Guest post by David Middleton
Even with up to $10,000 in federal and state incentives, only 4% of car buyers in California chose electric or plug-in hybrid vehicles last year. That’s a huge problem in a state with rising greenhouse gas emissions from passenger vehicles, and with a goal to more than quadruple the number of zero-emissions vehicles on the road by 2025.
How can the state kick-start EV sales and hit its target of 1.5 million zero-emissions vehicles? To Assemblyman Phil Ting (D-San Francisco), the answer is simple: Spend $3 billion on dramatically higher state rebates — as in, upping the state’s ante from $2,500 to $10,000 or more per vehicle.
Under Ting’s proposal, AB 1184, the state rebate program would be redesigned to make the cost of a compact electric vehicle comparable to a similar gas-powered one.
[…]
But there are several problems that make Ting’s current proposal a no-go. For starters, there’s the staggering $3-billion price tag, which is six times more than the state has spent on rebates since 2010. There’s talk about dipping into the cap-and-trade auction revenue, but there already are lots of proposals for how to spend that money to reduce carbon.
More fundamentally, there’s no analysis of why Californians aren’t buying more electric cars.
[…]
Could it possibly be that 96% of Californian car buyers don’t want to purchase EV’s?
I work in Houston and live in Dallas. Last Thursday, I “evacuated” to my house in Dallas. Our downtown Houston office was partially up and running yesterday. We expect it to be fully operational by Tuesday. My Houston apartment complex never flooded and apparently never lost power. CenterPoint, the local grid operator, mangaed to keep the power on to 95% or more of their coverage area throughout the storm. They are now back to about 99%. Houston METRO, the local mass transit authority, was 50% operational yesterday and expects to be nearly 100% by Tuesday.
I plan to head back to Houston Monday or Tuesday. It’s about a 255 mile drive. My Jeep can go about 360 highway miles on a tank of gas. North Texas is currently experiencing a gas shortage. Most of the gas stations near my house were dry yesterday. I have to plan on not being able to buy gas between here and Houston.
What would it take to persuade you to buy an electric car?
An electric Jeep that can ford 2-3′ of water, with a 360 mile range and be rechargeable in less time than I might have to wait in a gas line in Houston next week… might be what it would take to persuade me to buy an EV… Only if it cost less than $40,000. But that’s just me… What about you?
Featured image from this article:
Bad Weather Guide: What to do if Your Electric Car Has Been in a Flood
BY NIKKI GORDON-BLOOMFIELD • FEBRUARY 13, 2014
It’s something we hope nobody who reads this has to encounter, but given the propensity for extremes of weather we’ve seen over the past few years — not to mention the weather the UK has been subjected to continuously for the past six weeks — waking up one morning to find your prized EV submerged in water is a real possibility.
Here at Transport Evolved, we’ve already discussed how you should drive in stormy, winter weather, but what should you do if your EV ends up in more than just a puddle? What if the water level is above the bottom of your car’s doors, and there’s muddy, wet water in the footwell? What if the only bit of your car you can see is above the water line?
[…]
“And I would be able to perform any repairs myself.” Amen Arthur. When I first started driving ( CENSORED ) years ago, I could fix ( and I mean fix, not just remove and replace) almost everything I needed to with just a few wrenches, a pair of pliers, and a couple of screwdrivers. Us kids just didn’t do things like buying new parts or hiring mechanics. That cost MONEY, of which most of us had almost none. True, us girls could usually get some help from guys by batting our eyelashes and looking perplexed, but that only went so far so for lots of stuff we were on our own.
I would buy an EV if it:
1) Had a range of at least 300 miles with A/C or heat, lights and wipers running
2) Could be 100% recharged in 5 to 10 minutes
3) Had 4-wheel drive and would have no problems driving in 6 inches of snow
4) Would have no problems running when it’s 10 degrees F (it can get cold where I live)
If, after you drive it for 150K miles, I would buy it from you for $4K – if it can go another 150K miles with only expenses for tires and brakes. That’s the kind of affordability/longevity EVs need to compete in the marketplace with ICE autos.
SR
Wrong question.
The fact that the question even needs to be asked in this manner indicates that the product on sale is not currently worth it. McDonalds or Burger King (other fast-food products are available) don’t have to beg in this fashion because they sell a reliable product people want to buy at a price people can afford. People who have very limited disposable income. Electric cars have a long way to go. Honest people admit this to themselves and others.
Perhaps the question should really have been “What would it take to make you to buy an electric car?” Of course they are already working on the answer. The standard thinking of “planet-savers” is not persuasion but coercion.
Exactly right – at this point it would take FORCE to make me buy one. They cannot compete in the open market on a level playing field, for so many reasons among them price and performance and convenience and utility. As with self-driving or driver-less vehicles, there are just so many issues that are likely never to be resolved as satisfactorily as they already have been with ICE vehicles, only FORCE will suffice.
Is charging free at the Tesla stations? The price of gas is largely made up of taxes so how does the gov’t replace this revenue? Most EVs I believe are second cars that still need insurance and licenses so are the majority just replacements for second cars used to run around town? Just wondering!
I am willing to do my part but I cannot afford to part with any money over this. If the government will provide me with a free electric car and a home solar energy system to charge it up I am willing to make use of it but remember anything on my property I must own free and clear including taxes. The solar system must require batteries so that if I use the car during the day the car can still be charged up at night. I also require that the car have roof and hood solar panels so the the car can be changing up while parked in the sun during the day. I believe that we should do what we can to conserve on the use of Earth’s very finite supply of fossil fuels. But I also believe that the climate change we are experiencing today is caused by the sun and the oceans over which Mankind has no control and that my using an electric car will have no effect on climate.
The more you tighten your grip, the more drivers will slip through your fingers.
Also, the evangelism is getting a little creepy, turn the volume down, guys. Subtlety is appealing, shouty Mr. Sandwich Board is *not*.
Ok I’ll bite, here’s the science fiction that would get me to buy an EV:
1. Same price as a gas car.
2. Comes with two sets of batteries that are easily swapped.
3. These magical batteries can be recharged with standard sized solar panel allowing me to use one set to drive during the day while the other is solar recharged.
4. At least 300 mile range on a set of batteries.
5. Same magical properties that allow for solar recharging allow for a 5 minute recharge if I am taking a trip.
6. Comes with a coupon good for 5 free unicorn rides at my local unicorn ranch.
If it doesn’t sound and feel like a 66 Mustang with a Shelby built 289 I won’t buy it. That Detroit Symphony Orchestra response and feel is more important to me.
What would it take? First it would have to be at the same or lower cost than a gasoline powered auto WITHOUT any subsidies to the manufacturer or to the consumer. Then it would have to have a range of at least 500 miles on a single charge and able to reliably charge it at a price cheaper than the current price of gasoline. (Paying 30+ cents a kwhr for electricity AINT gonna do it). Have to full charge in two hrs or less and have lots of reliable chargers around with plentiful electricity supply to make it reliable. Then I would consider it. Currently, they do NOT meet even ONE of my conditions… and are a long way from it.
It would have to be competitively priced, and it would probably need to be powered by a solid oxide fuel cell—not a battery.
I would by an electric vehicle if:
I could drive from Denver to Washington DC in 27 hours in the middle of winter or the middle of summer (~24 hours of driving time).
Able to drive over the passes in the Rocky Mountains and be able to accelerate quickly on steep grades when desired.
It has 4 wheel drive (all-wheel drive).
The car can sit for a year without touching it and be fine.
Will go for ~150,000 miles with little maintenance.
Is extremely reliable (I drive a lot of roads which have few cars around).
Will have low running costs (which EV’s should have).
No more dangerous than gasoline-powered cars and don’t have to worry about special circumstances like perhaps driving through water any more than regular vehicles.
It has a lot of cargo space.
Will cost me about $5000 without any subsidies (I buy used cars).
Right now, I’ve got a Subaru Outback wagon approaching 170,000 miles and an old Infiniti in another state with almost 300,000 miles.
The Infinity is finally wearing out, but both cars fit all of the above criteria.
The owner of this site sells electric cars on Ebay, the name of them escapes me. Something like ‘Evo2Go’.
They seem like nice electric cars, good for zipping around town. It seems like this site would be a good place to advertise them, there are a lot of people who are interested in alternative energy, who read about climate.
We own a plug-in hybrid — a Ford C-MAX Energi, to be specific — and we couldn’t be happier. Around town (San Francisco), the system never kicks in its gas engine, seeing as how we get, oh, about 20 to 23 all-electric miles depending upon hills and temperatures. Out of town — we drive to Oregon somewhat regularly to visit our daughter and her husband — between flat stretches and downhill sections, we average well over 60 MPG on a 600-mile+ trip. The car is silent on electricity (nice), and switches between electricity and gas completely imperceptibly. Highly recommended.
What would it take to persuade you to buy an electric car?
To show off on a hot summer day
http://picture-cdn.wheretoget.it/7kfpmh-l-610×610-swimwear-pants-sweatpants-nike+pants-cute+pants-comfy-gray-black+bikini-nike-black-black+nike-black+nike+logo-logo-nike+logo-peace-golf-golf+cart-girls-triangle-triangle-triangle+b.jpg
You have two boyfriends too? lol
I bought an SUV last year, even though I always said I would never own one. I decided I needed to do my part to put more CO2 into the atmosphere for the good of the planet. Unfortunately it’s more fuel efficient than I thought. Maybe I should have bought the Hemi.
I took it on my recent trip to Idaho. I filled the tank on that Dodge Durango at the Shell on White & Arrow in La Verne, CA. I hit the Interstate and set the cruise control at 70 mph. 10 hours later I stopped at the Exxon on Wall & 12th in Ogden, UT to gas up after traveling 697 miles.
My fuel economy gauge on the dash kept showing a range of 726 miles but when I fueled up, it took 23.92 gallons leaving me thinking I would have been running on fumes if I has pushed it any farther. I would say I would never buy an electric but I said the same thing about an SUV for 20 years, so you never know.
Wrong preconditions. I dont want to be persuaded, I want to be convinced.
Battery driven electric cars are nothing but elec-trickery. The future of internal combustion is petrol, LPG, LNG and, probably, Hydrogenium. Later on they may power a fuel cell, but that’s music of the not so near future
di ethyl ether as synthetic motor fuel, produced by nuclear reactors (around 2500 to be expected)
Comrades, what makes you think the New World Order will allow you to have cars ? they’re intending to not allow you to have steak, why would they let you have a vehicle of any kind ? Agenda 21 -> Agenda 2030 -> 5 Year Plans.
LA Times: “What would it take to persuade you to buy an electric car?
.
This!
.
“Army discovery may offer new energy source”
http://www.arl.army.mil/www/default.cfm?article=3036
Very interesting and promising, but the other way round, the fuel cells, are closer to the drawing board than to practical application. Promising, yet fuel cells are still having considerable teething problems.
“What would it take to persuade you to buy an electric car?”
1) A three-car garage so I would have a place to keep the EV that I might use several times a week while also having space for our two existing IC vehicles we use every day. I really did look into an EV several years back and concluded I couldn’t replace either existing car — it would have to be a third vehicle.
or (2) an EV purchase deal which includes unlimited below-market rentals of IC vehicles. I read somewhere that Nissan was offering some kind of deal like this to purchase a Leaf, but I looked and as far as I could tell it was just a rumor. Come to think of it, this is like keeping a fossil thermal plant in spinning reserve so we can make greater use of wind/solar electricity. So for every 10 EVs you have on the road you’d need to keep perhaps up to 5 IC rental vehicles available to meet peak demand. Such an obvious and brilliant idea, it can’t be long before someone proposes it as a solution needing a public subsidy.
or (3) a practical liquid fuel cell (e.g., methanol).
The EV push is a perfect example of the perfect being the enemy of the good. “Good” today is hybrid vehicles; they work and don’t require mandates to promote adoption. You get a good bit of the benefits of EVs at a fraction of the total cost. I recently purchased a used Toyota Avalon hybrid and I like it very much. Saving money on fuel is not the main attraction; it’s the 650 mile range — I only need to fill up roughly every two weeks. I filled up just before Harvey hit Texas and with a bit of luck I won’t have to buy gas again until the price comes back down.
If you want to do better, spend research $$ on liquid fuel cells. Developing a practical solution there will provide almost all the benefits of pure EVs with none of the drawbacks.
But knowing how government works (especially left wing ones), they will pursue the mandate+subsidy route and proudly proclaim that all the disruption they cause will “create green jobs.”
An EV will not meet the transportation needs of most people. Hence, they are supplementary vehicles. Most people don’t want to spend money on a supplementary vehicle. Many don’t have spare parking space for them, either.
A toy for rich people. Subsidized by tax payers. Wealth redistribution!
Compare to wind/solar power. They cannot stand alone. Supplementary at best. Most people don’t want to pay for a supplementary power system.
A loan, co-signed by someone I really hate.
The only way electric vehicles will have a chance to become widespread is if a “hot” rail can be put on major thoroughfares that allow charging while driving. This process has been done before with rails and roads before autos and trains replaced horses and oxen.
While driving back from Idaho the day after the Eclipse, we ran into stop and go traffic about 60 miles east of of Reno NV, (not fun in the Shelby – besides the stiff clutch at idle in first its doing about 6Mph) that lasted over 2 hours (accident then wild fire) but had to laugh at the Tesla owners – it was dusk to dark and 90+ and a long ways to the nearest charging station
. . . and no reservations at charging stations. In a high traffic situation (or every day?), one could have to wait in line for hours just to get to a charger. Charging time isn’t the only issue on long distance travel.
Nother thing. I noticed a Tesla parked off the road on an interstate exit. I thought, “Hmmm . . . if you run out of gas, AAA puts a gallon in for you. What do they do if you run out of juice? Do they have to tow you to a charger?”
I would buy one if it is roughly the same price (under $30K), the same range (400 miles), has the same basic acceleration, has the same longevity (10 years), has the same or better cost per mile, is rated as reliable (like a Honda), does not require government subsidies, and most importantly if it can be charged from zero to full in less than 10 minutes, at every current gas station.
“What would it take to persuade you to buy an electric car?”
Bite me! I hate leading questions.
“Have you quit beating your dog?”
Nothing would. I need a car in heat, rain, cold, snow, sleet, hurricanes, etc. Imagine getting ready for work and realizing you forgot to charge the car last night. And, I would need a three car garage, with two parking slots reserved for junk and one for the car charging station.
A hybrid car would not be a hard sell to me, if there were sufficient subsidies.