Transatomic Power’s Molten Salt Nuclear Reactor | Kent Beuchert writes:
Leslie Dewan and Mark Massie, as Doctoral candidates in the nuclear department at MIT, produced a modified design of a reactor technology that first appeared many decades ago : the molten salt reactor, originally designed, built and tested at Oak Ridge Tennessee during the 1950’s 60’s and 70’s.
After her graduation, the two formed Transatomic Power in 2011, as a means of completing the design and commercializing their reactor design. Recently, they received a $2 million grant of venture capital from Founders Fund. The money will be used to test and verify the corrosion resistance of metals that their design employs in the reactor core and piping, as well as modeling the reactor design. One major purpose of the testing is to determine if the moderator’s lifespan (currently only vaguely estimated) will require periodic replacement, or will last throughout the reactor’s service lifespan. The answer to this question will not prove an obstacle to the design, only to the need for a design that provides for modulator access (for replacement).
Dewan believes one of the MSRs biggest advantage is the its ability to burn SNF (spent nuclear fuel – “nuclear wastes”) more or less completely, extracting 20 times more energy from uranium than a conventional reactor, producing a far smaller and far less radioactive final waste product, that will be much easier and cheaper to store, and will retain its radioactivity above background levels for only a few centuries rather than thousands of years. It also can be configured to burn Thorium, although that is not Dewan’s desired fuel, for several reasons : the greater perceived need to burn nuclear wastes, and the inferiority of a Thorium reactor’s proliferation safeguards, the lack of any need for an alternative to uranium fuel, as well as the current existence of a uranium fuel processing system.
The original Oak Ridge MSR design was modified in only a few ways : use of a different material for the moderator in place of the original space-consuming graphite, and slightly modifying the molten fuel salt (uranium dissolved in lithium flouride) being the most important. Together, these modifications allow for commercially competitive amounts of power to be generated, not possible from the experimental molten salt reactors built at Oak Ridge, and the ability to be powered by low level radioactive fuel, reducing proliferation concerns.
The Transatomic Power plant design has an estimated overnight build cost of $2 billion for a 520MWe unit. The lower costs are primarily due to the fact that no massive high pressure containment vessels or piping is needed for much of the plant, and also due to its higher efficiency output temps, which allow for smaller power turbines to be used. Power turbines constitute a major cost in any nuclear power plant design. With these build costs and the prospect of near zero fuel costs, there likely won’t be another power source that is cheaper, all things considered. Another advantage of the design is its ability to support load following – i.e. to alter power output quickly as demand changes. As of now only some fossil fueled and hydroelectric plants have such an ability.
This capability would allow for a larger percentage of nuclear power in any grid, which today only can exist as baseload power (although pumped storage does sometimes allow for nuclear power to be stored and then later available as hydroelectric, load following power). This plant would also likely reduce (realistically, probably eliminate) commercial prospects for the larger versions of small modular reactors, those that produce over 250 MWs. It achieves (actually, exceeds) the economies of scale of a conventional large reactor, something small modular reactors are totally incapable of. It also does not require shutdown for refueling – it is refueled at intervals and can be run continuously for decades, another cost advantage over conventional reactors.
Commercially, a $2 billion dollar 520MWe power plant can meet the needs of utilities facing only gradually increasing demand as well as those whose service area doesn’t require the 1000MW plus size of a conventional reactor, or those wanting to replace fossil-fueled load-following or baseload coal plants. Build time is estimated to be 36 months. The plant does not require any source of cooling water – the molten salt fuel liquid acts as its own coolant as it flows thru the primary loop, transmitting heat (but not radiation) to an intermediate loop. The lack of any requirement for cooling water dramatically increases the number of potential build sites. In fact, its inherent safety characteristics would allow for these reactors to be sited near large population centers, avoiding lengthy transmissions, reducing costs due to power losses and transmission line construction.
In considering the reactor’s characteristics with respect to safety, it’s hard to conceive of a situation that anyone would find threatening or dangerous. Every reactor state that one can reasonably imagine as conceivable, ends up with the reactor shutting down as the molten salt cools (slightly) and becomes a solid at which point no fission is possible (or heats up, reducing fission). No radioactive material (the molten fuel salt liquid) is ever subjected to anything other than slightly above atmospheric pressures, which essentially eliminates any radioactive blast issues, ( in fact, all pressures work towards forcing the radioactive material back into the reactor system), and no hydrogen emissions can develop to the point of posing an explosive danger.
The entire steam turbine system and its piping, which contains the only only material under significant pressure (water), is completely radiation free, meaning that any rupture in that system is, radioactivity speaking, a non-event. The fuel liquid operates at a much lower temperature than fuel rods in a conventional reactor and never contains the excessive reactivity potential possessed by a conventional reactor at the start of its two to three year run cycle.
The entire system is considered walk-away safe – no operator actions, or electricity, or pumps are ever needed in order for the system to shut down should an accident occur. The reactor will achieve a stable shutdown state in a fairly short time frame.
It’s hard to imagine anyone having any objections to this nuclear reactor design. For those attracted to the safety of Thorium reactors or concerned about future uranium fuel supplies (such as India) , this design is better all the way around. With its meager fuel requirements, uranium will be economically available from either SNF, terrestrial mining or ocean extractable uranium ( freely available to virtually every country) for many millennia, eliminating any conceivable concerns about future fuel sources. And, of course, it can burn Thorium as well, should anyone so desire.
The superior economics and flexibility and load following characteristics, lack of any need for refueling shutdown, elimination of any significant fuel cost increases, removal or reduction of nuclear waste storage requirements, a much lower build cost requirement and elimination of the economic danger of a multi-billion dollar nuclear accident, would certainly make these reactors the first choice for any grid operator. And the plants can easily be co-located with conventional nuclear plants without placing any additional water demands, and be located near the likely source of the SNF they will consume as fuel.
One finds it difficult to foresee any significant risks when buying into this reactor design, financial or otherwise. I see a real possibility for this reactor design to become not only the standard and universal nuclear reactor, but also the standard commercial power plant as well, rendering all others of this size and larger obsolete. It is everything one could reasonably ask for in a power plant.
A complete technical description, accompanied by economic and safety rationales can be found at the company’s website :
Click to access TAP_White_Paper.pdf
The earth and near Solar system are its own, dynamic energy resource. Piezoelectric electrostatics and grounded magnifying transmitters with turbines powered by electrostatics and induced power similar to lightning strikes from the ionosphere to the magnetic-heavy earth, photovoltaics or natural gas powering magnifying transmitters or photovoltaic fields, may be a more “universally-acceptable and economical energy source” than MSRs, TRs or PRs since they have less-potent reaction chemical waste [electro-magnetic waste fields or entropic output] which has the property of being recyclable.
I think the term “universally acceptable” refers to its versatility. The plant can be smaller or larger, run on different fuels, can power up and power down, and does not need to be built near a huge pond or lake.
I know the term “universally acceptable” does not mean, “Every one will just love this source of power and adopt it in every state, by Federal Decree.”
I would look forward to a prototype and a white paper for your underground magnifying transmitters if they could be produced. Until then, as the good book says, “Let not he who puts on his armor boast as he who takes it off.”
Zeke, do you have a website of your work projects?
Inre: Jonah Lissner
My second remark will answer your question. I certainly do not have a site or any work in power generation.
1. I do have an authentic interest in the subject, because I am presently being sold a lot of huey by politicians and progressive scientists, claiming that renewable energy is “reliable” and that it is also “free.” They go on to wildly assert that they can provide everyone a “warm comfortable home” using “wind, solar, and tides, which costs us nothing.” But results are quite different from the claims. And worse, the abject failure of these technologies are not acknowledged. Imagine carrying out an experiment and ignoring the horrible results. Who are these people?
2. The replacement technology will not come to the West or to the world without the means of mass producing it and shipping it; it will require abundant coal and oil and capital until it is actually in place. So my suggestion is that you get your design into a workable plant quickly before there is not enough electricity to even support an aluminum plant where you are. This has already happened in the UK, under current European Union renewables requirements. You will need plenty of steel and semi trucks for your system.
3. Any one who argues that there is “free energy” – while simultaneously claiming that the resources and infrastructure needed to develop and ship the new technology to domestic and international markets must be dismantled (ie harmless fossil fuels) – cannot possibly have the expertise, knowledge, or experience to address the subject in the first place. Suppose an engineer ripped out the plumbing and electrical wiring of a city, based on a promise of future “free energy.” Plainly, no engineer would be able to use such reckless practices and still be able to keep his license to practice.
Here, let me be of some small assistance to you if I can. To quote from your paper,
“Praxis
Example 2.
AMT^3 in prototypical design resemble an oil derrick or radio station antenna;
because of the interaction of the Ionosphere and the Magnetosphere, the ground already has a
range of electo-magnetic frequencies from 7 to 12 hz. Utilizing a very high rate of speed from an
opposing energy-state to perturb air via grounded electro-magnetic fields as efficiently as
possible, the AMT of the Tesla design utilizes three coils and oscillating rod to transmit
electronic standing waves from the earth surface location across the reflective Kennelly-
Heaviside layer to the opposing receiving station or stations wirelessly.”
http://lissnerresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/4/7/5/24752711/proposal_for_unitary_iono-magnetospheric_power_generation_theory.pdf
This should help to gain a hearing for what you are saying. It is important that you should be able to attract venture capital and develop a product which people want to buy, at a price that is right for them.
I’ll have a double order of that with cheese.
I could be wrong, but I think I see Sam Bodman’s fingerprints on this somewhere
Well, there are now three horses in the race.
D.O.E. & China are continuing to sloooowly advance the Thorium solution.
The third architecture is being designed by “Thor Energy” in Norway.
They have pursued an evolutionary design, which physically integrates our uranium with Thorium.
Think of the uranium as the fuse that lights the Thorium into activity.
http://www.thorenergy.no/
Description
Thorium-plutonium (Th,Pu) oxide fuels will provide an evolutionary way to simultaneously reduce plutonium volumes and capture energy from this material. In this work we compare the neutronic properties of Th,Pu-fuel and MOX fuel with different Pu isotope vectors. For these studies, burn-up simulations are performed for a regular MOX PWR fuel assembly and for a thorium-plutonium PWR fuel assembly of the same geometry. The neutronic properties and performance of the assemblies are investigated by lattice calculations using CASMO-5. The plutonium content of the two fuel types is chosen so that the same total energy release per fuel assembly is achieved, which demanded a somewhat higher plutonium content in the thorium plutonium case. The assemblies are then analyzed with regards to temperature coefficients, delayed neutron fractions, control rod and boron worths, coolant void reactivity (CVR) and decay heat. Overall, the results show that MOX and Th,Pu-fuel have fairly similar neutronic properties in existing PWRs. Th,Pu-fuel offers an advantage over MOX fuel with regards to CVR values and plutonium consumption. The conclusion is therefore that introducing Th,Pu-fuel would improve these factors without imposing any major hurdles from a reactor physics point of view
Pellets with various throium levels will be tested. The objective is pellets with 90% thorium or more.
Good news!
If the costs don’t rise during the initial phases this could be a good reinvention.
Lets hope nuclear-bomb building goes away.
I don’t mind the ‘hype’ style of the article all that much. It is more subdued and realistic than the constant hype for solar and wind that we hear almost every day. It is the nature of the game to hype what you are selling, otherwise people won’t even listen to you.
I think there is another problem here that has not been brought up, and may be more difficult to overcome than the problem of corrosion:
It will step on a lot of toes!
These reactors will greatly reduce the need for enriched uranium, make the current style of nuclear reactor obsolete and greatly reduce the need and scope of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC). A lot of wealthy and/or powerful people will become less so, and they won’t like it.
We have this idea that advancements in nuclear energy technology have stalled because of a grass roots distrust of the energy source. I am sure that is partially true. But I also believe that there are vested interests in the way things are done now, and they are not interested in any changes that will hurt or eliminate their bottom line. It will take some politically powerful allies of MSR’s to make these things a reality.
The powerful coal and railroad interests – and many other interests (back in the early days of nuclear power) used their power to put roadblocks to the economical development of nuclear power and financed a lot of the anti-nuclear “fervor” of those times. Today we have other entrenched powers that will manoever “behind the curtains” to protect their turf. It has always been so and always will. Unfortunately, these clowns appear to “own” the MSM (aka the ” Liberal Propaganda” press) which gives a very big chunk of illegitimate power to shape things to their liking. I’m betting Molten Salt Reactors will be “in their sights”.
I’m concerned that the political/regulatory regime will effectively kill this like they have conventional nuclear reactors. They could take decades to approve the design. (Visit the website of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and see their level of urgency for getting anything done.) Environmental lawsuits could prevent start of construction for another decade, and continuing lawsuits mandating construction halts and design changes could stretch out construction to 10-12 years beyond that. Reason does not rule in this area. The average age of a nuclear reactor in the US is 39 years, and the last one was built in the 1990’s. The same people complaining about CO2 and coal emissions work their tails off to prevent nuclear power from solving those issues. And most people seem to think nuclear = bomb, so they are easily swayed by green propaganda. The company may have to go to Russia or China to actually get anything built.
If this thing is as good as it sounds, someone will build one somewhere.
True. But I am disappointed and ashamed that my country is becoming a technological backwater mired in political corruption and unreason.
Oh-oh, Big Wind and Big Solar aren’t going to like this. Price-wise, it looks to be competitive with coal and gas, and cheaper than traditional nuclear plants.
the elites have already scared the public far too much about radiation…………people refuse to see the FIRES from the earthquakes and the natural gas lines…..they FEAR nuclear power generation that doesnt harm anyone and is safe clean and cheap….but are unafraid of the very things that are dangerous…that natural gas line into their homes could explode.
If this thing is more than just a pipe dream, then the current US puppet administration would do everything in their power to insure one never gets built.
Too many oxen would be gored.
Just think if these young workers had access to even a small portion of the $billion$ Obama’s insiders squandered on faux ‘renewables’.
Sorry for the quick post…
By the Foudners Fund is a truly powerful, wealthy and ground breaking group of investors. If anyone can persuade the enviros to cool it and let this progress, it is this group.
This new reactor design does need cooling water. 1200 degrees F steam makes electricity just like in a coal plant, but the steam must be condensed with cooling water to become liquid again to be re-used. 44% thermal efficiency is much better than LWR’s at 34%, but the 56% must be exchanged to cooling water.
I read most of the white paper. This reactor would be extremely unlikely to melt down, as the uranium is dissolved in molten salt, which would just drain into a dilution tank in the event of problems. The dilution would stop the fission. Fuel is added continuously, so no refueling shutdowns every four years. Spent Nuclear Fuel is a massive headache to the industry, and these reactors will consume it, huge advantage.
Sign me up!
Or the heat can be used to heat buildings.
Yes, I had a job offer from the old Detroit Edison to work on their downtown co-gen plant. I am not aware of any nuclear plants that do this though. Gulf States Utilities has the world’s largest water softener, supplies process steam to an oil refinery across the street from their natural-gas-fired power plant in Baton Rouge LA. I did work on that one!
Michael Moon Wrote
August 27, 2014 at 9:28 am
This new reactor design does need cooling water. 1200 degrees F steam makes electricity just like in a coal plant, but the steam must be condensed with cooling water to become liquid again to be re-used. 44% thermal efficiency is much better than LWR’s at 34%, but the 56% must be exchanged to cooling water.
This is exactly one of the key benefits of a Thorium reactor like the type that “Thor Energy” is trying to build in Norway. They will use a small amount of U235 to ignite the Thorium. The Thorium does NOT require water cooling! In fact, the only water in the containment building is a separate vessel holding water mounted above the Thorium reaction process. In the event of some kind, let’s say an earthquake, the water is released into the Thorium. The reaction is stopped. The East Coast has the oldest fleet of reactors. They’re located in valuable fish spawning rivers and coastal locations. The advancement to a deliverable, Thorium design would be worth billions and would be environmentally positive.
Whether it uses uranium, thorium, or antimatter, the end result is heat. Water is heated and needs to be cooled, or replaced with cool water. Dumping water onto a pile of thorium sounds like a recipe for a steam explosion.
Wrong. It doesn’t use water in the reactor itself. Molten salt cools the core. That’s why it’s called “molten salt.”
jim2, nuclear power plants don’t consume cooling water in the nuclear cycle, but in the steam cycle. The steam cycle is the same, regardless of the source of heat. You will still need large quantities of cooling water to condense the steam on the low pressure side of the turbines.
cool
look at this too:
http://dual-fluid-reactor.org/
http://dual-fluid-reactor.org/dfr.pdf
larrygeary
Here’s a YouTube video on Thorium. Your concern is addressed in the first minutes.
The Greens will oppose this not because it is bad, but because it is good. They are anti-growth and civilization, and if safe nuclear energy promotes economic growth, they will oppose it.
Besides, remember the progressive motto,”never let a good crisis go to waste.” If the energy “crisis” is solved, the Greens’ political importance will fall even lower than it already is.
“Wrong. It doesn’t use water in the reactor itself. Molten salt cools the core. That’s why it’s called “molten salt.””
I didn’t say it uses water to cool the reactor. It uses water turned to steam to turn a turbine. That water has to be cooled.
I think they are hoping to combine this new technology with a supercritical CO2 Brayton cycle turbine, no steam or water needed. https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/brayton-cycle-turbines/#.U_4t5vldVgg
Most brayton cycle gas turbines still ahve an exhaust temperature high enough to make quite a bit of steam.
Attn: This technology is known by the State of California to cause cancer, inattention, lethargy, obesity, autism, ADHD, and all of the same diseases and complaints caused by vaccination, jet contrails, GMOs, and cell phones.
Attn: This developing technology is known to the State of Texas to be a potential addition to present power mixes, and we will produce larger plants at a fraction of the cost of any Australian territory. Did you hear that we built desalinisation plants in Texas for 10 million dollars, and the Australians spent several billions of dollars on a similar plant? We will do this again. Drive friendly. Texas.
I thought the barrier to re-processing SNF was the non-proliferation treaty the Carter administration signed the US up to?
Read this:
http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/12/20/breakout-thorium-idINL4N0FE21U20131220
Too bad they couldn’t retro fit the San Onofre nuclear plant here in San Diego for this design. The plant is sitting idle ready to be decommissioned.
They should put modular reactors on the site.
The risk is 100% financial. It will cost $50 billion to commercialize this technology. The same as any other nuclear fission technology. South Africa folded on the pebble bed modular reactor not because of a any technical problems, but because a sober analysis of the costs to commercialize convinced them they could not afford it.
The MSR might be a great idea, and in 30 years there might even be one operating. But claiming there are no risks is foolish.
During the ’60s and even into the ’90s I repeatedly encountered people who repeatedly talked about the risks and costs of space craft development as if the end result was a craft loaded with cash that was shot into space and would never return. One hundred percent of all spending took place here on earth. That is, in effect, no true “cost” was incurred. Quite the contrary, the research and development costs created new wealth in many forms from things as abstract as new knowledge leading to new medical developments or wages that went to simple spending money that kept a local bar operating. It is no coincidence historically that periods of intense research and development are also typically periods of intense prosperity.
Aren’t the chinese reserching this already? If I were Beuchert and still needed work I would be off.
Just read Conrad’s link.
Greg White August 27, 2014 at 12:18 pm
I think they are hoping to combine this new technology with a supercritical CO2 Brayton cycle turbine, no steam or water needed. https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/brayton-cycle-turbines/#.U_4t5vldVgg
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Oh oh, CO2, I’m sure this will contribute to CAGW!
With the new format you can reply directly to a comment without having to quote.