Uh Oh – Pachauri caught out in IPCC 2035 glacier melt issue

The London Times is reporting:

“The chairman of the leading climate change watchdog was informed that claims about melting Himalayan glaciers were false before the Copenhagen summit, The Times has learnt.

Rajendra Pachauri was told that the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change assessment that the glaciers would disappear by 2035 was wrong, but he waited two months to correct it. He failed to act despite learning that the claim had been refuted by several leading glaciologists.”

See the Times article here

And from Richard North at The EU Referendum, this video news report link and his commentary:

Less than a week after he claimed the IPCC’s credibility had increased as a result of its handling of the “Glaciergate” scandal, Pachauri’s own personal credibility lies in tatters as The Times accuses him of a direct lie.

This is about when he first became aware of the false claim over the melting glaciers, Pachauri’s version on 22 January being that he had only known about it “for a few days” – i.e., after it had appeared in The Sunday Times.

However, Ben Webster writes that a prominent science journalist, Pallava Bagla – who works for the Science journal (and NDTV as its science correspondent) – claims that last November he had informed Pachauri that Graham Cogley, a professor at Ontario Trent University and a leading glaciologist, had dismissed the 2035 date as being wrong by at least 300 years. Pachauri had replied: “I don’t have anything to add on glaciers.”

Bagla interviewed Dr Pachauri again this week and asked him why he had decided to overlook the error before the Copenhagen summit. In the taped interview, he asked: “I pointed it out [the error] to you in several e-mails, several discussions, yet you decided to overlook it. Was that so that you did not want to destabilise what was happening in Copenhagen?”

Dr Pachauri replied: “Not at all, not at all. As it happens, we were all terribly preoccupied with a lot of events. We were working round the clock with several things that had to be done in Copenhagen. It was only when the story broke, I think in December, we decided to, well, early this month — as a matter of fact, I can give you the exact dates — early in January that we decided to go into it and we moved very fast.”

According to Pachauri, “… within three or four days, we were able to come up with a clear and a very honest and objective assessment of what had happened. So I think this presumption on your part or on the part of any others is totally wrong. We are certainly never — and I can say this categorically — ever going to do anything other than what is truthful and what upholds the veracity of science.”

Without even Bagla’s input, we know this to be lies. Apart from anything else, there was the crisis meeting under the aegis of UNEP – which we reported on Thursday – which concluded that the 2035 claim “does not appear to be based upon any scientific studies and therefore has no foundation”.

Read his complete essay here

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172 thoughts on “Uh Oh – Pachauri caught out in IPCC 2035 glacier melt issue

  1. Here is a great clip from an interview panel featuring Pachauri and the head o the California Air Resources Board (June 2008). It’s quite revealing to weigh Pachauri’s claims and his rhetoric against what has been learned in the past few months. Here’s a sample:

    PACHAURI: “The point is you have a transparent, comprehensive, extremely widespread process involving the best scientists and experts from all over the world telling you that climate change is for real.

    “And this is not something that the authors working on IPCC reports have invented. This is based on peer-reviewed literature. That’s the manner in which the IPCC functions.

    “We don’t pick up a newspaper article and based on that come up with our findings. This is on the basis of very rigorous research which has stood the test of scrutiny through peer reviews.

    URL: http://www.youtube.com/user/ClioSmith#p/a/u/0/ucf3BWLrw3Y

    Cheers,

    Ken in North Dakota

  2. And he called the Indian Scientific position arrogant?
    Certainly no respect or consideration for any organization
    or for anybody. Should be booted out into the alley. The
    front door is too good for him.

  3. “within three or four days, we were able to come up with a clear and a very honest and objective assessment of what had happened”

    Hmm… I heard no mention of Halcrow Consulting anywhere in the ‘honest and objective assessment of what had happened’.

    “The scientist behind the bogus claim in a Nobel Prize-winning UN report that Himalayan glaciers will have melted by 2035 last night admitted it was included purely to put political pressure on world leaders.

    Dr Murari Lal also said he was well aware the statement, in the 2007 report by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), did not rest on peer-reviewed scientific research.”

    From the World Wildlife Fund web site:

    http://www.panda.org/about_our_earth/aboutcc/problems/people_at_risk/personal_stories/about_cw/cwscientists/

    Climate Witness Science Advisory Panel (SAP)

    Prof. Dr Murari Lal, specialises in global and regional climate variability, scenario development, regional environmental change, … ecosystem modeling, regional adaptation & mitigation potential, water resource management; Environment and Carbon Trading Group Halcrow Consulting India Ltd., India

    Did you catch that:

    Carbon Trading is part of the Environment Division, now that is a surprise.

    “Environment and Carbon Trading Group Halcrow Consulting India Ltd., India”
    See also:

    http://www.halcrow.com/html/documents/pdf/india/halcrow_india_environment_brochure.pdf

    From the CRUs own website we know the World Wildlife Fund funds the CRU.
    bottom of this page:

    http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/about/history

    I wonder where a charity gets the money to fund climate research.

    The WWF funds the CRU

    Murari Lal->WWF->CRU
    Murari Lal-> Halcrow Consulting->Carbon Trading

    How about we skip the pawn:

    Carbon Trading-> Halcrow Consulting-> WWF->CRU->IPCC

    Simplifing..

    Carbon Trading->WWF->CRU->IPCC
    Carbon Trading->WWF->IPCC
    Carbon Trading->IPCC

    Carbon Trading->IPCC->Carbon Trading

    or

    Carbon Trading->Pachauri->Carbon Trading

    An employee of a Carbon Trading department, working for the World Wildlife Fund, submitting bogus content to the IPCC, just to scare people into implementing Carbon Trading.

    Does that look like a mistake to you?

  4. Somehow this context reminds me of the wonderful little book, “On Bullshit.” Pachauri appears to be a consummate BS artist. I think what happens to bad BS artists is that they stop believing in their BS, and they are caught, or lose their stomach for it. And what happens to great BS artists is they believe their BS, they run too many absurd bets against reality, and eventually reality calls them on it, and they fail.

    Pachauri’s bet has been called.

    My own bet is, he’s gone in a month. I am torn between wanting to see him gone sooner (so he does less damage) and later (so he twists in the wind, and damages the IPCC brand with his contortions).

  5. Hear no Evil!

    A whimsical look at the Senate reaction to Obama’s claim of “the overwhelming scientific evidence for Climate Change”.

  6. Whether he can hold on to get out AR5 is the least of Dr Pachauri’s problems. As damaged goods, who will want to hire him post-IPCC? For his influence and pull? Will those with grants want to dispense them to any activity which hires him?

  7. I perceive that Pachauri will brass it out until the bitter end. This is actually a blessing in disguise since it will take down the IPCC as well. It will stain the UN also. But it will be hard to see that stain on such an already discolored reputation.

  8. Pachauri keeps hanging himself. All anyone wants fron the UNIPCC is simply transparency, accountability and responsibility. When their climate claims are exaggerated, manipulated and made up then it is unlikely we will get what we want anytime soon.

  9. On the 4th of December, Pachauri put out a statement that included:

    “The entire report writing process of the IPCC is subjected to extensive and repeated review by experts as well as governments. Consequently, there is at every stage full opportunity for experts in the field to draw attention to any piece of literature and its basic findings that would ensure inclusion of a wide range of views. There is, therefore, no possibility of exclusion of any contrarian views, if they have been published in established journals or other publications which are peer reviewed.”

    And:

    “In summary, no individual or small group of scientists is in a position to exclude a peer-reviewed paper from an IPCC assessment. Likewise, individuals and small groups have no ability to emphasize a result that is not consistent with a range of studies, investigations, and approaches. Every layer in the process (including large author teams, extensive review, independent monitoring of review compliance, and plenary approval by governments) plays a major role in keeping IPCC assessments comprehensive, unbiased, open to the identification of new literature, and policy relevant but not policy prescriptive.”

    “No possibility” and “no ability” are emphatic statements. They are falsified by the existence of even a single contray example. So he knew that these statements were false when he issued them.

    Uh oh.

  10. “The chairman of the leading climate change watchdog was informed that claims about melting Himalayan glaciers were false before the Copenhagen summit, The Times has learnt.

    Rajendra Pachauri was told that the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change assessment that the glaciers would disappear by 2035 was wrong, but he waited two months to correct it. He failed to act despite learning that the claim had been refuted by several leading glaciologists.”

    Damning evidence that Pachauri is corrupt — the bigger question — how many other people at the IPCC are equally corrupt and how high and far does it go?

  11. This latest development has to be linked to Pauchauri’s comments in early November when he was challenged on the glacier issue and accused the Indian scientists/government of being arrogant and guilty of voodoo science. It would appear that when he made these serious accusations, he already knew that the IPCC report was wrong and there was no scientific evidence backing up the IPCC glacier claims. Accordingly, it would appear that at the very least he was being disengenuous, if not deceiptful in not answering honestly/truthfully the issues of doubts raised in November. This looks bad for the chairman of a supiosedly independent scientific body.

  12. what a classic response from pachauri!

    Science Mag: Extended Interview:
    Climate Science Leader Rajendra K. Pachauri Confronts the Critics
    Pallava Bagla
    Q: Has all that has happened this winter dented the credibility of IPCC?
    R.K.P.: I don’t think the credibility of the IPCC can be dented. If the IPCC wasn’t there, why would anyone be worried about climate change?

    http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/327/5965/510/DC1

  13. The BBC published these denials by Pachauri on Dec. 5, 2009. Article by above mentioned Bagla. They’ve been sitting out there little noticed all this time. “Himalayan Glaciers Melting Deadline a ‘Mistake’,” by Pallava Bagla in Delhi. Includes Pachauri calling India’s Environment Minister Ramesh’s findings on glaciers “voodoo science”.

  14. Why would Pachauri feel that he could pull this on his own people?
    What am I saying? Gore almost got away with it too…

  15. Ken – that clip is an absolute ‘gotcha.’ Clearly, Pachauri does not feel bound by facts when a good cause is at stake. He needs to go, not only for the credibility of the IPCC, but for the credibility of science.

    The reason that warmists are losing the debate is that they are not arguing on the basis of facts, but choose instead to push implausible propaganda to motivate action. It is a stupid strategy, that has now been found out.

    If leading physical scientists don’t start condemning this use of spin, bullying, and half-truth, large sections of the public may lose faith in science altogether. Not just climate science, but all public science.

  16. We will all miss Rajendra Pachauri when he’s gone.

    Slicker, more polished crooks in high places hope the story will stop there.

    With kind regards,
    Oliver K. Manuel
    Emeritus Professor of
    Nuclear & Space Sciences
    Former NASA PI for Apollo

  17. SlightlyO/T~~ I see that skepticalscience blog has misrepresented skeptics by an order of magnitude. Alarming. It is set up a lot like WUWT? Do you think that might have been intentional? Do you also think the title of the blog is design to catch people who want to learn more about the subject before they get to WUWT? I have been blocked from posting at every alarmist site I have found. Dare I try skepticalscience?

  18. “I did not have sex with that glacier.”
    (I reminded myself of my 1st marriage on that one ;)….

  19. Why does this surprise anybody, this ‘charade’ as it has been exposed?

    It is drawing out now only the *thickest* of low-level trolls who are becoming as ‘thick as fur’ … gone are the days when Joel Shore, noted physicist would debate and argue actual (albeit perhaps obscure, non-essential) technical points, we now have certain ‘thickheads’ who don’t even know the basis (initially counter SM and MM), the beginnings (David Fenton communications), the reason for existence (promote _only_ the AGW viewpoint) of RC (realclimate.org)!!!!

    .
    .

  20. Jones has stood down already (and we’re waiting for the announcement that it’s permanent), Mann is under review, and Pachauri looks doomed. I wonder how this will play out. Will they fall in some sort of rapid succession? How much coverage will their terminations get? Will Mann survive? Quit?

  21. Oh, bother (18:03:33) : “Mr. Railway Engineer, you do know what the light at the end of your tunnel looks like?”

    No, but the higher-ups have selected him to inspect the undercarriage of the train they’re preparing to toss him under.

  22. Cleansing the IPCC of Pachauri no more cleanses the IPCC than firing Phil Jones,Michael Mann, and their ilk, would cleanse the legacy of IPCC ‘science’. The entire administrative edifice of the IPCC should be discarded and replaced with nothing at all. This intergovernmental attempt at supranational administration is revealed to be a failed experiment. The IPCC, from its creation, was an agenda immune to refutation.

  23. We seem to be forgetting that these people are career diplomats/beurocrats. As such their lives revolve around reaching agreements and consensus.
    With that in mind, I contend Pachauri will neither resign nor will he be sacked. What will happen is that he will be PROMOTED within the UN, with the usual accolades and thankyous for his dedication yada yada yada. Don’t be surprised if Yves De Boer isn’t standing beside him at the press conference announcing this. Show of support wink wink

  24. David Ball – Re: Skepticalscience, I post there sometimes, it is a very well run sight, and except for a couple of contributors, most of the regulars seem to be very ernest. I am not a sceptic per se, but a lukewarming fencesitter, so it is nice to be able to get some of my questions answered by both sides in a respectful manner. Try it!

    P.S. I do not post controversial stuff, cuz I am way out of my league, I just ask questions of things that interest/bother me.

  25. Oliver K. Manuel (18:58:46) :

    It didn’t stop with Climategate CRU, so there’s no reason to expect the avalanche crashing down the slope will stop at Pachauri’s office.

    Remember, they round robin-ed their own circle of peer-reviewed trust for years, so now they find themselves shackled together… perched on a precipice.

  26. Jones has stood down already (and we’re waiting for the announcement that it’s permanent), Mann is under review, and Pachauri looks doomed. I wonder how this will play out. Will they fall in some sort of rapid succession? How much coverage will their terminations get? Will Mann survive? Quit?>

    If only it were that simple. The rot goes far beyond the scientists, they are just the front lines. If we were talking about infantry, they would be called “bullet stops”. The roy will protect itself. The scientists will leave one by one, each with a severance package requiring non-disclosure of terms and issues. That protects the scientists because they legaly can’t discuss what happened and why for fear of losing their severence package. It protects the rot higher up because now no one is going to give up their severence package to let the cat out of the bag that they were just producing the results that the higher ups wanted. They’ll quietly find low profile jobs with the assistance of the political hacks they are protecting. The IPCC will get reorganized or dissolved and replaced, with the political hacks who now cannot be implicated still in charge. When a suitable time has passed they quietly resurrect their soldiers with new titles and positions and issues to manipulate the tax payer with.

    I wish it were not so, but I am old enough to be cynical and to have seen history repeat itself.

  27. David Ball (19:06:11) :

    SlightlyO/T~~ I see that skepticalscience blog has misrepresented skeptics by an order of magnitude. Alarming.

    David, most alarming to me is that they would like to literally silence all opposition. The first indignant reaction is always, “blah blan Shouldn’t be allowed!” Stalin would have been proud.

    I have a particularly insightful comment here from over at realclimate:

    ****1. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, all this fixation on get-it-right, got-it-wrong is obscuring the real issue: the truth is what we define it to be, and the truth is that mankind is a scourge on the planet. The sooner we can limit the right to breed, the sooner the planet will recover. If glacier data is a little incorrect but helps that effort, then the data is true in all but a very narrow and clinical scientific sense.

    2. Common people don’t really understand science. But they understand not having enough to eat and not being able to sit down on a too-crowded subway. if we can educate people not to reproduce there will be many seats and the fewer people will be happier. Indeed, as the capitalist economies of scale are reduced, the atisfaction from making your own clothes and embracing a low-carbon vegan diet will be so intense, reproduction will come to be seen in the same category as child abuse.

    I yearn for the day when i might not have been born!***************

    We teachers joke about the weak “Gene Pool” sometimes. But this is proof.

  28. Leo G (19:32:05),

    The fact that an alarmist propaganda blog, which censors uncomfortable skeptics’ posts, calls itself “Skeptical Science,” should make it clear to you that they are starting out with a lie from the get-go.

    Believe their AGW spin if you want to. But I’d hope you would be smarter than that.

    Ask your questions here. You will get much more honest answers.

  29. ClimateGate2009 (18:16:17) : “A whimsical look at the Senate reaction to Obama’s claim of “the overwhelming scientific evidence for Climate Change”.”

    The full quote that the Demmunists are snickering at is something like: “Did you know that there are actually people who deny the overwhelming scientific evidence for climate change?”

    Imagine that.

  30. “The chairman of the leading climate change watchdog was

    informed that claims about melting Himalayan glaciers were false before the Copenhagen summit, [mid December] The Times has learnt.”

    “”I became aware of this when it was reported in the media about ten days ago.””

    I once said on WUWT that Pachauri should resign. I have since then changed my mind because I think he has become our best ally. :o)

  31. Quote: bateman (19:33:23) :

    “It didn’t stop with Climategate CRU, so there’s no reason to expect the avalanche crashing down the slope will stop at Pachauri’s office.

    Remember, they round robin-ed their own circle of peer-reviewed trust for years, so now they find themselves shackled together… perched on a precipice.”

    Exactly! I have observed and could name members of the round robin-ed circle of peer-reviewed trust for space sciences since the early 1960s.

    But I was more disturbed when the Climategate scandal exposed these scientists and the UN’s IPCC as part of an unholy international alliance of politicians, scientists, news media and publishers that have used science as a propaganda tool to try to control the world.

    That is frightening! In the best of circumstances, self-governance may work if the people have reliable information.

    What’s how it looks from the “Show-Me” state,
    Oliver K. Manuel

  32. Smokey (19:56:30) :
    Smokey (19:56:30) :
    Leo G (19:32:05),

    Ask your questions here. You will get much more honest answers.

    Ask at both sites, and compare your answers.

  33. Where is Al Gore these days?

    I think he’s over at Sherwin-Williams trying to develop a new white wash.

  34. davidmhoffer (19:45:25) :

    If only it were that simple. The rot goes far beyond the scientists, they are just the front lines. If we were talking about infantry, they would be called “bullet stops”. The rot will protect itself.

    The rot will try to protect itself; that’s what this whole thing has always been about. Depending on how this plays out, AGW could become a textbook case in how scientists can go bad. Scientists are highly egotistical and many of them do not take criticism well. Even though this is contrary to the principles of science, it is not contrary to the principles of psychology — it is typical human nature.

    The whole thing is nothing more than a classic case of abuse of power by pusillanimous people.

    And now the whole thing is collapsing.

    Popcorn?

  35. “Jimbo (19:46:23) :
    OT – Question Where is Al Gore these days?”

    And how about our friends Joel Shore, Tom P et al.?

  36. Hello,….. Policitians, Main Stream Media, Wake up. How long are you going to have your head stuck on stupid? Parliament is not in session and you cannot learn anything while your typing drivel. Maybe spend some time on the internet and search climategate, IPCC AR4 bogus, scandals at the CRU, NASA and Penn State. You will be very surprised to learn a lot of things have happen since your went and Rip Van Winkled on us. IPCC AR4 is a fraud and all the scientists involved in this have their reputations and credibility in disrepute. You will now realize there is something important to write. Like, Why are we on the doorstep of signing legally binding legislation based on a false report. You could also ask the politicians why they Rip Van Winkled.

    Hello, are you still sleeping….Wake up and get your head out of stupid.

  37. They call him Pants-down Pachy round here
    The time is not now – but its near
    When quizzed about ice
    He replied in a trice
    “I’ve been cate-gore-ickly clear”

  38. That is frightening! In the best of circumstances, self-governance may work if the people have reliable information>

    In primitive tribes, the fiercist warrior held the power to make group decisions. The smartest guy in the tribe became the shaman. He could challenge the chief with impunity by consulting the spirits (which of course only he could do) so that it was them that disagreed with the chief, not the shaman. If he was clever, he could control the chief while leaving him in charge. In human history, the chief was displaced by government, the shaman by the priesthood. Now they were both organized. But power and knowledge became synonymous and both built libraries. Power belonged to those who could assemble the most knowledge and apply it which was a labour intensive process involving many scribes. The printing press destroyed all that, driving the cost of a printed record down to the point where educational institutes and corporations could assemble knowledge that rivaled that of governments and priesthoods. At each of these stages in our history, the same tools were used to promote misinformation and control the masses as they were to document fact and prove it.

    The internet is the last chapter in this progression, with the collective knowledge of humanity available to anyone who takes the time to research and comprehend. Those who wish to control others disseminate misinformation via the internet too, but they can be confronted en masse by the common man, and alliances can spring up on a moments notice involving millions of people who can make their own analysis and communicate it with a single voice.

    The power of the government and the priesthood to control the common man by speaking for the spirits, or propogating falshoods to foster hatred and justify a war while the truth of matters is locked in records to which the pulic has no access. I fear not the machinations of the IPCC and their ilk to control my life because the information to expose them and the medium to express it is so available. I always knew they would lose this one.

    But the watcword is vigilence. Albert Einstein said he did not know what wespons world war III would be fought with, but that world war iv would be fought with sticks and stones. He may have been wrong. World war III is being fought as we speak, but the weapon is information. Organized government recruited and built its own special priesthood, which will be defeated by the common man with nothing more than a keboard and an ethernet cable.

    The shaman’s mistake was inventing writing. My regrets to the many femaile posters here, I’m just to sleepy to word this to be more inclusive, but rest assured I mean all of us.

  39. So long, Choo Choo

    You gonna get back into the failed solar panel business that you had in Europe?

    You could never find an “angle” to make people want to buy solar panels because they weren’t worth the money – you figured the only way to get people to buy solar panels, was to have the Government FORCE people to buy solar panels

    You figured wrong, Choo Choo

  40. O/T but perhaps informative:

    This will all definitely end up in court.

    This might also help to explain the position of the BBC, the Environment Agency, other Government and some Universities.

    http://www.iigcc.org/index.aspx

    “The Institutional Investors Group on Climate Change (IIGCC) is a forum for collaboration on climate change for European investors. The group’s objective is to catalyse greater investment in a low carbon economy by bringing investors together to use their collective influence with companies, policymakers and investors. The group currently has over 50 members, including some of the largest pension funds and asset managers in Europe, and represents assets of around €4trillion. A full list of members is available on the membership page”.

    Did you catch that: FIVE AND A HALF TRILLION DOLLARS!!!!

    These guys are in this [expletive deleted] deep, and many may stand to loose their pensions, and some churches other than the ‘Church of AGW’ may also loose their robes. It is going to be a mess. It will definitely end up in court.

    http://www.iigcc.org/membership.aspx

    Members of the IIGCC include [I trimmed the list a bit]:

    Baptist Union of Great Britain
    BBC Pension Trust
    Bedfordshire Pension Fund
    BT Pension Scheme
    Central Finance Board of the Methodist Church
    Corporation of London Pension Fund
    Environment Agency Pension Fund
    Greater Manchester Pension Fund
    Kent County Council
    London Borough of Hounslow Pension Fund
    London Borough of Islington Pension Fund
    London Borough of Newham Pension Fund
    London Pensions Fund Authority
    Merseyside Pension Fund
    Roman Catholic Diocese of Plymouth
    Roman Catholic Diocese of Salford
    South Yorkshire Pensions Authority
    The Church Commissioners for England
    The Church in Wales
    The Roman Catholic Diocese of Portsmouth
    United Reform Church
    Universities Superannuation Scheme
    West Midlands Metropolitan Authorities Pension Fund
    West Yorkshire Pension Fund

  41. Just a crazy thought for the US readers here. The US constitution requires a separation between church and state. Specifically it states the US government shall not establish a state religion.

    Environmentalism in general (endangered species, zero threshold tolerance for all toxins) and anthropogenic global warming specifically (we are all going to die unless we live in mud huts again) meets all of the qualifications describing a religion. The proponents are immune to logic and prosecute their non-scientific beliefs with religious zealotry. They have insinuated themselves into government and are making their personal faith the official US national religion.

    I wonder if there is a constitutional challenge or remedy to reverse this religious takeover? Otherwise these religious environmental mullahs will ruin this country.

    Fraudulent science was used to buttress the AGW premise and it was found out thanks to WUWT and others. I wonder how much fraudulent science is being used to stand-up the other enviro-green arguments. I think it may be a rich mother-lode for others to mine. These may be easier to topple than AGW was.

    We never voted for these religious environmental mullahs. We never had a choice.

    Mariss

  42. Did we transit in Bizzaro World when the sun went blank for the last two years? You could hold a black card in front of their faces and they would still claim it is white… unbelievable!

  43. Can we have those Indian journalists come here to the U.S.? It seems like they actually do their jobs, ask questions, consider all sides, realize BS when they hear it and report the truth.

    Most of our media? Not so much.

  44. This presumes that he actually believed the story in the first place. Please. This is simple foolishness. Like predicting the Greenland Northern ice table will melt in 10 years. Fantasy. Bogus physics. It is a con. He was in for the money. Think craps table.

  45. Oh, bother (18:03:33) :

    “Mr. Railway Engineer, you do know what the light at the end of your tunnel looks like?”

    I’m picturing Wile E. Coyote slowing turning to look at the camera…

  46. Kate (19:50:45) : Is there such a term as speciesist? The self loathing is shocking, only exceeded by the dangerous line of thinking in “the common people” view. This man need also to experience a subsistance level lifestyle for a year or so. Yes we have issues to sort out. There have been improvements which are being ignored and downplayed. But to view civilization as a curse (which Hansen has said recently, n’est pas?), saddens me tremendously.

  47. @ davidmhoffer
    Your post immediatley above is very moving and inspirational! I think all of us here are very conscious that we are witnessing – partaking in – a very important moment in the human story.

    I can’t contribute to the science but I’m doing my best instead to disseminate the facts and to bring this site and a couple of others inc CA to the attention of as many people as possible, so to assist the collective effort in another way.

    Thank you Anthony for having persevered, and for providing this extraordinary ‘environment’ in which the truth can seed, grow, and take wings. I don’t have children, but those who do will be forever in debt to you and those like you who’ve fought the good fight.

  48. Someone above asked where Al Gore is. I wondered, too, because I thought maybe he finally found some dignity somewhere to stop this nonsense. But no!

    He’s busy right this moment pushing this climate hysteria as religion. See my post and click links (the religion post on his site is dated 1/22/10). Gore – with Yale University, of all places, and churches – is desperately working to indoctrinate people, complete with prayer, in climate change.

    http://aprilbaby.typepad.com/a_california_life/2010/01/new-religion-climate-change.html

    I think everyone probably already knows about his company Silver Springs, which will provide software and meters to monitor our carbon usage.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/03/business/energy-environment/03gore.html?_r=2

    Not only is that Orwellian and creepy, but he’s going to make millions, billions… No wonder he’s cramming this crap through as religion. He wants his damn money and he wants it now!

    O/T, but interesting – I heard a caller on a radio today say that she had to go to defend her child in school against a principle, teacher and union member because her son failed a state mandated test. Why did he fail?

    He didn’t believe in global warming. He got a 0.

    One last thought, why can a person – like I heard on the news the other day – go away to prison for stealing a trench coat, but Gore is involved in deceiving everyone on the planet for his own gain – yet he’s not locked up?

  49. What if Pachuri is only a front man — for bigger fish pulling the strings…

    And now that AGW is crashing down — he’s the designated fall guy — not that he isn’t guilty, mind you, just that he isn’t alone…

  50. As of my writing foxnews.com is now carrying this story on top of their home page, left column.
    The headline in the graphic that has a photo of Mr. P. sez:
    ”Before Copenhagen, Climate Chief…
    KNEW OF ERRORS”.

    When you click on the photo at foxnews, the underlying piece links to the same Times Online article as this thread start.
    AND:
    If you click on the foxnews link UNDER the graphic that sez:
    ”U.N.’s Global Warming Report Under Fresh Attack for Rainforest Claims”,
    they have a piece that is IMO a good summary of Amazon-Gate.

    Attaboy, FoxNews. . . . :-]
    CNN ?? . . . Nowhere that I can see. . . .

  51. Someone floated the idea on another blog yesterday that Pachauri had been put in place by the Bush admin with the express purpose of discrediting AGW/climate change and bringing the whole shebang into disrepute, but I find that a little farfetched esp as they might well have got away with the scam without CRU/Climategate.

    But in the Alice in Wonderland world of climate change, who can rule out any scenario?

  52. Michele (22:45:38) : “He didn’t believe in global warming. He got a 0.”

    Would that be “anthropogenic global warming” he got a 0 for? He should believe in “global warming” since that is happening, slightly..
    If schools are pushing alarmist crap the schools and names of the teachers should be published.

  53. Andrew30 (18:07:17) :

    Damn good points Andrew….. Pachauri’s goose is cooked. That’s ironic considering he’s a vegetarian an’ all;-)

  54. Screwing these warmist Watermelon types is getting to be more and more a necrophilic perversion.

    I expect soon that they’ve have lost even the ability to flinch when you stick it in ‘em.

  55. I think that this dead man will be walking for a lot of extra time.

    The surprise that he knew it for two months is ludicrous. This chap has surely known that he’s been lying about all important things at least since 2002 and probably much longer than that.

  56. jaymam (23:16:34) : “He should believe in ‘global warming’ since that is happening, slightly”

    Apart from the fact that “believe in” is an inappropriate terminology in this context… doesn’t the truth of “global warming is happening” depend on the time scale you are referring to, and the integrity and accuracy and adequacy (all of which are questionable at this stage of our knowledge) of the data you base your opinion on?

  57. Andrew30 above discusses the Institutional Investors Group on Climate Change (IIGCC), which “represents assets of around €4trillion” and includes a whopping number of prominenten in the U.K., both social and governmental.

    I’ve got to figure that there are similar critters, institutions, and aggregates who are stuck deeply into this same humongous fiscal Tar Baby in these United States, and there are foxes and bears a-plenty slavering to rend their flesh.

    One of the principles of economics is that malinvestments must be liquidated. The financial slight-of-hand types who inflated the residential housing bubble in America and made it “the way to promotion and pay” had long known that it was soon coming to a pop, and obviously they’d been manipulating the “global warming” fraud as a vehicle through which they could fasten their fangs at another point upon the body politic’s jugular vein.

    Those who took their counsel and followed these “master of back-stabbing, cork-screwing, and dirty dealing” types into positions in this castle-in-the-clouds environment are now hearing the gurgle-gurgle of flowing currency circling the drain.

    Look forward to another “stimulus package” from Barry Soetoro and his little ACORN elves as the politically connected swashbucklers on Wall Street squeal (again) for rescue.

  58. Where are Joel Shore and Scott Mania when we need them? They made a high quality counter point to the rest of us-including me-singing from the same song sheet.

    Are they embarassed at the recent deluge of information which seems to point out their position was based on incorrect information? Or did they merely become exasperated at being the lone voices. Debate is good. Come back Joel and Scott-all is forgiven.

    Tonyb

  59. davidmhoffer (19:45:25) :

    erm, yes. I think that’s what happened to the excellent German scientists after WWII. Reformed into NASA or the like. And your spelling was not a mistake. “Roy” means “royalty” after all :)

  60. Each one of them will stay completely incapable to admit an error until they’re thrown under the bus. Ignorance was their recipe to success, ignorance will bring them down.

    Loot at Gore. He learned that when you don’t know the answer to a question, just invent one that suits your needs and try to get away with it. Asked about the temperature of the earth’s core, he hesitates, then laughs nervously and says millions of degrees. Pachauri is exactly like that.

    They make their answers up as they go. Pachauri, Gore and the entirety of The Team make up their answers as they go. It’s an entire culture of con artists.

  61. tokyoboy (22:17:26) :

    In the thread title, “Pachuri” should read “Pachauri”.
    Anyone has noted already?

    No. MOD!!

    [Thanks, fixed. ~dbs]

    Oh, bother (18:03:33) :

    “Mr. Railway Engineer, you do know what the light at the end of your tunnel looks like?”

    Jus’ followin’ the tracks.

    James F. Evans (18:39:35) :

    Damning evidence that Pachauri is corrupt — the bigger question — how many other people at the IPCC are equally corrupt and how high and far does it go?

    rbateman (19:33:23) :

    It didn’t stop with Climategate CRU, so there’s no reason to expect the avalanche crashing down the slope will stop at Pachauri’s office.

    Remember, they round robin-ed their own circle of peer-reviewed trust for years, so now they find themselves shackled together… perched on a precipice.

    Dr. Lal is next up. He’s more important, because he’s been involved longer (20 years) and more deeply with the IPCC’s internals than Pachauri. (The heads of organizations and foundations are often chosen to interface with the outside world rather than manage the entity itself.)

    I hope the Daily Mail has got Lal on tape, and that Kaser can and will produce a copy of the letter he sent Lal, and that it includes Lal’s address. If so, then he’ll be “pinned and added to our collection,” as Sherlock Holmes once said.

  62. “DirkH (00:46:20) :
    […]
    They make their answers up as they go. Pachauri, Gore and the entirety of The Team make up their answers as they go. It’s an entire culture of con artists.”

    …look at this explanation by Vicky Pope about how the long term projections by the Met Office are made and how reliable they are. Start watching at 0:55. She says they made 400 models, “representing all that we know about the uncertainty of the science in our models”.

    Wait. They can cover all parameter permutations of the things they don’t know and thus have to parameterize to run a model at all with 400 runs? No.

    Again, this is making up an answer and trying to get away with it, a bald faced lie. They made 400 models because that was the maximum number they could run in the timeframe given. The entire philosophy of climate “science” is: when we can deceive 85% of the population, that’s more than enough in a democracy. It’s not even an attempt at believable propaganda. It’s incompetence and confidence tricks wherever you look.

  63. Chili palmer (18:52:49)

    I notice NOW the BBC report of Dec. 5. 2009 that you have highlighted was inconspicuously hidden away in the South Asia section of the BBC site, not exactly somewhere I would normally read, very convenient if the BBC didn’t want to rock the boat 2 days before Copenhagen.

    Well worth the read thanks.

  64. Something that should not be overlooked here, with regard to the bigger picture, is that this is yet another ‘sceptical’ article in the London Times. The two left-leaning UK papers, The Guardian and the Independent will never express scepticism over AGW because to them Man-made Global Warming is short for Western Capitalist Man-made Global Warming and to question that would be to question their whole raison d’être.

    However, the centre/right-wing press is becoming much more outspoken (and, if you ever read the comments on an AGW article in them, with justification if they want to keep their readership).

    What with the Climategate enquiry, the Parliamentary investigation, the Lawson think-tank being set up, and the upcoming election, amongst other things, it does look like the UK is going to be the major battleground over AGW in the coming months. The ongoing very cold winter is also helping the sceptics’ cause. At the moment, the momentum is all with the sceptical side thankfully.

  65. I agree with I once said on WUWT that Pachauri should resign. I have since then changed my mind because I think he has become our best ally. :o)

    I agree. It’s Machiavellian, but the longer Pachauri and his followers try to defend the IPCC the more opportunities there will be to get the media on our side and expose the IPCC’s political agenda and corrupted science (and the problems with CRU, GISS and USHCN etc.). The reality is that while we are winning the scientific arguments, the media are only just beginning to take an interest , and there are still many people and politicians who are convinced the planet is heading for catastrophic warming as a result of our CO2 emissions, who will not willingly divest their personal and financial commitments to AGW. Much depends on the course taken by the mainstream media; will they let their love of scare stories (like the Himalayan glaciers disappearing by 2035 – which perfectly demonstrates their scientific illiteracy and gullibilty) get in the way of proper investigation of what is arguably the largest scientific scandal in history? Having seen how the MSM failed to question or take any interest in the many holes in the offical 9/11story, and then lapped up the illegal war in Iraq, I am not too optimistic that we can rely on them too much. The BBC had the bones of the glaciergate story on December 5th – but buried it on the south-asia section of their website. Likewise the CRU emails and code, which they sat on for weeks, and then, even after it went viral on the web, they chose to ignore and play down, apart from an odd 5 minute report on Newsnight. It seems that Andrew Neil and Stephen Sackur are the journalists in the BBC with any credibilty. This is going to be a long battle, and I fear it may well take a few more long cold winters in the NH to get the idiots in Washington, NYC, London and Berlin to see the light. Looking at the geo-politics of AGW, there is no way that the Russians and Chinese will go along with significant CO2 emission reductions, as their economies are too dependent on fossil fuels and economic development. The question is whether they will be happy to watch the west waste money and resources on pointless AGW mitigation policies. In the cold war, this would have been the obvious course of action for them. But now with a global economy, and so much Chinese investment in the USA (and UK), they will hopefully want to see some return (or at least get the interest payments back), which is much more likely if we have functioning economies, where we burn coal and oil for heat and energy, rather than fanny about trying to capture the CO2 in it. So the Chinese and Russians are going to be key players (and allies) in the political battle to overthrow the AGW alarmists. (And I have no problem with that, the planet’s too small for us all not work together).

    Sorry, that was meant to be a short comment, but its Saturday morning and freezing outisde.

  66. >>The BBC published these denials by Pachauri on Dec. 5,
    >>2009. Article by above mentioned Bagla.

    The BBC does this all the time. It hides things on its website, and does not mention them on the TV. That way, the BBC hides the truth but cannot so easily be accused of bias.

    The BBC needs putting out to grass – or perhaps putting down. It is past its sell-by date.

    .

  67. The Times link is incomplete, here is the full one: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article7009081.ece

    Pachauri already has his next career move sorted. He is going to be a writer of fiction and his first book is already out. Easy transition. It amazes me how one man can be on so many dfferent boards and panels, he must have written this whilst flying around the world to save the planet.

    http://www.flipkart.com/return-almora-r-k-pachauri/8129115743-ru23fe1npf

    In his own words:

    http://blog.rkpachauri.org/blog/12/1231737875.htm

    “The major financial scandal that one of the largest IT companies in India, Satyam Computer Services Limited, has been involved in has shaken the confidence of the public, of the government and the corporate sector in general across India. Given the size and scale of this major fraud, there would also be several organizations across the world that would also be affected profoundly by this development particularly those that have had dealings with Satyam.

    Cases of corporate misdemeanor and fraudulent and unethical acts by top management appear to have become widespread in recent years, and this at a time when the social, environmental and governance challenges facing human society require a high sense of corporate social responsibility and ethics in corporate organizations!

    (his exclamation mark)

    I am seriously considering the launch of a global movement called Forum for Revival of Ethics & Ecosystems for and by Youth (FREE Youth). Would those who read this blog care to provide any reactions? “

  68. vibenna (18:55:38) :

    “If leading physical scientists don’t start condemning this use of spin, bullying, and half-truth, large sections of the public may lose faith in science altogether. Not just climate science, but all public science.”

    It appears that the era of men and woman with integrity has passed. Science, money and politics are so interconnected; it is actually – Politics – money – science. “Here are the answers, here’s the money – find us the questions.” Loose faith! – It would take a reformation complete with “the inquisition” (not quite – but close) to restore mine.

  69. What’s that you say?

    The outstandingly respectable Dr P deliberately making a false statement (or two)?

    Getting EU research money after he knew his data was wrong?

    Shurely Shome Mistake?

  70. “Ralph (01:31:17) :

    >>The BBC published these denials by Pachauri on Dec. 5,
    >>2009. Article by above mentioned Bagla.

    The BBC does this all the time. It hides things on its website, and does not mention them on the TV. That way, the BBC hides the truth but cannot so easily be accused of bias.

    Not entirely fair! i read the mentioned article on Dec 06th – it was linked to on the South Asia section of the news that day. As i’m interested in what happens in India, Pakistan etc i check that page regularly, and there it was. Granted, it should also have been linked in Science/Environment which it wasn’t.

  71. This was written before Copenhagen:

  72. “Ralph (01:31:17) :
    […]
    The BBC does this all the time. It hides things on its website,”

    Oh, sorry, i misunderstood you. By “hiding” you mean it’s only on the website, not on TV. First i understood you thougt the web article was “hidden” so that nobody would really find it. Sorry.

    Sometimes it’s difficult for me to understand the way TV viewers process information. It’s been such a long time now i last used TV news.

  73. I am am just repeating another blogger – but can’t resist

    Calling Joel Shore – Calling Joel Shore – Calling Joel Shore –

    Where are you we need you for balance!!!!

    Sorry – just could not help myself.!!!

  74. Richard North is doing a superb job in exposing Pachuari and the IPCC for what they are.

    He should be Knighted for ‘services to realism”.

    Thank you Richard. Please keep up the great work.

  75. I clicked on the Speakers Bureau ad just for fun. Pachauri is top of the environment list here, some other noteworthy names there as well, including Crispin Tickell, Maurice Strong and intrepid explorer Penn Hadow:

    http://londonspeakerbureau.co.uk/Science_Environment_Speakers.aspx

    “Many international figures such as former US president Bill Clinton, his vice-
    president Al Gore, former UK prime minister Tony Blair and the last head of
    former USSR Mikhail Gorbachev earn anywhere between $200,000 and
    $400,000 by speaking at international events and seminars.”

    You can hire Al Gore here: http://www.harrywalker.com/speaker/Al-Gore.cfm?Spea_ID=649

  76. ” James F. Evans (22:49:43) :
    What if Pachuri is only a front man — for bigger fish pulling the strings…”

    In German the saying goes: ‘The fish starts to stink at the head’.

    So you would have to wonder what body part Pachauri is. And who is the head.

  77. DirkH (01:55:53) :

    “Ralph (01:31:17) :
    […]
    The BBC does this all the time. It hides things on its website,”

    Oh, sorry, i misunderstood you. By “hiding” you mean it’s only on the website, not on TV. First i understood you thougt the web article was “hidden” so that nobody would really find it. Sorry.

    The BBC’s website is so extensive that unless a story is linked from the front page or a regional front page, or for example the Science/Environment section, it is effectively hidden. I came across the BBC’s Himalaya Glacier pages –

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8355837.stm Himalayan glaciers’ ‘mixed picture’ (December 1st)

    and then: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/8387737.stm
    (Himalayan glaciers melting deadline ‘a mistake’ Dec 5th)

    back in December, totally by accident, while looking for something else. And I suspect that both the pages were put on by the South-Asia editor, without approval from the BBC’s Politbureau / ‘Policy Unit’ in London. They certainly weren’t picked up by any UK BBC staff anyway.

    Right, must go out, the sun has now finally risen over the distillery roof, so it might just be above freezing.

  78. Money laundering the Russian way?

    If you want to broaden the scope a little, try these emails. They are only part quoted and there is a chance that I have missed some continuity; but it sure looks fishy to me. (Some email parts have been deleted for brevity, without changing the meaning)
    ………………….
    From: “Tatiana M. Dedkova”
    To: K.Briffa@uea.ac.uk
    Subject: schijatov
    Date: Thu, 7 Mar 96 09:41:07 +0500
    Dear Keith, March 6, 1996
    I and Valery Mazepa were in Krasnoyarsk during one month and
    together with E.Vaganov wrote the manuscript of book “Dendroclimatic
    Studies in the Ural-Siberian Subarctic”. The problem now is to find
    money for its publication. If we find enough money soon (20 million roubles), the book will be published this autumn. We analysed 61 mean ring-width and 6 cell chronologies which we intend to publish in form of tables in the Appendix. We can send to you all raw measurements which were used for developing these chronologies.

    Also, it is important for us if you can transfer the ADVANCE money on the personal accounts which we gave you earlier
    and the sum for one occasion transfer (for example, during one day) will not be more than 10,000 USD. Only in this case we can avoid big taxes and use money for our work as much as possible. Please, inform us what kind of documents and financial reports we must represent you and your administration for these money.

    ……………………………………………….

    From: “Isaak M. Khalatnikov”
    To: k.briffa@uea.ac.uk
    Subject: Keith Briffa
    Date: Tue, 10 Jun 97 07:18:26 +0400 (MSD)

    Dear Keith,

    Thank you for the message of 5 June, 1997.

    I am anderstanding your difficulties with transfering money and I
    think the best way for us if you will bring money to Krasnoyarsk
    and I give you a receipt.

    Rashit will go to Yamal at the end of June and I go to the Polar
    Urals at the beginnind of July. We can find money temporary at our Institute and other sources for three months to fulfill our fieldworks.

    Sincerely yours Stepan Shiyatov
    ………………………………………….

    From: Keith Briffa
    To: evag@ifor.krasnoyarsk.su
    Subject: transfer
    Date: Wed Nov 18 11:04:42 1998
    Cc: stepan@ipae.uran.ru

    Eugene
    I am told that the money transfer ( 5000 u.s. dollars) should have gone to the bank account you stated. Please let me know if this is received by you. I am also sending Stepan’s 5000 dollars to Switzerland now to be carried back by his colleague.
    best wishes
    Keith
    ……………………………..

  79. From Richard North’s site I noticed this dated 29th Jan so I await the full report with interest

    As it stands, therefore, the British government (i.e., British taxpayers) shelled out £315,277 to disprove Hasnain’s claims. But, when WG II of the IPCC came to consider the issue of melting glaciers – funded by British taxpayers to the tune of £1,436,162 – it ignored the Sagarmatha report (which had also been written up in a per-reviewed journal) and went with Hasnain’s not only baseless but also discredited claim.

    The background to this, and subsequent developments, are now the subject of an ongoing investigation by The Sunday Times, the results of which will be published this weekend.

  80. Mpaul@634,

    of course what the guy is saying is absolutely correct, no one scientist or group can keep peer reviewed papers out of the IPCC. However what the moron has side stepped is the very fact that individual scientists and groups HAVE conspired to keep papers that go against Mann made global warming ™ from being peer reviewed in scientific publications and to keep those papers from being published, which in effect means they can be ignored by the IPCC.

    Unless of course that paper is from the wwf et al.

    Regards

    Mailman

  81. “The chairman of the leading climate change watchdog was informed that claims about melting Himalayan glaciers were false before the Copenhagen summit…”

    I suspect that Pachauri knew long before Dec 09.

  82. OT, but here in Australia, the media are on an all-out scare campaign. Stranded walruses a scare website is http://www.100places.com and it appears to be in German, ice meting, the same old adverst on TV with black carbon balLOONs escaping up into the sky etc.

    And in February, the Govn’t tries to sell an ETS to the Senate.

    Icing on the cake tonight; Doom gloom movie “The Core”.

  83. Talk about condemned out of his own mouth-

    from pat(18:49:17)
    Quote from Pachauri

    “If the IPCC wasn’t there, why would anyone be worried about climate change?”

    Indeed, why would they?

  84. When did Pachauri Know?

    We know he knew in Dec ‘09, but he first said he knew in January ‘10.
    However when he knew we knew he knew in Dec ’09, he said he did know but he was too busy. I reckon he knew before we knew he knew but he knows that we don’t know that for sure!

  85. Andrew30, wow stunning find; the BBC and a great deal of local authority pensions depend on AGW that explains everything!

    Sooner this comes crumbling down the better, if I was told my pension was fragged because of this I might break out the pitchfork and go for the people who instigated this dodgy investment plan.

  86. @David Ball (19:06:11) :

    “SlightlyO/T~~ I see that skepticalscience blog has misrepresented skeptics by an order of magnitude. Alarming. It is set up a lot like WUWT? Do you think that might have been intentional? Do you also think the title of the blog is design to catch people who want to learn more about the subject before they get to WUWT? I have been blocked from posting at every alarmist site I have found. Dare I try skepticalscience?”

    Sure, give it a try, but keep it academic and polite. A little circularity may help your post get past the moderators. At the very least you’ll create some extra work for their censors. skepticalscience is run by an Aussie. Usually those guys tend to be rather cool headed, but realize that right now Australia is in the midst of their summer heat. I’m not surprised that you’ve been blocked at numerous alarmist sites, since blocking dissenting views is the hallmark of propagandist sites that have an agenda, have an aversion to debate and don’t give a **** about the truth.

  87. Andrew30 (18:07:17) :
    “…within three or four days, we were able to come up with a clear and a very honest and objective assessment of what had happened”

    Hmm… I heard no mention of Halcrow Consulting anywhere in the ‘honest and objective assessment of what had happened’.,,”

    Roger Knights (00:59:47) :
    “…Dr. Lal is next up. He’s more important, because he’s been involved longer (20 years) and more deeply with the IPCC’s internals than Pachauri. (The heads of organizations and foundations are often chosen to interface with the outside world rather than manage the entity itself.)

    I hope the Daily Mail has got Lal on tape, and that Kaser can and will produce a copy of the letter he sent Lal, and that it includes Lal’s address. If so, then he’ll be “pinned and added to our collection,” as Sherlock Holmes once said.”

    Your both right I think, Dr, Lal will be sure to get the chop as well. I was amazed to hear his confession of guilt in the Daily Mail article – it beggars belief! Excerpt and URL to full article below:-

    Glacier scientist: I knew data hadn’t been verified
    By David Rose
    Last updated at 12:54 AM on 24th January 2010

    “…The scientist behind the bogus claim in a Nobel Prize-winning UN report that Himalayan glaciers will have melted by 2035 last night admitted it was included purely to put political pressure on world leaders.

    Dr Murari Lal also said he was well aware the statement, in the 2007 report by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), did not rest on peer-reviewed scientific research.

    In an interview with The Mail on Sunday, Dr Lal, the co-ordinating lead author of the report’s chapter on Asia, said: ‘It related to several countries in this region and their water sources. We thought that if we can highlight it, it will impact policy-makers and politicians and encourage them to take some concrete action…”

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1245636/Glacier-scientists-says-knew-data-verified.html

  88. I keep thinking about the old myth about how foxes rid themselves of fleas by grabbing some wool in their mouth and backing in to water until all the fleas are on the wool, and they let go of the wool.

    If you think of the IPCC as the fox, Pechauri as the wool and the fleas as inconvenient truths and criticism….

    The pseudo-science is settled, the only remaining problem is reality.

  89. Geoff Sherrington (02:35:08) :

    From: “Isaak M. Khalatnikov” to Keith Briffa

    In view of what has happened, perhaps that should have been “Kalashnikov”.

  90. “within three or four days, we were able to come up with a clear and a very honest and objective assessment of what had happened”

    And after less than a week the science was settled again.

  91. David Ball (22:43:16) :

    My post of (22:17:47) was directed to davidmhoffer (21:01:36) . Thanks

    Saw it Dave, but have since dropped the thread. Blowing through cowtown on weekend, will wave as I go by.

  92. As it happens, we were all terribly preoccupied with a lot of events. We were working round the clock
    ———————————————————–

    We were studying the effect of the Royal We and got distracted. It was horrid, you should have been there, we would have waved.

  93. Unfortunately, the “real culprits” of AGW are not the Pachauri’s and Lal’s, the Phil Jones’ or the Michael Mann’s, or the millions and millions duped into demonstrating and chanting for, and donating to, “the cause”. The worst among us are the business men and politicians who used “science” and fear and sought to seperate us from our meager savings and basic freedoms for their own perverse gain. Presidents, Vice Presidents, and Prime Ministers, Senators and Representatives, MP’s, Banking and Industrial Tycoons, Publishers and Political Party bosses, these privilaged few are the true scum of the Earth. Who will hold them to account? John and Mary Voter won’t!

  94. Quote: Luboš Motl (23:49:24) :

    “I think that this dead man will be walking for a lot of extra time.

    The surprise that he knew it for two months is ludicrous. This chap has surely known that he’s been lying about all important things at least since 2002 and probably much longer than that.”

    I fear that you may be right. He learned from the very best. In the face of precise, space-age measurements, the Geophysics Section of NAS and NASA have lied very successfully about Earth’s heat source – the Sun.

    His foolishness was in thinking that people could be equally as easy deceived about the weather!

    With kind regards,
    Oliver K. Manuel
    Emeritus Professor of
    Nuclear & Space Sciences
    Former NASA PI for Apollo

  95. “A disgusting putrid apology of an outrageous perversion of the scientific method. I would urge all readers to review the comments as their very sharp audience weighs in and cuts the apologists to shreds. I have included one that will make all Cornell alumni very proud:

    “Shame on SA for publishing such a blatantly biased apology for what appear to have been long lasting and willful manipulations on an issue of the greatest importance to us all. Casual dismissal of Climategate as “a record of how Science is actually done” is deeply offensive to me. No this is not the way Science is actually done! Climategate has brought to public light all kinds of behaviors anathema to Science: Groupthink, restricted and/or proprietary access to data, significant use of poorly documented yet “highly complex” data processing techniques, primary reliance on extrapolations or “proxies”, and most damningly, offhand dismissal of skeptics as crackpots, quickly come to my mind. As a scientifically trained person, I am genuinely embarrassed that the Wall Street Journal, as opposed to SA, has understood the great concerns raised by Climategate.

    Dr Thierry Copie Ph.D Physics 1988, Cornell U.”
    …-

    “Negating “Climategate”: “…” Climate Science Survive Stolen E-Mail Controversy (Read Comments)
    Scientific American ^ | Jan 29, 2010 | David Biello

    Copenhagen—Even under this city’s low, leaden skies, at least one thing remained clear as leaders from 193 countries gathered to negotiate climate agreements: one ton of carbon dioxide emitted in the U.S. has the same effect as one ton emitted in India or anywhere else. That simple truism is part of a huge body of data pointing to humanity’s effect on climate, and for most negotiators, the weight of that evidence seems to have crushed any doubt they may have felt in the wake of the 1,000-plus e-mails and computer code stolen from the University of East Anglia’s Climatic Research Unit (CRU).

    The theft made headlines as “Climategate” in November, and many private correspondences among scientists became public. Climate contrarians and politicians, including Senator James M. Inhofe of Oklahoma, have claimed that the messages show that climate science was far from settled, that “tricks” were used and that researchers hid unfavorable data.

    In fact, nothing in the stolen material undermines the scientific consensus that climate change is happening and that humans are to blame. “Heat-trapping properties can be verified by any undergraduate in any lab,” notes climate scientist Katharine Hayhoe of Texas Tech University. “The detection of climate change, and its attribution to human causes, rests on numerous lines of evidence.” They include melting ice sheets, retreating glaciers, rising sea levels and earlier onset of spring, not to mention higher average global temperatures.

    (Excerpt) Read more at scientificamerican.com …”

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2440733/posts

  96. Although Pachauri of TERI (Trick Every Reasonable Individual) and Jones of CRU (Crooked Research Unit) can squeal and bleat they have done nothing wrong, it is fast becoming apparent that only career politicians and the gullible are prepared to believe them anymore.

    The bottom line is we have to go back to basics – back to the basic data of many thousands of temperature sites – and have sceptics and alarmists both agree how the readings from each one of these sites should be adjusted/’homogenised’ to reflect reality. This is a truly huge task as all the CRU manipulated data is now so corrupted/manipulated as to be effectively useless.

    The next task is to have a well-funded independent scientific commission of independents, advised by both sceptics and alarmists, scientifically prove the warming impact, if any, of each of the various ‘greenhouse gases’ and then determine whether or not natural cycles, ‘greenhouse gases’, or a mixture of both is responsible for the very modest warming trend (~0.7 degrees C) of the past century.

    This unfortunately would be impossible for many reasons, but most importantly as it would remove much of the reason for the existence of the many deeply flawed greenie and quasi-government funded climate organisations – no more snouts in the grants trough would not be an acceptable option for the self-appointed leaders of the alarmists.

  97. Pachauri obviously needs to go – but he is only a small part of the issue. We have in place multiple individuals who are wedded to an activist environmentalist agenda. Taking out Pachauri will be useful only insofar as it leads to changes in the way lead authors are chosen and the original review and summary criteria for the IPCC are adhered to.

  98. climate skepticism – the new form of gay.
    Have you come out of the closet yet?
    Need advice on how to tell your parents?
    In the army they have a dont ask, dont tell policy.

    We really need a skeptics pride ‘march’ day

  99. Someone else may have pointed this out but the following from ABC news on-line via Climate Depot. (My bold)

    “Toyota, the world’s largest automaker, also contributed $80,000 to TERI. Last week the Japanese company was awarded the $1.5 million (¬1.05 million) “Zayed Future Energy Prize” for its Prius hybrid car. Pachauri was the chairman of the jury, but he explains that he temporarily suspended his chairmanship because of his consulting activities. Nevertheless, he did manage to praise Toyota at the awards ceremony in Abu Dhabi, saying that the company deserves “the fullest appreciation” for bringing about a radical shift in technology.

  100. A good post from The Times comment section

    Dennis Kelly wrote:
    What ever happend to common sense and the use of our own senses? Are the oceans rising? No! Is it in fact getting noticably warmer? No – in fact it has been getting a bit colder! Have we through Earth’s history seen many periods of warming and cooling – none of which were related to mankind? Yes! I doubt mankind has seen such a stupid craze as MGW, with it’s almost religious zeal, since the Tulip Bulb Craze, our first true economic scandel. There were a few years there however where these nuts almost took the high ground and forced changes to ruin the economies of the western world – luckily the rest of the world finally woke up and most of that damage has been averted. Well, back to shoveling the snow!
    January 30, 2010 2:54 PM GMT

  101. “toyotawhizguy (04:13:28) :
    […]
    since blocking dissenting views is the hallmark of propagandist sites that have an agenda, have an aversion to debate and don’t give a **** about the truth.”

    Just for the record, the WWF did delete my comments when i wanted to soothe them about the fate of the polar bear, pointing out that its numbers are up. One moment my post was up, the next it was gone without a trace. Maybe they don’t want their visitors to be informed? Wonder why?

  102. Tenuc:

    You’re both right I think, Dr, Lal will be sure to get the chop as well. I was amazed to hear his confession of guilt in the Daily Mail article – it beggars belief! Excerpt and URL to full article below:-

    Lal now claims he was misquoted. He’ll be able to brazen it out unless the reporter taped him. Or if an IPCC insider or (preferably) two comes out with accounts of routine internal suppression of awkward corrections.

    OTOH, if the reporter has got him taped, then Lal will be done for. (It’s the cover-up that sinks you, not the crime.)

  103. OT…I clicked on the Join Leonardo/NRDC go-to ad link….and found this little gem..

    “…Not to mention the fact that President Obama spent 15 hours at the negotiating table in Copenhagen drafting an international climate accord with his own pen because he believes so deeply in the need to confront climate change…”

    I said “Wow. What a sacrifice.”

    But the good part is that WUWT gets paid, AND I get inspired by the acts of our great leaders.

    See? It pays to click on the links!!

  104. Pachauri, Lal, Jones, Mann (et al) are mortally wounded has beens. Gut shot banditos. It really doesn’t matter if they stay on where they are at or not, their organizations are also dying a slow uncureable death. It’s a vicious form of organizational cancer.

  105. Not seen this linked to yet, so here goes.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jan/29/water-vapour-climate-change

    An apparently rational report about research that may imply a negative feedback via H2O, with the Guardian apparently reporting it a non-hysterical manner.

    Susan Solomon, of the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, says something that deserves an award if true:

    “What I will say, is that this [new study] shows there are climate scientists round the world who are trying very hard to understand and to explain to people openly and honestly what has happened over the last decade.”

  106. Turns out Obama et al in the White House have included about$700 Billion in Cap & Trade revenues in their budget projections.

    As the IPCC fraud unravels, as Barry’s political bank account goes into over draft, it is very, very unlikely the Dumbocrats can scam or bribe Cap & Trade legislation into ka=law.

    So the Obama administration will be looking at an additional deficit load equal to the “lost” revenue . . . should put the USA over the $2 TRILLION annual deficit.

    That should make Americans want to support CO2 reductions.

  107. “Rajendra Pachauri was told that the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change assessment that the glaciers would disappear by 2035 was wrong, but he waited two months to correct it. ”

    They knew this was wrong at the moment of conception.

    When they did not have peer reviewed papers in their hand that they were looking at.

  108. Keith Davies (05:21:00) :

    Pechauri ? not Pin[n]ochio?

    If he were it seems as if his nose would be at least 6metres long.

    Not to mention the extra millimeters of extension to the nose due to thermal expansion from Mann made Global Warming and his Hockey Stick.

  109. Jaymam,

    Sorry to shake your cage – but YES! our kids are being fed this (explative deleted) and have been for years in science class. They believe their teachers, and the teachers believe what they’re teaching because Al Gore, a former Vice President, The EPA, the Federal Government, and etc. tell them so. Textbooks agree, and many teach the textbooks without critical review. Take a look at television – buy energy efficient appliances – not because it will save you money, but it will prevent three polar bears from drowning…

    End of rant…

    Satisfaction at seeing some people caught up in their own game, or overwhelmed by a desire to be important is one thing, but getting education into line will be the biggest problem.

    Mike

  110. Why do these political pundits think that Pachauri will resign? They must be confusing him with someone who gives a damn.

    Why do they think he will be pushed? They must be confusing the IPCC with a democratic institution, accountable to the people they serve.

    These political pundits are normally right on the button when they comment on democratically elected representatives, but they are applying one measure to gauge something different. And yet, the longer he clings on, the more disrepute he will bring down upon the whole rotten edifice.

  111. Ron de Haan,

    Glad to see you got your email sorted!

    I agree with your post, that too much emphasis has been given to the one confirmed illegality – FOIA violations. There are obviously more angles to this work in progress than that. Your link focuses on fraud, quite rightly. There is also the additional factor of conspiracy – clearly evidenced in the emails. Conspiracy to commit crimes is outside the summary justice act and not bound by the statute of limitations. I would have thought, at the very least, there is evidence of conspiracy to violate FOIA laws.

  112. “While paying lip service to skeptics, UK chief science advisor insists it is “unchallengeable” that man is changing the climate!”

    Well, it is. How *much* we are changing the climate, whether one means globally or locally, whether one means changing temperature or rainfall or snowfall, whether one means changing averages or distribution, and whether said changes are good, bad, indifferent or catastrophic, that of course is another matter completely!

    Trouble is, what people hear when you say “man is changing the climate” is “man is causing catastrophic global warming” – but they’re not the same statement at all! Trick is to know both what he meant and what he was trying to imply…

  113. @ Baa Humbug (07:00:54) :

    So Toyota sent TERI $80,000 and got $1.5 million back? Seems like the best return any investor in TERI is ever going to see.

    BTW, can someone explain how the self-described full-time salaried TERI employee Pachauri could so busy setting up Copenhagen? Did he take vacation, go on sabbatical? Or is TERI simply paying at least one person to produce and promote reports that help it bring in customers and funds?

    Conflict of interest? Of course not, no one’s self-interest was conflicted.

  114. davidmhoffer (21:01:36) :

    In primitive tribes, the fiercist warrior held the power to make group decisions. The smartest guy in the tribe became the shaman. ….
    The power of the government and the priesthood to control the common man by speaking for the spirits, or propogating falshoods to foster hatred and justify a war while the truth of matters is locked in records to which the pulic has no access. I fear not the machinations of the IPCC and their ilk to control my life because the information to expose them and the medium to express it is so available. I always knew they would lose this one.

    But the watchword is vigilence…..

    The shaman’s mistake was inventing writing. My regrets to the many female posters here, I’m just to sleepy to word this to be more inclusive, but rest assured I mean all of us.

    An excellent summation of history. Unfortunately the priesthood/chiefs have recently learned to remain hidden and work through puppets like Al Gore, Maurice Strong and Pachauri. In this way they avoid being lynched by the angry masses when they people realize they have been robbed. All they have to do is move onto the next scheme with new puppets and the masses never figure out who was actually behind their fleecing.

    As a female I resent the politically correct terms since I consider myself part of “mankind” Politically correct terms are just another device used in the “lets you and he fight” game fostered by the priesthood/chiefs to control the masses.

  115. Update on BBC Bias.

    http://www.professionalpensions.com/professional-pensions/news/1440290/iigcc-calls-urgent-changes-encourage-institutional-investment


    Professional Pensions | 19 May 2009 | 01:00

    Categories: Investment

    Carbon markets need urgent changes in order to encourage institutional investment and the development of a low-carbon economy, the Institutional Investor Group on Climate Change says.
    The group is calling for strong price signals and caps on carbon emissions that will encourage scarcity and demand.”

    IIGCC chairman and BBC head of pensions investment Peter Dunscombe said: “The credibility of emissions trading schemes would be greatly improved with a robust price signal as well as clear and frequent communication from the regulator on trading data and improved transparency over direct government participation in schemes.”

    Catch that: “IIGCC chairman and BBC head of pensions investment Peter Dunscombe…”

    I would say that the BBC has a major non-Scientific reason for their AGW Bias.
    If this AGW thing does not pan out then perhaps a lot of BBC pensioners will be left ‘out in the cold’.

    It is despicable how these charlatans of science are playing with the lives and futures of so many trusting people. These trusting people should pick up the phone, call their MP and get to the bottom of this before their pensions go the way of the dot-com or housing bubble.

  116. “Can we have those Indian journalists come here to the U.S.? It seems like they actually do their jobs, ask questions, consider all sides, realize BS when they hear it and report the truth.

    Most of our media? Not so much.”

    The USA media is bought and paid for and has been for years. JP Morgan bought controlling interest in the 25 major newspapers ninety years ago according to the U.S. Congressional Record February 9, 1917 and nothing much has changed since then except the names.

  117. jaymam (23:16:34) :

    Michele (22:45:38) : “He didn’t believe in global warming. He got a 0.”

    Would that be “anthropogenic global warming” he got a 0 for? He should believe in “global warming” since that is happening, slightly..
    If schools are pushing alarmist crap the schools and names of the teachers should be published.

    ********************************************************************
    Okay, let’s play ignorant. That’s fun!

    What kind do you think the schools are cramming down the kids throats? Come on! Where have you been? Gore’s still brainwashing young minds with his “humans are evil and causing global peril” crap for years. Political activism has allowed this to be in the curriculum. Kids can’t don’t know math, proper English, how to think critically (ie being spoon-fed what the Unions, activists, politicians believe).

    Teachers should be published?

    You don’t have kids, do you? This is all mandated testing now. ALL teachers would need to be “published”. Teachers don’t have freedom to pick and choose in these mandated tests – they have no choice in the testing these days.

    Beside your foggy understanding of today’s public schools, you have an odd idea of how science should be taught: “belief” in politicized propaganda.

  118. Michele (22:45:38) :

    “…O/T, but interesting – I heard a caller on a radio today say that she had to go to defend her child in school against a principle, teacher and union member because her son failed a state mandated test. Why did he fail?

    He didn’t believe in global warming. He got a 0.”

    I hope she has the wherewithal to take the school to court on this if needed. Feeding propaganda/religion to a child in school is sickening. If Al Gore is now pushing AGW as a religion she may have a real good case. Hope it turns into another nail in the coffin of AGW.

  119. James F. Evans (22:49:43) :

    “What if Pachuri is only a front man — for bigger fish pulling the strings…”

    Of course he is only a front man. Follow the money and look at how much the World Bank and the rest of the central bankers were set to gain.

  120. Fred (07:53:57) :

    “…..So the Obama administration will be looking at an additional deficit load equal to the “lost” revenue . . . should put the USA over the $2 TRILLION annual deficit.

    That should make Americans want to support CO2 reductions.”

    WRONG “That should make Americans want to” find a rope and a stout tree limb. I wonder if there are enough tall cherry trees in DC…..

  121. one more wheel has fallen off the wagon

    mercurior (13:49:23) : Your comment is awaiting moderation

    Reply: What are you whining about? This is a moderated site. All comments await moderation. Please do not waste our time with this [self snip]. ~ ctm

  122. “Aunty Freeze (13:41:58) :
    […]
    I would love to hire Al Gore to speak to a packed out hall. Once he was on stage, I would sneak in Lord Monckton and release him onto the stage. Carnage would ensue!”

    It would be over in 5 minutes. And it would only take so long because the viscount is such a polite person.

  123. Pity the MSM media didn’t pick up on this before. I broke this story in my blog post on January 26, see here:

    http://buythetruth.wordpress.com/2010/01/26/un-ipcc-rotting-from-the-head-down/

    where I wrote:

    “For example, even the BBC correspondent, Pallava Bagla in Delhi, reported on December 5, 2009 before the summit:

    The UN panel on climate change warning that Himalayan glaciers could melt to a fifth of current levels by 2035 is wildly inaccurate, an academic says…When asked how this “error” could have happened, RK Pachauri, the Indian scientist who heads the IPCC, said: “I don’t have anything to add on glaciers.”

    In other words, no comment. Eventually, the IPCC had to back down and admit that the claims were lies, but not before Pachauri had added his own dissembling (exposed as a lie in the quote above) about when he first heard of the problem. The London Times reported on January 23:

    Dr Pachauri also said he did not learn about the mistakes until they were reported in the media about 10 days ago, at which time he contacted other IPCC members. He denied keeping quiet about the errors to avoid disrupting the UN summit on climate change in Copenhagen, or discouraging funding for TERI’s own glacier programme.”

    See the rest of the blog for evidence that the 2035 figure was debunked in the peer-reviewed literature in 2005, and previously by Jack Ives (expert on Himalayas) in 2004. But though Pachauri and TERI would have known this, as I report in the blog post:

    “It was none other than R.K. Pachauri who continued to spread the lies after their exposure by Ives, as reported in Hindustan Times (New Delhi), 22 July 2006

    R.K. Pachauri, who heads the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, says: “In the next 25 years half of Himalayan glaciers will be lost to warming, affecting adversely crops and people of the region.””

  124. latitude (08:00:05) :

    -“Rajendra Pachauri was told that the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change assessment that the glaciers would disappear by 2035 was wrong, but he waited two months to correct it. ”

    -They knew this was wrong at the moment of conception.

    -When they did not have peer reviewed papers in their hand that they were looking at.

    WORSE than that – they had a peer-reviewed paper in the Himalayan Journal of Sciences in their hands in 2005 that told them it was UNTRUE, see

    http://buythetruth.wordpress.com/2010/01/26/un-ipcc-rotting-from-the-head-down/

    The paper is here (wait for it to load as PDF – be patient):

    http://www.nepjol.info/index.php/HJS/article/view/457/447

  125. Think of how much simpler Choo Choo’s life would be if it weren’t for all those pesky “deniers.”

    He could just dictate what everybody should do and get on with his life.

    The insolence of these people!

  126. It was a dark and stormy night, and Choo-Choo was penning his novel with Shirley, when to his eyes did appear AGW-Al.
    …-

    “Revealed: the racy novel written by the world’s most powerful climate scientist

    As the UN’s climate change chief, Dr Rajendra Pachauri has spent his career writing only the driest of academic articles. But the latest offering from the chairman of the UN’s climate change panel is an altogether racier tome.

    Some might even suggest Dr Pachauri’s first novel is frankly smutty.

    Return to Almora, published in Dr Pachauri’s native India earlier this month, tells the story of Sanjay Nath, an academic in his 60s reminiscing on his “spiritual journey” through India, Peru and the US.

    On the way he encounters, among others, Shirley MacLaine, the actress, who appears as a character in the book. While relations between Sanjay and MacLaine remain platonic, he enjoys sex – a lot of sex – with a lot of women.

    In breathless prose that risks making Dr Pachauri, who will be 70 this year, a laughing stock among the serious, high-minded scientists and world leaders with whom he mixes, he details sexual encounter after sexual encounter.

    …Other passages in the novel involve group sex and more risqué sexual practices.

    The novel was launched amid much fanfare with Bollywood stars and wealthy industrialists in attendance, a reflection of Dr Pachauri’s esteemed status in the country.

    He won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2007, on behalf of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

    In the acknowledgement of his novel, Dr Pachauri admits to writing the book while flying around the world between meetings as IPCC chairman or else in his capacity as head of a research institute in Delhi.

    But with calls for him to resign over academic blunders in the reports he presides over, some critics will question whether he should have devoted more time to scrutinising the science behind the reports.

    (Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk”

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2441056/posts

    http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/mt/mt-comments.cgi

  127. Michelle – question:

    Which state in the US was she calling from?

    (you wrote: O/T, but interesting – I heard a caller on a radio today say that she had to go to defend her child in school against a principle, teacher and union member because her son failed a state mandated test. Why did he fail?)

  128. If you click on davidmhoffer’s post you will be taken to another brilliant piece! Don’t miss it.

    And thanks for the link to openthemagazine, whoever did that!

  129. After reading an earlier post on “Glaciergate” I decided to check up the other Murari Lal references used in the IPCC AR4 WGII report. One that I found interesting is “Lal, 2003″ – “Global climate change: India’s monsoon and its variability. Jour-
    nal of Environmental Studies and Policy”. What’s interresting is that the journal is published by TATA Energy Research Institute (TERI) http://isid.org.in/jrnls/j57.html where Pachauri himself is a Director General http://www.terina.org/

    One example where it’s referenced (Page 476): “Frequency of monsoon depressions and cyclones formation in Bay of Bengal and Arabian Sea on the decline since 1970 but intensity is increasing causing severe floods in terms of damages to life and property Lal, 2001, 2003″

    From the first reference (http://www.ias.ac.in/currsci/may102001/1103.pdf) you can find that frequency of monsoons has indeed declined but to say that it’s intensity HAS increased is quite a stretch. Lal assumes in the report – from model simulations saying sea surface temperature WILL increase – that so WILL the intensity of monsoons. Notice the change of tense. No measurements to verify that is mentioned in the report.

    Now I’m looking for help from English reader on the other reference to verify what’s actually sad in that one. It seems to be available in the British Library. http://direct.bl.uk/bld/PlaceOrder.do?UIN=148833805&ETOC=RN&from=searchengine

    Are we looking at an monsoongate here?

  130. For Andrew 30….moving the pawn? you mean moving the queen! Your pawns are moving too many squares each time, ever heard of guilty by association? Does not stand up in legal circles. Too many shortcuts my friend, a bit lazy on your part. Tighten all this up a bit and then it might be a useful read….

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