuckles and his scion likely no longer have feet, but webbed appendages stamped “American Riviera Orchard” (limited edition – get yours for the bargain price of only $100,000 today).

Originally, the spirit of Brexit was in breaking free from the Euroblob. Lately, it seems UK leadership has co-opted Brexit in an attempt to out-green and out-communize the rest of the world. That effort is supported by royalty, so I’d argue that there is an element of royally screwed here.

As in-breeding still, amazingly, has not left the royal family infertile, the poor Brits should be very, very careful about birth control or the intermittent “whomp, whomp, whomp” of turbines will invade every open field in the country, dooming the next generation to the maladies associated with a lack of ability to concentrate or get a good night’s sleep during their early years.

Reply to  Joe Gordon
April 18, 2024 9:34 pm

It occurs to me that a wind turbine operates by extracting energy from the air passing through the turbine’s disk. Therefore, the wind downstream of a wind turbine contains less energy than it did before passing through the wind turbine. Place enough turbines in series and the air eventually contains no energy.

No, no one is stupid enough to line turbines up in series, but if there are enough turbines over the landscape, eventually the energy in that air mass will be significantly depleted.

bobpjones
Reply to  Retired_Engineer_Jim
April 19, 2024 7:07 am

You’re absolutely right. Last year, I was talking to a young man who windsurfed at sea. He said when you are downwind of a turbine, you can feel the pulsing of the wind, as the blade cuts through the air upstream.

When they construct a wind farm, they try to position each turbine, so that it doesn’t interfere with a downstream turbine. But this only effectively works for the predominant wind direction. At some point, the wind will come from, a less beneficial direction, and interference will occur.

Reply to  Dave Andrews
April 18, 2024 11:13 am

Here in the US we have King Jobama and his court of jesters.

Writing Observer
Reply to  Dave Andrews
April 18, 2024 1:34 pm

So long as they go along with it, they are complicit!

Sean2828
April 18, 2024 3:23 am

Surge pricing at the retail level is inevitable. Look at how the wholesale electricity market is structured. When demand exceeds generation, the price rises, sometimes dramatically.

The grid was designed with excess on demand generation capacity to handle this. When that was exceeded, there were large industrial users you could compensate to shut down free up capacity. But those users can tolerate these interruptions only so long and soon they are put out of business or forced to relocate by high operating costs and/or energy prices. When this happens renewable energy advocates and the politicians that support them pat themselves on the back and note how well the transition is going and find they can shut down more dispatchable capacity to be replaced by clean green energy sources. De-industrialization has been cornerstone of successful emissions reduction in the west for the past 2 decades and for most people it was invisible. Of course clean energy proponents don’t consider the emissions of the displaced production.

The automated demand reduction and surge pricing is simply the next phase of the clean energy transition because the tools used to control generation on demand or control large scale consumption have been eliminated. The next phase of the transition won’t be invisible or painless unless you have the wherewithal to purchase significant electricity storage capacity.

observa
April 18, 2024 3:39 am

You’ll just have to do the decolonized math and be happy-
This Is Why Math Literacy is Plummeting In The United States (youtube.com)
When equal happiness doesn’t occur as planned decolonizing smart meter algorithms will follow for the various happiness groupings using the Internet of Your Things

bobpjones
April 18, 2024 5:07 am

As the saying goes, “Less is more”.

The less we use, the more we pay.

observa
Reply to  bobpjones
April 18, 2024 7:13 pm

That’s less for you mass boy and more for the Fearless Leader and Co.

strativarius
April 18, 2024 5:09 am

Story tip – climate change in a single event

“…scientists warned the record-breaking rainfall that has brought the city-state [Dubai] to a standstill was likely to have been “supercharged” by climate change.
More than a year-and-a-half’s worth of rain fell on Dubai in a matter of hours “
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/dubai-airport-floods-rain-climate-change-cloud-seeding-b1152227.html

It’s likely that the storm was kind of supercharged by climate change because there’s just more moisture available in the air for any storm system to then precipitate out,” said Colleen Colja, a climate scientist at Imperial College London.”

Of course it is…

Reply to  strativarius
April 18, 2024 6:15 am

Looks like Dubai will have a nice green spring!

Dave Andrews
Reply to  strativarius
April 18, 2024 8:19 am

In the past meteorologists would have been fascinated by such a rare occurrence and determined to find out what happened and why it happened. Today the the climatistas know the answer before they have even asked the question.

Reply to  strativarius
April 18, 2024 9:37 pm

Yes, just ignore the many cloud-seeding operations that preceded the rains.

April 18, 2024 6:03 am

Nick approves of surge pricing. Other businesses that try to practice surge pricing are said to be gouging and are called all kinds of names.

Reply to  mkelly
April 18, 2024 8:14 am

Good point. The Left has no problem with ‘surge pricing’ to accommodate intermittency, but goes ballistic if the local Home Depot raises prices after a hurricane. The result of the latter action is that hoarding and shortages are commonplace since vendors have no incentive to increase inventory or expedite re-supply.

April 18, 2024 6:21 am

“The days of cheap, reliable energy are over”

If true would result in the decline or collapse of civilization as we know it.

MarkW
Reply to  Ollie
April 18, 2024 11:48 am

That’s been their goal all along.

They believe that they can build a perfect civilization, with themselves in charge, on the rubble.

heme212
April 18, 2024 7:44 am

grid-tie microinverters for the win.

MarkW
Reply to  heme212
April 18, 2024 11:48 am

Still enjoying the subsidies paid for by the rest of us?

heme212
Reply to  MarkW
April 18, 2024 2:12 pm

LOL. I got no subsidies for anything. Totally out of pocket. try again.

April 18, 2024 8:12 am

The only possible solution to intermittency, if you persist in insisting on getting to net zero in electricity generation, is indeed to match demand to the intermittent supply.

The UK political class is finally waking up to this. They are not prepared to abandon net zero, so the only remaining solution is to use smart meters to drop demand as the wind fluctuates.

That will not work either, as we will all find out together. Or rather, it may partially work technically, but socially, economically and politically it will be a total disaster.

https://royalsociety.org/news-resources/projects/low-carbon-energy-programme/large-scale-electricity-storage/

April 18, 2024 8:57 am

This might work if creative people are allowed to fix this problem.
Consider a smart meter, which knows what the power costs at any given moment. You could program things like your drier, heat pump, car charger, etc, to run at the most cost effective times. So, if energy gets real cheap, run the heat pump like mad to heat the house up, heat the hot water, charge the car, etc. Have a big water tank or some other form of heat storage and heat them up when power is cheap.
And, let’s be real. We have at least several hours of lead time, in most cases, to know when there will or not be wind or solar power in abundance. If you programmed your car charger to provide a minimum number of KwH’s to your car each night, the smart meter, using its knowledge of current pricing and with a reasonable forecast for the next 12 hours, could get you the best available deal on power.
Of course, if everybody does this, I suppose the network might collapse as people turn on and off major appliances all at the same time.
But, if govt does not get in the way, this could work. Bit coin miners naturally would be on this like *hit on a stick.

Reply to  joel
April 18, 2024 11:39 am

I’m sure there are ways to work around variable pricing but why should you? Why should you have to do this?

We used to have abundant, reliable and relatively inexpensive electricity available 24 * 7 * 365. Now we need to plan to live like third-world citizens who never know when the power will be on or for how long.

No thanks.

Mr.
Reply to  joel
April 18, 2024 2:08 pm

You do realize that having the ordinary daily course of our lives being constantly at the whim of weather conditions is a situation we overcame a couple of thousand years ago?

So this is where renewables proponents want us and future generations to revert to now?

C’mon man! (as even old Joe would say if he was in a state of awareness)

bobpjones
Reply to  Mr.
April 19, 2024 4:10 am

And they would call it progress. 🤔

Reply to  joel
April 18, 2024 9:40 pm

Yes, and then the grid drains your EV battery to try to maintain frequency and voltage.

April 18, 2024 8:58 am

Here in the US, the state of Missouri now allows surge pricing and rates based on time of day. The utility companies are also using more renewables. I believe it’s an admission they can’t generate enough power to meet demand.

I don’t blame the utility companies, they want to sell power to customers.

Bob
April 18, 2024 2:44 pm

Get the government out of the energy production and transmission business. Government is the problem not the solution. Remove government and our energy issues disappear, it’s as simple as that.

Bob
April 18, 2024 3:38 pm

I caught a guy from the power company replacing my meter with a smart meter. I told him to take the smart meter off and put my old one back on. He said the power company wanted me to have the smart meter. I said I know they do but I don’t want it. He put my old meter back on.

About a month later I got a notice informing me I had to formally request to opt out of the smart meter. I could request an opt out in person or online. I chose online. They sent a three or four page form full of all kinds of gobbledygook, I struggled through it and made my formal request.

About a year later I got another notice informing me that I needed a smart meter, I turned them down again. They sent a follow on telling me how I was going to suffer by refusing their offer, several pages of gobbledygook. I turned them down again.

We’ll see what happens next.

MarkH
April 18, 2024 4:28 pm

“It’s a trap!” – Admiral Akbar

Kieran O'Driscoll
April 18, 2024 9:32 pm

More proof that the politicians are unqualified idiots….

DFJ150
April 19, 2024 8:02 am

Surge pricing to make energy too expensive when you need it most, with probable rolling brownouts and blackouts coming to “save the planet”. Add this to skyrocketing gas and diesel prices, increasingly stringent emissions regulations, upcoming kill switches for all ICE vehicles (will the unaffordable and unreliable EVs get them too?), attempted outlawing of gas stoves and furnaces, cancellation of oil leases and drilling permits, unattainable particulate emission standards for coal fired generating plants, shuttering of nuclear power plants, and the absolutely dismal failure of wind/solar power generation, one gets the idea that TPTB want us broke, immobile, despondent, and entirely dependent on them for even the most basic subsistence. One might even surmise they intend to reduce the number of “useless eaters” consuming the elite’s resources. All the third-world illegals invading the US (and Europe) should feel right at home, as our leaders/rulers/oppressors are using technology, and every method possible, to destroy our culture and reduce our standard of living to one approximating that of the dark ages. On the brighter side, we haven’t had to endure those “mean tweets” for the last 3.5 years (sarc off).

Rational Keith
April 22, 2024 4:44 pm

What is the actual plan?

From that brief article is sounds as though prices will vacillate on short notice, which is not good.

Time-of-day pricing exists in the USofA – ask one Anthony Watts.

In the US, opinions vary as to how much people will shift time of consumption. Some people will carry on as usual and pay the extra cost, but others will cook at different times including preparing much of meals ahead. They may wash clothes and children less often which will have a health impact.

Anti-gas goons will restrict options. Those who can plan ahead or save or borrow might invest in alternative sources – having both electricity and gas, and maybe an electric car to run the laundry. :-o)