…
Fisker said it was not aware of any consumer complaints, warranty claims or “any other reports related to this condition.” It said fewer than 50 vehicles were in the hands of consumers.
Under federal regulations dealers may not sell the remaining new models until the recall is completed.
Full story at the NYT
======================================================
It’s another example of USA tax dollars at work – in Finland:
From ABC News, Oct 20th, 2011:
With the approval of the Obama administration, an electric car company that received a $529 million federal government loan guarantee is assembling its first line of cars in Finland, saying it could not find a facility in the United States capable of doing the work.
Vice President Joseph Biden heralded the Energy Department’s $529 million loan to the start-up electric car company called Fisker as a bright new path to thousands of American manufacturing jobs. But two years after the loan was announced, the company’s manufacturing jobs are still limited to the assembly of the flashy electric Fisker Karma sports car in Finland.
=======================================================
Let’s do the math.
239 cars produced for 2012 model year.
$529,000,000 USD in Government loans
That works out to $2,213,389 (2.2 million) per car.
Selling price $103,000 USD, that leaves only $2,110,389 in taxpayer funded overhead per vehicle. And, they’ve only sold 50 so far.
Such a deal.
Of course, when your promotion strategy revolves around a sitcom based on Charlie Sheen, such things are bound to happen:
Full story at GreenCarReports.com
The 2012 Fisker, the peoples car affordable to Internet billionaires and Hollywood actors, fire extinguisher not included.
dear America, it’s a shame our glorious electric car project didn’t work out.
If you could just pop that $500 million we agreed to in the mail, that would be dandy.
Thanks so much, sincerely etc.
Finland.
J Cuttance says:
January 1, 2012 at 3:28 pm
“dear America, it’s a shame our glorious electric car project didn’t work out.”
They’re not bankrupt yet; don’t confuse them with the Norwegian and later Finnish “Think” which is. (again – the company goes broke every few years)
“The A-to-Z of Going Broke Building EVs”
http://evworld.com/blogs/index.cfm?authorid=12&blogid=1013&archive=1
LazyTeenager says:
January 1, 2012 at 1:35 pm
Well I followed the link and read the article.
Can someone explain to me how “loan guarantee” was magically transformed into “loan” in the original article. As far as I can tell if it’s a guarantee it means the federal gov is NOT providing the 529 million.
There is also in the article the explicit assertion that the 529 million of presumably US funds, wherever they came from, is NOT being spent in Finland. How come that information disappeared?
I know you guys are going to get all excited by this, but maybe the facts need to be checked first.
————————————————————
LT, what do you think the prospects are for this project to ever break even, let alone make a profit? Would you put your personal assets on the line for it?
When (not if) they go bust, taxpayers will have just copped another quick half a billion of their hard earned money down the toilet. I bet the executives are well paid, with nice golden parachutes, though.
The Green Economy strikes again.
And, as others have mentioned, those batteries have to supply ALL the car’s power.
But, there’s more: (from here: http://www.wday.com/event/article/id/54206/)
“…Area car dealers can hardly keep them on the lot. The popularity of electric cars continues skyrocket and with that trend, comes concerns from firefighters. As more electric cars hit the highways and city streets, fire departments are now going through special training. The reason??? High voltage electricity.
Fargo Firefighter and training officer Captain Lee Soeth knows it is a matter of time before he and other firefighters are confronted with working an accident scene involving electric cars.
That is why fire departments around the nation are now going through special training. The big concern is obvious – Electricity. A lot of it.
Captain Lee Soeth – Fargo Fire Department: “Very high voltage that can run through it there is a high voltage wire that runs from the back to the front.”
Because firefighters are first on scene to remove victims trapped in cars, there is concern over the batteries and electric cables and wires that power the car.
Captain Lee Soeth: “They are either bright orange or bright yellow or blue power cord the big thing is you never cut them enough voltage you could kill someone on the spot.”
But another challenge for firefighters nationwide is that electric cars are being built with lighter but stronger metal, and the Jaws of Life used to cut through cars to rescue victims cannot cut through the metal. Moorhead Firefighter Rick Loveland leads the Minnesota Board of Fire Training and Education. He trains fire departments on rescuing victims from electric cars.
Richard Loveland – Moorhead Fire/MN Fire Training and Education: “The main thing is where to cut. We are taking high voltage, in some up to 500 volts running through, the nice thing is they are labeled. So our guys have to peel apart the car before they tear it apart.”
And firefighters are being trained on where exactly they can cut the car, since that has changed. The Department of Energy is funding training for fire departments across the country. Fargo and Moorhead are both getting firefighters up to speed on the training so when emergencies come up, they are protected as well while trying to rescue those injured. It is estimated that one million electric cars will be on our highways by 2015…”
Notice that the DoE has to fund the training. Even MORE tax dollars drained out…
For the person seeking a cheap car with good gas mileage: I own two Geo Metro automobiles. The 1991 car is now 21 years old, doesn’t look like much, but gets 53-55 miles per gallon. The 2000 car still looks OK (though the inner roof is held in place by staples) and gets 45 miles per gallon. Both cars still pass inspection every year and are still fun to drive. Why not resurrect the best features of these cars and make more of them? The 1991 cost $7000 new, and the 2000 cost maybe $10,500, also new. Think about it.
Tenuc says: “…I’ll slip in a 3L petrol supercharged six and have a great vehicle. Will be great for traffic light burn ups… :-)”
I’m not sure you’ll get an inline six to fit. Best bet: rebuilt VW or Porsche flat four, or new aircraft engine.
The recall of the Karma leaves a gaping hole in the $100,000 “go-nowhere car market.” I’m looking for investors. I want to build a sleek-looking $99,999.99 car that has no engine. Think of all the CO2 that won’t pollute the atmosphere. Think of all the good-looking chicks/guys that will flock to you as you sit in your parked car on Broadway with your nose in the air feeling so superior. Motive power will be hockey sticks–used either as poles to push the car or as oars when in the near future New York floods. The sales price will include one year’s supply of hockey sticks, two of which will be signed by Michael Mann himself. The car may not catch on, but it is guaranteed not to “catch on fire.”
@evilincandescentbulb Well, it may just be a superposition of states and all. You can’t really count how many. At any second, there is a non-zero (but very, very, very small) probability that you might have 1,000 states. Who wudda thunk that Obama grocked quantum theory and Lie groups. Of course his definition of Lie groups is a bit different than mine, but that is something else I guess.
“Karma Chameleon – you come and go.. you come and go..”
The question is does Boy George drive one?
To the socialist wannabe keepers of the hive the onle true “peoples car” is a elevator in NYC or Boston and a train of black government SUVs to ferry the peoples’ leaders to and fro in safety and security.
Recalled due to fire hazard? Where is the Volt PR team when you need them. When a Volt bursts into flame they simply describe it as a “Thermal Event”.
The Medium is the Message:
How do you know Fisker is a scam?
It’s not made in China.
Do ANY of you folks have any clue at all about this wondrous Fisker Karma Electric car; a 125 MPH electric car no less.
It was in fact the front page story in the Sunday, Jan 1 San Jose Mercury News, which I received on Saturday Dec 31st; lat year. That alone had me wondering; but after reading the two Karma articles I realized it was actually the April 1st 2012 news paper; not Jan first.
This 100,000 to 120,000 electric sports car even has a shaped roof of solar cells to charge the battery so the car can run forever in daylight. My guess is that it might have ten square feet of solar cells, which in Northern California can probably get a whole quarter horsepower of juice, to run your green machine. It is also quite heavy, about 5,000 pounds, and yet it can go from zero to sixty MPH in 6.3 seconds, and it is good for 50 miles, although they don’t claim that it will do 50 miles at 125 MPH.
Actually, the Karma is more like the Toyota Pius, in that in addition to the all electric drive system, the Karma like the Pius, has an auxilliary gas engine. I don’t know how big the Toyota aux engine is, but the Karma one is 403 Horsepower, so it can charge the battery a bit faster than the solar cells.
So if you are a fan of all electric cars, and you don’t mind carrying a 403 horse gas engine for emergency use, in the trunk, then the Fisker Karma is the electric car for you. I see that you can extend the 50 mile range to 250 miles if you use the auxilliary gas engine.
George E. Smith, you need to get with the program. At least you have grasped that something which extends the range of a vehicle x 5 using completely different technology is an ‘auxiliary’. This is the kind of language that reaps rich rewards in the Grantosphere. 🙂
My fellows, Americans, a few points from Finland:
The Valmet Automotive plant in Finland is an independent factory producing relatively small series of specialty models for bigger manufacturers. Porsche Boxsters, SAAB convertibles and such have been built there. Making a car in a plant that is already up and running, with a trained workforce and a network of suppliers, makes good business sense.
Now, these are of course good industrial jobs and I’m sure they would be most welcome in any US state also. And the loan guarantee (not loan or subsidy) for Fisker by the US gov, should give said government some say in where the money is spent. Apparently later models are to be assembled in a newly built US factory. We’ll see how it works out. The current model make for less risk, and less benefit, for the US taxpayer.
As for the general concept of the car, well, at least they are not misleadingly claiming it will save you money, as the compact EV:s are supposed to do.
>>>Captain Lee Soeth – Fargo Fire Department: “Very high voltage
>>>that can run through it there is a high voltage wire that runs from
>>>the back to the front.”
Excuse my ignorance, but I thought these things ran on low voltage and high amperage…? What, exactly, is the voltage of the motors they use?
.
Reminds you of the old joke: Q: You produce light bulbs [*ahem*] at 10 cent per bulb and you sell them at 9 cent a bulb. How do you hope to gain a profit? A: You don’t understand. If you really do it in bulk…
Richard Holle says:
January 1, 2012 at 8:56 am
Karma is Patchy choo choo reincarnating as a sacred cow, but in a feed lot in Amarillo Texas surrounded by wind turbines for the next 100 lives.
============
🙂
or gore manbearpig in a CAFO piggery, with lipstick ,making methane
Did the designer stare at a BMW Z8 for too long before scetching this?
jorgekafkazar says:
January 1, 2012 at 5:19 pm
Tenuc says: “…I’ll slip in a 3L petrol supercharged six and have a great vehicle. Will be great for traffic light burn ups… :-)”
——————————
Unlikely… this tank weighs ~5,300 pounds as it sits. You’d still be way under powered. Well I guess you could gut the thing and maybe get it down to a still too heavy 4000 lbs.
From the instruction manual: “As with any battery-operated device avoid dropping your Fisker Karma in the toilet.”
China isn’t really a major player in automoblie mfr’ing.
nor Finland but China has billions more users of this technology–blessed by the Leftist-liberal bureaucracy–that would save the Earth from human-produced evil CO2, right?
“”””” johanna says:
January 1, 2012 at 11:45 pm
George E. Smith, you need to get with the program. At least you have grasped that something which extends the range of a vehicle x 5 using completely different technology is an ‘auxiliary’. This is the kind of language that reaps rich rewards in the Grantosphere. 🙂 “””””
Well Johanna; I’ll cut ya some slack, since you seem to have figured out the Karmascam too. The idea that a “green” hybrid, should require a 403 Horsepower auxilliary power source to back up its “electric” power train system, is absurd.
This overweight heap of junk is simply a Detroitosaurus Maximus muscle car that has its electric starter motor connected to the cubic gas guzzler via the transmission in such a way, that the starter motor can also drive the wheels with the smogger discombobulated; using a slightly oversized Sears Diehard starter battery.
I once owned (1962-4) a 1956 XK-140 Jaguar hard top coupe that had a special high compression 210 HP engine, instead of the standard 180 Hp motor. That car could climb trees. My present 2010 model Subaru Legacy has a 170 HP engine, and I can’t even imagine using the 265 HP six cyclinder engine; let alone a 403 HP one.
A true electric hybrid, would have a small gas engine that only ran at one speed where it was most efficient in driving an alternator charging the battery at the most efficient rate. Having it drive the wheels is silly and unnecessarily complicated.
Justa Joe says: “…this tank weighs ~5,300 pounds as it sits. You’d still be way under powered. Well I guess you could gut the thing and maybe get it down to a still too heavy 4000 lbs.”
The weight is mostly batteries and associated electric components, like motors. I suspect a stripped chassis would be closer to 2000 pounds. With V-8 engine, maybe 3000, if it will fit. With aircraft engine, 2500,
Ralph says: January 2, 2012 at 12:12 am
>>>Captain Lee Soeth – Fargo Fire Department: “Very high voltage
>>>that can run through it there is a high voltage wire that runs from
>>>the back to the front.”
Excuse my ignorance, but I thought these things ran on low voltage and high amperage…? What, exactly, is the voltage of the motors they use?
—————————————————————–
I couldn’t find the specification for the Fisker, but the battery pack in a car like this typically runs at about 300 Volts (Chevy Volt is 300 V, Nissan Leaf 360 V). Fisker’s stated 403 HP from the electrics translates to 300 KW, so that would be 1000 Amps at 300 Volts. Standard cars use a 12 Volt cranking/lighting/ignition battery, and Military vehicles mostly use 24 VDC. Thus the statements about the Fisker’s “high voltage battery”
I did find the specs on the roof mounted photovoltaic array. In a sunny place, if left outside all day, it will generate 500 W-Hr, or about enough to add 1 km to the car’s daily range.
Anthony: What’s the battery pack voltage in your car?