Solar cycle 24 continues the slump

Dr. Deanster says: “I can see the global temp dropping by a good 0.5C”
You might be right, here’s the fundamental problem, when we wrote our equations for feedback, it was written with predisposed conclusions towards CO2. We really do not know how much of the cooling, 1880-1910, was the drop off in solar activity (equal to solar cycle 24) combined with a negative PDO, how much of the cooling 1940-ish till 1975, was natural neg PDO w/ high solar activity or unnatural aerosols. Then how much of the equal warming .5c 1910-1940 & 1975-2000, was natural or man-made. There is no denying, CO2 can trap heat, then again the last half of the 20th century was characterized by a solar maximum last seen 1000 yrs ago. So how much is natural and how much is from CO2.
The only way to make accurate predictions is to remove predisposed biases towards CO2 and start from scratch!

Dermot O’Logical says:
August 13, 2013 at 1:26 am
totally agree – but then if the climate boyz can find ‘The AGW Warming’ in all that natural variablilty, hopefully they can find the cooling too! LOL
Doug Allen says:
August 13, 2013 at 5:35 am
absolutely – the solar energy is not just TSI – but probably a zillion other interactions of magnetic influences, x-rays, UVE, etc, etc. Perhaps I should have put /sarc ? – but to be fair, at this stage, AFAIK, nobody, but NOBODY has a sh*tload of applicable modern solar data through a very weak sun yet (?) and so the solar guys must be pretty excited if we start to see some strange readings?.
I for one, still think that the time lags of relatively minor solar effects to earth effects are likely to be in the multidecadal to ‘centuries’ scale – so don’t think we will get any answers soon, but if solar energy (in all its forms) is seen to vary a lot more than some currently think, during the possible quiet phase, it will certainly put the cat amongst the pigeons…..especially as we simply have insufficient data to even model possible ‘solar’ effects. (I can’t see a few decades of solar obs and thermal obs being much use, can you?)
In any event, no doubt the guv’ment/alarmists will come up with some upside down theory, e.g. that we are taking too much solar energy instead of reflecting it back to the sun (to keep it warm), or some such rubbish! to prolong further taxation, etc,etc – damn, that’s another idea I’ve given them…….

JimS, if you are so sure that .00012% of CO2 cannot have a significant effect, consider that 0.00012% of body weight is very close to the lethal dose of sodium cynanide to a human.
And many other substances are much more toxic than cyanide.
Small amounts of things really can matter.

@steveta_uk Writes:
“JimS, if you are so sure that .00012% of CO2 cannot have a significant effect, consider that 0.00012% of body weight is very close to the lethal dose of sodium cynanide to a human.
And many other substances are much more toxic than cyanide.
Small amounts of things really can matter.”
JimS responds:
Yes, very small amounts of poison can have a significant affect upon the human body, since poison brings about death.
Since CO2 is not poison or pollution, but is a necessity for life continuing upon this planet, your logic is faulty. Given that earth has experienced significantly higher levels of CO2 for the past 500 million years and life thrived on the earth as a result, your logic goes from being faulty to being the antithesis of logic.
You really should take some time and explore the past history of the earth, as you might find this venture quite illuminating. Listening to Catastrophic Anthropongenic Global Warming extremists, and to no one else, is rather poisonous to the mind.

Ian W says: @ur momisugly August 13, 2013 at 2:12 am
…As already apparent in UK and Germany the provision of energy is already too high for some domestic customers and 5000 extra deaths were recorded in UK just in March 2013 due to cold and energy poverty – with no political response. IFF the global temperatures do drop the cold winters will be concurrent with extreme increases in energy costs (which will have ‘necessarily sky rocketed’ TM Obama) . Expect progressive politicians at that point to attempt to apportion blame for these deaths probably to the ‘climate science Team’. Nevertheless, their policies and governance can be expected to remain regardless of increasing deaths from cold as they were the long term aim of the AGW scare…..
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Heck Obama is ALREADY SHIFTING BLAME

TOP NEWS TODAY: Climate Change Is Threatening the Power Grid
Just days away from the 10-year anniversary of the worst power outage in U.S. history, the White House and the Energy Department released a report on Monday evaluating the resiliency of the nation’s electric grid and recommending steps to prevent future blackouts. full story

It is also on YAHOO: Climate Change Is Threatening the Power Grid

The report called storms and severe weather “the leading cause of power outages in the United States,” and warned against the steep cost of weather-related damage to the electric grid. It put the price tag for electrical failures caused by inclement weather at between $18 billion and $33 billion annually, and noted that costs have increased in recent years, jumping from a range of $14 billion to $26 billion in 2003 to $27 billion to $52 billion in 2012. Storms exceeding a billion dollars in damages (electrical and otherwise) have also become more frequent in the past decade, as the chart below shows.
Senior administration officials told reporters during a conference call Monday morning that investing in improvements to the grid is the best way to make sure this figure does not continue to rise.
Officials said the electrical distribution system, largely made up of power lines, is the most vulnerable part of the grid….

Tally Ho And Away we go to, wait for it… The SMART GRID Interesting that the report on the Smart Grid is from 2009 but Obama waits until AFTER the election and the start of the hurricane season to blame it on ‘Climate Change’

The Department of Energy Report 2009

A smart grid is needed at the distribution level to manage voltage levels, reactive power, potential reverse power flows, and power conditioning, all critical to running grid-connected DG systems, particularly with high penetrations of solar and wind power and PHEVs…. Designing and retrofitting household appliances, such as washers, dryers, and water heaters with technology to communicate and respond to market signals and user preferences via home automation technology will be a significant challenge. Substantial investment will be required….
These controls and tools could reduce the occurrence of outages and power disturbances attributed to grid overload. They could also reduce planned rolling brownouts and blackouts like those implemented during the energy crisis in California in 2000.

No mention of course that the EPA and Department of Energy drastically underestimated the effects of the new EPA rulings and many more plants are closing than anticipated. This means electricity prices will sky rocket and the electric grid could become unstable New Regulations to Take 34 GW of Electricity Generation Offline and the Plant Closing Announcements Keep Coming… According to EPA, …. these regulations will only shutter 9.5 GW of electricity generation capacity.

Energy InSight FAQs
….Rolling outages are systematic, temporary interruptions of electrical service.
They are the last step in a progressive series of emergency procedures that ERCOT follows when it detects that there is a shortage of power generation within the Texas electric grid. ERCOT will direct electric transmission and distribution utilities, such as CenterPoint Energy, to begin controlled, rolling outages to bring the supply and demand for electricity back into balance.They generally last 15-45 minutes before being rotated to a different neighborhood to spread the effect of the outage among consumers, which would be the case whether outages are coordinated at the circuit level or individual meter level. Without this safety valve, power generating units could overload and begin shutting down and risk causing a domino effect of a statewide, lengthy outage. With smart meters, CenterPoint Energy is proposing to add a process prior to shutting down whole circuits to conduct a mass turn off of individual meters with 200 amps or less (i.e. residential and small commercial consumers) for 15 or 30 minutes, rotating consumers impacted during that outage as well as possible future outages.
There are several benefits to consumers of this proposed process. By isolating non-critical service accounts (“critical” accounts include hospitals, police stations, water treatment facilities etc.) and spreading “load shed” to a wider distribution, critical accounts that happen to share the same circuit with non-critical accounts will be less affected in the event of an emergency. Curtailment of other important public safety devices and services such as traffic signals, police and fire stations, and water pumps and sewer lifts may also be avoided.

JimS and BobW – you’ve both completely missed my point.
I was pointing out that claming that anything in low concentrations cannot have a major effect is simply wrong. I could just have easily have used a vitamin as an example, or some of the rarer elements we need, where tiny amounts are required for life.
I was not suggesting that CO2 is in any way harmful, nor was I suggesting that CO2 is connected to CAGW.

Nigel Harris says:
August 13, 2013 at 7:12 am
JimS
The valid comparison is: TSI may fall by around 0.1%, the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere has increased by around 42% (280 ppm to 400 ppm)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
So a 0.1% decrease in the Pacific ocean is less water than a 42% decrease in the water in a mud puddle.
Same logic.

@steveta_uk
I apologize for not understanding your position. However, I have come across too many CAGW extremists who used this same argument that you used. Therefore, I assumed you would be in that category.
Regards