350.org fudges the numbers again

Via Tom Nelson:

“For “the biggest climate rally in history,” attendance was remarkably sparse. Those of us in the Light Brigade guessed 5,000”

The Light Brigade Shines at the Shivering Blackout Rally

It was really, really cold the whole time. I was surprised that everyone we ran into was wearing oil-based clothing. I figured a couple people would try to symbolically wear “natural fibers,” I didn’t see any. When I pointed out to people that their clothes were made of oil, they blamed “the system.”

For “the biggest climate rally in history,” attendance was remarkably sparse. Those of us in the Light Brigade guessed 5,000. We were heartened by the lack of real enthusiasm by the protesters. The Light Brigade, as our videos will show, had real passion–we love energy with conviction, while they hate it with confusion.

“Forward on climate” was personified by the shivering, emotionally muted, and fairly sparse crowd leaving early in their oil clothing to get to their coal and gas homes.

The lesson of the protest was clear: Nature, untamed by fossil fuels and other affordable, reliable energy is an often uncomfortable and dangerous place to be. That’s why the protesters left as early as they could, and why the whole production was ridiculous. Who wants to stand outside in the middle of February, freezing to “send a message” about “global warming”? Resolve faded to the point where by the 4:00 closing time, I could shoot footage right next to the stage with no one within 20 feet of me.

Stunning: 40,000+ Rally in DC for Forward on Climate | 350.org

What a day! Over 40,000 people poured into the streets of Washington, DC today to push President Obama to take our nation “Forward on Climate” and say no to the Keystone XL pipeline.

Our team here at 350.org had expected a crowd, but this was MASSIVE. Volunteers from around the country organized 130 buses to get people to the rally and it showed: there were people of all ages from Florida to Wisconsin to California here today.

Washington DC Climate Rally – February 17, 2013 « Suwannee – St. Johns Sierra Club

Contact our bus coordinators to sign up for a seat on the bus. We are asking everyone to contribute $72.74 towards the actual cost of $130.  [So who paid the rest of the “actual cost” and why?]

Charter Bus Prices and Bus Options

[Typical capacity around 50 people]

It seems highly unlikely that all the buses were chock-full of people. 130 buses at 30 people per bus would be about 4,000 people. If 36,000 other people actually attended this rally, how did they get there?

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Pull My Finger

Even the organizers photos show a sparse crowd. 5000 seems like the MAX that were there. Desperate Stalinsist propoganda unleashed during the death throes of the movement.

Isn’t 350.org financed by the Rockefellers aka Standard Oil money?
Of course the oil companies want us to stop using coal in power plants. of course they want to stop the keystone pipeline from bringing oil from a reliable neighbor and thus drive up oil prices in the US. the oil companies want the US to be dependent on middle east oil, because this is not a reliable supply. this leaves the consumer ready to pay any price.
Stop importing middle east oil. Stop the money flowing to the waring parties and they will be forced to reach a peace agreement. So long as billions in US $$ are going the the Arabs and Israelis under the status quo, why would they want peace? they will of course talk about it. but why would they want to end the gravy train?
At the same time why would those in the US making billions as a result of the ongoing conflict want to change? Why would they want the US to have a secure supply of oil? Thus while every US President talks about ending the conflict, everyone around them is giving them advice to ensure it never ends.

commieBob

Here’s something from Huffington:

But despite claims by organizers that 50,000 people were in attendance, the crowd appeared smaller, with one police officer in attendance unofficially pegging it at about 10,000 as it got underway. http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/02/17/keystone-xl-pipeline-protest-washington_n_2707269.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

Do these people think their lies won’t be noticed? Why, yes, yes they do.

I watched this McKibben … person.. on Al Jazeera a couple days ago – he downright lied several times. He blinked a lot while he claimed “the oceans were 30% more acidic recently” and he couldn’t articulate why Canadians shouldn’t clean up the biggest oil spill in North America and turn it into usable fuel. He appears to be a very well paid mouthpiece for someone(thing) unsavoury.

PaulH

So who paid the rest of the “actual cost” and why?
Who has the most to lose from a switch from OPEC oil to Canadian oil?

surprise, surprise, surprise

Jeff Alberts

It seems highly unlikely that all the buses were chock-full of people. 130 buses at 30 people per bus would be about 4,000 people. If 36,000 other people actually attended this rally, how did they get there?

VW microbuses powered by wishful thinking and Unicorn Farts(TM).

JaceF

It’s exactly the same formula as used when evaluating climate sensitivity you have to multiply by six to get the actual figure, in CAGW attendance figure reporting it’s called ‘crowd sensitivity’ you get a doubling per attendees to account for their ego and you multiply it for each online trolling account they have so times 3.

pottereaton

Which leads to the joke, “how many nitwits does it take to freeze their appendages off to protest global warming?”
Haven’t got the punchline yet . . . feel free . . .

cui bono

Protester in clip: “Whether that means there’ll be a planet for us [points at people], or not, I think the planet will be better..”.
I didn’t realise the ‘350’ stood for the number of humans the ‘org’ want remaining after the glorious global blackout.

Gary D.

When I typed “washington dc climate” just now into Bing it didn’t offer “rally” as the end of a phrase. It doesn’t seem like there is much interest.

You’d think that these people would want to time their rallies for the warmer summer months, but then it would probably be too hot for them to venture out from their climate controlled homes.

steveta_uk

A bus would cost around $1000/day, so for Fri-Sat-Sun hire, the $130 cost would mean about 23 people expected in the bus. Not a lot.

Chris @NJ_Snow_Fan

Off topic but not much news about James E Hansen being arrested last week for the second time protesting the Keystone Pipeline. How can that guy still have a job at NASA Anthony?

Just some thoughts on that oil-based clothing about which we are supposed to experience guilt. I grow the species of bamboo that is used for “natural” fibre, and I do very much like my bamboo underwear. Yet it’s hard to keep a straight face using the word “natural” while knowing how the stuff is turned into fabric, and how much synthetic substance is required for the many other things bamboo is used for. Just as a lot of fossil fuel goes into producing (and supplementing) the comforting hum of wind turbines, there are very few “natural” or “oil-free” products that don’t depend massively on oil and worse for their manufacture and distribution. (It’s a bit like Earth Hour really. Where would it be without massive urban infrastructure supported by fossil fuels?)
As most know, before synthetic winter clothing was common and warmth became cheap, there was an Animal Apocalypse in places like Hudson Bay and Siberia. What many don’t know is that, in one year in the 1920s, two million koala pelts were exported from Australia. Makes one feel a bit better about donning the Goretex and Dupont fibres, does it not?

j ferguson

The WaPo reports the head-count (so to speak) at 35,000 AS reported by the organizers. Are there any photos of the crowd?

Steve Keohane

I went to 350.org to see the article, which said no more than the few lines above. It was interesting to see it is purely a propaganda site, with no place for discussion. I suppose who needs discourse when you have consensus.

Skiphil

The photos so far on the 350.org do not suggest much more than a couple of thousand people….. If they had photo evidence of a far vaster crowd why would they not be showing it???
One thing we see over and over again is that groups like 350.org simply lie when convenient or helpful to “the cause” (as Michael Mann might say).

Slartibartfast

[snip . . site rules. I suppose you are being ironic, but there are many here for whom English is not their first language and so might misinterpret your comment. Perhaps it needs a /sarc tag, perhaps not . . mod]

Fred from Canuckistan

Just more proof that you have to be arithmetically challenged to be a Believer in Global Warming.
Just like a Decline that needs to be Hidden is interpreted to be an increase in temperature, 5000 magically becomes 40,000.
Maybe they are auditioning for a job in Obama’s administration, where a ten $trillion dollar increase in planned spending is magically a $2.5 trillion dollar cut when you don’t increase the deficit as much as planned.

Oflot

I was hoping it was going to be a science related fudging 🙁 To compensate for the fudging IBD and Taylor did recently, which hurt the skeptical side. Hippies always gonna be hippies.

Gail Combs

” We were heartened by the lack of real enthusiasm by the protesters. “
I wonder if they were like the Seabrook Nuclear Plant Protesters, PAID to show up. (The Boston Globe had a want ad advertising $10/hr for protesters in the mid eighties. It paid better than a lot of other jobs)
Here is a humorous video about paid activists/protesters.

tgmccoy

Even 40,000 is chump numbers for a DC rally.

Mike Fowle

This movement isn’t going anywhere, they say proudly. Correct.

7552209

They drove? They took the train?
I do not think more than 5K were there, that said DC has great trains and public transportation and 1000s of parking spots.

Gary

Of course the liberal media did their typical job. The clips I saw on the news were shot cleverly to make it look like there were literally tens of thousands there!
Dealing with these people is a lose-lose proposition. They are firmly committed to blaming naturally occurring changes that have been going on for millions of years (before humans were ever on the earth) on human activity. If we implement the taxes and draconian regulations they want, we all lose! Additionally, if we implement these measures, when (not if) they fail to change anything it will be because “Its too late – we waited too long!” Just because it seems warmer or colder than it did when we were a kid means nothing in comparison to the age of the earth. The one thing we can count on is that climate does and will change!

Slartibartfast

Ok, yes I was being ironic. Sorry. Once upon a time people would have known me for a frequent commenter, and laughed (or not, possibly). It’s been a while, though.
[sorry, but we have a lot of B-Ark types pitching up too. . . mod]

MattN

Of course they fudged the numbers. Number fudging is all they know how to do…

Gary

The Light Brigade, as our videos will show, had real passion–we love energy with conviction, while they hate it with confusion.

They seem so pitifully confused. Oil and coal have real conviction; it’s wind and solar that are tentative.

Matt

“It seems highly unlikely that all the buses were chock-full of people. 130 buses at 30 people per bus would be about 4,000 people. If 36,000 other people actually attended this rally, how did they get there?”
The largest intercity coach buses seat 55 to 60 people. Even if all 130 buses were in this class and were all at capacity that is still < 8000 people, still a long ways short of the 40,000 claimed by 350.org.
I have a question. When has 350.org produced anything other than fudge?

djkelly

I saw someone here in NC looking for people to carpool to catch the bus in Durham early in the morning. From NC they were making a daytrip, not a three day excursion, so those were some expensive buses. The post I saw did say they were biofuel powered buses.

jayhd

Off topic, but just a thought on “oil based” clothing. When I joined the U. S. Army, cold weather clothing was made of mostly “natural” fibers (cotton, wool and fur). Cold weather operations in Alaska, Korea, Norway and Germany were usually pretty miserable affairs, with frostbite and hypothermia common injuries. Then the “oil based” (nylon, gore-tex, etc.) extended cold weather clothing system (ECWCS) came along. Cold weather operations were a lot easier, especially for the Special Forces, who operated mostly on foot, skis and/or snow shoes. The CAGW crowd had better pray that they never have to live in freezing conditions without oil, coal or nuclear energy.

Adam

A link to CBS, who said that more than a thousand protesters rallied in DC. Now let’s find the missing 34000 people they claim were there.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57319383/thousands-in-d.c-protest-pipeline/

Wamron

Network37 says:
“I watched this McKibben … person.. on Al Jazeera a couple days ago – he downright lied several times. He blinked a lot while he claimed “the oceans were 30% more acidic recently” and he couldn’t articulate why Canadians shouldn’t clean up the biggest oil spill in North America and turn it into usable fuel. He appears to be a very well paid mouthpiece for someone(thing) unsavoury.”
The House of Saud has played a double game with civilised nations* since we liberated them from Ottoman rule.
On the one hand they take our money in exchange for allowing us to extract oil under where they have pitched their tents, on the other hand they fund Wahabbi missions that underpin anti-Western dreams of a new Caliphate, world-wide. On the one hand they promote sale of oil in the West but on theother they are happy to see Environmentalists undermine the basis of our societies, which is industry. Its the same long term agenda really.
*I say “civilised” nations. The word civilised basically means living in cities. The Saud Arabs are proud of their nomadic heritage and continue to use tents wherever they can. Ridiculous pretense though that may be when these tents are carpeted and air-conditioned. Nonetheless, they like to think of thmselves as Bedouin-like people of the desert.By definition they cannot also be “civilised”.

pottereaton says:
February 18, 2013 at 8:02 am
Which leads to the joke, “how many nitwits does it take to freeze their appendages off to protest global warming?”
14.1 – but Hansen will round them up to 15 for the children.

SanityP

A satellite image of the event would quickly settle the question regarding the number of participants at this “rally”.

Matt in Houston

The most ironic part about the idiots that actually engage in supporting the political pawns of the Democrat Elite is they don’t understand that they are actually ushering in the destruction of everything that makes their miserable lives even moderately comfortable.
Yet they sit their in their clothing and everything else whose manufacture would be impossible without modern energy and oil derivatives and scream, whine and handcuff themselves (and worse) to things for a purpose they have not the slightest understanding of. Mr. McKibben and all the others like him are pawns in a game they either don’t understand or simply don’t care while they garner their 15 minutes of fame.
Sad and disgusting. The inmates are running the asylum. Aside from a handful of Republicans their isn’t much real opposition to these folks designs.

This was the email I got (i always let the enemy inform me what they are going to do)
Friends —
Today, the largest climate action in United States history is happening in Washington, D.C.
People are standing in solidarity throughout the world, and calling on their leaders to move #ForwardOnClimate.
There’s a lot more work to be done tomorrow, but today we need to get really loud, and grab the world’s attention.
Henry says
Glad to hear it was cold so not too many turned up…
http://blogs.24.com/henryp/2012/10/02/best-sine-wave-fit-for-the-drop-in-global-maximum-temperatures/
global cooling is here,
I am sure in due time they will find something to blame humans for the coming cold….

numerobis

It’s pretty much a constant that you can halve the organizers’ claim and double the police’s claim to get a number that is approximately accurate, in any big protest in a free country. So we’re talking a significant number of people by US standards (in France, this is what happens whenever the sun shines or fails to shine).
I’m amused at this wondering where the others came from. DC is a city, and the mall is in the middle of it. There’s lots of ways to get there — fly, drive, take a commercial bus, take Amtrak — and lots of people who live there already.

Chuck Nolan

Many just flew in their private, corporate or public hydrocarbon / CO2 emitting jets.
Many, many more must have had to drive their SUVs, circling the block looking for a close parking place to keep from freezing during this Global Warming Rally.
We’re in trouble!
cn

outtheback

I understand that the refining of the tar sands involves technology available in Texas but not (yet) in Canada hence the “need” for the pipeline.
Being one of those people who prefers to do the processing close to the source of the raw material I have to ask: why don’t the Canadians get the technology, refine the sands and send the downstream products to the US (or elsewhere for that matter)?
It is not that this refinery operation would be used for just a year or two.
It would leave them in a far better market position and the options of sending the refined products directly to multiple markets where they are to be used rather then piping it to Texas and then from there to the various markets.
Does anyone know why this is not considered, or is it but the pipeline takes all the media attention.

Theo Goodwin

j ferguson says:
February 18, 2013 at 8:23 am
“The WaPo reports the head-count (so to speak) at 35,000 AS reported by the organizers. Are there any photos of the crowd?”
Good old WAPO – as blind as Bill McKibben.

pottereaton

It’s not the first time the left/greens have lied about their numbers at a demonstration. In the link above they estimated more than 2.5 times the actual number.

son of mulder

I want to know who produced the fuel for the coaches. Surely they wouldn’t pay the oil companies.

Sarah

So desperate to prevent climate change they deliberately created 130 bus journeys worth of totally avoidable CO2. Yet another example of the joined up thinking coming from these people.

pottereaton

I used the term “nitwits” to describe these people above, and this quotation from their website confirms it: “The march today looked like the movement that elected President Obama. Now, it’s time for him to join us in standing up to Big Oil and saying no to Keystone XL. Because this movement isn’t going anywhere. We’re, to borrow a phrase, fired up and ready to go. And we’re not stopping until the President takes action.
“Because this movement isn’t going anywhere.”(?) LOL. Of course we all know they did go somewhere. They went inside and got warm.

As McKibben says (but never actually seems to show how) “Do the math.”.
Matt says:
February 18, 2013 at 9:17 am
I have a question. When has 350.org produced anything other than fudge?
If they actually produced fudge, it’d be something useful – I like fudge. I also like seeing loonies freezing to death to stop – what? A pipe being built. A pipe which would help their country to become self-sufficient in oil, and stop their dollars being donated to undemocratic regimes in the middle-east. A pipe – my God, what’s the world coming to.

George Daddis

Interesting contrast; look at a photo of any “grass-roots” Tea Party rally and note that most of the signs are home made; suggesting folks thought about what they were assembling to promote beforehand. Now look at the signs for 350 (or ANY left wing protest) and you will see professionally designed and printed posters.
I best most of these 350 protesters could not explain the meaning of the signs they carried. (E.g. What is “Climate Justice”? It certainly isn’t science.) Do they realize they are useful idiots for those with an income redistribution or an extreme socialist agenda?

Larry Geiger

We backpacked past 5,000 of these folks camped out at Hopkins Prairie down here in warmth challenged Florida this past weekend. 5,000 freezing hippies in the woods burning every branch in sight. Welcome Home guys!

There are some techniques that Fenton Communications actually teaches (or did) in their literature. First of all, official crowd estimates are usually made by the area covered by the crowd so they tell you that in events drawing a less than expected number of people, to put more space around the individuals. So you might see, in a sparsely attended event, people putting 3 or more feet around each other in order to spread out the area of the crowd and increase the estimate by increasing the covered area. Another thing they teach is to find specific places to escort journalists to so that you present your protest in the best way possible for photojournalists and tv cameras. They teach you to make a press packet, tell the journalists where to arrive to connect with protest organizers, and then escort them to the desired location.
It’s all just plain propaganda.