Claim: How a Cognitive Bias is Blocking the Rise of Electric Cars

[More in the genre of: If those stoopid peasants only understood what is good for them!]

A UNIGE team shows that underestimating battery autonomy is a major psychological barrier to buying an electric car.

Peer-Reviewed Publication

UNIVERSITÉ DE GENÈVE

What are the barriers to the adoption of electric cars? Although the main financial and technological obstacles have been removed, their market share still needs to increase. In a recent study, a team from the University of Geneva (UNIGE) investigated the cognitive factors that still dissuade many people from switching to electric cars. They found that car owners systematically underestimate the capacity of electric driving ranges to meet their daily needs. These results, published in Nature Energy, open up new avenues to speed up the electrification of mobility in addition to conventional policy approaches.

The increase of greenhouse gases (GHG) in the atmosphere is one of the main causes of global warming. Among the GHGs is carbon dioxide – the well-known CO2 – of which the transport sector is one of the main emitters. Fossil fuel vehicles alone account for nearly 18% of global CO2 emissions. The electrification of the vehicle fleet has therefore become one of the major challenges of the energy transition.

The number of electric vehicles is increasing in many countries. However, they are still far from having the market share that would allow a significant reduction in road traffic emissions. In 2020, they represented only 1% of the global vehicle fleet, including hybrid vehicles. To meet the 2030 climate targets, this proportion needs to reach at least 12%.

It’s (almost) all in the head

Now that the main financial and technological barriers have been removed (more affordable purchase prices, financial incentives, denser network of charging stations), what factors are still blocking widespread adoption of this mode of transportation? A large part of the answer lies in the cognitive biases and shortcuts of car drivers.

“Until now, initiatives related to the energy transition generally focused on the technological and financial barriers to their realization. Psychological factors have been given very little consideration. However, many studies show that individuals do not automatically adopt the behaviors most beneficial for themselves or society, often due to a lack of access to complete information”, explains Mario Herberz, first author of the study and researcher at the Consumer Decision and Sustainable Behavior Laboratory of the Department of Psychology at the Faculty of Psychology and Educational Sciences of the UNIGE.

The solution: tailored information

By interviewing more than 2,000 car drivers of different backgrounds and ages in Germany and the United States, the UNIGE scientists identified the source of the cognitive biases that were holding them back from adopting an electric vehicle. “We observed that the participants systematically underestimated the compatibility of electric battery capacities available on the current market with their real needs,” says Tobias Brosch, director of the Consumer Decision and Sustainable Behavior Laboratory and last author of the research.


In other words, consumers wrongly believe that the autonomy of current batteries is not sufficient to cover their daily journeys. This underestimation is substantial, the researchers estimating it at around 30%. “To reassure people, the solution is not only to densify the network of charging stations or to increase the size of batteries, which require scarcer resources such as lithium and cobalt. It is the provision of information adapted to the concrete needs of drivers that will reduce their concern and increase their willingness to adopt an electric vehicle,” explains Mario Herberz.

250 kilometers, the ideal range

The research team found that more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers, a modest range among the currently available batteries. “The trend is to increase performance, but we have observed that a greater range, beyond 300km for example, does not increase the fit to daily needs. It would only have a minimal impact on the number of additional trips that can be completed with one electric charge. Increasing the size of the batteries is therefore not a key element in the energy transition,” says Mario Herberz.


This research, partly financed by the Swiss Federal Office of Energy, demonstrates the importance of psychological factors and access to relevant information when implementing the energy transition. It opens up new avenues for promoting the electrification of mobility with scientifically informed interventions, as a complement to conventional policy approaches.


JOURNAL

Nature Energy

DOI

10.1038/s41560-022-01028-3 

METHOD OF RESEARCH

News article

SUBJECT OF RESEARCH

People

ARTICLE TITLE

Counteracting electric vehicle range concern with a scalable behavioural intervention

ARTICLE PUBLICATION DATE

19-May-2022

From EurekAlert!

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Simonsays
May 22, 2022 2:34 pm

Obviously none these people have tried towing a boat or caravan with an EV.

Duane
Reply to  Simonsays
May 22, 2022 2:48 pm

Obviously you’ve never driven a Ford F-150 Lightning that has both substantially higher towing capacity, towing torque, horsepower, and equal if not longer range than a IC powered Ford Pickup. Which is why Ford is selling hundreds of thousands of them a year despite just being introduced.

BobM
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 3:08 pm

Price of a F-150 starts at $30.5K, the F-150 Lightning, $39.5K (tax credits available). Range for F-150 (23 gallon tank) at 21 mpg (combined) almost 500 miles, vs. around 300 tops for the Lightning (no air conditioning or heat on long trips though 300 mile range is not a long trip).
Sure, some will be bought, but most folks don’t want to have to worry about what restrictions they may have purshased with a new toy.

Then there’s this quote from the article: “However, many studies show that individuals do not automatically adopt the behaviors most beneficial for themselves or society, often due to a lack of access to complete information”, explains Mario Herberz.”

Well, duh. The entire automobile market is based upon people buying a dream, not a utility. That has been the case for ICE vehicles for a century. Now all of a sudden they need to be worried about charging stations and what is “most benefiticial”? Hardly.

jim lumbers
Reply to  BobM
May 22, 2022 5:37 pm

Important omission by the researchers. The huge difference in consequences between running out of fuel and the battery going flat. One requires, at worst, a lift to the gas station and back. The other at minimum, a tow plus a 2-8 hour wait while the battery is charged. on a long trip this would also require overnight accommodation. This massive difference in consequences, one of which can be mitigated merely by carrying a can of gas. The other cannot at all, would give any thinking motorist second thoughts about committing to electric.

Rhoda R.
Reply to  jim lumbers
May 22, 2022 8:07 pm

Of course, with the EV they could carry a couple of Jerry cans of gas and pull a 25 kw generator on long trips. Would safe having to find recharging stations.

H.R.
Reply to  Rhoda R.
May 22, 2022 8:43 pm

🤣🤣🤣🤣 Yup. All that towing capacity is absolutely great for a trailer with a generator and some fuel.

The boat or caravan…? Optional.

Simonsays
Reply to  jim lumbers
May 22, 2022 11:39 pm
Kit P
Reply to  Simonsays
May 23, 2022 8:01 pm

If you had an EV F-150, you could tow the Tesla and the regenerative braking would charge the batteries.

Just for the record, I sometimes run the generator in my motor home when driving down the road. The reason is powering the air conditioners on the roof.

See the problem?

The idiot in the video is going to be found dead in the desert.

That Honda in the video will charge 4 golf cart batteries but not run an A/C. I have a portable generator that will run one A/C. My motor home has a bigger Cummins generator that is too heavy to lift without a fork lift. It will run all my electrical loads.

To get it all going down the road at 65 mph, assuming no hills, requires a 300 hp Cummins diesel. A 6% grade put me in the truck lane going 35 mph going up and down.

The range of my RV is 700 miles. I can stay in the boonies for a month.

A 1/2 ton anything is not very good at towing much. It is about getting down the hill safely. Never heard of a fatality getting stuck going up.

SMC
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 3:23 pm

Wrong. Of course, it depends on the trim. The ICE F-150 has a greater towing capacity, larger payload capacity and greater range on a tank of gas than the Lightning does.

John Howe
Reply to  SMC
May 22, 2022 8:44 pm

EVs range drops significantly when you hook a trailer or a caravan on behind them.

DHR
Reply to  John Howe
May 22, 2022 9:11 pm

And it drops further when you read the owners manual that says the battery should not be depleted below 10% nor charged above 80%. That takes away 30% of the advertised range from the git go.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  DHR
May 23, 2022 1:13 pm

but…but…but… those are just details!

decnine
Reply to  John Howe
May 23, 2022 12:39 am

Or drive in hilly terrain. Or drive into a head wind. Or drive in cold weather. Or need to run the windscreen wipers. Or need to keep slowing and accelerating because of speed bumps. Or stopping and starting for traffic lights. And don’t even mention repsonding to the antics of other drivers…

WBrowning
Reply to  John Howe
May 24, 2022 10:34 am

EV Trucks are like Giant Golf Carts, very useful for hauling things around in a small radius, but horrible once you leave the “course”.

I’d like to see a video of someone towing with one at full capacity on a family vacation trip, say from L.A. to Yosemite. It’s only 350 or so miles, but travels through the very hot central valley, and climbs through the Sierras up to over 5000 feet. A fairly easy day’s drive with an ICE powered truck.

I figure it would take a good two maybe three days. The first obstacle is the 4100 pass on the “Grapevine” you’d need to do with the A/C on. It’s 80+ miles from most of L.A. and almost always hot after May. If you make it over the pass, the downhill regen will get you to Bakersfield.

You’d still have 150 miles and 100 deg. f temperatures to deal with before the next climb. Sounds like a real adventure, but the ids might get board setting at the charging stations, and most of your week off will be burned up traveling.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  SMC
May 23, 2022 5:43 am

But if the power goes out in your house you can run the house (if you spent the $2500 to get the correct setup) for a few hours, then wait for the power to come back on to recharge the truck.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  SMC
May 24, 2022 5:22 am

My 92 F150 has a 650+ mile range. I have to admit though that the truck has twin tanks and when full holds almost 40 gallons. I guarantee it can tow more than the electric truck. I have towed a 8000lb trailer in West Virginia without any issues other than having to shift out of overdrive on the climbs.

Rob_Dawg
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 3:49 pm

> Obviously you’ve never driven a Ford F-150 Lightning that has both substantially higher towing capacity, towing torque, horsepower, and equal if not longer range than a IC powered Ford Pickup.

As have all but a few hundred at most drivers as the vehicle is in new limited release.

UNGN
Reply to  Rob_Dawg
May 22, 2022 5:36 pm

You’ve obviosly never towed anything in your life. “Greater towing capacity” means nothing when your range is reduced to 100 miles and try charging it with a 25 foot long trailer attached.

H.R.
Reply to  UNGN
May 22, 2022 9:17 pm

Try charging it with a 16,500#, 42′ trailer attached after driving 550 miles before looking to park for the night and then ‘tank up’ in the morning.

What’s that? Ain’t gonna happen?

I’ll stick with my Cummins Turbodiesel dually with a 50-gallon tank, thank you very much.

Oh, and if I get a little bit of range anxiety, I’ll just add an auxiliary bed tank that will extend the range another 500 or 600 miles.

And, as pointed out above, if I somehow run out of fuel before reaching my destination 1,100 or more miles away, I’ll just thumb a ride to the nearest exit and get a few gallons so I can fuel up and be on my way.

Badges? Range anxiety? I doan have no steenkin’ range anxiety.

I have more range than I am willing to drive in one day.


Seriously, the EV F-150 is fine for those who understand its capabilities and for whom its capabilities suit their needs.

But the EV F-150’s capabilities don’t suit my needs. Nice try, Ford. Thanks for playing.

P.S. I’m not the only one out there. There are at least 100 other people alone in the RV park where we snowbird who would agree with me. Wanna see some cool, very bad-ass big, big pickup trucks, all makes? Just walk the RV grounds with me in the morning. (And then there are the motor homes with really big diesels and dual tanks.)

Tomsa
Reply to  H.R.
May 23, 2022 8:42 pm

I missed this yesterday due to travel. Agree with H.R. having towed with our F150 pulling our 22ft. fifth wheel over 400 miles across northern Montana today in eight hours with stops including one very quick one for gas, No way could I do that with the EV F150.

Sunderland Steve
Reply to  UNGN
May 23, 2022 3:51 am

He was quoting Duane. Not his own view.

curly
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 4:02 pm

Duane, do you have references to support the sales and range numbers?

My contacts inside Ford, in engineering, not marketing or bean counting, say they are concerned about the PR when customers live with real range performance. Their test data says that with a full load in the bed, covered with an aerodynamic cover, range is reduced by 30%. Worse, when towing near full rated towing capacity, the range is reduced by 50% (i.e. – 1/2) on flat ground, more if you’re towing in hilly terrain. The advertised, best case “marketing, not to exceed” range is 230 miles for the standard battery pack and 300 miles for the enhanced battery pack. Those seem like a concern for a work truck where payload and range are primary design goals. And of course, YMMV if you have to run with the heater or a/c on.

I’m sure the torque numbers are good with electric motors, but the horsepower for the base battery pack is less that the high output 3.5L V6.

For charging times, with the standard battery pack, Level 2 charging times of 10 hours with a Ford Charging station (240V/80A) and 14 hours with a 240V “portable” charger. The upgraded battery pack takes longer, up to 20 hours with a 240V portable charger. Those also seem like problems for a work truck where availability is also primary design goal.

Real world experience will tell, but if you have credible references and real data, please share.

DHR
Reply to  curly
May 22, 2022 9:16 pm

Claims for the wonders of electric motor torque never compare electric torque to geared ICE torque. Something over 100 years ago, the gear box was invented to overcome the well established and well known limited torque of ICE engines. Gears are still used for the very same reason.

curly
Reply to  DHR
May 24, 2022 2:51 pm

I’m w/you DHR, but didn’t want to confuse Duane with torque.vs.RPM curves, or gear ratios or power-train/transmission loss or other sciencey/mathy stuff.

ihfan
Reply to  curly
May 23, 2022 8:02 am

Don’t confuse Duane with facts. He’s obviously not operating in the real world or had any classes in physics or electricity.

Tim Gorman
Reply to  curly
May 24, 2022 5:10 pm

I’m not sure how many people understand fleet operations. Where different shifts use the same vehicle where will the charging time come from? Reduced productivity?

DEVILS TOWER
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 4:21 pm

The F150 lightning has a fully loaded range of 100 miles. Do ot plan on pulling your RV. It could take you a hund miles to find a place to pull your RV up to charging station you can park you truck plus trailer at. Anybody here pulled anything cross country?

In the 80s I had a faulty head light switch over heat and cause a car fire in my garage. That was easy to put out. Parking a full sized truck EV in my garage. It is all in my head, right…

Rich Davis
Reply to  DEVILS TOWER
May 22, 2022 4:49 pm

Hey, if your EV bursts into unquenchable flames and burns your house to the ground, I’m sure your insurance company will make you whole, right? I mean unless you’re a pile of ashes in what used to be the cellar I suppose.

csm800
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 4:25 pm

My 3.5L Twin Turbo Ecoboost F150 crew cab has a 36 gallon tank. I can head to the wilderness in the high country 180-200 miles away, with a 4000lbs trailer and spend a week hunting and not worry about the return trip. The Lightening will leave me stranded, far far away from a charging station. Maybe if I bring a diesel powered generator to charge it while I’m in the forest….It is a useless vehicle for me but I’m sure it’ll be great as a grocery getter and picking up potting soil at Home Depot – in other words, not useful to someone who would use it as a real truck. Same for towing a boat to the lake.

Plus my vehicle doesn’t have slave labor and child labor involved in making the battery, so I get to drive with a clean conscience.
So no, I won’t buy it, no matter how hard the attempt to sell it.

Right-Handed Shark
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 4:38 pm

Hundreds of thousands per year? You must be getting confused. There has been a “Lightning” model in the F-150 lineup since 1993 and they were most definitely gasoline powered. The have certainly sold hundreds of thousands, possibly even millions since then. The 2022 electric version, not so many:

“Ford says it has received more than 200,000 reservations. The company has the capacity to build 15,000 of the trucks in 2022.”

https://www.kbb.com/car-news/ford-closes-reservations-for-f-150-lightning-has-3-year-backlog/

By the end of 2024 they expect to have built around 150,000. I make that 50,000 per year.

Last edited 1 month ago by Right-Handed Shark
Right-Handed Shark
Reply to  Right-Handed Shark
May 22, 2022 5:03 pm

Missed the edit.. meant to say an average of 50,000 per year.. obviously this year they will fall short.

Last edited 1 month ago by Right-Handed Shark
H.R.
Reply to  Right-Handed Shark
May 22, 2022 9:37 pm

@Right-Handed Shark – Yup. The F-150 Lightning has been a Ford SVT (Special Vehicle Team) model for years.

If you bought one back when and spent an extra $5k or so at a speed shop, you could smoke any Corvette made from a stop at a traffic light.

I wound up buying a triple-black SuperCoupe; an SVT supercharged Thunderbird, but I always ‘lusted in my heart’ for an SVT F-150 Lightning.

*ahem* Nice truck *ahem*. Vrroooomm!!!!

MarkW
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 6:14 pm

That people are buying a handful of them is not in doubt.
However your belief that they are using them to tow things is cute. You will believe whatever you are told to believe.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  MarkW
May 23, 2022 1:25 pm

With the lack of investigative thinking demonstrated by any of the “buyers” of these trucks, it would appear (to me) to be “gotta keep up with the neighbor” type decision-making… OR… just brainwashed Libs.

Ed Hanley
Reply to  Duane
May 22, 2022 10:32 pm

Introduced on April 26 this year, about 2,000 F-150 Lightning pickups have been manufactured. So that’s a month. I appreciate your enthusiasm, and marvel at the magic of wildly speculative extrapolation into the future.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Ed Hanley
May 23, 2022 5:49 am

That’s a month of sales, probably 4 to 5 months of actual build. Obviously the numbers will go up as they get more experience in the plant(s).

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 5:41 am

It was just introduced so they have not sold hundreds of thousands of them a year. Ford announced that they will up production capacity to 150k units annually, but that was before the huge rise in the price of lithium. There are a lot of truck owners who do not use their pickup as a truck, but there are many that do and they will not go EV because of the diminished capacity of the vehicle when carrying a load or towing. Having a higher towing capacity than the base F-150 but sacrificing 50% of range is not a good option for most. And when towing a trailer in the winter through hilly terrain, good luck.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  Trying to Play Nice
May 23, 2022 1:31 pm

Is Ford intentionally heading to bankruptcy? Or will the taxpayers be expected to infuse another “too big to fail” company?

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Sturmudgeon
May 23, 2022 3:44 pm

From what I could see they built an assembly area for the EV. The body is built and painted elsewhere, probably in the F-150 plant next door which could make all ICEV bodies if the EV fails. The assembly area looks like a vehicle assembly plant that could build other vehicles with the right tooling modifications, which is standard in the industry. The EV capacity has a lot to do with parts availability, not necessarily brick and mortar in the assembly plant. If sales tank they will lose some money but they will definitely not fail. Even the 150,000k sales number is only about 20% of their current F-150 sales.

Steve
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 5:52 am

The Lightning Pro, the most affordable option, has a 230 mile range. This range will be reduced substantially if towing. If I want to tow my boat 150 miles to go fishing in northern MN, what are my prospects of this being a successful trip? No charging available at the public access site. In the fall I need the truck to go deer hunting. I drive 450 miles to my destination to hunt. Then I will drive a few hundred miles while I’m at my remote hunting location. What are my charging options?

ihfan
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 8:04 am

Obviously you’ve never driven a Ford F-150 Lightning that has both substantially higher towing capacity, towing torque, horsepower, and equal if not longer range than a IC powered Ford Pickup.

Obviously you’ve never read the specs on the Lightning, either.

Meab
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 9:44 am

You’re ignorant, DuhWayne. The range of a standard Lightning is 230 miles. Towing will reduce that range by 50% to 115 miles. However, you would only get that with a 100% full charge taken down to zero. But discharging to zero damages the battery. Also, there won’t be a fast charger exactly where you need it, so you had better be thinking about charging after 80 miles. Unfortunately, getting a full charge takes over an hour, so you’ll probably only charge to 80% in a half hour. Add that to the time it takes to pull off the highway, disconnect and reconnect the trailer (there are no pull-through chargers) and you’ve spent about an hour to get enough juice to go another ~60 miles. That’s about a minute of time related to charging for every mile.

Compare this to my own experience towing 10s of thousands of miles with a gas powered pickup. It could easily go 200 miles before range anxiety set in and fill-ups took 8 minutes.

EV pickups can only do local towing, DuhWayne. I trust that you will learn about this and stop lying.

Robert of Texas
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 10:19 am

From the Ford site: Ford’s new plan includes a ramp to 15,000 vehicles in 2022, 55,000 in 2023, and 80,000 in 2024.”

Reservations are not car sells, and you are looking at reservations through presumably 2025.

MarkW
Reply to  Duane
May 23, 2022 2:10 pm

Obviously, you have once again failed to verify your facts.

Observer
Reply to  Duane
May 24, 2022 12:50 am

“The research team found that more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers”

Cool, so I can pay over the odds for a vehicle that only covers 90% of my needs when it’s new, and less and less as it ages? Wow! Where do I sign??

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Observer
May 24, 2022 10:18 am

Not only that but the “study” was in Europe where driving distances are a lot shorter. 200km?! Bwa-ha-ha-ha-ha! That’s all of 124 miles. A trip to visit one of my sisters is probably about 2x that, so much for “meeting 90% of needs.” A trip to visit my other sister would probably be 10x that.

I probably couldn’t go to my usual “day trip” photography haunts and get home without adding an eternally long recharge to the trip. Effing useless. It’s not “cognitive biases” that causes people to stick with ICE cars, it’s that ICE cars are far more useful!

Alba
Reply to  Duane
May 24, 2022 11:52 am

In fact, it seems that Ford has achieved its stated goal of making the Lightning better than the gas-burning F-150 in pretty much every way except for outright range (especially when towing). 
https://insideevs.com/news/587849/top-gear-test-ford-lightning-texas/

Bryan A
Reply to  Simonsays
May 22, 2022 3:16 pm

Kiss your Bass goodbye

H.R.
Reply to  Bryan A
May 22, 2022 9:47 pm

Ha! I suppose you are in the pay of Big Bass Boats, Bryan? 😉


Really. Ain’t no bass pro gonna ever use one to go from tournament to tournament. I’m pretty sure it can’t be done if one expects to arrive on time at the next lake for the next tournament.

Wait up… [search on “bass pro using EV F-150 Lightning”]

Okay. Zero hits on Bing.

Zig Zag Wanderer
Reply to  Simonsays
May 22, 2022 5:31 pm

Or running a bus service…

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-61543634
Potters Bar: Buses catch fire at town centre transport depot

Last edited 1 month ago by Zig Zag Wanderer
H.R.
Reply to  Zig Zag Wanderer
May 22, 2022 9:51 pm

Ho hum, Zig Zag. Yet another EV bus depot fire?

It’s a “Dog Bites Man” story. That’s not news.

Let us know when “Man Bites Dog.”

Ack
Reply to  Simonsays
May 23, 2022 4:56 am

How dare you own a gas guzzling boat or caravan!

Robert B
May 22, 2022 2:39 pm

Anyone else get the feeling that we are being pushed into electric cars so that it’s a privilege to drive? The poor in first world nations make more from social security than the average worker in developing countries and can’t afford heating. What chance is there that after phasing out fossil fuels that charging up a car will be cheap?

Chaswarnertoo
Reply to  Robert B
May 22, 2022 2:43 pm

You will own nothing, and be happy…

H.R.
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
May 22, 2022 9:52 pm

Or else.

MarkW
Reply to  H.R.
May 23, 2022 8:22 am

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
May 23, 2022 1:36 pm

There are SO-O-O many who refuse to consider this forecast…even though they have been told it hundreds of times, (or more).

John Bell
Reply to  Robert B
May 22, 2022 3:27 pm

And they can turn off your power and you can walk, peasant!

Rhoda R.
Reply to  John Bell
May 22, 2022 8:12 pm

Not to mention fry or freeze depending on the time of the year. Not to mention walking to the store every day due to inadequate refrigeration.

Dave Fair
Reply to  Robert B
May 22, 2022 6:02 pm

But you can rest assured, Robert, that you are doing the right thing for society and increasing your social score with the government.

Chaswarnertoo
May 22, 2022 2:42 pm

Electric cars do bugger all to ‘save the planet’. Net zero is a very stupid idea. Anyone who believes in this nonsense should stop breathing out, right now!

G Mawer
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
May 22, 2022 5:13 pm

Exactly. I shake my head when these carbon life forms say we need to ” decarbonize”.

badEnglish
May 22, 2022 2:49 pm

Cognitive bias related to battery range, huh? How about this: https://bc.ctvnews.ca/mobile/video?clipId=2447968&utm_campaign=trueAnthem%3A+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR1TCqBBSzbzJ7XA3Na8YAJcdVcOw99cHiZCH3DqaDyMGJZVbTjGCzQYbEk

I think if my car locked me in and spontaneously caught fire, that might have something do with my willingness to adopt EV’s moving forward.

badEnglish

commieBob
May 22, 2022 2:53 pm

People aren’t as stupid as the supposed elites think. My observation is that the effect exists at all time scales and over geography. For instance, modern scholars, who would starve if they had to farm, fish, or hunt for a living, often assume that people from other places and times are/were too stupid to do the bloody obvious.

People’s choice of vehicle is driven by many factors. The price of fuel is one such factor.

Lately, when gas has been relatively cheap, folks around here tend to drive giant pickup trucks, most of which, as far as I can tell, seldom carry cargo.

When we had arab oil embargoes, people drove tiny econoboxes.

So, what factors would keep people from driving electric cars? Could it be the price?

A while ago, I calculated that the price of gas would have to more than double before switching away from gasoline would make sense. Mind you, natural gas or propane might be a better choice than electric.

If enough people switch to electric cars, the government will lose enough gas taxes that it will slap a mileage fee on the electrics. So there’s that.

ATheoK
Reply to  commieBob
May 22, 2022 5:21 pm

Lately, when gas has been relatively cheap, folks around here tend to drive giant pickup trucks, most of which, as far as I can tell, seldom carry cargo.”

So much for rational observations.
Combined with a belief system that judges others based upon personal biases with minimal observation. e.g., “Oh look, that truck isn’t carrying anything… Bet they never use a truck’s ability…”

When you need a truck, nothing else serves as well.
The truck carries in one load what cars require multiple trips for (lower gross vehicle weight which minimize carrying capacity).

My truck has over a thousand pounds of bagged river rock and sand in the cargo bed right now.
It’s easy to unload. I just slide the bags off the tailgate and carry it to where I need it.
Broken bags? I sweep out the back into a bucket.

In a car, you’d have to lean into the car and lift the bags out of the vehicle… By the way, that type of lifting is bad for your back!

The truck tows far greater weights than what cars can safely handle.
Besides the massive wear and tear on lightweight transmissions, suspensions, axles and brakes, towing large heavy boats, trailers, RVs, etc., requires a larger heavy vehicles to safely control the towed object.

If you can only afford one vehicle, you purchase a vehicle that handles ALL of your needs! Not just a vehicle to handle weekday lightweight commuting or a few nearby errands.

No-one believes new vehicle mileage rates. Most rational people know that moving heavy objects always equates to greater fuel usage.
Those light vehicles with highly touted mpg rates promptly lose those high mileage rates when faced with carrying heavy weights or towing anything.

Towing a couple of noisy single person water craft? You certainly do not need an almost useless expensive EV to do that.

Ford F150 EV lightnings? Pfft.
They’re secondary/tertiary play vehicles for rich landowners, not hardworking vehicles ready to work 24/7/365!

So you see a truck driving empty, like most vehicles on the road; doing it’s job handling all of that owner’s needs, including errands and commuting. You do not need to immediately assume the worst of your beliefs.

Rhoda R.
Reply to  ATheoK
May 22, 2022 8:21 pm

Both of you are correct. There are people who have trucks that under utililze their carrying capacity. I had a truck for about 15 years and maybe carried loads that I couldn’t have carried in a SUV type vehicle maybe20 or 30 times. My neighbor hasn’t used her truck for truck like stuff since they moved in about 10 years ago. My other neighbor mostly uses his to pull his camper. Okay. I get it. Trucks are nice to have and kind of cool. Also, when you need a truck you need a truck. So I found a place in town that rents pick-up trucks. It’s a trade off between the price of gas/diesel and convenience.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Rhoda R.
May 23, 2022 5:48 am

In my neck of the woods, home improvement centers are not more than 10 miles away anywhere in the state. Most of them have pickups you can rent for $20 for 75 minutes. If you have a one-time need to shuffle 100 bags of mulch, you’re covered. Not to pooh-pooh truck ownership, not at all. Currently though, it’s very painful for diesel folks to fill up; we’re at $6.20/gal (US). I know the folks across the pond are laughing hysterically at that price, but it’s all about what you are used to.

TimTheToolMan
Reply to  ATheoK
May 23, 2022 3:07 am

When you need a truck, nothing else serves as well.

The truck carries in one load what cars require multiple trips for (lower gross vehicle weight which minimize carrying capacity).

I think the best solution for many would be for registration and insurance to be transferrable between vehicles such that “one registration/insurance” covers all your vehicles as long as only one is used at any one time.

Then many could actually afford to have an ICE vehicle (ie truck) for those times when you need it and an EV for the times when you’re just commuting around.

I dont know how that might be policed but it’d be a great interim step towards going electric.

BobM
Reply to  TimTheToolMan
May 23, 2022 7:04 am

I had that “one registration/insurance coverage for all your vehicles as long as only one is used at any one time” discussion with my insurance agent. And the answer was, first, all the cars have different insurance rates. Pay for the most expesive even though you don’t drive it much? Second, how do you document that only one is being driven at a time, especially if there are more than one driver in the household? Third, have an accident in one and you’re done. You can’t drive any others until you insure them first. Same goes for a whole host of issues, like collision, comprehensive, liability, whatever. How do you drop one off for maintenance/repairs without someone driving one other one, unless you get a neighbor to drop you off? The whole concept doesn’t really work, and is ripe for fraud. Not happening.

TimTheToolMan
Reply to  BobM
May 23, 2022 1:22 pm

It could work if registration and insurance was applied to the individual rather than the car. But there would still need to be a way for unsafe cars to be kept off the road.

MarkW
Reply to  TimTheToolMan
May 23, 2022 2:14 pm

As Bob pointed out, since the cost of insuring different types of vehicles varies, there is simply no way to to attach the insurance to the person only.

TimTheToolMan
Reply to  MarkW
May 24, 2022 1:28 pm

Insurance is about statistics. The value of the insurance can be set independently of the vehicle if that was wanted.

commieBob
Reply to  ATheoK
May 23, 2022 4:34 am

You do not need to immediately assume the worst of your beliefs.

Around where I live (southern Ontario) some people are getting rid of their large vehicles because of the cost of fuel. link It boils down to a question of how badly you actually need a truck or large van.

Dave Andrews
Reply to  commieBob
May 23, 2022 7:44 am

In the UK revenue from fuel duty and vehicle excise duty (commonly called road tax) brought in £37 Billion to the UK Treasury in 2019-20. EVs are currently exempt from paying both these charges.

Eng_Ian
May 22, 2022 2:54 pm

If an EV was released onto the market with a range of 1000km it would be beneficial to almost everybody. The reason seems obvious. After driving 1000km in one day you’d need to sleep, so there would be 12+ hours of recharge time available.

Now let me think, where can I get a solar charger at night so that I am sufficiently green in my life choices……

Another way of looking at this, that range would probably require a 250kWHr battery. Ignore the cost, weight and the mining resources required for your lifestyle choice, that’s all fairy dust to the green cohort anyway.

The other option…. Just make and sell electric cars to the rich who want to show how internally green they are, the car can sit on charge all week and be driven the 10km to the coffee shop in a Saturday morning. The latte on the other hand will be manufactured from cradle to grave using fossil fuels and will in most cases fully outweigh the benefits of elite and their environmental medal.

They buy one car, once every ten years, they buy coffees everyday. I wonder where the true benefits could be found if a change was forced to be made.

markl
May 22, 2022 2:57 pm

Having more charging stations doesn’t impact charge time which wasn’t mentioned. Because of the longer time to charge vs. fill with gas many more charging stations will be needed. Range anxiety doesn’t disappear with more charging stations. Reduced cost doesn’t mean competitive to ICE car cost either. The least expensive EV is still over double the cost of the least expensive ICE car. EVs are a niche vehicle suited for city driving if they can be afforded and charged at home during sleep hours.

Rhoda R.
Reply to  markl
May 22, 2022 8:24 pm

EVs also need garages. Many people living in apartments and condos don’t have sheltered parking of any sort.

Tom
Reply to  Rhoda R.
May 23, 2022 3:40 pm

Only if allowed to park in them. Some have had to park away from the house. GM advised owners to park a certain distance from the house in the past year I believe and some parking garages do not allow EV’s from what I have read.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Rhoda R.
May 24, 2022 10:52 am

They need something for a garage that will retain the heat of the fire when it comes.

Like a really big brick oven.

DonM
Reply to  AGW is Not Science
May 24, 2022 12:28 pm

… good sustainable thinking.

You should be on your local sustainability advisory board/commission.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  DonM
May 24, 2022 5:15 pm

If you’re lucky your BEV will self-ignite when it’s cold out so you can possibly make use of the heat.

Dave Andrews
Reply to  markl
May 23, 2022 7:59 am

A recent article (14th May) in the UK i newspaper quoted the European Automobile Manufacturers Association as saying out of 225,000 public chargers currently available in the EU only one in nine is suitable for fast charging.

The writer of the article also noted that she has had to download 9 apps for the various charging networks encountered whilst travelling in the UK

John Bell
May 22, 2022 3:01 pm

FORD is set to build a huge new factory in Michigan just for e-cars, seems risky to me. I guess if it does not fly then it can be written off.

curly
Reply to  John Bell
May 22, 2022 4:24 pm

Their investment in Rivian seems questionable now that they are selling 8 million shares at a loss. Maybe that’s just a warmup for losses on the EV plants investment. At least they’re doing it with “their” money, and not bailout money. Yet. Another large investor was selling 15+ million shares of Rivian.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  curly
May 23, 2022 5:59 am

Rivian made 1000 trucks their first year. How can you not get rich with such high volumes? At least with those production numbers they can keep saying they have a waiting list.

Anthony
May 22, 2022 3:10 pm

What about the prevalence of high density living without off street parking? As with other green initiatives such as rooftop solar, home charging an EV is a luxury afforded only to those wealthy enough for a home with a large footprint.

H B
May 22, 2022 3:12 pm

They are getting desperate they must think the public is extremely stupid

Rod Evans
Reply to  H B
May 22, 2022 11:40 pm

The authorities have a well developed program to ensure the ‘education’ of individuals makes them stupid.
They are very impressed with their work so far.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  H B
May 23, 2022 1:45 pm

Well, they appear to be correct! Have you noticed the masks?

Bryan A
May 22, 2022 3:12 pm

What are the barriers to the adoption of electric cars? Although the main financial (??? Financial obstacles still exist as EV$ are minimum twice the cost of ICE equivalents) and technological obstacles have been removed, their market share still needs to increase (and where will the materials come from for this necessary increase??). In a recent study, a team from the University of Geneva (UNIGE) <UN(H)I(N)GEd investigated the cognitive factors that still dissuade many people from switching to electric cars. They found that car owners systematically underestimate the capacity of electric driving ranges to meet their daily needs. they need to allow for Worst Case Scenarios not best case These results, published in Nature Energy, open up new avenues to speed up the electrification of mobility in addition to conventional policy approaches
Just …
Increase mining DRAMATICALLY
Increase smelting DRAMATICALLY
Increase mineral processing
Increase Raw Ore (ICE diesel) Transportation Fleet
Increase Refined Mineral Transportation (ICE diesel)
Quintuple electricity generation for production and redouble for full electrification
Quadruple quantity of distribution Transformers with minimum 100KVA sizing (4 house max per)
Increase primary wire ampacity for increased load
Replace and upsize almost every distribution pole for increased weight
Build Thousands of miles of Transmission Lines/Towers to allow for remotely produced unreliable energy to be accessed where it’s needed
Quadruple shipping fleet to transport raw ore to offshore refiners
Quadruple diesel production for increased shipping
All the above may need to be doubled or redoubled depending on the timeframe for full net zero

william Johnston
Reply to  Bryan A
May 22, 2022 3:33 pm

I hereby pledge to do my part for the environment. I will never buy anything that consumes more resources than necessary.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  william Johnston
May 24, 2022 5:17 pm

Careful, if the Eco-Nazis get their way that will include ELECTRICITY.

John Bell
May 22, 2022 3:15 pm

Tailored information. Sounds Orwellian

Tom Abbott
Reply to  John Bell
May 23, 2022 3:07 am

These authors are just exploring new ways to brainwash people.

They are (obviously) brainwashed themselves, about climate change and associated issues, and think they are doing others a service by passing on their own brainwashing to the general public.

Last edited 1 month ago by Tom Abbott
Nik
May 22, 2022 3:25 pm

“tailored information” A strange way to spell “lies,” by commission and omission.

Bryan A
Reply to  Nik
May 22, 2022 5:08 pm

Only Approved Disinformation shall be allowed

Admin
May 22, 2022 3:29 pm

Its the average load problem all over again.

A lot of IT failures occur because planners underestimated required capacity. Instead of using peak use, they used average use, to estimate capacity. As a result, every time usage peaks, the system goes down.

Same with EVs. EV ranges are good enough to cover most daily driving requirements. But what about the exceptions? What are you supposed to do when you need to tow a heavy load, drive in exceptionally cold weather, or drive a bit further than usual?

No problem if you have a gasoline automobile. A big problem if you own an EV.

Last edited 1 month ago by Eric Worrall
Mr.
Reply to  Eric Worrall
May 22, 2022 3:59 pm

Well Eric, you apply the same rationale that greenies do to meet the problems of night-time solar panels and calm wind days for turbines –

you just install lots more of them!

So, with an EV that doesn’t meet all your circumstances, the solution is obvious –

you just buy 4 extra EVs with different performance specs to cover all eventualities!

Simples!

Rich Davis
Reply to  Mr.
May 22, 2022 5:00 pm

Yes you can just tow a couple of extra trucks so you can make it back home. Why do you Deplorables need those nasty trucks anyway? Just get a nice high-end Tesla for $100k or so.

Mr.
Reply to  Rich Davis
May 22, 2022 5:15 pm

Why limit my virtue signaling to just one EV when I can save the planet with 4 of them?

Izaac Walton
Reply to  Eric Worrall
May 22, 2022 5:24 pm

What are you supposed to do when you need to tow a heavy load”
U-haul or the local equivalent works extremely well. In all the years I have owned a car I have never had one with a tow bar and have also never worried about that fact.

Dave Fair
Reply to  Izaac Walton
May 22, 2022 6:20 pm

Izaac, never, never, never use your needs, wants and experiences to extrapolate to what other people “should” do. Additionally, consider:

Around 40.8 million used vehicles were sold in 2019 in the United States. In contrast, only 17 million new vehicles were sold in the same year. As you can see the number of used vehicles sold in the United States in 2019 was double the number of new ones and that should give you an idea of just how big is the used car market.”

Who, pray tell, will be buying used EVs?

Admin
Reply to  Izaac Walton
May 22, 2022 9:53 pm

Izaac, you have no idea what circumstances other people face. If that works well for you, good on you. But don’t expect your solutions to match everyone elses needs.

Izaac Walton
Reply to  Eric Worrall
May 23, 2022 12:00 am

Eric,
I am not. But judging from the high percentage of cars driving around without a towbar my solution would appear to match most people’s needs.

Jim Gorman
Reply to  Izaac Walton
May 23, 2022 5:17 am

Do you EVER take trips of 1000 – 1500 miles? How do you do that reasonably with an EV?

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Jim Gorman
May 23, 2022 5:51 am

Strawman. Not to carry water for Izaac, but that was not the argument he was making.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  D. J. Hawkins
May 23, 2022 1:57 pm

Exactly! He may be making a very good point, if the amazing number of U-Haul type locations are any indication.

ihfan
Reply to  Izaac Walton
May 23, 2022 8:26 am

U-haul or the local equivalent works extremely well.

U-Haul doesn’t rent anything that can actually tow a “heavy” load. The biggest truck they rent has a “Towing Capacity: Up to 10,000 lbs.”

“Heavy” is relative. Based on your response, “heavy” to you is probably a big lawnmower or a few hundred pounds of mulch.

Please don’t make the assumption that just because you don’t need a truck bigger than something that you’d get at U-Haul, that nobody does.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  ihfan
May 23, 2022 2:00 pm

If I read his post accurately, he was stating his own, personal decisions. Considering the number of people living in bee-hive homes nowadays, his solution could very well be applicable to large numbers of people.

Old Cocky
Reply to  Eric Worrall
May 22, 2022 9:37 pm

The Australian Bureau of Statistics learned that the hard way a few years back with a Census.

Jim Gorman
Reply to  Eric Worrall
May 23, 2022 5:15 am

This study misses the point entirely. Daily commutes are not the only issue one must consider when purchasing a vehicle. I can only afford one vehicle. It must serve my daily commutes AND longer trips for vacations, visiting relatives, and other duties. I can’t afford a second ICE vehicle just for these occasional uses. Neither can I afford to have overnight hotels for every recharge interval.

The only other option is to have one EV and forego longer trips that its range simply won’t support. This is as valid a reason for NOT buying an EV as for those who were interviewed but didn’t think an EV would meet their needs.

Michael in Dublin
May 22, 2022 3:33 pm

It is simple old fashioned common sense that convinces a person that electric cars are a premature and very costly solution that cater for the rich elite.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Michael in Dublin
May 23, 2022 3:29 am

Massive EV use is not feasible within the 2030 time limits set by the alarmists.

Biden implied yesterday that high gasoline prices would drive people to get EV’s and he seemed rather pleased with that thought.

Gasoline prices this high or higher won’t cause a massive switch to EV’s (for numerous reasons) but the higher prices will do great damage to the U.S. economy.

I don’t think Biden is interested in reducing gasoline prices. He pretends he is for political reasons but I think he likes the prices where they are.

Biden is a climate change fanatic and he is going to try to force these alarmist “solutions” on us. All he will succeed in doing is tanking the U.S. economy.

The only solution to inflation and the slowing economy is to do everything the U.S. can do to pump as much oil and gas as possible as soon as possible. This will bring prices down and some relief to the “little guy” and the U.S. economy. Remember: It is estimated that when the price of gasoline goes up $0.80 per gallon, the U.S. GDP goes down one percent, and when the price goes down by $0.80 per gallon, the U.S. GDP goes up one percent. The price of gasoline was around $1.84 per gallon during Trump’s term. The price is now $4.59 per gallon. You do the math.

Unfortunately, Biden is locked into his war on oil and gas and CO2 and an all-out effort to pump as much oil as possible is completely out of the question as far as he is concerned.

Biden is a dangerous fool. He is leading our nation down the Road to Ruin over this Climate Change Hoax (among other things). Let’s hope we can stop most of this stupidity after the next election. If we don’t take political power away from the Radical Democrats, we are sunk, and our freedoms go out the window. 1984 is just around the corner. Be careful who you vote for.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  Tom Abbott
May 23, 2022 2:03 pm

Biden is a dangerous fool. He is leading our nation down the Road to Ruin over this Climate Change Hoax (among other things). Let’s hope we can stop most of this stupidity after the next election. If we don’t take political power away from the Radical Democrats, we are sunk, and our freedoms go out the window. 1984 is just around the corner. Be careful who you vote for.”

Biden has HIS bank. Why would he care?

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Michael in Dublin
May 24, 2022 11:14 am

They are costly, but let’s not go too far and label them “premature,” which suggests they will be “needed” at any point in the future, or label them a “solution,” other than a “solution in search of a problem.”

Tom.1
May 22, 2022 3:35 pm

Although the main financial and technological obstacles have been removed,

LOL

Rhoda R.
Reply to  Tom.1
May 22, 2022 8:28 pm

Not so long as fossil fuels are used to generate the electricity that charges the batteries.

H.R.
Reply to  Rhoda R.
May 23, 2022 7:42 am

Yup, Rhoda. In my neck of the woods, EVs are powered mostly by coal and nuclear, with a bit of natural gas thrown in. We have some wind, but my State hasn’t gone into wind turbines that heavily… yet.

The greens and pinwheel sellers have been applying a lot of pressure to install more. So far, they have had limited success, and so far, my State hasn’t had to deal with rolling blackouts or brownouts.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Tom.1
May 23, 2022 3:31 am

Wishful thinking. There’s a lot of that on the alarmist side.

Rich Davis
May 22, 2022 3:42 pm

Just another imbecilic YouReekAlot! press release

Paul Blase
May 22, 2022 3:44 pm

“The research team found that more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers,“

The problem is that I can’t afford to buy a second car just for that last 10%. Also, of course, there are events like the Great I95 Clog Up of last year, which left EV drivers SOL.

BobM
Reply to  Paul Blase
May 22, 2022 5:32 pm

Exactly the point. We could use an EV for “around-town” driving, a second car, along with an ICE vehicle for everything else. But what happens when the ICE vehicle has a problem, or is in an accident and the EV now has to be the primary vehicle? It CAN’T BE THE PRIMARY VEHICLE for way too many. That’s the problem. An EV can’t backup an ICE vehicle.

End of story.

Rob_Dawg
May 22, 2022 3:46 pm

> The research team found that more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers, a modest range among the currently available batteries.

200km out and back?

“Range” isn’t just about distance but also time. The time to recharge is a factor.

Bryan A
Reply to  Rob_Dawg
May 22, 2022 5:02 pm

I may regularly drive 10 or 20 miles daily or 50 – 100 miles weekly but I often drive 300 – 600 miles. Limiting myself to 200 km or 124 mi before having to stop for hours to recharge at 120v is ludicrous
While the Tesla Quick Charger system is great, it sucks if your car isn’t a $100,000 Tesla. And while Tesla does have the $35,000 model 3, they don’t produce them and you can’t get the $45,000 model 3 for less than $50,000

Last edited 1 month ago by Bryan A
BobM
Reply to  Bryan A
May 22, 2022 5:40 pm

Even the millions of snowbirds know better. From NY and NJ and farther north in the East, and Michigan and Ohio in the Midwest, there’s no way they want to have to worry about range anxiety going from one home to another. Sure, there’s an EV niche marketplace, but it is a niche.

Last edited 1 month ago by BobM
MarkW
Reply to  Bryan A
May 22, 2022 6:31 pm

Quick charge is also murder on battery life.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  MarkW
May 24, 2022 11:28 am

And you can only do it a limited number of times before being forced into slower charging. Puts you right back in “eternity” spent “charging” as opposed to “driving.” I can fill my gas tank in 5 minutes every time as long as the car lasts.

2hotel9
May 22, 2022 4:27 pm

“cognitive bias” is leftarded stupid speak for “No real human being wants this shit.”. Want me to buy an electric vehicle? Simple! It will have a gasoline or LP gas engine running a generator to supply the electricity. Period. Full stop. And yes. I am the MFer who will make them eat shit and die. Try me.

Simon
Reply to  2hotel9
May 23, 2022 3:03 pm

You sound like a really tough scary guy. Had a chance to ride in a Ford Lightning yet? I see the reviews are pretty good. Maybe you should open that mind of yours before the tough talk. You know… be informed.

Steve
May 22, 2022 4:27 pm

The problem is travel during long weekend is problematic because not enough charging stations. Yes car might be good for 90 pct of situations, but the 10 pct of situations are very important.

Scissor
Reply to  Steve
May 22, 2022 5:39 pm

Yep. I went to Arapaho Basin to ski today and all of the charging stations (I’d guess about 10 as I just glanced) were occupied, mostly by Teslas. Mind you, these are next to a lodge so have the benefit of being a good parking spot. However, range is the number one concern, especially when one has to go over a 12,000 foot mountain pass.

Anyway, I drove my ICE, leaving this morning with a little over a half tank and returning home with a little under a quarter tank. No worries, I’ll fill up later this week.

RevJay4
May 22, 2022 4:39 pm

I’m quite sure the “researchers” (overpaid bought and paid for shills) at University of Geneva were congratulated for their efforts by some morons with a vested interest in the outcome of said study. Same as all the rest of the climate studies using info which left out the real world experiences which would be required by real folks with real jobs. The EV trucks wouldn’t cut it in the real world. Sorta like all the big pickups some folks are driving these days just cuz it makes ’em look cool, or something. Its an ego thing. Same with EV trucks and cars. Useless at most everything except sucking up resources and making somebody wealthier. And giving jobs to academics with useless degrees.

Steve McArthur
May 22, 2022 4:52 pm

I wonder if the same sort of rubbish research was undertaken in the 1920s & 30s during the transition from horsepower to Horsepower?

Davidf
Reply to  Steve McArthur
May 22, 2022 5:21 pm

No research back then, just sensible common folk being left alone to make individual choices in their best interest.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  Davidf
May 23, 2022 2:07 pm

Ah… where has it all gone?

Chris Hanley
Reply to  Steve McArthur
May 22, 2022 6:16 pm

Unnecessary of course.
Ford made his first self-propelled car in 1896, the second in 1898, the first T model in 1908 and by 1927 (19 years) had built 15 million units in a population of 120 million.
Tesla was founded in 2003 and by 2021 (18 years) had sold 2.3 million units, maybe 2 million in US in a population of 330 million (via Wiki).

Last edited 1 month ago by Chris Hanley
David S
May 22, 2022 5:14 pm

When I was in engineering school about 1/2 century ago one of the things we learned is that electric motors are well suited to powering cars. They have a high starting torque that reduces the need for a transmission. They’re more efficient than gas engines, they are far simpler, they can use regenerative breaking to greatly reduce the loss of kinetic energy during braking. The main problem was where do you get the electricity. At that time it was thought that fuel cells would be the answer. That hasn’t materialized yet but lithium batteries seems to filling that need.

I wonder if the roads could be electrified kind of like slot car tracks. So the car can be charging while driving, at least on main roads.

Anyway even if we aren’t concerned about global warming EVs could be a good idea.

Chris Hanley
Reply to  David S
May 22, 2022 6:01 pm

I wonder if the roads could be electrified kind of like slot car tracks …

The problem would remain in ‘Brandonland’, where do you get the electricity?

MarkW
Reply to  David S
May 22, 2022 6:38 pm

Electric motors are good at low speed, however their efficiency drops as they go faster.
Many EVs have a two speed transmission for this reason.

Charging cars from the road has many problems. The biggest being, having to shut the system down every time it rains. Beyond that, why should we drastically increase the cost of roadways, just to solve a problem that never needed solving?

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  MarkW
May 23, 2022 2:09 pm

Bingo!

John Dilks
Reply to  David S
May 22, 2022 10:48 pm

We aren’t concerned about global warming.

Rod Evans
Reply to  David S
May 23, 2022 12:36 am

“I wonder if the roads could be electrified kind of like slot car tracks. So the car can be charging while driving, at least on main roads”.

That is a well developed option already, David. We call them trams. Very popular in many large towns but completely absent from any rural communities.

MarkW
Reply to  David S
May 23, 2022 2:20 pm

While it may be true that an electric motor is more efficient than an IC engine, that’s only if you completely ignore the inefficiencies in getting the power to that motor.

When you compare total efficiency for well/mine to motor/engine, the ICE ends up winning the efficiency battle.

Tim Gorman
Reply to  MarkW
May 24, 2022 3:34 pm

good point!

Davidf
Reply to  David S
May 23, 2022 2:36 pm

My understanding is that electric cars efficiency is mostly in urban situations, short runs, stop start. The lack of emissions certainly helps from a pollution perspective – although modern ICEs are very good. In rural situations, the efficiency advantages largely disappear. The extra costs, material requirements, range concerns, recharging times, lack of recharging facilities etc remain.
EVs are fine to have in the mix, people free to choose. When they become a political tool forced upon people by Government intervention, they become an anathema.

niceguy
Reply to  David S
May 26, 2022 4:56 pm
LearDog
May 22, 2022 5:24 pm

The problem is revealed in the assertion that “…the main financial and technological obstacles have been removed”. For all factors. For all people. For all uses. Anywhere. And you’re an idiot to not see this.

randomengineer
May 22, 2022 5:30 pm

There’s about 1 million US citizens who live full time in an RV. No electric vehicle is going to be able to fit that use case, although one can envision some minor fraction of retirees towing an EV runabout behind their class A. No idea how one of these might get charged in the average KOA or independent campground though.

UNGN
May 22, 2022 5:48 pm

Guy brought his $130K Hummer to the car show last weekend. Super cool crabwalking around people in his 9,000lb toy. My current upscale neighborhood is 20% Teslas, but electric cars are still for the rich. I’ll tow my 8.000 lb trailer with my 22 year old 3/4 ton SUV and daily drive my 30 year old sports cars. When working, good condition electric cars are $12,000. I’m all in. Until then….

MarkW
May 22, 2022 6:12 pm

Although the main financial and technological obstacles have been removed

When exactly did that happen?

Rhoda R.
Reply to  MarkW
May 22, 2022 8:33 pm

They had a technological wet dream this morning?

ihfan
Reply to  MarkW
May 23, 2022 8:37 am

Yea. Loved that line, too. Last time I checked (a few minutes ago), electric vehicles were still outside of my price range. Perhaps for the elite the financial obstacles do not exist, and since they don’t tow or haul anything there are no technological obstacles.

MarkW
May 22, 2022 6:20 pm

When a leftist starts talking about how individuals are failing to do the “socially” optimal thing, get ready to start kissing goodbye to more of your freedoms.

Christopher Chantrill
May 22, 2022 6:38 pm

“electricifation of mobility.”

They sure can come up with the world salad.

Rod Evans
Reply to  Christopher Chantrill
May 23, 2022 12:25 am

Christopher, I think they are visualising a cattle prod……

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  Rod Evans
May 24, 2022 6:11 am

Funny I tend to dream about cattle prods every time a democrat pundit opens their mouth. 😊

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Christopher Chantrill
May 25, 2022 3:43 am

Given the range limitations and the increasingly less reliable electric grid due to adding worse-than-useless ‘renewables’ to the grid, that should read more like “the END of mobility.”

J.R.
May 22, 2022 7:39 pm

Just more elitist snobs complaining that the ignorant rubes won’t follow their directives.

Thousands of people live in apartments. Are apartment complex owners expected to install hundreds of charging stations in their parking lots? How will the local electricity grid support that? How high will rents have to be raised to cover the construction and maintenance of charging stations?

I envision private companies building multi-level charging garages.

H.R.
Reply to  J.R.
May 23, 2022 8:02 am

I envision property insurance companies saying, “We wish you luck” to those multi-level charging garages.

MarkW
Reply to  J.R.
May 23, 2022 8:34 am

Those multi-level charging garages are going to have to be within walking distance of your apartment.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  J.R.
May 25, 2022 3:45 am

Which the EVs then will be prohibited from parking in due to the fire ‘issue.’ D’oh!

Gary R Wescom
May 22, 2022 8:09 pm

The folks doing this study should have talked to the automobile companies and their sales people. Vehicles are bought based upon peak expected use, not some fictitious average.

MarkW
Reply to  Gary R Wescom
May 23, 2022 8:35 am

It’s the same kind of thinking being used when you hear them talking about how much energy wind and solar are able to generate in a given year.

Averages mean nothing if power, or your car, is not available when you need it.

Gunga Din
May 22, 2022 8:25 pm

“Now that the main financial and technological barriers have been removed (more affordable purchase prices, financial incentives, denser network of charging stations),..”

Having the taxpayers foot part of the bill (via subsidies for manufactures, tax credits for buyers, etc.) is NOT removing financial barriers.

Martin
May 22, 2022 8:37 pm

The paper must have been written strictly for a Swiss audience. Price and technological parity has not been achieved worldwide. Nor will it for a very long time…if ever.

DHR
May 22, 2022 9:05 pm

OK, so an electric car will fill 90% of an average person’s daily needs. That means to meet 100% of these needs, the average person will need a gas or diesel car as well. Two cars to do the job of one! A similar calculus attends electric power generation by windmills and solar panels. They can provide some fraction of our societies daily needs but for the remaining fraction, a “backup” generation system powered by something that is dispatchable such as gas, coal or nuclear power is also needed. And of course, that backup must be able to fill all the needs since at many times there is no wind or sun. Two power generating systems to do the job of one!

Someday, some person in power is going to have to bring some sense to these issues. That day seems not to be now.

JoHo
May 22, 2022 11:08 pm

Since the invasion of Ukraine do you think, as I do, that many people are waking up to the fact that some energy, food and materials may not be readily available? The question is, have politicians put one and one together and come up with the correct answer? Uhmmm, maybe not.
If China keeps on rattling its sabre and eventually conflicts with Taiwan ‘how available’ will the 90% of rare minerals they own or control be available to Western countries for EVs, Solar panels etc? They will have their boot firmly on the neck of our future technologies.
Aghh, but this will never happen..,,,,!!!!

Tom Abbott
Reply to  JoHo
May 23, 2022 3:45 am

Biden said “yes” earlier today when asked if the U.S. would defend Taiwan.

The White House gaff correction team is currently trying to walk this back a little.

I’m glad Biden said it. I don’t know why he said it, or whether he meant it. His brain doesn’t work properly in the best of times, since he is a radical leftist, and now that he is cognitively challenged, it’s hard to figure what the guy is thinking.

But the good thing is the Chicoms don’t know what to make of it, either. It’s good to keep the Chicoms guessing. It’s good to have the Chicoms think the U.S. might come to the aid of Taiwan if Taiwan is attacked.

The White House spin team shouldn’t walk that back too much.

starzmom
Reply to  Tom Abbott
May 23, 2022 7:37 am

On the other hand, what other answer is there on Taiwan? If Biden says no, we won’t defend them militarily, he may as well roll out the red carpet for them.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  JoHo
May 23, 2022 2:16 pm

Pretty much all of this has been outlined on Sundance’s, the Treehouse.

Rod Evans
May 23, 2022 12:10 am

Here is some “tailored” information that the authors at UNIGE might find helpful.

  1. Individual choice is always based on personal perceptions.
  2. Pushing only one side of story is called propaganda not tailored information.
  3. Battery powered vehicles are good at many things e.g. silent morning deliveries
  4. ICE vehicles are good at many things. e.g. work and adventure activities.
  5. Battery based motive power charge, is > 80% from fossil fuel burning generation.
  6. Virtue signalling green energy is a first world privileged activity.
  7. If ‘Green’ energy i.e. wind and solar was adequate for civilisation the industrial era would not have been required.
  8. More people live better quality lives today than have ever lived in past history thanks to the industrial era developments. The replacement of muscle power with mechanical fossil fuel powered machinery allowed electricity to develop.
  9. If you want to take a battery powered pick up into the wild country, make sure you have a 12kW generator and 10 gals of fuel in the back.
  10. The daily home delivery of milk via a battery powered milk float, may be closer than we think. As the grid supply of electricity becomes ever less reliable fridges could become just another .cupboard
Last edited 1 month ago by Rod Evans
BobM
Reply to  Rod Evans
May 23, 2022 8:01 am

“If you want to take a battery powered pick up into the wild country”, not just the “wild country”, either. Wait for Fall and the college football season. Thousands of pickups drive a couple of hundred miles each way for tailgating, sometimes for multiple days. And that would be for just two team’s fans converging on a college town for the weekend. When you see 50 or 90 thousand fans in the stadium, remember there are another similar amount in parking lots and fields still tailgating, often watching the game on TV.

I just don’t see many Lightnings making the 545 mile trip between Knoxville, TN and Gainesville, FL., for the Florida-Tennessee game, for one example..

Mike Edwards
May 23, 2022 12:56 am

the main financial and technological obstacles have been removed”

So let me check that out:

  • EVs are significantly more expensive than their ICE equivalents
  • EVs have limited ranges and charging arrangements make longer journeys tricky and slow at best

The cognitive bias here is with the researchers, not with vehicle purchasers.

Sure, most of us drive short distances for much of the time. But what happens when we need to drive long distances – to visit relatives, to go on vacation? Do they expect us to walk?

Even if charging points are available in the right places, EVs still make long journeys a real hassle. We only have one car in our family – and this car has to suit all our journeys, not just the short journeys. So EVs are not even on the agenda for us.

I think that hybrids look a good option – as long as the range on battery power is enough for the typical short journey. But even hybrids are more expensive than pure ICE models.

“Cognitive bias” – yeah, us consumers are real idiots when it comes to knowing which products really suit our needs and our budgets.

Vincent
Reply to  Mike Edwards
May 23, 2022 7:43 am

Sure, most of us drive short distances for much of the time. But what happens when we need to drive long distances – to visit relatives, to go on vacation? Do they expect us to walk?
Even if charging points are available in the right places, EVs still make long journeys a real hassle. We only have one car in our family – and this car has to suit all our journeys, not just the short journeys. So EVs are not even on the agenda for us.
———————————————————————–

If a currently available EV is not suitable for your circumstances and requirements, then you obviously shouldn’t buy one. However, I would expect, as the technology and manufacturing processes progress, the price of EVs will fall and newer types of batteries will be developed which are safer (no explosions) have shorter charging times and provide much longer ranges on a full charge.

If you’re driving a long distance and you’re worried about being stranded with a flat battery, then use your nous and do a bit of planning. Search the internet for locations on your journey which have a charging station.

As EVs increase in number, the number of charging stations will also increase. For example, restaurants will probably have large parking areas with chargers for their customers, so you can recharge your EV whilst having lunch. If you’re on holiday, the motel or hotel will have charging stations. Also, your EV will have a meter that shows you continually, at the current rate of usage, how many miles or kilometres you can drive before the battery becomes flat.

What’s the problem??

Slowroll
Reply to  Vincent
May 23, 2022 9:35 am

Who is going to pay for all these chargers, and where is the electricity going to come from? You do realize that fast chargers require significantly more current than the average building can supply, especially if many of them are installed? Yep, a hotel on a mountain will easily be able to get a gigawatt of 440 volt service.

Sturmudgeon
Reply to  Vincent
May 23, 2022 2:25 pm

Yep… those batteries are sure being ‘developed’… taking a darned long time, though. Electric vehicles will NEVER replace gasoline/diesel vehicles, UNLESS this current insanity against low-cost, efficient, readily available (fossil ?) fuels, continues to clog the brains of politicians and ne’er-do-wells.

MarkW
Reply to  Vincent
May 23, 2022 2:27 pm

Every time I need to make a trip outside my neighborhood, I need to research where all the charging stations are first, and be prepared to wait several hours while everyone else who is taking trips outside their neighborhood also recharges their cars?

If the government wasn’t hell bent on forcing everyone into EV’s whether they want to or not, I would have a lot more respect for your opinion.

niceguy
Reply to  MarkW
May 26, 2022 5:17 pm

Even in Paris almost all stations I see are basic European home current type: mono 230 V, for 7 kW max. The new “Belib” triple “bornes” offer 22 kW (tri-phase I think, they say also DC is available…) but I see very very few.

I saw real fast charge slots (those with high power DC) only the Seine river – probably for tourists.

And Paris isn’t power starved! It’s a power hub.

So if it isn’t done here, how could it be done in remote areas like in highway stations?

Tim Gorman
Reply to  Vincent
May 23, 2022 4:54 pm

However, I would expect, as the technology and manufacturing processes progress, the price of EVs will fall and newer types of batteries will be developed which are safer (no explosions) have shorter charging times and provide much longer ranges on a full charge.”

Why would you expect any of this? Do you know of any advances that are even on the drawing boards or is this just blind faith?

“Search the internet for locations on your journey which have a charging station.”

And when this station is out-of-service and is the only one around for miles?

” For example, restaurants will probably have large parking areas with chargers for their customers, so you can recharge your EV whilst having lunch.”

You don’t live in fly-over country do you? Places like western KS and NE, or rural Montana?

Vincent
Reply to  Tim Gorman
May 23, 2022 7:38 pm

Cor Blimey! Are you not aware of the major advances in technology since the industrial revolution. There are so many examples of useful products that were very expensive initially, but gradually became more affordable, together with increasing performance, as the technology and manufacturing processes progressed.

Just a couple of examples are the digital camera and the large screen HD television. Why would any reasonable person think the EV will be an exception to such progress?

It’s true I don’t live in a ‘fly-over’ part of Australia. I live in the outer suburbs of a city. I currently drive a Kia Cerato ICE vehicle with a range of around 630 km on a full tank, which is a range very similar to the range of the latest Tesla EVs. The main reason I’m not currently interested in buying an EV is the ridiculously high price, just as I’m not currently interested in buying an 83 inch OLED 4k TV set for A$13,000.

I don’t know why people seem to think there should be one product that suits all circumstances. If you are a wealthy and egotistical person who likes to show off, you’ll probably buy a Rolls-Royce or Ferrari. If you are a practical, pragmatic, sensible and rational sort of person with only a modest income, then you will investigate the pros and cons of various types of vehicles and choose the one which best suits your circumstances.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  Vincent
May 24, 2022 3:14 pm

I wouldn’t be so sure Vincent. So far they have been developing EV’s in the US since 1890 and they are still not ready for prime time. Look up Baker electric vehicles. They were very popular with women clean and quiet. Sales of the approx. $8000 cars dropped after 1917 when Henry Ford developed an electric starter for the Model T which sold for about $450. Woman didn’t like hand cranking engines but they did like saving money. There are no great leaps in battery power density on the horizon, but there is a steady stream of fever dreams from the EV cultists.
For a fairly comical aside, in 2014 an Tesla model S was almost beaten in a 765 mile race by a 1915 model T
Link
https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a15112705/2013-tesla-model-s-vs-1915-ford-model-t-race-of-the-centuries-feature/

Last edited 1 month ago by Matthew Bergin
Tim Gorman
Reply to  Vincent
May 24, 2022 3:17 pm

Are you not aware of the major advances in technology since the industrial revolution.”

Those are PAST innovations. Where are the FUTURE innovations? I can’t find any that are beyond the “might work” phase of research!

“I’m not currently interested in buying an EV is the ridiculously high price,”

And yet you still think the price will come down? How? The components used in the batteries will only go up as demand increases. Meaning the price of an EV will go up, not down.



Vincent
Reply to  Tim Gorman
May 24, 2022 6:49 pm

“Those are PAST innovations. Where are the FUTURE innovations? I can’t find any that are beyond the “might work” phase of research!”
————————————————————————————–
Where are the future innovations?? What a silly question. All future innovations are in the future, which does not yet exist. Didn’t you know that?

Tim Gorman
Reply to  Vincent
May 25, 2022 10:49 am

If they don’t exist then why the assumption that they will? An equal assumption would be that they won’t. Then you make your judgements on what path to take based on that!

Mike Edwards
Reply to  Vincent
May 24, 2022 2:00 pm

What’s the problem??”

The problem is that you are in dreamland and you are not dealing with the realities of EVs today.

“use your nous and do a bit of planning”

Yes, I do use my nous – and that means that I don’t own an EV, but instead I have a vehicle that will take me everywhere I want to go, with zero hassle. That’s called planning.

Vincent
Reply to  Mike Edwards
May 24, 2022 7:08 pm

Of course I’m dealing with the realities of EVs. For most people, including me, they are currently too expensive. For some people, including you, they do not yet have a sufficient range on a full charge and there is not a sufficient number of available sharging stations in your area, and the charging time is currently inconveniently long.

These are all valid reasons for not buying an EV, but all these issues are being addressed. I think it’s very foolish to assume that no further progress can be achieved.

Mike Edwards
Reply to  Vincent
May 24, 2022 11:55 pm

“it’s very foolish to assume that no further progress can be achieved”

Where did I assume that no progress could be achieved? If the glaring problems can be addressed, then I would certainly consider an EV. But neither do I assume that the problems will be addressed.

What really annoys me is that the UK government is aiming to force us all to buy EVs, whether or not the problems have been addressed. They are even going to ban hybrids, which seem the best option to me. Total stupidity.

Slowroll
Reply to  Mike Edwards
May 23, 2022 9:30 am

As usual, it is the researchers who are the idiots. Suffering from the Dunning -Kreuger syndrome–which says stupid people don’t know how stupid they are, and assume everyone else is even more stupid. A bunch of arogant, supercilious elitist idiots.

Ted
May 23, 2022 4:06 am

‘Why aren’t people buying cars that cover 90% of their daily needs in favor of ones that cover 100% of their needs and cost less? It must be that they’re ignorant.’

And they got paid (Swiss) tax money to push this idiocy.

Stephen Rowland
May 23, 2022 4:27 am

In cold climates, heat is an issue also. Nothing drains a battery faster than -20 temperatures.

Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
May 23, 2022 5:46 am

Global Warming angst is a first world problem; EVs are a first world solution. Actually they are a 1% of the first world solution.

jeffery p
May 23, 2022 5:48 am

These people are completely convinced that getting their agenda accepted is just a matter of messaging. Frame it correctly, and everyone will fall into line. Anything that questions that messaging is, of course, disinformation.

Tim Gorman
May 23, 2022 6:06 am

They found that car owners systematically underestimate the capacity of electric driving ranges to meet their daily needs. “

Daily needs? What about non-daily needs? Like most people I do on occasion take long trips. What am I supposed to do to meet that need?

Now that the main financial and technological barriers have been removed (more affordable purchase prices, financial incentives, denser network of charging stations), “

What financial barrier has been removed for the poor/ middle class and those on fixed incomes?

Where has the “denser network of charging stations been installed? There are none near me! The closest one is seven miles away and it is one at a gasoline station that must be shared with the public.

“We observed that the participants systematically underestimated the compatibility of electric battery capacities available on the current market with their real needs,””

Who defined “real needs”? Are we to become nothing more than automatons? Drive to and from work and the rest of the time sit in front of the TV listening to the propaganda of the elites who are exempt from the rules the rest of us have to follow?

“The research team found that more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers, a modest range among the currently available batteries.”

How are we to handle the other 10% of car trips? Just not make them? Abandon the rest of our lives?

What a freakin’ joke this is!

J.R.
Reply to  Tim Gorman
May 23, 2022 9:58 pm

For the remaining 10% we will have to rent internal combustion automobiles. Perhaps the green overlords will allow them to exist in order to attain the Great Electrification.

Editor
May 23, 2022 8:03 am

Are there really this many INSANE people working on government policy?

Fact: There are about 1.446 billion cars worldwide today.

Quote: “In 2020, they (electric and hybrid vehicles) represented only 1% of the global vehicle fleet, including hybrid vehicles.”

Quote: “To meet the 2030 climate targets, this proportion needs to reach at least 12%..”

The Math: 14.46 million electric vehicles on the road today. Needed: 175 million electric vehicles in 7.5 years, So we must launch over 23 million new electric vehicles per year to meet the “target”.

The worldwide production of automobiles is about 100 million a year. Only about 3% of those are electric today.

There is already shortage of critical materials for that 3%.

The electric/fossil fuel gap is and will increase, not decline…..

FACT: Such a rapid transition is impossible.

Olen
May 23, 2022 8:21 am

There is no error in thinking about buying an electric car. It is a matter of getting what you want for the money you can afford to spend. Even in daily use not many want to wait hours for the battery to charge when 5 minutes at a gas pump will get more miles. There is also the insurance for the car and house that will go up with the chance of a fire. And batteries lose more power as they age compared to the gasoline engine.

My insurance just went up on my house because of the price to replace it. The price to replace it went up because of government restrictions on fuel to force us into green energy. Anyone thinking I wont notice that at the ballot box is nuts.

Joao Martins
May 23, 2022 8:46 am

Yes, I shall NOT have ane EV.

Because…

… because I am biased.

Yes, I am biased:

I am completely one-sided: I refuse to abandon the scientific method and reasoning.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  Joao Martins
May 25, 2022 4:20 am

I seem to suffer from the same bias. I might buy a EV if I take up golf as a past time, 🙄

mkelly
May 23, 2022 8:54 am

Duane if I want to start a snow plowing business here in the UP of Michigan would you advice me to buy an EV or ICE truck. When it’s -10 F, snowing, and dark so I need heater, wipers and lights how many driveways will I complete with EV?

Slowroll
Reply to  mkelly
May 23, 2022 9:37 am

Maybe your own…

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Slowroll
May 25, 2022 3:58 am

Maybe. LOL

Burgher King
May 23, 2022 9:08 am

Joe Biden: “When it comes to the gas prices, we’re going through an incredible transition that is taking place that God willing when it’s over we’ll be stronger and the world will be stronger and less reliant on fossil fuels.”

He said this in Japan today, confirming that fast rising fuel prices are a deliberate feature of his energy policy.

David Anderson
May 23, 2022 9:20 am

250 kilometers, the ideal range

Why would, say, 500 kilometers be less than ideal? Seems the “ideal” range is infinity.

Bruce Cobb
May 23, 2022 9:25 am

What we have here is failure to communicate.
EVs good, ICEs bad.
EVs good, ICEs bad.
One and one is three…

Gunga Din
May 23, 2022 9:28 am

Sounds like “Cognitive Bias” is a new name for “Common Sense”.

Robert of Texas
May 23, 2022 10:14 am

more than 90% of car trips could be completed with vehicles with a driving range of 200 kilometers,”

So what do I do with the other 10% of the trips I need or want to take? With the air-conditioner running, and 1/2 a ton of cargo on board? Where do I plug in when I need to charge? (Few charge stations and even fewer that work). When I take a 1,400 mile trip, do I stop every 100 miles for a few hours to recharge?

Gunga Din
Reply to  Robert of Texas
May 23, 2022 10:36 am

For a trip over 100 miles, go by covered wagon.

MarkW
Reply to  Gunga Din
May 23, 2022 2:30 pm

You’ll have to pull it yourself, thanks to PETA, animals can no longer be used to haul heavy loads.

J.R.
Reply to  Robert of Texas
May 23, 2022 10:12 pm

Can a solar panel be installed on the roof?

Boff Doff
May 23, 2022 11:43 am

Until it’s possible to drive into the service station and swap out the batteries in 5 minutes EV’s are an expensive virtue signalling toy for brainless Libturds who have way too much money and no sense.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Boff Doff
May 25, 2022 4:03 am

And since battery pack location, size, etc. will never be standardized, you can dismiss that notion as totally impractical. Us, just think of the conflagration you’ll get going in one of those battery ‘stockpiles’ with just one short in one battery pack!

shoehorn
May 23, 2022 12:33 pm

Increased atmospheric GHGs are “one of the main causes of global warming”. What are the other main causes of global warming, we never seem to hear about them?

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  shoehorn
May 25, 2022 4:04 am

Objection! “Facts” not in evidence!

AFP
May 23, 2022 1:04 pm

I will gladly by an EV when I can change the battery like I can with my drill!

Kpar
May 23, 2022 2:39 pm

In other words, consumers wrongly believe that the autonomy of current batteries is not sufficient to cover their daily journeys.”

OooohKaaaaay, I suspect that part is true, but what about the non-daily journeys that most of us use our vehicles for?

And left out of this is that the USA, like many nations around the world, is beginning to suffer electricity shortages. Seems to me that adding a WHOLE LOT OF DEMAND, while switching over to unreliable (and expensive) renewables is a recipe for disaster.

And don’t forget the transmission lines that are already only marginally adequate.

Tom
May 23, 2022 3:35 pm

90%<100%

Like saying why do kids happen if the contraceptive is 90% effective. People want to be able to take care of their needs 100% not 90% of the time.

EV also has battery replacement cost problem, fire problem, and lack of electricity problem. (ie. Brown outs and black outs as happening more and more.)

Bob
May 23, 2022 4:46 pm

“However, many studies show that individuals do not automatically adopt the behaviors most beneficial for themselves or society, often due to a lack of access to complete information”, explains Mario Herberz, first author of the study and researcher at the Consumer Decision and Sustainable Behavior Laboratory of the Department of Psychology at the Faculty of Psychology and Educational Sciences of the UNIGE.”

You don’t have to read any farther than this to understand this study nothing but BS. Lies and cheating that is all they know.

May 24, 2022 1:48 am

I rather like sleeping at night without the thought of an electric vehicle fire outside.

Paul Hurley (aka PaulH)
May 24, 2022 12:02 pm

From a recent article at Autoevolution:

EVs No Longer an Economic Alternative to ICEs As Supercharging Rates Go Through the Roof

Apart from becoming more expensive, the EVs have also lost their cheap operating costs appeal. Electricity prices have spiked and Supercharging costs often shocked Tesla owners.

and…

In countries where the charging rates are per minute, a full battery charge became closer in price to a tank of gas.

Tee Shanny
May 24, 2022 12:05 pm

[snip]

2) Moderators, step up: REFUSE to publish ignorant, fact-free rants, whether articles or comments.

[your wish is my command-mod]

Last edited 1 month ago by Charles Rotter
David Long
Reply to  Tee Shanny
May 24, 2022 1:06 pm

Synopsis: Another vote for censorship

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  David Long
May 25, 2022 4:07 am

Not to mention another vote for the enforcement of “right think.”

Mike Edwards
Reply to  Tee Shanny
May 24, 2022 2:11 pm

STOP all ignorant, hide bound rants”

You mean all those like the one you just posted?

You can always practice some self-censorship – that’s free and instantly available to you.

Brazos Valley Chuck
Reply to  Tee Shanny
May 24, 2022 2:30 pm

Plenty of facts posted here. You just didn’t like em so you resort to calling everyone shills or idiots. You’re the loser here, I think. Why do you even come here? What are you trying to accomplish?

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Tee Shanny
May 25, 2022 4:09 am

Funny, you seem to paint an apt self-portrait. Projection personified.

David Long
May 24, 2022 1:44 pm

I’m not the least bit concerned about my daily driving needs. There’s no question an EV could handle that.
The driving need I plan for is the uncommon but inevitable one when a hurricane is bearing down on the Gulf Coast and evacuation is necessary. Imagine the outcome in a population dependent on EV’s: everyone has to charge up within the space of a few days, then everyone has to travel inland and deplete their charge at the same time. Some will run out of juice and clog the roads. Then the power outages will hit while everyone needs to recharge again. And again the roads will be clogged with cars that run out of charge.
As with our other fine new ‘climate saving’ technologies, EV’s work reasonably well under routine conditions, and have the ability to make extreme conditions worse. Lack of resilience is part of their basic physics. I will never buy one.

Tim Gorman
Reply to  David Long
May 24, 2022 5:07 pm

This is why the future should be hybrids, not EV’s. You have options!

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