Climate Craziness of the Week – Forbes Steve Zwick loses it

Steve Zwick

Steve Zwick

Wow, it doesn’t get much uglier than this. In my opinion, this is hate speech. Steve Zwick writes in his Forbes column:

We know who the active denialists are – not the people who buy the lies, mind you, but the people who create the lies.  Let’s start keeping track of them now, and when the famines come, let’s make them pay.  Let’s let their houses burn.  Let’s swap their safe land for submerged islands.  Let’s force them to bear the cost of rising food prices.

They broke the climate.  Why should the rest of us have to pay for it?

People who doubt the magnitude of CO2/AGW driven climate change broke the climate?

I suppose then that Mr. Zwick has never driven a car, never taken an airplane trip, never heated or cooled his home, never bought products produced overseas and shipped here, never grilled at a BBQ, or never used electricity to power his computer to write his litany of hate for Forbes. No, he’s apparently not used any CO2 producing modern convenience at all, which is why he bizarrely believes he has some sort of moral high ground.

His hypocrisy is beyond description. His full essay is here.

For those who wish to complain about his hate speech against fellow Americans, see the Forbes Contact page here.

As for his points about the Yale poll trying to make us all fear the weather as some human caused machination of climate, read this.

UPDATE: Warren Meyer offers a thoughtful rebuttal in Forbes here

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Tad

Isn’t he concerned about all the CO2 from those burning houses being released into the air?

Jeff
J Martin

[snip -name calling serves no purpose – Anthony]

I’ll go ahead and delete my own comment before they do! And it was a doozy.

Anthony, do you have the article cached?
REPLY: Yes, here: http://www.webcitation.org/6738oKF2s

Ally E.

How does asking to see the evidence equal “They broke the climate”? Does wanting to see the data cause more CO2?

Interesting that Judith Curry points to the new book the Righteous Mind
http://judithcurry.com/2012/04/19/the-righteous-mind/
Do you ever find yourself reading something by a commentator you disagree with and wanting to punch them in the face? Do you listen to people on the other side of the political debate and find yourself almost hating them?

stpaulchuck

Once again this exposes the warmists as a religion and not a science and engineering issue.
There is still no empirical evidence supporting the warmist nonsense (excepting the bent data, which has been mostly pointed out here and at junkscience.com). So, just like the current US election, the desperate believers are thrashing about getting ever more strident and ever more far from truth. I’m stocking in extra popcorn and adult beverage. When the final meltdown occurs (pardon the pun) it will be a sight to behold.

Essay still in place

Keith Pearson, Formerly bikermailman, Anon No Longer

I don’t want these nutburgers silenced, give ’em a microphone and let people see just who they are, and what they want. Get out of their way and let them prove what (snippety snip) they are.

Anything is possible

Stage 2 : Anger.

Latitude

well someone in his DNA pool broke something….that’s for sure

We know who the active denialists are ……
……… Let’s start keeping track of them now
———————–
that sounds a lot like we know who you are, we know where you live..
a threat or incitement (and very irresponsible) in anyones language..
Ranting rhetoric for him, lets hope the least stable person reading his rubbish, doesn’t take any ‘action’.

johanna

“Let’s let their houses burn”? Is he advocating arson? Or will this be a selective by-product of boilng seas, directed at unbelievers by Gaia?
The man is deranged.

Eve

It looks like the global warming wars are turning into hate crimes. I was on think progress the other day. The warmists are cheering the tornado damage in red states. One Australian said he was happy when there were disasters in areas that did not believe in global warming/climate change. None of this looks good on humanity.

No Name Guy

I feel nothing but pity for poor Zwick. What a sad person he is.

MrX

Like I said before, it’s sad that the alarmists are making everyone not want a warmer climate. The alarmists don’t want it because they think the world will end. And skeptics don’t want it because it shows how foolish the alarmists assertions are. Yet, I want a warmer climate. I think it’s ridiculous that there’s still ice on this planet which wouldn’t take much at all when we consider cosmic scales to have the entire planet frozen over and these guys want it colder? Also, at below 200 ppm, there isn’t enough CO2 to keep plants alive. We’re on the low end of the spectrum. If we take up Steve Zwick on his offer, then mountainous regions are his and coastal lands are ours, right? RIGHT?

He’s making a list, is he checking it twice? he’s gonna find out who’s naughty or nice, the anti-Santa is coming to town,.

Michael Auer

I went to his web page… I think I’m going to be ill!
He left out ‘May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your arm pits’
Truly pathetic and mental.
Regards,
Michael
PS.. Thank you Mr. Watts for all that you do! Speaking of litany of Saints…

cui bono

Two can play at that sick game. But let’s not.

Tilo Reber

“Let’s swap their safe land for submerged islands.”
Hey, Steve, I’m ready to swap my land for some beach front property right now. My house is at 5,000 feet, so if you or your friends have some beach front property that you are worried about loosing to AGW, let me know and we can arrange a trade.

Some are more equal than others

The story still shows, and now it appears Forbes no longer supports free-speech…I’m sure that’ll do their subscription base wonders.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevezwick/2012/04/19/a-tennessee-firemans-solution-to-climate-change/
From the comments:
Bluecloud 7 hours ago
If you look at the typical profile of a denier, you will find most of them are old, white men (just think of the Koch brothers and the rest of the 1%) who won’t be around, and certainly don’t want to be around when the fire catches hold. They are also most likely to have enough money to protect themselves, or their descendents to some extent as well. I suspect that some of them are also psychopaths with no sense of empathy toward others.
As ever, it’s the 99% who will suffer the most severe burns and it is this 99% who need to be persuaded to stop burning fossil fuels as we are all pouring gas on the fire right now. When the spark ignites we can be sure that the deniers will be long gone to their islands and bunkers.
So what can we do? Apart from reducing our individual impacts we can cooperate with those around us to build communities which can become resilient to disasters through things like local farming, local production, education and repair and innovation centers. We need to walk away from the lifestyle that is helping to burn down our houses.
Steve Zwick, Contributor 6 hours ago
That is the ultimate solution, but how do we turn off the torrent of BS these guys are flooding us with?
*************************************************
Wow, “ultimate solution”…you heard it on Forbes first, a magazine that clearly can’t even stand up for free-speech in America.

Siliggy

If there are famines but they turn out to be a result of solar caused global coolling perhaps even accompanied by lack of CO2 what should we do Mr Zwick? The global warming scare would be blamed for the lack of preparation and therefore most of the deaths.
Will not take your advice but curious to know what it would be.

JJ

We know who the active catastrophists are – not the people who buy the lies, mind you, but the people who create the lies. Let’s start keeping track of them now, and when the famines come, let’s make them pay. Let’s subject their 14,000 sq ft houses to civil forfeiture. Let’s swap their private jets and cushy salaries for the tenement and food stamp lifestyle to which they would condemn others. Let’s force them to bear the cost of rising food and energy prices.
They broke the economy to enrich and empower themselves. Why should the rest of us have to pay for it?
That game may be played by more than one …

wikeroy

Maybe Steve Zwick could read this;
http://www.crichton-official.com/essay-stateoffear-whypoliticizedscienceisdangerous.html
and let it sink in…….

David

I laughed at this part of the article:
“they still can’t tell you exactly which specific storms arose from climate change and which would have happened anyway – and they probably never will.”
-snip-
“But they can tell us how many extreme events would happen each year on average without manmade greenhouse gasses, so we can see what percentage of the damage is caused by man and what percentage is caused by nature.”

So, there has to be some kind of algorithm for the second part. But how did they test its accuracy given what’s stated in the first part?

JFB

He is following the Mann-Gleick’s footprint. We know where this will finish… Desperate, without rationals arguments, he want promote a “street fight”. A “crusade” against those that dont agree with him. Is better put fire in the world than concede that the game is over. And he is the looser.

I’d like to say “deal”, and if it turns out that it got rally cold and my house is the only source of warmth and you come knocking on my door, I’ll put one between your eyes.
I’d like to. But I can’t. I can’t because of the way my parents raised me. I can’t because of the way MY church taught me. I could go on with reasons why I can’t, But I won’t.

[snip – taunts serve no purpose – Anthony]

Scarface

“They broke the climate”
A child losing a toy would say that.
He could call Greenpeace to be his big brother: “We know where you live”
Pathetic.
But if this is all he can come up with in the face of all evidence against AGW, it is in fact a good sign. I wonder though, when he would say this in another context, if he wouldn’t get arrested.

P Walker

Unfortunately , this sort of fanaticism is rampant in the AGW collective and elsewhere on the left . Scary . I can’t believe that Forbes would publish this rubbish .

Disko Troop

I am surprised he did not suggest that all his acolytes dress up in brown shirts and go round breaking our windows in the dead of night. Perhaps all dissenters should have a yellow star sewn to their clothes so that we can identify them. Seems reasonable to me.
/sarc.
“Today’s guest post is from Steve Zwick, who edits Ecosystem Marketplace, an online news service that reports on market-based solutions to environmental problems. Based on the premise that the cost of production should include the cost of environmental degradation, EM is published by non-governmental organization Forest Trends and funded by a diverse array of NGOs, governmental agencies, and private companies.” http://www.marcgunther.com/2010/06/21/steve-zwick-paying-for-natures-services/
Forest Trends tracks back to the Jeff skoll foundation which also funded “An Inconvenient Truth”. Jeff Skoll was one of the early starters in E-bay. (http://www.skollfoundation.org/staff/jeff-skoll/)
Looks like we are not the only ones living off someone elses dollar.
(My cheque is late again Exxon..get to it.)

I have to stick up for Forbes a bit here. Forbes asked me to blog on their site a couple of years ago. In that time, they have exercised no editorial control over what I do, and I presume over what Mr. Zwick does. Forbes isn’t endorsing his views in any way, even by allowing them to remain posted. Nor do they, I am pretty sure, moderate comments except maybe for profanity. The author can do that, and if comments are disappearing, blame Zwick, not Forbes. Forbes is just offering the platform, and is obviously seeking writers from all sides of the political spectrum.
I agree with an earlier poster – please,please, let’s not take away these folks’ platform to speak. Every time they say crazy stuff like this hurts their cause. Asking for Forbes to take the column down is only going to help Zwick. Remember you Napoleon – never interrupt and enemy when he is making a mistake.

Clarice

Seems to me Forbes should really be calling the FBI to investigate this psycho before he silences the lambs, he sounds like a serial killer.

Gunga Din

Science fiction is full of stories about a lone hero, or group of heros, detecting some danger and running around trying to convince others to take the proper course of action to prevent the disaster or, at least, try to save people from it. Often they meet with resistance, usually from those who have something to gain from the disaster or what led to the disaster. The heros do not wish evil on the resisters. They try to help them. Often the resisters do wish evil on the heros. So, who fits which role in this SciFi story of Catastrophic Man Made Global Warming … er … Climate Change?

clipe
sophocles

I see Steve Zwick’s potted bio on Forbes says:
===================================================================
I edit Ecosystem Marketplace, an online news service that reports on market-based solutions to environmental problems — a calling I received after a career trading futures, writing about business, and getting entangled in a few local environmental campaigns.
===================================================================
… futures trading is basically a casino. It’s the money sponge which has helped create the modern economic meltdowns and contributed heavily to the high rates of inflation we suffer. His economic knowledge and his scientific knowledge appear to be on a par: very little. His historical knowledge appears to be non-existant. The absence of all three creates severe analytical inability, which explains the latching onto populist plausible but untenable solutions. “Market-based solutions” for environmental problems is a nonsense too—they’re the modern “get rich quick” schemes. Those career choices indicate a good nose for “following the money” but a total inability to analyse the causes and ramifications of the problems and the supposed solutions.
The Medieval Warming produced crop surpluses which financed the building of cathedrals across Europe and paid for the Crusades. When the surplus disappeared, the Crusaders had to return home and the cathedrals took another few hundred years to complete. Other earlier warmings (eg: the Roman Warming) had similar easy times. Otherwise the Roman Empire would not have been able to expand as it did.
Plants, animals and people flourish when it’s warm. Cold is the enemy. Both warmings ended in cold times and significant economic and population contractions. The coolings brought significant storms, droughts and through these large crop failures. Anyone familiar with the history of the Little Ice Age will know of the crop failures, ergotism and witch hunts—all of which are prominent in the historical record. Let’s just hope the present solar minimum doesn’t bite our agriculture too hard.
But then, we all know that. Zwick et al obviously don’t. I’ve got the ideal job for Mr. Zwick: mounting a serious search for the Sun’s remote control … but he’ll have to organise a market-based solution to fund the search.

P Walker

Some are more equal than others @ 2:37 pm
Please read all of the comments . Bluecloud and Zwick have created their own echo chamber – most of the others are very negative .

Steve P

Eve says:
April 19, 2012 at 2:27 pm
“… None of this looks good on humanity.”
No, and let’s not forget what went on during the Little Ice Age, when certain humans were blamed for the advancing glaciers, and for the devastating (hail) storms that wiped out crops.
Witch hunts.
Human beings caused the bad weather by consorting with the devil, it was believed. Indeed, after prompting, many warlocks and witches confessed to this and all manner of demonic deeds, before being burned at the stake. If McKay is to be believed, in Europe, thousands upon thousands were put to the torch during this particular period of human madness. According to Wikipedia, the last report from Greenland, before the colony went silent, told of a witch being burned at the stake there.
~
In May 2011, I drove into the aftermath of a hail storm in E. Colorado that was piled up to several inches, and recently, an area near Austin got several feet of the icy balls. It’s not hard to imagine what these kinds of storms could do to crops.

I used to have a signature I used on one of the forums I frequented. It read:
“Global warming the next inquisition.”
I might have to go back to using it if this pattern of behavior keeps up, because this sort of speech is gateway to open persecution of people they disagree with.
So much for freedom of speech, presumption of innocence and a half dozen foundation concepts in our form of government.
Before you can persecute a group, you first have to marginalize and demonize them. Once that sort of marginalization and demonization becomes acceptable behavior the door is open for active discrimination and persecution.
Have any of these wacko’s read any history? Don’t the see that they are following a long established pattern that if allowed to run to its logical conclusion leads down a path toward the destruction of freedom of expression of everyone.
The scary scenario is that they have read history and know exactly what they are doing.
The benign scenario is that they are just self righteous idiots.
Just another example of how defective their education and moral code is. They are totalitarians at heart and cannot conceive of the possibility that they might be wrong about anything. Therefore all problems are the fault of someone else.
Larry

john

Yale poll? We know what Yale is up to…
http://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/hey-angus-hey-shell-company
See Bayroot.

juanslayton

I do not take his premise as being typical of the good people of Tennessee. Of some of their politicians maybe, but we all have to suffer these types. Even a few of them are having second thoughts:
http://www.firehouse.com/news/10702774/tenn-firefighters-could-be-liable-for-pay-for-spray?utm_source=related_content_box&utm_medium=related_content&utm_campaign=10472820
Some of the comments by real firefighters are worth reading….

wwschmidt

looking at the big picture, there’s one clear lesson that can be seen in this:
We’re winning, and the other side knows it. That’s why they’re getting desperate and shrill; they’ve lost on the science, they’ve lost the public’s attention, and they don’t know what to do except to stomp their widdo foots and promise to hold their breath til they turn blue.
But this is also why this fight is no longer scientific – that battle is over. The only real battle left is political, as they attempt to use political power to achieve what they couldn’t get the public to buy, and we must be vigilant and focused on defeating those efforts.

Lark

Fahrenheit 451 + No Pressure = Steve Zwick.
He has a model – dialectical materialism? – that says we’re all going to Hell if we don’t give his church – Marxism with a Green rind – all our property. But we don’t want to, so therefore it’s our fault we’re all going to hell, so therefore his church should take all our property as punishment.
Aren’t greedy millenarian religious fundamentalists just ever so nice?

pat

Sourcewatch: Steve Zwick
He considers himself more of a conduit than an expert, but is capable of speaking on: derivatives, sustainable development, and environmental finance. The latter includes payments for ecosystem services, payments for watershed services, wetland mitigation banking, water footprinting, biodiversity banking, and REDD.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Steve_Zwick
Zwick is vicious, cos derivatives are at stake. at least the Markit guy knows “carbon credits” are not a “real commodity”:
2009: Ecosystemmarketplace: Steve Zwick: Markit: Gathering – and Mining – the Data for Tomorrow’s Ecosystem Marketplace
Markit: The New Gorilla of Environmental FinanceBacked by a consortium of investment banks, Markit has spent most of the last decade culling prices and other carefully-selected details from complex transactions on the books of secretive trading houses and then identifying the sweet spots where knowledgeable buyers and sellers overlap…
Zwick: Are you limiting this to carbon, or will you be moving into other ecosystem markets?
Niall Cameron, Markit’s Executive Vice President of Commodities, Indices, Equities and Risk Management,: Our registries side will be capturing credits from all kinds of projects, including wetland mitigation banking…
Obviously, carbon is the main market at the moment and will continue to be for a while, but going forward you can see many, many different types of environmental products being listed. That is when price is going to get very interesting, because there’s going to be a lack of knowledge about where some of these things should trade.
Zwick: Which market do you see taking off first after carbon?
Niall Cameron: We are interested in how the water market develops. Unlike carbon credits, water is a real commodity, and possibly the most important one in the world…
http://www.ecosystemmarketplace.com/pages/dynamic/article.page.php?page_id=7133&section=home

Jurgen

If it is like he says and “we” skeptics do have the power to influence the climate, well, there is no real problem, is there? When “the team” will go after us for revenge, all we have to do is cause a little ice age to cool them down. Piece of cake.

If you want to have some fun, I encourage you to read this very short Wikipedia article on “the Summer of the Shark.” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summer_of_the_Shark I am pretty sure you will recognize some parallels to current discussion of severe weather and the recent Yale study. I discuss the Summer of the Shark in my Forbes column response to Zwick linked above.

Jimbo

Whenever you look closely at people like Steve Zwick you tend to find:
“Do as I say, don’t do as I do.”

Okay… Steve Zwick, lets give him the benefit of doubt, he’s probably a very honest and a very nice person, a caring man who has the best intentions for everyone around him.
Sometimes he likes to play.