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Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 2:43 am

The other day I got into a discussion about the lack of meaning of the average difference of temperatures with a 30-year base line (I say differences, not anomalies because anomalies suggest that there is something wrong). Averages discard much information, especially because opposite extremes can cancel each other out, partially or even completely. Silly as it is, it is what is touted as the infamous 1.5 degree climate goal

Looking at the standard deviation would make more sense, even though that still would not have a physical meaning. What do we know of how the standard deviation in temperature is developing?

Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 3:00 am

During a speech in Pasco, Washington, in 1991, Dixie Lee Ray denounced the growing number of scientists advancing theories of climate change by telling her audience to “beware of averages. The average person has one breast and one testicle.”

rhs
Reply to  Steve Case
April 14, 2024 4:02 pm

The average person is really mean..

Reply to  Steve Case
April 14, 2024 8:31 pm

These days it’s probably marginally more than one breast and marginally less than one testicle. What a timeline it is.

Richard Greene
Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 3:03 am

“Looking at the standard deviation would make more sense,:

It would make more sense to get on with our lives and stop thinking about the average temperature. If it seems too hot, lose weight and turn on the AC. And all pretty girls should wear string bikinis to keep cool.

Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 3:41 am

“anomalies suggest that there is something wrong”

Reminds me of how too many weather persons on TV will say something like “today will be 4 degrees above normal”. That’s sooo stupid.

Scissor
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 14, 2024 5:48 am

A democrat with actual scientific knowledge that tells the truth would be an anomoly.

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 7:00 am

She’s one of the brightest lights in the left side of the House.

Reply to  karlomonte
April 16, 2024 2:20 am

This is true, and the reason why we should not vote for Democrats.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 14, 2024 10:06 pm

Yet they will also say that tomorrow’s temperature will be 3 degrees below average. Always “normal” if it is going to be hotter, “average” for cooler.

Reply to  Retired_Engineer_Jim
April 16, 2024 2:25 am

I was watching Fox Weather yesterday and they had three maps of the U.S. displayed on the tv, each one representing one day, and the caption for each showed that in the first one 240 million Americans would be experiencing “above average” temperatures and then the next day, as a weather front moves through, there were 220 million Americans experiencing “above average” temperatures and then the next day it was down to 217 million Americans experiencing “above average” temperatures.

It gets kind of ridiculous after a while.

In my neck of the woods, the temperatures are about average. 🙂 And I’m located right about in the middle of all those maps.

Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 6:59 am

Climate science routinely ignores the standard deviations from all the multitude of averages they calculate. If they did, the impossibly small “error bars” they claim would disappear.

Another bogus claim is that systematic biases in air temperature data magically transform into random ones when lots of stations are clumped together, then disappear.

And yes, averaging throws away a lot of information.

Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 9:36 am

Temperature is an intensive property and cannot be added. Therefore cannot be averaged especially over the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intensive_and_extensive_properties#Extensive_properties

Reply to  mkelly
April 14, 2024 11:22 pm

But velocity is also an intensive property…

Eng_Ian
Reply to  Rainer Bensch
April 15, 2024 3:04 pm

You can add velocities. For example, the total velocity of a ball being thrown forward by a passenger on a moving train.

You can, (simply), add when the vectors are in the same orientation, you vector add when they are not aligned.

Nothing tricky about that.

So does that mean that the concept that you can’t add an intensive property is falsified?

Reply to  Art Slartibartfast
April 14, 2024 8:56 pm

Something that has confused me is why a 30 year period is used at all. In light of the discovery of the AMO/PDO ocean current cycles with periods that are roughly double that period, you are all but guaranteed to find that the climate is either warming or cooling (at times dramatically or seemingly alarmingly).

Imagine if we had chosen a period of 12 hours to define the “climate” in a region (it wouldn’t work globally for fairly obvious reasons). You would find that there would be apparent dramatic “warming” in the morning followed by equally dramatic “cooling” in the evening and into the night. “Scientists” would create models that predict that, given the rate of temperature increase by 10am, the temperature will increase to well over 100C by midnight the next day. By late afternoon, their models will predict the entire region to freeze solid by morning. But, these apparent changes are just cyclical fluctuations that do not result in long term changes. Although there remain long term changes (annual seasonal changes for instance). Now, this contrived example is obviously absurd. But it is no different from looking at any cyclical signal using the wrong sampling period.

So, what period should be used? 30 years may have seemed to be a reasonable time period before the AMO/PDO were known about. Perhaps you could use a 30 year period, but you would have to include a cyclical correction to account for the expected changes in order to observe any residual signal. But, that residual signal could well be the result of longer cycles, with periods of hundreds or thousands of years. Any anthropogenic changes to the climate can only be claimed once all known cyclical changes have been taken into account, which may be impossible as there are likely signals that we do not yet know of (and their waveforms are very likely not smooth sine waves, but may oscillate relatively rapidly from one state to the other).

There is probably not any real easy answer to this though. We simply don’t have enough quality data to use a reasonable timespan, something like 150 years would give a full 2 cycles of AMO/PDO, which would go a long way to accounting for those cycles, but then may have issues with influence from longer cycles.

Reply to  MarkH
April 16, 2024 2:40 am

“Something that has confused me is why a 30 year period is used at all. In light of the discovery of the AMO/PDO ocean current cycles with periods that are roughly double that period, you are all but guaranteed to find that the climate is either warming or cooling (at times dramatically or seemingly alarmingly)”

Maybe that’s why the climate alarmists use a 30-year period.

Going by history, it looks to me like 30 years is about half a climate cycle.

Of course, the bogus Hockey Stick chart does its best to eliminate any significcant weather cycles in the past, but we know from unmodified, regional charts that it was just as warm in the recent past as it is today, but this doesn’t show up on a bogus Hockey Stick chart because the climate alarmists can’t have a period in the past that is equal to today’s warmth, otherwise their claims of unprecedented warmth today is shown to be false. So they lie about the temperature profile.

Below is a U.S. chart showing the cyclical nature of the climate alongside a bogus, bastardized Hockey Stick chart which for the most part eliminates the cyclical nature of the climate, which was the purpose of the bastardization. The climate alarmists wanted to fool us into thinking we are living in the hottest times in human history.

All the unmodified, regional charts from around the world have the same/similar cyclical temperature profile as the U.S. chart, and none of them have the “hotter and hotter and hotter” temperature profile of the bogus Hockey Stick chart.

The bogus, bastardized Hockey Stick chart is the BIG LIE of climate science.

Hansen-USchart-verses-Hockey-Stick-chart
April 14, 2024 2:43 am

The Global Warming Potential Number of any greenhouse gas is an inverse function of its concentration in the atmosphere and has nothing to do with its absorption spectrum.

CH4 1800 ppb GWP 86
N2O 380 ppb GWP 273
CFC 4 ppb GWP ~8000

Richard Greene
Reply to  Steve Case
April 14, 2024 2:58 am

The GWP Global Warming Potential is the ratio of the warming caused by a substance to the warming caused by a similar mass of CO2. 

These are BS numbers

Actual climate effects depend on the quantity of gas and the effects WITH existing water vapor and CO2. Not just the isolated effects in lab spectroscopy with artificially dried air.

The actual warming effects of all three gases you mention, combined, could be too small to mesure.

Claims about NO2 make me laugh.

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 3:27 am

“The actual warming effects of all three gases you mention, combined, could be too small to measure.”
_____________________________

Could?

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 3:44 am

“Claims about NO2 make me laugh.” I’ll give you a thumbs up for that one.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 14, 2024 5:05 am

Except NO2 is Nitrogen Dioxide and is poisonous, not Nitrous Oxide (N20 laughing gas).

Richard Greene
Reply to  JohnC
April 14, 2024 6:16 am

Please don’t ruin a lame joke
NO2 was not funny

Reply to  JohnC
April 14, 2024 6:31 am

OK, I’ll convert it to a thumbs down. 🙂

Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 2:45 am

The climate emergency is a fake crisis

Nut Zero is a fake engineering project

The Transition to Leftist Fascism is very real

CO2 as a boogeyman, and Nut Zero control of energy, are being used to control people. The goal is Rule by Leftist “Experts”. Called fascism in the past.

Climate Confuser Games
CO2 boogeyman
Nut Zero
— Ruinables
—– Bird Shedders
+ Jumpin’ Joe Bribe’em
= Fascism

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 3:19 am

Nut Zero is a fake engineering project”

I think I have to politely disagree with you on that.

Nut Zero has absolutely NOTHING to do with engineering…

.. if it did, it would be thrown in the dustbin quick smart.

It is a baseless virtue-seeking idiotology… nothing more… maybe a lot less. !

Richard Greene
Reply to  bnice2000
April 14, 2024 6:24 am

That’s about I meant by fake
There are Nut Zero costs and labor hours inputs but almost no Nut Zero outputs: CO2 levels keeps rising and the percentage of global primary energy from hydrocarbon fuels barely changed in a decade.

Bird shedders and solar panels are being built and EVs are being bought.

But only about 20 nations seem to care about Nut Zero. The other 175 nations are not part of Nut Zero, so it can’t accomplish much, except wasting money. And maybe some blackouts.

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 4:41 am

“The Transition to Leftist Fascism is very real”

That’s true. The Fascists are very close to taking over.

It looks to me like just one guy, and a whole lot of voters, stands in their way.

Richard Greene
Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 6:30 am

If the Dumbocrats think they can’t win again with election fraud, they could easily put Trump in prison before election day. With 91 felony charges, beating every charge would be a miracle in a blue city.

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 16, 2024 2:51 am

Every one of the charges against Trump are bogus and will eventually be thrown out of court. The radical Democrats are just making it up as they go.

That’s not to say that a New York jury might not find Trump guilty of something right before the election, but even that will be thrown out of court eventually.

I think Trump can still run for president from jail, and if he is jailed, I would say that will motivate a LOT of people to go vote for him.

The Biden Administration will probably have to give Trump a whole Prison Pod to himself since he will need to take the Secret Service with him.

Simon
Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 11:52 am

I see the odds have now evened up between Trump and Biden. The abortion issue seems to be the problem for Trump. Gonna be close….
https://www.ladbrokes.com.au/sports/politics/usa/us-elections/2024-us-presidential-election/165557b2-4c37-403a-940f-f14ca7b849aa

Reply to  Simon
April 14, 2024 9:47 pm

Nutter.

Simon
Reply to  karlomonte
April 14, 2024 10:01 pm

Ah there he is the rabbid racist Trumpster. It is so funny how you get things soooo wrong, then go all “conspiracy theory” when you lose elections/court cases and your widdle world just doesn’t make sense. Gonna be fun this week watching the woman he screwed telling the world about the integrity of the man. I mean seriously… what sort of man bonks a porn star while your wife is at home breast feeding the new born baby?

Reply to  Simon
April 16, 2024 2:54 am

The porn star wrote and signed a letter denying any sexual contact with Trump at any time.

Was she lying then, or is she lying now?

Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 16, 2024 6:18 pm

Here is a copy of Stormy Daniel’s denial of a sexual affair with Trump and that she took “hush money” from Trump.

Official Statement of Story Daniels

January 30, 2018

To Whom It May Concern:

Over the past few weeks I have been asked countless times to comment on reports of an alleged sexual relationship I had with Donald Trump many, many, many years ago.

The fact of the matter is that each party to this alleged affair denied its existence in 2006, 2011, 2016, 2017 and now again in 2018. I am not denying this affair because I was paid “hush money” as has been reported in overseas owned tabloids. I am denying this affair because it never happened.

I will have no other comment on this matter. Please feel free to check me out on Instagam at @thestormydaniels.

Thank You

Stormy’s signature

Gregory Woods
Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 5:33 am

Other than that what is wrong with AGW agenda?

Richard Greene
Reply to  Gregory Woods
April 14, 2024 6:33 am

AGW is real, mild and beneficial
CAGW is a fantasy climate

Denying both AGW and CAGW does not work because AGW is real AND ALMOST 100% OF CLIMATE SCIENTISTS HAVE BELIEVED THAT SINCE 1896.

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 7:02 am

I was unaware that climate scientists existed in 1896 so hanks for he info.

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 8:35 am

The Transition to Leftist Fascism is very real

These commie nazi zombie sharks at it again! 😀

Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 4:55 pm

Yep.. you are !

strativarius
April 14, 2024 3:11 am

Scientific integrity

there is not a reliable evidence base upon which to make clinical decisions

The Cass report
https://cass.independent-review.uk/home/publications/final-report/

When ideology takes over

Mr.
Reply to  strativarius
April 14, 2024 7:05 am

Just like there’s no ISO standard for “global average temperature” constructs to comply with.

So anyone can cast their fly in this pond, and one person’s catch is as edible as the next.

(that’s if you’re into eating carp 🙁 )

April 14, 2024 3:21 am

European nuclear plants put out of work by green power surge

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/business/2024/04/09/europe-nuclear-industry-renewables-surge/

French Revolution: Cyclists Now Outnumber Motorists In Paris
https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2024/04/06/french-revolution-cyclists-now-outnumber-motorists-in-paris/

The world keeps moving. 😀

Ron Long
Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 3:42 am

Looks like the French better start pedaling faster. The French GDP in 2022 was 2.5%, in 2023 was 0.9%, and in 2023 last quarter was 0.1%.

Richard Greene
Reply to  Ron Long
April 14, 2024 6:38 am

Slower GDP growth
= fewer CO2 emissions

Someday socialists will claim recessions are actually good news because they cut “carbon pollution” (translation: Now that we screwed up the economy, we’ll try to convince you that was a smart thing to do.)

Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 10:40 pm

I’ll take “What is Degrowth Marxism?” for several trillion dollars, Alex.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 3:52 am

When those nukes shut down- you won’t want to be there at night or when there’s no wind.

As for the bikes- it’s funny but just a few decades ago- we saw images of people in China going to work on bikes and scooters – now they’re going to work in nice cars. Soon, millions of Chinese will visit Europe and take photos of the peasants in front of their huts.

Ron Long
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 14, 2024 6:55 am

He shoots……..he scores!

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 14, 2024 7:03 am

What happens when to England if the nuclear plants shut down?

Reply to  mkelly
April 16, 2024 3:00 am

Yeah, doesn’t England buy a lot of electricity from France?

strativarius
Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 4:17 am

The world keeps moving.

Despite your attempt at stasis.

Scissor
Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 5:41 am

Are you serious? Seems like you might have a hydrino in your boson.

Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 5:46 am

LMAO – usual BS

From your link:

The city’s socialist mayor Anne Hidalgo has pushed through a great many anti-motoring measures during her two administrations—such as reducing the number of parking places, restricting access by SUVs, and closing some major roads to motorists

So the reason why there are more cyclists is because Parisians are having their freedom to travel how they wish curtailed by “their betters”, they are being priced out of their cars.

Qu’ils mangent de la brioche

Viva la revolución!

Scissor
Reply to  Redge
April 14, 2024 6:50 am

It was a bogus study. All conclusions were derived from about 3000 GPS trackers.

Fran
Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 11:13 am

So Parisians are cycling to work in winter? They must be a lot tougher than Vancouverites, let alone the people of Toronto.

Reply to  Fran
April 14, 2024 11:28 am

Scissor
Reply to  MyUsername
April 14, 2024 3:48 pm

That guy biked grandpa down to the euthanasia center and he didn’t complain at all, at least not after his treatment.

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 11:37 pm

People not needing oversized emotional support vehicles scares you, huh?

April 14, 2024 3:38 am

Wokeachusetts?

Hah-vid U. owns a 4,000 acre forest in central part of the state. They do research there- but not forestry research, that’s too beneath them- so they focus on obscure “science” there. It’s also a location for putting on big events for researchers from across the planet- the elite of the elite to pontificate about their important research. Once every year they put on a really big event which I used to attend because it’s only a few miles from my home to get “continuing ed credits” but I was bored to tears. Too many “researchers” with “man buns” and nothing at all relevant to real forestry problems. The place also has grad students and post docs there for months at a time to get their association with the almighty Hah-vid. They also have guest speakers for much of the year and in case they ever have anyone talking about a subject I might be interested in I got on their email list. The following email is the latest. The following is the latest showing just how woke Hah-vid is. Oh, by the way, that term “LTER” stands for “long term ecological research” which apparently is the mission of the Hah-vid Forest as an institution.
*************

Dear Harvard Forest staff, HF LTER co-Is, and HF LTER graduate students,

 

We’re writing to request your help in populating our speaker roster for Harvard Forest’s 2024 Fall Seminar Series, which will run from September to December. 

 

With inspiration from the UMass BRiDGE seminar program, and in an effort to amplify the voices of individuals from groups historically excluded in STEM, we request your nominations of speakers that will help us make progress toward a diverse and inclusive series, with at least 50% of speakers being BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, people of color); at least 50% of speakers being women, non-binary or otherwise gender-diverse individuals; and 25% of speakers being early career scientists (including graduate students and post-docs). Additional types of diversity, including representation of relevant disciplinary fields beyond plant biology (though plant biology is also great!), are welcome and encouraged.

 

Seminars are live-streamed, and speakers may present in person or virtually. An honorarium of $200 is offered to all in-person speakers and $100 for virtual presentations. Speakers attending from within reasonable distance will be reimbursed for travel and offered housing accommodations.

 

Our seminar committee will select from the nominees a final roster of speakers and alternates, and circle back to you, the nominators, before sending out invitation letters to speakers with date options (all Wednesdays, biweekly, beginning Sept. 4th).

 

To nominate a speaker,

please fill out this brief survey

 

 

Thanks,

Josh

 

 

Joshua S. Plisinski

He/Him

GIS and Research Tech.

Harvard Forest, Harvard University

324 N. Main St, Petersham MA 01366

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
April 16, 2024 3:06 am

You should nominate Donald Trump as a speaker. If they want diversity, they need to have a white guy involved.

April 14, 2024 3:53 am

How’s that “warmest year on record” doing in the Arctic?

Well, the PIOMAS estimate of Arctic Sea Ice Volume for March 2024 is a touch above March 2011. The trend looks pretty flat since then. The numbers are in 1000’s of cubic kilometers.

https://psc.apl.uw.edu/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/schweiger/ice_volume/PIOMAS.2sst.monthly.Current.v2.1.txt

Reply to  David Dibbell
April 14, 2024 12:52 pm

The trend looks pretty flat since then.”

The eyes have it. !

Piomas-2011-2023
Reply to  bnice2000
April 14, 2024 11:07 pm

y-axis units?

strativarius
April 14, 2024 4:26 am

Ever considered visiting an heat pump?

A new service aims to help would-be heat pump owners to book a visit with households that already have one installed, through a website launched by the innovation charity Nesta.


The site, VisitAHeatPump.com, allows users to locate one of 150 households that have signed up to host interested visitors to look at their low-carbon heating systems.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2024/apr/11/uk-heat-pump-adopters-open-up-homes-to-encourage-others-to-ditch-gas-boilers

Needless to say it’s a waste of time

Reply to  strativarius
April 14, 2024 4:43 am

The first thing they should do is look at the heat pump owner’s electric bill.

strativarius
Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 4:47 am

Excellent point

Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 5:49 am

The only people who would sign up to “VisitAHeatPump” and allow others to visit are the virtue signallers.

Perhaps a few of us should visit to grill the owners 🤣

Dave Andrews
Reply to  Redge
April 14, 2024 8:02 am

They might also be receiving a fee per visitor – helps with the increased costs of installing and running “that blasted heat pump”!

Rich Davis
Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 9:28 am

And visit on the coldest day of winter

April 14, 2024 4:55 am

The Mad Mullahs of Iran launched a missile and drone attack on Israel last night.

Israel and allies apparently shot down nearly all the missiles and drones, although the latest report is about 30 Israelis were injured.

Benjamin Netanyahu must take this opportunity to destroy the nuclear weapons-making facilities of the Mad Mullahs. Nothing is more important than this. This is an existential threat to the State of Israel and they must stop the progress now before the Mad Mullahs get a functional nuclear weapon. Just imagine what these madmen would do if they had a nuclear weapon. That can’t be allowed to happen and now is the time to destroy this threat, no matter the consequences.

Don’t listen to Biden. You know what needs to be done, BB. Do it. Biden and the Democrats are appeasers of dictators and following their appeasement advice is definitely the wrong way to go in this case.

Destroy Iran’s nuclear facilities and save Israel, and a lot of other nations, in the process.

And destroy the drone making facilites and the rocket making facilities, too. Make Russia go elsewhere for their drones.

When you are done, the Mad Mullahs should be dead or disarmed. If you disarm them, the Iranian people will overthrow the Mad Mullahs. They are just waiting for the opportunity. Give it to them now.

The bottom line is: Israel must take this opportunity to destroy the most dangerous thing they face: Religious fanatics in possession of nuclear weapons.

Just think: One nuclear weapon detonated over the East Coast of the United States would knock out half the nation. We don’t want to allow this capablity to be acquired by the Mad Mullah’s of Iran.

Don’t listen to Biden, BB. I know he’s trying to get you to back off, but you can’t back off if you know what’s good for Israel. You know what needs to be done, so do it.

And don’t destroy Iran’s oil production facilities just yet. Save them for the Iranian people, after they depose the Mad Mullahs. Only do short-term damage to their facilities.

strativarius
Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 5:54 am

Everybody is scared witless when it comes to matters islamic, be it at home or abroad. The UK repealed the old blasphemy laws in 2008 only to have them gradually reintroduced again from 2015 following Charlie Hebdo. No UK publisher ran the cartoon, none dared upset the Ummah.

A school in Batley Yorkshire had been showing the Mohammed cartoon in a religious education class on… blasphemy. For a few years it went under the radar and then the fundamentalists took note and, yes, they got righteously upset.

“A new report, published by the government’s Commission for Countering Extremism and produced by extremism academic Alexander Meleagrou-Hitchens, has lifted the lid on a form of extremism that the great and good are also desperate to downplay: Islamic anti-blasphemy extremism, which appears to have gained a grim foothold in the UK of late. Indeed, as Meleagrou-Hitchens details, the string of ‘blasphemy’ scandals we’ve seen in recent years – from the Batley Grammar school teacher, who was suspended and forced into hiding after he showed his students Muhammad cartoons; to the Lady of Heaven protests, which managed to shut down a supposedly ‘blasphemous’ film; to the Wakefield Koran incident, in which an autistic child and his family were menaced with death threats – were motored by activists with links to extremist anti-blasphemy groups.

The activists and imams who came to the fore during those shocking scandals – in which politicians, school leaders, cinema chains and police fell over themselves to cancel and condemn those accused of ‘blasphemy’ – were often at pains to say they did not support violence. As Adil Shahzad, one of the leading Batley Grammar protesters, put it, Muslims should make their views known in the ‘democratic way’. But, as Meleagrou-Hitchens diplomatically puts it, ‘the possibility of further anti-blasphemy violence is heightened by the activism of the groups and individuals’ in question. Not least because so many of the activists discussed in the report condemn violence with one breath and then praise murderous anti-blasphemy groups with the next.

Since the Satanic Verses controversy, Britain has developed a considerable network of groups posing as the voice of British Muslim outrage.”
https://www.spiked-online.com/2024/03/23/the-anti-blasphemy-bigots-must-be-confronted/

It’s no contest – at all- from the self-loathing, leukophobic state.

Reply to  strativarius
April 14, 2024 6:39 am

Open borders and debt kill nations. We’re in big trouble, too.

Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 10:43 pm

Open borders and a welfare state are a guarantee of disaster. You can have a welfare system OR open borders, but never both.

Reply to  Tom Abbott
April 14, 2024 6:49 am

Gaza has an area of 141 sq mi., which is about a third of the area of the NY county I grew up in. Before we go kinetic, I’d like to know why our vaunted ‘intelligence community’ didn’t have a clue that the events of last October 7th were in the works.

Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 6:58 am

I have no first-hand knowledge but there are accounts that claim the information was in the hands of the intelligence community. If true, people need to be fired, or possibly even put on trial.

Reply to  quelgeek
April 14, 2024 7:22 am

Kinda like the flight instructor in TX who was ignored by our FBI pre 9-11.

Mr.
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 7:17 am

Just like Jan 6th, the “intelligence community” is often an active participant in unrest.

Like rogue fire fighters who deliberately start fires so they can be called upon to put them out.

Self-actualization, I think Mazlow termed it.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 10:21 am

That is a very legitimate question, not some wild conspiracy theory. It has been over six months since the events of October 7th. If the evidence has not been collected by now, it has likely been successfully hidden.

It has been apparent to me for 25 years or more that certain powerful interests not necessarily aligned with US national interests have been maneuvering to get America to fight a war with Iran. For a time it appeared as though they had Iran surrounded with forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. The end game was somehow thwarted and the senseless, pointless loss of blood and treasure has been a disaster for us.

Admittedly I have nothing but pure speculation but it would come as no surprise to me at all if the decision was made at the highest levels to have an ‘intelligence failure’ as a pretext to eventually escalating to an attack on Iran’s weapons program.

That Israel’s national interests demand the destruction of Iran’s nuclear capabilities is manifestly obvious. It is far from obvious that US interests are at all aligned with this, except that by doing Israel’s bidding for 75+ years, we have earned the permanent enmity of the entire Muslim world and now find ourselves too exposed to the risk of nuclear attack.

Reply to  Rich Davis
April 14, 2024 2:42 pm

It’s been a clown show since Mosaddegh. It will certainly not get better now that the Democrat Left and the formerly Republican (Never Trump) Neo-Cons have joined up to promote interventions at home and abroad.

Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 5:07 am

The atmosphere holds 215 more CO2 molecules than CH4 molecules. A doubling of the CO2 molecules has 30/7 more climate influence than doubling the CH4 molecules (W&H). Then each new CH4 molecule must have 50 times more climate influence than a new CO2 molecule and one new ton methane accumulated in the atmosphere must have 138 times more influence than a new ton of CO2.

Richard Greene
Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 7:21 am

CH4 absorption frequencies are overlapped by water vapor so the warming effect is very small

The methane threat is almost 100% BS.

Science Under Attack

Methane PaperREV2.indd (co2coalition.org)

Bjarne Bisballe
Reply to  Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 8:11 am

Got the 30 : 7 from Wijngaarden & Happer – not trustworthy?

Richard Greene
Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 5:13 pm

Te effects of greenhouse gases in dry air are different from the effects when there is water vapor in the air.

Also consider the very tiny quantity of CH4

Richard M
Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 5:32 pm

Also from W&H … “Table 4 shows that for optically thin conditions, the forcing power per molecule is about the same for all greenhouse gases,”

Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 9:45 am

Fun with numbers, BB. Fig. 10 says doubling CO2 results in 3.0 watts of forcing, while Fig 12 says doubling of methane results in .7 Watts of warming. Thats about 1/4 as “bad” in my books. Admittedly there is 200 times as much CO2 as CH4 so one might be able to multiply that out to say it is 50 times as bad on a molar basis, and then add in a ratio of molecular weight to get it up to around 100 times as bad on a weight basis, then assume 2.5% of natural gas leaks out of the gathering system, so natural gas is worse than burning coal, etc. Personally, I’ll stick with 1/4 as bad, plus declining every week after emission by ozone and UV as the most rational approach.

Bjarne Bisballe
Reply to  DMacKenzie
April 14, 2024 10:11 am

The fast break down and the low concentration makes methane a weak player. It i simple to calculate: 600 Mt emitted per year, 30 Mt stay in the atmosphere

Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 8:15 am

Except CH4 breaks down in atmosphere to CO2. (2CH4 + 4O2) —-> 2CO2 + 4H2O

So methane quickly starts loosing any perceived large influence.

Bjarne Bisballe
Reply to  mkelly
April 14, 2024 8:19 am

True, but my calculation is ok

Reply to  Bjarne Bisballe
April 14, 2024 10:09 am

Methane enters the atmosphere and starts decomposing, unlike CO2

Water vapor condensing releases heat and evaporating water requires heat
That process is vital for distribution of energy to areas that have low insulation.
That process is the control knob, not trace quantities of CO2

April 14, 2024 5:29 am

HYDRINO ® AND THE SunCell® IS 200 TIMES CHEAPER THAN COMPETING POWER SOURCES. HYDRINO ® IS VERIFIED TO BE DARK MATTER.
JE Ommang, Electronics Engineer, Examined Lead Assessor Quality Sys.
Ex-Project Manager Topside Oil Well Engineering & Startup Oil & Gas wells Oseberg platforms
https://www.climatesolutions.tech/what-is

200x
strativarius
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:50 am

Hydrino®”
I bet it is.

Reply to  strativarius
April 14, 2024 7:03 am

Ref:  
The Brilliant Light Power Story
The Most Disruptive Company In History
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-brilliant-light-power-story

 The Hydrino Hypothesis: Chapter 1
An Introduction to the Grand Unified Theory of Classical Physics

https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-1
The Hydrino Hypothesis: Chapter 2
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-2
The Hydrino Hypothesis: Chapter 3
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-3
The Hydrino Hypothesis Chapter 4
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-4
The Hydrino Hypothesis Chapter 5
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-5
The Hydrino Hypothesis Chapter 6
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-hydrino-hypothesis-chapter-6
The Misleading Brilliant Light Power Wikipedia Page
Correcting Wikipedia’s Misinformation
https://hydrogenrevolution.substack.com/p/the-misleading-brilliant-light-power

Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 8:25 am

Well over $100 million in investments and grants since 1991 and still disrupting, no energy production, however,

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 9:25 am

BLP is operating a SunCell® at commercial scale (250 kW)

A-plasma-test-involving-hydrino-production_BrLP
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 7:05 am

Spammer.

Reply to  karlomonte
April 14, 2024 8:38 am

Well, Spammer…. when providing real info from Professor Jonathan Phillips.«Climate Solution Denier Information» (CSDI):

«Information that delays the Climate Solutions and the end to the Climate Crisis, hinder the moderation of the climate change policies and spread Climate Scare & Climate Depression among the young population.»

Is that what you think this is?

Electron_paramagnetic_resonance_proof_for_the_existence_of_molecular_hydrino_-_International-Journal-of-Hydrogen-Energy
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 9:06 am

You missed the point—you are spamming your free energy website and nonsense.

Reply to  karlomonte
April 14, 2024 9:30 am

Promoting the website, yes. But in addition informing that we have several new renewable energy sources. ClimateSolutions.Tech is deeply concerned about the impact of climate change policies both to the world’s poorest people and the environment.

We do not need the old renewables: Wind, Solar, Bio, Wave. They cannot solve the Climate Crisis. Nor do we need «blue» hydrogen, carbon capture/storage, new battery factories and similar subsidy activities. Carbon Credits and CO2 Taxation have not solved anything and emissions increases. The new trend of disrupting the ecosystem with deep-sea mining for seabed polymetallic nodule / minerals to make EV-batteries is not needed. In the near future we do not need batteries for real electric cars, boats, ships. Several companies are working on replacement technologies. US/Italian company is soon to do road testing of ZPE-charging for EVs and now takes pre-order for ZPE-units.
We need real Climate Solution Technologies. Not expensive installations based on breeze and some sunlight

Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 10:56 am

The Brilliant Light Power website says that Randell Mills is “A Living Legend, Greater Than Einstein and Tesla Combined.”

Do you believe that?

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 11:56 am

The mind behind those discoveries is the genius polymath Dr. Randell L. Mills, founder of the company Brilliant Light Power (BrLP).

After high school, he attended Franklin & Marshall college and graduated with a chemistry degree with highest honors, winning numerous awards and accolades in the process by virtue of his academic prowess. Notably, he went on to collaborate for many years with his chemistry professor, Dr. John Farrell, who proclaimed him the best and brightest student Franklin & Marshall had ever seen. 
 
He then attended Harvard Medical School (HMS), where he garnered top grades. His extraordinary intellect allowed him to complete most of the required coursework in 3 years, so he elected to spend what would have been his 4th year at HMS studying physics and electrical engineering under Professor Hermann Haus at MIT.1

While doing research with Professor Haus on free electron lasers for the Reagan administration’s Strategic Defense Initiative (informally known as the “Star Wars” program), Dr. Mills began to question the accepted explanation for the nature of the electron by standard quantum mechanics (SQM), the reigning paradigm of atomic scale physics, which discards the classical physical laws of Newtonian dynamics and Maxwell’s equations governing electromagnetism.

SQM instead models the bound electron as an infinitely small point particle that exists as a probability density function around the nucleus. Classical physical laws do not apply in this model. Dr. Mills found this mathematical description of the electron to be unintuitive and unsatisfying, and unable to provide insight into what an electron actually is in terms of physical principles. He is in good company, as Einstein also never fully accepted aspects of quantum mechanics.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 1:11 pm

Where are all these cars and other devices using this “incredible” discovery.

THEY DON’T EXIST. !

They are “poised to”, though… just “believe” [spooky music]

Scissor
Reply to  bnice2000
April 14, 2024 4:11 pm

Latest BLP plan is to roll out prototypes in 2026. To date, the duration of testing of individual pre-production prototypes is about 20 minutes. Some say they need to get this up to about an hour for demonstration purposes.

Anyway, shares of stock can be obtained for $40,000 each. With the current number of shares outstanding, this equates to about a $5.5 billion valuation. This seems like a large valuation considering Mills says they have about $10 million in cash on hand. They’re trying to raise about $100 million prior to launching an IPO.

The next round or two of financing will, if successful, separate the suckers from the suckees. My opinion is that Mills will discover a “show stopper” and run away with some of the loot. We shall see.

The worst case for Mills is he takes a salary and pilfers some of what’s left of the the unused $10 million plus that from new “investors” and folds shop.

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 6:16 pm

I’m sure Randell Mills “believes” it. 😉

—–

real Climate Solution Technologies. “

WTF does that even mean…..

… meaningless garbage, anti-science goobledygoop.

Fran
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 11:24 am

This smells a bit like the add I’v seen for a gizmo that cuts your electricity bill by 90%.

Reply to  Fran
April 14, 2024 11:42 am

It is a re-hash of the water-powered cars from the 1970s.

Reply to  karlomonte
April 14, 2024 12:03 pm

Yes. and that worked. Therefore the inventor was killed after a large new coverage.

Stan_Meyer_Water_Fuel_Car
Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 4:16 pm

Someone asked previously is you had studied any thermodynamics. If you had, and had comprehended it, you would understand that Stan Meyer’s water car consumed more electrical energy than it produced in kinetic energy from the chemical combustion of hydrogen.

Reply to  Fran
April 14, 2024 12:01 pm

There are many fake technologies out there. Hydrino is not one of them.

A-plasma-test-involving-hydrino-production_BrLP
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:03 pm

Tell you what.

How about refrain from any further comment, until you have a working saleable product… that means you have sold, say, 500 items using your mythical non-technology.

I doubt we will ever hear from you again.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 15, 2024 3:42 pm

Looks like a white Minion without the eyes (or eye), overalls, or arms and legs.
Is your real name “Gru”?

If you want to put your own money into this, go for it.
If it works, I hope you get rich.
If it doesn’t work, I hope you bail before you go broke.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:17 pm

The fact they use the name “climatesolutions” shows it is just another offshoot of the whole climate scam.!

WT* is a “climate solution”… other than pure anti-science gibberish.

April 14, 2024 5:31 am

“We should abandon the fantasy of phasing out oil and gas and instead invest in them adequately reflecting realistic demand assumptions”.
CEO of Saudi Aramco, the world’s largest oil and gas company

“We should phase in new energy sources and technologies when they are genuinely ready, economically competitive and with the right infrastructure.”
CEO of Saudi Aramco, the world’s largest oil and gas company.

His conclusion is based on what he considers the failure of wind and solar to supply under 4 per cent of the world’s energy, less than 3 percent of vehicles being electric.
CEO of Saudi Aramco, the world’s largest oil and gas company

EV-MASSIVE-DISAPPOINTMENTApple_pulls_the_plug___kills_its_electric_car
Richard Greene
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 7:23 am

“We should abandon the fantasy of phasing out oil and gas”

And begin a new policy of phasing out leftists.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:12 pm

new energy sources and technologies when they are genuinely ready”

None exist except as fantasies… always 10 years away.. or “poised”.. on the brink !! 😉

April 14, 2024 5:37 am

HYDRINO ® IS ONE OF OUR NEW RENEWABLE ENERGY SOURCES

The old renewables like Wind, Solar, Bio have no future

Traditional Hydrogen and Carbon Capture and Storage (CCS) will not provide Climate Solutions

HYDRINO ® AND THE SunCell® IS 200 TIMES CHEAPER THAN COMPETING POWER SOURCES

HYDRINO ® IS VERIFIED TO BE DARK MATTER

CO2-FREE REAL GREEN LOW-COST POWERFUL

Power essentially all thermal, cooling, electrical, and motive applications

80+ patents worldwide, 100+ patent applications

Breakthrough Zero-CO2 Distributed Power Source: Brilliant Light Power, Inc. (BrLP) has developed a new, zero-pollution, zero-CO2 primary energy source based on a proprietary hydrogen plasma reaction that releases 200 times the energy of burning hydrogen.

THE FUEL IS WATER & THE FUTURE IS BRILLIANT

CNN_BrLP_2017_1
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:52 am

Is it gluten free?

Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 7:07 am

Probably, but it is also brain-cell free.

Reply to  karlomonte
April 14, 2024 8:25 am
Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 8:44 am

Junk article with a whole 1 citation. Very disrupting, indeed. Why was the hydrino retention time unreproducible? Why wouldn’t there be 3 allotropes of H2?

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 9:34 am

Mills has published extensively using a wide array of analytical techniques to demonstrate and characterize the Hydrino reaction. A full list of publications and reports can be found here.

Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 10:00 am

The questions I asked concern the very poor article that you linked above.

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 10:50 am

This is not a “very poor article” or “Junk article” as you state. If that was the case it would not have been published in International Journal of Hydrogen Energy

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0360319922022406

As Professor Jonathan Phillips states about the article:

Dr. Mills has faced scorn and strong opposition from proponents of the dominant paradigm that has hampered his ability to publish his excellent experimental work in top-tier journals.

 However, that may soon be changing. Here is a link to a very important paper that has been published in the International Journal of Hydrogen Energy, which is a fairly well-regarded publication.
 
The lead author is Professor Fred Hagen, a world class expert in the use of an analytical technique called electron paramagnetic resonance (EPR) spectroscopy. Professor Hagen of TU Delft (known as the MIT of Europe) has performed EPR spectroscopy on a Hydrino compound that can now be made on demand by BLP. 

The paper as a whole is hard for the layperson to interpret, but the punchline is not, as seen here:

“In summary, the present study provides compelling EPR spectroscopic and gas chromatographic evidence for the existence of molecular Hydrino, and, by inference, for the reality of atomic Hydrino, and it provides plausibility of the electron model in GUTCP. In more general terms our results are a significant test against falsification of GUTCP. In view of the possible far-reaching implications of this conclusion for the theory of quantum mechanics, for hydrogen-related chemistry, for astrophysics of dark matter, and for energy transduction and production technology, it is also offered as an urgent invitation to academia at large to repeat and extend the described experiments in lieu of refutation on quantum mechanical theoretical grounds.”3

Hopefully this paper will galvanize the scientific community to begin to engage with Dr. Mills’ work. It is unequivocal in its conclusion and is relatively easily replicated. Furthermore, Dr. Mills has indicated that other reputable institutions have replicated the findings of the EPR paper and plan to publish themselves. 

Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 11:08 am

Care to answer any of my questions above about this paper?

In my opinion, this paper, with a total of 1 citation is a shit article that should not have been published. The retention times given for “hydrino” are not even repeatable.

The journal is peer reviewed but has been criticized for an integrity issue. https://cen.acs.org/policy/publishing/Elsevier-journal-under-fire-for-rejecting-paper/101/web/2023/02

Anyway, the Brilliant Light Power website says that Randell Mills is “A Living Legend, Greater Than Einstein and Tesla Combined.” Do you believe that?

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 12:08 pm

The mind behind those discoveries is the genius polymath Dr. Randell L. Mills, founder of the company Brilliant Light Power (BrLP).

He is in good company, as Einstein also never fully accepted aspects of quantum mechanics.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 1:13 pm

This garbage has been around for quite a while.

But there is NOTHING that uses it in real life.

You have been CONNED.. or are being hired as a SHILL.

And you are being laughed at. !

Mr.
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 7:22 am

and what colors does it come in?

Reply to  Mr.
April 14, 2024 8:29 am

Traditional hydrogen, call it gray, green or blue, is just an energy carrier like a battery. It is not an energy source such as oil, the sun or Hydrino®. Using hydrogen the traditional way only result in loss of energy and some CO2-emission. This is not climate solution technology.

Making-‘Green-Hydrogen-From-Part-Time-Wind-and-Solar-Mission-Impossible
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:09 pm

Fantasies, all of them.. Including yours.

Not one of them is “climate solution” technology…. whatever that is meant to be. !!

The fact you even use that terminology shows how brain-washed you are.

Reply to  Frank from NoVA
April 14, 2024 8:23 am

Story At A Glance

  • A little known company named Brilliant Light Power has been developing a revolutionary hydrogen-based energy technology for the last 30 years.
  • The technology harnesses a reaction that catalyzes the transition of hydrogen to a lower-energy state. It releases roughly 200 times the energy of combusting hydrogen on a per atom basis. Think Fire 2.0.
  • This lower energy state has been dubbed “Hydrino” by Dr. Randell L. Mills, who theoretically predicted the state and experimentally verified its existence. He then founded Brilliant Light Power to commercialize Hydrino-based technology.
  • The dominant paradigm of physics says Hydrino can’t exist. The dominant paradigm is wrong. Scientific controversy and the challenges of harnessing an extraordinarily power-dense reaction previously unknown to science have kept the company off most people’s radar.
  • However, Brilliant Light Power now stands poised to upend the global economy and energy markets in unprecedented fashion and usher in a world of zero-carbon, zero-marginal cost, and zero-pollution energy production.
  • Their device, the SunCell, relies on the highly energetic Hydrino reaction. The SunCell is superior to all existing energy technologies on every metric.
  • Professor Jonathan Phillips
Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 10:04 am

Please list even one single commercial sales reference for the 250 kW reactor or please list a single press release showing licensing of the technology by a known reputable company.

Reply to  Scissor
April 14, 2024 10:56 am

Operating a SunCell® at commercial scale (250 kW) is not the same as a commercial sales reference.

Specifically, BLP is operating a SunCell® at commercial scale (250 kW) producing power levels that, upon finalization of engineering and design, can power essentially all power applications with no fuels or grid connection, projected $20/kW cap cost, $0.001 kW/h generation cost with no transmission, distribution, or demand charges, no supply chain issues, and zero pollution including CO2.

«I don’t really worry about skepticism. We have enough resources to get this done, and have 70 of the world’s largest corporations coming in and measuring.»

– Dr. Randall Mills 
CEO & Founder of Brilliant Light Power, Inc.

Scissor
Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 11:31 am

He’s been saying basically the same thing for over 30 years. He gets by with it because a sucker is born every minute.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 6:05 pm

How about refrain from any further comment, until you have a working saleable product…

… that means you have sold, say, 500 items using your mythical non-technology.

I doubt we will ever hear from you again.

Reply to  Jorn-Erik Ommang
April 14, 2024 1:16 pm

Developing for 30 years.

Yet ABSOLUTELY NOTHING uses it !

Do you realise how stupid you look !

Show us a pic of this clown “standing poised”.. !!

Richard Greene
April 14, 2024 6:53 am

While looking for a YouTube music video this morning, which I found, a fascinating pretty girl doing acrobatic tricks on a bicycle video popped up.

Starts slowly in the first minute, and the music is annoying (turn it down), but the tricks soon become unbelievable:

Girl Biker Performs – You Must See (youtube.com)

This was the song I was looking for:

Big Bad Voodoo Daddy – Go Daddy-O (youtube.com)

CD in Wisconsin
April 14, 2024 8:06 am

Actress Jane Fonda has recently opened her mouth again on the issue of climate change…..
“Jane Fonda decries inaction on climate, apologizes to the young: ‘Sorry that we’ve created this issue for you’”

https://tinyurl.com/2cbwr8ec

“The 86-year-old Fonda, who has been arrested while participating in past climate protests, tried to rev up famous faces at a Beverly Hills fundraiser against big oil in California, and later in the week, educate college students at USC Annenberg that the climate crisis is a “manifestation of racism, misogyny and patriarchy.””

She wants to lock up all the “white men” running the Big Oil companies. She is still as hard left as the day she travelled to Hanoi and went on North Vietnamese radio to speak out against U.S. servicemen fighting for the South.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnFVFz9d6vU

It is granted that she is a talented actress and looks great at age 86 and obviously takes good care of herself. Her position on climate and her political radicalism however no doubt leaves a very bad taste in the mouth of a lot of people, including me.

Mr.
Reply to  CD in Wisconsin
April 14, 2024 9:58 am

Fonda has always tried to carry her acting performances in to causes and politics.
Just another way to keep her name being mentioned in the media.

This seems to be an affliction that many Hollywood “stars” suffer from.

But, as always, look past what they’re exhorting we plebs to do, and look at what they personally actually do themselves to comply with the behavioral dictates of their causes.

Reply to  CD in Wisconsin
April 16, 2024 3:41 am

It must be hell living in Jane Fonda’s radical leftist world. There’s a white man around every corner.

Pat Smith
April 14, 2024 10:00 am

In a recent discussion in The Times about emissions of electric cars, I stated that an electric car produced far more emissions during manufacture than a conventional car and, as a result, you would have to drive it 60,000 miles on emissions-free electricity before it was ‘cleaner’ than an ICE car. At present, with more than half of electricity being produced by hydrocarbons, that cutover would never be reached. Another contributor criticised this statement strongly, stating that I was completely wrong and pointing me at a website with a handy calculator in which you could put in the type of car, number of miles, etc that would show me that electric cars are much cleaner. I found the website though not the calculator, handy or otherwise. So, am I right that in the current state of electricity production, electric cars can never be cleaner? Can anyone point me at a reliable paper on this? Thanks in advance for your help!

Scissor
Reply to  Pat Smith
April 14, 2024 11:28 am

The piece has links to a number of references. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2022/06/09/fact-check-electric-vehicles-emit-less-carbon-over-life-than-gas-cars/9900644002/

Most papers support the claim that EVs emit lower CO2 over auto lifetime and a break even mileage of 60,000 miles or even less. A lot depends on assumptions.

Fundamentally, however, heavy EVs require more energy to operate because they are heavier. For this reason, they also produce many times more particulate emissions from tire wear that ICE vehicles do.

Reply to  Pat Smith
April 14, 2024 2:34 pm

Unless you are paying a premium for a label, everything you buy is just a reflection of the energy that went into producing it.

If something needs government sanctioned theft to make it economic against competitors then you can guarantee it is more energy intensive.

Wind and solar are more energy intensive (read fossi, hydrol or nuclear fuel) than using the fuel directly because they need subsidies. Chine will end up burning around 4.6bnt of coal this year. Some of that will go to making stuff for wind turbines, solar panels and batteries that are sold to countries chasing NutZero.

EVs are still hugely expensive and even the subsidies do not make them an economic proposition. They use electricity that is ever more fossil fuel intensive.

Russell Cook
April 14, 2024 10:04 am

LancasterOnline newspaper poll question — “Bucks County is suing the oil industry, asserting that it systematically deceived the public about its role in accelerating global warming. Do you think the oil industry should be held accountable?

Vote here.

A week back, the hours-old results were 75%-yes, 25%-no, but in the interim time to today, that’s now shifted to 52% / 40%. Might be interesting to see if WUWT readers can move that shift a bit more. (story tip)

Scissor
Reply to  Russell Cook
April 14, 2024 2:03 pm

Should the reporter who created that poll stop beating his wife?

Yes
No
Depends on who his wife is

Editor
Reply to  Russell Cook
April 14, 2024 10:02 pm

Now:

44.8% Yes

48.3% No

6.9% Not sure

Russell Cook
Reply to  Mike Jonas
April 15, 2024 8:27 am

Still no word if the email I sent to the Bucks County commissioner (shown in a screencapture link toward the end of my guest post here) is part of what prompted him to withdraw his support of the case. Might only be a coincidence …

Russell Cook
Reply to  Mike Jonas
April 16, 2024 10:52 am

As of mid-morning April 16:

40.6% Yes

53.1% No

6.3% Not sure

Fran
April 14, 2024 10:52 am

In reading Javier Vinos’ book, the hardest thing to wrap my head around is planetary waves.

Edward Dilley
Reply to  Fran
April 14, 2024 12:03 pm

I found that difficult also.

The late Murry Salby’s book ‘Physics of the Atmosphere and Climate’ has several sections on Planetary Waves (a type of Rossby Wave).

Lots of deep mathematics – but I confess I still don’t really understand!

rhs
April 14, 2024 4:03 pm

Where should the bets be placed regarding the Dutch vs. Shell lawauit?
My bet is on the current “science”
https://amp.theguardian.com/environment/2024/apr/12/shell-says-it-lobbies-for-energy-transition-during-climate-ruling-appeal

observa
April 15, 2024 4:31 am

We want to know who among you are not completely onboard and are having impure thoughts-
Biden wants companies to ‘disclose’ their opinions on climate science (msn.com)

Reply to  observa
April 16, 2024 3:48 am

There’s a dictator hiding behind that Joe Biden ugly smile.