NYC Turns Back to Gas Buses After Finding Out the Hard Way That the Electric Versions Have Big Problems

From NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THAT

By Paul Homewood

That low carbon bus crap stuff isn’t only failing in Aberdeen!

From Western Journal:

western journal nyc electric buses

New York City is pretty much broke. Mayor Zohran Mamdani may be crowing about the fact that he’s balanced the city’s budget, but that’s mostly because lawmakers in Albany bailed him out. There are also looming tax increases driving people out of the city and gutting future revenue, so that’s an issue.

In short, now isn’t the time that NYC needs to be making a capital outlay on something that should have been predicted long ago. But apparently, a bunch of electric buses that Gotham bought in order to go zero emissions? Yeah, it turns out that, in a development that could have been predicted by anyone who’s followed EV developments, the city’s transit authority is going to have to acquire 650 new buses that run on compressed natural gas because the EV buses won’t work.

From The City Reporter, Sept. 10:

The MTA committed nearly a decade ago to having its entire fleet of close to 6,000 buses be emissions-free by 2040, but officials on Thursday said the transportation authority is instead seeking proposals from manufacturers to produce low-emissions alternatives to diesel.

Officials tied the release of a request for proposals to the “Next Stop: Fast Buses, Better Service” plan unveiled in July by Gov. Kathy Hochul and Mayor Zohran Mamdani, as the head of the MTA has repeatedly acknowledged that electric-bus technology is “still immature.”

“The governor and the mayor have been clear: better bus service can’t wait,” said Janno Lieber, the transportation authority’s chairperson and chief executive. “So, while the electric bus industry continues to mature, MTA is moving forward with CNGs to further improve service for the millions of New Yorkers who ride MTA buses every day.”

Yes, like any good socialist, Zohran Mamdani wants zero-emission vehicles. However, when you’ve based much of your image on getting the buses running on time and in order, spending absurd amounts of money on articulated EV buses that don’t work as much as they should is a major problem. And when you consider the whole project of replacing the city’s entire bus fleet with EVs is estimated to cost $12 billion and use enough electricity to light 200,000 houses to accomplish, as The City Reporter noted, that becomes a double whammy.

And the city is turning back to compressed natural gas, purchasing the 650 new CNG-powered vehicles to replace 620 CNG-powered vehicles it purchased in 2013.

The City Reporter is describing the move as “part of the MTA’s largest single upgrade to its fleet since 2013.” This is being counted as a win by the people who should have known better in the first place.

“Modern, reliable buses can spend more time on the road and less time in the shop than the old vehicles they will replace, a win for riders who depend on frequent, reliable service to get around,” Democrat New York Gov. Kathy Hochul said in a statement, according to The City Reporter.

Anyone with sense could have told them this years ago, but why learn from logic when you can get knocked around by experience?

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46 Comments
willybamboo
September 21, 2026 6:13 am

And all the bus mechanics will tell you that CNG buses are crap compared to diesel. Engine life is the big difference. Not even half the miles in service. Speaking of half the miles, not even half the miles between fueling either. Almost all express buses still run on diesel.

Reply to  willybamboo
September 21, 2026 6:50 am

Diesel acts as a lubricant/coolant to the valves and valve guides which CNG does not. Hence why on CNG conversions for cars, which were a thing in the UK a few years back, you added an lube injection system to keep the top end happy.

Scarecrow Repair
Reply to  willybamboo
September 21, 2026 8:00 am

The company that delivers propane to my house had a propane-powered truck. The driver said it seemed like a natural buy for a propane company, especially being cheaper, but it turned out to be gutless enough that it could only make it up the hill to my house at the end of its route, and they had to replace it at half the lifetime of the other delivery trucks (I do not remember now if they were diesel or gasoline, only that they weren’t propane).

Erik Magnuson
Reply to  Scarecrow Repair
September 21, 2026 8:39 am

Back in 1980, truck engines running on propane lasted longer than the same engines running on gasoline. Spark plugs and lube oil were also much cleaner.

roywspencer
Reply to  Erik Magnuson
September 21, 2026 8:45 am

Maybe before fuel injection? Accurate metering of fuel has greatly increased the life of gasoline engines due to less washing of lubricant off of cylinder walls and less contamination of oil.

Scarecrow Repair
Reply to  Erik Magnuson
September 21, 2026 9:33 am

This was from 2005 to 2015 or so, more or less.

Scarecrow Repair
Reply to  Scarecrow Repair
September 21, 2026 10:38 am

Downvoted, for saying when something happened to me? Someone needs to take a break.

Reply to  Scarecrow Repair
September 21, 2026 11:00 am

comment image

Sweet Old Bob
September 21, 2026 6:46 am

That nasty bitch, REALITY, bites HARD !
😉

September 21, 2026 6:59 am

In Naptown Numbers‘ “Reduce Carbon-Dioxide Emissions” we found that even if you accept the “social cost of carbon” the emissions-avoidance benefit usually isn’t worth the cost.

Bus-Cost
Bruce Cobb
September 21, 2026 7:09 am

Wow, that’s amazing. I mean who, I say WHO could possibly have predicted such a thing?

Mandobob
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
September 21, 2026 8:39 am

You left off the “sarc on” 🙂

Dr. Bob
September 21, 2026 7:14 am

I worked with California Energy Commission on CNG busses and Renewable Diesel Buses (clean diesel fuel). The RNG busses were a big problem as they could not be stored or serviced unless the building was Class 1 Div 1 explosion proof. Explosion Proof Equipment | Class I Div 1 & 2 Guide (2026) | Intrinsically Safe Store You simply cannot store NG cylinders in a closed space without making it intrinsically safe. This adds considerable expense to any municipal bus operation.

Plus, NG busses require more maintenance than diesel busses and the actual emissions are no better now that diesel buses (and all on-highway diesel vehicles) have exhaust cats and traps. CEC showed that modern diesel buses have exhaust output that is cleaner than ambient air in large cities. So, no net benefit for using NG. And no reduction in GHG emissions either as there simply isn’t enough Renewable NG for NYC while Renewable Diesel is readily available and domestically produced.

Typical of politicians. Address a perceived problem with solutions that have no impact on the problem, perceived or real.

Reply to  Dr. Bob
September 21, 2026 7:33 am

Missing: today’s higher (outrageous?) cost of diesel per bus-mile compared to that of CNG per bus-mile.

Mr.
Reply to  ToldYouSo
September 21, 2026 7:55 am

So what are the numbers that demonstrate a significant difference in costs?

Reply to  Mr.
September 21, 2026 8:46 am

I generally refrain from being anyone’s lap dog, but in this case I’ve made an exception since the answer is easily obtained by anyone that can access the Web and knows how to use a search engine.

Here is Google’s AI bot answer:

“At today’s market prices, using Compressed Natural Gas (CNG) reduces a bus’s fuel cost per mile by roughly 35% to 40% compared to using diesel at $6.50 per gallon.”

Took me about 30 seconds to type out the question and get the above answer.

Mr.
Reply to  ToldYouSo
September 21, 2026 9:06 am

Well, I expected no less.
Since you’re on here so often “Telling Us So”.

And the 30 seconds you used up on my query was 30 seconds not spent on “Telling Someone Else So”.

So that’s my good Samaritan deed for the day.
(No need to thank me – it was beneficial to someone else, not me 🙂 )

Reply to  ToldYouSo
September 21, 2026 9:31 am

High price for diesel won’t last. Sooner or late Russia and Iran will be allowed to produce as much a they want- along with Venezuela. Prices for all petroleum products will crash.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
September 21, 2026 11:03 am

Venezuela will take years.
But yes, prices will crash – mainly due to demand destruction.

Curious George
Reply to  Dr. Bob
September 21, 2026 7:36 am

A Typo in the second sentence – CNG misspelled as RNG.

Scarecrow Repair
Reply to  Curious George
September 21, 2026 8:04 am

Might not be — I saw that too, but he later mentions “Renewable NG”.

And no reduction in GHG emissions either as there simply isn’t enough Renewable NG for NYC while Renewable Diesel is readily available and domestically produced.

Scarecrow Repair
Reply to  Scarecrow Repair
September 21, 2026 10:39 am

Man, the downvoter of doom is having a bad day today.

claysanborn
Reply to  Dr. Bob
September 21, 2026 10:17 am

Dr. Bob, with your “Typical of politicians.”, summary, I believe you very well highlighted the bigger problem, especially among all the “blue” states – when states’ politicians and their approving constituents can’t even define, describe. or recognize women’s God-given attributes, it’s a clue to the rest of the world, that while they are at least morally useless, they are at least socially dangerous too.
From Fox News (you can logically substitute the EV bus issue into the following comic):
comment image?ve=1&tl=1

September 21, 2026 7:15 am

While battery-electric bus (BEB) designs and performance are slowly improving, especially in cold higher latitudes, success is partly dependent on addition of diesel powered heaters installed in the buses. In optimum temperatures (around 55 to 60°F ), BEBs have far less range on an overnight charge compared to diesel and CNG buses. As temperatures plummet, so does the BEB range. In winter operations, BEBs require costly, indoor storage and charging infrastructure, supplemental diesel heating, mid route supplemental charging, and back up buses for frequently missed routes. BEBs also cost far more per unit than diesel or CNG buses. So why do people keep buying them for any reason beyond trial purposes?

Despite federal state and politically left cleaning climate activist city policies, BEBs still constitute an insignificant percentage of the transit bus fleet. They are even far less common in school bus and non-city transit bus fleets. In addition to the city and state politically motivated promotion of BEBs, the principal reason that electric bus buses are becoming a significant share of new bus orders (about 20%) is state and federal grant money. Were it not for massive government underwriting, the BEB market would collapse.

barryjo
Reply to  pflashgordon
September 21, 2026 8:01 am

Similar to the wind turbine subsidy scam.

MarkW
Reply to  pflashgordon
September 21, 2026 9:45 am

Having the market collapse when the subsidies run out seems to be the pattern for all electric vehicles. Excluding golf carts which, to the best of my knowledge, were never subsidized.

rogercaiazza
Reply to  pflashgordon
September 21, 2026 11:18 am

Niagara Frontier Transit Authority (Buffalo NY) has a fleet of electric buses. They have a unique situation that addresses some of the cold weather issues you list. BUT, they had to get new batteries for all the buses after several years because the road salt ate the first set of batteries. They were under warranty so NFTA did not have to eat that cost.

mleskovarsocalrrcom
September 21, 2026 7:24 am

When I was a kid I sold newspapers while standing in the street loading dock for the electric trolleys in Los Angeles. Some areas had electric busses. Both are gone now because diesel is more efficient and doesn’t require the overhead transmission lines that limit the bus/trolley course, sometimes jumped track, and filled the overhead with supporting and live wires. So now it’s back to the future but without the previous drawbacks only to introduce new ones that hamper reliability. More unintended consequences from the AGW crowd.

NotChickenLittle
September 21, 2026 7:27 am

As Ayn Rand wrote, you can ignore reality but you can’t ignore the consequences of ignoring reality…

Leftists persist living in a fantasy world even when their noses are rubbed in reality over and over again. All of us taxpayers suffer because of their delusions.

MarkW
Reply to  NotChickenLittle
September 21, 2026 9:47 am

The left wing mantra seems to be “This time it’s going to work.”

J Boles
September 21, 2026 7:36 am

I just KNEW that the e-bus house of cards would fall down, after all that expensive virtue signaling. Liberals just LOVE to piss away other peoples money.

ResourceGuy
September 21, 2026 8:08 am

How much did they pay consultants to come up with “still immature” to maneuver around the failure? It takes a village you know.

George Thompson
Reply to  ResourceGuy
September 21, 2026 8:50 am

Every village has an idiot-or more-and at least one leftist or Dem grifter. Just ask Hillary.

DipChip
Reply to  George Thompson
September 21, 2026 11:20 am

And all of them seem to get into politics.

ResourceGuy
September 21, 2026 8:16 am

So all the other cities in CA, CO, and other greenwasher municipalities are using “still immature” buses.

Reply to  ResourceGuy
September 21, 2026 10:22 am

Electric busses already dominate new sales in china and europe. The technology is far from “immature”.

MarkW
Reply to  MyUsernameReloaded
September 21, 2026 11:05 am

They why don’t they work?

Reply to  MarkW
September 21, 2026 11:14 am

Sad, isn’t it? The whole public transport system in chinese cities broke down years ago. Nobody told them yet, though.

DipChip
Reply to  MyUsernameReloaded
September 21, 2026 11:26 am

You are correct if you base that on what they say and consider the huge subsidies.

mleskovarsocalrrcom
September 21, 2026 9:31 am

By definition Gore is the epitome of a useful idiot.

MarkW
September 21, 2026 9:38 am

The 620 buses bought in 2013 need replacing already?
I know that the life of a big city bus is rough, but only 13 years?

Reply to  MarkW
September 21, 2026 10:53 am

13 years is quite a good age for a city bus if you can afford replacement. Trams last around 30 to 40 years – the high up-front costs are their main problem.

September 21, 2026 10:20 am

In Europe and china electric city busses already dominate new sales.

MarkW
Reply to  MyUsernameReloaded
September 21, 2026 11:06 am

Governments, spending other people’s money, don’t care how much money they end up wasting.

Reply to  MarkW
September 21, 2026 11:10 am

Electric busses have higher purchase but lower operational and lifetime cost. It’s money better spend.

Sonicsuns
September 21, 2026 11:58 am

There are also looming tax increases driving people out of the city and gutting future revenue

The link under “driving people out of the city” does not mention anyone being driven out of the city. It only mentions people complaining about the new tax, not actually leaving because of it.

New York’s population was at 8.8 million in 2020, dropping to 8.4 million in 2022 and recovering partially to 8.5 in 2025. Mamdani took office in 2026 and we don’t have good figures for 2026 yet.

https://s-media.nyc.gov/agencies/dcp/assets/files/pdf/data-tools/population/population-estimates/new-york-city-population-estimates-and-trends-march-2026.pdf