Dr. Mann doesn’t seem to know who he’s labeling as a “garden variety troll”.
This is probably just a conditioned reflex on his part, since anyone who disagrees with the omniscient Mann is eventually labeled a troll, but in this case, Dr. Mann’s annoyance gives the extra distinction of “garden variety troll”. Observe:
Source: [ http://twitter.com/EcoSenseNow/status/426611745562447872 ]
Um, I think Dr. Mann doesn’t recognize a fellow PhD when he sees one, and surely you’d think Dr. Mann would recognize the co-founder of Greenpeace. Apparently not.
I guess Dr. Mann took exception to the “sensible” part.
UPDATE: A tweet by “AndyMac” is worth mentioning here, especially since I witnessed Dr. Mann and others decrying the poisonous atmosphere that apparently is all the fault of “deniers” at a special session of AGU 2013:
@wattsupwiththat Mann seems to split his time thusly…
1) Complain about abuse, etc, in the media/journals.
2) Abuse, name call on twitter— Уинстън смифф (@AndyMeanie) January 24, 2014
Reblogged this on leclinton and commented:
Maybe Mr. Mann is still mad at Dr. Moore for his take down of Mann’s friend that other stellar PhD Mr. Fruitfly on SUN NEWS up here in CANADA
Mann is such a strange person
Mann and gang are getting harsher and more shrill on a near daily basis. Not to mention reactionary and ignorant. People who are winning based on evidence do not act like this.
I’ll think M. Mann is wery soon wery lone person. Nobody want’s to be mentioned at the same time with him. Poor bastard, he should go to therapy.
Mann was probably irritable from shoveling snow and scraping ice from his windshield. Ma Nature ain’t cooperating with the story line.
What is Mann known for in “science” – Hockey Stick, Hide the Decline
What skills has Mann got – high school maths seems to be beyond him, practically all of physics is beyond him.
What is left for Dr Mann – the only way he is noticed is when he is abusive. We can expect more of this as he becomes more isolated and more irrelevent.
I don’t understand twitter. Is it possible to see what made the Mann upset in the first place?
Well certainly Greenpeace does not think that Patrick Moore was a “co-founder of Greenpeace.
http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/en/campaigns/nuclear/patric-moore-background-inform/
REPLY: That’s not surprising they’d say that now, since Dr. Moore has pointed out that Greenpeace has lost its way, and now is more about the Green$ than the peace. He’s become a staunch critic, and of course they need to make sure their flock isn’t distracted by doubts from a sensible co-founder, so they create a distancing method.- Anthony
David Sanger (@davidsanger):
Greenpeace is not a reliable source of information on anything unless, of course, you want propaganda which fits whatever happens to be their current agenda.
Richard
Mann is such a hypocrite. He writes articles like these…
Harassment of climate scientists has to stop
saying how he is constanty being unfairly attacked, but then carries out exactly the same activity himself.
Does the warmist crowd really want this guy as their “man”? If I were doing any marketing for their side, I would strongly recommend a distancing…
There he goes again …
steveta_uk
Probably this tweet, retweeted by someone, came to Mann’s TL:
https://twitter.com/EcoSenseNow/status/426712330865754112
I do not have any time for the left wing neo-terrorists of Greenpeace. However I have lots of time for the very sensible Dr Patrick Moore. It is a real shame that extremists forced him out of Greenpeace as he had the right approach to nudging and encouraging corporations to be much more environmentally responsible, whilst not alienating them. The extremists running Greenpeace now are just a bunch of commie nutters.
Mann’s research has fallen out of favor and thereby he has become sidelined, best to be ignored. Then forgotten.
I too am puzzled by Dr Mann. I cannot but help think he may have a touch of the Walter Mitty about him, a type of fellow described on one site (http://www.reference.com/motif/arts/walter-mitty-syndrome) as
‘An ordinary, often ineffectual person who likes to indulge in fantastic daydreams of their own triumphs.Walter Mitty was an ordinary and unremarkable man who had a great imagination that allowed him to mentally depart from the person he was, and go to where he was beyond others in greatness.He was a legend in his own mind. He’d have fantasies about himself. He was performing tasks of great heroism or genius.’ [edited slightly to improve syntax].
Sanger:
Officially the Greenpeace Foundation came into being in late 1971, and Moore was part of that. The foundation was, however, a renaming of the “Don’t Make A Wave Committee”, whose creation predated Moore’s involvement.
So everyone’s right. That’s nice.
What, no one has said it yet?
State pen, not Penn State.
” David Sanger (@davidsanger) says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:22 am
Well certainly Greenpeace does not think that Patrick Moore was a “co-founder of Greenpeace.”
Unfortunately for the Peas, this is 2014, not 1984, where unpeople are memory-holed:
http://www.greenpeace.org/international/about/history/founders
http://web.archive.org/web/20021119050900/http://www.greenpeace.org.au/aboutus/founders.html
Simultaneous attack of winter in Europe, America and Asia. Forecast polar vortex at an altitude of 17 km on January 28.
http://earth.nullschool.net/#2014/01/28/1500Z/wind/isobaric/70hPa/orthographic=7.26,71.30,419
Encourage the Mann.
The more he speaks, the quicker this CAGW nonsense will collapse.
I found Dr. Moore’s book (Confessions of a Greenpeace Dropout: The Making of a Sensible Environmentalist) an enjoyable read for anyone believes in a scientific, middle-of-the-road and commonsense approach to environmental protection. It’s too bad though that he is Canadian because IMHO he would be a great choice for heading the EPA.
As for Mann, if and when his massive and oversized head finally explodes someday, the only problem I would have with it is the mess that would need to be cleaned up afterwards. Yuck.
Massive egos like his can at times lead to one’s own self-destruction. Having a PhD is no guarantee that one has the common sense to understand that.
Will it never stop, the constant drum beat of climate alarmism? For a rare breath of fresh air take a look http://www.arizonadailyindependent.com/2014/01/24/the-eocene-climatic-optimum-and-paradise-lost-or-whos-afraid-of-the-2-degree-bogeyman/
@steveta_uk says: January 24, 2014 at 8:21 am
I don’t understand twitter. Is it possible to see what made the Mann upset in the first place?
================================================================
“Upset” is Mann’s default state of mind. Indeed, I think he would be upset were he not upset. He’s in a permanent state of tantrum. My kids stopped doing what Mann does when things didn’t go their way before the age of five. At the latest.
From Wiki:
Greenpeace[edit]
According to Greenpeace: How a Group of Ecologists, Journalists, and Visionaries Changed the World by Rex Wyler, the Don’t Make a Wave Committee was formed in January 1970 by Dorothy and Irving Stowe, Ben Metcalfe, Marie and Jim Bohlen, Paul Cote, and Bob Hunter and incorporated in October 1970.[6] The Committee had formed to plan opposition to the testing of a one megaton hydrogen bomb in 1969 by the United States Atomic Energy Commission on Amchitka Island in the Aleutians. Moore joined the committee in 1971 and, as Greenpeace co-founder Bob Hunter wrote, “Moore was quickly accepted into the inner circle on the basis of his scientific background, his reputation [as an environmental activist], and his ability to inject practical, no-nonsense insights into the discussions.”[7] From as early as September 2005 until its alteration in March 2007, the Greenpeace International web site included Patrick Moore in a list of “founders and first members”.[8][9][10]
————————————–
So, Greenpeace is desperate to re-write their own history…
@Alan Robertson says: January 24, 2014 at 8:54 am
What, no one has said it yet?
State pen, not Penn State.
========================
They have. Dr. Tim Ball said just that. Mann’s suing him.
David Sanger (@davidsanger) says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:22 am
Well certainly Greenpeace does not think that Patrick Moore was a “co-founder of Greenpeace.
______________________________________________________________
They used to, and then they re-wrote history. Can you trust a group that re-writes history?
http://web.archive.org/web/20070203080000/http://www.greenpeace.org/international/about/history/founders
http://web.archive.org/web/20021119050900/http://www.greenpeace.org.au/aboutus/founders.html
CaligulaJones:
Okay I guess I stand corrected. Michael Moore WAS there at the creation fo the “Don’t Make A Wave Committee:.
Mann is just projecting. Kind of like the climate world version of Amanda Bynes. Guess he will be calling everyone “ugly’ soon.
O wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!
It wad frae mony a blunder free us,
An’ foolish notion:
What airs in dress an’ gait wad lea’e us,
An’ ev’n devotion!
– from To A Louse by Robert Burns
I’m repeating myself, but IMO B-movie king Roger Corman nailed the Michael Mann story and psyche in A Bucket of Blood (1959). The IMDB description:
“A frustrated and talentless artist finds acclaim for a plaster covered dead cat that is mistaken as a skillful statuette. Soon the desire for more praise leads to an increasingly deadly series of works.”
Corman’s deft send-up of Beat culture pretensions looks a lot like the Greenies of today too.
Corman’s original “Little Shop of Horrors” is a close analogue. Both can be easily found and viewed online.
jeremyp99 says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:09 am
______________________
I would not presume to be the originator of such a witty statement.
For CD@CD153 – Re: Massive egos. I know lots of people educated waaaaay beyond their intelligence (old Jerry Clower joke for the younger crowd). Most of the one’s I know are in academia and never made an honest living for themselves or anyone else. Why such a person can even become President today. Don’t be alarmed. Cleaning up the mess when they explode provides the rest of us with lots of opportunities. Look at how much work there will be to do rebuilding America after all the green stuff collapses.
CaligulaJones says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:54 am
Well done, Sir!
I am starting to feel sorry for Mikey. Just a tiny bit sorry, but for a guy with enough smarts to get a decent PhD, he has certainly given in to his dark demons, allowed himself to abandon his scientific objectivity and seek fame and glory by allowing his inner narcissist to ride him like a whipped mule.
Sad when someone throws away a career. Must be terribly hard for him to keep the gig going while knowing that reality is not conforming to his scientific projections, that he got the science dead wrong, that he will go down in history as the poster child for how not to do science.
Best if just fesses up and allows the healing to begin.
hunter says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:13 am
“People who are winning based on evidence do not act like this.”
As the old law school saying goes:
alex says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:08 am
From Wiki:
“So, Greenpeace is desperate to re-write their own history…”
That’s a well-known trait of all Marxist organisations (and Maoist ones as well.)
Ken Hall says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:39 am
” I do not have any time for the left wing neo-terrorists of Greenpeace. However I have lots of time for the very sensible Dr Patrick Moore. It is a real shame that extremists forced him out of Greenpeace as he had the right approach to nudging and encouraging corporations to be much more environmentally responsible, whilst not alienating them. The extremists running Greenpeace now are just a bunch of commie nutters.”
Right on………………… totally agree.
Oi, sse Hockeyscktickse is bleating once again…
Mann makes Steve Mosher look like a social goddess.
Mpcraig says: ______________________________________________________________
They used to, and then they re-wrote history. Can you trust a group that re-writes history?
No, I don’t, that is why I don’t believe the warm-mongers who have airbrushed the medieval warm period from climate history. I am also sick of hearing about Mann throwing his toys out of the pram if someone says something he doesn’t like. It is high time he grew up and stopped being the charmless hypocrite that his beliefs have turned him into.
James Taylor takes Mann up on his “If you see it say something” “opinion” with Michael Mann’s Global Warming Argument Fuels ‘Denier’ Skepticism
Note that increasing Carbon Dioxide Emissions Stimulating $15 Trillion in Crop Production
PS I am among Mann’s “97%” of scientists who believe that the earth has been warming (since the Little Ice Age and since 1950), and that humans have contributed to that! (The $64 trillion dollar question is “How much?”)
So very sad.
Such a hateful little man, lashing out in petty fury.
Sometimes the only response that fits is pity for what the creature has become.
Bart says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:41 am
hunter says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:13 am
“People who are winning based on evidence do not act like this.”
As the old law school saying goes:
“When the facts are on your side, pound the facts. When the law is on your side, pound the law. When neither is on you side, pound the table.”
==========================================================================
Exactly, so imagine how bad things are for Mann who has been reduced to pounding on the floor.
From Greenpeace’s (GP’s) own erstwhile website:
“The committee’s founders and first members included:
• Paul Cote, a law student at the University of British Columbia
• Jim Bohlen, a former deep-sea diver and radar operator in the US Navy
• Irving Stowe, a Quaker and Yale-educated lawyer
• Patrick Moore, ecology student at the University of British Columbia
• Bill Darnell, a social worker ”
This states clearly that Moore was either a ‘founder’ or a ‘first member’ (or both) of the ‘committee’. It’s not yet clear to me whether the ‘committee’ preceded the establishment of an organisation under the name Greenpeace, but even if it didn’t, Moore seems, as he himself maintains, to have been on board at a very early stage. GP may be unhappy to be reminded of this, but rewriting history desn’t change the facts. .
I confess an interest having myself worked for Greenpeace in the early 1980s.
Is it just me or these ego warmists behaving like Justin Biebers? Too much too soon and now no respect for anyone and no self control!
Good news on the environment
The skeptical environmentalist Bjorn Lomborg and the Copenhagen Consensus of Nobel laureate economists provide some pragmatic commonsense of what our global priorities should be. For some good news of how economic development helps people and the environment, see: A Report Card for Humanity: 1900-2050, and the Copenhagen Consensus 2012
Deny everything. Admit nothing. Attack! Attack! Attack!
He cannot be forgotten until MBH99 is retracted. Then he can be forgotten.
I’m just re-reading Sagan’s “Cosmos”, and this caught my eye concerning his opinion on the “Velikovsky Affair”:
“Many hypotheses proposed by scientists as well as by non-scientists turn out to be wrong. But science is a self-correcting enterprise. To be accepted, all new ideas must survive rigorous standards of evidence. The worst aspect of the Velikovsky affair is not that his hypotheses were wrong, or in contradiction to firmly established facts, but that some who called themselves scientists attempted to suppress Velikovsky’s work. Science is generated by and devoted to free inquiry: the idea than any hypothesis, no matter how strange, deserves to be considered on its merits. The suppression of uncomfortable ideas may be common in religion and politics, but is not the path to knowledge; it has not place in the endeavor of science. We do not know in advance who will discover fundamental insights.”
“We do not know in advance who will discover fundamental insights.”? You mean like…bloggers like McIntyre, Watts and Tisdale, for instance?
Oh, and this:
“…the astronomer and geographer Ptolemy: his earth-centered universe held sway for 1,500 years, a reminder that intellectual capacity is no guarantee against being dead wrong”.
Surely Lewserdownsky could therapize Manniacal? No need to burden real shrinks with the mental black hole Manniacal carries on his shoulders or where he sits.
andrewmharding says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:48 am
“I am also sick of hearing about Mann throwing his toys out of the pram if someone says something he doesn’t like.”
Love the visual. Could be a cartoon idea for Josh, if he hasn’t already used it.
What is amazing to me is how quickly some people turn to snark when the scientific evidence fails the test. Dr, Mann would really help his cause more if he avoided the snark and stuck to scientific principles, by turning to snark he proved he has neither science or principle behind him.
rabbit says:
“Mann is such a hypocrite. He writes articles like these…
Harassment of climate scientists has to stop
saying how he is constanty being unfairly attacked”
Yes, of course so they can hide temperature declines, do quantitative climate reconstructions using unique data that ignores all previous data and well documented evidence to concoct a new, hockey stick shaped graph of climate history that only brilliant scientists, like Michael Mann can see.
The world must behave and give a free pass to brilliant climate scientists, whose great cause is so important, that they should not have to answer to those that are not able to see what minds as brilliant as Dr. Mann’s can see.
Let us not hinder the opportunity of climate scientists to take climate science to the next level……………….of friggin fraudulence that is.
I liked Tim Ball’s comment some time ago, something like, instead of at Penn State University, Michael Mann should be in the Penn State Prison.
The tremendous amount of harm that he and his cohorts have done to climate science will take decades to recover from.
William Grubel says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:28 am
For CD@CD153 – Re: Massive egos. I know lots of people educated waaaaay beyond their intelligence (old Jerry Clower joke for the younger crowd). Most of the one’s I know are in academia and never made an honest living for themselves or anyone else. Why such a person can even become President today. Don’t be alarmed. Cleaning up the mess when they explode provides the rest of us with lots of opportunities. Look at how much work there will be to do rebuilding America after all the green stuff collapses.
=========================
We’ll see.
I think it will be the same idiots cleaning up the mess, at the taxpayer’s expense, again !!.
Digging ditches and filling them in, 21st Century-style.
I think I’ve found Patrick Moores original sin that provoked the Mann.
Tom Zeller Jr. @tomzellerjr Jan 23
Judge: Falsely accusing a scientist of “conducting his research fraudulently” IS defamatory. http://bit.ly/1bkln2d @NRO @MichaelEMann #AGW
Patrick Moore @EcoSenseNow Jan 23
@tomzellerjr @MichaelEMann @NRO So, Mike’s Nature Trick to Hide the Decline was not “fraudulent”? Oh, forgot it was a “colloquialism”
@ Robert Bissett
Enjoyed the article, if it isn’t already there consider dropping it into tips & notes.
Burning Mann.
[snicker snicker] }:-D
Yep. It’s Friday.
As far as Greenpeace and eco-terrorists go, how come they don’t live what they preach and give up all modern conveniences, like oh say, the Arctic Sunrise? Their nice little ice breaker that runs on Diesel fuel……. breaking up the scant ice that’s left in arctic? They should shun cars, electricity and anything that uses petroleum products.
Then, we’d never hear from them again. Sounds like a win-win for us!
It’s called mannhandling.
Instead of Greenpeace, Michael probably misheard it as Green Peas, hence the “garden variety” association. As Emily Litella would say, “never mind”.
Maybe Mann is an example of the social misfit that believes garbage like Climate Change and benefits from it:
Climate Change gives him the license to be nasty, cowardly, and abussive, as well as a jurisprudence tyrrant.
He’s like a lot of other activist climate change acolytes.
Treat them all with junkyard-dog avoidance–biting and growling is their norm.
Maybe it’s time for a class action lawsuit against Mann by all taxpayers around the world and demand that he show his work and data and be judged by a jury of his peers…..
Oh wait, in his mind, he has no peers…… damn.
Mann suffers from ‘LITTLE MAN SYNDROME”
David Sanger (@davidsanger) says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:22 am
“Well certainly Greenpeace does not think that Patrick Moore was a “co-founder of Greenpeace.”
Comon David, you’re too smart to fall this soci_alist revisionist baloney. I was in Vancouver when this was all going on and Patrick Moore was definitely in there a the beginningj (with the group of activists who changed their name to Greenpeace). Just because you’re a CAGW guy doesn’t mean you have to believe everythilng. Remember the consensus agreed they must exaggerate and inflate and lie as a policy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Hunter_%28journalist%29
Greenpeace hasn’t thought to change the biography of their first leader who is listed here as a journalist and “. He was a co-founder of Greenpeace in 1972 with Patrick Moore, Ben Metcalfe, Jim Bohlen, Irving Stowe, Paul Watson (which is contested by Greenpeace; more at this page)….In 1975 Robert Hunter led the Greenpeace expedition against the Soviet Whaling fleet, along with lifelong friend and activist, Paul Watson and Patrick Moore. “
Speed:
Deny Everything! Reminds me of this:
[youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzXhLp2wLQo&w=420&h=315%5D
Maybe “Little Big Mann” wasn’t there a movie about it with Dustin Hoffman.
So, would that make him a:
Cowardly little Mann?
ren says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:54 am
Simultaneous attack of winter in Europe, America and Asia. Forecast polar vortex…
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Hopefully that means bitter cold and a snow storm for Obama’s State of the Union Address (Tuesday the 28th) and frozen feet for Mikey.
D.C. is looking at lows of 9 to 10° F but no snow, little wind with highs of 17 to 18° F ) The average low is 29 °F and average high is 44 °F for that date.
NYC is a bit colder with 3 °F for the lows on that date. The average min is 27 °F with a record of -2 °F. Last year was just as bad with a manipulated recorded low of 5 °F.
I do not think Ma Nature likes Mikey.
Well there was a time when I had a soft spot for Green Piece; I still think whales are pretty neat; and it is entirely un-necessary to regularly kill some of them for “research”.
Well I think the Japanese people are pretty smart; so I think that by now, their scientific research on whales must have established beyond doubt, that they are indeed very tasty.
But back at GP: I still remember when France sent a team of terrorists to attack New Zealand; and started by bombing a ship, tied up at an Auckland harbor pier. It turned out , that ship was named “Rainbow Warrior”, and it belonged to Green Peace. A GP person was killed in that sneak Pearl Harbor like attack. I guess the Frogs went to war on NZ, because the Kiwis thought the French should set off their atom bombs in their own country, and not in the South Pacific.
I guess they haven’t realized that the era of European colonialism ended with WW-II.
Viet Nam (Dien Bien Phu) and Rainbow Warrior, demonstrate the French are slow on the uptake.
But the attack on RW, is probably one of the great French military victories of their history. New Zealand decided that it wasn’t worth them invading France; not much to gain.
Besides, Kiwi soldiers already know what fighting in France is like; they have done it in two world wars. So next time, the frogs can save their own arses.
But RW still serves a Greenpeace purpose; it is now an artificial reef , and dive site , providing habitat for reef denizens, way North of Auckland. That would be another good place to do research on ocean acidification; including the effect on the acid corrosion of sunken steel ships.
As for Dr. Patrick Moore; I would rather heed someone who was in the forefront of a cause, and had the gumption, and good sense, to call a spade a spade, when he saw the program running off the rails; than those who drank the Coolade, and had their brains addled by it.
I have some great Photographs, I took at the docks in Auckland of that famous round the world speed boat, that was going to circumnavigate the globe in record time using only liposuction fat for fuel. That was before GP sent it out to do battle in the Pacific, and it got sunk.
alex says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:08 am
” … So, Greenpeace is desperate to re-write their own history…”
—-l
They might have to do a Connolley on the wikipedia entry 🙂
“Because Patrick Moore was among the crew of the first protest voyage and the beginning of the journey is often referred as the birthday of Greenpeace, Moore also considers himself one of the founders.[38] Greenpeace used to list Moore among “founders and first members” of but has later stated that while Moore was a significant early member, he was not among the founders of Greenpeace in 1970.[44][53]”
Leon Brozyna says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:49 am
So very sad.
Such a hateful little man, lashing out in petty fury.
Sometimes the only response that fits is pity for what the creature has become.
—-l
Something like gollum carrying the burden of the one tree-ring?
As the one who helped Patrick compile and organize his early thoughts for his book Confessions of a Greenpeace Dropout (my title suggestion, I say proudly!), I can difinitively state that Greenpeace wishes it could erase Dr. Moore’s critical and central involvement in the organizing and literal launching (as in sea voyage to protest nuclear testing in the Aleutians) of Greenpeace as an activist entity.
He’s the real deal, hugely thoughtful, sincere, and effective. So obviously Greenpeace now hates his guts and does everything they can to discredit and disavow him. Which only means he’s having an impact.
Fight on, brothers and sisters!
Cheers,
Alex Avery
Hudson Institute’s Center for Global Food Issues
Extraordinary that anyone would back an organisation with such a Stalinist approach to its own past. I would hope that Mr Sanger will look at CaligulaJones and Gary Pearse’s posts and think veryhard about any information that comes out of Greenpeace in future.
jeremyp99 says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:09 am
@Alan Robertson says: January 24, 2014 at 8:54 am
What, no one has said it yet?
State pen, not Penn State.
========================
They have. Dr. Tim Ball said just that. Mann’s suing him.
Err, I think that’s what Alan was referring to.
Rumors of Mann’s erudition and maturity are greatly exaggerated.
Mann has met the enemy, and it is Man.
John Shade says:
” I cannot but help think he may have a touch of the Walter Mitty about him”
Michael Mitty Mann!
Pay no attention to the Mann behind the curtain….
Probably Patrick Moore caused him Mann-ic depression…
(oops, isn’t that bi-polar disorder now? oddly apropos as well)
(apologies to people with REAL issues, no insult intended…)
If you want to have some fun, ask an alarmist what the difference is between Mann’s big oil funded climate denial machine and a conspiracy theory.
“Green$”. Like it Anthony. Is it original and can we pinch / borrow / use?
Little surprise , Mann has an ego so big it has its own gravity field , which is a good thing because its that same ego that will one day land him right in the shit, to many , many peoples joy.
rabbit says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:51 am
“Officially the Greenpeace Foundation came into being in late 1971, and Moore was part of that.”
————–
I have a fond memory of Greenpeace and money …. due to an event that occurred at the Vancouver Airport in the late 70’s. I was part of group of 6 that was returning from a 3-week hunting trip in the British Columbia bush, somewhere north of the Finley River area and we were waiting for our flight departure for Toronto.
There were dozens n’ dozens of hunters at the airport, some like us returning from hunts and some embarking on their hunts. Anyway, Greenpeace was there in all its protesting glory, and of course the News media …. and us big game hunters were the primary reason for their staged protest at the airport.
A member of my group got really perturbed that they would even think of protesting our hunting and told us he was going over to that dapper looking gentleman who appeared to be in charge and give him a piece of his mind, and he went. And we could see Hans talking to the “boss” man and soon he came back with a puzzled look on his face and sat down, but didn’t say a word. Finally one of us asked him “What did he say, Hans, what did he say”?
Hans thought about it for a few seconds and then told us that after he had chewed that dude out real severely like …. that the dapper dude looked him straight in the eyes and told him, …..’Listen you, … I’m President of Greenpeace … and they pay me one hell of a lot of money for doing a job, ….. and by damn I’m doing that job”.
Then Hans said, …… “What could I say after that”?
And “no”, I do not know what his name was.
Cheers
Anthony,
Please keep articles like this coming. The comments are so very enjoyably hilarious!
Interesting comment Alex Avery. I was one of the “10,000” at the US/Canadian border and still have some clippings of information for and against the Amchitka nuclear test in an old folder. Green Peace didn’t exist yet, but all the characters were about including David Suzuki. Someone arranged to bus students from Universities and schools in the Greater Vancouver area to the Peace Arch at the border. As I recall, it was a nice sunny day, and quite a party. A lot of people subsequently followed the folks who organized this protest. It was one of those rare times when the government, the populace, and the activists were united in their concerns given that we are often told that someday a good part of Vancouver (especially the North Shore) might get shaken into the Ocean and the communities of Delta and Richmond may sink into the river muck /bog/ex-farmland upon which they are built and completely disappear. Always interesting to follow write ups on Hunter, Moore and Watson. Some of their beliefs are coincident with the beliefs of a large portion of the public (stop the Japanese[also Norway, Iceland, Denmark] whaling, stop the Danish slaughter of dolphins etc.). However, Green Peace itself seems to have been hijacked. Some of the “activists” that have left to focus on selective environmental issues that industry and government can buy into are having some success. It takes time to turn an aircraft carrier.
Good article, brought back lots of memories. Thanks.
Hateful little Mann
Models all agley
Screams at the world, unheaded
” Olavi says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:17 am
I’ll think M. Mann is wery soon wery lone person. Nobody want’s to be mentioned at the same time with him. Poor bastard, he should go to therapy.”
What if he’s already been through therapy and his current state is the best achievable outcome? 🙂
Did you hear the one about the climate scientist who made a hockey stick but it broke on the ice?
It would be fantastic Mann sued for defamation, then we could finally have a court decide if what he did was fraudulent or not. This reminds me of a case recently where a number of bloggers taunted our former Prime Minister about their corrupt and illegal behaviour as a union lawyer which led to them being fired from the law firm at which they worked prior to their career in politics, followed by a large cover up involving many senior members and current politicians in the political party, as well as people who’ve subsequently been rewarded through judicial postings and other plum jobs. No court case was brought – it wouldn’t have won on the basis that the comments were essentially based in fact, and the case would have exposed the whole rotten and corrupt underbelly of that side of politics. The corrupt individual got so upset that they even named one of the bloggers in one of their many unhinged outbursts in parliament. In this case, the corrupt person effectively muzzled the media through threats to introduce media censorship laws (a natural tendancy anyway for leftists). Luckily Mr Mann doesn’t have such power at his disposal.
Jeff,
“What if he’s already been through therapy and his current state is the best achievable outcome? :)”
Well then, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVFBK9GhS5Q
Dr. Anthony Watts
and to all and everyone:
Mann with the pile I call him, because it is not a hockeystick, it is a Pile. Can`t you see that?
“Mann med ljåen” we call him, where Ljå = Pile.
Because I never believe in the experts not even Bjerknes, but I examine his methods and his waterbaths,
I have also carefully examined the construction elements of that fameous pile or “hockeystick” as you falsely call it.
The blade is in order. Allthough he never visited Norway, he has got with him local history and rumors here,. that can be examined in detail by other elements, different from what Mann has used. The “haid the declain” is a silly vulgar rumor argument just betraying yourself of your own ignorance. You hardly learnt how to check it up with reality.
We have here the ice history on Lake Mjøsa and in the Oslofjord for the last 150 years, the ski- sport ski- jumping and cross country skiing history,, and the history of gardening and we have old photographs, The blade of that pile of that Mann seems in order.
Then the shaft to it, that the Mann has made of crooky and choisest naturally grown wood from the rocky mountains and the north american continent and with only a quite few controls for the rest ofthe world. the quite extreemly important mideival document
What Michael Mann has told of the rumorous “warm mideival time” is seemingly approximately right, according to what I could be able to check up.
There we have the SAGA and its mentioning of seasonal weathers and ices, place datum. When did King Halvdan plunge through the ice on lake Randsfjorden with his men and horses?
Further we have the quite extreemly fameous document SPECVLVM REGALE or Konungs skuggsjao ( clear evidence of global recognition and consciousness and elementary physical and geophysical understanding of the worlds climates allthough in a geocentric universe), a document that is most probably stated at the Arch Bishop See and Castle of Nidaros ( Today NTNU Trondheim.no) at about 1220-1250.
Giving very solid and practical evidence and explainations of the climate and eventual fogs and ices and snows on Island and near Grønland, where the arch bishop of Nidaros was in charge. Having also left very accurate cronicles in detail of the bishops of both Holar, Skålholt, and Gardar, whether they were there or not, and of how soon they eventually were killed or froze in hell (=fryse i hel) and how soon they rather went to Roma, where it is quite much warmer than on Gardar in Austerbygd for instance, today Igalicu Grønland.
. But Nidaros is rather warm. According to the SAGA, The King of Mære drowned in the brewery barrel.
Which is really No wonder. I never saw as fine and ripe fields of Malt as on Medalhus, Stiklestad and Mære. The area does deliver the worlds best Malt also today, and ripe apples in Steinkjer in August.
But this situation is all due to the golf stream and the very regular western winds in that fjord. No wonder Olav Digre (Later St. Olav) came there on drive in tourism in summer 29th of july, with his men, until the Bishop told the peasants to take to their arms and to stop that tourism.
But on the Gardar Bishop See in Austerbygd, Grønlands warmest hole, today Igaliku….
…..they hardly knew bread according to reality and the Cronicles and to the SPECVLVM REGALE.
Rumors different from that, spread in the contrarian moovement, of Bold Siegfrieds and Brunhilders with golden helmets and cow horns lightly dressed and swetting in ox leather and with a “Cathedral” in the background on “eastern Grønland” …..
……..is but Wagner Opera from Teutoburger Wald for the sceenes of Bayereuth in order to pleace the wealthier public and their Führer in the audience, and to cash for that.
I could check up Hvalsey Kirke on the net. (a most important document)
That building is unluckily founded on permafrost right out to the sea by Scotsch masons, who mistook permafrost for solid gound in Grønlands warmest hole in the warm mideival time.
Those buildings were founded strictly west- east to have the easter sunrise right into the apex window and with narrow windows to the south tight to the north, to observe the sun and keep catolic calendar of holidays. Wvery narrow windows round at the top gave Camera obscura projections of the sun on the northern wall, and sun crosses could be painted fresco on the white wall to keep very exact ly observed sun calendar.
The southern and warm wall of that church has sank 75 Cm on thawing permafroost (during the little ice age perhaps?), since it was set up. Today corrected and secured by hydraulics and concrete. You surely will find it on the net.
The stones are talking from Hvalsey and Austerbygd. They rather ruin the alternatives. The extreemly world fameous Hvalsey Church in Austerbygd rather give Mr. Mann right with the shafts end, of that pile..
Conclusion. Rumors of that warm medeival time is shooting itself in the feet before going into clinch and fight and dispute.
Another probably most important and reliable climate indicator of the very area, is the use of hydraulic lime mortar for masonry and for plaster (Murpuss) with Fresco paintings during the warm mideival period.
This very critical criterium of summer warmth and length of season is my personal suggestion. Being a physical chemist with interests in technical archaeology I learnt it a bit from Hans Rosberg in Malmø, hydraulic lime mortar and fresco and church mason with his royal swedish public scool different from Dialectic Materialism as insytructed by Chicago Gangsters for you, the flat earth believers and hopelessly uncritical and unsceptical ones to the holy scriptures.
The very fameous Ikait mineral CaCO3 . 6H2O forms below 5 deg celsius from lime mortar and next summer the very masonry falls down again like dry chalk powder, and that very burning of twigs and thimbers and forests for it was done in vain.
De- carbonatization of CaCO3 occurs at 900 celsius in an endotherm reaction. That is a quite tremendous heat really. Only the church and / or the King could afford i. But in New England where there is huge forests, early settlers have left really very sublime and advanced hydraulic lime mortar masonry with natural stones. The tower of Plymuth Rock for instance. Vitis lambrusca also growing wildly in the wood.
Above +8 Celsius, provided that you also can guarantee that there will be absolutely no frost onward for one month at least, rather Calcite CaCO3 will form from hydraulic lime mortar mixed with sand. That will keep, and you can paint Fresco on it next year.
Antony Watts & al should take notice of this: (Would anyone of you remind him?)
Rather seek up the limit between chalk and mortar and of burnt brick and tiles on one side……
….. and the extreemly fameous rather Wooden churches and cathedrals, for which te Pope had to give DISPENSATIONE in the Novgorod and the Nidaros Arch Bishop see areas, the quite extreeeeemly fameous stave churches of Norway and the logged thimber cathedrals of Russia. From the warm mideival period..
That limit is very distinct all through Scandinavia and the north russian areas. St Magnus on Orkenøerne is the outer limit of enough sunner warmth for lime mortar masonry north- westwards in the Atlantic, probablyb also for necessary large thimber for that kind of work.
Plus long season and pasture land and hey for the oxes to drag those huge stones, and not forget beer for the masons, else they will complain and strike.
There is no redbrick and tiles and lime on Island allready. From the warm mideival period.
Burt you find it indeed in eastern Europe, in the southern baltic sea area and onward to Lund and Roskilde Denmark, All over Jylland, furher to Hamar, Oslo, Stavanger, Bergen, Selje, Nidaros and all up to Alstadhaug on Helgeland in Norway. An up the walleys where there is enough summer warmth and,…… huge thimbers and trees to be logged and chopped and burnt. That ain`t not so on Færøerne allready and not at all om Island and in Austerbygd at Gardar.,Today Igaliku.
Mideival architecture on Island and on Grønland, as I could see and judge it, is rather frappingly similar to southern Sæmi- architecture uphill and up in the mountains in the warmest places there, in the Nidaros arch bishop see domain during the warm mideival period.
Theese circumstances together seem quite clearly to be ruining the very warm mideival period on this side of the atlantic and further on Island and Grønland, even in Grønlands hottest hole.
Mann with his pile can be solidly sustained there, by methods thart Dr Mann was definitely not aware of as he made that…pile.
But the SAGA allready gives him quite right.
The little ice age is quite more tricky as seen from my side,……
……… because there we have histories and we have the diaries of both Tycho Brahe on Uranienborg (Probably having had SPECVLVM REGALE personally on hand for studies in royal diplomacy and astrology chosmology) and the isle of Hven in Øresund, and of Johan Daniel Berlin , Cantor and master of the fireward in Nidaros around 1750. Who took very fine notice of the weathers and the snow and ices datum also. Brahe took consequent notice of the weathers and when the ices came and went on Hven at his Uranienborg in Øresund. Rundetaarn in Copenhagen by brick and lime mortar, is the paralell King Christian IV`s royal observatory in town from the little ice ages. The belts froze so on one occation the sweedes could march over the ices and take them, and the Royal Navy was unable to leave harbour and shoot the sweedes. That is also history.
Then we have the very fameous glacier morraines documents, that I also could go and inspect and pick into and convince myself without having to ask the experts. They correspond splendidly with Peter Breugels flemish paintings of bitterly cold winter scenes, and with the ice festivals on the Thames in London.
I am quite surprised that the fameous little ice age does not show up on the shaft of that pile of that Mann
But to all the rest of you, you must learn how to build an argument by details and marks of real nature and by enlighted knowledge of nature different from commerciallized communist and nazi vulgar and romantic & fanatic religion of the blind believers……
…….before you go into clinch with the Arch Bishops of Nidaros and of Novgorod and of Uppsala and into clinch with a Mann with a pile, blindly believing that it is a hockeystick and that the earth is as flat as an indoor hockeystic arena.
Don`t be so uncritical and unrealistic about which Chateau and from which Tank you support and buy your wines.
Never buy it from Thinktank at Chateau Heartland for instance. Because that Brewery is rather similar and equal to the fameous Arbeiter und Bauernfakultät in Greifswald, now closed. They were the Thinktank for the Chateau d`Asbestos behind the wall in Berlin the “Palast der Republik” (now taken down, because it was not sustainable…). Greifswald brewed on Licens. from Chateau Leningrad, to defend all the coalsmokes and living standards in Carl Marx Stadt old Saxonia for many many many years.
Nidaros arch bishop see from the warm mideival period, todays NTNU.no is better, together with the Harward, and the Massachusetts institute of technology where rather I buy my american brews and wines for safe consumption.
That brew from Chateau Heartland seems mixed up with sheere coce from the Ayn Rand institute in California also, to refresh you best and give you a new personality.
Choisest Barley and apples is better, having very solid traditions also over there I know.
REPLY: Not a “Dr.”, but thanks for the sentiment. – Anthony
MattS, I had a Violist friend in Uni who always talked about the world’s smallest violin when someone was doing Mann-ic whining, but I had no idea that such a small violin existed (then again
I guess most violins are small to violists…).
By (odd) coincidence, the smallest violins in common use are for the Suzuki method for small
children (1/32 and perhaps smaller, I forget). Another climate, er, hero needing a small violin.
(And I’m not going to bring sax and violins into it)….oh the pun…..
From the man himself (via WayBack). Patrick Moore’s Greenspirit webpage that no longer exists since last year.
How Sick Is That? Environmental Movement Has Lost Its Way
http://web.archive.org/web/20130524211137/http://www.greenspirit.com/logbook.cfm?msid=83
Goodness, more irony, said violist is now based in Australia, not too far from Mawson lakes….
Re Greenpeace who was it who said …
“The New World Order is a global system of fascist corporate technocratic rule that uses non-profit organizations masquerading as grassroots to facilitate and fabricate consensus for the corporate agendas that can be summed up to be the destruction of the nation-state, dissolution of the concept of citizenship, property rights, privacy rights, and all other rights rooted in the concepts of nations and citizens.”
Dont know, but I wish it was me.
Dr Mann is learning that shoddy work will follow you for a lifetime like a bad dream. And, like a bad dream that shoddy work will always come back to haunt you.
Mr Watts, you should update this post with the posting by CaligulaJones at January 24, 2014 at 8:54 am, showing Moore on the Wayback Machine’s capture of the Greenpeace founders.
Mother Jones and minions revel in poor Mann’s victory:
A Win for the Climate Scientist Whom Skeptics Compared to Jerry Sandusky
nutso fast, thanks for the link and introduction of “Mother Jones and minions revel in poor Mann’s victory”. Enjoyed that!
How does one hyperventilate on twitter!?
Good Golly, Carbomontanus, I read every word and can hardly believe it.
======================
nutso fasst says:
January 24, 2014 at 4:11 pm
If Mann really welcomes discovery, then why has he not given UVA the go ahead to release his emails sent while at that institution, as FoI requests & the former VA AG sought?
Carbomontanus says:
January 24, 2014 at 3:20 pm
If I translate your comment back into Norwegian & then into English again, will it become more comprehensible?
As it so happens, both the Medieval Warming Period & Little Ice Age show up well in the proxy data for Norway, Iceland & Greenland, despite Mann’s hat tricky attempt to make them magically disappear.
@rabbit –
It would be hard to imagine a more exact description and account of his own actions than the Womann-named-Sue’s diatribe in her op-ed. That is orders of magnitude above hypocritical, 100 on the dishonesty scale from 1 to 10.
@carbomontanus –
A first-class example of how the Medieval Warming Period is solidly, indelibly documented in the historical record – and withal, yet only one of hundreds of such examples. One wonders what the Womann-named-Sue thinks she can really do about that? The cost of traveling to libraries all over the world to destroy the records would probably exceed even his fat “research” grant budget. Not to mention that the custodians of those records might take rather a dim view of her attempting to do that, and might resent it with handcuffs and guns pointed in her face.
Mann seems disturbed. Is he a runt (as in short stature)? His extreme sensitivity comes over as a chip-on-the shoulder psychosis. A very unattractive fellow.
milodonharlani said @ January 24, 2014 at 5:10 pm
After 8 translations through babelfish etc becomes:
“If your note back to Norway and later the new English translation and will easier to understand?”
🙂
MattS says:
January 24, 2014 at 2:44 pm
LOL though way too upbeat for Mann’s psychological landscape … Insufficiently jagged I thought. 🙂
I don’t know. Those Rightwingers over at Greenpeace sometimes position themselves at the EXTREME middle sometimes.
RaiderDingo says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:13 am
Mann is such a strange person
Mann is a poster boy for a specific syndrome outlined in the DSM. In fact, it is still considered a disorder even in DSM V.;
If skeptics planned for a month of Sundays and executed to perfection, they couldn’t ideate (there’s a word global warming psychologists can get their fuzzy heads around) much less create a person with Michael Mann’s ego/personality/shortcomings. That nature produced a real-world Michael Mann is a blessing to skeptics everywhere. May his star burn bright until this CAGW baloney fades into oblivion.
It seems Dr. Mann lost all of his constitutive properties long ago.
Gary Pearce, Anthony, yes indeed it certainly does seem Moore and Greenpeace parted ways quite a while ago
Carbomontanus says:
January 24, 2014 at 3:20 pm
Dr. Anthony Watts, and to all and everyone:
__________________________________
Now that is another good plot for a remake of Monty Python And The Holy Grail!
…Or perhaps Black Adder?
No no no no. Patrick Moore is not the “founder” of Greenpeace (http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/en/campaigns/nuclear/patric-moore-background-inform/). If you bothered to spend 5 minutes googling you would know this. Why can’t I find single post on this blog that doesn’t contain a blatant factual inaccuracy?
How’s that defamation legal suit going by the way?
The Pompous Git says:
January 24, 2014 at 7:07 pm
I believe his comment would be easier to comprehend if the text were chiseled onto a vintage LP and played backward on a phongraph.
Does Tim Ball have a legal defense fund. We know Mann will be well resourced.
Hush
The mighty Mann of climate mystery
Speaks.
As Reed Coray says above, he is our mann now.
An accidental ally.
Bless the mann
Keep him talking.
Siberian Husky: It’s very easy to see that five minutes of research is all you did, and you did not bother to read all the comments. Otherwise you would see one with this link: http://web.archive.org/web/20021119050900/http://www.greenpeace.org.au/aboutus/founders.html
The Don’t Make a Wave Committee evolved into GreenPeace as documented here;
http://web.archive.org/web/20021119050900/http://www.greenpeace.org.au/aboutus/founders.html
So the question is, is GreenPeace misrepresenting the truth in your link, or the above link?
Perhaps if you learned how to properly research you would not be so confused about climate change.
Two personality condemnations in one post.
Mickey Mouse Mann – B’zugda-hiara.
See fifth phrase. http://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/index.php/Dwarfish_phrases
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/10442550/Chelsea-manager-Jose-Mourinho-calls-West-Bromwich-Albions-Jonas-Olsson-a-Mickey-Mouse-player.html
The “troll” lable is too frequently used IMO (And maybe that is a good thing because it’s “meaning” and impact diminishes with increased use). Is it so difficult for people to accept others with an alternate opinion? Surely isn’t this the fundamentals of democracy? Sure, I have been “outspoken” towards other posties here at WUWT, but is that “trolling”? Not IMO! But, of course, that’s just my opinion.
JAtom- except the group had been in existence for about a year…
http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/Global/usa/binaries/2008/12/patrick-moore-s-application-le.pdf
Siberian_husky says: @ January 24, 2014 at 8:07 pm
No no no no. Patrick Moore is not the “founder” of Greenpeace…
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Good grief dude, read what was said about that re-writing of history!
Patrick says: January 25, 2014 at 2:18 am
Indeed. Try disagreeing with BoB Tisdale or Chris Monckton, as I have on a couple of occaisions, and their fan base goes ape-shit with troll flinging. Monckton himself usually joins in. I find it one of the most depressing aspects of the WUWT commentariat.
[Correct. A difference of opinion does not make a commentator a ‘troll’. ~ mod.]
Mod:
You are right when you say
Difference of opinion on a subject is desirable because it exposes various understandings of the subject for all to see.
Trolls attempt to inhibit discussion of a subject by deflecting a thread onto another subject.
This thread is about Friday Funny – Mann Overboard! “Dr. Mann doesn’t seem to know who he’s labeling as a “garden variety troll”. So, discussion of trolls and trolling is not being a troll on this thread but it is on most threads.
Any attempt to deflect a thread onto a different subject is being a troll, and trolls need to be ‘called-out’ if their nefarious activity is to be defeated.
Richard
I clicked “continue reading” just knowing thus must be the makings of another great Josh Cartoon.
Ah….
You people don’t understand. If a person is always right and busy saving the world, the only possible explanation for opposition is oil-funded conspiracy or trolling. Gee, I wish I was always right…
Michael Mann seems to have evolved into the Kim Jong-un of the climate science community. Doesn’t he have work to do?
Greenpeace should erect a Soviet-style 10M bronze statue of Trofim Lysenko, the “prophet” upon whom this religious organization is based, directly in front of their headquarters.
– – – – – – – – –
steveta_uk / Patrick / ~ mod. ,
I am thankful for ‘Patrick’ for bring this up.
I agree with you if your thought is that the frequent name-calling involving the word ‘troll’ is unreasonable and unjustified on WUWT. So what is a ‘troll’?
I would not have a concept of ‘troll’ to be centered on vehemently opposing a thread’s populist logics. Nor would I consider that a concept of ‘troll’ has anything to do with a very direct or a very indirect chain of thought of a commenter. Some thinkers are very (amazingly) subtly indirect and have many wondrous intermediate inferences before one can appreciate where they are going with their thoughts. The path is pyschologically illuminating and often educational, often lead to expanding the lead post in new lead posts. Nor would I consider being oblique to any simple literal association to the main thrust of thread’s development as being part of the concept of ‘troll’. That stuff makes WUWT a great venue, in my view.
I think the concept of ‘troll’ is essentially not about the relations to other commenters or topic or thread or ideas.
I think a concept of ‘troll’ must be essentially tied to a serious long sustained attempt, over many threads and months, to maliciously and intentionally destroy the whole venue’s capability to function (and thus also destroy the ability of a blog owner to lead). Where ‘serious’ means based on a very long term chain of commentary evidence showing beyond reasonable doubt that there are intentional occurrences of an attempt at destruction of the capability of the blog to function or of the owner to lead.
So, you see for me the ‘troll’ name-calling should be withheld from the way most WUWT commenters are using it.
John
Anthony Watts & al:
John Whitman rather writes autenic sense here.
Troll is a scandinavian word an conscept. The Swedes have it, and H.C.Andersen has also mentioned it. The Germans call it “Riese” but todays modern English conscept is rather “a monster”. But Trolls may also be small.
Those “garden variety trolls” are not trolls , although related a bit. But it is false use of the conscept. They are “Gartenzwerge” in Germany and rather “Gnome” in Norwegian and not ugly.
I checkede up and it shows that Rather Paracelsus seems to have invented them, or rather given them a psevdo- latin name meaning the underground fairies. Paracelsus was Swiss.
Proper traditional action and medicine against Trolls is quite important.
If you are able to find out or guess and tell its name, the Troll looses its power. And further, when day comes and the sun goes up and the dark and grey fogs vanish, it shows that what was believed to be trolls is nothing but quite common mosses and huge boulders and old rotten wood in the landscape, quite common and natural things and nothing to fear at all.
Proper daylight over it you see, does change a lot of things.
A person with an all too big “Aura” (if you know what I mean) , can be called “a Troll”. That means a person who takes up all too much place for his privacies and all too much attension, in common room and area..
Thus, John Withman rather gets to the point.
You rather ought to know of and to cooperate with the “Gnome”.
In the garden, you should not harvest fruits and berries too clean , but leave a bit “hanging for the Gnome” i. e for Nature to consume. And not least because what you let hanging further, will tell you a lot both of weather and of climate and of birds and of microbes, and how things may seed out naturally.
Buying plastic models and replica of them from the industrial gardening center shops however, and to put that out for worship in the garden…..,…..
is violence to the 10 commandments §2 and quite sinful.
– – – – – – – – – –
Carbomontanus,
I liked your discussion of trolls in the blog interpreted via troll and gnome mythology / folklore. I am a long term fan of Joseph Campbell’s many works on mythology and I think folklore is related to it.
So, a question. Are trolls in mythology and folklore only malicious (intending harm and ill fortune)? Are there, by definition, any kindly and helpful trolls?
I have a comment on your discussion of beneficial and nice looking gnomes as distinguished from ugly and bad behaving trolls. You might be suggesting we consider treating respectfully (like gnomes are in myth and folklore) most of the commenters who have been previously called trolls by other commenters. If that is what you are suggesting, then I agree we should treat them with respect . . . . stop the name-calling.
John
When I hear “Michael Mann”, I reflexively think “Piltdown”. (2.0)
When I looked up the Wikipedia entry on “trolls” I discovered that this word in its recent new meaning in the context of blogs, has no clear etymology. The term might derive from Scandinavian goblins, or from the fishing technology of trolling. What I want to know, arising from Carbomontanus’s very interesting but somewhat puzzling comment, is what the heck is a “pile”?
David Sanger (@davidsanger) says:
“Gary Pearce, Anthony, yes indeed it certainly does seem Moore and Greenpeace parted ways quite a while ago”
That is quite noble of you, both refusing to admit that Moore is properly named a “founder of Greenpeace” and refusing to acknowledge the considerable evidence that GP has attempted to scrub its own history for political purposes.
@vigiliantfish
Now you are lucky that I have J.Brynhildsen Norsk->engelsk ordbog Kristiania 1917 measuring 2″ x 8″ x 5″ on hand,
so let us see:
“Lja = er. Mindre godt f. ljaa.
Ljaa = er scytche; manden med =er fig the old man with the scytche, the old reaper.”
Is that clear?
@John Whiteman
I have a very personal and autentic relation to trolls, thus able to tell about them.
However, this must be taken by all neccesary scepsis and grains of salt, i. e seen also at daylight.
They showed up in my night dreams as early as I can remember and were very huge and ugly. They were mentioned and descibed in the fairy tales and mentioned on the radio for children.
The standard 1st story or fairy tale for children inauguration is ” De 3 Bukkene Bruse som skulle til seters og gjøre seg fete” Maybe we can find it on the net.
= 3 bucks “brousing” going to “Seters” = Sumarsæte = Somerset to make themselves fat. On their way they had to walk over a bridge and under that bridge there was a huge and ugly …. troll.
First came the smallest Bukkene Bruse tripp tripp tripp tripp over the bridge. “NOW I COME AND TAKE YOU!” said the troll. . Oh no, don`t take me. Soon comes the middle Bukkene Bruse, he is much larger and fatter than i. Yes OK said the Troll.
and then the 2nd Bukkene Bruse Tripp Trapp Tripp Trapp over the bridge
…..
but then the large Bukkene Bruse TRAMP! TRAMP TRAMP TRAMP! over the bridge
“NOW I COME AND TAKE YOU said the troll
“Yes, just you come. I hav 2 large spears, With them I skall sing your eyes out. And I have 2 large stones, With them I shall crush both your marrow and bones.
The troll came up and thus it went. He was thown back in the rushing river again quite molested.
And they all went to Sumarsæte / Somerset, and got so fat, that if the fat has not got off them yet, they still have it. & Snipp Snapp Snute , the fairytale is out.
I can tell you it is dramatic. on “NOW I COME AN TAKE YOU::”They scream, so you must tell them exactly by words how it goes. Then they breathe out. And then they call together all the other children and play puppet theater with it.
It is the very basics of Alchemy to be told when they are about 3 years old.
The trolls are first huge and dark and foggy , then they become smaller and more distinct as you grow up and learn how to manage. It shows more and more that they are rather quite blunt and stupid and can be tackled and cheated.
And then you can put them on museum.
The best I have found elsewhere in litterature is Carl Gustav Jungs description of “The unconscious” and of “The shadow..”
In recent time I have found litterature and comic strips for children where the trolls may be rather indifferent and even kind. But that is not at all my idea, so one must ask the authors about it.
For that kind of entities, I would rather have used and referred to other archetyps like the huge and small animal gods and figures and principles, after which you even name your children Cfr Bjørn, Arne, Ulf, Leo, Felix, Hrafn (raven) and Eberhardt the boar and Wolfgang. Høykur Hawk, I heard from Island.
Girls are rather named after flower archetypes. Nothing of this entails that they are Trolls. If children are trolls, which they often may be, it is to be corrected for bad behaviours and spirits.
But it is for having a necessary arsenal of angels and of devils and of gods. But those are not trolls.
A “Psychopat” (allthough many definitions) is a troll.
Good greef
Pile,… a pile of hey,..= såte,
I have confused that with Ljå and the scytch.
Thus it comes when people are unclear when telling it to me in English….
To all and everyone including Anthony Watts & excluding Moderator
Yes really
Http:/ The Billy Goats Gruff
on English Wikipedia
Is compulsary.
[Miffed, the now-excluded moderator will point out your atrocious spelling error of “compulsory” to the rest of the world at large. 8<) Mod]
I hope that Mark Steyn has someone following Mann on Twitter. Mann is so prolific on Twitter some of his tweets can surely be used against him.
I think that “trolling” on the “net” refers to fishing, trolling with a line, so to speak, in order to
catch fish from a boat, quietly. In this case the trollers are attempting to lure comments and
commenters in their direction, or as the Scots say, winding them up. Not the same as those
garden statues, but at least as ugly, if not more so…
@jdgalt al.
I see it the quite other way around. The STALIN- lysenko type of procedure by popular folklore and Quacky propaganda at the imperial court and for the people through the imperial and progressive Prasvda mass media, is most characteristic of the climate and the science denlial moovement. That also rather rides instructions by a political vote and decision behind closed doors of what “The science” is going to find out and to sustain.
Manns “hockeystick” work has later been q1uite solidly sustained by its essence and principle by up to ten other and independent works by other institutes and on other temperature indicators, by systematically independent empirical methods.
Going on fighting that “hockeystick” is truly hopeless. It is rather nothing but silly imperial manners for open scene on the free market, proudly with ones nose and ones cravatte up to the sky having forgotten ones own bottoms and necessary suspenders.
“up to ten other and independent works by other institutes and on other temperature indicators, by systematically independent empirical methods.” It is common language to speak of the ten commandments, but not “up to ten”. You ought to be capable of precisely telling us the number and correct titles so that the reader may find out for himself if your description matches. Thank you.
@JMVanWinkle: Best ignored, yes. Forgotten? Then it will just continue to happen again. Mann needs to be taught in history right alongside Lysenko. Let him continue to be famous, just not in the way he wanted.
Maybe if we do the job well enough, the next con man will target some other field than science. But to get the corruption out of our institutions, we must first get the taxpayers’ money out. Ayn Rand predicted all this sixty years ago.
Carbomontanus is a Norwegian “Troll” that spends his time running around in circles making sounds and waving his arms.
No. miss Baby
I have only told you all that going out on the free market hand in hand shoulder by shoulder all talking with one voice against a Mann with a scytch
is silly.
You will all end up in a “pile” for consumption, maybe even for ensilation.
He is allready having the US supreme court on his side.
You have called for a decision of misbehaviours and that decision is allready taken.
I have absolutely no problems with him because I am elementary aquainted to the methods, thus able to judge the validity and quality of his work.
Mob- behaviours like that is what we call Troll. You are unconscious and looking at
yourself in a troll- mirror
Al Gore I would like to take and brush over a bit and teach him both Manners, Science, and Theology; Michael Mann however, is not problematic at all. He has delivered very good work and he is probably on museum allready. There are quite other things to be furthered and discussed now.
Rajendra Pachauri has rather given the formula for further:: Never go into clinch with KALI, she wins.