Via Tom Nelson:
“For “the biggest climate rally in history,” attendance was remarkably sparse. Those of us in the Light Brigade guessed 5,000”
It was really, really cold the whole time. I was surprised that everyone we ran into was wearing oil-based clothing. I figured a couple people would try to symbolically wear “natural fibers,” I didn’t see any. When I pointed out to people that their clothes were made of oil, they blamed “the system.”
…
For “the biggest climate rally in history,” attendance was remarkably sparse. Those of us in the Light Brigade guessed 5,000. We were heartened by the lack of real enthusiasm by the protesters. The Light Brigade, as our videos will show, had real passion–we love energy with conviction, while they hate it with confusion.
“Forward on climate” was personified by the shivering, emotionally muted, and fairly sparse crowd leaving early in their oil clothing to get to their coal and gas homes.
The lesson of the protest was clear: Nature, untamed by fossil fuels and other affordable, reliable energy is an often uncomfortable and dangerous place to be. That’s why the protesters left as early as they could, and why the whole production was ridiculous. Who wants to stand outside in the middle of February, freezing to “send a message” about “global warming”? Resolve faded to the point where by the 4:00 closing time, I could shoot footage right next to the stage with no one within 20 feet of me.
Stunning: 40,000+ Rally in DC for Forward on Climate | 350.org
What a day! Over 40,000 people poured into the streets of Washington, DC today to push President Obama to take our nation “Forward on Climate” and say no to the Keystone XL pipeline.
Our team here at 350.org had expected a crowd, but this was MASSIVE. Volunteers from around the country organized 130 buses to get people to the rally and it showed: there were people of all ages from Florida to Wisconsin to California here today.
Washington DC Climate Rally – February 17, 2013 « Suwannee – St. Johns Sierra Club
Contact our bus coordinators to sign up for a seat on the bus. We are asking everyone to contribute $72.74 towards the actual cost of $130. [So who paid the rest of the “actual cost” and why?]
Charter Bus Prices and Bus Options
[Typical capacity around 50 people]
It seems highly unlikely that all the buses were chock-full of people. 130 buses at 30 people per bus would be about 4,000 people. If 36,000 other people actually attended this rally, how did they get there?
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ferd berple says:
February 18, 2013 at 7:52 am
Gee Berple, what a maroon. Your take on the “Big Oil” rape of the world (conspiracy) is childish. There is enough of an energy market for all of the fossil fuel companies to take care of themselves for centuries. What liberal clown BS are you reading. They don’t want to put the other industries out of business. The longer society is perpetuated on this eff’ed up planet, the more money they will make. And me too.
They’ve always been carpeted. For centuries.
Tidbit: Carpets can take dirt and sand, and dirty shoes. It’s bare feet that destroy carpets. Feet oil and toxins damage the fibers. A rich friend had an Aubusson carpet on his floor, paid $50Gs for it in the 1960s. He asked me to keep my shoes on, then explained the science of carpets and their use as traditional protection against radiant heat in the desert.
Thanks for the suggestions.
Sending different downstream products along a pipe line is easy, that is done all the time. You put a “pig” in between and way you go again.
The heat to refine issue could be, but you need to heat it up (and dilute it) all the way from Alberta, so what is easier refining at source or inTexas?
Politics and ROI, yes I can see that being an issue as it always is.
Canadians being happy being rid of the “oil spill” and any residue? Yes that could be. That is a bit like the West Australians wanting to do the rare earth mining but the polluting refining in SE Asia (which they do not want there either).
I have no problem thinking about why Canada would not want it or why the US would want it.
The issue is that there is no pipe line at the moment and until there is one or an alternative action is taken the tar sands will remain just that and Alberta will not make a dime. Until there is something in place there is no ROI for those involved.
This was the big thing in Alberta in the 80’s but the price was not right. Man, there was a buz in Edmonton in those years.
In my opinion Alberta has to face the facts, there will always be a determined action against a pipe going anywhere, Texas, BC or the East. Real issues or imagined. Refining at source will kill a lot of those issues. If there is no pipe other people (or the same) will object against road or rail transport of the stuff (with the volumes involved that is not really a choice anyway).
Why not get on with it?
And like it or not, Canada has to do what is right for Canada. Whatever that is.
(I have no interest, financial or otherwise, in this matter, although a US blackout would mean sourcing some of my raw materials elsewhere).
Jim Mayer,
You are the moron. You assume that Ferd believes that we must buy oil from the Middle East. That is not what he said.
Robert A. Taylor,
I don’t have access to an introductory anthropology text.
Talking about fudging numbers, this slightly off topic article, details what the EU are trying to do with their carbon permits.
http://www.smh.com.au/business/carbon-economy/eu-poised-to-set-fate-of-carbon-market-20130219-2eotk.html
Do these people think their lies won’t be noticed? Why, yes, yes they do.
It does not matter if the lies are noticed or not if they are not reported in the mainstream media. The BBC here is committed to presenting the case of AGW positively so they automatically pick the most positive figure their reporters can find. The BBC were caught out with their lies but who knows how many other media sources are equally dishonest.
I’d like to see the source of the money that is used to oppose North American fuel development. Could it be Saudi??
In Canada, the Prime Minister is pushing for the closure of many of the country’s coal power plants under the excuse of saving the planet. What most frost bitten Canadians don’t realize is that coal is a competitor of oil, and when the coal plants are closed they will be replaced by oil. Alberta oil. It’s not merely a coincidence that the Prime Minister is from Alberta.
Canada’s PM is Alberta’s best oil salesman. He should be paid a healthy commission for his efforts. Lol!
Alberta oil will save the planet…sniff…
DirkH says: @ur momisugly February 18, 2013 at 12:54 pm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Well put. It is about a world wide totalitarian state where our every move is dictated and freedom.
See my comment here
In addition to the fictitious numbers for 350’s protest, they are abject failures at giving an intelligible argument for why stopping this Keystone XL pipeline is supposed to be of environmental value.
Activists are trying to choke off new or expanded supplies of evilll fossil fuels in order to force changes to ‘renewables’…. But transporting bitumen by rail and relying upon supplies from Venezuela, the Middle East, etc. is not a better course than having the Keystone XL pipeline in service.
Meanwhile, similar nuts in the EU/UK have pushed the UK into a predicament in which they will face a 10% drop in electrical output almost overnight at the end of March:
http://www.bishop-hill.net/blog/2013/2/19/what-next.html
The combination of aging coal power plants, destroyed incentive for building new gas or coal fired plants, and growing but highly unreliable “renewable” sources such as wind, are pushing the UK toward wrenching changes. That is what groups like 350.org want, of course, although they hope that a compliant media will not place the blame on them if too much of the public becomes annoyed or worse.
Sounds like the bus ride cost $72 and each rider probably got $75 to stand in the cold for a few hours….
Jim Mayer says:
February 18, 2013 at 8:17 pm
“Gee Berple, what a maroon. Your take on the “Big Oil” rape of the world (conspiracy) is childish. There is enough of an energy market for all of the fossil fuel companies to take care of themselves for centuries. What liberal clown BS are you reading.”
Well the Gas industry paid the Sierra club to fight against coal. This is documented. You can call it a conspiracy – they tried to keep it secret.
Why, Jim, did they do that? What do you think?
I don’t get the remarks about quantity of chartered busses.
If transit busses and rapid transit were running that’s a lot of capacity able to bring people into the city from an area population of many times 40,000.
Perhaps they couldn’t get many people from the DC area to attend.
As for “commieBob”s remark “Do these people think their lies won’t be noticed? Why, yes, yes they do.” there are some phenomenon at work:
– telling a lie as an offensive measure. For example, call someone on their behaviour on the street or in a store and they’ll tell lies
– their perceived audience of people who will believe them and not those corporate fat casts/oil industry patsies/etc.
– delusionary mentality (evasion)
– Alex Epstein of Centre for Industrial Progress suggests it is shame that they did so poorly (that would fit confusion about self-esteem)
outtheback says:
February 18, 2013 at 10:28 am
“I understand that the refining of the tar sands involves technology available in Texas but not (yet) in Canada hence the “need” for the pipeline.”
Although there are several useful replies above, permit me to add a few more facts;
– Serious commercial production from the Athabasca oil sands started in 1967, with Suncor, then Great Canadian Oil Sands. (yes, 45 years ago)
– the GCOS plant included an upgrader; they upgraded essentially all their bitumen production for many years.
– the second plant, Syncrude started up in 1979, also included an upgrader, and Syncrude has upgraded essentially all its bitumen since then. The product is marketed as “Syncrude Sweet Blend”, and even today attracts a market price similar to West Texas Intermediate (WTI). (the discount of $30 per barrel we a hear about applies to diluted bitumen).
Figures for 2011 (from Government of Alberta) are total bitumen production of 1.7 million barrels per day, of which 57% was upgraded in Alberta – so some 700,000 barrels per day of bitumen (plus the diluent to make dil bit) already shipped out of Alberta (as far as I know, it all goes to the U.S.)
So obviously there is no technology gap, and has not been one for 35 or 45 years.
CodeTech provided some good points as to why the trend has been to more shipments of dil bit, such that, as total production has increased, the percentage upgraded within Alberta has dropped from perhaps 90% as recently as 2000 to the 2011 figure of 57%. Note current production is closer to 2 million barrels per day, so the upgraded portion is probably now down around 50%.
I will add one more reason. Refineries are tailored to the expected feed – yes, they do have some flexibility, and yes they can migrate with further capital investment towards a different crude slate. Regardless, certain Gulf Coast refineries were optimized for Venezuelan crude, which is much like Athabasca bitumen. The owners of those refineries are concerned Chavez will run the Venezuelan industry in to the ground (with good reason, perhaps – some very competent Venezuelan engineers have already voted with their feet and are making solid contributions in Alberta) – and are concerned their refineries will require substantial capital investment to suit some other crude slate. Solution? Get the same stuff from Alberta.
Paul Jackson said:
“Silly 350ers, global warming events are for summer!”
Well, it used to be global warming, but it’s worse than that now, it’s Climate Change!
Don’t you know it’s so cold because the CO2 is over 350 ppm?
My Dog, think of the children.
Has anyone analyzed and published photo or video evidence of the actual turnout numbers on Feb. 17?? From what I saw in 350’s own photos there may have been only a few thousand people max., nothing like the 40,000 that is still being claimed. This is going to go into media/contemporary history as another inflated activist fraud if someone with photos and details can’t establish the facts.
btw, fascinating profile of McKibben in which he displays an utterly nutty obsession with the Keystone XL pipeline as though it’s the key to the entire future of the human race (who knew that an enviro-whacko could say we have “infinite” hydrocarbons available when usually they are telling us we are just about to run out):
[h/t Tom Nelson]
Bill McKibben is a fanatic
Yet again I search but fail to find any photo or video evidence that there were more than a couple of thousand people at the 350.org event:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/350org/8483599573/in/photostream/
are any journalists or bloggers of a critical bent investigating the possible fraud of ongoing claims that 35,000 or 40,000 demonstrators were present??
I find it difficult to believe there would not be even one photo or video giving a sense of such a large crowd ……