James Cameron's folly: 'Titanic Chicken of the Sea'

Cameron backs out. So much for that attempt to sink skeptical arguments.

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From King of the World to Chicken of the Sea: Director James Cameron challenges climate skeptics to debate and then bails out at last minute

Via the SPPI Blog, Source: Climatedepot

Hide the Debate: Cameron ducks Climate Debate with Breitbart, Morano, & McElhinney

by Marc Morano

ASPEN COLORADO: Hollywood director James Cameron challenged three high profile global warming skeptics to a public debate at a global warming and energy conference. But Cameron backed out of the debate at the last minute after environmentalists “came out of the woodwork” to warn him not to engage in a debate with skeptics because it was not in his best interest.

Cameron challenged Andrew Breitbart, Climate Depot’s Marc Morano and filmmaker Ann McElhinney of ‘Not Evil Just Wrong.’ The debate was already in the program for the Aspen American Renewable Energy Day (AREDAY) summit. The website program described the agreed to debate as “AREDAY Climate Change Debate: Reality or Fiction?” (see image below)

After setting up the public global warming debate, Cameron and his negotiator then changed formats multiple times and initially said it would be open to the media and then said he would only participate if it was private with no recording devices. The skeptics agreed to all the changes. According to AREDAY organizers, activist Joseph Romm of Climate Progress urged Cameron not to go ahead with the debate as well.

Cameron’s cancellation of the agreed to debate did not happen until one debate participant (Morano) was already in mid-air, flying from DC to Aspen on Saturday August 21 to attend the debate. (AREDAY did grant Morano a 90 minute slot to speak at the summit. See: Climate Depot’s Presentation at Warmists’ Summit Met By Hostile Interrupting Moderator and Crowd; Call for Morano to Kill Himself!)

(Morano Note: After ducking debate, James Cameron boldly slammed global warming skeptics as “swine” on the day he was supposed to be debating them. “I think they’re swine” Cameron told a friendly audience at the AREDAY summit. Also see: Cameron Morphs Into Gore, Quits AGW Debate: ‘Chickened out–even after he won Gore-like concessions that there would be no media and no audio or video record kept’ — How does Cameron square ducking a climate debate he set up when just a few months ago he seemed so confident? See: Director James Cameron Unleashed: Calls for gun fight with global warming skeptics: ‘I want to call those deniers out into the street at high noon and shoot it out with those boneheads’)

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Below is detailed report from Ann McElhinney of www.NotEvilJustWrong.com on how Cameron ducked out of debate he set up.

James Cameron—King of Hypocrites

Written by Ann McElhinney

Sunday, 22 August 2010 17:49

Last March James Cameron sounded defiant.

The Avatar director was determined to expose journalists, such as myself, who thought it was important to ask questions about climate change orthodoxy and the radical “solutions” being proposed.

Cameron said was itching to debate the issue and show skeptical journalists and scientists that they were wrong.

“I want to call those deniers out into the street at high noon and shoot it out with those boneheads,” he said in an interview.

Well, a few weeks ago Mr. Cameron seemed to honor his word.

His representatives contacted myself and two other well known skeptics, Marc Morano of the Climate Depot website and Andrew Breitbart, the new media entrepreneur.

Mr. Cameron was attending the AREDAY environmental conference in Aspen Colorado 19-22 August. He wanted the conference to end with a debate on climate change. Cameron would be flanked with two scientists. It would be 90 minutes long. It would be streamed live on the internet.

They hoped the debate would attract a lot of media coverage.

“We are delighted to have Fox News, Newsmax, The Washington Times and anyone else you’d like. The more the better,” one of James Cameron’s organizers said in an email.

It looked like James Cameron really was a man of his word who would get to take on the skeptics he felt were so endangering humanity.

Everyone on our side agreed with their conditions. The debate was even listed on the AREDAY agenda.

But then as the debate approached James Cameron’s side started changing the rules.

They wanted to change their team. We agreed.

They wanted to change the format to less of a debate—to “a roundtable”. We agreed.

Then they wanted to ban our cameras from the debate. We could have access to their footage. We agreed.

Bizarrely, for a brief while, the worlds most successful film maker suggested that no cameras should be allowed-that sound only should be recorded. We agreed

Then finally James Cameron, who so publicly announced that he “wanted to call those deniers out into the street at high noon and shoot it out,” decided to ban the media from the shoot out.

He even wanted to ban the public. The debate/roundtable would only be open to those who attended the conference.

No media would be allowed and there would be no streaming on the internet. No one would be allowed to record it in any way.

We all agreed to that.

And then, yesterday, just one day before the debate, his representatives sent an email that Mr. “shoot it out ” Cameron no longer wanted to take part. The debate was cancelled.

James Cameron’s behavior raises some very important questions.

Does he genuinely believe in man made climate change? If he believes it is a danger to humanity surely he should be debating the issue every chance he gets ?

Or is it just a pose?

The man who called for an open and public debate at “high noon” suddenly doesn’t want his policies open to serious scrutiny.

I was looking forward to debating with the film maker. I was looking forward to finding out where we agreed and disagreed and finding a way forward that would help the poorest people in the developing and developed world.

But that is not going to happen because somewhere along the way James Cameron, a great film maker, has moved from King of the World to being King of the Hypocrites.

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Addendum

In other news from the SPPI Blog

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Climate Depot’s Presentation at Warmists’ Summit Met By Hostile Interrupting Moderator and Crowd; Call for Morano to Kill Himself!

Source:  Climatedepot

Global Warming Summit’s Warm Welcome: Morano told to drive car into garage with engine running and then close the doors

By Marc Morano

[SPPI Note: This is the same arrogant and hapless Joe Romm who claimed that global warming cause the collapse of the I-35W Bridge in Minneapolis in August of 2007.  For other entries on Romm see here:  http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/commentaries/climate_mccarthyism.pdf

and here: http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/blogwatch/climate_inquisition.pdf

and here:  http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/commentaries/romms_fairy_tales.pdf ]

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Note from Climate Depot’s Executive Editor Marc Morano:

My presentation at Aspen American Renewable Energy Day (AREDAY) summit on Sunday August 22, 2010 at 5:30 was met by a rude moderator and hostile audience. I was offered the 90 minute time slot to present the skeptical view of man-made climate change after Hollywood director James Cameron’s cowardly final cancellation of a pre-planned and agreed to global warming debate. See here: From King of the World to Chicken of the Sea: Director James Cameron Sets up Debate with Skeptics Then Flees! Cameron Ducks Climate Debate with Breitbart, Morano, & McElhinney

Cameron’s cancellation of the debate did not happen until I was already in mid-air, flying from DC to Aspen on Saturday August 21 to attend the debate. After challenging us to the public debate, Cameron was spooked by Joseph Romm of Climate Progress who warned him not to debate us. Finally, we were told Cameron would debate us if Romm joined the debate and at Romm’s insistence there would be no cameras or media present. We agreed and I flew to Aspen. (See full report of Cameron’s chickening out here. How does Cameron square ducking a climate debate he set up when just a few months ago he seemed so confident. See: Director James Cameron Unleashed: Calls for gun fight with global warming skeptics: ‘I want to call those deniers out into the street at high noon and shoot it out with those boneheads’)

After arriving I found out that Cameron had canceled the debate that he challenged us to. The AREDAY global warming summit organizers then offered me the consolation prize of 90 minutes to speak to the conference and present the skeptical argument with Q and A from the audience. But the 90 minute event turned out to be further evidence of manipulation by Cameron and the ARDAY conference organizers.

My PowerPoint presentation was repeatedly interrupted by ARDAY moderator Richard Greene and the audience was not receptive to me continuing my presentation. Instead, the bulk of my presentation turned into a disjointed moderator and audience rant session. I attempted several times to return to my presentation, but the crowd and moderator refused to cooperate and seemed completely disinterested.

One participant confused carbon dioxide with carbon monoxide. She suggested I kill himself by driving my car into my garage and then close the doors with the engine running. I twice attempted to explain to the ARDAY conference participant that there was a difference between carbon dioxide — a harmless trace essential gas we exhale from our mouth– and toxic carbon monoxide, but to no avail. I sadly shook my head and told the audience: “Wow, what a warm welcome I have gotten here.”

In the end, the ARDAY’s offer of 90 minutes for me to present the skeptical view of man-made global warming after Cameron’s debate cancellation revealed itself to be essentially disingenuous.

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212 thoughts on “James Cameron's folly: 'Titanic Chicken of the Sea'

  1. Well he got one part right of “shoot it out”. Unfortunately its was his mouth. Another case of foot, mouth, swallow. They just get more and more bizarre. It’s a bit like the kid shouting his mouth off across the street. The second you challenge him he goes running into mummy because the big man across the road is a bully.
    Childishly stupid behaviour.

  2. Perhaps he was wholly convinced on the AGW talking points, and decided to read the complaints of the skeptics and became less convinced. To the point of embarassment.
    Just maybe he is wrestling with his conscience, given all the hype he has helped to perpetuate.

  3. Avatar was a wonderful film, made by a gutless wonder. Who knew?
    I feel no compunction to be kind about those who have no honour, but I’ll watch their films. I’m sure Cameron DID believe in CAGW, but the indicators are that after doing some preparatory research for the debate, he ain’t so confident now. I’m sure he’d never admit it.. given his previous verbosity on the subject, that’d be a lot of face to lose.

  4. My guess is that, as he prepared for the debate, he realized that contrarians had comebacks to his “how to talk to a climate skeptic” talking points and that he wouldn’t win in a walkover–or win at all.

  5. So James Cameron and Al Gore have something in common besides being rich [snip – policy].
    They are terrified of being put into a situation where their brainless utterances would be picked up and used against them.Therefore they try hard to shut out as much of the media as they can.While they hold some sort of presentation behind closed doors.To fellow kool aid drinkers of course.
    Thus debates are out of the question. It is amazing that James even got this close,before he realized he was going to exposed for he really is. A ignoramus on the topic of Global Warming/Climate Change. A moron for getting himself into a corner of dilemma on his own initiative.

  6. I guess the proof will be whether Cameron quits running his mouth about AGW and stops calling skeptics “boneheads”. If he continues to do both it doesn’t say much for his integrity.

  7. Cameron’s obviously decided that his future lies in science fiction – so as a votary of AGW he’s in good company.

  8. Michael Moron has been strangely quiet on the topic with films since an Inconvenient Goof. Moral of the story, never confuse an actor or a director with an intelligent being. Some of them are, but very, very few are good at anything but their craft.

  9. JG says:
    August 23, 2010 at 12:55 pm
    “Just maybe he is wrestling with his conscience, ”
    Conscience? If he had a conscience, he would have credited Poul Anderson’s story “Call me Joe” as the inspiration for Avatar. He didn’t, so he doesn’t have one. Just like George Lucas never credited Christin & Mezieres for all their ideas he ripped off from “Valerian”.

  10. Here in England Cameron would be called a ‘twat’. Certainly his TV interviews over here showed him to be.

  11. The ever-angry left at its best. Very good at calling names from atop their high horses but as for debating the facts… Nothing new here.

  12. I think Cameron refusal to debate probably has more to do with advice from Joe Romm. Joe did not want to lend credibility to skeptics by debating Morano. If your position has 90% approval/support, that could be an effective strategy but if a majority the public at large thinks climate change is overblown, refusal to debate simply reinforces the skepticism.

  13. One of the many things that have convinced me that AGW is indeed a fraud is the complete absence of an open forum debate which has been called for many times by the ‘sceptical’ side of the argument but has never been taken up by the ‘warmists’. The nearest we have come is the heavily moderated Guardian debate.
    As Ann M. eloquently comments above, if people are so concerned about the threat to humanity they should be taking every opportunity to put their case and their evidence, at the same time rebutting the science and evidence of the opposing camp.
    Their failure to step up to the challenge exposes the weakness of their position more than anything else. The failure of the MSM to highlight the situation is extraordinary.

  14. What’s the world coming to……dishonest hypocrites in the entertainment industry……next it’ll be politicians………oohhh the humanity!!!

  15. James Cameron is a master of fantasy and of creating realistic interpretations of fantasy, indeed he has won many awards for his fantasies on screen.

  16. Not Cameron’s finest moment, for sure. One would like to think it would teach him a little more caution, but apparently not so much.

  17. I remember a few months ago there was a report posted on WUWT about an AGW proponent who spoke at a skeptic’s event and came away impressed at how polite they were even though they disagreed with him.

  18. SimonH says: August 23, 2010 at 12:56 pm
    Avatar was a wonderful film…

    Avatar was a visually amazingremake of a propaganda movie shown to children in the 90s.

  19. SimonH says:
    August 23, 2010 at 12:56 pm
    “Avatar was a wonderful film, made by a gutless wonder. Who knew?”
    Sorry Simon, have to disagree there, Avatar was absolute nonsense, made watchable by the backroom boys with powerful computers and graphics programs. I hate self loathing; we humans are all to blame baloney. Titanic was a far greater and up-lifting achievement. As to our esteemed director, well, you can’t take a loudhailer to a gunfight and you can’t shout cut when ever your ass gets kicked. Not in the real world.

  20. Absolutely incredible behavior on the part of James Cameron – after all that hot air and talking it up like a prizefighter he bails out completely. What happened? Did he get the flu or something?
    This story is one I am actively sharing with people that haven’t really kept up on the climate-change debate and believe me it’s stuff like this that gets a lot of attention. Now people are asking me “GregO why don’t we hear about this in the news? You should write to Newsweek or something – this isn’t right – how come no one is telling us the truth?”
    CAGW is the largest example of Popular Delusion and Madness of Crowds in modern history.

  21. Cameron is the worse type of gutless coward. A man who starts a fight, issuing challenges and than flee’s from the encounter, before it even happens.
    I find it Ironic that he makes movies about underdogs and the value of moral character, when in reality, he has the same personal character traits as his antagonist of his films. I wonder if he can even grasp the depth of Irony here. Na, probably not.

  22. @ SimonH
    Actually, Avatar’s theme was the big bad mining companies taking over a primitive garden of eden and forcing the indigenous people to a reservation. And only the actions of the hero, combined with the spiritual assistance of Gaia, brought down the military might of the invading miners. All pretty well in line with far-left-greenie-crapology. That said, the CG graphics were pretty cool.

  23. Cameron is such a loudmouth coward.
    Intellectually and morally bankrupt, like the whole AGW enterprise.

  24. I have to agree, his apparent behavior indicates that as he “studied up” on the science he realized he was backing the wrong side. However, Avatar was a wonderful film? Compared to what? I was only in awe at how unoriginal it was! And will that generation EVER get tired of painting capitalists as evil, heartless, murderous corporations? I doubt it.
    First half of Titanic was a good movie. Second half, not so good.
    Any other of Cameron’s work is meaningless drivel with one odd exception: I love the Terminator stories. (The whole time Alien was playing I was screaming “OPEN AN AIRLOCK!”)

  25. “It’s not evil just wrong”, but just silly. Why so a supposed intelligent people, as they think of themselves, who imagine themselves being the saviors of the world couldn’t imagine a more real threat, if they wanted to invent a credible story to scare the people of the world and thus achieve their esoteric/initiate goal of global governance?

  26. SimonH, you lost me at “wonderful film”. I guess I just don’t have the affection you do for oversized, anti-Western, anti-military, and anti-corporate smurfs. Cameron is now permanently on my “no fly” list.

  27. AREDAY certainly had an impressive list of flakes for their presentations . Dayrl Hannah should return to her tepee .

  28. Oh, come on now,
    Have sympathy for him – he is seeing his dreams of a one world socialist government crumble. His dream of being one of the rulers is disintegrating before his eyes. As is his dream of telling others how to live.
    Thank god we got rid of this threat without another world war and only a few hundred thousands dying from the bio fuel scam instead of many millions from carbon elimination.
    Thanks
    JK

  29. He asks some people to join him in debate and then bails at the last minute. Then turns around and calls those people “swine”.
    Way to keep it classy Jimmy.

  30. We can only hope in doing a bit of actual reading on the topic, as in both “sides,” he realized the issue is at least, not so “black and white,” and in addition, at least that the science is indeed NOT settled.

  31. The currnet tactic is to pretend that AGW skepticism is the new creationism and thus shouldn’t be honored with a debate as this would give the “false” impression that there is any question that man made CO2 is leading humanity to a catastrophe.
    It may be a smart ploy considering the weakness of the case for catastrophic warming. They have already convinced the James Camerons and Leaonardo DiCaprios of the world, and the mass media, so what do they have to gain by exposing their dogma to public scrutiny?
    Hopefully this cowardly tactic will blow up in their face and continue to convince the public of the hollowness of their arguments.

  32. I haven’t seen Avatar yet. Regardless how “wonderful” the film is, I will definitely skip it. I’ll be as attendant as Cameron was in this debate. NOT!
    BTW, does he really understand, in real life, what a shootout is at high noon? I’m afraid the man lives in a fantasy land, full of flim-flam, folly and fiction.

  33. Mr. Cameron’s mistake was in entering Mr. Gore’s realm of AGW, where eyes are closed, ears are closed, and, above all, the mind is closed. He should consider these words from the theater, with apologies to Mr. Shakespeare:
    Macbeth, Act 5, Scene 5:

    [AGW’s] but a walking shadow, a poor player
    That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
    And then is heard no more: it is a tale
    Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
    Signifying nothing.

  34. It was a good decision just to keep it where it belongs: To fantasy realm. Any discussion about it would have been like trying to prove that cinderella really exists.

  35. Nolo Contendre,
    I have to disagree. Avatar was everything you say,”anti-Western, anti-military, and anti-corporate” but was still amazing. I just ignored the silly new age political “message” and enjoyed the ride.
    C’mom, who doesn’t want to fly on a purply pterodactyl and make it with a blue, seven foot tall, golden eyed, willowy alien chick?
    Maybe you didn’t see it in 3D? It was visually stunning, especially in 3D I Max.
    Cameron is a cowardly leftist idiot but he can craft compelling cinema.

  36. Imagine a world where everyone looks at the facts, analyses their perceptions, presents their perspectives and then listens carefully to opposing or tangential arguments.
    Imagine a world where a person can change his mind and his position based upon new and (more) correct information.
    Imagine a world where someone that opens their mind and evolves into a new paradigm would be welcomed as a leader and an explorer.
    Imagine a world where there would be no fear of loss of personal standing based upon the refutation of the status quo or the support of new and innovative positions.
    You’ll have to imagine it because it ain’t anywhere ’round these parts…

  37. I started noticing about a year ago that Cameron appeared to be an AGW Kool-Aid drinker, and stopped supporting his projects since. This more recent episode simply confirms my decision was an informed one.

  38. Cameron’s ducking out on the debate certainly lends a great deal of credibility to the AGW skeptics side of the argument. I wonder why he turned tail and ran even after changing the rules of engagement time after time until the whole ‘discussion’ would essentially be hidden under the ‘cone of silence’. I can only conclude that in his preparation for the debate he discovered the weakness of the pro-AGW arguments. He then realized he had neither the facts nor the bluff to avoid a public humiliation in an open debate. The ‘swine’ comment confirms that he has resorted to the last refuge of the those unable to refute the argument so they instead attack the person. Cameron’s behaviour confirms AGW is humbug.

  39. I tried to watch Avatar – for something like 2 minutes. The same two minutes were censored out in the version of the Titanic I watched – with the Kate Winslet posing for her sketching.
    Before all the Titanic and Avatar crap, Cameron made The Terminator, Aliens, True Lies and the Abyss (what a near-death scene!) – can you believe that. Obviously Cameron lost his mind during the Titanic movie. Imagine making the Terminator movie and then making Avatar – what a washout, heh.

  40. “C’mom, who doesn’t want to fly on a purply pterodactyl and make it with a blue, seven foot tall, golden eyed, willowy alien chick?

    That would be me.
    I rejected spending any money on Avatar because of the second rate, second hand story, and my “we are the bad guys ” fatigue.
    Besides, if somebody wanted to really make the most astounding actual science fiction movie ever, they would start with an actual science fiction story, crafted and refined by someone who knows what they are doing .
    I suggest Vernor Vinge’s “A Deepness in the Sky”.

  41. I never watched neither “Titanic” nor “Avatar.”
    At first it was because both films were highly recommended to their audience by the Chinese ruling Communists. This immediately put a black ideological mark on Mr. Cameron.
    Now I have another good reason to despise his snide output.

  42. Amazing that the skeptics were so accommodating that they even agreed to conditions that would allow the warmists to attempt to control the spinning of the results. Except, of course, Climate Depot and WUWT are such huge fora that this probably would not have worked.
    Happy to say that I have avoided Avatar out of principle. I did not want my hard-earned $$ added to the bottom line of Cameron’s masterpiece of propaganda – not that this would have made much difference 🙁

  43. Marlene Anderson says: I wonder why he turned tail and ran even after changing the rules of engagement time after time until the whole ‘discussion’ would essentially be hidden under the ‘cone of silence’. I can only conclude that in his preparation for the debate he discovered the weakness of the pro-AGW arguments. He then realized he had neither the facts nor the bluff to avoid a public humiliation in an open debate.
    JK: The other possibility is that it was a setup to get Breitbart, Morano and McElhinney to drop out because of ridiculous restrictions, then to claim the skeptics refused to debate.
    Thanks
    JK

  44. jim karlock says:
    August 23, 2010 at 1:38 pm
    Thank god we got rid of this threat without another world war and only a few hundred thousands dying from the bio fuel scam instead of many millions from carbon elimination.

    Do you think we already got rid of it?, go to the UN pages and see how many binding agreements have already signed the majotity of countries, under that perspective if this one in special fails it won’t be so catastrophic for the general plan. Almost everything has been changed: from education to flu shots or ASTM no longer valid but ISO instead, you name it, the “Brave New World” it’s almost implemented.

  45. Sad, I thought he was better than that, I can only assume that the AGW reptiles sucked his brain out and left a shell they could manipulate to their will.

  46. James Cameron, who is a great film maker, made his fortune by making movies that the establishment said would never work. In other words he ‘really’ understood what people wanted to see. When a man like Cameron, who is famed for his bravery and determination and who also posseses an uncanny sense of the public mood, backs down from a position you can be certain that position is indefensible.
    It’s over for the hoaxers and they know it!

  47. So both Cameron and Romm didn’t think they could defend global warming, even with a stacked audience??
    That’s says it all……………..

  48. It is unbelievable – this RealClimatish and Rommish censorship these people practice – “debate” us but with no cameras. For what? So no one finds out how soundly they’d get thrashed? Censorship and cowardice go hand in hand.

  49. Apparently we sent the wrong debaters. [snip – OTT]
    REPLY: Mike, that flamebait has also been snipped also from an earlier comment. Don’t provide ammunition. – Anthony

  50. In the end, all this was about getting the skeptics to back down.
    Changing rules one at a time to try and find something that they couldn’t handle.
    The bluff was called, and found Cameron empty handed.
    Doesn’t look good, does it? It ain’t.

  51. Romm is afraid. Very afraid. He pushed and Cameron is now hiding from confrontation. Remember November?
    Now the consensus is to duck and run.

  52. I pegged Avatar as “Dances With Wolves… IN SPACE”.
    That was enough for me to avoid it. Then there is the YouTube critic who is devastating.
    Reply: Throw in Billy Jack, Little Big Man, and On Deadly Ground. Shake, don’t stir ~ ctm

  53. A bit like the Titanic itself, woman and children first and James [snip -policy] Cameron.
    But that’s what you get when you are trying to defend the existence of climate unobtanium. No matter what amount of handwavium and technobabble is used it is still unobtanium, it isn’t there.

  54. Buck, buck, bukcerrrrr
    James Cameron does not realise that Marc Morano, Andrew Breitbart and Ann McElhinney are battle hardened and will simply point out contrary evidence and brazen lies which the media has a tendancy to avoild. That’s why Joseph Romm urged him to back out. No wonder Al millions of degrees internet Gore says the debate is over. :o) What does Cameron think Morano does every day? Make movies?

  55. While disappointing, this whole episode is not a total loss:
    1) We finally found something bigger than Cameron’s ego: his mouth.
    2) We finally found something(s) smaller than his brain: his [self-snip].

  56. (Morano Note: After ducking debate, James Cameron boldly slammed global warming skeptics as “swine” on the day he was supposed to be debating them. “I think they’re swine”

    Cameron took a case of swine flu.

  57. Is it likely that all the ‘conditions’ the Cameron was putting up was to try to get Andrew, Ann, and Marc to finally say, ” . . no, we have given into a few of your conditions, but just can’t give in any more . . .”, in order to then tell the media and everyone that the ‘denialists’ wouldn’t debate them, and then he wouldn’t have to back out, and he would look like the hero? It sure seems that way to me.
    Cameron, you are a clown. Kudos to you, Andrew, Ann, and Marc. BTW, have you offered again to debate him?

  58. hehe! Okay, guys.. *I* liked Avatar. I understand the mining/fossil fuel inferences, Gaia and the rest.. but.. I saw it on IMAX, in 3D.. twice.. and it just plain rocked.
    Just because I think the director’s a twonk, and that the analogy is silly, doesn’t mean that I can’t appreciate a work of pure fantasy for the thing it really is.. a work of pure fantasy! Just enjoy the art for the thing it is. A couple of hours of pure escapism is good for you! 🙂
    PS: I also don’t really believe the Harry Potter film makers are really telling us that there’s a Hogwarts, or that we should be extra nice to kids with glasses because some of them might really be wizards. 🙂

  59. The tree had to fall in the direction the blue people where moving away… talk about bad luck! If it had fallen in the other direction it would not have looked great on camera.
    Cameron should be ashame of being a Canadian… we stand being our words and don’t chicken out like he did.

  60. I can hear what Joe Romm said to Cameron:
    “Don’t go. They will shred you. We have been avoiding frontal debate for years. Why do you think we have never debated with sceptics and have run our dogma only through press releases?”

  61. The cool thing about Avatar was how the evil human (pretending to be the hero) convinced the tribe to give up all the stuff they learned on how to sneak through the jungle … and just do a stupid suicidal frontal assault.
    It was laugh out loud stupidly funny.

  62. The hecklers that told Morano that he should drive his car into the garage, close the door and leave the motor running obviously haven’t kept up with developments in modern automotive technology. With pollution control improvements it has become increasingly difficult to take yourself out by this once fairly reliable technique. Most modern vehicles put out so little CO that you’re more than likely to run out of gas before you succumb to CO poisoning, unless your garage is exceptionally well sealed. Even then the COD will probably be asphyxia, not CO.
    This is, of course, another example of how highly developed societies, driven by the availability and efficient utilization of abundant and affordable energy, have progressed inexorably beyond our previous primitive circumstances and are now able to offer to all but their most extremely destitute citizens access to lifestyles beyond what even monarchs and emperors of little more than a century ago could even imagine. Those monarchs lived gilded and pampered lives, but the majority of people who are classified as living in poverty in the US live with air conditioning, flat screen TVs, microwave ovens, cellphones, and many of the accoutrements of modern life which were beyond the reach of the richest segment of the population even when I was lad.
    Now we are told that all that must go and that those living in the developing world should be denied the opportunity to ever experience it for themselves and their offspring on the off chance that in 2100 some cluck sipping MaiTais on the patio of his condo in Miami Beach might get his ankles wet. That still doesn’t seem like much of a deal to me.

  63. Cameron is a [snip – policy] with celebrity confreres. Reality has no bearing on such hysterics’ attitudes. He’d better hope Lord Monckton of Brenchley doesn’t call him out, firing a steam-punk Zombie Blaster into the ceiling of Big Hollywood’s defunct Last Chance Saloon.

  64. Anyone have a E-mail for Cameron, Can only find the Director Guild Address
    would love to let him know what i think of him and his decision to walk.

  65. It is ashame that Marc Moranot’s presentation was so rudely received. The determined effort on the part of the AGW crowd was one of the early reasons why I began questioning AGW. Over the last 5-10 years, I’ve developed the philosophy that if something is beyond debate that it’s probably wrong.

  66. Perhaps, in debate preparation for this event, he found that the questions and statements put forward by the pseudo-opposition were quite beyond his depth to address properly.

  67. Well the saddest part of the whole Cameron/Avatar propaganda BS, is that it was a graduate of my alma mater; Mark Sagar who dreamed up that butt ugly face, of the aliens in that overhyped movie.
    Sagar is actually a fairly nice looking fellow himself; judging by his portrait on the cover of Ingenio; the University Alumni magazine for Autumn of 2010 (which was back in March of course.)
    But that combination of Vulcan ears; or is it Yoda ears; and the African plaitted hairdo, the blue with grey stripes; or izzat grey with blue stripes PC zebra coloring; is it even plausible that Mother Gaia would create on another planet, a structural model that is hardly that successful on this one. After all, on Planet earth, there are more creatures that look like Lobsters, than look like humans; so the human form is hardly a survival winning strategy.
    Maybe Cameron couldn’t figure out how to get his actors to play Lobster looking characters in his movie.
    Lobsters are even smart enough to back up when they run into trouble, instead of charging forward into oblivion; so they likely will outlast us.
    Well maybe Mark Sagar will get himself a better producer/Director to work for next time; and not have to bring Cameron’s distorted fantasies to life.

  68. “We are delighted to have Fox News, Newsmax, The Washington Times and anyone else you’d like. The more the better,” one of James Cameron’s organizers said in an email.
    This is how it should have been. Why was he convinced otherwise?

  69. Weather service predicts it will get down to 27 in West Yellowstone tonight, and down to 23 in Stanley, ID! We’re under a freeze advisory where I live, and I’ve harvested all of three ripe tomatoes from 19 loaded plants. *sigh* Looks like a bunch of those “global warming” facts that just might be an inconvenience to CAGW believers.

  70. Did I hear somebody suggest that Cameron also did Titanic. They already made that movie eons ago; why do it again? (A Night to Remember.)
    I knew there was some reason not to waste the money on it; other than that other green whatshisname who played in it; didn’t he play Howard Hughes ?
    The role models we let them set up for our children !

  71. Then they wanted to ban our cameras from the debate.
    How long can they run and hide? Sorry to say it that way, but that’s what it looks like. It doesn’t make the ‘skeptics’ look bad that it played out like this. It makes them look bad. Global warming has this propensity for hurting itself. The ‘skeptics’ are MORE than ready to lay it all out in the open. That makes them look good. 🙂
    Is there another ClimateGate on the way? It took a ‘-gate’ to get some things into open. Let’s have some more. Anyone on the inside of global warming getting enough yet with seeing this happen with James Cameron? Be a whistleblower.

  72. “”” CodeTech says:
    August 23, 2010 at 1:31 pm
    I have to agree, his apparent behavior indicates that as he “studied up” on the science he realized he was backing the wrong side. However, Avatar was a wonderful film? Compared to what? I was only in awe at how unoriginal it was! And will that generation EVER get tired of painting capitalists as evil, heartless, murderous corporations? I doubt it.
    First half of Titanic was a good movie. Second half, not so good. “””
    Well I can understand the second half being not so good; after all the ship probably sinks in the second half; which is much more unpleasant than all the silly fictional nonsense in the first half.
    One thing about the Titanic disaster is that its history, and the historical details of virtually every single passenger on the ship, have been told and retold so many times that we the public don’t buy any fictional portrayal of those events.
    Would we buy a Hindenberg disaster movie that blamed the disaster on Hydrogen flotation; rather than the skin being built out of high explosives ? I don’t think so.

  73. Jimbo says:
    August 23, 2010 at 2:32 pm
    Al Gore says the debate is over because he had the misfortune of meeting Monckton of Benchley in a verbal joust.
    (Romm to Cameron: Don’t try that at home).

  74. Avatar was fine. It attempted to explain teleconnection as seen in dendroclimatology. The rest of the movie could have been edited for length though. Best watched with a large slice of ham.

  75. Amino Acids in Meteorites says:
    August 23, 2010 at 3:47 pm
    I’d really like to see Phil Jones tell all.
    That’d do it. The man with the historical records to back it up.

  76. I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno and I can tell you first hand what it was like. Moreno not once showed any science disproving CO2 warms the climate. IN fact he showed absolutely no science at all. Instead his purpose seemed to be all about entertainment. He would list quotes (without any context), he would show a polar bear taking a crap, he would show Obama looking at a women’s behind (as if any of this has anything to do with climate change). His lack of ability to show any science angered the audience who could see through his lack of substance.
    The bully in the room was Moreno. He constantly shouted, talked over people when they would ask him a question. I don’t know how the moderator was able to keep his cool. I think debating the science is a very good thing to do, but it’s not possible when people like Moreno use bullying tactics (and absolutely no science but quotes) to make his point. There was a 16 year old kid in the audience who made Moreno look to be an utter fool.
    REPLY: Thanks. Do you know if there is a video record of the presentation available? Was it recorded? – Anthony

  77. Like the majority of science fiction films from Hollywood, they can’t also get the real physics right in real life…. man! since when do we hear sound in space?

  78. Cameron got Cowed by Romm, turned Chicken and ended up bleating about Pigs!
    Truly a master of Play Station modelling.
    Hasta la Vista baby!
    Your integrity lies in tatters, your childish truculence and spite exposed for everyone to see but, don’t over despair, I’m still determined to watch Avatar in 3d!
    My few cents worth of appreciation will still be added to your bank balance.
    Your behaviour in this affair was deplorable and you did yourself no favours by capping with the parting “Swine” shot.
    You were bullied, beaten down or just conned. No shame there. It’s only perpetuation of cowardice that guarantees historical infamy.
    And it’s the rejection of cowardice that defines a hero!

  79. “I attempted several times to return to my presentation, but the crowd and moderator refused to cooperate and seemed completely disinterested.”
    Sorry to be a geek but this is a mission of mine… the difference between ‘Disinterested’ and ‘Uninterested’.
    The crowd was obvioulsy Uninterested in hearing what our man had to say because they had an (serious self-) Interest in maintaining the warming narrative.

  80. “Anybody that is a global-warming denier at this point in time has got their head so deeply up their ass I’m not sure they could hear me.“ Cameron – March 24, 2010
    http://www.macondaily.com/news.asp?id=27730
    I used to like you James.
    Ok, you can get on a jet now and produce some co2. And your movie reels can be sent by plane all over the world too. Good to see your intense drive to save the world. Avatar has made $2.7 billion so far. That’s a lot of reels. But I guess your carbon footprint is a-okay.
    Thanks for being the brave one and showing up at ‘high noon’.
    But you’ll never see this comment. You’re probably somewhere in Hollywood on a cel phone that takes more energy to use than a poor person in Africa is allowed to use in a year.
    Can you hear me? Or is your head ‘deeply up’ your comfortable life?
    I used to think since you were a truck driver years ago you were more in touch with regular people than others in Hollywood. Maybe you used to be. But now, you won’t feel the high price of doing something about this supposed ‘global warming’ problem. So much for being in touch. We’re fu(self snip)d, you’re not.
    Oh, by the way, have you heard about what’s happening to farmers in Australia? Joe Romm probably kept that from you.

  81. Romm and Cameron would have wanted to film the debate themselves. If they did well, they would then show it. Anyway, they are poor losers.

  82. Maybe this is preparation for Cameron’s latest film?
    The self appointed Sherriff of our story boldly calls out the evil Deniers gang for a shoot out at the OK Corral at high noon. The Deniers have been farming their own land and using their own water. They supply food for the town. They refuse to admit that ManBearPig is stealing all the crops. The nerve! The mayor has been confiscating the crops for taxes, and sharing the loot with the sherriff.
    Sherriff Fantasium gathers his deputies and sixguns, invites the whole town, and everyone from all towns around. He even brings in famed gunslinger Kidd Romm. They plot their strategy, and realize they have everything but ammunition.
    At 11:45, Fantasium yells insults down the street at the yet to arrive gang, then jumps on his faithful donkey and begins whipping the crap out of it to get outta Dodge before they show up. The donkey ambles down the road taking a vicious beating the sherriff really wants to give himself. The deputies and gunslinger run like hell.
    Morano shows up bare fisted and says: WTF? Some townsfolk throw tomatoes at their supplier.
    The End. Roll Credits…

  83. latitude says:
    August 23, 2010 at 2:21 pm
    So both Cameron and Romm didn’t think they could defend global warming, even with a stacked audience??
    That’s says it all……………..

    Very interesting way to put it.

  84. Anthony, I’m not sure it was recorded but I do remember a camera set up for filming.
    In retrospect I wish Cameron would have debated Moreno. I think from what I saw from Cameron speaking at the AREDAY events that he is very intelligent and well-educated about climate change issues and as long as the moderator could have contained Moreno’s constant shouting, that Cameron would have won the debate since Moreno seemed incapable of discussing science.

  85. SimonH says:
    August 23, 2010 at 2:43 pm
    *I* liked Avatar……a work of pure fantasy for the thing it really is.. a work of pure fantasy!
    I don’t want to sound like I’m jumping on you.
    I saw James Cameron interviewed on Inside The Actors Studio. He personally believes in the message of Avatar. It sounded like 60’s Generation Marxism to listen to him. He insisted he isn’t anti military though because he has a brother that was in the military. So he said Avatar didn’t have an anti military message, but only in regards to the average soldier. Those in control are of the military are his anti military message.

  86. jeff brown August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno and I can tell you first hand what it was like. Moreno not once showed any science disproving CO2 warms the climate. IN fact he showed absolutely no …

    A) nice ‘strawman’ arg you’ve set up (“Moreno not once showed any science disproving CO2 warms the climate”; I think we actually have some idea what the CO2 molecule DOES in an energy flux field such as we see vis-a-vis thermal IR radiation)
    and B) We’ll wait for the camera-phone video to ‘back this up’. (What? Were you born yesterday?)
    .

  87. This is just another publicity stunt. This is kind of thing I would expect from the evangelistic anti Darwin crowd. AGW is little more then religion under the facade of humanism. No religion I am aware of tolerates decent from the dogma. People like Cameron are not interested in anything but making themselves and their cause look good. He should be ignored specifically at the box office.

  88. “I have to agree, his apparent behavior indicates that as he “studied up” on the science he realized he was backing the wrong side.”
    I think it’s much more likely that as he studied up on the science he realized he was woefully underqualified for the task he had taken on. I think the truth is that Joe Romm made James Cameron understand that he was getting in completely over his head. The man’s a film director. I’m sure he *feels* very strongly (“swine” isn’t a subtle word) about the whole global warming/climate change issue but that’s no substitute for understanding the details of the physics and the statistics. Once his absolute un-mastery of the subject was bared he would have been left with simply babbling repeatedly, “But all real scientists say it’s true.” And that isn’t going to win any debate, even one in front of a friendly audience. It was hubris on his part to agree to the debate in the first place and an act of self-preservation to run away when it finally dawned on him that he had no clue what he was doing.
    Reply: Bingo ~ ctm

  89. George E. Smith says:
    August 23, 2010 at 3:58 pm
    Would we buy a Hindenberg disaster movie that blamed the disaster on Hydrogen flotation; rather than the skin being built out of high explosives ? I don’t think so.

    No, but if Michael Moore really likes poking sticks at big boys and thier games, he’d love to do an expose on AGW.
    In the meantime, where’s Leanord Nimoy gotten off to?
    He’s due for the filming of The Coming Ice Age: Revenge of the Ice Cream Truck.

  90. This in the article where Jimmy the Crow is quoted, “they’re swine”.
    It’s worse than we thought…
    ‘Greene, Cameron and a host of other climate-change activists said there needs to be a broad educational campaign, one aimed at convincing voters and politicians that not being able to prove that fossil fuel-produced carbon is changing the temperature of Earth is not a license for inaction.’
    ___________________
    Uh-hemm, really? I was thinking that not being able to prove that the temperature was changing is a perfectly sound reason for not wasting billions of our tax dollars, oh well…silly me.
    On the one hand, I initially thought, the comment below was a riot and started laughing. Then I thought of the depths these people are willing to sink to and almost up-chucked. Really? 50%!? A full half of the media’s attention!?! For less than 1% of the scientists? Only wish that were true. I’d like to see the source for THOSE statistics!
    ___________________
    ‘They also criticized the media for giving half of its attention to a very small — less than 1 percent, they said — portion of scientists who say global warming is not caused by humans.’
    Pathetic, wrong, and malicious.

  91. jeff brown says:
    August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno and I can tell you first hand what it was like. Moreno not once showed any science….
    I can believe you. This is why I don’t like people with a political mindset in these presentations/debates. I don’t want to see someone being a Republican. I would want to see the science presented. It should be people like Lindzen, Christy, Happer, Spencer, but also Lord Monckton. They will all answer with the data. And I would think they would keep a cool head.

  92. jeff brown says:
    August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    =====================
    Interested to read about the slating Morano got in the debating chamber when he started. I wonder if anyone has a copy of his presentation to verify the claims made by you.

  93. Ooops! To correct my post above:
    I wish it true that we had ‘half of the media’s attention’, and I believe we may have a smidge above the ‘less than 1%’ of the scientists claimed, and would go one step further to say we have 99.9% of the scientists that have the skills and ability set to be critical investigators/thinkers.

  94. kcon, I don’t agree with you.
    Romm was supposed to be at the table with him.
    It was Romm that changed it to no cameras or media.
    Both Cameron and Romm backed out.
    They both backed out at the last minute.
    ==================================================
    kcom says:
    August 23, 2010 at 5:04 pm
    I think it’s much more likely that as he studied up on the science he realized he was woefully underqualified for the task he had taken on. I think the truth is that Joe Romm made James Cameron understand that he was getting in completely over his head.
    ========================================================
    Morano said:
    “Finally, we were told Cameron would debate us if Romm joined the debate and at Romm’s insistence there would be no cameras or media present. We agreed and I flew to Aspen”

  95. So did he retreat on his private jet to his 730 acre ranch, Malibu mansion, Santa Barbara gated home or one of his other properties?

  96. Could Mr Morano post his ppt somewhere on line? That would shed some light on a couple of questions raised here.

  97. I’m surprised I haven’t seen any comments about having the conference in ASPEN of all places. Why not Denver instead? How much extra carbon was put into the atmosphere to reach the more remote destination? If the many atmospheric scientists from Boulder drove there, that’s nearly a 4 hour drive and over 200 miles! It’s a similar time/distance from DIA. Flying into Aspen is also an option, but I assume that would put even more emissions into the atmosphere than driving, right?
    If saving the earth from CO2 is so important, why place the conference at a place that’s so difficult to get to? Or even better, why not make it a teleconference?
    My own experiences with conferences are similar…tend to be at highly extravagant hotels or even resorts/casinos. My advisor routinely goes to conferences at other locations in the Rockies, such as Breckenridge.
    Just my thoughts,
    -Scott

  98. “”” jeff brown says:
    August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno and I can tell you first hand what it was like. Moreno not once showed any science…. “””
    Well You say you were in the room; and you can tell us first hand that thee was no science presented. So how come it is that twice in one line, you can’t even spell the speaker’s name correctly.
    Marc Morano, it is well known is NOT a climate scientist; and he has never presented himself as such; he is a reporter; and he reports what others are saying about the climate issues; and most often that is purely political; which is why he is able to speak on it as ably as anybody.
    But then the “Scientists” didn’t show up to debate; did they; so why talk science when the experts don’t show.
    Amazing how the AGW crowd have to resort to deliberate and obvious mis-spellings to try and fool the search engines that otherwise would keep on turning up the articles by people who actually get published.
    Perhaps if the AGW folks presented some science at places like WUWT, then the search engines would start to notice their writings also.
    You have to think we are all as dumb as a box of rocks to not see your too obvious shenanigans.
    You can spell it WUTW, WWUT, WWTU, UTWW, or anyway you want; but it won’t stop the bell from ringing for the clear leader.
    And if you can’t spell Morano correctly; it isn’t going to cut into his traffic either.

  99. Cameron probably got together with his minions to go over the talking points and started seeing all the holes in his views, then panicked…..

  100. jeff brown August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    So Moreno’s presentation was weak and easily refuted? Hmmmm. I guess James Cameron missed a huge opportunity to easily refute Moreno in person.
    Perhaps James had the flu or something. It does happen. How about a rematch?

  101. Classic case of how controversies get tangled up, with facts and with other controversies.
    Breitbart is a swine, although not for his opinions about climate but for his faked, racist videos.
    Then Cameron attacks a renewable energy project at a renewable energy conference, apparently to applause.
    You can’t tell the players without a program, can you?

  102. This is so typical – there is a community out there who totally believe in AGW – there’s nothing that will sway their opinion and as they all hang together in the arts and creative industries they don’t hear another opinion. If you tell them that the science has been proven wrong they reply with the “But we can’t continue polluting the environment” or the “we have to move to renewable energy someday so why not now” arguments or of course the appeal to authority in the consensus angle.
    Unfortunately our scientists have lost all credibility – the best example is the recently released Beyond Zero Emission’s report on how to take Australia to a zero emission renewable energy status in 10 years. Anyone who takes the time to follow up on the two renewable energy systems proposed in the report (solar thermal power stations capable of 24 hour operation at 217MW and wind generators capable of delivering 7.5MW) will find that neither of them exist yet here we have leading scientists from the world community supporting the plan!! It’s because it appeals to their social philosophy, not their science, as it should.
    I’m sure Cameron was complimented and encouraged by his artsy friends and acquaintances but unfortunately once a serious scientist told him what level of debate to expect and the flaws in the whole proposal he headed for the hills as fast as he could.

  103. Jeff Brown,
    As you attended the conference, and had a ticket for the climate session, do you have any idea why Cameron opted out of the debate? Did you hear anyone speculate about the cancelation? Considering the negative publicity Mr. Cameron was sure to get for his backing out at the last minute, I’m just surprised he did. Perplexing.

  104. Incidentally, Cameron had tried the same trick with talk host Mike Siegel for a different event. Sounds like he was trying to make lots of prominent “deniers” look like cowards by playing this bizarre rule-changing game. Obviously didn’t work.

  105. Where are was the media during the conference? Did areday only invites global warming sympathizers to the meeting? It would be interesting if someone leaked a video to the mass media. Romm and Cameron are like two kids that badger someone to pick a fight and back down when their bluff is called. Very immature behavior on the part of the moderator also.

  106. I don’t want to sound like I’m jumping on you.

    Don’t worry, I’m not sensitive 🙂

    I saw James Cameron interviewed on Inside The Actors Studio. He personally believes in the message of Avatar.

    I understand. But I don’t believe in his message. But, to enjoy the film for what it was, I don’t need to believe in his analogy. The idea of living a symbiotic rather than parasitic existence – a portion of the message, I presume – is not offensive to me. But Cameron’s politics, where they depart wildly from mine, are anyway superfluous to the spectacle of Avatar, and to my appreciation of it as well. No, it doesn’t have a particularly good narrative and yes, it is a re-hash of a many-times told tale, but I’ve come to expect a certain thing out of Hollywood that bears little if any relation to reality, and which visually knock my socks off. Avatar doesn’t disappoint in the great scheme of all things Hollywood.
    I’m not so lacking in confidence in my own ideological viewpoint that I fear subjecting myself to someone else’s perspective or sales-pitch. Even if it IS two and a half hours long and involves blue humanoids, weird buffalo-cum-rhinoceros-type creatures and more.

  107. Scott, it’s always do as I say not as I do.
    What would you bet that NOAA has more elite qualifiers in frequent flyer programs than any other government organization? I know one guy a couple of years ago at the end of the year who flew to LA and back on the same day (never leaving LAX) so that he made 100K miles.
    Susan Soloman bemoans how much time she spends flying all over the world (without any guilt).

  108. This is the best thing that could have happened for Moreno. What sort of points would he score debating this hollywood clown? Moreno would be accused of taking advantage of a challanged person. Better to wait for a chance to debate Hansen or Mann, not that they’ll ever get caught in any position where they would have to defend their illusions.

  109. After all, on Planet earth, there are more creatures that look like Lobsters, than look like humans; so the human form is hardly a survival winning strategy.
    However, the human form — especially the attractive female human form with a very thin decorative veneer of mild alienness layered over it — is certainly a winning strategy for mass-marketed entertainment.
    Let’s hear it from Mr. James Cameron himself, who said about the lead female protagonist of his alien-world eco-fable, “Right from the beginning I said, ‘She’s got to have tits,’ even though that makes no sense because her race, the Na’vi, aren’t placental mammals. ”
    We can reasonably suppose that a lobster with tits would not have put as many butts in seats for his profoundly silly movie. Nope, bring on the scientifically senseless hot blue chick.
    And this fellow holds himself up as an expert on climate? The mind boggles.

  110. The whole point of CAGW nowadays is to make rich people richer. I do not know if Cameron has his snout in the trough [I mean : … is investing wisely in renewable energy]. Certainly some people think Al Gore has made his first billion, no doubt with more to come if he keeps it going.
    The clever thing is to get people who will be badly affected by the expensive ‘remedies’ to support it. To get turkeys not only voting for Christmas, but demanding it be Christmas every day.
    The CAGW scare will only be over when the governments are no longer be able to support the heavy subsidies which makes it all so worthwhile. By that time the countries may be bankrupt and their industry in ruins, but if you are rich enough that won’t matter.

  111. Six months ago this little kerfuffle would have infuriated me. Now I find myself laughing. The problem with ideologues is that they exist on the fumes of hysteria, on emotion. Their modus operandi is to hector, to harangue. A rational debate on the facts would reveal the empty underpinnings of their alarmist message. Imagine if the Nazis had been forced to rationally defend the vicious mythology they used to whip up the crowds. How could you end a rousing “Renewable Energy Day” with a splash of cold facts from people who know something about energy and the climate?
    This is progress. But as Enneagram says (August 23, 2010 at 2:14 pm), don’t imagine for a moment that we have defeated the enviro-fascists, who still dominate in the halls of government, academia, and media. A few cold facts aren’t going to stand in their way; they’ll just duck the debates, and do their best to silence the ‘deniers’. It may seem silly to us now, but history is full of True Believers (cf. the work of that title by Eric Hoffer) who are perfectly happy to muzzle, jail, and kill those who deny their avowed ‘Truth’. Today’s idle threats and bravado could be tomorrow’s guillotine.
    /Mr Lynn

  112. Cameron, Cameron, Cameron….tisk tisk tisk…mmm….mmm…mmm.
    Never have seem avitar….never plan to.

  113. The reality is even Romm knows the real score – as he encouraged Cameron NOT to debate. Guys, if your position is so unassailable, why no debate? Why don’t you just put an end to this controversy so we can move on to truly important issues? Oh, because a debate might just end it – with you on the losing side.
    This is just another data point confirming that the AGW hypothesis is weak at best & AGW is really just a left wing political movement parading as science. Sad. A huge disservice to science & humanity. A prime example of the saying “The road to hell is paved with good intentions”.

  114. reminds me of the movie “the untouchables” when the guy is confronted by Sean Connery and he states, “typical w…., shows up to a gun fight with a knife”, James Cameron bails out of the Ok Corral…(debate)

  115. R. Shearer August 23, 2010 at 7:19 pm

    Susan Soloman bemoans how much time she spends flying all over the world (without any guilt).

    Eeek!
    Have these people never seen the results of cloud chamber experiments performed at altitude? (That alone is enough to dissuade me from flying frequently!)
    Oh, right! I forgot … (forthemostpart) they’re not ‘hard science’ types …
    Personally, I fancy a full 30,000 plus feet of ‘buffer’ between me and the galactic ‘out there’ …
    Refs – Cosmic Rays:
    http://authors.library.caltech.edu/4970/1/ADApr49.pdf
    http://www.robfatland.net/MainSequence/CosmicRays.html
    http://www.jstor.org/pss/97338
    .

  116. Chris Thorne says:
    August 23, 2010 at 7:35 pm
    “… a lobster with tits…”
    Thanks for the laugh Chris. What an image this conjures up! One for Josh?

  117. Jeff Brown,

    The bully in the room was Moreno. He constantly shouted, talked over people when they would ask him a question.

    This seems peculiar. I thought Moreno was to be allowed to make a presentation and then there was to be Q & A. From what Moreno says, he wasn’t allowed to make his presentation. When the moderator and the audience are interrupting, a speaker has every right to shout over the interruption. My guess is that you’re not being honest about what happened.

  118. I enjoyed Avatar for the visual effects and the popcorn even though it was clearly Triumph of the Will for Malthusians. ; )

  119. It now pleases me that i have seen Avatar at 30.000 feet while flying intercontinental.
    Still as Camaron claims it, his sci-fi movies must have near future technology to make us comfortable, and it works quite well in Aliens and Avatar, its not over the top technology. But if you you are so up into believable technology, and lets be honest, the starship at the start in the movie “Avatar” screams technical functionality apart from the super-physics propulsionsystem, the guns brought in still make a lot of noise and throw a lot of brass around, the exoskeletons are not that far fetched.
    How come that one like Camaron would fall for the whole “CO2 is the root cause of AGW)”?

  120. Heh…. James Cameron is one of the first hour guest on Coast to Coast AM right now.
    http://www.coasttocoastam.com/
    Call-In Phone Numbers and International Access Codes
    Western US: 1-800-618-8255 (toll free)
    Eastern US: 1-800-825-5033 (toll free)
    First time caller: 1-818-501-4721
    Wild Card line: 1-818-501-4109 (anyone can call)
    Skype users call: george97313

  121. Guys, this is the equation you’re looking for.
    “Call Me Joe” + Fern Gully = Avatar.
    I think you’ll find it’s solid science.

  122. Dave Dardinger, Morano was asked if he wants to take questions during his talk or for questions to come afterwards. He answered that he would prefer to have the questions come when people thought of them as that would be more affective. I am not at all being dishonest about his presentation.
    I do hope his presentation is put online someplace so everyone can see it.

  123. J. Knight, no I do not know why Cameron opted out of the debate. I don’t know if it was ever supposed to be a debate as I was not privy to that info

  124. George, really? Is that all you can find to complain about, a spelling typo? Seems you could do more useful things with your time than that.

  125. Amino Acids, I completely agree with you. It would have been great to have an actual scientist who is a skeptic on GHGs affecting our climate come and talk about why they believe that rather than some entertainer with political motives. We need to remove politics from the debate in order for anyone to get a real education on both sides of the fence.
    Still I have never understood the resistance to believe that human activities can affect climate. I don’t think any scientist out there believes GHGs are 100% responsible for the observed warming since they know natural variability plays a role. Seems to me the real debate is on how much of the warming is due to natural variability and how much is due to increasing concentrations of GHGs in the atmosphere from human activities. So having scientists show their data/analysis addressing this very question is what I think is needed in order for us all to make informed decisions.

  126. When you have an indefensible viewpoint, it is only natural that you should not want to publicly debate it. It is much simpler to dictate your views/policy, thus removing the awkward need to listen to either moderation or reason.
    Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot are all examples of this, nowadays we have similar examples: Fidel Castro, Kim Il Sung, the Taliban, Al Gore and this guy Cameron.
    Their motto – as with all AGW fanatics – is the same: Dictate, do not Debate.

  127. Yes, Avatar is a New Age and anti-capitalist propaganda film which is the reason it was so incredibly hyped up in the media but then didn’t do particularly well at the Oscars. They wanted everyone to see it. History is repeating itself.. but there’ll be no Hollywood Ten this time around. Cameron is a coward and a shill for the people responsible for undermining our society. Would be a ‘terrible’ thing if the skeptics beat him in a debate and it was recorded (officially or otherwise) for the world to see!

  128. SimonHsays: August 23, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    I also don’t really believe the Harry Potter film makers are really telling us that there’s a Hogwarts, or that we should be extra nice to kids with glasses because some of them might really be wizards.

    However, their movies have substance and do follow the message contained in the books—basically that the good guys in the white hats will eventually defeat the evil guys in the black hats (or with crooked wands).

  129. @Paul R says: August 23, 2010 at 9:58 pm
    “I enjoyed Avatar for the visual effects and the popcorn even though it was clearly Triumph of the Will for Malthusians. ; )”
    I don’t go in for these fantasy epics so I haven’t seen Avatar and only about 10 minutes of Harry Potter & Lord of the Rings.
    But I’ve seen and admire Battleship Potemkin on the one hand and Triumph of the Will on the other, although the politics behind both is just as bad as Avatar.
    But, having seen some of Cameron’s other stuff, I don’t think you can seriously consider him a great (or even important) film director, as some other commenters on here suggest.
    Whereas Eisenstein was certainly great and Leni Riefenstahl was certainly extremely talented.
    But pernicious ideology is still pernicious, no matter how skillfully it is presented.

  130. Avatar was visually spectacular, but the theme was the same tired old story of the wicked mining company versus the good people – of David over coming Goliath.
    This type of thinking seems to be prevalent among greenies, liberals and lefties, who forget the fundamental truth: IF IT CAN’T BE GROWN, IT’S GOTTA BE MINED.
    This is similar to the thinking of the AGW crowd, who conveniently ignore the fact that the economic impact of the proposed ‘cure’ for their non-existent problem will be hugely deleterious to humanity.

  131. Couple of things I’m surprised the alarmists have not put out a cost in co2 for every $ spent, I guess it’s against their religion to villify money directly because if they did they would have to justify their millionaire lifestyles, how much was the budget for avatar again?
    Also mr Cameron seems to advocate smoking in most of his films, how does that square with environmentalism I’ve seen a lot of green nutters directly adding co2 burning lighter fuel and adding methane and co2 to the air, I guess smoking to them must be carbon neutral in the same way it was advertised in the 50’s as being good for your throat. If we did face food shortages we would need to replace tobacco crops for food crops anyway, hypocrites the lot of them!

  132. I’ve met Cameron twice. I count him as a friend. He’s a very creative and fiery person and loves science, but on this he is very wrong and I always expected him to be a fast enough learner to know it. The problem is that the higher profile a person is the harder it is for them to change direction on public affairs.
    Anyway, I’m glad he bailed out on this debate and it is a good thing he did not try to debate this with a qualified scientist such as Christy instead of the three media personalities chosen.

  133. jeff brown says: August 23, 2010 at 4:05 pm

    I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno… I think debating the science is a very good thing to do, but it’s not possible when people like Moreno use bullying tactics…

    Lotsa bitta stories. Marc was in mid-flight before he was told the debate was off. So his presentation was, maybe, pretty impromptu. I’d emailed him thus:

    I’d like to suggest you point towards the importance of the quiet persistence of the likes of Steve McIntyre, and indeed the importance of accountability, openness, and comprehensible, repeatable statistics; the non-existence of any “big oil” funding in almost all sceptics’ efforts; the high level of science as well as “green” concerns among skeptics, and the general counter-productivity to Science when it becomes “alarmist”. People will expect you to deliver a blustery speech and it would be interesting to see the effect of the opposite.

    but that arrived after the event, about which Marc simply said “Things did not go well”.
    Actually, I think things did go well, insofar as the resultant publicity loudly shows up Cameron as a fool. But from my POV, two people whose work I like have been shown up as having feet of clay. Cameron (I did like Avatar) and Morano (well, probably, if Jeff Brown is right as seems at least partly likely).

  134. And this happened just as his very good friend Mr Obama was removing all on line references to policies controlling CO2 from his cyber-history.
    Those Blackberries sure are useful things.

  135. That panzerpant Romm and the warmist crowd would behave like the stark raving made horde gone postal was of course to be expected it seems, but that James Cameron would throw in his, used to be known as, whitey tidy with all that support. ROFL what a stinker.

  136. Check out the body language in this video:

    Quite revealing if you ask me. I think that kcom got it right when he said:
    August 23, 2010 at 5:04 pm
    I think it’s much more likely that as he studied up on the science he realized he was woefully underqualified for the task he had taken on. I think the truth is that Joe Romm made James Cameron understand that he was getting in completely over his head. The man’s a film director. I’m sure he *feels* very strongly (“swine” isn’t a subtle word) about the whole global warming/climate change issue but that’s no substitute for understanding the details of the physics and the statistics. Once his absolute un-mastery of the subject was bared he would have been left with simply babbling repeatedly, “But all real scientists say it’s true.” And that isn’t going to win any debate, even one in front of a friendly audience. It was hubris on his part to agree to the debate in the first place and an act of self-preservation to run away when it finally dawned on him that he had no clue what he was doing.

  137. LarryD: August 23, 2010 at 2:29 pm
    I pegged Avatar as “Dances With Wolves… IN SPACE”.
    Three hundred million dollars for CGI and he couldn’t spend ten bucks for a plot…

  138. There seem to be a number of comments around here about Obama quietly getting rid of his climate commitments. Intrigued, I just took a look at his website. Global warming still figures large:
    “The Current Situation
    The country that harnesses the power of clean, renewable energy will lead the 21st century. For too long, politicians in Washington have been beholden to special interests, but no longer. Our new, responsible energy policy recognizes the relationship between energy, the environment, and our economy and leverages American ingenuity to put people back to work, fight global warming, increase our energy independence and keep us safe.”
    http://www.barackobama.com/issues/newenergy/index.php
    Am I missing something?

  139. jeff brown says:
    I was in the room during the presentation by Moreno and I can tell you first hand what it was like. Moreno not once showed any science disproving CO2 warms the climate. IN fact he showed absolutely no science at all.
    Moreno says
    I attempted several times to return to my presentation, but the crowd and moderator refused to cooperate and seemed completely disinterested.
    End
    So Mr Brown
    As you didn’t disagree with Moreno’s statement.
    Did you see enough of Moreno’s presentation to be able to judge the content?
    lol@Anthony
    I am sure some doctored film will surface soon.

  140. The enviromental’s after spending the 1900’s being bullied and pointed and laughed at finally have there 15 minutes of fame and what do they do with it, why bully, laugh and point.
    And the way they treated him at the conference just goes to show they maybe all women in fake beards but to be honest they’ll stone the first person they can without a shred of integrity amongst them.
    Did anyone see news night last night? people always look diffrent in person.

  141. One argument for his non-attendence, that most certainly would have been put to him, is that by having a serious debate with sceptics shows that sceptics are worthy of serious debate, and that there must be ‘no public platform’ for deniers else they become legitimized as human beings with minds of their own and equal right to use them. The actual reason for his no-show is not yet known.

  142. Who is James Cameron? He is a good story teller; movie maker. Is he a scientist? Definitely not. So why dabble in science? Because he does not know what science is, therefore he thinks he knows it. A real case of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing.
    So there he goes, swinging his 6 shooter challenging everyone for duel, then seeing Henry Fonda coming out into the street and Romm tells Cameron that he’s got no chance against this guy Fonda, being the fastest gun around. So, the only thing he can do (and Romm) is run for it at when the clock strikes 12 noon. Can Cameron produce a remake of High Noon with such an ending? I wonder.
    I know that it has been said a hundred times, but I cannot not say it. Chickens.

  143. The whole movie had too much Gaea (sp?) for me. Totally science fantasy mixed with religion, up to and including a resurrection.

  144. Noelene, yes I did see enough of his presentation to judge the content. Since Morano is not a scientist and was not able to actually talk about science, he instead focused on quotes from various people saying the debate is over, or he would show a pole number saying the majority of scientists do not believe GHGs are causing the warming, or he would show quotes stating it’s all junk science (though I’m sure he doesn’t think climate scientists like Lindzen and Spencer do junk science). It was primarily a “shock” value set of slides and quotes, a lot of it having no relevance to the actual debate over whether or not increases of CO2 in the atmosphere are altering the Earth’s temperature (though he did say that he believes CO2 absorbs infrared radiation and warms temperatures).
    What seemed obvious was that the audience could see through his “fluff” and was frustrated that he was not showing any actual science to support his beliefs. They kept asking him to skip all these quotes he would show on every slide and get down to the real science of the issue. I think the presentation was simply one he normally gives to get people fired up and clap after each slide (sort of like a campaign rally).
    I have seen numerous science talks in my life and they are calm and focus on showing data and calmly take and answer questions. This was my first time seeing a politcal talk on climate change and its methodology is completely different; yell, talk over people, don’t let people finish their sentences, go for shock value, etc. I truly felt like I was at a campaign rally.

  145. Morano is not a scientist …
    audience … was frustrated that he was not showing any actual science
    Explains the ‘audience frustration’ very well indeed.
    Maybe James Cameron would have shown them the science.

  146. Henry chance says:
    August 23, 2010 at 2:29 pm
    Romm is afraid. Very afraid. He pushed and Cameron is now hiding from confrontation. Remember November?
    Now the consensus is to duck and run.

    ——————–
    Henry chance,
    Remember November!
    Catchy phrase, that is.
    John

  147. jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 8:03 am
    I did see enough of his presentation to judge the content. Since Morano is not a scientist and was not able to actually talk about science…
    So which are you complaining about – the fact that he “isn’t a scientist” or that he didn’t/couldn’t talk about the science (not being a scientist)?
    Frankly, your accounting of what transpired seems very suspect, as do your motives.
    If only there were a video, or even audio of what went on….Oh, right, they wouldn’t allow that. How convenient.

  148. So you challenged a guy to a fight, blindfolded him and tied one hand behind his back and STILL ran away?!? Cameron you are a pathetic coward.

  149. Bruce, I have no motives except to tell it like it is. I’m surprised you don’t think Morano has a motive here. He shows up after “he” says the “debate” was “canceled” and was more than happy to give a talk and was smiling the entire time, loving firing up the audience, he gets his name all around the blogosphere and you think this wasn’t orchestrated? I think Morano likely had this planned all along in order to give himself more visibility and publicity. After watching him speak I certainly didn’t walk away thinking the guy was honest in any way.

  150. Bruce, seems you are quick to believe whatever Morano has to say, but you appear closed-minded to listen to another person’s point of view who was actually there. Morano has a political agenda, I do not. I went there to get educated.

  151. Just for my own enlightenment – it doesn’t seem like any of the people on the skeptic side of the debate were scientists. So wouldn’t that place Cameron on the same level?

  152. ” jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 9:10 am
    I think Morano likely had this planned all along in order to give himself more visibility and publicity.”
    So Morano can manipulate this Cameron fellow like a puppet on a string? Make him say “yes, yes, yes, no” and whatever else whenever he wants to?

  153. ” jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 9:20 am
    Bruce, seems you are quick to believe whatever Morano has to say, but you appear closed-minded to listen to another person’s point of view who was actually there. Morano has a political agenda, I do not. I went there to get educated.”
    I would definitely side with Jeff on this. Having seen Morano appear on television a couple of times my opinion of him is not a positive one. He has been loud and rudely overbearing and seems to enjoy taunting his opponents rather than simply engaging with them. From Cameron’s comments about skeptics being ‘swine’, perhaps this was to be a match made in heaven. I’m glad it was called off.

  154. >>Avatar was a wonderful film, made by a gutless wonder. Who knew?
    ‘Avatar’ was ‘Dances With Wolves’ in space, and disgracefully anti American too.
    Two ‘crimes’ in one film – plagiarism and traitorism – not bad. Had Cameron been a citizen of many other regimes around the world, he would have been thrown in the slammer for such a disgraceful film.
    .

  155. jeff brown says:
    August 23, 2010 at 10:56 pm
    . . . . [edit] . . . Still I have never understood the resistance to believe that human activities can affect climate. I don’t think any scientist out there believes GHGs are 100% responsible for the observed warming since they know natural variability plays a role. Seems to me the real debate is on how much of the warming is due to natural variability and how much is due to increasing concentrations of GHGs in the atmosphere from human activities. So having scientists show their data/analysis addressing this very question is what I think is needed in order for us all to make informed decisions.

    —————————-
    jeff brown ,
    In your above quote, I think the use of the words ‘belief’ or ‘believe’ are inappropriate when used in the context of a scientific dialog on climate or any other subject matter of science. I think it is at the crux of the ongoing dialog between the so-called consensus climate science community and those independent of it.
    In the context of your quote:

    “. . . [edit] . . . Still I have never understood the resistance to believe that human activities can affect climate. . . [edit]. . .”

    I offer this understanding of mine:

    [following are my words] A key to understanding how consensus climate science got to the current situation is the basic yearning need for many human beings to believe in something and their tendency to resist some independent person’s contradiction of their belief by critical analysis and evidence of untainted/objective data. When independents engage in critical analysis and evidence of untainted/objective data, well, we get the current situation in climate science dialog.

    The situation now stands as a overdramatic interaction of consensus and independents.
    It is overdramatic due to involvement of beliefs. From now on, it would be good to abandon beliefs. We need open discussion on any open forum that is available. Beliefs mentioned in that open discussion can be weeded out mercilessly and persistently. A direct consequent of having no beliefs involved is no more seclusion of data or code or methods for publically funded climate science papers published in science journals.
    On another note, I recommend we leave the kind of discussion where somebody says Morano-said-this and somebody else says no-Morano-said-that. Proof will only be in the live video in unedited form. Until that shows up then there is nothing left to say.
    John

  156. “”” jeff brown says:
    August 23, 2010 at 10:48 pm
    George, really? Is that all you can find to complain about, a spelling typo? Seems you could do more useful things with your time than that. “””
    Who’s complaining ? We all make typos; I do it all the time. Mostly it is a physical keyboard dylsexia where my fingers flip pairs of letters including the space bar. I normally go back and edit, to remove them but sometimes I don’t catch them all.
    But it stretches one’s credulity to believe it’s a typo, when you repeat the exact same incorrect spelling even in a longer post where you used the name more than a handful of times. You say you went to the meeting; I don’t doubt that; never did.
    But why would anybody bother to go to any meeting, where they didn’t even know who the speaker was, to the degree they could spell the name correctly.
    We never comment on typos here or typically anywhere on the web. It is part of the culture that people writing open kimono, will make misteaks, so we let them slide.
    Dr Richard Lederer, the world’s foremost authority on the English Language (American) routinely uses misspellings in his writings, as a figure of speech; often replacing a word with a differently spelled word that sounds the same, and also has a quite different meaning; usually for comedic effect. In a recent letter to me he wrote the word “cymbalism” instead of “symbolism”, because the comment was of a musical nature.
    I often deliberately spell words incorrectly simply to break the monotony, or arrest a reader’s attention.
    But then there is this new pernicious habit when commenting about rivals/enemies/opponents and the like to deliberately spell the name incorrectly, to divert search engines; in the belief that any comment about someone in disfavor, is still a comment that can be discovered by searches. Such as the brillinat folks over at RC routinely do with WUWT.
    If you went to a Marc Morano lecture in the belief that you were going to learn some new climate science; something of his own research, rather than a report on what somebody else had reported; then you went to the wrong lecture. He is a reporter; and all he does is uncover things others have written or said, and makes them available to a wider audience. If you want to criticize that; criticize the authors of the stories he finds. Shooting the messenger is not an effective strategy.
    The reporters who “leaked” the so-called Pentagon Papers became National heroes. Nobody even remembers what the blazes those papers were about.

  157. Well Cameron’s spokesperson; whoever that is, says that Cameron should only be debating persons who are of equivalent stature to him in society.
    So clearly the debate was not going to be about science; but more about social status. Well lah-de-dah !

  158. You will discover i think that the warmists have commenced a very successful tactic in their defence of their position. It is referred to as “Totschweigtaktik” which is German for “death by silence”. In the 1930’s It was used by the left leaning literati to attempt to deny oxygen to George Orwell’s crittique of Stalinist intervention in Spain “homage to Catalonia” and is being applied to Dr Bob Carter in Australia. They will refuse to engage in debate by saying that “there is no debate” it is as if serious scientists are debating creationism. I know it sounds a little paranoid and when some opinion is not published the complaints may sound like whingeing and whining and in that lies the strength of the tactic. for interesting reading may i recomend http://www.quadrant.org.au/magazine/issue/2010/7-8/death-by-silence-in-the-writers-combat-zone
    and
    http://www.quadrant.org.au/blogs/doomed-planet/2010/03/abc-gags-bob-carter

  159. George E. Smith: August 24, 2010 at 11:18 am
    Well Cameron’s spokesperson; whoever that is, says that Cameron should only be debating persons who are of equivalent stature to him in society.
    Is there an equivalent phrase for “noblesse oblige” when referring to a pipsqueak blowhard…?

  160. “Well Cameron’s spokesperson; whoever that is, says that Cameron should only be debating persons who are of equivalent stature to him in society.”
    No fair! Why should WUWT readers have to wait for Cameron to get up to our stature before he is allowed to debate us?

  161. ““I want to call those deniers out into the street at high noon and shoot it out with those boneheads,” he said in an interview.”
    Mr. Cameron realized that it’s not a good idea to bring a butter knife to a gunfight.

  162. jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 9:20 am
    Bruce, seems you are quick to believe whatever Morano has to say, but you appear closed-minded to listen to another person’s point of view who was actually there. Morano has a political agenda, I do not. I went there to get educated.
    First, I wasn’t even there, so how would I know what Marc Marano said. Secondly, unlike you Warmists, I’m not apt to simply believe anything someone says based on who they are, or what credentials they might have. You say Marc Morano “has a political agenda”. Perhaps so. I would say that that “agenda” involves fighting what has become probably the biggest lie in the history of mankind, i.e. that a benign, entirely beneficial gas has been made enemy number 1, for various reasons, be they political, economic, job security, self-aggrandizement, etc. etc. The Warmist side has used politics from Day 1 on this issue in order better to support what has turned out to be incredibly weak science. Now when those who are pushing back, (and very successfully I might add) use politics, this is somehow considered foul play. Their hypocrisy indeed knows no bounds.
    I still say that your view of what transpired is one-sided. I would want to hear what Marc has to say as well. In the end, we will never really know, though, without actual video footage. People’s agendas do have a way of coloring their memory.

  163. Shub Niggurath says:
    August 24, 2010 at 10:22 am
    Ralph
    Cameron is Canadian. The Canadians are left-leaning, so…
    Be careful about such assupmtions. I’m Canadian and am defininately not left leaning, nor are many others, particularily out west. Although a minority, we currently have a Conservative government in Ottawa. If you don’t know your facts you should keep comments such as those to yourself. I personally don’t care that Cameron is a Canadian. Anyone who calls somebody out, then runs, is a punk. It doesn’t matter where they are from.

  164. Cameron makes fantastic movies, but should really leave climate change to “the experts”, like Dr. James “thumb on the temperature scale” Hansen, and Michael “I reconstructed the entire world’s temperature using one pine tree proxy in the Yamal Penninsula” Mann.

  165. “”” George E. Smith says:
    August 24, 2010 at 11:18 am
    Well Cameron’s spokesperson; whoever that is, says that Cameron should only be debating persons who are of equivalent stature to him in society.
    So clearly the debate was not going to be about science; but more about social status. Well lah-de-dah ! “””
    I have Marc Morano’s comment on what happened; from which I extracted the above information. I’m sure Anthony has it too, so if he wants to put out something from it he can.

  166. Stu, have a look at this video, in which Marc Morano was treated to utter rudeness by both the moderator and Andrew Watson, is given less than half the speaking time as Watson, and who is finally called an A**hole by Watson. Despite that treatment, Marc remains remarkably calm, even cheery, no doubt somewhat amused by their antics and desperation to keep him from speaking:

    I have no doubt that he is a lightning rod for Warmist hatred of the truth, and for anyone who dares speak it. He has to be made of strong stuff, and is to be admired. They don’t call this “climate wars” for nothing.

  167. Chris Thorne says (August 23, 2010 at 7:35 pm): “We can reasonably suppose that a lobster with tits would not have put as many butts in seats for his profoundly silly movie. Nope, bring on the scientifically senseless hot blue chick.”
    Heh. IMHO the maker of “Titanic” really “missed the boat” on this one. If you have to make the “aliens” look hot for the box office, why not make a virtue of necessity and incorporate that into the plot? The Na’vi look human-ish because–surprise!–they are! Pandora looks like a Disney Adventureland theme park because–surprise!–it is! Over the course of the movie our intrepid heroes gradually discover that ancient star-faring aliens (who look like lobsters) engineered life forms from many star systems, including our own, to create a global amusement park they experience by proxy, i.e. through–surprise!–avatars. It even explains why Pandora is (apparently) the only significant source of Um (unobtainium) in two star systems: Cameron–er, I mean the aliens, wink wink–put it there as part of the global park’s biological computer control system. The “park” was abandoned millenia ago when the galactic real estate bubble collapsed and the tourists stopped coming. 🙂
    Now if I can only figure out how to include lots of explosions and a high body count, because, God knows, Hollywood hasn’t given us enough of those…

  168. #
    Sad, I thought he was better than that, I can only assume that the AGW reptiles sucked his brain out and left a shell they could manipulate to their will.
    #
    You just insulted reptiles. If they could think, they would know AGW isn’t happening, because they still have to warm themselves up with solar heat before looking for food!
    Signed AGW skeptic & reptile owner

  169. jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 8:03 am
    I have seen numerous science talks in my life and they are calm and focus on showing data and calmly take and answer questions. This was my first time seeing a political talk on climate change.

    So you missed Al Gore’s movie and talks?

    Noelene, yes I did see enough of his presentation to judge the content. Since Morano is not a scientist and was not able to actually talk about science, he instead focused on quotes from various people saying the debate is over, or he would show a pole number saying the majority of scientists do not believe GHGs are causing the warming, or he would show quotes stating it’s all junk science (though I’m sure he doesn’t think climate scientists like Lindzen and Spencer do junk science). It was primarily a “shock” value set of slides and quotes, a lot of it having no relevance to the actual debate over whether or not increases of CO2 in the atmosphere are altering the Earth’s temperature …

    But warmists don’t stick to CO2-science either. They cite the consensus and say or imply that skeptics are junk-science pseudoscientists. That material is a large part of “the actual debate.” Therefore Morano’s points were “in order” as rebuttals; and thus his audience’s annoyance was disingenuous.

  170. George E. Smith says:
    >Lobsters are even smart enough to back up when they run into trouble, instead of charging forward into oblivion; so they likely will outlast us.
    George – Lobsters have made that cardinal evolutionary sin : being delicious

  171. Brave James Cameron, let’s sing his praises!
    Brave James Cameron ran away
    Bravely, ran away…away…
    When danger reared its ugly head
    He bravely turned his tail and fled
    Yes, brave James Cameron turned about
    And gallantly he chickened out
    Bravely taking to his feet
    He beat a very brave retreat
    Bravest of the brave, James Cameron.
    Apologies to Python (Monty).
    I did try the conference website near the appointed time but the live feed was down. I suspect the “debate”, had it taken place, would have been more of a three ring circus than a reasoned exchange, but it is exceedingly poor form to invite folks for a debate, demand numerous changes (perhaps hoping for Morano and Co. to object and pull out instead) as the date came close and then decide at the last minute to skip out.
    There was an excellent NPR/Intelligence Squared debate a few years back in front of a reserved NYC audience, with Lindzen, Crichton and Stott on the skeptic side, and Gavin S, Eckwurtzel and Somerville on the alarmist side; I’d like to see a reprise of that format, which was a rout with its audience firmly on the RealClimate side of the aisle to start with a major shift at the end.

  172. ” Bruce Cobb says:
    August 24, 2010 at 4:35 pm
    Stu, have a look at this video, in which Marc Morano”
    You’re right, the interview was very much weighted to Watson’s side. I’d agree with Morano’s points over Watson’s and understand Morano had to fight to have himself heard, but I assume that for a lot of people watching that it must have been Morano, not Watson- who came over as the unreasonable one. Watson’s name calling of Watson at the end was unjustified, but I’ll admit that the first time I saw that interview, I was feeling the same thing. How can Morano be right and still come out all wrong? It’s his style which turns (some) people off… perhaps this is a cultural thing but a ‘just the facts maam’ approach would have served much better in this case, imo. I’ll admit that I don’t really know that much about Morano, but he presents as a very political type of guy, the kind that if global warming was a republican issue, he would be supporting it. I don’t know. Perception and trust count a lot in this battle, a certain amount of restraint from Morano would have gone a long way here. Morano’s ‘oooooooh’ as he was being told to shut up by Watson, was unnecessary. Holding back would have given Morano the edge, as Watson was obviously beginning to lose his cool and blow the presentation of himself as a detached scientist. The ‘ooooooh’ turned Morano into a schoolboy and the argument into a playground taunt. Scientist against bully. Watson won.

  173. Bruce, I also suggest reading over Lucy’s letter here to Morano again, as I feel she may have similar concerns or point to make regarding Morano’s ‘presentation’.
    ” I’d like to suggest you point towards the importance of the quiet persistence of the likes of Steve McIntyre, and indeed the importance of accountability, openness, and comprehensible, repeatable statistics; the non-existence of any “big oil” funding in almost all sceptics’ efforts; the high level of science as well as “green” concerns among skeptics, and the general counter-productivity to Science when it becomes “alarmist”. People will expect you to deliver a blustery speech and it would be interesting to see the effect of the opposite.”
    but that arrived after the event, about which Marc simply said “Things did not go well”.”

  174. Charles S. Opalek, PE: August 24, 2010 at 2:34 pm
    …Michael “I reconstructed the entire world’s temperature using one pine tree proxy in the Yamal Penninsula” Mann.
    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRKVXG3DV-I&fs=1&hl=en_US]

  175. jeff brown says:
    August 24, 2010 at 9:10 am
    “Bruce, I have no motives except to tell it like it is. I’m surprised you don’t think Morano has a motive here. He shows up after “he” says the “debate” was “canceled” and was more than happy to give a talk and was smiling the entire time, loving firing up the audience, he gets his name all around the blogosphere and you think this wasn’t orchestrated? I think Morano likely had this planned all along in order to give himself more visibility and publicity. After watching him speak I certainly didn’t walk away thinking the guy was honest in any way.”
    Um, jeff, given that the program stated this to be a debate I find your comment above to be a great threat to your credibility. Or am I/we to believe that Mr. Morano was able to convince the organizers to print a misleading agenda?

  176. Interesting emails, Pops. Thanks for posting that link.
    I’d like to hear Julienne Strove’s explanation for why her team chickened out of the debate at the last minute, and why Joe Romm decided to take her place. Did she protest? Did she ask why she was being bumped? Or was she relieved, knowing the likely debate outcome? How did Julienne get involved with that disreputable crowd, anyway? Is she unable to recognize the abject lack of character in her own team members? Their obvious bargaining in bad faith? If so, will she continue to be part of their alarmist shenanigans? Will she publicly distance herself from those conniving cowards? Or does she approve of their insincere actions? Where exactly does Julienne stand?
    It appears that fair dealing and ethics are as passé with the alarmist crowd as the Scientific Method is.

  177. jeff
    Thanks for your answer.I have no doubt Morano gave as good as he got.I have no doubt that he was smiling and laughing all the time.I have seen a number of his interviews and he is always smiling or laughing,that’s why I like him.
    He should have been allowed to finish his presentation,no matter what the content.It is common courtesy is it not?
    One particular thing he says in this debate cannot be refuted.

    “If we face the climate catastrophe they’re all talking about we would all be doomed if we relied on Kyoto,Koyoto 2 or congressional cap and trade”
    End

  178. Ok boys and girls, it is time for Saturday morning cartoons!
    When you find yourself in danger,
    When you’re threatened by a stranger,
    When it looks like you will take a lickin’, (cluck, cluck, cluck, cluck)
    There is someone waiting who
    Will hurry up and rescue you,
    just call- for Super Chicken! (cluck, awk!)
    Fred, if you’re afraid, you’ll have to overlook it,
    Besides you knew the job was dangerous when you took it! (cluck, awk!)
    He will drink his super sauce
    And throw the bad guys for a loss
    And he will bring them in, alive and kickin’ (cluck, cluck, cluck, cluck)
    There is one thing you should learn
    When there is no one else to turn to
    Call- for Super Chicken! (cluck, cluck, cluck, cluck)
    Call…for Super Chicken! (cluck, awk!)

  179. I can imagine a person with a typical ‘left-wing’ outlook being eager to participate in a debate to expose what he thought was the evasive ‘denial’ of a ‘clear and present’ social responsibility to prevent ‘dangerous’ global warming. I do not think that person could be faulted for avoiding that same gratuitous debate if he later found the topic was not as simple and sure as he had first thought, involving highly complex technical issues of which he was unqualified and could not be expected to speak with any real authority. He must, however, be prepared for certain amount of levity at his expense.

  180. Can Cameron actually fire a weapon? Or any of his other lefty friends? I mean, I know that they know how to shoot blanks and make huge explosions for special effects, but can they ACTUALLY shoot it out? Since skeptics are notorious (from the AGW crowd’s perspective) for being right wing big-oil supported nut jobs and are therefore more likely to be card-carrying NRA members, you would think they would NOT want to shoot ANYTHING out with the skeptics.
    It’s really too bad that the world supports the thespians with so much money that they have free time to use their often uninformed and logically incapable minds. Also a tragedy that they make pretty good entertainment. I don’t have the fortitude to skip the good movies as my father-in-law has with “Hanoi Jane” since her stunt in Vietnam. So I suppose I’m part of the problem, too.
    Cameron, move to Pandora and email us your ideas from there.

  181. Well, if the science is settled to the point that it need not be debated, maybe the new tack should be to cut funding to all those government-funded Global Climate Warming Change institutes, research centers and university chairs. After all, if there’s no need for any more scientific work to be done regarding GCWC, why do we need to pay any of those groups to do science? Why do we need to send people to expensive, carbon burning conferences to discuss GCWC when there’s nothing left to discuss?

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