From the University of Oregon a wacky idea to refrigerate smokestacks.
Cooled coal emissions would clean air and lower health and climate-change costs
EUGENE, Ore. — (Aug. 27, 2012) — Refrigerating coal-plant emissions would reduce levels of dangerous chemicals that pour into the air — including carbon dioxide by more than 90 percent — at a cost of 25 percent efficiency, according to a simple math-driven formula designed by a team of University of Oregon physicists.
The computations for such a system, prepared on an electronic spreadsheet, appeared in Physical Review E, a journal of the American Physical Society.
In a separate, unpublished and preliminary economic analysis, the scientists argue that the “energy penalty” would raise electricity costs by about a quarter but also reap huge societal benefits through subsequent reductions of health-care and climate-change costs associated with burning coal. An energy penalty is the reduction of electricity available for sale to consumers if plants used the same amounts of coal to maintain electrical output while using a cryogenic cleanup.
“The cryogenic treatment of flue gasses from pulverized coal plant is possible, and I think affordable, especially with respect to the total societal costs of burning coal,” said UO physicist Russell J. Donnelly, whose research team was funded by the U.S. Department of Energy for the work detailed in the published journal article.
“In the U.S., we have about 1,400 electric-generating unit powered by coal, operated at about 600 power plants,” Donnelly said. That energy, he added, is sold at about 5.6 cents per kilowatt-hour, according to a 2006 Congressional Budget Office estimate. “The estimated health costs of burning coal in the U.S. are in the range of $150 billion to $380 billion, including 18,000-46,000 premature deaths, 540,000 asthma attacks, 13,000 emergency room visits and two million missed work or school days each year.”
In their separate economic analysis, Donnelly and UO research assistant Robert E. Hershberger, also a co-author on the journal paper, estimate that implementing large-scale cryogenic systems into coal-fired plants would reduce overall costs to society by 38 percent through the sharp reduction of associated health-care and climate-change costs. Not in the equation, Donnelly said, are the front-end health-care costs involved in coal extraction through mining.
The cryogenic concept is not new. Donnelly experimented briefly in the 1960s with a paper mill in Springfield, Ore., to successfully remove odor-causing gasses filling the area around the plant using cryogenics. Subsequently the National Science Foundation funded a major study to capture sulfur dioxide emissions — a contributor to acid rain — from coal burning plants. The grant included a detailed engineering study by the Bechtel Corp. of San Francisco.
The Bechtel study showed that the cryogenic process would work very well, but noted that large quantities of carbon dioxide also would be condensed, a consequence that raised no concerns in 1978. “Today we recognize that carbon dioxide emissions are a leading contributor to climate-warming factors attributed to humans,” Donnelly said.
Out came his previously published work on this concept, followed by a rigorous two-year project to recheck and update his thermodynamic calculations and compose “a spreadsheet-accessible” formula for potential use by industry. His earlier work on the cryogenic treatment of coal-plant emissions and natural gas sources had sparked widespread interest internationally.
While the required cooling machinery would be large — potentially the size of a football stadium — the cost for construction or retrofitting likely would not be dramatically larger than present systems that include scrubbers, which would no longer be necessary, Donnelly said. The new journal article does not address construction costs or the disposal of the captured pollutants, the latter of which would be dependent on engineering and perhaps geological considerations.
According to the Physical Review E paper, carbon dioxide would be captured in its solid phase, then warmed and compressed into a gas that could be moved by pipeline at near ambient temperatures to dedicated storage facilities that could be hundreds of miles away. Other chemicals such as sulfur dioxide, some nitrogen oxides and mercury also would be condensed and safely removed from the exhaust stream of the plants.
Last December the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency issued new mercury and air toxic standards (MATS), calling for the trapping of 41 percent of sulfur dioxide and 90 percent of mercury emissions. A cryogenic system would do better based on the conservatively produced computations by Donnelly’s team — capturing at least 98 percent of sulfur dioxide, virtually 100 percent of mercury and, in addition, 90 percent of carbon dioxide.
“This forward-thinking formula and the preliminary analysis by these researchers offer some exciting possibilities for the electric power industry that could ultimately benefit human health and the environment,” said Kimberly Andrews Espy, UO vice president for research and innovation. “Scientists at the University of Oregon are continuing to develop new ideas and advanced materials to foster a sustainable future for our planet and its people.”
Co-authors with Donnelly and Hershberger on the journal article were: Charles E. Swanson, who earned his doctorate in physics from the UO and served as postdoctoral researcher under Donnelly; John W. Elzey, a former research associate in Donnelly’s Cryogenic Helium Turbulence Lab and now a scientist at GoNano Technologies in Moscow, Idaho; and John Pfotenhauer, who earned his doctorate at the UO and now is in the mechanical engineering department at the University of Wisconsin, Madison.
@ur momisugly tadchem: 10:52Am
“Ad infinitum????
Ad nauseumn.
You won’t just condense the CO2, you’ll also freeze out all the water from the combustion process as well. This will approximately double your refrigeration load, further reducing efficiency. Wet CO2 can’t be pumped through a pipeline, it’ll rust it out.
If all that work can be effected with only a 25% loss in efficiency, why can’t my car get 500 miles per gallon?
….not nearly as much fun as engineers playing at being physicists!! I swear, some of the PEs I work with can’t seem to understand….water flows DOWN!!
BTW, give me all of that CO2 for my algae process. Our research at the UIUC shows we can make biodiesel for about $0.70 per US gallon.
“Last December the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency issued new mercury and air toxic standards (MATS), calling for the trapping of 41 percent of sulfur dioxide and 90 percent of mercury emissions.”
Excuse me. It is the exclusive right of Congress to put our lives, property and liberty at risk with legislation like this.
In a cold climate, one could build a heat exchanger type mechanism that warms surrounding buildings by taking some heat (and some soot, which causes more problems than the CO2) out of the exhaust. Or heat a bunch of greenhouses with CO2-enriched air. We might make that work.
But a 25 decrease in efficiency is a bad idea. If nothing else, the extra coal requires energy spent to mine and transport to the power plant. Add up all the costs, we might actually end up with more CO2 in the air, more wasted coal, and more expensive energy, from this scheme.
It seems that in most green power schemes, the only ones to benefit are the manufacturers of the so-called “green” equipment. We need to be vigilant in separating the few promising ideas from the greenwashing.
“[Donnely and Hershberger] estimate that implementing large-scale cryogenic systems into coal-fired plants would reduce overall costs to society by 38 percent through the sharp reduction of associated health-care and climate-change costs.”
And after that, they will have such great savings, and such great numbers reporting, that they can export the excess power to other countries, mostly in July and August and during the months of November – March!
barryjo says:
August 28, 2012 at 6:19 am
“Electronic spreadsheet”. Is that similar to a computer model?
‘Prof’ Phil Jones, at least, will be impressed by their use of such cutting-edge technology.
CRS, Dr.P.H. says:
I swear, some of the PEs I work with can’t seem to understand….water flows DOWN!!
Except when it doesn’t.
You guys are all just unimaginative complainers. We build vertical pipes and pump the cryo-CO2 into space, outside the atmosphere. And since evaporation is a cooling process, the pipes will act as air conditioning to cure the earth’s fever. Problem(s) solved.
From JJ on August 29, 2012 at 8:33 am:
Yup. Here at the parent’s old house, I take a shower and the toilet bowl level goes higher. Clean the hair and scum off the small drain grate and let a standing inch start draining, the water will burble up into the bowl. I plunge the toilet, and when it lets go and flushes down the “water” surges up a bit into the bathroom sink.
Since this obviously violates the laws of physics, as water must flow down, obviously the house must be haunted. What else could it be?
From a business and economic perspective, taking 25 percent of generation capability off line, with future demand signals all increasing means that you have to replace this 25 percent and going forward, factoring that into every megawatt of increased demand. (Not to mention the difficulty and expense in permitting a coal fired power plant) Someone above, using the precautionary principle as a guide thinks it a good idea to try…..wow. Electricity rates will necessarily sky rocket by at least that 25%. Until you prove something is an issue, this is an incredibly expensive and wasteful thought exercise.
Seriously, how long before we all stop listening to these numpties?
Wouldn’t it be cheaper and societiallylylyly better for these habitually indignant ecotards to just buy some tree saplings and plant them somewhere?
The champions of using carcinogens to capture carbon (dioxide) from exhaust emissions only admit to a 15% increase to the energy bill of the afflicted industrial process, so how do these p.l.on.k.e.r.s expect to attract funding for refrigerating exhaust at a cost of 25%?
I have also thought that we could turn the stacks laterally and use the carbon dioxide and heat to warm giant greenhouses. Just filter the exiting materials from the stack. You could probably grow wonderous amounts of vegetables during winter months. Use the heat and CO2 for good purposes. Filter the emissions from the top of the stack.
Kadaka: Old house plumbing and post-modern climate scientists – same cause.
Ideas like this which are driven by a phantom problem and which would increase the price of electricity considerably are even worse if your country is the only lemming who goes down that road. Boy, am I sure glad I live in Australia…OH WAIT!
“””””…..Neville. says:
August 28, 2012 at 1:55 am
Pielke Jr has a story at his blog that looks at the possibility of recycling co2 into liquid methanol.
This is taking place in Iceland where a joint Iceland USA venture is in progress.
http://rogerpielkejr.blogspot.com.au/2012/08/recycling-carbon-dioxide-in-iceland.html…..”””””
Sounds great to me. I wonder if it is competitive with recycling H2O into methanol.
If we work it right, we could have a closed system containing just water and dry ice, turning them into methanol which we can burn to replenish the H2O and CO2 feedstocks.
“””””…..According to the Physical Review E paper, carbon dioxide would be captured in its solid phase, then warmed and compressed into a gas that could be moved by pipeline at near ambient temperatures to dedicated storage facilities that could be hundreds of miles away……”””””
Now isn’t that just precious; so we mine dry ice by simply shovelling it up off the ground at Vostok Station, in Antarctica, and we ship it in refrigerated cryoships to Australia, where they have plenty of coal; which we can burn to warm up the dry ice to room temperature, so we can then pump it at high pressure, under the ocean to Yucky Mountain Nevada, which I believe is available. Pumping it down into the mountain (they call that ‘fracking’), will bring up enough oil and natural gas to pay for the whole operation.
I just knew that carbon dioxide snow would become a commercial commodity one day.
Good on Ya Oregon; you and old Brownie from Nyew Orleens; would make a great team !
kadaka asked:
Sounds like a blocked vent.
David Larsen said:
I believe they have been doing this in Finland since the ’80s or so. Picture a really long greenhouse with a conveyor belt and hydroponics. Plant seeds at one end, pick vegetables at the other.
george e smith says:
Pielke Jr has a story at his blog that looks at the possibility of recycling co2 into liquid methanol.
It isn’t really recycling. It is a complex method of wasting energy.
Sounds great to me. I wonder if it is competitive with recycling H2O into methanol.
The process referred to uses H20, and copius amounts of energy, along with Co2 to produce methanol.
If we work it right, we could have a closed system containing just water and dry ice, turning them into methanol which we can burn to replenish the H2O and CO2 feedstocks.
Nope. It would need to be an open system, where you pump in more energy than you hope to take out. See Laws of Thermodynamics, #1.
michaeljmcfadden wrote:
> After all, it’s worse than plutonium you realize. Plutonium has a half-life. We can store it up for
> a little while and then it becomes safe and we can let it out. But carbon dioxide will retain its
> deadliness for all of eternity!
>
> SOMETHING MUST BE DONE!
If only there were some way to compress the carbon dioxide and all of those toxic materials into a solid form that could then be buried. Little black lumps of material that could be stored under mountaintops. Drat! Nothing’s coming to mind.