Countdown To New York’s Rendezvous With Energy Impossibility


Francis Menton

The race is on to see who hits the green energy wall of impossibility first. California, Germany and the UK (the “Poseurs”) might seem to have leapt early into the lead positions. But New York is now making a strong sprint to catch and surpass them, so it can be the first to splatter its citizens’ flesh and blood all over the impenetrable barricade.

The Poseurs accumulate vast green progressive virtue credits for ridiculous promises, but their promises all have dates so far in the future that today’s politicians will be long gone when the crash detonates. Germany promises 100% of electricity from renewables by 2035. Whoopie! Chancellor Scholz will be out tending his unfertilized Spargel gardens long before then. In California they don’t promise 100% renewable electricity until 2045, by which time Governor Newsom will likely be not just retired but dead.

Who has sufficiently pure cult adherence to set firm green energy deadlines with real consequences in the here and now? That task has fallen to the true climate heroes here in New York City.

New York City’s bid to create the first real test of an impossible green energy deadline is found in its Climate Mobilization Act of 2019, the key part of which goes by the name Local Law 97. LL97 (formal name: New York City Administrative Code Sections 28-320 and 28-321) imposes energy efficiency standards on large residential buildings starting in 2024 — next year. Buildings that fail to meet the standards are subject to large and accelerating fines starting right away.

It appears that the owners of these buildings are just now figuring out that the standards that have been set cannot be met, at least not in any remotely reasonable way. What next?

The New York Times had a big front page article on Monday about the maneuvers of one large building to try to comply with the law. The headline (online version) is “A Huge City Polluter? Buildings. Here’s a Surprising Fix.”

The building that is the subject of the profile is called The Grand Tier. It is a large (280 apartments), newish (built 2005), and very high-priced building that you may even have seen, because it sits directly across Broadway from Lincoln Center at West 64th Street. To give you an idea of the market segment the building is in, the only apartment listed at the moment on the Streeteasy website is a one bedroom for $5895 per month.

The owner of the building is Glenwood Management. Here are a few things about Glenwood that do not appear in the Times’ piece. It is one of the major apartment developers in the City, known for highest-end buildings and premium rents. The long-time head of the company was Leonard Litwin, for many years the single largest donor to New York’s Democratic Party and big backer of power broker and Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver. Litwin died in 2017 at age 102, shortly after Silver was convicted in 2015 on corruption charges, some of which involved his relationship with Litwin. (Silver then died in 2022 while still serving his prison term.). Meanwhile, the value of Litwin’s protection money payments ran out when the radical wing of the Democrats gained full control of the State Legislature in 2019. LL97 takes direct aim at major large-building residential landlords like Glenwood, who are one of the main designated villains of the climate morality play.

Anyway, the people now running Glenwood, who are no dummies, have figured out that even in a premium building like this that is rolling in money, compliance with LL97 on its own terms is not a realistic option. The building is heated with natural gas — as are nearly all similar buildings. Being the goodie goodie Democratic Party sycophants that they are, the Glenwood people initially tried the route of compliance with the new standards on their own terms by doing all the obvious things to increase energy efficiency. But it was not nearly enough. From the Times:

Ahead of the new climate law, the company had made all the easy changes to save energy and reduce emissions: it replaced incandescent light bulbs with LEDs, upgraded old fan motors and improved insulation. But it wasn’t enough: The Grand Tier was set to face roughly $100,000 per year in fines starting in 2024, rising to $400,000 per year in 2030, because of those two giant carbon-spewing boilers in the basement.

The only route left to comply with the literal terms of the law would have been to convert the whole building to electric heat, which would mean a full re-wiring from top to bottom, at enormous expense. To avoid that, the Glenwood people are trying a different gambit: Carbon Capture! From the Times again:

[T]he hot exhaust from [the building’s natural gas] boilers [is] funneled through a duct to a small, spotless room filled with pipes, rumbling compressors and metal tanks. Inside several of those tanks [are] dry absorbent materials that look like lentils and bind to carbon dioxide, allowing the machines to filter out other gases like nitrogen and oxygen. The remaining carbon dioxide [are] then chilled to minus 10 degrees Fahrenheit and turned to liquid.

One problem: carbon capture is not a permitted option under the law for complying with its emissions standards. And the City bureaucrats are not about to stick their necks out to help the likes of Glenwood — or any of the thousands of other landlords caught in the same spot. From the Times:

For now, however, carbon capture faces an enormous hurdle: It has not been approved by the city as a solution that complies with Local Law 97, since the technology didn’t exist when the law was drafted. The Department of Buildings, which enforces the law, said it is reviewing CarbonQuest’s system but has a number of questions, such as how to verify the emission reductions claimed by the Grand Tier.

And to top it off, the carbon capture system that Glenwood has come up with only sequesters about 60% of the CO2 that the building’s boilers generate. No way will that satisfy the environmental zealots behind LL97, who detest half-way measures and want fossil fuels extirpated.

A few of the other wealthiest landlords will likely try something like the Glenwood gambit. But I can’t imagine any substantial number of landlords, most of whom are not remotely in Glenwood’s market niche, actually going through with full building rewirings and installation of heat pumps that will fail on the many days per year when temperatures here are in the 20s and below. We’re about to see thousands of buildings designated as law-breakers and subjected to punishing annual fines, with no realistic way to get around them. Let’s see how long this can continue.

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Tom Halla
March 17, 2023 6:10 am

Unicorns on treadmills?

Bodach Ceannmor
Reply to  Tom Halla
March 18, 2023 1:25 pm

Halla – Unicorns ? Really ?

1) Where can New York find enough virgins to interact with the unicorns, to take care of them ?
2) Where can New York find enough land for the treadmills for the unicorns where the only folk nearby are virgins ?
3) If the unicorns are vegetarians, their digestion produces CO2 and Methane …
4) If the unicorns are carnivores, the ecoweenies won’t allow them to be used on the treadmills – plus, who wants to clean up after carnivorous equinoids ?
5) This is New York – and they have yet to require that folk use electric motors to run the treadmills to generate the electricity for their buildings … isn’t that the next “logical” step for New York legislators ?

Bill Powers
Reply to  Bodach Ceannmor
March 20, 2023 7:14 am

You are not thinking like a politician which means you need to stop thinking and keep promising rainbows. Oh and yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus. And Bodach his sleigh rides will be powered by 100% unicorn farts by 2035…or 45, or some subsequent date on some future calendar what matters is the dream not the conditions under the candle lit Christmas tree.

Ed Zuiderwijk
March 17, 2023 6:26 am

Oh well. The liquid CO2 can be used as fracking fluid.

Sooner or later someone will realise that a few underworld contracts could be a much cheaper option.

Steve Case
Reply to  Ed Zuiderwijk
March 17, 2023 7:28 am

Sooner or later someone will realise that a few underworld contracts could be a much cheaper option.”

The left doesn’t have any objection to using such tactics. Ashili Babbit, Jeffery Epstein, Seth Rich… There are probably more. Plus we now have political prisoners Jacob Chansley and a few others. They also create hideous riots every four years, we’ll see what 2024 brings.

Reply to  Steve Case
March 17, 2023 9:14 am


Steve Case
Reply to  Scissor
March 17, 2023 9:32 am

Oswald said he was “just a patsy”

Reply to  Steve Case
March 17, 2023 10:40 am

When did he say that?
What’s your evidence?

More Soylent Green!
Reply to  Steve Case
March 17, 2023 11:34 am

Source, please?

I’m certain that Lee Harvey didn’t kill JFK but he sure tried his darnedest. Likely killer? JFK was accidentally shot by a startled, hungover Secret Sevice agent in the follow car.

TC in the OC
Reply to  More Soylent Green!
March 17, 2023 12:14 pm

You need to do a search on “Lee Harvey Oswald I’m a patsy”.
I did not know the evidence or source either and was greatly surprised.

Reply to  TC in the OC
March 17, 2023 5:06 pm

I read a couple of those “sources”. They all boil down to somebody said that somebody else told them that Oswald said it.

Reply to  MarkW
March 18, 2023 6:41 am

Here is the video of Oswald saying it:

Reply to  Steve Case
March 17, 2023 3:23 pm

Vince Foster and Ron Brown were not available for comment.

Mike McMillan
Reply to  Ed Zuiderwijk
March 17, 2023 12:09 pm

Underworld contracts aren’t needed. Most all landlords carry fire insurance.

Bodach Ceannmor
Reply to  Ed Zuiderwijk
March 18, 2023 1:28 pm

@Ed Zuiderwijk – is there any reason to believe that the Devil has any interest in more souls from New York ? Plus, could the Devil do any worse than New York Democrats ?

Dodgy Geezer
March 17, 2023 6:28 am

It appears that the owners of these buildings are just now figuring out that the standards that have been set cannot be met, at least not in any remotely reasonable way. What next?

Not an issue. These people are NOT really interested in lower CO2 – they would have gone nuclear long ago if they were.

They are interested in power – so they will not risk themselves being voted out of office. They are interested in compliance, so they will not risk requiring the impossible. What they will do is find some form of words or loophole which allows this farce to proceed for as long as possible – where ‘loophole’ may be as simple as suppressing all comment on situations where a breach is unavoidable. They did that with whale deaths due to wind turbines, for instance.

In the end, logic is not applicable in this situation. It is a religion. It can survive an irresistable force meeting an immovable object quite easily by applying Jesuitical equivocation….

Last edited 14 days ago by Dodgy Geezer
Paul S
March 17, 2023 6:33 am

I started to write about how all of the electricity entering the buildings will be produced by burning fossil fuels and the electrical distribution system is inadequate and the costs are prohibitive, and…I realized we all know this. In a nutshell, this is all insanity.

Reply to  Paul S
March 17, 2023 10:56 am

“Liberalism is a serious mental disorder”. Now the landlords get a chance to understand that maxim up close and personal.

Reply to  Paul S
March 18, 2023 6:40 am

You missed the obvious Net Zero case where nobody has a car or a house, and eats dead grass…

Tom Abbott
March 17, 2023 6:54 am

The Loony Left destroys everything they touch.

Now it’s New York’s turn.


Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 17, 2023 7:30 am

but there’s also a Loony Right- time for some old fashioned Yankee common sense that is neither, and well understood by the ordinary citizen- I think most Americans don’t identify as left or right- which is why our politics switches so often from one to the other with too few of the elected having common sense- I’d like to see politicians say, “let’s get back to common sense and avoid left and right bullshit”- the constitution, bill of rights and decency to protect the most vulnerable without having to pretend we’re going to solve everybody’s problems

Joe Crawford
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 8:06 am

If they had any common sense they wouldn’t be politicians.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Joe Crawford
March 17, 2023 8:10 am

well, there is a need for that role- of course now the word has a very negative connotation- there have been a few, like Abe Lincoln with little formal education but a lot of common sense

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 10:29 am

While lacking formal education, he was more familiar with the classics, and more articulate, than most college graduates today.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
March 17, 2023 10:58 am

Same for George Washington. He might have been better “educated” if his father hadn’t died while he was young – and if the Brits had let him into THEIR army instead of just the colonial army, he might not have hated them so much. George was a man of few words but when he spoke everyone listened!

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 8:43 am

90% of the time, people identified as loony-right, are actually loony-left.

Reply to  MarkW
March 17, 2023 9:48 am

Don’t you mean 91.4632436474563856 +/1.0000000000000001%

More Soylent Green!
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 11:43 am

Define “common sense.”

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  More Soylent Green!
March 17, 2023 12:11 pm

yuh, of course, that’s always a problem and everyone defines it differently- for me it means when it comes to political ideas to not depend on “experts”

I googled the term and found the following which I like:

Common sense (or simply sense) is sound, practical judgment concerning everyday matters, or a basic ability to perceive, understand, and judge in a manner that is shared by (i.e., “common to”) nearly all people.

I think most people don’t believe there is a climate emergency- which is a good example of common sense.

Then there’s the book called “Common Sense”:

More Soylent Green!
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 12:28 pm

I think you missed the sarcasm.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  More Soylent Green!
March 17, 2023 12:57 pm

You’re just too sophisticated for this back woodsman.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 18, 2023 4:24 am

“but there’s also a Loony Right”

So the Loony Left says.

I don’t think conservative thinking is Loony, so I don’t believe in a Loony Right the way the Loony Left describes it.

There is a small group of extremists that espouse some conservative principles like individual freedom but that doesn’t put them in the same category as a conservative, because they promote violence, whereas conservatives do not promote violence.

Conservatives do not believe in the violent overthrow of the government.

The Loony Left does believe in the violent overthrow of the government.

The Loony Left lies about conservatives all the time. If the Loony Left didn’t have lies, they wouldn’t have anything.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 18, 2023 4:48 am

I certainly didn’t mean to imply all conservatives are loony. I think there are some good ideas from across the political spectrum. It would be foolish to say one side has all the answers. I like social security and medicare- I like some elements of protecting the environment. I also believe in the constitution and bill of rights. And, amazingly for an old hippy- I support the 2nd amendment. Personally, I hate guns- but I’d like to think if I change my mind for any reason I can easily get one- because- I don’t trust the government. Tyrants don’t like their subjects having easy access to guns. I don’t bother people who like guns and they don’t bother me.

Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 18, 2023 8:57 am

It’s time to get rid of the “left, right, liberal, conservative” labels as they have been long misused. The correct labels, for Americans at least, should constitutionals and unconstitutionals.

Last edited 13 days ago by beng135
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 17, 2023 9:46 am

I’d like to see politicians say, “let’s get back to common sense and avoid left and right bullshit”?

Have you really never heard them say it? I thought they all said it, Googling for quotes.

More Soylent Green!
Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 11:48 am

What was that “moderate” coalition of not left/not right that tried to get traction a few years ago?

Liberals, all of them. None of them ever saw a problem where the solution wasn’t more government. They just pretended to be what they weren’t.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  KevinM
March 18, 2023 4:27 am

Those on the Left are devoid of common sense. Otherwise, they would be conservatives.

Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 7:25 am

“But New York is now making a strong sprint to catch and surpass them…”

Woke-achusetts is also in the race. After all, it’s this state that sued the EPA in the Supreme Court so they’d issue the infamous “finding”. MA is full scale bonkers over the “climate emergency”. It claims to be the most energy efficient state in America, which may be true thanks to having exported all our industries, other than universities, hospitals and some high tech. Currently there are efforts here to stop all logging- a professor Moomaw has published a paper on a theme he fantasized called “proforestation”- which means we must lock up all the forests so their only function is to sequester carbon “to save the planet and biodiversity”. Yes, I think MA is the Mecca of the this climate lunacy. Michael Mann spent time here and his comrade with his infamous hockey stick paper was a prof at U. Mass.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 9:52 am

The political leanings of elementary teachers resurface in voting much later in the grownup culture. Median 1980s middle school students are now in their financial prime.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 10:00 am

not a subject I know much about- but I’d think it depends on what part of America- certainly true in the so called “progressive” states like CA, NY, and MA

me thinks the main priority of all public school teachers is to support their labor union because, in my opinion, they are vastly overpaid- and, in MA, I see most towns in recent years are building new schools which cost a fortune, not because the old buildings were in terrible shape but because it would be nice for the teachers to work in new buildings- of course they claim the buildings are falling down- in my home town in the Berkshires, it was claimed that the middle school I went to in the early ’60s- the roof was going to collapse any moment- so the town allocated a ton of money to tear the school down and build another one- but when they hired a company to take it down- that company said they had a huge problem dismantling the roof because it was so strongly made! But of course the town wasn’t going to allow a roof to cave in on students so the town got suckered.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 11:12 am

The situation would be more tolerable without money games. I played a corporate rec basketball game in a South Boston public school building, and I have to say I would not knowingly send my children to it. The bathroom was nightmarish in scent and appearance.
Possible solution: Agree on a “replace by” date before the building is built. Obviously that system would create yet more opportunity for gaming, but at least we could then say that a building built before 1960 (mow 80 y/o) is “used up”.

Frank from NoVA
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 10:31 am

There’s a lot of ‘pro-forestation’ going on in NE. Anyone walking through the ‘woods’ there quickly comes upon untold miles of stone walls that once defined fields and pastures. (God only knows how anyone ever scratched a living out of these hills). However, I assume the progressive transplants from New York and Boston love the all of the vegetation, notwithstanding the accompanying deer ticks and power outages.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
March 17, 2023 11:05 am

When Nixon went to China and they showed him The Great Wall, supposedly he said “there is more stone in the walls of New England than this Great Wall”. Probably true too. You can find them everywhere deep in the forests. Scratching a living on such land made those Yankees tough. Then in about 1830 the Eire Canal opened up- the farmers were told “get to the Canal then you can ride out to lots of free land- flat and with top soil dozens of feet deep- and few rocks in them”. That emptied many New England towns. So there is a lot more forest now than in 1830 but the proforestation nutjobs want no more tree cutting. After all, they already own nice wood homes with nice wood furniture and lots of paper products.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
March 17, 2023 2:03 pm

True what you say that the Erie Canal opened up better farmland in the Midwest, and the trend subsequently emptied many New England towns. John Deere, the Vermont blacksmith who founded the farm equipment company, was one of them. Deere invented a plow especially effective at turning over prairie soil. It attracted more farmers to the Corn Belt.

It’s also true that the California Gold Rush a generation after the Erie Canal, emptied out many more small New England towns. Plymouth, MA, where the Pilgrims first landed, lost about a third of its young men within a few years of the gold discovery at Sutter’s Mill.

Eugene O’Neill’s play, “Desire Under the Elms” is set on a 19th century New England farm. The plot hinges on a tyrannical father who irks two of his three sons so much, that they set out for the west rather than put up with him.

Last edited 14 days ago by tom_gelsthorpe
March 17, 2023 7:32 am

Of course, there is always the option of “ethnic lightning’

March 17, 2023 7:36 am

The DemoTwats are doing their best to crash the banking system so why not move on to the property market.

Reply to  gezza1298
March 17, 2023 9:54 am

Not needed: “DemoTwats

Reply to  KevinM
March 18, 2023 9:01 am

How ’bout libtards?

Peta of Newark
March 17, 2023 7:48 am

Lets cut through the cr4p here:Glenwood have come unstuck, and are becoming increasingly more so, because they tried a policy of Appeasement

All throughout Human History it has never worked out well for the appeasers.
(are you really sure you know how the GHGE works)

Glenwood should have just installed some huuuuuge fugoff electric immersion heaters to replace the gas boilers (as per Heat Pumps turn into when temps drop) and crashed the New York grid…….

Reply to  Peta of Newark
March 17, 2023 2:44 pm

While their “carbon capture” system couldn’t have been cheap, how would its cost compare to re-wiring the building to accommodate such heaters?

Lee Riffee
Reply to  Peta of Newark
March 17, 2023 3:07 pm

Appeasement rarely works in the end. There’s the old saying about feeding the crocodile hoping it will eat you last…..
What they should have done from the get-go is sue, sue, sue! A company with that kind of financial resources should be able to gear up an impressive team of lawyers to try and repel and negate these laws in court.

Reply to  Lee Riffee
March 17, 2023 5:23 pm

I wouldn’t be surprised if the vast majority of their renters aren’t fully bought into the global warming scam, and those that aren’t are making money off it.
If they publicly fought too hard, they risk losing their appeal to the wokerati, and hence their ability to charge ridiculous rental fees.

Curious George
March 17, 2023 7:54 am

I wonder if water pipes will freeze in compliant buildings?

Reply to  Curious George
March 17, 2023 5:24 pm

Don’t know about the pipes, the tenants certainly might.

Joe Crawford
March 17, 2023 8:01 am

Thank the Lord for the idiots in charge of New York. The faster they go the better in their search of a local Net Zero. Pretty soon, when the fines kick in and the rents go out-of-sight the rest of their tax base will haulass to Florida leaving the area to slowly go back to Nature. Maybe we aught to ship ’em a few Kudzo rhizomes to speed up the process :<)

Reply to  Joe Crawford
March 17, 2023 9:59 am

…New York… Pretty soon, when…. rents go out-of-sight…

Imagine if it were expensive to live in NYC? What a strange, different world it would be, surely a different place than exists today. /s

Reply to  Joe Crawford
March 17, 2023 12:05 pm

Wish I could give you more pluses. I wish California would speed up their process. Maybe they aren’t as stupid as the City of New York, but that just doesn’t sound right.

Chris Foskett
March 17, 2023 8:06 am

Looks like the best option for the landlords is filing for chapter 11, that will protect them from the fines, or sell to the Chinese government…..

It doesnot add up
March 17, 2023 8:09 am

$400,000 over 280 apartments is a rent hike of $1,500 a year. Bill it as a contribution to a green city, and the residents will be eager to pay for it. Try and do the same thing on 85th St and you would have a riot on your hands.

Douglas Proctor
Reply to  It doesnot add up
March 17, 2023 9:19 am

The rent hike idea means the building owners’ profits don’t change.

You made an excellent point us nonrich citizens missed: it’s an immaterial charge to the renters and owners. 400 grand sounds a lot to us. It’s pocket change – literally! – to the entire building renters.

Lee Riffee
Reply to  Douglas Proctor
March 17, 2023 3:14 pm

Yes, that kind of money is indeed pocket change to the very wealthy. But, if the building’s owners did install the kind of equipment required by the law, I can’t imagine that the residents would put up with paying that kind of rent to live in cold, dark apartments!

Ron Long
March 17, 2023 8:26 am

Francis, why do you live in Manhatten? For example, your comment “Grand Tier”…”you may even have seen, because it sits directly across Broadway from Lincoln Center…”, is in reality this (I was in NYC so my wife can check off the box entitled “see aliens from Mars in Times Square”), but didn’t walk down Broadway because you had to dodge drug dealers, homeless people (sorry, persons without a roof), and blood stains with chalk outlines. Get out of there before it’s too late.

John Hultquist
Reply to  Ron Long
March 17, 2023 9:20 am

 I agree with you RL but I’m not interested in those aliens.
However, Google Street View can show you the Grand Tier Apartments in context. Or search for images: Grand Tier Luxury Apartments
Go to: 40.772246, -73.982464
It is the tall building on the east (right) side.  

Dan Hughes
March 17, 2023 8:30 am

Isn’t it highly likely that all the auxiliary equipment that’s needed to separate and extract the CO2 is based on fossil-fueled electricity? The same for making, transporting, and installing that equipment.

March 17, 2023 8:30 am

I suppose they could always buy some surplus power plants from the navy and replace those noxious gas boilers that way.

Reply to  jvcstone
March 17, 2023 10:06 am

Despite exhibiting behaviors I might not celebrate, USA DoD has invested in and/or preserved technology that USA and/or all humanity might need. Nuclear powered navy ships and their suppliers contain wonderous ideas.

Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 12:04 pm

I understand that one of the carriers could power a small city in an emergency. Wonder why that technology hasn’t found it’s way to dry land yet??

Reply to  jvcstone
March 17, 2023 2:49 pm

Aren’t military nuclear power plants still highly classified?

Reply to  AndyHce
March 17, 2023 5:26 pm

The designs are, but the technology behind the reactors isn’t.

Lee Riffee
Reply to  jvcstone
March 17, 2023 3:24 pm

I’ve wondered that too. A small nuke plant like on a carrier could supply steam that would heat large portions of a city….My husband served in the Navy and lived on a carrier for some time. He said they had plenty of steam to launch the aircraft, the ship was warm in the coldest climates and the showers were nice and hot. All from the steam produced by the nuke plant.

Bruce Cobb
March 17, 2023 8:34 am

New York – Putting the dumb in crash test dummy.

March 17, 2023 8:39 am

This is the Illogical nonsense that occurs when you californicate a city.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Sage
March 17, 2023 10:39 am

Or Manhattanize a city.

March 17, 2023 8:50 am

How many have to die in the cold, when the grid comes crashing down, for the insanity to end?

Reply to  captainjtiberius
March 17, 2023 10:07 am

None, if they have access to cars,

Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 5:27 pm

If they have access to cars that work when you need them.

John Hultquist
March 17, 2023 9:06 am

” … of heat pumps that will fail on the many days per year when temperatures here are in the 20s and below.”

Heat pumps installed in cold climates would normally have resister-elements. In my stick-built home I have had such for 15 years.
The really serious issue is the need for emergency heat when the electricity goes off. The big buildings will need a second source of heat or thousands in NYC will die.

Lee Riffee
Reply to  John Hultquist
March 17, 2023 3:28 pm

They will also still need diesel powered generators for such emergencies. Modern buildings are so tightly sealed that the air would quickly turn deadly (CO2 buildup from people breathing) without mechanical ventilation. Not to mention heat….My husband used to work on commercial HVAC and said that buildings had to be empty of residents before the systems could be shut down. Generally they did what ever they could to avoid shutdowns….

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  John Hultquist
March 17, 2023 9:15 pm

As long as the dying are the idiots that vote for that shit. As opposed to everyone else being the collateral damage for their idiocy.

Douglas Proctor
March 17, 2023 9:15 am

Socialize rentals by selling buildings to City, which can then use profits to Green the buildings?

Building owners association that points out ALL of them face the same time crunch which they CAN’T meet because NYC doesn’t have the electricity infrastructure to handle the expected load, so therefore the timing must be changed not just totally but sector by sector? Pull in the EV mandates, gas stove requirements. Then Association lawsuits based on Force Majeure reasoning.

NYC is, along with AOC, doing its best to stop new and maintenance investments alike, while driving away cost-sensitive, well-heeled citizens with career and family flexibility/options.

Is this part of a plan to decrease 1st World standards of living (affluence) for the “Planet”? Or eliminate voters who disagree with Progressive politics, while solidifying political control by the remaining voting zealots?

Reply to  Douglas Proctor
March 17, 2023 10:10 am

For other dummies like me: “In contract law, force majeure (from French: ‘overwhelming force’, lit. ’superior force’) is a common clause in contracts which essentially frees both parties from liability or obligation when an extraordinary event or circumstance beyond the control of the parties, such as a war, strike, riot, crime, epidemic, or sudden legal change prevents one or both parties from fulfilling their obligations under the contract.”

Last edited 14 days ago by KevinM
March 17, 2023 9:36 am

Given the truth of Twain’s observation, the only solution is to let it play out. Maybe after all the bankruptcies and deaths they will catch on.

March 17, 2023 9:41 am

A problem with “set a target and the market will solve it” is that sometimes the market turns into a crowd waiting for someone else to solve it.

More Soylent Green!
Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 12:47 pm

You can’t dictate solutions. The market is creative, often disruptive and the solution may not be politically acceptable.

For example, if the world is in a climate crisis due to emissions from the burning of fossil fuels, then nuclear is a great solution. But nuclear power just doesn’t fly with the Net-Zero crowd. Nuclear isn’t the “right” solution and no matter how safe and economical the market makes it, that solution won’t get any traction.

Reply to  KevinM
March 17, 2023 5:32 pm

If the market is sitting around, it’s because the math doesn’t add up.
Nobody voluntarily invests in a project that they don’t think will make money.

Bodach Ceannmor
Reply to  MarkW
March 18, 2023 1:39 pm

– *cough* Solyndra *cough* …

Turned down by the Bush administration, then eagerly supported by the incoming Obama administration …

Krishna Gans
March 17, 2023 9:46 am

Won’t some $$ not be able asking for an exemption ?

AGW is Not Science
March 17, 2023 9:48 am

It’s almost fun to watch when you’re not one of the unfortunate “minority party” voters living in the Vampire State who didn’t vote for this mass idiocy, as you watch those who did be hoist by their own petard.

Hopefully most of the residents of my native Staten Island will be in buildings that are too small to be subject to this lunacy, but you know they’ll just keep pushing until any useful source of heat is “banned” to “save” us all – from nothing. I’m no longer living there, and you couldn’t pay me enough to go back.

I actually want them to accelerate their colossally idiotic “plans” as much as possible, so that the resulting catastrophe will discourage others. Better it happen in NY, where they experience actual winter weather state-wide. CA is a bit too dissociated from the penalties of not providing adequate and reliable heat and electricity due to the warmer climate that prevails over much of the state and most of its population centers.

Let the NY loons vote themselves into extinction quickly so all can see how stupid these ideas are, so the cancer might stop spreading.

Reply to  AGW is Not Science
March 17, 2023 2:56 pm

The politicians will not be responsible. God punishes the sinners who didn’t comply.

March 17, 2023 10:10 am

Bonkers on steroids. I thought Westminster was loony, but this is suicidal.

March 17, 2023 10:19 am

annual fines, with no realistic way to get around them.

You mean taxes?

Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 17, 2023 10:30 am

I have read on WUWT many times how heat pumps dont work in cold weather.. all while sitting in my large home with two open air heat pumps and 5 remote split heads that work just fine here in Ottawa / Canada down to -25C.. so I doubt New York would have any problems. I have auxiliary heat but used it once for one morning this winter. If you want to bash heat pumps bash the installation costs but get the low operating temperatures right as it detracts from the other factual information.

Reply to  Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 17, 2023 12:04 pm

I have experience of an air source heat pump/AC unit in Norway.
it had a big unit outside and a unit at ceiling height inside. It made a fair show of blowing warmish air out and kept a bit of the chll off. Thereafter resistance heaters as and when and /or log fires in the stove. In Norway 10 years ago quite sensible and affordable . Thinking of doing it in Surrey England, where we already have the stove . Cost about £1500 for a 27000 unit supplying 3 rooms with a total electricsl input about 3 KW. Maybe it will make sense

Leslie MacMillan
Reply to  Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 17, 2023 4:45 pm

Funny you should get downvotes just for saying your own heat pumps work in friggin’ cold Ottawa, the second coldest national capital in the world. But I have to ask, are you not on municipal gas? Surely that would be cheaper, certainly is here in balmy Hamilton. I get it certainly if you are the country where your alternative would be propane or furnace oil. I’m just always curious about successful heat pump operation in Canada.

Peter Ashwood-Smith
Reply to  Leslie MacMillan
March 17, 2023 5:58 pm

We dont have gas on my street. So Electricity it is. However my previous home of about the same size was on gas and cost only slightly less to heat. I actually live a few Km from Ottawa on the Quebec side where electricity is a bit cheaper.

Anyway most heat pumps being installed in the last year here are rated down to -25C. I was also skeptical until I bought the house and saw it first hand.

Anyway Id suggest people stop arguing they dont work and focus on other problems like the high installation costs.

Leslie MacMillan
Reply to  Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 17, 2023 7:14 pm

Thank you, Peter.

Lee Riffee
Reply to  Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 17, 2023 8:11 pm

But do you understand that the heat pump itself isn’t what is keeping you warm? Air blowing over coils that are heated by electricity running thru them (like the burners on an electric stove) is what is doing the work at -25C.

Reply to  Lee Riffee
March 19, 2023 8:07 am

I don’t know about the new heat pumps, but mine, installed about 7 years ago, has coils that I know for sure are running in around 25F (-4C), and I’m sure even higher temperature than that. You can tell by the warmth of the air coming out of the vent.

While I understand the advance of technology, I find it hard to believe they have gotten 20C more efficient in only 7 years.

Reply to  Peter Ashwood-Smith
March 18, 2023 12:12 pm

Hi Peter

all while sitting in my large home with two open air heat pumps and 5 remote split heads that work just fine here in Ottawa / Canada down to -25C..

There are any number of heat pumps that do function down to -15F (-25C) and even lower. Their efficiency is much diminished (Coefficient Of Performance…energy in over energy out… getting to 2 or lower). The biggest issue is that these cold climate heat pumps also have much diminished capacity as the outside temperature goes down. From various specs I have seen, you likely have approximately 1/2 the capacity at -25C that you do at 0C and above. Unless you have very large capacity systems to deal with this, you systems are likely using the built in electric resistance heater coils (COP=1). This built in backup is not apparent to the user, except that your electric bill will jump a bit when you have a number of very cold days. The comment that heat pumps don’t work in cold temperatures is no longer literally true, but it is true that even cold climate heat pumps will likely required electric heater backup when needed.

I am considering a cold climate heat pump in my house in northern Michigan…however, it will be used mostly for AC…and backup for my very cost efficient natural gas furnace. If I did not have natural gas, I would likely do as you have done, ie install a cold climate heat pump with electric backup as the overall energy cost is typically lower than propane. And much easier on the back than wood..:). If the power goes out, then I would be cold. My generator could not run the 15 kw of electric heat needed at very low temperatures…so would still have a gas fired furnace as backup (much lower electric power needed to run).

I functionally have wood, propane, natural gas and heat pump…and old fashioned electric space heaters. I use whatever is cheapest and easiest….and whatever is not broken at any given time.:)

Ethan Brand

March 17, 2023 10:53 am

Another story illustrating “elections have consequences”. My bet is that the moron landlords donated heavily to the leftists elections, and will reap the rewards of being extremely stupid.
Now, they get to pay the real price of their choices in the city’s administration.

Reply to  guidvce4
March 17, 2023 11:57 am

Renters will pay also.

More Soylent Green!
March 17, 2023 11:30 am

I’m very inclined to let these dumb fukkahs fail and let the poor sumsofbitches who voted for them suffer. It could be a teachable moment for us all.

However, we live in a post-accountable world. Nobody in the ruling class has to face the consequences of their actions, no matter how foreseeable those consequences may be. People who didn’t succumb to this folly will pay for those that did.

Life’s a big shitz sandwich and we are about to take a big bite.

Reply to  More Soylent Green!
March 17, 2023 12:07 pm

Cars plus Florida plus (shrinking?) COLA. They’ll be fine.
Good “Hypocrisy Index” might be extracted by feeding cost-of- real estate trends for coastal areas into a climate model? I don’t have the tools to do it. Intuitively (aka unrestrained by fact or reality) economic data would contradict ecologic data.

I’ve asked people who live in NYC why they live in NYC. It seems to be a truly unique cultural experience, and the minds who seek it out are powerful. The arguments in favor of what I would call overpriced living are strong.

March 17, 2023 12:29 pm

Property values will soon tank, followed by tax revenues.

Anyone seriously planning to convert to electric heat might want to check with ConEd about capacity/reliability.

Last edited 14 days ago by Nik
March 17, 2023 1:10 pm

The idiots are in charge of the asylum .
If some sense (which is not common and is very scarce in the New York City Administration )
was applied to what these bureaucrats are demanding they would soon realize that New York is heading down hill from now on .
Carbon zero is the biggest scam ever thought up after the global warming scam .
Even if these buildings are retro fitted with electric heating and cooling what about all the food that is consumed in New York?
The so called emissions that are counted in other US states or other countries on all the food consumed in New York are not counted in New York.
Absolute bonkers .
Rules have been enacted at Kyoto accord and the Paris Agreement around emissions which these dimwits are interpreting which will cost $ billions which the residents will eventually have to pay for.
New York’s emissions would be astronomical if all emissions on food production was counted in the cities where it is consumed .

March 17, 2023 1:32 pm

1+1 “=” 3… odd

Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
March 17, 2023 1:52 pm

A fair percentage of New York City apartments are either “rent controlled” or “rent stabilized”. Rent stabilized units are assigned a Maximum Base Rent (MBR) which is reviewed every two years to adjust for changes in operating costs. But tenants can challenge increases; one of the grounds is if the “building has violations”:

In New York City, rent control operates under the Maximum Base Rent (MBR) system. A maximum base rent is established for each apartment and adjusted every two years to reflect changes in operating costs. Owners, who certify that they are providing essential services and have removed violations, are entitled to raise rents the lesser of either the average of the five most recent Rent Guidelines Board annual rent increases for one-year renewal leases or 7.5 percent each year until they reach the MBR. Tenants may challenge the proposed increase on the grounds that the building has violations or that the owner’s expenses do not warrant an increase.

So if a building is fined for non-compliance with LL97, the owner has to wait for the bi-annual MBR review to hike rents, which tenants can challenge because the building is “in violation”. So the owner of a smaller building could easily be unable to make the compliance upgrades then get squeezed by fines which can’t be recovered from tenants who are rent controlled or rent stabilized, especially as those building are likely to be full of people who can’t afford the higher rents.

When are all the city-owned buildings going to be brought into full compliance?

It doesnot add up
Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
March 17, 2023 3:23 pm

The question becomes would they be evicted because the building is non compliant? That is essentially what is proposed in the UK for renters.

Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
March 17, 2023 5:46 pm

There is no problem so bad, that government intervention won’t make it worse.

Dave Fair
March 17, 2023 2:17 pm

This will end when the wealthy supporters of the Leftist Democrat Party realize they are cutting their own collective throat. Everything environmental and climate change action sounds good to progressive do-gooders until the unintended consequences harmful to themselves multiply.

March 17, 2023 3:50 pm

Democrats need never fear for their own stupidity. They just need to blame Trump for all their bad decisions; thus cleansing their hands and giving them the clear conscience that can, otherwise, only be had by purchasing green tokens.

March 17, 2023 4:08 pm

Gee, politicians should know the rule Politicians Promise Rule. Never ever promise a result or goal that must be met with a time limit of less than ten times your personal expected time in office.

Thus a US senator, who is elected for six years, should promise on things to be accomplished 6o years in the future. Even he gets three terms (18 years) he can say “We are making great progress!” — it doesn’t have to be true.

Presidents have it easier — an initial 4 year term allows the President to promise anything…and then say “I’m making progress, so elect me for another term”. After that, the ex-President doesn’t care.

March 17, 2023 7:53 pm

Careful who you vote for … hahahaha !

March 18, 2023 4:39 am

The NYC council has a female majority. That explains it all.

March 18, 2023 8:24 am

This is just a tempest in a teapot by NYC’s standard. With crime out of control thanks in no small part to bail and discovery reform, woke DAs and cop retirements, a collapsing public transit system, office vacancies via remote work, horrible public schools, eye watering housing costs, freakish taxes and a government that thinks this is all just the most fantastic stuff, NYC is already circling the drain. That is collectively why literally hundreds of thousands of high income people have bailed out of there in the last few years. That’s just going to continue.

Andy Pattullo
March 18, 2023 10:52 am

Well this will be “fun”. Very much like watching a self-described elephant whisperer trying to stop an elephant stamped by gentle moral persuasion followed by application of the very modest manual force at their disposal. The stampede will run its course unaffected by the eco-virtue of the whisperer and the whisperer will be no more. Unfortunately a lot of truly innocent bystanders will also be trampled.

Last edited 13 days ago by Andy Pattullo
March 21, 2023 9:07 am

The fine is only $360 per apartment per year, why not just pass it on?

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