Even the very liberal UK Guardian picked up on this. What next Jim, the Constitution? NASA, please fire this man. (h/t to Barbara)
Photograph: Gareth Fuller/PA
From the UK Guardian:
Protest and direct action could be the only way to tackle soaring carbon emissions, a leading climate scientist has said.
James Hansen, a climate modeller with Nasa, told the Guardian today that corporate lobbying has undermined democratic attempts to curb carbon pollution. “The democratic process doesn’t quite seem to be working,” he said.
Speaking on the eve of joining a protest against the headquarters of power firm E.ON in Coventry, Hansen said: “The first action that people should take is to use the democratic process. What is frustrating people, me included, is that democratic action affects elections but what we get then from political leaders is greenwash.
“The democratic process is supposed to be one person one vote, but it turns out that money is talking louder than the votes. So, I’m not surprised that people are getting frustrated. I think that peaceful demonstration is not out of order, because we’re running out of time.”
Hansen said he was taking part in the Coventry demonstration tomorrow because he wants a worldwide moratorium on new coal power stations. E.ON wants to build such a station at Kingsnorth in Kent, an application that energy and the climate change minister Ed Miliband recently delayed. “I think that peaceful actions that attempt to draw society’s attention to the issue are not inappropriate,” Hansen said.
He added that a scientific meeting in Copenhagen last week had made clear the “urgency of the science and the inaction taken by governments”.
Read the entire story in the UK Guardian
….That is why some guy named Al moved nearer the ocean…but..surprinsingly, by some already known “effect” it rapidly cool down, making the PDO change, and, worst than that, provoking earthquakes too.
Alan the Brit,
“A teacher has all the rights in the world to believe whatever he/she wants to believe, BUT, not to bring it into the classroom unless balancing their viewpoint!”
Quite right, but what happened after 100 pupils in my school were taken to see Age of the Stupid? Was that followed up by a balancing presentation on the case against AGW? What do you reckon?
On the other hand I wonder what would happen if a teacher told his class that AGW was a myth and just showed his pupils videos of Prof Bob Carter from YouTube?
Schools are becoming less places of learning and more and more places for indoctrinating children with whatever views the government happens to support.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7959667.stm
It is part of a much bigger plan: President Obama wants to spend $150bn over 10 years on a massive expansion of renewable energy.
He says it will cut the country’s dependance on foreign oil, create five “green-collar” jobs and help tackle climate change.
😉
Luiss Diaz said
‘Just because he has a public funded job, and even if you are legally entitled to call for his resignation, still, you should be ashamed of asking for his head because he makes public his views!
The only way you would be right would be if he was the one responsible to put in practice the policies he advocates ‘
Luis makes a good point.
This discussion should not be a personal attack on Hansen. Such attacks are often, rightly ridiculed on this blog.
The poster is wrong to call for Hansen to be sacked. He should make an official complaint, if he thinks he has a case. He should not use a science blog.
In my opinion Hansen has not broken the Hatch Act.
NASA employees are not barred from being ‘active at political rallies and meetings’.
The 1993 amendment says, It is the policy of the Congress that employees should be encouraged to exercise fully, freely, and without fear of penalty nor reprisal, and to the extent not expressly prohibited by law, their right to participate or to refrain from participating in the political processes of the Nation.
They may be foolish when doing so, but that is for us to establish with evidence and logic.
The authoritarian responses to Hansen exercising free speech are as worrying as Hansen’s intolerance of his opponents.
Get back to the science. It is working. Read the interesting thread about the Alaska volcano explosions.
No more ‘ad hominem’ attacks please.
M White (11:23:48) :
The net result was that far less carbon dioxide was absorbed and sent to the sea floor than scientists had anticipated.”
The experiment was a success.Any scientist who had not “Anticipated” hierarchical predation would be considered an idiot.
Seawifs captured the bloom here.
http://oceancolor.gsfc.nasa.gov/FEATURE/IMAGES/A2009045144500.LOHAFEX.chl.jpg
Luis,
“And I am entitled to say that censorship is evil, like it or not..”
You certainly are entitled to say that and I am entitled to disagree and say it is a misuse of the concept. Freedom of speech works both ways, yes?
“Mr Marsh, like I said previously, I don’t care if you are legally authorized to push mr Hansen to unemployment because of his views.”
This is an incorrect statement of my motivations. At no time have I ever stated that he should be fired because of his views. I could care less what he thinks or says. What I would ‘push him to the unemployment lines’ for is not his views, but his behavior in violating his organizations ethics and laws of the US. There’s a difference.
B Kerr, something is odd about the second video on that BBC article. It’s dark, it’s night and it should be -40C or less yet the reporter is wearing a light jacket, his face is uncovered but normal coloured and there is no vapour when he speaks. He’s not shivering much either. Can someone explain that?
It’s the second video on this page
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7961957.stm
The First Amendment does not extend to yelling [falsely] “Fire” in a crowded theater [which many of his statements are equivalent to] nor to inciting the direct harm to another individual – which several of Mr. Hansen’s pronouncements [commandments?] do and all in the name of his very questionable climate models.
I have to disagree with Roger Clague, who says it’s his opinion that Hansen hasn’t broken the Hatch Act.
Well, it’s my opinion that he has, Roger — by not making it clear that he is speaking as a private citizen. He never corrects the numerous British newspaper reports that identify him as head of NASA/GISS.
And I believe Hansen uses NASA/GISS resources in his travels. Prove me wrong, Roger… oh, that’s right: NASA is completely uncooperative when questions like that are asked by members of the taxpaying public. See, it’s a secret.
The U.S. government is doing nothing to rein in Hansen. Therefore, they are condoning his vicious attacks on legal, law-abiding, low cost energy providers. By taking no action, they are approving of his politicking as a NASA spokesman.
If that’s an ‘ad hominem’ attack, Roger, you’ve got some learning to do. It is James Hansen who is guilty of ad hominem attacks.
Luis,
I’d also point out that you haven’t called censorship evil. If you had I might agree. In your posts you’ve applied the term ‘evil’ to Anthony through his post and that usage is what I take issue with.
You’ve called Anthony’s post evil – “He is not in any sentence calling for an end to democracy, so this is a misleading, obnoxious, evil post.”
You’ve called his rationale evil – “Do you not see the evil of your rationale?”
I did a text search of the comments and nowhere did you call censorship evil except in your last reply to me.
I don’t suppose Dr. Hanson’s activities here in England will make a lot of difference to the way things work out in the end. We may not lead the world in many areas any more, but our supply of home grown buffoons is still the equal of any. Hanson is just one of a chorus. One thing intrigues me though, does GISS make an adjustment to it’s figures to offset the AGW caused as he jets around the planet or have NASA devloped a glider he can use to visit these shores? Or maybe he is a keen yachtsman. I can’t believe he might be a hypocrit. Can he?
Bill Marsh (10:20:52) :
Phil,
“NASA’s chief climate scientist is in hot water with colleagues and at least one lawmaker after calling on citizens to engage in civil disobedience at what is being billed as the largest public protest of global warming ever in the United States.” 2/27/09
Hansen’s testimony in defense of vandalism of a British Coal Plant is, in effect, an endorsement of ‘civil disobedience, of British law.
He was testifying as an expert witness about climate change and the role of coal in it, at a trial, it takes some rather fancy footwork to construe that as ‘endorsing civil disobedience’! His testimony didn’t even mention the actions of the protestors, by your logic murderers shouldn’t have defense attorneys?
So the Arctic expedition has an extra 5 litres of fuel to burn in their tent. I wonder what the carbon dioxide level in the tent is for them to breath after that. If they burn it too fast, we may not hear further from them. RIP.
A couple of points:
1. If I were Hansen’s boss, I probably would fire him because of fraudulent activity masquerading as science – in other words for not doing his job.
However, I would not associate my action with the Hatch Act, which is a “Political Reasons” law. From http://www.osc.gov/ha_fed.htm#may, the Hatch Act says,
“These federal and D.C. employees may-
* be candidates for public office in nonpartisan elections
* register and vote as they choose
* assist in voter registration drives
* express opinions about candidates and issues
* contribute money to political organizations
* attend political fundraising functions
* attend and be active at political rallies and meetings
* join and be an active member of a political party or club
* sign nominating petitions
* campaign for or against referendum questions, constitutional amendments, municipal ordinances
* campaign for or against candidates in partisan elections
* make campaign speeches for candidates in partisan elections
* distribute campaign literature in partisan elections
* hold office in political clubs or parties
These federal and D.C. employees may not-
* use official authority or influence to interfere with an election
* solicit or discourage political activity of anyone with business before their agency
* solicit or receive political contributions (may be done in certain limited situations by federal labor or other employee organizations)
* be candidates for public office in partisan elections
* engage in political activity while:
o on duty
o in a government office
o wearing an official uniform
o using a government vehicle
* wear partisan political buttons on duty”
If Hansen engages in any illegal activity, I could use that as grounds, but just political activity, much as I might despise that activity, is not cause for firing him.
2. This thread was entirely political – not about science. Many of the entries, on both sides, have ranged from merely illogical to approaching drooling lunacy. It wouldn’t take many more of this type of thread for me to question my desire to continue visiting this site.
Aron (12:01:05),
I watched the video, and you’re right, there is no noticeable vapor being exhaled. This is hard to explain at night, in minus 40° cold.
Then I watched the first video. What a trooper that guy is! What a tough guy! What a martyr! What a HE-RO!
OK, that was sarcasm. I couldn’t even finish watching the guy plainly mugging for the camera, struggling like the Three Stooges hanging wallpaper to get his jacket on, when he could have put it in front of the radiant heater for ten minutes and put it on normally.
This is the first time I’ve tuned in to these jokers. I doubt that I’ll listen to their staged adventure again — unless someone unexpectedly gets eaten by a Polar bear. Now that I’d even pay admission to see!
The iron experiment was likely carried out in a warm phase. Plankton blooms and survives because of upwelling cold water filled with nutrients that support plankton growth. It is also very likely that predation is decreased because those very conditions prevent predators from overcoming the plankton growth. Nature has fixed the timing of plankton bloom to control for nutrient availability and predator scarcity. Throwing iron in the ocean does not begin to approach what nature has figured out is the right mix. However, I’ll bet that there will be folks who will claim that oceanic sinks are not nearly what they thought they were and will fix the model to reflect this “new breakthrough” in carbon cycle facts.
pffft
You guys might know about this but Ed Milliband tried a bit of Marxist rabble rousing too when he said activists should take their direct action campaigns to different countries. A bit imperialist that I might add. No surprise to see the Guardian is here to inform us…or rouse us.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/dec/08/ed-miliband-climate-politics-environment
Not long after what appeared to be government support for direct action came a string of protests against development that the British government supports!
http://thejournal.parker-joseph.co.uk/blog/_archives/2008/12/8/4012567.html
Since then, after the imprisonment of several animal rights activists, and after a High Court judge condemned direct action, Milliband has shut up about direct action. He must have had his wrists slapped and realised that the interests of some close to government were outweighed by the interests of others even closer to government.
Jim Hansen what to say? I don’t agree with his theory on climate change. However every event or news article like this one only serve to destroy his reputation among thinking individuals. I say let him get all the attention he is doing a great job of destroying the AGW agenda. More interesting to me is who is protectiong him and why he has been protected for so long.
Pamela Gray (08:20:36) :
Thanks, Pamela, for the link. I have seen those pages before and came to the same conclusion then as now: James Hansen is, unfortunately, not prohibited by the provisions of the Hatch Act from engaging in partisan political activity, while proving (legally speaking, of course) that any of his activities are covered by any of the actions prohibited to employees of his category are slim. Those prohibited activities are :
These federal and D.C. employees may not-
• use official authority or influence to interfere with an election
• solicit or discourage political activity of anyone with business before their agency
• solicit or receive political contributions (may be done in certain limited situations by federal labor or other employee organizations)
• be candidates for public office in partisan elections
• engage in political activity while:
o on duty
o in a government office
o wearing an official uniform
o using a government vehicle
• wear partisan political buttons on duty
I believe his activities are unethical, but I don’t see the Hatch Act as applicable. Now, if someone could show he had deliberately misrepresented his data for the purpose of influencing legislation….. but that is what this blog is about, in part, and no one has found that smoking gun.
Smokey et al,
He also takes his hands out of his pockets close to the end of the video and reveals that he is wearing fingerless gloves. WTF? Is he made of fire, did he eat lots of Ready Brek, does he defy reality, did he only come out of the tent for a second or was that shot elsewhere?
OT: Scientists in possible cold fusion breakthrough
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.a67cf72fe27770f9ec992da18169937d.a1&show_article=1
But does it use carbon fuels?
Smokey (12:05:51) :
And I believe Hansen uses NASA/GISS resources in his travels. Prove me wrong, Roger… oh, that’s right: NASA is completely uncooperative when questions like that are asked by members of the taxpaying public. See, it’s a secret.
I can prove you right. Hansen was here in Norway just a few days ago, and met with our Environment Minister Erik Solheim, who exploited the relationship to NASA that Hansen has
“Jobs at NASA
Solheim stressed that he is an unusual climate champion, because he is the director of NASA, the U.S. Space program, and is not employed in an environmental protection organization.
– This gives you extra attention and credibility in many groups who are skeptical to environment activists, said Solheim.”
http://www.dagbladet.no/2009/03/16/nyheter/miljo/innenriks/klima/regjeringen/5319845/
“”” M White (11:23:48) :
OT but remember the attempts to seed the ocean with iron?
“Setback for climate technical fix”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7959570.stm
“But within two weeks, the algae were being eaten by tiny creatures called copepods, which were then in turn eaten by amphipods, a larger type of crustacean.The net result was that far less carbon dioxide was absorbed and sent to the sea floor than scientists had anticipated.”
Thought it might be of interest. “””
Well I wouldn’t read to much into that particularly the part:- “far less carbon dioxide was absorbed and sent to the sea floor than scientists had anticipated.”
I would have said this instead:- “far less carbon dioxide was absorbed and sent to the sea floor than THOSE scientists had anticipated.”
There’s no mystery to the fact that phytoplankton feeds zooplankton (call them copepods if you like), which in turn feeds larger species and so on up the ocean food chain.
Part of the oceanic problem has been that badly thought out fishing policies; like scooping up menhaden and other bait fish species to make omega-3 snake oil for unwitting snake oil customers.
As a result there hasn’t been proper predation on the zooplankton, by one time plentiful bait fishes, so the zoo-plankton (copepods) ate themselves into starvation. (their skeletons are raining down on the decks of the Titanic in one of the most studied ocean columns on earth.
Of course if you grow more phytoplankton via iron doping; you will get a zooplankton explosion, if you don’t also recover the bait fish species by curbing the omega-3 snake oil mythology.
The depletion of game fish species by gross overfishing should have left plenty of bait fishes to control the zooplankton populations; but if you have another bunch of idiots scarfing up every bait fish they can get ehri hands on; they not only depress the game fish stocks; but they wreck the rest of the food chain as well.
So stop with the quack medicine rackets, and the iron doping will work the way it is supposed to; and if those “Scientists” had thought about the whole system, even they would have seen that with the present lack of food chain balance, that their project would yield abnormal results.
George
Who does James Hansen think he is?
I sent an email to NASA when James Hansen did the Washington protest. They said that (para) what he does is not necessarily a reflection of NASA policy. But if James Hansen didn’t have the letters N-A-S-A attached to his name NO ONE would pay a bit of attention to him. And there is an unspoken understanding that since the letters N-A-S-A are attached to his name his views ARE NASA’s views.
Hansen must know this full well. He can’t be so stupid that he doesn’t.
Hansen abuses his title at NASA. Or maybe this is actually what NASA wants and it’s not an abuse at all.
This is what is unspoken :
What Jakes Hansen does is fully agreed upon, and approved, by NASA.
If this is not the case then NASA had better soon make some public clarifications.
Bob Shapiro,
I agree with you that this one particular thread, unlike almost all the others on WUWT, is about politics. The title refers to the “democratic process.” That isn’t science, that is politics. In fact, it refers to the politicization of science.
The site owner has exclusive discretion in these matters. And the fact that you also put in your 2¢ worth makes the opinion expressed in your last paragraph moot.
Since James Hansen’s entire purpose was political, how else should it be addressed? Remember that Hansen has adamantly refused to engage in any real debate over his purported science. The fact that he runs and hides from real debate over the science tells you all you need to know about whether he is speaking as a scientist, or as a politician.
Someone brought up a good point in a previous comment: a soldier can express himself — but not when in uniform. Hansen never makes it clear that he is speaking as a private individual; instead, he revels in the fact that he is speaking as head of NASA/GISS. He never corrects reporters on this point, and he never issues such a disclaimer prior to giving an interview.
Suppose that the United States Surgeon General traveled to another country and, speaking as the Surgeon General, began endorsing eugenics. Would that be A-OK?