Guest Post by Willis Eschenbach
Figure 1. The Experimental Setup
I keep reading statements in various places about how it is indisputable “simple physics” that if we increase the amount of atmospheric CO2, it will inevitably warm the planet. Here’s a typical example:
In the hyperbolic language that has infested the debate, researchers have been accused of everything from ditching the scientific method to participating in a vast conspiracy. But the basic concepts of the greenhouse effect is a matter of simple physics and chemistry, and have been part of the scientific dialog for roughly a century.
Here’s another:
The important thing is that we know how greenhouse gases affect climate. It has even been predicted hundred years ago by Arrhenius. It is simple physics.
Unfortunately, while the physics is simple, the climate is far from simple. It is one of the more complex systems that we have ever studied. The climate is a tera-watt scale planetary sized heat engine. It is driven by both terrestrial and extra-terrestrial forcings, a number of which are unknown, and many of which are poorly understood and/or difficult to measure. It is inherently chaotic and turbulent, two conditions for which we have few mathematical tools.
The climate is composed of six major subsystems — atmosphere, ocean, cryosphere, lithosphere, biosphere, and electrosphere. All of these subsystems are imperfectly understood. Each of these subsystems has its own known and unknown internal and external forcings, feedbacks, resonances, and cyclical variations. In addition, each subsystem affects all of the other subsystems through a variety of known and unknown forcings and feedbacks.
Then there is the problem of scale. Climate has crucially important processes at physical scales from the molecular to the planetary and at temporal scales from milliseconds to millennia.
As a result of this almost unimaginable complexity, simple physics is simply inadequate to predict the effect of a change in one of the hundreds and hundreds of things that affect the climate. I will give two examples of why “simple physics” doesn’t work with the climate — a river, and a block of steel. I’ll start with a thought experiment with the block of steel.
Suppose that I want to find out about how temperature affects solids. I take a 75 kg block of steel, and I put the bottom end of it in a bucket of hot water. I duct tape a thermometer to the top end in the best experimental fashion, and I start recording how the temperature changes with time. At first, nothing happens. So I wait. And soon, the temperature of the other end of the block of steel starts rising. Hey, simple physics, right?
To verify my results, I try the experiment with a block of copper. I get the same result, the end of the block that’s not in the hot water soon begins to warm up. I try it with a block of glass, same thing. My tentative conclusion is that simple physics says that if you heat one end of a solid, the other end will eventually heat up as well.
So I look around for a final test. Not seeing anything obvious, I have a flash of insight. I weigh about 75 kg. So I sit with my feet in the bucket of hot water, put the thermometer in my mouth, and wait for my head to heat up. This experimental setup is shown in Figure 1 above.
After all, simple physics is my guideline, I know what’s going to happen, I just have to wait.
And wait … and wait …
As our thought experiment shows, simple physics may simply not work when applied to a complex system. The problem is that there are feedback mechanisms that negate the effect of the hot water on my cold toes. My body has a preferential temperature which is not set by the external forcings.
For a more nuanced view of what is happening, let’s consider the second example, a river. Again, a thought experiment.
I take a sheet of plywood, and I cover it with some earth. I tilt it up so it slopes from one edge to the other. For our thought experiment, we’ll imagine that this is a hill that goes down to the ocean.
I place a steel ball at the top edge of the earth-covered plywood, and I watch what happens. It rolls, as simple physics predicts, straight down to the lower edge. I try it with a wooden ball, and get the same result. I figure maybe it’s because of the shape of the object.
So I make a small wooden sled, and put it on the plywood. Again, it slides straight down to the ocean. I try it with a miniature steel shed, same result. It goes directly downhill to the ocean as well. Simple physics, understood by Isaac Newton.
As a final test, I take a hose and I start running some water down from the top edge of my hill to make a model river. To my surprise, although the model river starts straight down the hill, it soon starts to wander. Before long, it has formed a meandering stream, which changes its course with time. Sections of the river form long loops, the channel changes, loops are cut off, new channels form, and after while we get something like this:
Figure 2. Meanders, oxbow bends, and oxbow lakes in a river system. Note the old channels where the river used to run.
The most amazing part is that the process never stops. No matter how long we run the river experiment, the channel continues to change. What’s going on here?
Well, the first thing that we can conclude is that, just as in our experiment with the steel block, simple physics simply doesn’t work in this situation. Simple physics says that things roll straight downhill, and clearly, that ain’t happening here … it is obvious we need better tools to analyze the flow of the river.
Are there mathematical tools that we can use to understand this system? Yes, but they are not simple. The breakthrough came in the 1990’s, with the discovery by Adrian Bejan of the Constructal Law. The Constructal Law applies to all flow systems which are far from equilibrium, like a river or the climate.
It turns out that these types of flow systems are not passive systems which can take up any configuration. Instead, they actively strive to maximize some aspect of the system. For the river, as for the climate, the system strives to maximize the sum of the energy moved and the energy lost through turbulence. See the discussion of these principles here, here, here, and here. There is also a website devoted to various applications of the Constructal Law here.
There are several conclusions that we can make from the application of the Constructal Law to flow systems:
1. Any flow system far from equilibrium is not free to take up any form as the climate models assume. Instead, it has a preferential state which it works actively to approach.
2. This preferential state, however, is never achieved. Instead, the system constantly overshoots and undershoots that state, and does not settle down to one final form. The system never stops modifying its internal aspects to move towards the preferential state.
3. The results of changes in such a flow system are often counterintuitive. For example, suppose we want to shorten the river. Simple physics says it should be easy. So we cut through an oxbow bend, and it makes the river shorter … but only for a little while. Soon the river readjusts, and some other part of the river becomes longer. The length of the river is actively maintained by the system. Contrary to our simplistic assumptions, the length of the river is not changed by our actions.
So that’s the problem with “simple physics” and the climate. For example, simple physics predicts a simple linear relationship between the climate forcings and the temperature. People seriously believe that a change of X in the forcings will lead inevitably to a chance of A * X in the temperature. This is called the “climate sensitivity”, and is a fundamental assumption in the climate models. The IPCC says that if CO2 doubles, we will get a rise of around 3C in the global temperature. However, there is absolutely no evidence to support that claim, only computer models. But the models assume this relationship, so they cannot be used to establish the relationship.
However, as rivers clearly show, there is no such simple relationship in a flow system far from equilibrium. We can’t cut through an oxbow to shorten the river, it just lengthens elsewhere to maintain the same total length. Instead of being affected by a change in the forcings, the system sets its own preferential operating conditions (e.g. length, temperature, etc.) based on the natural constraints and flow possibilities and other parameters of the system.
Final conclusion? Because climate is a flow system far from equilibrium, it is ruled by the Constructal Law. As a result, there is no physics-based reason to assume that increasing CO2 will make a large difference to the global temperature, and the Constructal Law gives us reason to think that it may make no difference at all. In any case, regardless of Arrhenius, the “simple physics” relationship between CO2 and global temperature is something that we cannot simply assume to be true.
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Thank you, Willis, for the well-written comments.
With kind regards,
Oliver K. Manuel
The simple physics are still part of the overall description of the system (in both cases), but the key is they are only PART, not the entirety of the description of the system.
Willis, the stream equilibrium analog is interesting. For anyone who doubts the description provided, check the geological literature – there is tons of geological research of both modern & ancient fluvial systems which support the basic description provided.
Now the critical data which we haven’t seen is with forcings in the climate “flow” system – is there data that could be used to support this hypothesis that it behaves in an analogous way to the stream model (has an equilibrium independent of forcings). And if this is true, over what time scales is it true? Willis, if you could expand on that with some data, it could provide a fairly powerful argument.
Wow that is the best explaination so far. I have read many good explainations, but this one is simple, easy to understand and follow along with (including the thought experiments).
An excellent treatment. I will read it to my physics students – next year!
Where do the proles fit in?
So far, it has worked in downtown Battle Creek; however, it should be mentioned that the banks of said river are now made of concrete 😉 … that was >30 years ago.
Battle Creek and the ‘plains’ it and surrounding communities exist in are an area that was effectively evened out over geological time (after the glaciers) by the ‘meandering river’ and oxbow lake (and swamp) effect.
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chaos, the bane of models.
I carried out a similar thought experiment last week:
Suppose we did not know that water boiled at 100C, and we were engaged in predicting the long-term surface level in a tank which we were also heating. Based on measured trends we would confidently expect the depth of water to go on increasing in a linear fashion as we warmed it and it expanded. We would be correct only until boiling started! Then we would have a period of turmoil, followed by a steadly FALL in the level due to the loss of water as it boiled off as steam.
When you get complicated and REAL, it’s what you don’t know and didn’t think of that stuffs things up!
Hmm – that boiling WAS a tipping point though!!
gtrip (20:00:23) :
“Where do the proles fit in?”
Everyone has a job in the new world order. The job of the proles is to pay the freight.
Are there any researchers looking at climate as a system governed by a Constructal Law?
I’m not sure cutting out / bypassing an oxbow would have no effect on the length but I do buy that it would have an unpredictable effect as a result of a change in pressure both upstream and down. I think your point is better made by saying that if we fiddle with things it will have unforeseen/unpredictable consequences, that we will need to adapt to, rather than none; and that similarly we can not attribute current consequences to past simple actions.
A wonderfully simple illustration of the difficulty of modeling fluid dynamics.
forgot to include the racism
Doug in Seattle (20:06:24) : edit
Bejan himself, in the final of the four links above (here). Other than Bejan, I’m not aware of any, but there may be some.
Very good work, Mr. Eschenbach.
I do not know how many times that someone has told me that they will explain the theory of global warming and then they describe the relevant properties of the CO2 molecule? Excuse, me! That is no theory of global warming. Much…much more is needed, as you show.
For example, can global warming advocates predict where the offending CO2 particles are found? I take it they are not randomly distributed between Earth and Heaven. (Even that would be a hypothesis of sorts.) They do collect somewhere up there, don’t they? Well, do they heat up? So, can global warming advocates predict, on a given day, where to find a warm spot in the atmosphere (or higher) that is caused by the offending CO2 molecules. No warming advocate has given me a positive response. Yet they refuse to take their inability to make such predictions as maybe counting against their theory. (Though some folks have said the failure to find such a warm spot somewhere over tropical South America is a major problem – but they are not climategaters.)
By contrast, Svensmark’s theory about the formation of clouds that contribute to cooling actually predicts where the clouds will be found and explains the causes of the cloud formation. Now, there we have a theory that can be used and tested.
gtrip (20:00:23) : “Where do the proles fit in?”
north prole at the top, south prole at the bottom.
Correct me if I’m wrong … but in addition to the climate being a complex system, by itself, CO2 can only warm the planet by a limited amount due to the fact that additional warming reduces logarithmically in response to additional CO2. For a “catastrophic” temperature change additional positive feedback mechanisms are required that increase the climate system’s sensitivity to CO2.
My point is, that even simple physics says that CO2 has a limited warming effect, and that additional complexity (i.e. positive feedback mechanisms) must be introduced to get the sort of warming predicted by climate models. Is this correct?
_Jim (20:01:03) :
So far, it has worked in downtown Battle Creek; however, it should be mentioned that the banks of said river are now made of concrete 😉 … that was >30 years ago.
Battle Creek and the ‘plains’ it and surrounding communities exist in are an area that was effectively evened out over geological time (after the glaciers) by the ‘meandering river’ and oxbow lake (and swamp) effect.
So what? I don’t know what you are saying. There is nothing wrong with routing a river through a city by using concrete. The concrete banks may not last forever, but they will serve their purpose for as long as they can. And your city will be able to crank out corn flakes for the good of the nation until they collapse.
Unfortunately, while the physics is simple, the climate is far from simple
That is because the Earth basically is cold without being too cold. Heat it up enough [say to 10,000 degrees] or cool it a couple hundred degrees, and simple physics takes over. In the regime of liquid water is where things get complicated.
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All this ‘simple physics’ makes me think of the simple formula for the area of a circle. Area is equal to pi times the radius squared. Many people have used this simple formula. Not many can derive it or prove that it is true.
But the simple GHG idea is even more difficult. When someone says it is simple, just say “Prove it.” Ask them if the process works for CO2 why doesn’t it work for O2 or N2, both of which are major components of the atmosphere. Yes, some people do know what is going on but most have no idea, especially those out in the snow chanting ‘turn off the heat.” And if it is simple physics, why must there be some unknown ‘forcing’ to make it work. Do most of the people know about this or have any idea how quickly simple physics gets astoundingly complex?
As for Willis’s example the concepts for meandering rivers have been shown for years in earth science classes, thus providing such a demand that the “stream table” has been commercialized:
http://wardsci.com/category.asp?c=890&bhcd2=1261975346
and an interesting example:
http://scienceblogs.com/highlyallochthonous/2009/10/how_to_build_a_meandering_rive.php
For many years Washington State University in Pullman had a RR-boxcar size one inside a building. Maybe they still do.
“The important thing is that we know how greenhouse gases affect climate. It has even been predicted hundred years ago by Arrhenius. It is simple physics.”
And every time I here James Hansen say this, I giggle uncontrolably. Arrhenius also concluded that the sun was made of coal, and that the earth was less than ten thousand years old.
“2. This preferential state, however, is never achieved. Instead, the system constantly overshoots and undershoots that state, and does not settle down to one final form. The system never stops modifying its internal aspects to move towards the preferential state.”
Like a sign wave.
This whole Arrhenius thing has always bothered me. His calculations were done before either Einstein or Plank’s work and without the foundation in quantum mechanics it is impossible to understand the absorption and emission of infrared radiation. I have been laboring through several of the papers that form the foundation that are used by the AGW community and have found that many of them do not say what it is claimed that they say. The best work in this area was actually done in the fifties and sixties and yet little of it has been applied to this modern era of computer analysis of the effect of CO2.
Oops, make that ‘sine’ wave.
..need sleep…