BBC runs 6 excellent minutes on quiet sun and past correlation with Little Ice Age

DrudgeSunComp

Guest post by Alec Rawls

Nice hype by Matt Drudge, whose three linked quotes are all from the BBC’s one brief paragraph of text, but the accompanying video (full transcription below) is more substantial, with scientists talking about the likelihood of an extended Maunder Minimum type period low solar activity and the cold temperatures that coincided with the Maunder Minimum during the 1600’s.

Professor Richard Harrison from the Rutherford Appleton Laboratory is clear about the correlation [at 1:57]:

The Maunder Minimum of course was a period of almost no sunspots at all for decades and we saw a really dramatic period where there were very cold winters in the northern hemisphere. It was a period where you had a kind of mini ice-age. You had a period where the Thames froze in winters and so on. It was an interesting time.

BBC science correspondent Rebecca Morelle doesn’t shy away from the possible implications today:

So does a decline in solar activity mean plunging temperatures for decades to come?

Best of all is Dr. Lucie Green from University College in London, who describes the unsettled state of the science [at 3:35]:

It is a very very complex area because the sun’s activity controls how much visible light the sun gives out, but also how much ultraviolet light and x-rays that the sun emits and they create a web of changes up in the earth’s atmosphere producing effects that actually we don’t fully understand.

Green then wraps up the segment by declining to suggest that anthropogenic warming can be expected to outweigh solar cooling:

… on the one hand we’ve got perhaps a cooling sun, but on the other hand you’ve got human activity that can counter that and I think it is quite difficult to say actually how these two are going to compete and what the consequences then are for the global climate.

The weak link is solar physicist Mike Lockwood who makes irrational and unsupported claims about solar activity only affecting regional climate and not having a global effect.

The BBC voice-over sets up Lockwood’s unsupported speculation:

BBC: Less solar activity means a drop in ultraviolet radiation. Mike Lockwood says this seems to affect the behavior of the jet stream. The Jet stream changes its pattern. This ends up blocking warm air from reaching Northern Europe. This causes long cold winters, but what about global temperatures as a whole?

Lockwood [at 5:03]: One has to make a very clear distinction between regional climate and global climate. If we get a cold winter in Europe because of these blocking events it’s warmer, for example, in Greenland, so the average is almost no change, so it is a redistribution of temperature around the North Atlantic.

As Stephen Wilde has been pointing out for years, the wider meanders in the polar jet that seem to be associated with low solar activity can be expected to cause a net increase in cloudiness which would increase the earth’s albedo, having a global cooling effect. The jet stream follows the boundry where cold polar air slides beneath and pushes up warmer temperate air, creating storm tracks. Not only do wider meanders create longer storm tracks but the resulting cloud cover occurs at lower latitudes, where the incidence of incoming solar radiation is steeper, making the albedo reflection stronger.

Snow cover albedo effects would likely also be global, not just regional. A warmer Greenland has almost zero marginal albedo effect: it’s 98% white anyway. But a snow covered Europe and North America will reflect away a lot of sunlight. Also, the important thing over large parts of Asia and North America will not be temperature—it’s always going to be cold enough to snow during the Siberian winter—but the extent of the storm tracks, so that cloud and snow albedos both increase with the amplitude of the jet stream meanders, as seems to have been the pattern with the current solar lull. Here is a graphic showing the 21st century’s high average snow anomalies (from Rutgers, via Brett Anderson at Accuweather):SnowAnom_N-hemisphere_Rutgers

Lockwood is up against the paleologic evidence as well. He is suggesting that, while the Little Ice Age may have been induced by low solar activity, it was a northern-hemisphere-only event, but recent studies indicate that it was a global climate swing, as was the Medieval Warm Period.

Overall though, a very good report from the BBC. Have the recent revelations about top level BBC collusion with green propagandists reduced the power of the warming alarmists to censor other views? In any case, it is good to see them do some real reporting.

Full transcript (not provided by the BBC – is this unusual? – so I transcribed it myself)

BBC voice-over: The wonder of the northern lights reminds us of the intimate connection we have with our star. The aurora borealis happens when the solar wind hits the earth’s upper atmosphere, but many of these displays may soon vanish. Something is happening to the solar activity on the surface of the sun: it’s declining, fast.

Professor Richard Harrison, Rutherford Appleton Laboratory [0:28]: Whatever measure you use, it’s coming down, the solar peaks are coming down, for example with the flares. It looks very very significant.

Dr. Lucie Green, University College London [0:36]: The solar cycles now are getting smaller and smaller. The activity is getting less and less.

BBC: There is a vast range of solar activity: sunspots, intensely magnetic areas seen here as dark regions on the sun’s surface; solar winds and uv light radiate toward the earth; flares erupt violently and coronal mass ejections throw billions of tons of charged particles into space. Solar activity rises and falls in 11-year cycles and right now we are at the peak, the solar maximum, but this cycle’s maximum is eerily quiet.

Harrison [1:18]: I’ve been a solar physicist for 30 years. I’ve never seen anything quite like this. If you want to go back to see when the sun was this inactive, in terms of the minimum we’ve just had and the peak we have now you’ve got to go back about a hundred years, so this is not something I’ve seen in my lifetime, it’s not something that a couple of generations before me have seen.

BBC: The number of sunspots is a fraction of what scientists expected, solar flares are half. Richard Harrison is the head of space physics at the Rutheford-Appleton Laboratory in Oxfordshire. He says the rate at which solar activity is falling mirrors a period in the 17th century where sunspots virtually disappeared.

Harrison [1:57]: The Maunder Minimum of course was a period of almost no sunspots at all for decades and we saw a really dramatic period where there were very cold winters in the northern hemisphere [not only the northern hemisphere – A.R.] . It was a period where you had a kind of mini ice-age. You had a period where the Thames froze in winters and so on. It was an interesting time.

BBC: Rivers and canals froze across Northern Europe. Paintings from the 17th century show frost-fairs taking place on the Thames. During the “great frost” of 1684 the river froze over for two months, the ice was almost a foot thick. The Maunder Minimum was named after the astronomer who observed the steep decline in solar activity that coincided with this mini ice-age.

BBC science correspondent Rebecca Morelle [2:46]: The Maunder Minimum came at a time when snow cover was longer and more frequent. It wasn’t just the Thames that froze over. The Baltic Sea did too. Crop failures and famines were widespread across Northern Europe. So does a decline in solar activity mean plunging temperatures for decades to come?

Dr. Lucie Green [3:04]: We’ve been making observations of sun spots which are the most obvious sign of solar activity from 1609 onwards and we’ve got 400 years of observations. The sun does seem to be in a very similar phase as it was in the run-up to the Maunder Minimum, so by that I mean the activity is dropping off cycle by cycle.

BBC voice-over: Lucie Green is based at the Mullard Space Science Laboratory in the North Downs. She thinks that lower levels of solar activity could affect the climate, but she’s not sure to what extent.

Green [3:35]: It is a very very complex area because the sun’s activity controls how much visible light the sun gives out, but also how much ultraviolet light and x-rays that the sun emits and they create a web of changes up in the earth-atmosphere producing effects that actually we don’t fully understand.

BBC voiceover: Some researchers have gone way further back in time, looked into the ice sheets of particles that were once in the upper atmosphere, particles that show variations in solar activity. Mike Lockwood’s work suggests that this is the fastest rate of solar decline for 10,000 years.

Professor Mike Lockwood, University of Reading [4:20]: If we look at the ice core record we can say, “okay so when we’ve been in this kind of situation before, what’s the sun gone on to do,” and based on that, and the rate of the current decline, we can estimate that within about 40 years from now there’s about a ten or twenty, probably nearer a 20% probabilility that we will actually be back in Maunder Minimum conditions by that time.

BBC: Less solar activity means a drop in ultraviolet radiation. Mike Lockwood says this seems to affect the behavior of the jet stream. The Jet stream changes its pattern. This ends up blocking warm air from reaching Northern Europe. This causes long cold winters, but what about global temperatures as a whole?

Lockwood [5:03]: One has to make a very clear distinction between regional climate and global climate. If we get a cold winter in Europe because of these blocking events it’s warmer, for example, in Greenland, so the average is almost no change [a completely unsupported conjecture that is at odds with reason and evidence A.R.], so it is a redistribution of temperature around the North Atlantic.

Morelle: The relationship between solar activity and weather on earth is complicated but if solar activity continues to fall could the temperature on earth as a whole get cooler? Could there be implications for global warming?

Dr. Lucie Green [5:38]: The world we live in today is very different to the world that was inhabited during the Maunder Minimum. So we have human activity, we have the industrial revolution, all kinds of gases being pumped into the atmosphere, so on the one hand we’ve got perhaps a cooling sun, but on the other hand you’ve got human activity that can counter that and I think it is quite difficult to say actually how these two are going to compete and what the consequences then are for the global climate.

BBC: So even if the planet as a whole continues to warm, if we enter a new Maunder Minimum the future for Northern Europe could be cold and frozen winters for decades to come, and we won’t even have bountiful displays of the northern lights to cheer us up.

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January 21, 2014 1:10 pm

lsvalgaard says:
January 21, 2014 at 11:35 am
“Mass and gravity are always positive and there squares [even more so] and cubes are always positive.
Wolf’s formula is squaring orbital parameters distance without assigning which variables represent the positive and/or negative vectors of aphelion and perihelion of two (or more) planetary masses orbiting around a third body. Basically, he factored in the planetary orbital distance from the sun and squared it over time, removing any interaction/relationship between solar activity and planetary orbits.

January 21, 2014 1:14 pm

Sparks says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:10 pm
he factored in the planetary orbital distance from the sun and squared it over time, removing any interaction/relationship between solar activity and planetary orbits.
Gravitational and tidal interactions depend on those distances which are always positive.

January 21, 2014 1:27 pm

Leif,
This (red) trend line is one half of aphelion and perihelion and the orbital distance between Uranus and Jupiter without factoring in the suns distance.
http://thetempestspark.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/sunspot_area_1875-2012-ju.gif

January 21, 2014 1:31 pm

Sparks says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:27 pm
This (red) trend line is one half of aphelion and perihelion and the orbital distance between Uranus and Jupiter without factoring in the suns distance.
And proves nothing at all. What is seems to be the trend of [the blue and pink dots] does not match the sunspot data in the first place.

January 21, 2014 1:36 pm

lsvalgaard says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:14 pm
“Gravitational and tidal interactions depend on those distances which are always positive.”
I understand what you are saying, My point was not about Gravitational and tidal interactions.

January 21, 2014 1:41 pm

Sparks says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:36 pm
I understand what you are saying, My point was not about Gravitational and tidal interactions.
There are no other that we know of or that are plausible.

January 21, 2014 1:47 pm

lsvalgaard says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:31 pm
And proves nothing at all. What is seems to be the trend of [the blue and pink dots] does not match the sunspot data in the first place.
It is the trend of the blue dots (only), observational data of when Jupiter is moving away from Uranus towards aphelion, The blue line is the sunspot numbers.

January 21, 2014 1:51 pm

Sparks says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:47 pm
It is the trend of the blue dots (only), observational data of when Jupiter is moving away from Uranus towards aphelion, The blue line is the sunspot numbers.
the blue triangles and the pink squares do not follow the sunspot curve in the first place.

Ted Clayton
January 21, 2014 1:53 pm

Sparks said January 20, 2014 at 12:18 pm;

Is it true that the Delaware has frozen over for the first time since the Maunder minimum?

No. It’s froze-over, but it happens in modern times.
‘Frozen rivers’ gets a little involved. For how long? How deep & hard? I don’t see anybody cavorting out on this ice. NOOoooo….
This last was a ‘brief’ arctic outbreak. There is talk of another building in. The Great Lakes probably froze-over, and that will help even a weaker next outbreak.
When these outbreaks are just marchin’ down outa the North like ol-time coal-trains outa Tennessee … they don’t even have to be anything Day After Tomorrow, to lock the river up good & deep.
It’s the “persistence” of the pattern, that counts most.

January 21, 2014 2:01 pm

Hi dr. Svalgaard
Our last exchange ended on positive note, so I wonder if you could help with the aurora data after 1965, when your Danish colleagues’ records ended.
Either way thanks.

January 21, 2014 2:04 pm

lsvalgaard says:
January 21, 2014 at 1:51 pm
“the blue triangles and the pink squares do not follow the sunspot curve in the first place.
Have you an idea why they are similar?

Zeke
January 21, 2014 2:08 pm

Ted Clayton says,
“Plato could see plainly, 2,400 year ago, that an education (the exclusive prerogative of Aristocracy, then) made all the different, in being qualified for many of the roles that exist.”
True, Plato “could plainly see 2,400 years ago that an education made the [difference].” Perhaps, he even knew that maintaining a changeless, stable state meant there could be no education, horses, chariots, private land, weapons, and even pastries (!) for the lower class. In fact, his view of the purpose of education was to produce philosophers who were alone fit to rule.

January 21, 2014 2:08 pm

Sparks says:
January 21, 2014 at 2:04 pm
Have you an idea why they are similar?
1: they are not similar
2: they may look similar because Jupiter’s period is close [but not quite equal] to the solar cycle period

January 21, 2014 2:28 pm

vukcevic says:
January 21, 2014 at 2:01 pm
so I wonder if you could help with the aurora data after 1965, when your Danish colleagues’ records ended.
I’m always willing to help if I can. I’m afraid that there are no auroral records after 1965. Or at least auroral records that are calibrated and can be compared. Various amateur organizations observe aurora [e.g. the British http://www.britastro.org/aurora/ and some German ones] but not systematically enough to be useful. And we have more direct indices today, e.g. Ap and Dst.

January 21, 2014 2:30 pm

It is a strange world, today in what once was the cradle of civilization, education of women is frowned upon, and yet nearly two and half millennia ago Plato said:
Women need to be educated in same way as man, if expected to think and do as men (approximate translation from my Logic science syllabus from decades ago).

Zeke
January 21, 2014 2:48 pm

Women were only to be educated if they were within the Guardian Class, in order to support the Philosopher-king.

Ted Clayton
January 21, 2014 3:13 pm

Zeke said January 21, 2014 at 2:08 pm;

Perhaps, [Plato] even knew that maintaining a changeless, stable state meant there could be no education, horses, chariots, private land, weapons, and even pastries (!) for the lower class. In fact, his view of the purpose of education was to produce philosophers who were alone fit to rule.

Plato believed the sensible world (and therefore society) is non-real. That what the senses apprehend & report (‘what goes on in the world’) is but shadows on the cave wall. In his conceptualization, what is Real is completely invisible, but can be apprehended by an act of Pure Mind. The ability to Know the Real can be cultivated.
His Real (but invisible) world is intrinsically changeless. Of Perfect Form, and Immutable. (The immutability/indivisibility notion/principle was a general feature of Greek thought, and also underpins the work of others to whom we now reference modern Atomic Theory … and astrophysics.)
Plato disdained what his lessors (and we) take to be ‘reality’. To him, the normal world is constantly changing, but in meaningless, valueless ways. And this pattern of change is both unpredictable and beyond control, because it is merely the fleeting shadows of eternal forces that are only barely known, even to such as himself. What the eyes see, the ears hear, is but Chaos; pay no Mind.
To him, the world, worldly affairs, society, the State, was all simply Unworthy.
And besides, people like himself were wing-nuts, in the Halls of Power of their day.

Ted Clayton
January 21, 2014 3:49 pm

Zeke said January 21, 2014 at 2:48 pm:

Women were only to be educated if they were within the Guardian Class, in order to support the Philosopher-king.

Sparta accorded many of the elements of societal empowerment, to women. The status & stature of their females is something of a (to-delight-in) scandal among their Greek contemporaries. (And beyond Greece…)
In Athens, meanwhile, women made do with a somewhat more-than-typically derogatory status. In some debatable part & degree, this is accorded to their (form & style of) Democracy. That what we see of the unfortunate parts of the female estate in Athens, arose through the Democratic Process, as cultural biases & prejudices within the population became codified through the ballot box. (As predicted by Plato…)
Interestingly, the low status of ‘hard/modern science’ (that a Greek intellectual would stoop to a “hypothesis & test” protocol was an embarrassment) seems to have aided & abetted the occasional female author of ‘real science’, within the Classic Greek literature. (‘Oh, don’t worry about it – she’s just a woman!)
… Sooo, had Greek Science & Democracy not fizzled, it might now be disproportionally females who declare that they can see into the sun! 😉

Zeke
January 21, 2014 3:58 pm

Thank you.
PS
I am surprised your “soot dusting” comment (@8:09 am) to control snow cover in a cooler climate did not raise more eyebrows than it did. Of course, particulate matter from coal and farming is a concern to the EPA and is being blamed for mortality rates. It is being claimed that it is part of the “social cost of carbon.” We now have a slew of PM 2.5 regulations, also being used to outlaw home fireplaces in Alaska.

Zeke
January 21, 2014 4:03 pm

Ted Clayton says, “Sparta accorded many of the elements of societal empowerment, to women.”
Women of Sparta had their sons seized from them at very tender ages for training in the military. Women could wrestle with men. I am afraid I remain unconvinced of Spartan women being empowered in any desirable sense of the word. There is absolutely no accounting for taste. (;

Ted Clayton
January 21, 2014 4:55 pm

Zeke said January 21, 2014 at 3:58 pm;

I am surprised your “soot dusting” comment (8:09 am) to control snow cover in a cooler climate did not raise more eyebrows than it did.

Although I call it ‘soot’, it would be and would have to be immaculately clean & pure … ‘carbon-black’ is a better but less-familiar name.
Soot pollution is the result of ‘incomplete combustion’ of common fuels, and as such includes an ill-defined, unpredictable & uncontrollable ‘sh*tload’ of unpleasant and nasty stuff, besides just the carbon. This would be too ineffective & inefficient, in the effort to dust snow and melt it.
To melt snow that we fear would stay through the summer, we must wait until snowfall has ended. It won’t do, to dust and than have fresh snow come down & cover it.
But we don’t want to delay, either, because the longest days occur early in the summer, and we have to get the snow off promptly, so plants can have time to grow decently. It won’t do, to use most of the summer to ‘finally’ get the snow melted off. The ecosystem will already have been damaged.
So dusting-planes have to go up at just the right time; fly around the clock with multiple crews onboard; refuel & reload with dust-fuel, in the sky.
The duster-generators on the planes must produce an exquisitely defined & controlled carbon-product, so that it descends to the ground in a known, predictable & controlled manner. Otherwise, yer just kidding yerself.
Fortunately, we know how to make this kind of carbon-stuff. It was a HUGE industry, throughout the 19th C, and generating “atomically pure”, fantastically-defined carbon particles remains very important, for critical modern technologies. Carbon is a semiconductor, and heavily relied upon in electronics … where uh-huh, it is precision-defined & controlled, literally at the atomic level.
There will those who oppose this kind of effort. But Canada, Russia and Scandinavia know that their butt is on the line. And they’re cultivating allies.

Ted Clayton
January 21, 2014 6:28 pm

Zeke said January 21, 2014 at 3:58 pm;

Women of Sparta had their sons seized from them at very tender ages for training in the military. Women could wrestle with men. I am afraid I remain unconvinced of Spartan women being empowered in any desirable sense of the word.

Sparta does often set jaw-muscles clenching, for reasons unrelated to the relative or absolute status of their females.
It’s hard to smile graciously, as redeeming & attractive attributes of Sparta come into view, with the face already twisted into a reflexive grimace.
But our kids obviously know better. Many of us come through school as Spartans. School Admins, suggesting a name change during an attack of Political Correctness, are often chagrined at how well the schoolyard ‘Spartans’ understand & emulate the essential determination of their (in)famous namesake.
Recent-history has seen Athens thrust onto a pedestal, and Sparta made the goat.
The – highly literate & numerate – women of Sparta were encouraged to enter the crass & worldly forms of engineering & science (too many men not around to do things) … at which more elite Greek intellectuals looked down their nose. To use “hypothesis & test” protocols was the mark of an inferior Mind, in their game.
Had the great diversity of cultural traditions in Ancient Greece not unraveled, not only would women be over-represented in Astrophysics — a distressing portion of them would be Spartan. ‘And y’all best do something with that look on yer face … stat‘. 😉
But then, glancing in the mirror, it is hard to avoid discovering that, like Neanderthals & Denisovans, Sparta is meaningfully alive & well.

bushbunny
January 21, 2014 8:06 pm

About ten years ago, I think, a American female scientist stated after an extreme cold winter that we only need 15 years of extreme cold winters to realise we are headed towards another mini ice age. That’s the Northern Hemisphere not down under. She added that interglacials are generally separated from cold periods by 10 to 15 k warmer periods, but they decrease naturally depending on the sun and our orbit. Other than in Africa because they never evolved into cold weather homo sapiens. We humans have only been in an agrarian state for around 10,000 years, before they had not been able to grow crops or domesticate wild live stock because of the weather. I think if another mini ice age came, like it did from the 14th century until mid 19th in Europe, with our populations governments do not want us to know yet what might be in store for us. Certainly the southern hemisphere would be more popular to live in.

bushbunny
January 21, 2014 8:08 pm

As far as Australia is concerned there were no known glaciers on the main continent, but only one in Tasmania. Although the rainforests were depleted somewhat and tree levels on elevated spots were lower down. But we were joined to PNG and off shore islands, including Tasmania.

Nikola Milovic
January 22, 2014 2:25 am

Sparks, your discussions and information that are relevant to the mowing ground orientation has dezorjentisanje science, seeking to address the true causes of phenomena that are discussed for years, with no logical conclusions.
Here’s how the planets affect all these phenomena, given the strength of the effect:
Neptune 1. 1953 Mercury; Uranus 2.090 ; Mars 2.450, Earth 52.928 ; Saturn 55.367 ; Venus 82 .454 , and Jupiter 621. 803 times
So the planets was a major factor!!