Britain pulls the plug on solar subsidies

From the GWPF

Global Warming Policy Foundation

Image via Wikipedia

 At Last: Britain Pulls Plug On Green Energy Boondoggle

The Government Giveth and the Government Taketh Away –-Famous green proverb

Ministers have been accused of destroying 25,000 jobs and “bankrupting a whole industry”, after the Government unveiled plans to slash subsidies for green energy. Hundreds of solar companies are likely to go bust by Christmas after the Department for Energy and Climate Change confirmed it is looking to halve subsidies for new panels. –Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 1 November 2011

The row over solar subsidies is the latest manifestation of a long and fierce battle within the government between Chris Huhne’s  DECC and George Osborne’s Treasury over the role of green growth in the UK’s economic recovery, made especially pointed by soaring home energy bills. “We may be out of touch with the solar lobby, but we are not out of touch with energy bills,” Barker told parliament on Monday. –Damian Carrington, The Guardian, 31 October 2011

At a time when household savers are struggling to get a 0.5 per cent return on an instant access saving account, some of these renewable energy subsidies – paid in the form of generous payments for the electricity produced, so called feed-in tariffs (FITs) – are guaranteeing annual returns of 10 per cent. It’s one of the biggest wealth transfers – from millions of ordinary hard-working tax payers to a few hundred of the hugely wealthy – in British history. It’s staggeringly unfair and, in the growing opinion of many, totally pointless. –Benny Peiser, Daily Mail, 9 June 2011

The right hon. Lady says that we are out of touch. We may be out of touch with the solar lobby, but we are not out of touch with energy bill payers. She says that they are groaning under a £175 increase, but she wants to put that up. If we did not act now, consumers would face massive increases in energy bills. –-Gregory Barker, Minister of State, Department of Energy and Climate Change, House of Commons, 31 October 2011

Silicon Valley’s green geek scenario, which we can date at around 2005-2009 is now gurgling down the WC pan of history. Its elitist and totally unreal notions of extreme high priced electric cars for Nice People Saving the Planet, and designer Low Energy homes for the same Nice People, and nobody else, has gone down the tube. –Andrew McKillop, The Global Warming Policy Foundation, 31 October 2011

Beacon Power Corp filed for bankruptcy on Sunday, just a year after the energy storage company received a $43 million loan guarantee from a controversial Department of Energy program. The bankruptcy comes about two months after Solyndra — a solar panel maker with a $535 million loan guarantee — also filed for Chapter 11, creating a political embarrassment for the administration of President Barack Obama, which has championed the loans as a way to create “green energy” jobs. –Reuters, 31 October 2011

Here’s the kicker: Market-driven energy choices are cutting more tons of CO2 in the U.S. than have been cut by wind and solar—even with their billions of dollars in subsidies. Natural gas-fired electricity generation has grown from 15.8 percent of America’s power generation in 2000 to 24.1 percent in the most recent 12-month tally from the Energy Information Administration. That 8.3 percent increase is enough to cut 120 million metric tons of CO2 per year compared to coal. Over the same span, wind- and solar-generated power grew to 2.75 percent of total power generation. That would cut CO2 by 108 million metric tons per year compared to coal power. So over the past decade, hugely subsidized wind and solar have done less to cut CO2 emissions than market-driven natural gas production. –-David Kreutzer, The Foundry, 25 October 2011

In Britain, once in the vanguard of action on climate change, the government is scaling back its green energy investment… Nobody expects a UN climate deal in Durban this year — nor next year, nor the year after. But meanwhile the coal keeps burning. Global production is set to rise by 35 percent in the coming decade, according to industry analysts. The cheapest, most abundant and dirtiest of all the fossil fuels is extending its grip on the world’s energy supply system. And nowhere more so than just up the coast from Durban. –Fred Pearce, The Guardian, 31 October 2011

We have to put shale in the context of other energy sources in order to convey a comparative analysis of the environmental impact. People forget the environmental costs of coal mining or oil exploration; nuclear also has its own risks. Natural gas is a form of energy that falls into the low risk category. Can the green lobby win the shale debate over environmental objections? I don’t think it can. Ten or 20 years ago it could have won when governments were willing to burn billions, but the economic climate has changed, we’re facing the biggest crisis in decades. No government in the world would give up this opportunity, not even the British government, which is very green indeed. –Benny Peiser, Natural Gas Europe, 25 October 2011

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theduke

Good one, Anthony. Anyone who says AGW proponents are not on the run isn’t paying attention.

vboring

This is being blown way out of proportion by everyone involved.
Solar panel prices have fallen significantly since the subsidies were created, therefore the size of the subsidy should decrease.
The size of the subsidy should have been tied to some price metric so that it would automatically decrease as the technology became more competitive.
The same QQing happened in Colorado recently when Xcel decided to reduce solar subsidies.

SandyInDerby

For Android phone users in the UK get the GridCarbon app, and see just how little wind and sun contribute.
The sooner all FITs are removed completely the better.

Curiousgeorge

Reality sucks, don’t it. The Euro economy is collapsing, with Greece, Italy, and others leading the charge, and the Greenies want to accelerate the process.

George Lawson

If it wasn’t for the coalition I’m sure Mr Cameron would of got rid of the stupid Mr Huhn a long time ago. Mr. Cameron should bite the bullet and get rid of him now. An action which could lead to an immediate saving of £billions of wasted expenditure.

Mark M

Down in LA, they have had to increase the FIT to get folks to buy solar panels as noted below. It’s very hard to get a payback with any alternative energy self generation option when it only costs $.07 kwh (winter rates) for power…………….. hence to meet the state mandated goals of %RE they-LADWP- needed to up the incentives………….. How cost effective is this FIT approach to reducing CO2……………….. say vs providing incentives to obtain a more fuel efficient mode of transportation……….
https://www.piersystem.com/go/doc/1475/1153343/LADWP-to-Relaunch-Solar-Incentive-Program-with-Revised-Incentive-Levels-and-Streamlined-Customer-Service
“As we re-launch the Solar Incentive Program in September, it is extremely important that we leverage the incentives to achieve the most solar power and encourage as much customer participation as possible. We also want to grow solar at a steady and sustainable pace while being prudent about the cost to all customers who pay for this program through their rates,” said LADWP General Manager Ronald O. Nichols.
Mr. Nichols has also asked staff to investigate more options for making solar affordable to low income customers. “We need to do more to make solar accessible to customers of all income levels. In the next few months we will come back with more leasing options and other proposals for lower income households,” he said.
Under SB 1, the state’s “Million Solar Roofs” legislation established a goal of 280 megawatts and mandated that LADWP spend $313 million through the end of 2016 for solar photovoltaic incentives. “We are committed to spending the full $313 million for customer incentives and achieving as much solar as possible with that level of funding,” Mr. Nichols said.
“One of the biggest dilemmas we have faced in this program is setting the incentive level to make the program more attractive to customers since our power rates were, and continue to be, much lower than those of the state’s other major utilities,” notes Aram Benyamin, Senior Assistant General Manager – Power. The paradox is that offering higher incentive levels made less money available for more customers to install solar systems…….
“Under the guidelines approved Tuesday, the incentive levels were revised to be consistent with the California Solar Initiative, which is better aligned with existing solar markets and achieves a reasonable payback period for customers. LADWP will continue to offer the option of assigning the “REC” (Renewable Energy Credit) to LADWP and receiving an additional $0.40 per watt—which makes the incentive significantly higher than the state minimum.”

AnonyMoose

If an industry will be wiped out by removal of government funds, then it was a government program and not an industry.

Shevva

The Orwell meters ain’t lookin to good either.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/11/01/smart_meter_debate/

43 million, 535 million … Iraq: 3.4 trillion and we just hand it over to Iran

Huhne is a luxury that Britain can not afford,
The Government and the BBC keep banging on aboutt how green technology will create jobs for Britain and that Britain is also world the leader in renewable offshore energy.
So why in this “How to build a windfarm” production by the BBC are the Windmills made in Sweden and their erection offshore done by the Dutch? It seems to me the only British input is to pay the bills.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14412189

Solar panels need a connection to “ground” 🙂

Bruce Cobb

“Ministers have been accused of destroying 25,000 jobs and “bankrupting a whole industry”, after the Government unveiled plans to slash subsidies for green energy.”
If jobs are the only metric, not what is actually being produced and the benefit to society, then I’d suggest they immediately get to work producing an “industry” whose sole purpose is the digging of holes, and filling them in.

Mike

Is it just me, or does it seem strange that push for solar panels seems to come from the side that says its not the sun but rather that magic trace gas – seaoh2

And not before time. Fuel Poverty in the UK will be a real killer this winter. Visit http://www.fuelpovertymap.org.uk and get involved.

Robert L

I looked at this last year with a friend, we figured that we could get pretty close to a 20% Government guaranteed ROI for doing solar, which is frankly ridiculous for a subsidy scheme. You didn’t even need to hook up to the grid – just run it all into a pool heater or something.
We also figured out that the subsidy on micro hydroelectricity meant that we could install a small hydro plant and use a natural gas engine to pump the water back up to the top of the hill to go through the hydro generator again and again, thereby making an absolute killing even if you had no running water. Same thing could be done on a wind turbine using a natural gas engine driven fan (though energy coupling is worse).

Unfortunately that won’t happen with our government in Ontario. It’s full solar ahead for them, and the huge costs to us. Worse is these solar panels don’t really do anything. Example, two pillars of 235 panels over the course of the year will not provide enough power to run the home it is installed on. The the NET production of the panels, minus what the home owner consumes, is negative. Yet we pay that person $20,000 a year for the power, while they consume $1500 of power. Thus the rate payers of Ontario are paying these solar ownes $18,500 a year to be off the grid. It’s a recipe for collapse.

Mike

speaking of solar panels, I have yet to see any interest by the sticky fingers of this country to steal any of the governments casually unguarded solar arrays littering the landscape. Until that starts happening, I give this technology low marks as just some yuppie extravagance sorta like a Prius.

hell_is_like_newark

Please let NJ be next to kill subsidies (even though it would hurt my employer). Cost of electricity went from $0.12 per kW to $0.18 per kWh in order to subsidies solar and other green insanity.
My tenants are getting their power shut off at times because they ran the A/C and found out they couldn’t pay the outrageous electric bills. I upgraded the insulation in every single building… I can’t reduce the heating / cooling loads anymore than they already are.

G. Karst

Curiousgeorge says:
November 1, 2011 at 7:54 am
Reality sucks, don’t it. The Euro economy is collapsing, with Greece, Italy, and others leading the charge, and the Greenies want to accelerate the process.

Check your history. Collapsing economies is the fertile soil, from which socialism, communism and fascism springs. These people are doing everything possible to initiate and accelerate such processes. It matters not, who suffers, as we will all reap the benefits of a brave new world. Well, the elite will anyway. Life as a troglodyte will not be too bad… Will it?? GK

Gail Combs

Mark M says:
November 1, 2011 at 8:00 am
Down in LA, they have had to increase the FIT to get folks to buy solar panels as noted below. ….
https://www.piersystem.com/go/doc/1475/1153343/LADWP-to-Relaunch-Solar-Incentive-Program-with-Revised-Incentive-Levels-and-Streamlined-Customer-Service
“As we re-launch the Solar Incentive Program in September, it is extremely important that we leverage the incentives to achieve the most solar power and encourage as much customer participation as possible. We also want to grow solar at a steady and sustainable pace while being prudent about the cost to all customers who pay for this program through their rates,” said LADWP General Manager Ronald O. Nichols…..”
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Well “Growing Solar” explains it. No doubt Al Gore or one of his buddies wants to set up a solar panel farm and does not want to bother to pay full price for the land o rentice people to sell it….
Battle for the California Desert: Driving Folks off Their Land

The Antelope Valley is a vast patch of desert on the outskirts of Los Angeles County, and a segment of the few rugged individualists who live out there increasingly are finding themselves the targets of armed raids from local code enforcement agents, who’ve assembled into task forces called Nuisance Abatement Teams

Ain’t dirty politics great? And it is all done in the name of “saving the environment” of “saving the children” or “saving the poor”….
The sage of Baltimore, H.L. Mencken, had it right, “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it.” He forgot to add and rip them off while at it.

imoira

“The most massive energy programme ever proposed anywhere in the world outside wartime conditions.” That’s how energy analyst Andrew McKillop, the author of today’s new publication on European Energy Review, describes current EU energy and climate policy:
http://www.europeanenergyreview.eu/site/pagina.php?id=3318

About time too. But this feed-in tariff, which is being paid for by higher energy bills (disproportionately affecting the poor), needs to be scrapped altogether. Not only do the poor not have the capital to invest in solar power but they often live in rented accommodation, where the landlord would not permit such an installation, or they live in tower blocks which have nowhere to site solar panels. They have no opportunity to get the subsidies, but they have no choice but to pay through the nose for ever more inefficient production because of government coercion.
It is economic madness and immoral to be paying the wealthy householders and landowners subsidies to make a killing at the expense of the poor, all for producing electricity (a basic commodity) at a cost of between 20 and 40 times the cost of production from traditional means.
It’s just like saying that, when there is no shortage of water, the government will slap a levy on consumer water bills to pay wealthy landowners 40 times the market price of water for collecting in their own back yards, and guaranteeing to purchase all rainwater collected from domestic back yards, but not allowing water companies to get in on the subsidy. Guess who will get rich (those with very large roofs and large back yards), and guess who will get poorer (those without roofs or back yards). It’s a manipulation of the market that re-distributes wealth in a coercive and immoral way.

DocMartyn

Do not forget the opposition to ‘fracking’ which would make the UK independent of imported natural gas for at least a 100 years.
Cuadrilla announced this week that its tests showed there could be as much as 5.6 trillion cubic metres (200tn cubic ft) of gas in the Bowland shale under Lancashire; 60 years supply. This is just one of the shale gas deposits.
UK gas consumption is 95 billion cubic metres a year.

Stephen Richards

vboring says:
November 1, 2011 at 7:48 am
I don’t know where you are buying your solar panels but in europe the price remains the same as a recent quote I received demonstrated. ~ 3500€ / Kwh of PV.

Jon

This is the best news I’ve heard all year. That a government somewhere is willing to cut some expenditure give me hope that cutting government spending can actually happen, making jobs available again to those who are suffering.

More Soylent Green!

These green power subsidizes are corporate welfare and a transfer of wealth to the well-off. The better they are ended, the better for all.
In the USA, we need to move forward with ending our disastrous policies for ethanol. Phase out the mandates, the subsidies and the tariffs on imported ethanol. Let farmers focus on growing food, not fuel.

Curiousgeorge

G. Karst says:
November 1, 2011 at 8:47 am
Curiousgeorge says:
November 1, 2011 at 7:54 am
Reality sucks, don’t it. The Euro economy is collapsing, with Greece, Italy, and others leading the charge, and the Greenies want to accelerate the process.
Check your history. Collapsing economies is the fertile soil, from which socialism, communism and fascism springs. These people are doing everything possible to initiate and accelerate such processes. It matters not, who suffers, as we will all reap the benefits of a brave new world. Well, the elite will anyway. Life as a troglodyte will not be too bad… Will it?? GK
==================================================================
True. I recall somebody saying recently that one should never let a good crises go to waste. Even better is to invent one that you have planned for.
The ‘savior’ is right thru that curtain folks: Step right up.

Mydogsgotnonose

The UK government is, at last, withdrawing the privileges the Midlands’ Mafia which paid for Brown, later Balls to get to power.

Steeptown

Although the UK Gov’t is halving the subsidies for solar, there will still remain huge subsidies. And there are still huge subsidies for onshore and offshore wind.

Nuclear is safer than any other energy production. Coal, wind, and gas are all more dangerous. Why? Nuclear is well managed. Our new generation of plants are vastly improved. Pebble bed technology can reuse all already spent fuel and get as much energy again as was produced the first time through. And the truly spent fuel will then be good for other purposes. And then there’s liquid thorium reactors which do not pander to nuclear proliferation and being already liquid cannot melt down. The fuel requires little processing before use and we have loads of it.
Nuclear power can meet all of our electricity needs and has the smallest footprint and is the least environmentally intrusive of all.

Brian Johnson uk

The subsidies for wind will not drop as the Prime Minister’s Father-in-Law has invested heavily in wind power and the Queen gets massive amounts from ‘owning’ the UK seabed out to 12 miles.
“They will net up to £37.5 million extra income every year from the drive for green energy because the seabed within Britain’s ter­ritorial waters is owned by the Crown Estate.”
As for solar power, why on earth subsidise a system that relies on the sun when we see so little of that year on year!

DCC

vboring said: “This is being blown way out of proportion by everyone involved. Solar panel prices have fallen significantly since the subsidies were created, therefore the size of the subsidy should decrease.”
Whoa, take off your blinders. Subsidized panel manufacture still is not competitive with imported panels and subsidized electricity generators using the imported panels aren’t competitive with gas or coal. That means that all the subsidies accomplished nothing beyond wasting money. The entire mess should be canceled immediately and an invoice rendered for repayment.

AndrewR

I live in the north of england, Heres a little snippet from our local newspaper,
Quote “A PLAN to slash subsidies for household solar power has been slammed as “nonsensical” by a Kirklees councillor./unquote
Clr Andrew Cooper, who leads the four-strong Green group on Kirklees Council, said a Government plan to reduce subsidies for household solar electricity could threaten up to 25,000 jobs.”
Well you have to ask yourself Mr councilor, “is it ok to subsidise green energy when 2700 people in the UK die of Fuel poverty ?”.

Fred from Canuckistan

The government that bankrolls can also, it seems, bankrupt.

Olen

Under the circumstances why is there a fierce battle within the government? The headline could be politicians attempt to force the use of new energy failed.
What caused the change, the prospect of their fellow citizens dying from heat or cold stress in their homes while their country is in financial free fall supporting green energy or was it the image of pitchforks and torches reminiscent of a Frankenstein movie? Frankenstein used natural energy in lightening and look how that turned out. The whole town was mad at him. OK Frankenstein was fiction but so is green energy.

DesertYote

And who buys all those solar panels? Large corporations getting tax breaks. They do it to increase there green cred. One company in Oregon put in panelss ate one facility with the classic solar panel tilt, but facing East. AT one of their other facilities, just down the street, the panels are tilted towards the West!!! Not only did they get it wrong, but they got it wrong in two different ways.

“Market-driven energy choices are cutting more tons of CO2 in the U.S. than have been cut by wind and solar—even with their billions of dollars in subsidies. Natural gas-fired electricity generation has grown from 15.8 percent of America’s power generation in 2000 to 24.1 percent in the most recent 12-month tally from the Energy Information Administration.”
Won’t the percentage of gas generation very quickly increase mostly due to the EPA regulations that will shutdown coal powered plants (with a net lose of production for consumers)???

Widget

You don’t need an Android app to check on the miserable contribution that the windmills make. It’s all here for the UK: http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
As of now, wind is generating a mere 0.723gw against a Grid demand of 49gw (1.48%)
All that effort & despoilation of the environment for so little return. (Unless you’re a landowner or windfarm developer!)

Gail Combs

Curiousgeorge says:
November 1, 2011 at 7:54 am
Reality sucks, don’t it. The Euro economy is collapsing, with Greece, Italy, and others leading the charge, and the Greenies want to accelerate the process.
——————————————————————————
G. Karst says:
November 1, 2011 at 8:47 am
Check your history. Collapsing economies is the fertile soil, from which socialism, communism and fascism springs. These people are doing everything possible to initiate and accelerate such processes. It matters not, who suffers, as we will all reap the benefits of a brave new world. Well, the elite will anyway. Life as a troglodyte will not be too bad… Will it?? GK
——————————————————————————-
EXACTLY! That is what all this collapsing world economy has been about along with the spiking cost of food, the loss of third world farmers, the land grab by the wealthy and the riots.
I do not think it was a coincidence that a FABIAN SOCIETY PHAMPHLET: “From Dictator to Democracy” was spotted several times in Egypt.:

As journalists have sought to untangle the disparate threads that unite these uprisings, one of the most interesting revelations has been a common reference to a dusty — but still relevant — book, “From Dictatorship to Democracy.”
Earlier this month, the New York Times proclaimed its author, Gene Sharp, a “shy intellectual” who had created “the playbook for revolution” — noting that his work was posted on the Muslim Brotherhood website during the Egyptian uprising, and was cited equally among Tunisians, Bosnians and Estonians in their quest for freedom. So far, it has been translated into 41 languages….

http://www.politicsdaily.com/2011/02/25/after-egypt-and-libya-whats-next-for-those-still-under-dictato/
Who has free e-books including Gene Sharp’s “From Dictatorship to Democracy?”
Fabian Essays In Socialism: http://www.bestebooksworld.com/ebook/16953/
Former UK PM, Tony Blair a UK Fabian Society leader is appointed Middle East envoy working on behalf of the US, Russia, the UN and the EU…. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6244358.stm
Blair is also in the pay of the bankers:
“Jan 28, 2008 … Tony Blair will be paid £2.5m a year for his post at US investment bank JP Morgan, it was revealed today.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-508157/Tony-Blairs-time-bank-job-make-times-expected.html
The Fabien Society article New World Encyclopedia – Organizing knowledge for happiness, prosperity and world peace.
Alternate view from Fabian Socialist George Bernard Shaw: http://www.sovereignindependent.com/?p=7948
had the industrial revolution and the rise of the middle class now we have a drive right back into Neo-fuedalism hiding under the name of “Socialism” All you have to do is look at the determined drive to kill off the middle class.
QUOTES from United Nations Leader and World Bank Senior Advisor Maurice Strong:

“Isn’t the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn’t it our responsibility to bring about?”
“It is clear that current lifestyles and consumption pattern of the affluent middle class – involving high meat intake, consumption of large amounts of frozen and convenience foods, use of fossil fuels, appliances, home and work-place air-conditioning and suburban housing – are not sustainable. A shift is necessary toward lifestyles less geared to environmentally damaging consumption patterns.”

The current economic collapse was not by chance it was an orchestrated move.
Look at just one US President , Bill Clinton. In the USA there is the North American Free Trade Agreement and the World Trade Organization Treaties and then getting the China admitted to the WTO all done under Clinton. These moves were key to the exporting of US industry and jobs.
Clinton also signed into law many of the “new improved” Banking Laws that lead to the Economic meltdown. SEE Quick list of Banking laws
After the Great Depression, several laws were put in place to prevent another depression. The 1933 and 1934
Security and Exchange laws, The McFadden Act of 1927, The Glass-Steagall Act or Banking Act of 1933. Also the Bank Holding Company Act of 1956.
Clinton signed into laws bills negating the above. They are the Riegle-Neal Interstate Banking and Branching Efficiency Act of 1994 and the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act of 1999
Also:
Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation Improvement Act of 1991: Allowed big banks to gobble up smaller banks more easily.
Housing and Community Development Act of 1992 and RTC Completion Act – Housing and business loans to minorities. (Unqualified buyers)
Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000 – left CDSs unregulated and set up AIG bailout and Foreclosuregate. CDSs are “insurance” betting that the mortgage will be foreclosed.
Any number of CDSs can be bought for one mortgage so not only is the land confiscated but there is a big cash pay-off, in some cases several times the amount of the mortgage. This was a big incentive for banks to trick homeowners into a foreclosure situation. The “Obama Loan Modification Program” was tailor made to give marginal loans a big push into the foreclosure bucket. No wonder the program was a major failure!
The big cash pay-offs to the banks of course were footed by American tax payers thanks to the AIG bailouts, while individual homeowners lost their homes. Big win for the banks Big lose for the middle class.
And do not forget all this money except for 3% was created out of nothing by the banks but it was paid back with the labor of the tax payer.
A PRIMER ON MONEY: by US House Committee on Banking and Currency: http://www.famguardian.org/Subjects/MoneyBanking/Money/patman-primer-on-money.pdf
US Banks Operating Without Reserve Requirements: http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/03/us-banks-operate-without-reserve.html

Richard111
More Soylent Green!

Matthew W says:
November 1, 2011 at 10:14 am
“Market-driven energy choices are cutting more tons of CO2 in the U.S. than have been cut by wind and solar—even with their billions of dollars in subsidies. Natural gas-fired electricity generation has grown from 15.8 percent of America’s power generation in 2000 to 24.1 percent in the most recent 12-month tally from the Energy Information Administration.”
Won’t the percentage of gas generation very quickly increase mostly due to the EPA regulations that will shutdown coal powered plants (with a net lose of production for consumers)???

The regulators and would-be regulators have a meme that environmental regulations, a carbon tax or cap-and-trade are all market forces, an idea that doesn’t even rise to the level of specious.
As for whether gas plants can replace coal plants, that depends upon multiple federal, state and local regulatory agencies. It’s doubtful new plants can be brought online quickly enough to replace those which would be taken offline. So where’s the power for our iPods, smart phones, notebooks, BD players, LCD TVs and electric cars going to come from?

More Soylent Green!

@Gail Combs says:
November 1, 2011 at 10:18 am
Gail, I recognized the Fabian Society as a British Fascist (or Fascist-sympathetic) group from the 1930’s. I had no idea it existed still existed. Wow!
It still appears to be a(n ecomomic) Fascist group.

timg56

I clicked on the Fred Pearce / Guardian link. Read most of the original article (until even my stomach couldn’t take it any longer). Loved the irony of him talking about the Germans shutting down their nuke plants. And of course the continued use of coal is completely the result of the coal and energy companies brainwashing the masses through better PR.
What is interesting is to read some of the comments. Didn’t take long for the “over population” argument to come out. 7 billion people are simply too much and many of them have to go. Of course the devil is in the details. Just who among the 7 billion goes and who stays? I’m pretty sure those calling for a reduction in population expect to be among those still around after it is accomplished.
I prefer to look at the positive side. Whenever I start worrying if I am failing to live in accordance to God’s plan for me, I can at least console myself with the probability that he’s going to busy with all the twits who think government controlled population control is not morally bankrupt. I might look ok by comparison.

Gail Combs

Richard111 says:
November 1, 2011 at 10:18 am
I am surprised this report has not had a mention yet.
http://www.suite101.com/news/new-satellite-data-contradicts-carbon-dioxide-climate-theory-a394975
__________________________________
Great!
I want Climate Justice!
The The Maldives OWE the USA and EU Climate Reparation.

RS

I am uncomfortable linking Beacon with Solyndra.
Phase control of the grid by instantly accessible power and load is a very useful technology with real value. It’s not a green creation out of whole cloth.
Beacon had business problems of too much leverage and too late cash flow, not a fundamentally useless product.

SandyInDerby

Widget says:
November 1, 2011 at 10:17 am
True you can always go to neta as well
http://www.bmreports.com/bsp/bsp_home.htm
But the android app can’t be trumped in a dicussion down the pub or the works canteen. Very good for winning a bet (wind contribution never gets close to 10%).

Ralph

There were never any Green jobs in this make-work project. The panels are made in the Far East and China, so the only Green jobs made in the UK will be for a few Polish builders fixing them onto roofs.
The Green jobs are a complete illusion. Britian has no industry that can profit from such lavish spending.
.

Ralph

>>George Lawson says: November 1, 2011 at 7:58 am
>>If it wasn’t for the coalition I’m sure Mr Cameron would of got rid of the
>>stupid Mr Huhn a long time ago.
Are you sure about that?
Remember that Ca-moron’s first actions as prime minister were to stick a windelec on the roof of his house, and then jet off to thebArctic to pat a few huskys and say he would lead the world’s Greenest government.
Ca-moron is up to his neck in this Green nonsense, and cannot see the struggles of ordinary people – let alone the many ghettos that have been established in the UK.
.

Widget

Cameron’s forte is PR — he’ll jump on any bandwagon that makes the ‘right’ impression.
Green’s on the slide a bit now, so he’s on a different tack.

Spector

On a related issue, here is a video of a House of Lords session where, in response to a question presented by Baroness Angela Smith of Basildon, the Government explains why they must put the development of Thorium Nuclear Energy in the background as they restart their Nuclear Energy program after a 25-year pause.
“Thorium Discussion in the House of Lords”
5 likes, 0 dislikes; 252 views; 7:37 min
Uploaded by hallezb on Jul 8, 2011