Nature hates straight lines

Guest Post by Willis Eschenbach

Yeah, I know Nature doesn’t have human emotions, give me a break. I’m aware it is unscientific and dare I call it atavistic and perhaps even socially unseemly to say Nature “hates” straight lines, but hey, it’s a headline, cut me some poetic slack.

My point is, everyone is aware that nature doesn’t deal in straight lines. Natural things move in fits and starts along complex paths, not straight from point to point. Phenomena have thresholds and edges, not slow linear changes at the perimeter. Tree branches and coastlines are jagged and bent. Things move in arcs and circles, relationships are complex and cyclical. Very little in nature is linear, particularly in complex systems.

Forcing is generally taken to mean downward radiation measured at the TOA (top of atmosphere). The IPCC says that when TOA forcing changes, the surface temperature changes linearly with that TOA forcing change. If there is twice the forcing change (twice the change in solar radiation, for example), the IPCC says we’ll see twice the temperature change. The proportionality constant (not a variable but a constant) that the IPCC says linearly relates temperature and TOA forcing is called the “climate sensitivity”.

Figure 1. Photo of impending change in climate sensitivity.

Today I stumbled across the IPCC justification of this linearity assumption. This is the basis of their claim of the existence of a constant called “climate sensitivity”. I quote it below.

I’ve removed the references and broken it into paragraphs it for easy reading. The references are in the original cited above. I reproduce all of the text on the web page. This is their entire justification for the linearity assumption. Having solved linearity in a few sentences, they then proceed to other matters. Here is their entire scientific justification for the assumption of linearity between forcing and temperature change (emphasis mine):

Linearity of the Forcing-Response Relationship

Reporting findings from several studies, the TAR [IPCC Third Assessment Report] concluded that responses to individual RFs [Radiative Forcings] could be linearly added to gauge the global mean response, but not necessarily the regional response.

Since then, studies with several equilibrium and/or transient integrations of several different GCMs [Global Climate Models] have found no evidence of any nonlinearity for changes in greenhouse gases and sulphate aerosol. Two of these studies also examined realistic changes in many other forcing agents without finding evidence of a nonlinear response.

In all four studies, even the regional changes typically added linearly. However, Meehl et al observed that neither precipitation changes nor all regional temperature changes were linearly additive. This linear relationship also breaks down for global mean temperatures when aerosol-cloud interactions beyond the cloud albedo RF are included in GCMs. Studies that include these effects modify clouds in their models, producing an additional radiative imbalance.

Rotstayn and Penner (2001) found that if these aerosol-cloud effects are accounted for as additional forcing terms, the inference of linearity can be restored. Studies also find nonlinearities for large negative RFs, where static stability changes in the upper troposphere affect the climate feedback (e.g., Hansen et al., 2005).

For the magnitude and range of realistic RFs discussed in this chapter, and excluding cloud-aerosol interaction effects, there is high confidence in a linear relationship between global mean RF [radiative forcing] and global mean surface temperature response.

Now, what strikes you as odd about that explanation of the scientific basis for their claim of linearity?

Before I discuss the oddity of that IPCC explanation, a short recap regarding climate sensitivity. I have held elsewhere that climate sensitivity changes with temperature. I will repeat the example I used to show how climate sensitivity goes down as temperature rises. This can be seen clearly in the tropics.

In the morning the tropical ocean and land is cool, and the skies are clear. As a result, the surface warms rapidly with increasing solar radiation. Climate sensitivity (which is the amount of temperature change for a given change in forcing) is high. High sensitivity, in other words, means that small changes in solar forcing make large changes in surface temperature.

By late morning, the surface has warmed significantly. As a result of the rising temperature, cumulus clouds start to form. They block some of the sun. After that, despite increasing solar forcing, the surface does not warm as fast as before. In other words, climate sensitivity is lower.

In the afternoon, with continued surface warming, thunderstorms start to form. These bring cool air and cool rain from aloft, and move warm air from the surface aloft. They cool the surface in those and a number of other ways. Since thunderstorms are generated in response to rising temperatures, further temperature increases are quickly countered by increasing numbers of thunderstorms. This brings climate sensitivity near to zero.

Finally, thunderstorms have a unique ability. They can drive the surface temperature underneath them below the temperature at which the thunderstorm formed. In this case, we have local areas of negative climate sensitivity – the solar forcing can be increasing while the surface is cooling.

As you can see, in the real world the temperature cannot be calculated as some mythical constant “climate sensitivity” times the forcing change. Sensitivity goes down as temperature goes up in the tropics, the area where the majority of solar energy enters our climate system.

So the IPCC claim of linearity, of the imagined slavish response of surface temperature to a given change in TOA forcing, goes against our daily experience.

Let me now return to the question I posed earlier. I asked above what struck you as odd about the IPCC explanation of their claim of linearity regarding forcing and temperature. It’s not the fact that they think it is linear and I disagree. That is not noteworthy.

Here’s what made me stand back and genuflect in awe of their claims. Perhaps I missed it, but I didn’t see a single word about real world observations in that entire (and most important) justification for one of their core positions.

I didn’t see anyone referenced who said something like ‘We measured solar radiation and downwelling longwave radiation and temperature at this location, and guess what? Temperatures changed linearly with the changes in radiation.’ I didn’t see anything at all like that, you know, actual scientific observations that support linearity.

Instead, their claim seems to rest on the studies showing that scientists looked at four different climate models, and in each and every one of the models the temperature change was linearly related to forcing changes. And in addition, another model found the same thing, so the issue is settled to a “high confidence” …

I gotta confess, that wasn’t the first time I’ve walked away from the IPCC Report shaking my head, but that one deserves some kind of prize or award for sheer audacity of their logic. Not a prize for the fact that they think the relationship is linear when Nature nature hates straight lines, that’s understandable, it’s the IPCC after all.

It is the logic of their argument that left me stammering.

Of course the model results are linear. The models are linear. They don’t contain non-linear mechanisms. And of course, if you look at the results of linear models, you will conclude with “high confidence” that there is a linear relationship between forcing and temperature. They looked into five of them, and case closed.

I mean, you really gotta admire these guys. They are so far into their models that they actually are using the linearity of the model results to justify the assumption of linearity embodied in those same models … breathtaking.

I mean, I approve of people pulling themselves up by their own bootstraps, but that was too twisted for me. The circularity of their logic made my neck ache. I kept looking over my shoulder to see if the other end of their syllogism was circling behind to strike me again. That’s why I genuflected in awe. I was overcome by the sheer beauty of using a circular argument to claim that Nature moves in straight lines … those guys are artists.

Meanwhile, back in the real world, almost no such linear relationships exist. Nature constantly runs at the edge of turbulence, with no linearity in sight. As my example above shows, the climate sensitivity changes with the temperature.

And even that change in tropical climate sensitivity with temperature is not linear. It has two distinct thresholds. One is at the temperature where the cumulus start to form. The other is at the slightly higher temperature where the thunderstorms start to form. At each of these thresholds there is an abrupt change in the climate sensitivity. It is nowhere near linear.

Like other natural flow systems, the climate is constantly restructuring to run “as fast as it can.” In other words, it runs at the edge of turbulence, “up against the stops” for any given combination of conditions. In the case of the tropics, the “stops” that prevents overheating is the rapid proliferation of thunderstorms. These form rapidly in response to only a slight temperature rise above the temperature threshold where the first thunderstorm forms. Above that threshold, most of any increase in the incoming energy is being evaporated and used to pump massive amounts of warm air through protected tubes to the upper troposphere, cooling the surface. Above the thunderstorm threshold temperature, little additional radiation energy goes into warming the surface. It goes into evaporation and vertical movement. This means that the climate sensitivity is near zero.

Now it is tempting to argue that the IPCC linearity claim is true because it only applies to a global average temperature. The IPCC only formally say that there is “a linear relationship between global mean RF [radiative forcing] and global mean surface temperature response.” So it might be argued that the relationship is linear for the global average situation.

But the average of non-linear data is almost always non-linear. Since daily forcing and temperature vary non-linearly, there is no reason to think that real-world global averages vary linearly. The real-world global average is an average of days during which climate sensitivity varies with temperature. And the average of such temperature-sensitive records is perforce temperature sensitive itself. No way around it.

The IPCC argument, that temperature is linearly related to forcing, is at the heart of their claims and their models. I have shown elsewhere that in other complex systems, such an assumed linearity of forcing and response does not exist.

Given the centrality of the claim to their results and to the very models themselves, I think that something more than ‘we found linearity in every model we examined” is necessary to substantiate this most important claim of linearity. And given the general lack of linearity in complex natural systems, I would say that their claim of linearity is an extraordinary claim that requires extraordinary evidence.

At a minimum, I think we can say with “high confidence” that it is a claim that requires something more weighty than ‘the models told me so’ ...

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186 Comments
Vince Causey
October 25, 2010 1:15 pm

If the response is linear then there can’t be any tipping points, so linear is good.

Vince Causey
October 25, 2010 1:18 pm

Steven Mosher,
Yes, a nice effort at changing what they said to what you want them to have said (are you are lawyer by any chance? You should consider it.) Just to be sure that they said what Willis said they said:
“there is high confidence in a linear relationship between global mean RF [radiative forcing] and global mean surface temperature response.”
But perhaps they didn’t mean what they said, but meant what you said they meant. I guess anything’s possible in climate science.

Ken Harvey
October 25, 2010 1:24 pm

LazyTeenager says:
October 25, 2010 at 4:48 am
3. There is an obvious mismatch between the idealised process described for a day in the tropics and the process of global climate.
That is not an idealised process laddie. At this moment, at any moment, it is around 4p.m. somewhere in the tropics and that storm you see described is actually happening. For all practical purposes it never ever stops. There are some small variables due to air pressure etc., but the basic situation never ceases for twentyfour hours of the globe’s day.

Dave F
October 25, 2010 1:24 pm

Actually, Willis, you can see the greater sensitivity at lower temperatures in the DMI graphs for the Arctic circle. During the Arctic winters, the temperature varies greatly, but during the Arctic summers, the temperature is pretty consistent year in and year out.

George E. Smith
October 25, 2010 1:36 pm

“”” Bill Illis says:
October 25, 2010 at 12:04 pm
Tom says:
October 25, 2010 at 11:21 am
dF = 5.35 ln (C/C0)
dT = S dF
Radiative forcing is a logarithmic function of CO2 concentration. Temperature change is a linear function of radiative forcing. “””
Well Temperature usually is related to the 4th root of the W/m^2 irradiance or the reverse for an emitter; so therefore Temperature is not a linear function of “forcing” in W/m^2.
And the relationship between the CO2 and the “forcing” is itself a fourth power function of the surface Temperature; so that too is non-linear and also non logarithmic; and also a circular reasoning since we are trying to get a surface Temeprature change from a forcing that is itself a strong function of Surface Temperature.

October 25, 2010 1:58 pm

davidmhoffer says: “In 2.8.1 they are explaining that they measure forcing and (I presume) calculate sensitivity AT THE TROPOPAUSE.”
Sorry, but even though it might make more sense to you, and make more sense physically, sensitivity is always defined with respect to the SURFACE temperature not at the tropopause. Yes, the forcing is not defined at the surface, but typically higher up (actually usually referenced to the “top of the atmosphere”) and while this may seem to imply that the sensitivity is referenced to the same layer, it never is. The sensitivity figures they talk about are ALWAYS regarding the SURFACE TEMPERATURE. So your presumption is wrong.

George E. Smith
October 25, 2010 1:59 pm

“”” Steven Mosher says:
October 25, 2010 at 10:59 am
George E. Smith says:
October 25, 2010 at 10:03 am (Edit)
So how does the IPCC protestation of a LINEAR relationship jibe with the climatists claim of a LOGARITHMIC relationship ?
George,
they do NOT claim a linear relationship. They argue that if you have 2 forcings (for example)
1. Solar
2. Aerosol
And you want to estimate the response to both you can combine them by summing.
read what they wrote. they wrote that you can combine indpendent RF (radiative forcings) by adding them. “””
Well Steve I don’t even believe that either..
Let’s say I have a 1% increase in atmospheric water vapor; and I’ll ignore cloud changes for now. That 1% increase in atmospheric H2O vapor, will result in about a 1% increase in the amount of solar energy that is absorbed by the water vapor, and so reduce the gorund level solar energy by that amount. (any increase in cloud would cause an additional albedo loss, and cloud absorption loss); but let’s skip that for now. So I have a negative forcing from my increased H2O vapor due to solar energy loss.
Now the energy lost to the increased H2O vapor, is of course energy gained by the atmosphere as a result of collision thermalization; so that would result in an atmospheric temeprature increase. That in turn would result in an increase in the isotropic LWIR thermal emission from the atmospehre, about half of which would go down to the surface, and the other half go up towards space. ( you can see that about half of the extra intercepted sunlight energy returns to the surface; so it is still a net energy loss to the surface.)
But now we have a problem. That downward LWIR red shifted solar energy from the warmert atmosphere; whcih comprises a new positive “forcing” DOES NOT react with the planet in the same way as does the original solar energy from whence it came.
The solar energy passed almost uninterrupted into the highly transparent deep oceans where it will be stored for a long time as far as immediate effects. Teh LWIR forcing on the other hand is totally absorbed in about the top 50 microns of water, and instead of being conducted slowly to the deeper wateres where the soalr energy went; to therby add to that, a set of totally different and non-linear thermal processes is activated; namely a localised heating of the very ocean surface layer, and a consequent enhanced evaporation of H2O along with latent heat of evaporation into the atmospehre, and covective transport to the upper atmosphere. The Clausius-Clapeyron equation (non-linear) comes into play in that transaction and you now have apples and oranges which you cannot directly add. The two forcings are not directly additive.
But I tend to agree that small perturbations tend to produce linear effects; which is why the concept of a logarithmic “Climate Sensitivity” is so silly; not to mention the absence of any experimental evidence to support it (compared to a linear fit to the data).

John Day
October 25, 2010 2:14 pm

George said:
> and also a circular reasoning since we are trying to get a surface Temeprature
> change from a forcing that is itself a strong function of Surface Temperature.
The “dt=lambda x dF” equation is a rubric, not a law of nature. There is no conservation law for temperatures, only for energy (and momentum).
Thus the ‘flaw’ in this sensitivity rubric (as Willis correctly pointed out in his article) is that the system can absorb massive amounts of energy, without any change in temperature, so dT=0.
Article:
“Above the thunderstorm threshold temperature, little additional radiation energy goes into warming the surface. It goes into evaporation and vertical movement. This means that the climate sensitivity is near zero.”
My quibble was the apparent conflation between non-linear mappings and their cumulative effect on energy conservation, which is always linear because energy is always conserved. Linearity, in physics, translates as the the Supposition Principle. (If we could amplify energy then we could add some scalar laws too, but that would violate conservation)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superposition_principle
I think we may be in violent agreement with Willis.

GaryW
October 25, 2010 2:16 pm

John Day says: October 25, 2010 at 12:17 pm
GaryW:
>calibrated measurement instruments … single physical quantity is measured in real time and read out directly.
In the mathematics of modeling, an ‘oracle’ is such an ‘ideal’ device. An oracle can read out true values without error or interpretation. Unfortunately, oracles are fictitious entities, invented solely for the sake of argument or elaborating a proof. They don’t exist in the real world.

John,
I am not a all sure what you are responding to here. Are you suggesting that since instrument measurements are never perfect that the values obtained from them are really just models of reality? Again, this is semantics. While your slant may be interesting philosophically, it is using a common term in a way that distorts technical meaning.
Let’s spin this back towards the subject at hand and that is about straight line approximations. Computer models are only validated when their outputs match values measured with instruments. Claiming that all measurements are merely different forms of models does not result in GCMs automatically becoming validated.
In engineering there is something called the “Engineering Fallacy.” That is a situation where a commonly used concept or calculation is assumed to represent reality instead of merely being a handy shortcut. My impression is that the folks running GCM’s are forgetting that Guesses In produce Guesses Out (GIGO). Calling measurements Models does not place GCM’s on the same level.

Milwaukee Bob
October 25, 2010 2:31 pm

John Day at 10:12 am….
I think we are agreeing…? ☺ The best you can do is an N-th order approximation. Always. No exceptions. And “an N-th order approximation” can be woefully insufficient for a given purpose and, as relates to predicting what the global weather system will be doing in _________ days, the current crop of GCMs are – – – well, “woefully deficient” for a range of reason, not the least of which is a lack of historically accurate data AND the computers to run them on are wholly inadequate in non-linear computational muscle even if we did have sufficient and precise data.
And let’s not forget, “Perfect” (note the capital pee) is a human “model” also that nature knows or cares naught of or for and while it may be difficult to observe – measure – perfection in nature, as WE idealize it, you can not say it does not exist, even if for only a moment in time, simply because in that moment in time no human is in the right place or has the capability to observe it. Which is THE point – our past and current ability to accurately “measure” weather is insufficient. Period. (Yes, again WITH a capital pee) ☺And all the “tricks” in the world can not make it so….

John Day
October 25, 2010 2:49 pm

GaryW:
> Claiming that all measurements are merely different forms of models
> does not result in GCMs automatically becoming validated.
Not what I said. I said that all measurements require some kind of model to be applied, sometimes very trivial (like a yardstick). I certainly did not want to imply that all GCM’s are automatically validated. (what a nightmare!)
> Computer models are only validated when their outputs match
> values measured with instruments.
True. I would re-state that differently: models are validated when their predictions or explanations match “reality”. Of course, “reality” really means using a trusted and validated model to validate a newer, hypothetical model, which may or may not be correct.
Just like the term ‘Prophet’, in the Jewish Bible, could only be applied to the “modelers” whose predictions actually came true.
😐

October 25, 2010 3:11 pm

I suspect there are places in the Atacama Desert (not near the coast!) where it only rains once a century and small clouds appear only a few times a year, then there probably is some form of linear relationship.
I will never forget driving through Arkansas one summer around 15 years ago. The temperature outside was about 85 degrees F. We then drove through a huge thunderstorm and the temperature fell (approx 4 in the afternoon) to below 50 degrees F – and stayed there for almost 100 miles. Turning the heater on to keep warm in the southern US in mid summer was truly a bizarre experience.
That sort of thing explains why climate ‘scientists’ prefer the fact of models over the facts/data of the real world. Why not? They are so much easier to manipulate.

Francisco
October 25, 2010 4:21 pm

Tom says:
October 25, 2010 at 9:08 am
Ohm’s law works nicely at the scales encountered for general circuit design. Or does no piece of electronic equipment actually work and it’s only me who hasn’t noticed? Biologists can say what they like, I suspect referring to very small scale (intra-cell etc) processes; engineers will keep on using it for circuit design and succeeding.
============
One would expect circuit designers to choose the right materials for their needs, ohmic or non-ohmic, yes. Who’s arguing they don’t?
Biologists say what they say for good reasons. Run a current through a piece of meat, see if your V/I ratio is anywhere near constant.
My point was that most materials found in nature are strongly non-ohmic, and so Ohm’s “law” is very, very restricted — by no means universal: restricted to some (few) materials under a certain range of conditions. Another way of saying this would be that “ohmicity” is a very rare property in nature. Which illustrates the point made by the title of this post: nature does hate straight lines.

October 25, 2010 4:36 pm

Andrew says;
The sensitivity figures they talk about are ALWAYS regarding the SURFACE TEMPERATURE. So your presumption is wrong.>>
As stated this is just an opinion. I propose that you cite the sections of AR4 and post links to the places where they SAY this. Not vague references, or cites of cites of papers behind paywalls, actually SAY it.
Then I propose you follow up by explaining how it is that they they justify their sensitivity calculations. Per their documentation, doubling CO2 = +3.7w/m2 = +1 degree of warming. Based on Stefan Boltzman equations, a body at -20C requires +3.7w/m2 to increase equilibrium temperature by one degree. A body at +15 degrees, the “average” temperature at earth surface, requires +5.5w/m2 to increase equilibrium temperature by one degree.
So which is it? CO2 doubling = +5.5w/m2, or sensitivity is calculated against effective black body temperature of -20C at the tropopause?

Francisco
October 25, 2010 4:57 pm

“I mean, you really gotta admire these guys. They are so far into their models that they actually are using the linearity of the model results to justify the assumption of linearity embodied in those same models … breathtaking.”
Reminds me of drawings like this:
http://visualfunhouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/escher640.jpg
Elementary Logic courses have been warning students against “petitio principii” for many centuries. To no avail. There are some entertaining examples at the link below.
http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/circular.html

October 25, 2010 5:02 pm

Willis (and Andrew)
Here is a rather in depth analysis of the IPCC’s claims in regard to sensitivity and feedback. Despite being part of Princeton’s dept of Mechanical Engineering and Aerospace, they couldn’t find the place in the IPCC report where it SAYS how sensitivity is calculated.
So they deduced it from various numbers and then show the math to arrive at a sensitivity of 0.7 degrees per CO2 doubling rather than the IPCC’s 1 degree at earth surface.
Andrew – I suppose this gives you a third option other then the two I already proposed. You could take the position that they plain simple got the calculations wrong. I’ll just chalk up the fact that if you take the equations in this paper and apply them to -20C at the tropopause, your gonna get 3.7 watts and a sensitivity of 1 degree to complete coincidence.
http://www.princeton.edu/~lam/documents/RadPhys08.pdf

Jeff Alberts
October 25, 2010 5:40 pm

How long does a line have to be before you consider it “straight”? You can see plenty of straight lines in geologic formations…

Joe Lalonde
October 25, 2010 6:01 pm

Willis,
This is exactly what I’m trying to show. Due to rotation, the majority of things move in a arches or circular.
But, most of our science does not feel it so it ignores it as no existant!
Winds at different level of our atmosphere do some pretty funky things depending on what factors are given them. The slow lining up of our low level winds to the planets rotation changes how heat can discipate more slowly.

eadler
October 25, 2010 7:20 pm

It seems from the arguments in this article, that Willis Eschenbach doesn’t understand the what Climate Sensitivity is.
Climate sensitivity relates to the change in temperature, required to restore radiative equilibrium, which is driven by a given radiative imabalance at the initial condition, caused by a change in greenhouse gases.
Eschenbach objects to the use of climate models as the tool to determine whether the final equilibrium temperature is linear in the radiative forcing which drive the system to a new equilibrium temperature.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_sensitivity
Let us take a look at the absurdity of his counter argument:

Before I discuss the oddity of that IPCC explanation, a short recap regarding climate sensitivity. I have held elsewhere that climate sensitivity changes with temperature. I will repeat the example I used to show how climate sensitivity goes down as temperature rises. This can be seen clearly in the tropics.
In the morning the tropical ocean and land is cool, and the skies are clear. As a result, the surface warms rapidly with increasing solar radiation. Climate sensitivity (which is the amount of temperature change for a given change in forcing) is high. High sensitivity, in other words, means that small changes in solar forcing make large changes in surface temperature.
By late morning, the surface has warmed significantly. As a result of the rising temperature, cumulus clouds start to form. They block some of the sun. After that, despite increasing solar forcing, the surface does not warm as fast as before. In other words, climate sensitivity is lower.
In the afternoon, with continued surface warming, thunderstorms start to form. These bring cool air and cool rain from aloft, and move warm air from the surface aloft. They cool the surface in those and a number of other ways. Since thunderstorms are generated in response to rising temperatures, further temperature increases are quickly countered by increasing numbers of thunderstorms. This brings climate sensitivity near to zero.

This argument has nothing to do with climate sensitivity at all. It doesn’t relate to any global average annual equilibrium temperature at all. It is a description of weather.
There is no way that observation of daily weather in a given locality can be used to infer anything about climate sensitivity.
The fact is that we have no way to do experiments to determine whether or not climate sensitivity as defined above, is a linear function of radiative forcing. The only way to do this is by modelling.
The whole premise of this post is nonsensical.

timetochooseagain
October 25, 2010 8:04 pm

davidmhoffer-It may well be that they erred in their calculations. At the moment I am hard pressed to find where they say that they mean the sensitivity of the surface temperature. However, I know that this is what everyone seems to think they are saying, including most of the “mainstream” scientists who talk about the sensitivity.
Maybe this is a huge fluke nobody has caught. It does seem to be rather odd that they are creating an opportunity for conflation of the surface and TOA responses.
This will require further examination.
~Andrew

October 25, 2010 8:10 pm

Eadler;
The fact is that we have no way to do experiments to determine whether or not climate sensitivity as defined above, is a linear function of radiative forcing. The only way to do this is by modelling. >>
You are kidding, right? For centuries science has been:
theory => model => predicted results
experiment => compare to predicted results => supports model/theory or doesn’t.
You now propose:
theory => model => done. The results of the model reflect the theory and should be considered proof of the theory. One can only shudder at the thought of the “new math” having morphed into the “new science”.

R. Craigen
October 25, 2010 8:39 pm

I’ve no problem with the anthropomorphism. My cats run for the hills whenever we get out the hoover to clean the carpet. The reason for this should be obvious to any physicist: nature abhors a vacuum!

George E. Smith
October 25, 2010 8:46 pm

“”””” Jeff Alberts says:
October 25, 2010 at 5:40 pm
How long does a line have to be before you consider it “straight”? You can see plenty of straight lines in geologic formations… “””””
Well in mathematics a straight line is infinitely long and has no other dimensions. There is no such thng anywhere in the universe.

October 25, 2010 8:48 pm

timetochooseagain;
At the moment I am hard pressed to find where they say that they mean the sensitivity of the surface temperature… (snip) Maybe this is a huge fluke nobody has caught. It does seem to be rather odd that they are creating an opportunity for conflation of the surface and TOA responses.>>
I could point you at a couple of the places where it sorta almost not quite says it, but why should you be exempted from the hours of fruitless searching and cross referencing that were such shear joy for me. There’s one place where it makes a clear statement about forcing and surface temps, but the surface temps reffered to are contained within the six economic scenarios which each have ranges of CO2 production rates changing over time. Good luck correlating that back to degrees C versus forcing. Why the obscure references? Why not clear concise definitions? Why not produce simple graphs depicting tropopause forcing (note – they say “at the tropopause” in almost all cases, not TOA. Is there a difference? I dunno. THEY DON’T SAY) versus surface temps. You’d think there would be ONE chart or diagram showing that. Just ONE.
I shall answer that question two ways.
1. When you wish to write a report not supported by fact, be selective of the information you use, write of it in vast quantities, and in excrutiating detail. No one will notice.
2. The “climate sensitivity” discussion distracts from a discussion of how it would exhibit itself. Suppose for a moment that the effective black body temp of earth increased by 3 degrees. What would that mean at surface? 2 degrees. But that’s an average. What would that mean at say the arctic circle. (guestimates from here to illustrate but supportable guestimates) arctic circle – 6 degrees. All year? No, plus 10 in winter plus 2 in summer. Lows of -30 instead of -40 and highs of +4 instead of +2. Equator? Plus 1. All year? Pretty much, pretty stable temps there. Oh, let’s not forget night versus day. Nights +20 instead of +19 and days +30.2 instead of 30.0.
THAT is the discussion the warmists want to avoid. Let’s do a survey. Hey all you polar bears out there, listen up. No seriously, put down your Coke and pay attention. By a show of paws, how many of you think that living through winters at -30 instead of -40 is a bad thing? None? I thought not. How about summers? Can you handle +4 instead of +2? Paws up if that’s gonna kill you guys because you might not know it but you’re the climate canaries. Those clown fish at the equator are useless, I asked them about day time highs going up 0.1 degrees and they just blew bubbles at me like the answer was obvious. No, you can’t eat the clown fish. No, not the canaries either. Why? Never mind why, just vote. What? No, the seals won’t change color, they’ll still be black. No! There aren’t any half black seals either, now would you just vote- OK, I get it. Funny polar bears.
I could go with the IPCC upper estimate of 4.5 degrees, or hey, why not 8? You still come back to the same analysis. Most of the warming happens in the coldest latitudes, in the coldest seasons, and at the coldest part of the day. The high temps don’t change all that much. Not even the IPCC has argued that Stefan Boltzman doesn’t apply.
Oh great, the polar bears all shook their Cokes and are spraying me.

AusieDan
October 25, 2010 8:49 pm

Willis – it’s all very simple.
As you say, they use linear models and get linear outcomes.
QEQ rather than QED I would say.
Climate is a chaotic (non linear) system.
Modelling climate with linear models gives – gasp – linear outcomes.
QEQ not QED
There – that’s proved it
– belief in disasterous global disruption is quite disasterous.
(Distasterous to clear thinking)
That’s all.