Consensus climate science: What would Thomas Huxley say?

Guest Post By Paul MacRae

“The evidence … however properly reached, may always be more or less wrong, the best information being never complete, and the best reasoning being liable to fallacy.”

-Thomas Huxley, Science and Christian Tradition, p. 205

Thomas H. Huxley (1825-1895) was one of the first and most vigorous promoters of modern scientific thinking. He is perhaps best-known as “Darwin’s bulldog”-no one did more to fight for Darwin’s theory of natural selection in the face of theological opposition-but he also almost single-handedly introduced science into the British school curriculum at all levels.thomas-huxley

Huxley was a formidable philosopher of science, anticipating many of the principles of scientific inquiry that Karl Popper would make a mainstay of scientific thinking in the 20th century, including the need for falsifiable hypotheses and non-dogmatic, continuous inquiry.

In short, in the history and philosophy of science, Huxley is someone to be reckoned with.

So what would T.H. Huxley have thought of today’s “consensus” climate scientists, with their claims that the issue of man-made climate change is “settled,” that there is no need for further debate, and that those who challenge the hypothesis of anthropogenic warming in any way are, in effect, heretics?

Three of Huxley’s books-Science and Hebrew Tradition (SHT), Science and Christian Tradition (SCT), and Hume, a biography of Scottish philosopher David Hume (1711-1776)-present Huxley’s philosophy of science very clearly. How well does “consensus” climate science bear up in Huxley’s crucible?

Science is never certain

The pretension to infallibility, by whomsoever made, has done endless mischief; with impartial malignity it has proved a curse, alike to those who have made and it those who have accepted it.

Science and Hebrew Tradition, Preface, p. ix

Just as Huxley fought against religious certainty in his time, so he undoubtedly would have questioned the consensus claim that the evidence for human-driven climate change is “overwhelming” and therefore beyond question.

But, then, orthodoxy always hates criticism, a point Huxley underscored by quoting from David Hume’s “Dialogues Concerning Natural Religion.” In “Dialogues,” Hume has the religious Cleanthes, who believes that because nature is harmonious there must be a Supreme Designer, say to the skeptical Philo:

You [Philo] alone, or almost alone, disturb this general harmony. You state abstruse doubts, cavils, and objections. You ask me what is the cause of this cause? I know not: I care not: that concerns me not. I have found a Deity and here I stop my inquiry. (Hume, p. 178)

Against this view, Huxley wrote: “No man, nor any body of men, is good enough, or wise enough, to dispense with the tonic of criticism” (SCT, “Science and Pseudoscience,” p. 93).

But, of course, the consensus climate science orthodoxy, as expressed many times by believers like Al Gore, Goddard Institute director James Hansen, and Canada’s Andrew Weaver and David Suzuki (who once stormed out of a radio interview because the interviewer dared to suggest the global warming issue is “not totally settled”)(1), is that “abstruse doubts, cavils, and objections” that don’t fit within the consensus paradigm should not be aired lest the public’s faith in anthropogenic global warming be weakened.

For example, in refusing to debate skeptical environmentalist Bjorn Lomborg , Gore said: “We have long since passed the time when we should pretend this is a ‘on the one hand, on the other hand’ issue. It’s not a matter of theory or conjecture.”

Canada’s leading climate computer modeler, Andrew Weaver of the University of Victoria, in explaining his reluctance to publicly debate the question of global warming on a CBC radio program, has written:

There is no such debate in the atmospheric or climate scientific community, and … making the public believe that such a debate exists is precisely the goal of the denial industry. (Keeping Our Cool, p. 22)

Why not debate with climate skeptics? Why not crush the abstruse doubts, cavils and objections, as Huxley did many times in publicly debating opponents of Darwin?

For example, in 1860, in one of the most famous debates in the history of science, Huxley demolished the arguments of Anglican Bishop Samuel Wilberforce, who was defending religious doctrine against Darwin’s theory of evolution. Huxley’s attitude wasn’t, like Weaver’s and Gore’s, “I’m right, the other side is wrong, and therefore I don’t need to debate them.” Huxley knew the public needed to hear both sides, not just one, to make up its mind.

For his part, Bishop Wilberforce must have felt he shouldn’t have to defend what he considered immutable religious truth against the upstart scientific heretics. Yet, unlike Weaver, Gore, and most others in the climate consensus, Wilberforce had the courage to publicly debate his views.

Why don’t Gore, Weaver, et al., feel the same need to put their “truths” to the public test? Perhaps because they fear that they and the climate orthodoxy would lose the debate, and quite rightly. The few times warming believers have publicly debated skeptics, the believers have lost.(2,3)

The facts must fit the theory

An inductive hypothesis is said to be demonstrated when the facts are shown to be in entire accordance with it [italics added].

Science and the Hebrew Tradition, “Lectures on Evolution III,” p. 132

What would Huxley think of the claim that the anthropogenic global warming hypothesis is based on empirical facts (i.e., is an inductive hypothesis), when the facts no longer support (are no longer in “entire accordance with”) that hypothesis? Probably not much given that, despite increasing levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, the planet has not warmed since at least 2001 and perhaps earlier than that.(4)

Theory must account for previous experience

The more a statement of fact conflicts with previous experience, the more complete must be the evidence which is to justify us in believing it.

Hume, p. 158

figure-1

What is the planet’s “previous experience” in terms of carbon dioxide and temperature? The geological evidence of the past 600 million years shows the relationship between carbon dioxide and temperature is tenuous at best (see Figure 1. The black line is carbon dioxide; the blue line is temperature).

Note particularly 450 million years ago, when the earth’s temperature was as cold as today’s-i.e., the earth was in an Ice Age-while carbon dioxide levels were more than 10 times today’s levels. Clearly, high levels of CO2 weren’t keeping the planet warm then.

There are other periods, such as 100 million years ago, when the temperature remained high but carbon dioxide fell. If, as consensus climate science claims, carbon dioxide is the main driver of climate, why didn’t the temperature start to fall until tens of millions of years after CO2 did?

The consensus view, which closely links high carbon dioxide levels and high temperatures, had no validity in “previous experience” (the geological past). Why should we accept that view now?

Science must be able to predict phenomena

.

The true mark of a theory is without doubt its ability to predict phenomena.

– Science and Hebrew Tradition, “On the Method of Zadig,” p. 20

Huxley didn’t pen these words, although he heartily approved of them. They were written in 1822 by Baron Georges Cuvier (1769-1832), one of the founders of biological classification, and have been repeated by philosophers of science every since.(5) To be valid, a scientific hypothesis must be able to predict phenomena. An hypothesis that can’t make valid predictions is guesswork, not science.

So what would Huxley (much less Cuvier) say of the failure of climate computer models to predict the flat-lining of temperatures over the past decade?figure-2

Figure 2 shows the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s predictions for the next two decades in red, orange and yellow. The blue and green lines show the actual temperatures as measured by Britain’s Hadley Institute and the University of Alabama at Huntsville climate monitoring centres.

Figure 3 shows the predictions of climate alarmist James Hansen in 1988. The blue line is Hansen’s scary Scenario A prediction; the orange line is the actual temperature. The only point of contact between the two is 1998, the year of an unusually strong El Nino warming.

Both predictions-indeed, all of the consensus climate model predictions without exception-have been higher than observed temperatures.figure-3

But, then, the IPCC itself said, in its 2001 report: “In climate research and modelling, we should recognize that we are dealing with a coupled non-linear chaotic system, and therefore that the long-term prediction of future climate states is not possible.”(6)

Extreme claims require extreme proof

.

It is a canon of common sense, to say nothing of science, that the more improbable a supposed occurrence, the more cogent ought to be the evidence in its favor.

Science and the Christian Tradition, “An Episcopal Trilogy,” p. 135

Huxley addressed, a century ago, the question of how much credence we should place in extreme claims of the type that Gore, Hansen, Weaver, and others present as scientific fact.

Not much, if we are also to believe astronomer Carl Sagan, who has written, in the same vein: “Apocalyptic predictions require, to be taken seriously, higher standards of evidence than do assertions on other matters where the stakes are not as great”(7). Sagan’s comment often appears online as “extreme claims require extreme proof,” but Huxley said it first.

Among these extreme claims is Andrew Weaver’s ominous prediction of a “sixth extinction” that will wipe out “between 40 per cent and 70 per cent of the world’s species” should the global temperature rise above 3.3 degrees Celsius” (a rise that is, for Weaver, entirely humanity’s fault) (Keeping Our Cool, p. 218). He has also called for a complete ban on fossil-fuel use.(8)

Hansen warns of sea level rises of five metres in the next century, 20 metres over the next 400 years (New Scientist, July 25, 2007). And, of course, we should all be familiar with Gore’s apocalyptic predictions (New York under water soon, no Arctic ice by 2014, etc.) if we fail to follow his draconian political and economic program.

Curiously, at least so far, none-not one-of the environmentalists’ apocalyptic predictions, from Thomas Malthus to Paul Ehrlich (mass starvation in the 1970s) to Suzuki, Weaver and Gore, has come to pass.

Or, as the CBC’s Rex Murphy notes:

So much of what the alarmists promised was supposed to be happening now isn’t happening. So many events are running counter to their near-term projections, they’ve decided to go all Armageddon with their long-term ones, projections for a future that none of us will be around to check.(9)

By any standard, the claims of Gore, Weaver, Hansen, et al., are extreme. Yet we are expected to accept these extreme claims with very little public debate, scrutiny, or criticism (after all, the debate is settled and the climate scientists are the experts), and based on almost no empirical evidence (unless mathematical models are considered the equivalent of empirical evidence).

Instead, climate alarmists abandon scientific principles of evidence, fall back on the precautionary principle (if it could happen we must act as if it will happen)(10), and try to silence anyone asking for proof more convincing than the flawed predictions of computer models.

Science doesn’t operate by consensus

My love of my fellow-countrymen has led me to reflect, with dread, on what will happen to them, if any of the laws of nature ever become so unpopular in their eyes, as to be voted down by the transcendent authority of universal suffrage.

Science and Christian Tradition, p. 252

Huxley was worried that citizens would decide to vote against, for example, the laws of gravity. Undoubtedly, he would be equally concerned if scientists declared that a scientific assertion was true because, after a vote, a majority of them had agreed it was so, i.e., proof by “consensus.”

Just as a vote of citizens doesn’t make a scientific fact true or false, neither does a vote of scientists make a fact true or false. Only empirical evidence does that. And the empirical evidence for anthropogenic warming isn’t there.

Dealing with absurdity

When you cannot prove that people are wrong, but only that they are absurd, the best course is to let them alone.

Science and Hebrew Tradition, “On the Method of Zadig,” p. 13

It would be nice to leave the consensus climate alarmists alone. After all, the hypothesis that anthropogenic gases might cause warming is not unreasonable. It may even be true, although so far the evidence (or lack of it) argues otherwise.

What takes consensus climate science into Huxley’s realm of absurdity is its dogmatic insistent that all other hypotheses are not just wrong, but so wrong that they should not be debated or, better, not even heard by the public or other scientists.

Moreover, the consensus climate science alarmists, and their environmentalist supporters, refuse to leave the rest of us alone. Instead, they wish to impose economy-crippling measures based on a global-warming hypothesis that becomes more and more surreal with each year that warming does not occur.

Conclusion

So, how well does consensus climate science meet Huxley’s conditions for real science?

Huxley: Scientific certainty does not exist. Consensus climate science: The evidence is so overwhelming there’s no need to discuss it any further.

Huxley: A strong theory must be “in entire accordance” with the data. Consensus climate science: Dismiss data (such as the current cooling) that doesn’t fit the theory (the planet should be warming).

Huxley: Data not in accord with previous experience should be regarded with suspicion. Consensus climate science: Ignore previous experience (such as the geological record showing little correlation between carbon dioxide and temperature) if it doesn’t fit the theory.

Huxley: Theories must be able to predict accurately. Consensus climate science: Nothing, so far, predicted accurately.

Huxley: Extreme claims require extreme proof. Consensus climate science: If the proof doesn’t exist, fall back on the precautionary principle.

Huxley: Science doesn’t operate by consensus. Consensus climate science: Yes, it does.

How, we might wonder, would Huxley fare in a public debate with consensus climate believers like Al Gore, James Hansen, or Andrew Weaver, assuming they had the courage to take him on?

As Bishop Wilberforce discovered, they wouldn’t know what hit them.

Notes

1. Barbara Kay, “David Suzuki vs. Michael Crichton.” National Post, Feb. 21, 2007.

2. See, for example, Marc Sheppard’s “No wonder climate extremists refuse to debate” at http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/04/no_wonder_climate_alarmists_re.html. For a list of the few debates that have occurred, and their outcomes, see Climate Depot, http://www.climatedepot.com/a/39/Climate-Depotrsquos-Morano-debates-Global-Warming-with-former-Clinton-Admin-Official-Romm.

3. Losing a debate to skeptic Marc Morano prompted Joe Romm to write, in his blog Climate Progress: “While science and logic are powerful systematic tools for understanding the world, they are no match in the public realm for the 25-century-old art of verbal persuasion: rhetoric.” To say that consensus climate scientists like David Suzuki, Andrew Weaver and James Hansen, much less ex-politician Al Gore, don’t have the rhetorical skills to match the skeptics is absurd. What Romm lacks, what consensus science lacks, and what Bishop Wilberforce lacked, is an argument that makes sense.

4. Meteorologist Richard Lindzen argues that the most recent cycle of global warming ended in 1995. See the Watts Up With That website, http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/03/30/lindzen-on-negative-climate-feedback.

5. Georges Cuvier, Recherches sur les Ossemens., Paris: Chez G. Dufour et d’Ocagne, Libraires, 1822, p. 292.

6. Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, Climate Change 01, Chapter 14, Advancing Our Understanding, Section 14.2.2.2.

7. Carl Sagan, “Nuclear War and Climatic Catastrophe: Some Policy Implications,” Foreign Affairs, Winter 1983/84, pp. 257-258.

8. Andrew Weaver, “Environmentalists’ are abandoning science.” Vancouver Sun, March 24, 2009.

9. Rex Murphy, “Armageddon theory: Vancouver,” Toronto Globe and Mail, Jan. 10, 2009.

10. For example, environmental writer Jonathan Schell has written: “Now, in a widening sphere of decisions, the costs of error are so exorbitant that we need to act on theory alone. It follows that the reputation of scientific prediction needs to be enhanced” [italics added]. “Our Fragile Earth,” Discover, Oct., 1987, p. 47.

Works Cited

Huxley, T.H., Hume: With Helps to the Study of Berkeley. New York. D. Appleton, 1896.

Huxley, T.H., Science and Christian Tradition. New York, D. Appleton, 1896.

Huxley, T.H., Science and  Hebrew Tradition. New York: D. Appleton, 1896.

Weaver, Andrew, Keeping Our Cool: Canada in a Warming World. Toronto: Viking Canada, 2008.

Paul MacRae is a former editor with the Toronto Globe and Mail and former editorial writer and editor with the Victoria Times Colonist. He teaches professional writing at the University of Victoria and is currently finishing a book on global warming entitled False Alarm: Why Almost Everything We’ve Been Told About Global Warming is Misleading, Exaggerated, or Plain Wrong. His blogsite is: paulmacrae.com.

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Douglas DC
April 17, 2009 7:06 am

Flanagan 01:44:46 <>
“It would be like saying “OK, only 90% of researchers in the field believe quantum mechanics to be a correct description of the microscopic world. So let’s stop all research and development projects based on it, cause there might be a faint probability that what we predict is not correct”.
“At that rate, we would still be living in caves…”
No we’d stil be paying indulgences to the Papal construction of the Sistine Chapel.
Not unlike our Carbon Indulg..er, offsets today,except Algore adds a new room to his
home or over hauls an Engine on his G-V.Oh,one other thing another figure from that era,Galileo-was keelhauled for violating-Concencus-by the Papal-“scientists”…

MattB
April 17, 2009 7:18 am

Nothing is a sure bet… every single aspect of science as we know it is up for grabs pending the next breakthrough… in light of this governments would never make any science policy because there is doubt. This is simply not practical is it folks?
There has never been a mainstream science position that has not been fought for tooth and nail against opposing developing viewpoints… and for every Galileo there have probably been a good few thousand complete loons. But nomatter what the resistance the science ALWAYS WINS in the end. well that is to say that some counter view becomes consensus, and inevitably in a few years it is also shown to be pretty much flawed in some way and improved on.
I seriously doubt that any AGW scientist would suggest that there is no possibility that it is not CO2… but the current science – despite exagerrated opposition – says it is and that is what policy makers will follow and rightly so… think of every non-mainstream crackpot loon theory you could swear is true by researching on the interwebs? Would you prefer that people only made policy based on those after all eventually one of them WILL be correct???
Your first step is to ditch the crackpots and only adopt pure science. Every day on blogs of a similar nature to this some random science from some random “scientist” from some un peer reviewd source, or E&E, is lauded as the nail in the coffin of AGW… even though it probably totally contradicts the last nail in the coffin. Opponenets of AGW have som many divergent theories that nearly all of them MUST be wrong… but no one sees that they all get lapped up…
It is not Watt’s fault that a lot of the skeptics are in fact total fruitcakes, and the same can be said for many warmists, but it does not change the science,, and although consensus is not science… science never becomes policy until it usurps the pretender.. the king is dead! Long live the King!
*rant over* 🙂

DAV
April 17, 2009 7:19 am

Patrik (23:53:39) : The basic assumption that anything more complex than coin tossing och dice throwing can be predicted over time, using statistics, is flawed. It’s very hard to find real life phenomena (other than coin tossing and dice throwing) that are easily studied based on the laws of probability.
Yet nearly all of your firsthand understanding about how the world works is statistical in nature.
Anyway, to be able to study phenomena in this way, one first must have an almost complete understanding of the phenomena in detail.
Not really. You don’t need deep understanding to suppose the sun will rise tomorrow after setting tonight. Previous civilizations reached this conclusion using faulty understanding to boot. You may argue that is from observation but nearly all models rely upon statistical premises for prediction.
The general assumption made by many people today, that statistics is a scientific discipline is totally wrong.Science is only that which can be proven by repeated experiments. Statistics and mathematics are in this way non-scientific, neither can be proven. You could of course try to prove that 1+1=2 by putting two apples on a table – but how on earth will You prove that there are in fact two apples?
Depends on whether they are apples or oranges. 😉 You are mixing math with observation and further implying that mathematics is provable by observation. Placing two apples on a table does not prove the conjecture that 1+1 always equals 2. At best it shows it can happen once. Incidentally, one does not, in fact cannot, prove a definition. “Two” has a definition. There are two apples by definition.
Science and mathematics arrive at conclusions by effectively opposite means. You’ve got it backwards. It is science which is unprovable simply because you can never be certain that the next observation will not completely contradict all preceding ones. Mathematics, on the other hand, is provable with every proof traceable to the initial assumptions. Statistics is a branch of mathematics (although some mathematicians may argue otherwise).

MattB
April 17, 2009 7:20 am

p.s. guys just read the wikipedia on DDT… you could only conclude that reduction in use has cased massive deaths by totally ignoring science… which I admit is not unusual for many people.. pick the science that backs up your politics and prejudices… I guess everyone does that no matter what side of the fence you sit on though.

Richard Heg
April 17, 2009 7:23 am

farmersteve (06:56:46) :
“The contrast between the cows and the humans is
Real cows would admit they do not understand.
Oh, and the cows taste better.”
I dont want to know how you know that!

Alex
April 17, 2009 7:24 am

Simon brings up a very good OT point.
More solar bias it seems.
This would definately be an excellent topic for investigation, due to the conflict about the August 08 “spot”, the April/March “spots” and likely future conflict because of the strange illusions of things popping up (or at least appearing to be popping up) on the sun during this strange minimum.

April 17, 2009 7:30 am

jamie wrote: “…This man is an airline industry shill! The science is settled! STOP ALL AIR TRAVEL!”
This is certainly what Caroline Lucas of the UK Green Party wants.
Caroline Lucas, the leader of the Green Party, suggested that travellers who regularly jet off to the Costas are threatening the lives of others – and do as much damage as thugs who stab people in the street.
Ms Lucas, who is also a Member of the European Parliament, made the controversial comment during a televised ITV debate about plans for a proposed third runway at Heathrow. She also hit out ‘binge flying’ and people who have second homes abroad.
When asked if flying to Spain was as bad as knifing a person in the street, Ms Lucas said: ‘Yes – because they are dying from climate change.’

Robinson
April 17, 2009 7:31 am

“When do laudable ends justify draconian, even ruinous means? Did winning WWII justify Dresden and Hiroshima? Could the end have been achieved with less horrific means? Hard to say, even in retrospect.”
Yes, but I fear you’re falling into the same trap as the warmists, i.e. you are basing predictions of future dire consequences on the status quo as it is today (you remember the old prediction about New York city being waist high in horse manure in the year 2,000 if the growth in the number of people using horses didn’t stop?). For example, consider that given government policy, more investment will go into alternative energy sources (whatever they may be), some of which haven’t even been thought of yet, energy efficiency (home insulation, reduced power consumption of devices, things like that) and other such innovations that are driven by the current Zeitgeist.
It isn’t hard to see that many of these things are beneficial in themselves and not just in the context or CO2 reduction. You should also imagine the trillion dollar per annum balance of payments transfer reduction you’ll get and factor that into the equation (not to mention the political advantage of not having to suck up to oil rich regimes in places like the middle east).
Now my standard disclaimer comes in here: I don’t use fossil fuels – that I know of – I use electricity that may or may not have been generated with fossil fuels of course, so I have no dog in this race at all, apart from an interest in Science and the integrity of the Scientific Process. That is my beef with AGW – but I can see the benefits of reducing fossil fuel use. Surely many of you sceptics feel the same way?
With respect to Draconian measures, they will be easily thwarted by the electorate. People vote on the economy; that is pretty much the single biggest issue for politicians. When the taxes start rising, the voters will start to get angry. The only question is this: will the balance of payments and technological innovation benefits balance out the economic effects of carbon taxation? Who knows.
Either way, lets not bandy about absurd predictions of the future, from either side, because they make us all look stupid.

Dave Middleton
April 17, 2009 7:34 am

Basically…Proponents of AGW are left with one arrow in their quiver…
Consensus climate science: If the proof doesn’t exist, fall back on the precautionary principle.
A bit more modern read than Huxley would be Thomas Kuhn’s Structure of Scientific Revolutions.
I wonder if the geosciences are somewhat unique in the fact that the philosophy of science pays a very large role in our educations…Steno’s Law of Superposition, Chamberlin’s Method of Multiple Working Hypotheses, The Principle of Non-Uniqueness, Lyell’s and Hutton’s theories and even Occam’s Razor are very philosophical in nature.
Geologists tend to correlate data and then try to figure out what happened in the past…Rather than fitting the data to the ruling theory. Chamberlin’s Method of Multiple Working Hypotheses is particularly important in the geosciences because of non-uniqueness…
http://geology.about.com/od/history_of_geology/a/aa_geothinking.htm
Climate science is probably at least an order of magnitude more prone to non-uniqueness than geology is…Yet the climate science consensus is nothing more than an application of the Method of the Ruling Theory rather than Multiple Working Hypotheses.
Great article! Thanks the Anthony and WUWT for posting it!

Flanagan
April 17, 2009 7:48 am

– A survey was conducted in 2003 by Dennis Bray and Hans von Storch. The survey received 530 responses from 27 different countries. It indicates a 72% to 20% endorsement of the IPCC reports as accurate, and a 15% to 80% rejection of the thesis that “there is enough uncertainty about the phenomenon of global warming that there is no need for immediate policy decisions.”
– In 2007, Harris Interactive surveyed 489 randomly selected members of either the American Meteorological Society or the American Geophysical Union for the Statistical Assessment Service (STATS) . The survey found 84% say they personally believe human-induced warming is occurring, and 74% agree that “currently available scientific evidence” substantiates its occurrence. Only 5% believe that that human activity does not contribute to greenhouse warming.
So, obviously researchers in the field think there is enough certainty to do something. Why do all these bloggers think they’re actually better informed and have a better vision on the climatologic system than those guys?

Joel Shore
April 17, 2009 7:51 am

hunter says:

While, allegedly, 97% of climate scientists think global warming is real, I would like to know how many think that a global catastrophe is on the way?

Well, here is a poll taken last year by a reputable polling organization: http://stats.org/stories/2008/global_warming_survey_apr23_08.html Their method of distinguishing climate scientists (by looking at people listed in the American Men and Women of Science who listed an affiliation in the AMS or AGU) is quite imperfect, and I think that this would probably tend to result in a larger proportion of skeptical views in the poll (since, for example, a larger proportional forecast meteorologists like Anthony tend to be much more skeptical of AGW than climate scientists actively publishing in the field). Here are the results in regards to dangers:
* 41% of scientists believe global climate change will pose a very great danger to the earth in the next 50 to 100 years
* Another 44% rate climate change as moderately dangerous
* Only 13% see relatively little danger.
It is also interesting to note that 64% see “The Inconvenient Truth” as being a very reliable (26%) or somewhat reliable (38%) source of information on global warming, which is better than any traditional news source and much better than Michael Crichton’s “State of Fear” (which less than 1% consider very reliable; they don’t say what percentage consider it somewhat reliable).

Mrs Whatsit
April 17, 2009 7:52 am

Robinson wrote, “The whole debate is about utility, not truth. I would have thought most people here recognised that fact a long time ago. … As to the ends, lets hope that our technocracy (driven as it is by Science and Scientists) will not end up too badly squashed by the irrationality of the catastrophists.
I fully agree with you, though I can think of other political ends just as well-served by AGW as reducing US dependence on fossil fuels. And I agree with you that the outcome of this brouhaha could be awful. In the US at least, there is already a widespread loss of confidence in scientific reasoning as a basis for decision-making and a shift toward fear-based emotionalism. Witness the anti-vaccination craze as just one example. I worry about how that shift may accelerate into complete rejection of all confidence in science if and when people realize that the “97%” of scientists who they have been told are foretelling apocalypse are wrong.
Notice I said “if,” not just “when”. The more I learn about how little even the best-informed of our experts know about how our climate works, the more agnostic I become about anyone’s ability to predict much of anything in that realm.

Gary
April 17, 2009 7:54 am

[snip – religion -evolution posts not allowed here, sorry]

DAV
April 17, 2009 7:55 am

Richard Heg (07:23:34) : farmersteve (06:56:46) : Oh, and the cows taste better.” I dont want to know how you know that!
Come, come, now! Did you seriously think killing babies with those “Coal Trains of Death” was just for fun?

Richard Sharpe
April 17, 2009 8:08 am

[snip – religion -evolution posts not allowed here, sorry]

Joel Shore
April 17, 2009 8:13 am

[snip – religion -evolution posts not allowed here, sorry]

kim
April 17, 2009 8:13 am

Joel 07:51:11
You might also note that successive polls over the last few years show growing skepticism among the public that CO2 is the threat that is portrayed in ‘An Inconvenient Truth’. Face it, the paradigm of CO2=AGW is collapsing in the face of cooling temperatures and spreading knowledge of climate science. Please, give up the hoax sooner rather than later, and spend your energies on discovering what is the true sensitivity of climate to CO2. It would be useful to know that. It’s not particularly useful to continue to defend a sham and a chimera.
===============================================

April 17, 2009 8:15 am

well, we are now tied with the 10th longest spotless streak since 1849. we have had 40 straight days without an official spot, tying the streak set from November 26, 1901 to January 4, 1902. wow!

John G
April 17, 2009 8:17 am

The question of whether we should take action on a scientific theory like AGW is only loosely attached to how certain we are the theory is correct. We can assume the theory is 100% correct and still not take action if the cost of the action exceeds the benefits derived therefrom. That’s Bjorn Lomborg’s argument. It costs more than the worth of the benefit derived and the money could be better spent elsewhere. His is not a hard argument to make. To seriously curtail global warming given it is caused by man generated CO2 might require us to return to the individual carbon footprint of a typical human of 1809 (roughly . . . can’t remember where I saw the analysis or exactly how much of a reduction of CO2 that entails). That would certainly cost more lives and hardship and make us worse off than adapting to a hotter climate. On the other hand we might take action on nothing more than a worry if it is a cheap and convenient, e.g. I’m pretty sure I get plenty of vitamins from my diet but I take vitamins anyway.

kim
April 17, 2009 8:18 am

Robinson 07:31:31
We can take care of your balance of payments problem, and the geopolitical implications of sourcing energy outside of our borders by using our own bountiful energy resources. Also, so far as the technological benefits of alternate energy go, the best way to bring those about is through a free market, which will eventually price hydrocarbons out of the energy markets. Subsidies and mandates can only bring hardships, inequities, and inefficiencies.
======================================

kim
April 17, 2009 8:22 am

MattB 7:18:59
Current science is NOT demonstrating the correctness of the CO2=AGW paradigm. Current journalism and politics still support it, but the science, represented most elegantly by the simple thermometer is disconfirming it daily. Please stop using the Argument to Incorrect Authorities. It’s had its day and the sun has set upon it.
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Patrik
April 17, 2009 8:32 am

Mike McMillan (03:20:14)>>
Sorry, I’m Swedish. 🙂
Bad excuse for not knowing greek from latin, but hey. 😉

Flanagan
April 17, 2009 8:43 am

[snip – Flanagan stop that crap or find another blog to haunt – Anthony]

MattB
April 17, 2009 8:45 am

kim – I’m not… I’m not saying consensus makes warmists like me correct, just that you can;t expect politics to act against the overwhelming consensus. and if you are right based on what you think is the current science, then I give it 5 years MAX until AGW is thrown out of the window by every major scientific body in the world. That is how science works… seriously could you ask for better than that? It is poetry in motion. Science does not suffer fools, and not many scientists will lose much sleep about changing their position when confronted with evidence – it is their life’s focus after all. These guys would not consider pursuing the changing “truth” of science as even forcing them to contradict themselves –

Joel Shore
April 17, 2009 8:47 am

[snip – religion -evolution- topics not allowed here, sorry]