Polar bears and sulfates

From the University of Washington  some apparent confusion about what sulfates look like.

Injecting sulfate particles into stratosphere won’t fully offset climate change

IMAGE:A polar bear walks along an expanse of open water at the edge of Hudson Bay near Churchill, Manitoba, in 2011. The bears need pack ice to hunt for…Click here for more information.

As the reality and the impact of climate warming have become clearer in the last decade, researchers have looked for possible engineering solutions – such as removing carbon dioxide from the atmosphere or directing the sun’s heat away from Earth – to help offset rising temperatures.

New University of Washington research demonstrates that one suggested method, injecting sulfate particles into the stratosphere, would likely achieve only part of the desired effect, and could carry serious, if unintended, consequences.

The lower atmosphere already contains tiny sulfate and sea salt particles, called aerosols, that reflect energy from the sun into space. Some have suggested injecting sulfate particles directly into the stratosphere to enhance the effect, and also to reduce the rate of future warming that would result from continued increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide.

But a UW modeling study shows that sulfate particles in the stratosphere will not necessarily offset all the effects of future increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide.

Additionally, there still is likely to be significant warming in regions where climate change impacts originally prompted a desire for geoengineered solutions, said Kelly McCusker, a UW doctoral student in atmospheric sciences.

The modeling study shows that significant changes would still occur because even increased aerosol levels cannot balance changes in atmospheric and oceanic circulation brought on by higher levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide.

“There is no way to keep the climate the way it is now. Later this century, you would not be able to recreate present-day Earth just by adding sulfate aerosols to the atmosphere,” McCusker said.

She is lead author of a paper detailing the findings published online in December in the Journal of Climate. Coauthors are UW atmospheric sciences faculty David Battisti and Cecilia Bitz.

Using the National Center for Atmospheric Research’s Community Climate System Model version 3 and working at the Texas Advanced Computing Center, the researchers found that there would, in fact, be less overall warming with a combination of increased atmospheric aerosols and increased carbon dioxide than there would be with just increased carbon dioxide.

They also found that injecting sulfate particles into the atmosphere might even suppress temperature increases in the tropics enough to prevent serious food shortages and limit negative impacts on tropical organisms in the coming decades.

But temperature changes in polar regions could still be significant. Increased winter surface temperatures in northern Eurasia could have serious ramifications for Arctic marine mammals not equipped to adapt quickly to climate change. In Antarctic winters, changes in surface winds would also bring changes in ocean circulation with potentially significant consequences for ice sheets in West Antarctica.

Even with geoengineering, there still could be climate emergencies – such as melting ice sheets or loss of polar bear habitat – in the polar regions, the scientists concluded. They added that the odds of a “climate surprise” would be high because the uncertainties about the effects of geoengineering would be added to existing uncertainties about climate change.

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The research was funded by the Tamaki Foundation and the National Science Foundation.

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James Evans
January 25, 2012 11:45 am

“The modeling study shows that significant changes would still occur because even increased aerosol levels cannot balance changes in atmospheric and oceanic circulation brought on by higher levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide.”
Somebody tell Hansen.

January 25, 2012 11:52 am

These….people….are….mad…..

Brian H
January 25, 2012 11:55 am

Oh my aching gut. “Climate emergencies” is it now? Despite the best efforts of geo-engineering?
It’s “double-down” time, apparently.

SES
January 25, 2012 11:55 am

Where is the DEA when needed …?
Trying to create a volcano winter …

R. Gates
January 25, 2012 11:56 am

Once you perturb a complex system, no amount of band-aid after the fact tampering can set things back to where they were. Decades of climate effects from the 40% increase in CO2 is already “baked into the cake” so to speak, and trying to turn off the oven won’t undue the baking that is already underway. But, as a matter of principle, I’m opposed to geoengineering efforts anyway. Just look at the rise of super-bacteria is hospitals caused by the use of ever stronger antibacterial compounds. Unintended consequences can often be worse than the problem they hope to remedy.

January 25, 2012 11:57 am

Final para:
“……… existing uncertainties about climate change.”
But I thought the science was settled …………………… .

pesadia
January 25, 2012 12:01 pm

Are they stark staring mad.
Answers on a post card.

Jason Calley
January 25, 2012 12:03 pm

My skills are not up to it, but I wonder whether some of WUWT readers could start a programming project. My idea is that some sceptics could make computer models of the CAGW models. They would not have to be based on real world climate or science, but would only need to be models of how the models act. For instance, feed in “world temperatures are increasing”, and the model-model would spit out “expect massive death, ecological disaster, dogs sleeping with cats!” On the other hand, feed in “world temperatures are decreasing”, and the model-model would say, “No! It is REALLY increasing, expect massive death, ecological disaster, dogs sleeping with cats, and besides, it’s our fault anyway!”
Once the model-model was available, I am sure that the CAGW proponents would quickly take advantage of it. After all, it says exactly what they want to hear, and using it would cut their outlay on computer hardware, leaving more funding for travel to highly impacted locations — like Hawaii or Tahiti.

Ged
January 25, 2012 12:12 pm

“…such as removing carbon dioxide from the atmosphere or directing the sun’s heat away from Earth…”
Can’t help but cringe when I read stuff like that. Direct the Sun’s heat away from the Earth (I don’t think the solar industry would approve)? The random stuff they propose is like having a blind man try to do complex surgery.

More Soylent Green!
January 25, 2012 12:14 pm

I thought we could offset the effects of global warming if only we would all paint our roofs white.
Imagine if we covered all those asphalts roads with something more reflective, or just covered them with parasols?

January 25, 2012 12:16 pm

R. Gates says:
“Decades of climate effects from the 40% increase in CO2 is already ‘baked into the cake’ so to speak, and trying to turn off the oven won’t undue the baking that is already underway.”
Can’t let that baseless conjecture pass without a refutation. Yes, there has been a large increase in [entirely beneficial] CO2. However, there are no measurable, testable “climate effects” that can be definitively attributed to CO2. None – as in “N-O-N-E”.
“Baked into the cake” is a nonsense analogy. It is not science, it is evidence-free belief. Come to think of it, that’s what 99.999% of climate alarmism is.

January 25, 2012 12:18 pm

But we’ve done so well at problem-solving mankind our environment! We’ve transplanted rabbits to Australia, possums to New Zealand, nutria to the Gulf Coast wetlands…what the hell, why not have a go at the global climate?

John West
January 25, 2012 12:21 pm

“climate emergencies”
What’s next, “rapid evolution”?
……oh…..
https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/carollee/web/Lee/CORE.html

David A. Evans
January 25, 2012 12:25 pm

Isn’t 40% of FA still FA?
DaveE.

Rob Crawford
January 25, 2012 12:25 pm

“My idea is that some sceptics could make computer models of the CAGW models.”
How hard is it to prorgram “y = mx + b”?

Rob Crawford
January 25, 2012 12:26 pm

Weren’t they claiming that the lack of warming was due to sulfates? Doesn’t this mean they can’t use that excuse anymore, and have to come up with another explanation for why we haven’t seen the warming they predicted?

January 25, 2012 12:27 pm

bladeshearer,
Don’t forget kudzu. [pics]

NetDr
January 25, 2012 12:28 pm

So far the global warming has been mild and beneficial. Why bioengineer anything unless that changes for the worse ?
The lie is in the “catastrophe” !
Even if we use significantly more CO2 there will not be a catastrophe in the next 300 years.
After that they can move the planet if they want.

dave38
January 25, 2012 12:30 pm

hhhmmm. Models all the way down again!

James Sexton
January 25, 2012 12:31 pm

These people are bat$hit crazy! Holy crap! These people need a hearing to determine that they are of no harm to themselves!

Scott Brim
January 25, 2012 12:31 pm

R. Gates says:
January 25, 2012 at 11:56 am
Once you perturb a complex system, no amount of band-aid after the fact tampering can set things back to where they were …
===========================
Several million years ago, Mother Nature, in an apparent fit of reckless tampering with the earth’s climate system, initiated a set of climatic perturbations which resulted in a series of ices ages, each one with a cooling and warming cycle.
You mean to tell us that through the course of these multiple cooling and warming cycles, there was no point in time where the earth’s climate was similar in character, more or less, to a corresponding point in some previous cooling-warming cycle?

Mark F
January 25, 2012 12:33 pm

Bladeshearer: Would warmistas be the Cane Toads of the scientific world, poisoning the ponds and killing everything in sight, while breeding without limit?

C Reed
January 25, 2012 12:37 pm

“directing the sun’s heat away from Earth – to help offset rising temperatures.”
If one didn’t know they were just using alarmism to get more money, one might conclude they are actually trying to kill us! Or, at least longing for it.
Are people that stupid to fall for this? And are they that arrogant that they think people WILL fall for it?

BrianMcL
January 25, 2012 12:40 pm

Climate surprise?
That sounds fun. Personally I’ve got bored with the dull, boring, old fashioned predictable climate and I’m quite looking forward to some of that.

Craig
January 25, 2012 12:41 pm

“could carry serious, if unintended, consequences.”
Exactly what liberal ideas don’t?

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