Summer was pretty quiet, thankfully, but time for a jolt to get reengaged. There’s no better way than getting yelled at, so today let’s talk about a surefire recipe – Electric Vehicles. Those that love EVs really love ‘em, and to speak ill of them in front of the fans is akin to asking questions about the size of their children’s ears.
EVs have an outsized role in the current cultural and economic landscape, in an odd way. They are seen as the best hope to turn the tide of general consumer emissions. Governments threw their full weight behind them to an astonishing degree, legislating them into projected dominance at an unprecedented (and as it turns out, insane) pace.
What makes EVs such a flashpoint is that they intersect with a bunch of stuff that people hold dear. For some, EV ownership feels like a major personal contribution to the global emissions problem, if owning one entails a significant personal commitment. For many, EVs make total sense if only running around town, or if wealthy enough to keep one in the garage amongst the Astons and Ferraris so as to be well-positioned to make an environmental statement if required. Some love them for their simplicity, with few moving parts and lower maintenance requirements (lower, but not zero). Still others love them because they can fuel up at home, at night. And then there is the cohort that feels their rage against oil companies sated cathartically every time they drive past a gas station, those that believe hydrocarbons bring nothing but death, irrespective of the fact that to that point in their life they’ve brought them everything within their purview, including all the things that keep them alive. Have pity on those people, the neutron-level boxing matches going on between their ears are not to be wished on anyone.
On the flip side of the equation, and what brings it to the news, is the public’s general feeling of “meh” towards them, the 80 percent that constitutes the non-extreme middle. In sane times, that is not a problem; major change happens gradually for such big ticket items, and most get a sense that certain segments of the economy work extremely well as EVs – delivery fleet vehicles, forklifts, urban taxis, etc. Many would drift toward EVs as battery technology improves, as range increases, as price falls. But such a shift would be a multi-generational thing, particularly with the infrastructure changes required.
Most consumers can see that that Total And Rapid EV Domination is not a particularly wise vision, even if governments have declared that that must happen within their dog’s lifespan.
Consumers do know a good idea when they see one, and we can see that by the explosion in popularity of hybrid vehicles – those with internal combustion engines augmented by modest battery packs and electric motors that give a certain emissions-free range before switching to gasoline power.
There’s a reason for this growing popularity – it makes sense on many levels. A hybrid removes some of the major reasons people are reluctant to go full-battery EV (BEV) – range anxiety, cold weather performance, etc. – and, as Toyota has wisely pointed out, hybrids are actually better for the environment in general than mass consumer adoption of EVs.
How can that be, you might wonder. Here is Toyota’s calculation, in what they call the 1:6:90 rule. An excellent write up can be found here, and the gist of it is: Because of immense challenges in finding, developing, mining, and processing critical metals and minerals (hundreds of new mines required globally, with each new mine having weaker grades than before, and with many jurisdictions becoming more hostile towards new mines), it makes more sense to utilize a given BEV’s minerals requirements to construct 90 hybrids instead.
Because many trips are very short, a hybrid can run on electric power for most of them, which is how the spreading-out of these minerals to many vehicles makes emissions reduction sense. Toyota calculates that if the metals/minerals used to construct a single EV were instead used to build 90 hybrids, the overall carbon reduction from those hybrids over their lifetimes would be 37 times that of a single EV (and with that sentence, I don my helmet for the incoming shouts of “Fossil Fuel Shill” – the aforementioned yelling).
Customers are clamouring to acquire hybrids. According to a Car Dealership Guy article (excellent auto news site, from a dealer perspective), in August, 48 percent of Toyota sales were hybrids, Hyundai had an 81 percent increase in hybrids (albeit from a relatively smaller number than Toyota), and Ford saw hybrid sales increase by 50 percent.
Volvo, a company that had pledged to be completely EV by 2030 and thereby banishing the smell of gasoline forevermore from customers’ nostrils, recently backed down from that pledge to announced hybrids would remain part of the equation indefinitely. “Everybody made a lot of assumptions two, three, four, five years ago, and that’s changed,” said Volvo’s CEO.
And then there is the Chinese onslaught of affordable, high-quality EVs that somehow policy planners didn’t see coming. Western countries announced bans on ICE in favour of full-EV by the next decade, and lo and behold, China controls most elements of an EV’s composition, and they took full advantage of that supply chain dominance (plus massive government support) to undercut virtually every western EV maker. Hey, you can’t do that, said US, Canadian, and EU governments, slapping huge tariffs on Chinese made EVs because well, we want to save the environment but not that badly (ultra cheap EVs are one of the few catalysts that would accelerate wide spread and rapid EV adoption among the masses).
Not sure where this goes next. Consumers have spoken, auto makers are responding, and the odd man out are governments still paralyzed in 2019 when euphoric and nonsensical “environmental” policy danced on the supposed grave of last century’s fuel. How they backpedal out of this is anyone’s guess, although there are signs, such as this headline: “Italy leads revolt against Europe’s electrical vehicle transition”. If memory serves from Italian traffic, they seem fine with virtually any sort of vehicular madness, so a automotive revolt in that land is a pretty big deal.
As with so, so many aspects of an energy transition, if the whole process had not been hijacked by zealots, we would be farther down the road, we would have consumers on side, we would have entire industries functioning properly instead of the fiascos we in for example the auto industry, and we most likely would have far less emissions.
Greenpeace USA on the ropes29dk2902lhttps://boereport.com/29dk2902l.html
In the big scheme of things, seeing something that has the words “green” and “peace” in the name fail would be disheartening; no sane person is against either the environment or peace. But put those two words together and you have something else entirely.
In the US, Greenpeace is for once holding the crappy end of the stick that they are used to jabbing at everything they disagree with. US energy pipeline giant Energy Transfer is seeking $300 million in damages for Greenpeace’s role in delaying the Dakota Access Pipeline. An ET victory would and should send shockwaves through the massively well financed protest industry that so far employs every tactic in the book to achieve victory (and by ‘victory’ we generally means ‘obstruction’ or ‘vengeance’ as opposed to any sort of constructive advancement). The big ENGOs spend hundreds of millions on staff and lawyers who literally have nothing to do other than bend society to their will without the bothersome hassle of going through the democratic process. Robert Bryce’s excellent Substack column keeps track of the staggering sums that US ENGOs churn through; Greenpeace US is a pipsqueak ($33 million annual engorgement) compared to locust-lawyer Natural Resources Defense Council’s staggering $548 million. With all that money, these groups construct nothing.)
It is a surprise there haven’t been more of these lawsuits filed by thwarted companies and hydrocarbon producers dragged into court for the sin of providing the fuel that keeps us all alive. It’s really not a hard argument to make; the world as we know it will collapse without hydrocarbon production, so shouldn’t thwarting that production on sometimes very flimsy grounds count for something? Shouldn’t blocking fuel from consumers that desperately need it (countless pipeline battles) count for something?
Greenpeace’s defence is pretty funny; suddenly they are insignificant, claiming to have had only a supporting role in the protests, and that the lawsuit is, the funniest part, an “attack on free speech.” Chaining one’s self (or worse, sending some naive acolyte to chain their selves) to a bulldozer on a construction site is, apparently, ‘free speech’, as is law fare and endless slanderous comments about the people and businesses that bring them the fuel that keeps their unhappy lives going.
Maybe the resurrected body, of which you can be certain will appear if this one is bankrupted, should start off with a bit of soul searching. Maybe peace means everyone working together for a common goal, not dramatizing a villain as the means of motivating the troops. Maybe ‘green’ should mean concern for habitat, concern for air pollution, concern for more intelligent use of resources, concern for the most logical global approach to progress, as opposed to a singular war against the bedrock of our society that it is glaringly obvious we cannot and will not live without.
What the world desperately needs – energy clarity. And a few laughs. Pick up The End of Fossil Fuel Insanity, available at Amazon.ca, Indigo.ca, or Amazon.com.
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Yep, there’s a hybrid sitting in our garage. The old 2010 Ford Escape got ~20mpg. The current 2022 Ford hybrid Escape gets 40 mpg. By the way, it doesn’t run on battery power for the first several miles, electric driving switches on and off as you drive down the road. But as I understand it, plug-in hybrids do drive ten twenty or thirty miles until the switch to electric mode occurs. If that’s true, a plug-in’s visits to the gas station would be a rare event.
So far nobody makes a two door plug-n hatchback which is what I want before I get ready to trade in my 2010 Hyundai Accent stick shift that gets a steady 32mpg.
Right, a small boxy hatch like the Honda Fit (“bigger on the inside than the outside!”). The ancient Honda “Insight” will return > 60 mpg on occasion – I know a couple nerdy engineers that have them, and somehow have kept them going. That was 30 year old tech! I’m seeing new 4,000 pound Toyotas (Venza, Crown Signia) that are rated low 40’s now.
It seems the plug in part is not important to most buyers – there are plenty of reports about the charging cable not ever being used. I know two people that own and love their Korean plug-in’s, but don’t ever plug them in because they make enough longer trips that the battery is usually filled up. That’s an interesting behavior to me.
The reports of the cable never being used is often company car drivers, who get them due to the tax advantages, but since they get free fuel anyway, why would they want to spend their own money charging at home?
My two friends – one doesn’t bother even though she has a garage and could do it. The other has logistical barriers to charging. They still love their cars, and the cars do just nose around neighborhood trips on electric till the engine kicks on.
Where is it free? You mean public charging stations don’t charge your account?
He was referring to fleet drivers only, they don’t have to pay for fuel, the company does.
Honda Fit? A friend bought one- it had the roughest ride I’ve been in. Seemed like he was driving on a road full of holes.
I had a 2012 Sport, got in from a friend for a song. I drove it several years before giving it to a daughter. I thought it rode fine for cheapo econo box.
There are two in my garage and I bought them simply because the fuel economy is substantial and the higher price is paid back well before the vehicle will be traded in. The economics are even better since Bidenomics essentially doubled the price of gas. I have no concern about the climate or use of fossil fuels.
I was looking at new car window stickers yesterday and it seemed the price delta between straight ICE and hybrid was not large. We were at a Tiyota dealership waiting for my wife’s car to process out of service. I was trying to get her interested in a 2024 Venza AWD hybrid, but she loves her 2015 Rav4.
I have the same car- and love it.
I like her 2015 lots more than my 2019. Take care of it Jose.
What do you do for the salt? Rust will kill that fine car faster than it will wear out.
They can keep the plug-in crap. That’s just an underpowered piece of shit when the battery isn’t charged, leaving you stuck with the same unbearable “refuel” times (at the charging station) to have full function (unless you like the nostalgic experience of Ford Pinto performance, complete with built-in incendiary device).
Somehow, the supposedly “rare” trip to the gas station is little consolation for the usability and charging dependency issues.
Mild hybrid or straight ICE only for me, thanks.
Was watching an auto industry video yesterday and they talked about the particular manufacturer “getting the message” about hybrids being preferred over EVs.
Then they mentioned working on a new *plug-in* hybrid. I smacked my head.
NO, they DIDN’T “get the message.” Anything that plugs in and needs charging sucks.
I’m not a plug-in fan either but they don’t “need” plugging in. You just save (more or less) on the gas bill if you do. It would save nothing for me out here in the wide open desert.
40 mpg? Are you counting your cost to charge it?
The straight Toyota midsize hybrids at rated above 40
I have a 3 seat Hyundai santa fe that gets me 33 miles per gallon combined city highway and yes with the ac running almost all of the time in summer
If there is a market for EV’s let them find it on their own. IMO there is a niche market and it will soon be saturated.
The niche is people who mostly make short trips around town and have a garage wired for electricity.
No the market niche is virtue signallers and it is nearly filled.
a hybrid can run on electric power for most of them
Have they gotten that much better since 2008? Or was my son’s hybrid just junk? It couldn’t run on battery for that long.
Better off – needing to charge for the promised performance sucks, unless you drive like a slug and wouldn’t notice.
“ Some love them for their simplicity, with few moving parts ” My bold. Few or fewer?
Whichever. I wonder where there is a list of parts that move in a fancy Tesla or a Ford Lightening?
Likewise, what about a Boxer (flat) engine or big V-8?
Is this “fewer parts” thing just another out-of-thin-air statement without facts being determined?
An IC engine has a lot of parts but if you take care of it, it will go 300,000 miles. Anyone who has worked with electric motors has experience premature burn-out and knows that the statement is BS.
I’ll trade oil changes I can do myself and spark plugs every 100k for endless waiting at charging stations.
My first car engine overheated one day (water pump failed) to a point where the engine almost seized up, and continued to run for a minute or two after I turned it off. I replaced the pump and changed the oil. It ran rough for a while, but then smoothed out again after the next oil change.
I put about another 120k miles on it before I had to get rid of the car. It wasn’t the engine that was the problem though – it was the electrical stuff in the steering column: lights, turn signals, wipers, etc. Stuff that an EV would also have. The engine was still in great shape.
The above article has a FANTASTIC, and quite appropriate, lead-in graphic!
IMHO, it is a great forecast of the ultimate end of EV culture in US society: a too-small EV that can’t even “limp home” because the much-promised charging infrastructure simply went bust despite (because of?) charging stations being available every quarter-mile on so, even on rural roads.
Kudos to the WUWT editor(s) for that insight.
Terry, “How dare you!” malign Greenpeace for opposing natural gas infrastructure and fossil fuel availability!!
(Apols to St Greta for plagiarising her battlecry.)
Surely you must be aware that the German franchise of Greenpeace sells natural gas* for profit?
*Albeit diluted by as little as 0.32% hydrogen.
https://green-planet-energy.de/privatkunden/prowindgas
If that wasn’t bad enough, its flagship ‘sailing’ vessel, Rainbow Warrior III has a pair of Caterpillar diesel engines. Whilst its puff-piece about its tub mentions “Rainbow Warrior III is a sailing ship mostly dependent on wind energy. It, however, has a back-up engine, 1,425kW Caterpillar C3512, that runs on diesel-electric propulsion.”, it fails to point out that the second Caterpillar diesel engine generates all the tub’s dependable electricity 24/7 for maritime safety, navigation, cooking food, and, providing thermal comfort & hot water for its crew.
https://www.ship-technology.com/projects/rainbow-warrior/?cf-view
“certain segments of the economy work extremely well as EVs – delivery fleet vehicles, forklifts, urban taxis, etc.”
Not sure about those delivery vehicles. Those vehicles are driven pretty hard. They have to make a lot of deliveries in a day- stop and go all day. Would a full charge be enough? How about it winter?
it’s more lies, BEV suck for all those applications
OK, maybe hybrids are groovy- but I don’t want to be forced to buy one either.
STORY TIP
about the EV industry free-fall
https://pjmedia.com/vodkapundit/2024/09/18/ev-blues-unsold-electric-cars-stacking-up-like-all-you-can-eat-pancakes-n4932623
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/19/germany-suffers-spectacular-70pc-drop-electric-car-sales/
I guess this is a story tip.
The European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association (ACEA) said sales of new battery-powered electric vehicles (EV) in Germany plunged by nearly 70pc to 27,024 in August.
In France, the EU’s second largest market for battery electric vehicles behind Germany, deliveries fell by 33pc to 13,143.
ACEA said “the spectacular drop” in both countries meant that only 92,627 battery electric vehicles were registered across Europe last month, a fall of 43.9pc compared to a year earlier. This drove a wider 18pc drop in new car sales across the EU.
The collapse in EV sales comes amid concerns about their range, high prices and the lack of charging infrastructure across the EU.
Felipe Munoz, a global automotive analyst at JATO Dynamics, said: “The reality is that whether you look at business or private, electric vehicles do not convince yet.”
There are concerns about demand for EVs among British drivers too. Separate data showed that the growth rate of EV sales in the UK had dramatically slowed.
Some 213,500 EVs were sold in the first eight months of 2024, up by 10.5pc compared to the previous year. That compared to annual growth of 40.5pc over the same period in 2023, according to the Society of Motor Manufacturers & Traders (SMMT).
The Grauniad today quotes the European Automobile Manufacturers Association (ACEA) saying sales of all cars were down by a sixth in August 2024, but sales of EVs were 44% down on sales in August 2023.
Reading other reports I see the Grauniad is reporting only the EV fall in Germany, although it does not specifically say this. Misleading.
Why are hybrids promoted?
What logic favours two small engines where formerly there was one?
How does that improve economy?
Geoff S
It depends if they are mild hybrids or plug-ins. If I understand it correctly, a mild hybrid is a motor driving the same transmission link as the ICE engine. During normal driving the battery charges and discharges to add power as needed, or to recharge from regenerative braking. This means that at those very short periods when the car is demanding most power, and when the ICE is at its least fuel efficient in terms of power produced, a lot of the load is taken by the electric motor. But its for seconds only. So this enables you to get the same performance as from a much bigger ICE engine, but with better fuel economy, and the ICE engine can be sized and tunded to best performance in more steady state driving.
But you do not drive on the electric motor, its purely for peak power assistance, at startup or at acceleration from very slow speeds.
Its not overly complex, the battery is very small (by comparison to plug-ins). Its not a whole separate drive train. And the fuel economy difference is surprisingly large, at least from larger cars. The small Fords it doesn’t make much difference. But the next size up, the difference is very large, and the Toyota Prius, which is the gold standard of these things, the mileage difference from the average ICE is very large.
They are also much cheaper to make than plug-ins, because the main cost element of these is the battery, so the very small battery means far cheaper. And finally, they are no heavier than an ICE car, whereas of course the problem with the plug ins is that you are always carrying around this huge weight of battery to avoid range anxiety.
Mild hybrids are a significant technical advance in design over conventional ICE cars. They sell on their merits, there is no need for any regulatory compulsion. Unlike pure EVs, which are meeting buyer resistance.
The middle range plug-in hybrid is a bit different – this is like the Ford Kuga, for instance, with a range of about 50 miles on pure electric. These do seem to be quite a bit more complicated, bigger battery and motor, and they are also seem to be more expensive. And you have to go to the trouble of plugging them in, probably overnight, if you want to get the advantage of being able to drive solely on electric.
My impression, though I’m not at all an expert, is that mild hybrids are currently the way to go. As a user they are indistinguishable from regular ICE, just more economical. Though like any modern car they will be full of electronic nonsense that you neither need nor want, so probably a three year old one is the best bet. From the generation when automatic lane enforcement and speed limit braking was an option, not an opt-out at every startup.
How are they more economical?
You have a certain mass of auto to move from A to B.
Used to be done by Internal Combustion Engine ICE.
Then they added electric motors with extra mass. Maybe also made the ICE smaller, lighter. If the combines gross weight exceeds the ICE weight, the design has gone backwards.
With plug-ins, are promoters hiding behind the “free” electrical fuel or accounting it properly?
I simply cannot understand that two engines and more complexity generates a saving. Geoff S
Very nice, good work.
I still have ant someone to tell me what they plan to do with all of that gasoline? If you want, and need, diesel, marine fuel oil and jet fuel in the same, or greater, quantities that you get today you’re still going to make a large amount of gasoline. It’s in the chemistry. You could adjust refining operations a bit but you’re still going to make a lot of gasoline. Where is that going to go?
Yes, government mandate
Yes because what we really want are proper ICE;s
Really don’t think so. Have you driven a mild hybrid? If you didn’t know, you would not notice any difference from a standard ICE car. Just lower gas consumption. Mild hybrids would be selling without any government mandate, simply on their merits. I am not as persuaded by full plug-in hybrids however, and as for full EVs, they are meeting severe and increasing buyer resistance.
So this is the point where government determination to move to electric meets the refusal of the public to spend their money that way. We shall see. Governments have very many means of coercion – differential road tax, parking fees, even charges per mile, straightforward bans. There’s no doubt they can force EVs on everyone if they are really determined.
We are approaching the crunch point in the EU and the UK. If the governments do not blink, the auto industry is in severe trouble and with it their re-election prospects. But if they do, one of the flagship projects of net zero is out the window, and that’s probably the beginning of the end for the whole thing.
Eight Billion Vehicle miles are driven in the USA every day. The probability of electrifying them in this century is lower than Unicorns being farmed on the White House lawn.
Current EV usage doesn’t even scratch the surface, despite the hype.
I was told that, due to the emissions being much higher during the build compared with conventional cars, you had to drive 60,000 miles to ‘break even’ with the emissions of a petrol car. Is this true?
My plugin Pacifica hybrid van does great. Got 36 mpg on last trip, 250 miles in four hours total including rests stops so was not driving slow. In some areas, like Massachusetts, it is cheaper to just use gas and not charge it. All depends on the price of gas and electricity in your area.
BTW, before you insult my blood line, I know the Pacifica has the worst rating of any car for reliability by Consumer Reports. I have had few problems (mainly the HV battery was replaced under warranty), and the big ticket items like engine and transmission are very reliable, according to CR. The 12V battery is now 5 years old. Try getting that with a Toyota or Honda vehicle.
Bottom line: Don’t believe everything your read.