Joe Bast responds to Dr. Judith Curry's post on Heartland

NICE POLITE ANSWER MR. BAST, YOU DID YOURSELF PROUD – Keep fighting for all of us that desire good fact based science on all items before we destroy our economic base in America like the EPA – Endangered Species Act did with our raw material through value added manufacturing sector. Cutting 5 million blue collar middle class manufacturing and mining jobs.

Latitude:
More like this, “Thanks to Peter Gleick’s misguided zealotry and subsequent fall from grace, Heartland had a unique opportunity to capitalize on public consternation and indeed sympathy. Sorry, the 37 m Americans were already watching from February onwards! Unfortunately, this potential for a continued outpouring of good will was squandered by running a tasteless ad campaign comparing proponents of AGW with the Unabomber.”
Good that Bast pulled the billboard after a day, and understandable that he was caught up into the fistfight in the first place. Too bad he doesn’t just leave well enough alone and write it off as poor judgement in the heat of battle.
Two wrongs really do not make a right.
Kurt in Switzerland

This is one of the reasons they have changed the topic – again. Climate change and it’s predecessors have been thrown under the bus and replaced with saving species. This will be the theme for Rio+20. Obama just made note of it also.
Apparently some of the better known skeptic’s will be “Occupying” the festivities. Should be fun. 😉
UN says case for saving species ‘more powerful than climate change’
http://www.climatedepot.com/a/16005/Time-for-Next-EcoScare-Obama-follows-lead-of-green-movement-and-demotes-global-warming-UN-now-says-case-for-saving-species-more-powerful-than-climate-change

Curry has finally got off the fence and nailed her colours to the mast. Personally, I’m not too surprised at what they were …
Pointman

“Accomplishes nothing besides further polarizing. Is that what you want? Really?”
(ignoring the $5 million in earned media, and DJ Hawkins pointed out)
Yes, actually. This is now a binary political fight – there is no middle ground anymore, there is no hope of achieving any kind of “consensus” with our opponents. There is only the sorting of the two opposing sides and then the fight to see who wins, and who loses. That’s what this game is about now.
I see you’re Swiss, it’s kind of like what the EU has to decide right now – they either have to start up the Euro printing presses to bail all the debtors out and keep Greece in, or they have to defend the currency and throw Greece out. The middle ground is gone, there is no “3rd way” in between those two very hard choices. It’s either / or, and all the wishing in the world won’t change that.
We are in a fight where one side is right, and one side is wrong. That’s where the polarization comes from.

Have you not heard of gumboot diplomacy?

A good response, and I wish Heartland well. Thanks for the online presentations.
The end does not justify the means re: the billboard saga. It seems like it was a knee jerk reaction that was out of character, though it was understandable under the circumstances. I hope lessons will be learned from it rather than just taking an arrogant “it was right” kind of stand. It takes a long time to build up credibility and only one second to lose it.

wws, Switzerland is in Europe, but not in the European Union (probably a good move on their part). Unfortunately, the (unelected) folks in Brussels will probably find a third way, even if
it’s just waiting things out….
The sad part about the billboard is that the point was valid, but the people it was aimed at
are probably a little too thick to get it (considering that they have their wagons circled
around “consensus”)…

I wondered at the stupidity of the global warmer supporters when they drew so much attention to the billboard. Didn’t they realise how much free publicity they were giving Heartland?
No doubt the tactic worked.
Parody of Churchill quote,coined by Anthony Eden:
“Never has so much been surrendered by so many, to so few.”
It’s amazing to think how much people have given up, or had taken from them in the name of climate change.
Personally I think the war has already been lost, and I am not talking about climate change.

“If you look at the peer reviewed scientific literature, the debate is over.” Al Gore
The AGW proponents have long since left behind the possibility of engaging in intelligent consideration of scientific data.
“War is merely the continuation of policy by other means.” Carl von Clausewitz

Judith Curry’s article is very disappointing, and Joe Bast’s response is a right.
I have not been disappointed about the billboard. It is a political battle and the other side tries as hard as they can. By showing simple facts in dramatic pictures, we do not fabricate anything, what is not true. When they scream, something was done the right way. Ross McKittrick should reconsider …

“The billboard, which cost $200, generated more than $5 million in earned media so far, and that figure doesn’t include television, radio, and tens of millions of page visits and online commentaries.”
That billboard shocked many because it signaled that Heartland had allowed itself to be dragged into an advocacy mud pond. Once you’re in that pond, you can forget about regaining an image of “high minded seekers of truth for its own sake” and attracting those who abhor mud. When a $5 million return on a $200 investment becomes your sole standard of judgement, better get accustomed to the color “brown”.

I must say, however I didn’t like the Heartland billboard, they are right – there’s little point to be trying to be fair in a debate if the other side isn’t playing fair too. And it definitely got attention.
But I still don’t like it.

Here’s a funny video of the guy with the boot on his head.

You know, I understand the upset and anger from the skeptics over the Unabomber ad. I sympathize with your position. It seems to lower us to the level of the AGW propagandists. It’s a fair concern. And one not to be dismissed lightly.
But I think it ended up being a brilliant propaganda move for our side. It was run for one day, right? And Heartland explained very clearly afterwards what the intent was. What the point was. And I think they made their point. Fabulously.
Has Heartland received a lot of negative press? Yup. Are they being branded as extremists and “haters”? Yup.
But how is that any different than what has already been happening over the last few years? Did the ad really make things any worse?
The world is filled with people looking for a reason to be upset. Filled with people looking for a reason to be outraged. Filled with people who absolutely know that they are our betters, and are willing, at the drop of the rhetorical hat, to let everyone know that blindingly obvious fact. Filled with people who are willing to use character assassination, legal loopholes, and outright theft to advance their “greater good.” Particularly the self-appointed guardians of Gaia. And their self-awareness and sense of irony is so profoundly lacking as to be non-existent.
Which was really the point of the ad. We have been demonized for years by these jackasses. Years. Our reputations have been trashed; our careers jeopardized; our families threatened; etc. We have been the butt of horrible jokes. We have been compared to Hitler, rapists, child murderers….
The Unabomber ad was a shot across the bow. Enough is enough. We have to start fighting fire with fire. Does that mean breaking the law, as they have managed to do on numerous occasions? No. Does it mean lying? Absolutely not. But it does mean, among other things, fighting the propaganda war that they started in a way that is effective. To “hit back twice as hard”, to quote one of their icons.
It’s time to shove their sh*t back in their faces. We are at war. AGW is just one of the fronts. But it is a critical one, as it involves so many huge international governmental agencies that would love nothing more than to collect yet more money and power to exert over all of our lives. The perfect vehicles through which the nannyists can accumulate more control.
Sorry for the rant. I hope you leave it up, Anthony. I think this is important, and needs to be said.
Repeatedly. We have to fight back. We have to be ruthless.

Noelene, after reading about Biffra’s Yamal data manipulations, I have to say that I don’t think it ever was about science.

nukemhill: Standing Ovation!

You can’t really blame Dr Curry she does hang out in one of the most biased parts of US society, Academia.
Shame she did not have 2 minutes to send an e-mail though.

nukemhill says:
May 25, 2012 at 11:39 am
“…….Which was really the point of the ad. We have been demonized for years by these jackasses. Years. Our reputations have been trashed; our careers jeopardized; our families threatened; etc. We have been the butt of horrible jokes. We have been compared to Hitler, rapists, child murderers….”
nukemhill,
Well said, Sir!
‘ I’m mad as hell… and I’m not going to take it any more!’
Does that about sum it up?
MtK

Personally, I think Dr Curry is a little too ambiguous or non-commital with her stance. Obviously, there is probably a case for not wanting to bite the hand that feeds her (?) – but even so, I’d like to think any real scientist would rather starve (metaphorically speaking) than have their name attached to false or bad science. If we stick to straightforward scientific proof (of CAGW I mean) there should be no scientists on the alarmist side! Ok, the ‘fencesitters’ are perhaps more acceptable, as ‘some’ AGW is always possible BUT it is exactly these folks who should be shouting the loudest – instead of sitting in the wings with their heads down! It is ‘science’ that is being abused in the CAGW scam. For my money, anyone directly involved with perpetuating the scam should be dishonoured – for example, any scientist who has published works using the known sham data like Briffa’s Yamal stuff – they are a disgrace for NOT checking sources, etc, etc..
just sayin……

Luboš Motl put up a post on the billboard kerfufflle a few weeks ago that is worth reading:
http://motls.blogspot.com/2012/05/kaczynski-heartland-billboard-wasnt.html
A commenter earlier in the month indicated she or he would appreciate a humorous approach. I agree. It is hard to go wrong when you make people laugh.

Luther Wu, Carrie, sunshinehours1, wws and others who “adore the billboard”:
No, this is not about the sensitivities of your arch enemies. I’m thinking about the vast majority of people who “generally believe there is a climate problem associated with atmospheric CO2 and that it is generally a good idea to drastically restrict humans’ emissions of GHG.”
Most people are not in this trench warfare as is Joe Bast. And they will respond negatively to attacks which are tasteless. They still “trust scientists.” The MSM are watching. Copying egregious errors of the proponents of AGW will not win you any points from the very important “undecided.” I don’t care if Al Gore and David Suzuki are behaving like fools themselves. Let them.
Tallbloke’s assertion that Goldenberg’s representation about the meaning of the billboard was a lie (parsing the term “scientists” with “believers of CO2 controlled climate”) is really only a nuance, which will be missed by 99+%. The Billboard raised emotions, for sure … but the wrong ones.
Sorry, I’m with Ross McKitrick and Donna Laframboise on this one.
I’m more interested in reading about Goldenberg’s claim that Gleick was exonerated of forgery (since Steven Mosher’s keen eye flushed out Gleick as the forger in the first place, which led him to admit to impersonation, identity theft, etc.)! Andy Revkin of NYT Dot Earth reported that Gleick’s former institute hadn’t drawn any conclusions (two days after Goldenberg’s article claiming Gleick was cleared [of forgery] by an investigation/review), which leads one to conclude that the Guardian was quite careless to publish the article. (Not that I’m particularly surprised about that).
Kurt in Switzerland

Noelene says:
May 25, 2012 at 11:07 am
….. Personally I think the war has already been lost, and I am not talking about climate change.
______________________________
Unfortunately I think you may be correct. The problem is they do not give up – EVER.
As an illustration.
American Consumers and Farmers have been fighting the World Trade Organization’s Animal ID and Traceability for almost a decade. The “Regulations” made it to the Federal register in Febuary of 2007 and got a resounding HECK NO! of over 5,000 comments (I read most of them) Did that stop them? Of course not. They tried again in March of 2009 and then again last winter. Each time getting a resounding NO! So now the “Ruling” is going to be fast tracked to president Obama to sign because the USDA “found” a mad cow.
Given how the USDA “Found” test results showing “Mad Sheep” and destroyed a herd owned by the Fallices (Fallice is the scientist who found that Sheep Scrapies did NOT caused Mad Cow disease much to the disgust of politicians) I find this very suspicious. Especially when a Freedom of Information Act show 400 tests were actually performed and ALL WERE NEGATIVE

…A few weeks later, Linda Faillace heard there was more information held by the USDA and used the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) to request the data. Two weeks after the request, the FOIA revealed four hundred negative results on sheep, including additional negative tests on the four sheep that Rubenstein and the USDA claimed were positive. Davis Buckley asked the court to force the USDA to surrender their entire file, which consisted of over 1,000 pages.” link

(Rubenstein “POSITIVES” were done at an unlicensed lab using an unproven test method. He was also a pal of the USDA agent.)
We also have the defeat of the Cap and Trade bill followed by the EPA ruling CO2 a pollutant anyway.
We now have a government run by a bureaucracy that is not even bothering to give lip service to Congress. A PRIMER ON MONEY: SUBCOMMITTEE ON DOMESTIC FINANCE. COMMITTEE ON BANKING AND CURRENCY documents how control of US money was wrested from the US government by the Federal Reserve by signing the “Accord” in 1951 and then going to the media with the “Story”. The President and Secretary of the Treasury who was in the hospital at the time had a different interpretation of the “Accord” (pg 103 – 107)
The government-industry revolving door puts industry-friendly experts in positions of decision-making power. is of course well known.

@ Kurt in Switzerland says:
May 25, 2012 at 12:41 pm
Luther Wu, Carrie, sunshinehours1, wws and others who “adore the billboard”:
No, this is not about the sensitivities of your arch enemies. I’m thinking about the vast majority of people who “generally believe there is a climate problem associated with atmospheric CO2 and that it is generally a good idea to drastically restrict humans’ emissions of GHG.”
******************************************************************************
Vast majority? I hope you have some reliable polling numbers for that statement. Last I heard the subject was last on the list of concerns. I doubt that the ‘vast majority’ have more than a nodding acquaintance with the subject at all.
Back up your claim, please.

Was the billboard successful?
Well it certainly is responsible for me comparing TK’s manifesto – with Mr Gores’. That is something I would not have researched on my own.

IMO MS Curry….did more harm to her scientific / research credibility by quoting Suzanne Goldenberg | The Guardian.
Ms Curry stated, in her defense, something like ” It was the only outlet covering Heartland at the time of my writing” [ not quoted verbatim – see her blog ]…..BUT Ms Curry, you used Suzanne Goldenberg | The Guardian to bolster your arguments.
C’mon!

I do not like Mud Slinging but it has been around in political fights for eons.
A History of Political Mudslinging and Character Assasssination
The Herman Cain campaign for president is a classic example in the recent press of just how effective mud slinging can be. Was there any truth to the accusations? Who the heck knows but $$$ can buy a lot of sexual harrassment accusations against a sixty year old guy especially if you do not have to prove anything in a court of law. Heck a major dislike of someone, few scruples and a media willing to pay for “tell -all” sound bites is all it takes.

Unforgettable Moments in Political Mudslinging
…Back in the 19th century, anonymous pamphlets wreaked havoc on politicians, much like comments left on today’s blogs. Then, as now, slurs centered on sexuality, origins and religion. And woe to the candidate with a funny-sounding name. Sometimes accusations were true, sometimes half-true, and often times as fanciful as unicorns. And they worked. One day a candidate was up, the next day, sayonora….

You can start with Andrew Jackson v. John Q. Adams go on to Lyndon B. Johnson v. Barry Goldwater, mud slinging has been around in this country’s politics from the beginning and unfortunately the nice guy often finishes last. However as the Elizabeth Dole v. Kay Haganmud slugfest shows you better not get caught in the lie or it will backfire on you.

Elizabeth Dole v. Kay Hagan
The 2008 US Senate race in North Carolina proves that women can be just as vicious as men in hitting below the belt. Or whatever. During the notorious battle between Republican incumbent Elizabeth Dole and challenger Kay Hagan, the Dole campaign hit upon a tactic that would surely take down her rival, who had been inching ahead in the polls. Hagan would be denounced as an atheist. An ad called “Godless Americans,” cooked up to target Hagan’s religion, featured a voice saying, “There is no God!” over a picture of the candidate’s face. The voice was not Hagan’s but the ad sure wanted you to think it was.
That was a sling too far for Hagan, who launched her own ad reminding voters that she was a Sunday school teacher. In the end, Dole’s repulsive ad backfired, and Hagan’s lead in polls doubled. “Godless Kay” beat Dole with a nine-point margin. http://www.alternet.org/election2012/154346/you're_an_atheist%2C_madam!_9_unforgettable_moments_in_political_mudslinging_/?page=3

The fact that Heartland is still the focus of such a concerted and ethically challenged effort to destroy it is evidence enough for me to suspect that they are still being quite effective, although it must be admitted that they never have nor likely never will amount to more than a flea on the back of a Bull Mastiff versus the CO2 demonization machine which has been so successful in embedding the Big Lie of Evil Carbon in the collective human consciousness that, even among the mostly skeptical crowd here, very few rise to challenge the implicit fallacy that reducing carbon is an unquestioned good. A seeming majority still cling to the naive notion that this civilizational war can only be won by maintaining our arguments within a cocoon of “scientific” purity.A view which requires ignoring the fact that among those most responsible for creating and maintaining the antiCO2 movement the science has always been a pretext and a distraction from their real plans.
Of course, actually accepting that fact will get you branded as a “conspiracy theorist” which is just another indication of how effective they have been at manipulating the language of the debate to suit their purposes. I have never been willing to call their plans a conspiracy because, to my mind, a conspiracy requires an effort to be covert and these folks have never made the slightest attempt to keep their true goals secret. They could be secure in their transparency knowing that every major path of information transmittal ( journalism, academia, and entertainment) was thoroughly dominated by like minded individuals and the only statements they made that would see the broad light of day would be the ones that they desired to do so. The Internet has assured that their strategizing efforts will always be accessible, but their multigenerational program to transform education has also assured that few will be left with the curiosity to seek them out.
That transformation of education is also why focusing on the science will never do much to curtail their plans. The notion of education as a system to develop the capacity for critical thought has been replaced by a system whose goal is the develop revolutionary consciousness. If you doubt this check out the works of Bill Ayres, Obama’s old mentor, who went from terrorist murderer to a leading light in educational philosophy and who is also utterly transparent about his goals. Goals he and his Weather Underground colleagues, most of whom who have not assumed room temp are now in academia, have been so successful at implementing that in recent years a number of graduate schools of Education have actually attempted to enforce a philosophical litmus test as a requirement of admission.
Polls about CAGW are notoriously unreliable, mostly because the language of the debate has been completely corrupted, but many recent ones suggest that doubts about the consensus view are moving to a majority position. But even if a large majority can be made to see that weakness, if they can’t be made to see, and more importantly actively resist, the harmful consequences of the regulatory despots and green subsidizers who have embedded themselves throughout human culture, winning the scientific battle will mean nothing because we will have lost the war. The real consequence of that loss will be the virtual elimination of any chance for humans to live in circumstances where they have any actual opportunity to live in real freedom.
I have long maintained that our Founders in accomplishing the American Revolution created what was and still is the only real revolution in human history. Throughout history and even today over most of the world the proper role of people vis a vis their governors was to be subjects. The men who drafted our Constitution sought to reverse that and make governance subject to its citizens. Recognizing that the will to power was of constant of human nature they constructed a structure with intricate checks and balance and sharply enumerated limits on government authority hoping restrain the natural human tendency toward despotism. The power hungry among us have been whittling away at that structure from the very beginning. We now have as President, a supposed Constitutional scholar, who believes those restraints were not the primary genius of the American experiment, but that they are a primary weakness. The forces of freedom have been engaged in a long delaying action for over a century, but recent years have turned the struggle into a philosophical version of Sherman’s march through Georgia. At this point I fear we have about as much chance of reversing the war between human freedom and despotism as the Confederates did of reclaiming their cause after Sherman but, if there is any hope, we are well past the moment where the gloves need to come off
The notion that those pushing the consensus cause deserve any kind of respect or deference is a nicety that we can no longer afford. Even if, in what seems to be a highly unlikely circumstance, they are sincere in what they choose to believe and espouse the solutions to this phony crisis that they are promoting are such a clear and present danger to the entire human community that they must be resisted by any and means available. Personally I am not all that hopeful that the task is achievable. Too many have already been assimilated by the environmental Borg, but even if “Resistance is Futile” I still think it is an effort we need to make.
Rant/off

@Gail Combs. Yes like a Trojan Horse, I suppose but it reminds me more of Aesop’s fable of the Scorpion and the Frog. In the end, the scorpion had to strike – it was its nature after all.
Pointman

Kurt in Switzerland is absolutely correct on this matter. I rarely find myself in complete agreement with anyone.
Most people care about the economy, their family and how they will make things better for all.
Global warming is a fringe interest. They have no knowledge of what is going on. They don’t need to; it’s not important to them (they think).
But guilt by association is dirty. It is not what people want to agree with. It is self-smearing.
Raise the profile of the issue by pointing out the fraud (Tiljander, Yamal, the fiddling of GISS). Do not raise irrelevancies like random nutters spouting rubbish.
The billboard lost the high ground.

Moby, is that you?

Dave Wendt says: @ May 25, 2012 at 1:
……The Internet has assured that their strategizing efforts will always be accessible, but their multigenerational program to transform education has also assured that few will be left with the curiosity to seek them out.
That transformation of education is also why focusing on the science will never do much to curtail their plans. The notion of education as a system to develop the capacity for critical thought has been replaced by a system whose goal is the develop revolutionary consciousness. If you doubt this check out the works of Bill Ayres, Obama’s old mentor, who went from terrorist murderer to a leading light in educational philosophy and who is also utterly transparent about his goals. Goals he and his Weather Underground colleagues, most of whom who have not assumed room temp are now in academia, have been so successful at implementing that in recent years a number of graduate schools of Education have actually attempted to enforce a philosophical litmus test as a requirement of admission….
_________________________________
About the demise of our educational system. A bit more on that: John Dewey (Fabian Socialist) started it over a century ago: http://www.ordination.org/dumbing_down.htm
We have now progressed to drugging anyone in school that is not a brain dead follower including our gifted children: see: http://www.scn.org/~bk269/r-ball.html
ESPECIALLY white males…

…..prevalence and treatment have been documented to vary by all three factors, with the highest rate of ADHD among 6- to 9-year-old white boys (LeFever et al., 1999; Safer & Zito, 1999; Safer et al., 1996). Safer (1999) has presented, although not published, data indicating that from the early to mid-1990s the rate of ADHD treatment (i.e., school-administered Ritalin) among white boys in Baltimore County elementary schools was over 15%. Failure to report more specific findings when they are available can distort patterns in ADHD care…. the study may have yielded an artificially low rate of ADHD and its treatment…. http://www.srmhp.org/0201/adhd.html

….The American Academy of Pediatrics reports as many as 3.8 million schoolchildren, mostly boys, have now been diagnosed with the newly-coined “ADHD” — attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder — a psychiatric “disease” with symptoms to which most of our grandparents would have responded by simply smiling: “Boys will be boys.” Or perhaps by asking, “Could it be that he finds your school boring? Does it really make sense to spend three or four years teaching reading, a skill easily mastered in six weeks if you’d just use phonics?”
At least a million children now take Ritalin for this “disorder.” In two school districts near Virginia Beach, Virginia, for instance, a 1999 study by psychologist Gretchen LeFever found fully 20 percent of white boys in the fifth grade in the 1995-1996 school year were receiving prescription drugs for ADHD. And even the AAP acknowledged in a recent study that many cases are misdiagnosed…. http://www.jpands.org/hacienda/supryno.html

Worse is the side effects

ADHD: Ritalin – Brain damage, heart attacks, hallucinations & liver damage
Ritalin is prescribed to 6 million children with ADHD every year and like all drugs comes with a long list of side effects including nervousness, nausea, dizziness, drowsiness, insomnia, joint pains, headaches, increased blood pressure, fever, rapid heartbeat, abdominal pain, and psychosis….
http://www.cchrint.org/2010/11/15/adhd-ritalin-–-brain-damage-heart-attacks-hallucinations-liver-damage/

Not to mention death

….Between 1990 and 2000 there were 186 deaths from methylphenidate reported to the FDA MedWatch program, a voluntary reporting scheme, the numbers of which represent no more than 10 to 20% of the actual incidence…. http://www.ritalindeath.com/

And psychosis – the desire to KILL

http://familyrights.us/bin/white_papers-articles/drugging_our_children/
….What’s frightening is that this study documented a better than 6- percent rate of psychotic behavior in children taking stimulants at a time when 5 to 7 million children are now taking the stimulant Ritalin. Psychiatrists have known for decades that Ritalin can cause psychotic behavior. In 1975, psychiatrist Daniel Friedman wrote that Ritalin was one of five drugs that “produced psychotic reactions.” Even at low doses amphetamine-like drugs “may occasionally produce psychotic states, and such psychosis may be prolonged, resembling paranoid psychosis.” In fact, in 1973, psychiatrists were giving amphetamines to volunteers in order to observe their reactions. The reactions frightened researchers, who noted that several of the
subjects expressed “a desire to kill” or to do something “bad or destructive.”[xxxix] Researchers concluded that there was a potential danger of impulsive murderous violence caused by amphetamine-induced psychosis….

Parents can be hauled into court for refusing school perscribed Ritalin http://www.schaler.net/inthenews/ritalin.htm and http://breggin.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=81 and http://www.cchrint.org/tag/ritalin/ (Israel)
Yes schools can prescribe the drug and enforce dosing of YOUR kid in the USA.

…Earlier a school nurse practitioner […] decided the Carroll’s seven year old son, Kyle, was suffering from attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) because he was restless in class. A physician, under contract to the school (whom had never “examined” Kyle) prescribed Ritalin… the Carrolls informed the school that they were going to take Kyle off the drug on a trial basis until they could have Kyle examined by their own physician. A school administrator reported them to Child Protective Services…. They not only found themselves facing Family Court Judge Gerald Maney but also later discovered they had been “posted” on a statewide list of alleged child abusers. The charge against them by the school was “educational neglect” not child abuse.
There was no defense…. The Carolls believed they would be able to contest the administration of a very addictive psychotrophic drug to their offspring without their own family physician examining him and either agreeing or refuting the school nurse practitioner’s “diagnosis.” They were wrong on both counts. This was not to be a hearing where actual evidence was examined. Judge Maney told the Carrolls if they did not agree to the school’s demand that their son be placed back on Ritalin, the court would order their children removed from the home and placed in the foster care system…. http://www.firedocs.com/remoteviewing/pjarchives/realworld/Children-and-Ritalin.cfm

So if you are wondering why kids now a days act “Brain Dead” it is because there is a good chance the actually had their brains fried by the government school system.
No wonder there is no real debate!

I supported the HI ‘s billboard tactics and the wonderful media blitz generated by HI’s billboard from the initial announcements of the billboards here at WUWT. I think early on in the initial WUWT post on the billboard that it was just Smokey and I who indicated positive views of HI’s actions. (SMOKEY – It was nice being introduced to you at happy hour during the ICCC-7).
HI has shown in the billboard experience that it is neither a wallflower nor a politically correct pansy. : )
I think HI knows that, although objective climate science research is necessary to debunk the thematically biased ‘science’ supporting IPCC’s CAGWism, they also think that objective climate science is insufficient by itself to win the overall dialog. It is my view that HI knows it is also necessary to apply all the intellectual weapons of an integrated philosophy (HI’s in this case) to debunk the many headed snake of false ideology that informs the IPCC leaders and their fawning acolytes in the science community.
The HI has brilliantly and efficiently refocused, with its billboard, on the broad irrationality of the IPCC centric CAGWists.
I applaud the HI. I support HI intellectually in this billboard experience.
John

Superb letter. Can’t disagree with a word. Notwithstanding the out-of-joint noses and sniffs of disdain thru same, I think the adage, “There’s no such thing as bad publicity!” does apply here (though it doesn’t always.)
How do you teach a mule? First, take a 2X4, …

Gunga Din says:
May 25, 2012 at 2:38 pm
Oh yeah, the Boot Head Guy, I think he just missed his mouth.

Nah, happened one morning when he was about to park his head as usual in his inferior orifice, and he liked the look.

AndyG55 (from down-under) says:
May 25, 2012 at 2:02 pm
I would like to see a billboard that challenges the AGW brethren to come and debate the issues… LIVE.
Come and debate….. Come on Al, Jim, Mick et.al.. IF YOU DARE !!!
Let the public know just how scared they are to even say hello !!! 😉
The AGW brethren are cowards.
*
Well said, AndyG55. I like this! Let the world know they are cowards – again and again and again. Regular folk might start to wonder why those screaming the loudest about CAGW won’t front up and clean up the skeptics in debate. Hey, and maybe even why the CAGW crowd won’t show their data, not even to “save the world” and, again, clean up the skeptics with their data. If they are so sure of CAGW and their authority and consensus – WHERE ARE THEY?

I would like to see the next billboard to feature Suzuki. Maybe Hansen after that.
Best to wait a while, not overload the “Pavlov reflex” that caused the press to respond so thoroughly to the first one.

Judith who ?

reply to jaschrumph at 11:50 am, Spiritual salvation is very personal and much considered over a lifetime. The results of this consideration are deep felt and lasting and will not be displaced by anothers vague arguments. The spirit within me that is my deepest self acknowledges a supreme being and I believe Jesus Christ manifested that being in the flesh. Where will your supposed arguments get you when this life is over? By the way, I think Heartland has been on target with their approach in this battle to return the debate to science instead of propaganda.

The views of Ted Kazynski on global warming have been truthfully presented by Heartland. I suspect that Ted’s support for AGW is “An Inconvenient Truth” for other CAGW fanatics. If the shoe fits, wear it!

Reg Nelson says:
May 25, 2012 at 7:07 pm
Glenn says:
May 25, 2012 at 5:12 pm
Hitler, the Unabomber, Manson are all criminals that committed criminal acts. Belief in AGW is not. Ian is right on target. It was idiotic and infantile, no matter the reason.
“Gleick admitted to (some of) his criminal acts in the name of CAGW. Why is he not in jail?”
Maybe because “pretexting” via email isn’t specifically outlined as a crime yet in the US.
“Unabomber and Gleick, both crazy and both criminals. I think the billboard.
Also what billboards used Hitler and Manson, BTW? I missed that part.”
You missed it because I didn’t claim it. And Gleick isn’t the only AGW supporter in the world, nor does he represent all the AGW supporters in the world.

Re: Heartland Institute’s billboards.
They were exactly to the point, and very effective. (Kurt from Switzerland and other milk-toasts just don’t get it. They still think it is about “scientific debate.” It’s an armed robbery, Kurt, and supporting AGW in any way or form is not an “opinion” — it is as criminal as supporting any totalitarian ideology.)
Russians have an ancient proverb that could be loosely translated this way:
“An honest fool causes more grief than a clever thief.”
Re: Judith Curry.
I told you so. Most likely, her boss called her with a simple message: if she wouldn’t do it, her professional career is over. Result: wet pants, full compliance.
As “climate change” mantra loses power, and as voodoo climatology loses its funding, the elbow space available around that unsavory feeding trough is going to be more and more congested. Wait for other false friends to throw their masks off.
Nobody is “entitled” to respect. Respect must be earned. It is precious and fragile. Once you lose it, it’s gone forever.

With all the economic and political problems, and preparations for war, going on in the world, this (CAGW ) isn’t even on the radar.

Andy Warhole says: “There is NO SUCH THING as ‘bad publicity’..”

How are your German neighbors doing with those windmills Kurt?

Allan MacRae says:
May 26, 2012 at 5:58 am
…
I say run a series of billboards highlighting the warmists’ repugnant attempts to stifle legitimate debate, threaten and intimidate their opponents, lie about the science, fabricate data to support their failed CAGW hypothesis and so on, and so on.

Great. Brilliant. But … I suggest the following exercise. On every billboard you see, do a word count. Tabulate only how many 10.
Then consider how you would word and compose those fact-filled b-boards you propose. Good luck with that …

“You didn’t see many new faces on the program because 50 warmists invited to speak refused to show up, and we had set aside space on the program for them.”
I would love to see that list who were invited and refused to show up. Why not publish it here on WUWT so everyone can see?
“Also I’ve seen the list of people invited who declined to join the debate. You’d think that if we were as wrong and as stupid as they claim, it would be easy to just show up and slaughter us intellectually, but for some reason they don’t want to even try. – Anthony”
I wonder why! Some ‘skeptics’ I have discussed with on this forum still refuse to accept that humans are the cause for the increase in CO2 while in the scientific community there is a general acceptance and agreement (even by Professor Lindzen and Dr. Spencer) that humans are causing the increase. Now I don’t know if amongst the speakers of Heartland there were any individuals who refuse to accept that simple fact. How does one debate with such a refusable person on stage?

rogerknights writes, “HI needed to be spotless and respectable and high-minded to get mainstreamers to come aboard”.
I think that at this point, this set of tactical decisions by Heartland is really mostly about the upcoming election. It is a well-known fact that Romney and certain other high-ranking Republicans are and have been highly suspect on the issue of AGW. That being the case, Heartland, I would think, would naturally want to participate in the process of holding their (and especially Romney’s) feet to the fire. And to do that, they would need to get the TEA party fired up about it. And if possible, they would want to keep turning up the heat steadily on Romney et al as the election approached, so that Romney et al could really get a good, strong, ROBUST taste of exactly how much their voters care about this issue.
FYI in case any readers didn’t know, the TEA party is the mainstream now, within the Republican Party. In most states right now, if you get them, you’ve got the Republican Party. So, a bit of friendly advice to all you Heartland detractors who might still be plodding along in the mental landscape of yesteryear:
Time to Wakey Wakey, smell the coffee.
RTF

To all those who decry the Heartland Billboard I give you Australia’s Al Gore – Tim Flannery:
“Climate change campaigner Tim Flannery says mercury tooth fillings should be removed from corpses before they are cremated …
Prof Flannery said undertakers should be required to remove the fillings and families also could request it.
“You just need a pair of pliers,” he said.
“It is a $2 solution.””
http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/cheaper_than_his_usual_solutions/
HI should do a billiboard in Australia. Tim Flannery defiling the dead with pliers.
The AGW cult is bat**** crazy.

rogerknights: “Borderline cases will be less likely to identify with Heartland in the future.”
Borderline mentally ill cases like David Suzuki and Tim Flannery are not wanted.
roger, you seem to want HI to try and appease the deranged.

Allan;
It’s not a question of billboard capacity, but of driver attention and time: how many words can be read at 30 mph, 45 mph, 60 mph, 75 mph? If drivers are stuck in a traffic jam, they may have time to read through long messages, but only a few will be in that situation at a time–by definition of “jam”. 😉
Note that the HI b-b was ~8 words. That’s about as far as you want to go.
As I suggested, look at real-world examples. They’re short and punchy for a reason.

Bill Tuttle says: @ May 26, 2012 at 2:07 pm
“The big push for biofuels to replace petroleum began roughly 10 years ago. Palm oil growers saw the dollar signs on the horizon and began expanding their tropical plantations on whatever land they could buy.”
________________________________
Glenn says: @ May 26, 2012 at 3:03 pm
What you don’t realize is that “dollar signs” is not “in the name of AGW advocacy”. People have died as a result of others seeing dollar signs in all endeavors….. The methods you reference are not advocated by AGW believers. If you can understand any of this, you will understand that I wasn’t and am not saying “So what? Everybody else has done that”.
_______________________________________
, NO YOU DON”T, You can not wiggle out of the blame that easily.This is the typical projection of YOUR attributes onto the “Enemy” we see so often.
CAGW (and PETA) would be nothing but fringe cults like the Flat Earthers if it was not for the Big Money that was pushing the crap in the first place. All it takes is a quick look on the internet to see that H. L. Mencken was correct.
The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.
I have talked to those advocating Communism/Socialism or what ever they want to call it while living in Massachusetts, home of the foremost scholars of Marxism as one told me proudly. As far as they are concerned wiping out a major portion of humanity is very acceptable.
This attitude is expressed by Obama’s Science Czar John Holdren in chapter 8, page 235 in the book ‘Human Ecology’

“The fetus given the opportunity to develop properly before birth, and given the essential early socializing experiences and sufficient nourishing food during the crucial early years after birth, will ultimately develop into a human being.”

So YOUR side does not even consider the rest of us Human because we have not had “The essential early SOCIALIZING experiences” – read brain washing by the state.
Read the discussion of what John Holdern wrote at: http://zombietime.com/john_holdren/
Here are some other quotes from just one website: http://seeker401.wordpress.com/2010/09/09/quotes-the-club-of-rome-green-cultists-and-eugenics-freaks/
“The common enemy of humanity is man. In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through changed attitudes and behavior that they can be overcome. The real enemy then, is humanity itself.” — Alexander King Co-Founder of the Club of Rome, (premier environmental think-tank and consultants to the United Nations) from his 1991 book The First Global Revolution
“We need to get some broad based support, to capture the public’s imagination… So we have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements and make little mention of any doubts… Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest.” — Prof. Stephen Schneider, Stanford Professor of Biology and Global Change. Professor Schneider was among the earliest and most vocal proponents of man-made global warming and a lead author of many IPCC reports. He is a member of the Club of Rome.
“We’ve got to ride this global warming issue. Even if the theory of global warming is wrong, we will be doing the right thing in terms of economic and environmental policy.” –Timothy Wirth, President of the UN Foundation and member of the Club of Rome.
“Isn’t the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn’t it our responsibility to bring that about?”
“The Earth Summit will play an important role in] reforming and strengthening the United Nations as the centerpiece of the emerging system of democratic global governance.”
“The concept of national sovereignty has been an immutable, indeed sacred, principle of international relations. It is a principle which will yield only slowly and reluctantly to the new imperatives of global environmental cooperation. It is simply not feasible for sovereignty to be exercised unilaterally by individual nation states, however powerful. The global community must be assured of environmental security.” — Maurice Strong, Executive Director of the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP), Al Gore’s mentor and executive member of the Club of Rome.
Sorry dude hiding behind your false front does not work here.

Billboard idea for HI.

Reality is saying to Hansen of NASA – “It’s over Jim.”

: )
John