Time Magazine: The EU Could Force the USA to Act on Climate Change

EU Flag Minus Britain

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

Green fantasies from Time’s Justin Worland.

How Europe’s Border Carbon Tax Plan Could Force the U.S. To Act on Climate Change


On Wednesday, European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen presented the European Climate Law, which would bind the bloc to eliminate its climate footprint by 2050 and officially launched the policymaking process to enact a new tax on products from countries that aren’t working to reduce their emissions. Such a rule could leave U.S. companies at a serious—and costly—disadvantage as they compete for business in the EU.

The EU’s plan is a significant escalation, but it’s not a complete surprise. The intellectual foundations behind policy, which the EU has dubbed a border carbon tax, have been discussed in policy circles for years. As the EU has doubled down on policies to reduce emissions, and the U.S. and others have lagged, pressure mounted on the bloc to take more sweeping action. “It’s pointless to reduce carbon emissions inside Europe, to then import them from outside,” Bruno Le Maire, the French finance minister, told reporters at the World Economic Forum meeting in Davos in January.

Several groups in Washington are pushing for the U.S. to get ahead of the Europeans’ plan by implementing its own carbon tax, along with an adjustment at borders. Such a move would make U.S. businesses more competitive on the global stage as countries increasingly demand more energy-efficient products, advocates say. Supporters of such an approach include a conservative group, the Climate Leadership Council (CLC), which is backed by some of America’s biggest companies, green groups, economists and Republican elder statesmen. “This really creates an incentive for other countries to say, ‘yeah, I want to get inside that club,’” says former Federal Reserve Chair Janet Yellen, who supports the CLC.

Read more: https://time.com/5793918/european-union-border-carbon-tax/

The problem with Justin’s theory is the EU has no backbone when it comes to trade disputes. When President Obama rejected the EU’s last attempt to impose carbon taxes on US businesses, The EU’s response was to express their disappointment.

Brexit has left the EU desperately short of cash, but I doubt President Trump will let the EU fill their budget shortfall by slamming US businesses with a new carbon tax.

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March 5, 2020 2:05 pm

Will the EU continue to buy goods from China and India?

John McClure
Reply to  OldGreyGuy
March 5, 2020 2:44 pm

….and gas from Russia.

The actual issue, does the USA need any products from the EU?

I can live without all but olives.

Donald Boughton
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 3:21 pm

Surely with range of climates available in the USA some where could be found to grow olives.

Reginald Reynolds
Reply to  Donald Boughton
March 5, 2020 4:53 pm

The grow olives in California over an area of more than 6 million acres.

Bryan A
Reply to  Reginald Reynolds
March 5, 2020 5:30 pm

But the USA IS acting on Climate Change, We promise to do Everything China is doing.

Ron Long
Reply to  Reginald Reynolds
March 5, 2020 5:53 pm

Yes, that’s the problem, Reginald, Bryan, and goldminor, Kalifornia is part of the EU. Stupid, dysfunctional, and proud of it. Anthony and Willis together can’t straighten them out.

Reply to  Reginald Reynolds
March 6, 2020 12:26 am

EU can’t even enforce it’s own borders.

Reply to  Reginald Reynolds
March 6, 2020 7:53 am

I’ve heard (from native Italians) that the olive groves in Kali are torn down and replaced every 15 years or so. The trees never get too mature, but they bear more fruit. The oil is different and IMHO not as good as the better European ones.

Reply to  Reginald Reynolds
March 9, 2020 1:22 am

Ron Long

As a citizen in EU I can tell you that you are absolutely 100% right. I´m not proud of it but maybe I´m the only one. And I live in the happiest country in EU, where is the purest air on this planet.

Reply to  Donald Boughton
March 5, 2020 5:13 pm

They grow olives up here in the foothills of Northern California.

Reply to  goldminor
March 5, 2020 6:58 pm

Most olives in France come from Spain or Italy, or even further afield. An olive firm near here produced “french” olive preparations. I looked at their container labels one : they came for Egypt !

The final product if “french” because it is prepared here. The law just requires the final step in production to be done locally. Plenty of legal cons like that. Shoes made in Asia and they punch the lace holes in EU to make them legally “EU produce”.

BMW engines are made in China ! Look it up.

Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 3:28 pm

In my case without all but Bordeaux Red wines.
I guess I will just have to dig further into my cellar.

Reply to  Herbert
March 5, 2020 4:19 pm

Australia makes red wines that rival anything you can get from France. 😀

The reason the international court banned countries from using France place names for their wines was Australia was winning gold medals against French wines IN FRANCE!

Trade up and buy Aussie!

Reply to  MarkMcD
March 5, 2020 6:25 pm

” … Australia makes red wines that rival anything you can get from France. … ”

In my experience equivalently priced European wines are almost always superior to Australian wines, but even the best reds and whites taste like cheap plonk compared to a half decent chilled* rosé — which is a much more enjoyable wine and very under rated.

* Snobby euro culture of not chilling a wine even when in the tropics is nuts, it’s often 20 C hotter than central Europe here so you do not drink a good wine at room temperature because our room temperatures can make a good wine taste like goon-bag plonk.

Reply to  MarkMcD
March 5, 2020 6:41 pm

The other reason is because it’s called fraud.

Bordeaux is not the best wine region in France, though for some reason it seems to be one of the names that sticks in English speaking minds.

I avoid buying Bordeaux now since it is all traded, mixed and blended with other stuff. It is very hard to find a wine that is produced and bottled by the vineyard that grew the fruit these days.

Many better regions in France.

Patrick MJD
Reply to  MarkMcD
March 5, 2020 6:43 pm

“MarkMcD March 5, 2020 at 4:19 pm

Australia makes red wines that rival anything you can get from France. ”

Absolutely correct. Some vines are over 200 years old. Aus for reds, NZ for whites IMO.

Reply to  MarkMcD
March 6, 2020 3:04 pm

I’m no wine drinker myself, enough of them give me a headache after just a few sips that I just say “NO” to wine. But I’ve been told that Oregon wines compete quite well on the international stage. Personally I’ll stick to our excellent craft brews instead.

Reply to  Herbert
March 5, 2020 6:31 pm

Herbert, did you know that AOC ( provenance ) rules for the Bordeaux appelation only require a minimum of 30% of Bordeaux grapes. Most of the grapes in Bordeaux wines are shipped up as juice in tankers from other regions , typical southern France, Aude. 😉

Reply to  Greg
March 5, 2020 9:17 pm

There are 60 AOCs in Bordeaux.
There are 9 million bottles of Bordeaux produced annually, at thousands of vineyards.
Any table wine of rough, vapid nature (like Australia’s famous ‘Kangarouge’ from the 1960s) gets qualified as red Bordeaux, “Grand vin de Bordeaux”.
But they are not putting only 30% of Bordeaux grapes into Chateau Latour or First through Fifth Growths.
Now let’s look at the good stuff, the legendary chateaus of the Left Bank and Right Bank.
Bordeaux is unquestionably the largest and most important fine wine region of the world.
Ask the Chinese who are trying to buy into the great vineyards, but are being largely rebuffed.
France is the cradle of fine wine and virtually every major grape variety and style of wine can be traced back to France.
In Bordeaux it is Cabernet Sauvignon and Merlot.
If you want to believe that New World Wines from California and Australia are better than Bordeaux (or Burgundy) I can’t stop you but it isn’t true in the upper realms of wines.
For centuries Bordeaux has dominated the market with a long proven record of ageing in the bottle that nowhere else can match.
That does not mean that Penfolds Bin 60A or Bin 707 or Napa’s Chateau Montelena can’t top Chateau Lafitte or Margaux in a particular vintage,(see the Judgement of Paris 1976 as featured in the movie ‘Bottle Shock’) but across the board in the top stuff, it’s no contest, as a check on the prices of the most expensive Australian reds versus the top Bordeaux reds at wine-searcher.com readily reveals.
Having said all that, the average Australian red wine is of better quality than the average French red wine.
There is a reason why Jacob’s Creek Shiraz became the top selling red wine in Britain but that is another story.

Reply to  Greg
March 6, 2020 5:08 am

“Herbert March 5, 2020 at 9:17 pm

Agreed, Herbert.
I would add the caveat that today’s world of inexpensive wines are far superior to the average inexpensive wines prior to the 1980s. Especially the inexpensive french wines prior to the 1980s; which most were at the time.

Spain and Italy scuppered their wine reputations of the 20th Century by dubious additions; not by inferior flavor/taste. I still shy away from Spanish and Italian wines; but entirely from what is now ancient history, now their wines of today.

Chile, Australia, New Zealand; heck, even Oregon, Washington, New York and Virginia wines are at least decent.
I’ve loved some of Oregon’s Pinot Noir and Australia’s Shiraz; both of which age superbly; over a few years if not for decades.
I’d love to try some Shiraz aged over decades. Apologies, my bottles keep getting opened well before a decade.

Try it some time! Put away decent red wines and try them at least several years later.

Will they measure up to a Grand Cru?
I don’t know and I am unlikely to ever get the chance to taste well aged Grand Cru or well aged red wines from elsewhere.

Back in the late 1970s, my Brother joined America’s submarine service, serving on one of America’s snoopers.
What I did not know is that before he reported for duty, he had stored a box of cheap wines. Cheap wines being all that he could afford at the time.

Six years later, shortly after his discharge, I got a call from my sister. That’s when I learned he stored wines at her house.
Anyway, my sister wanted to know what to do with a passed-out drunk ex-sailor?

I told her to drag him into the bathroom, preferably the shower.
After a little more haranguing from my sister, I agreed to come over and check on him.
Which ended up as my agreeing to remove my noxious drunk Brother and taking him and his evil box of wine home with me.

Except, for a couple of the cheapest wines, i.e. Boone’s Farm, all of the wines had improved considerably. I helped drink some of his wines after he recovered from his hangover.
He claimed that the wines were so much better that he couldn’t resist opening and trying another bottle.

Reply to  Greg
March 6, 2020 8:30 am


I still shy away from Spanish and Italian wines; but entirely from what is now ancient history, now their wines of today.

I spent the entire month of October 2019 in Northern Italy and visited some very interesting vineyards. One of these was the Giuseppe Quintarelli winery in Valpolicella (Verona). Quintarelli is known as the God of Italian wine, he revitalized the industry in the late 80’s. He idea was to produce a wine which was drinkable right out of the bottle because it was barrel aged for several years prior to bottling. His wines will also age for another 20 or 30 years in the bottle. Definitely worth visiting for a taste, an education into the production process and also meeting the family, wonderful caring people.

One the few places which I do avoid is anything from Argentina. Too acidic…

Robert W Turner
Reply to  Herbert
March 6, 2020 8:48 am

Well it’s a good thing that France produces over priced and overrated red wines. If only there were places to get superior reds for a cheaper price, like Oregon, Chile, Texas, etc. Now wines from northern Italia, Porto, and Espana, those wines are a bargaining chip.

But the EU might not want to push it on tariffs when it comes to trade with the USA on anything, but especially on wines since the wine industry from the new world, Australia, and China is rapidly growing. A tariff on overrated wines could push even more of the market share to these regions.

Robert Terrell
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 3:36 pm

The USA is NOT any part of the EU! Therefore, they can’t “FORCE’ us to do anything! That’s just wishful thinking!

Reply to  Robert Terrell
March 5, 2020 6:51 pm

Agreed, this move is totally delusional. The EU is the only part of the world intent on economic self immolation based on solving a problem which does not even exist.

There is zero chance they will be able to con, trick or harass other major blocks into going along the same stupid path.

Such a move would make U.S. businesses more competitive on the global stage as …

Yeah , increasing your prices with pointless taxes always makes you “more competitive”, that works !

Bryan A
Reply to  Greg
March 6, 2020 10:02 am

What exactly does the EU produce WHICH the USA purchases from them that can’t be produced locally and create needed Jobs in the US?

Even snooty hypocrites and eco-fascists are produces locally

Adam Gallon
Reply to  Robert Terrell
March 5, 2020 11:16 pm

They can “force” you. Which is why only US meat that complies with EU regulations, can be imported into the EU.
Your farmers want to access the EU market, they’re “forced” to comply with EU regulations.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Adam Gallon
March 6, 2020 5:03 am

I think Trump and the EU are getting ready to enter into trade negotiations soon. I imagine the EU’s ridiculous carbon dioxide tax will be one of the issues discussed.

And, no doubt, EU tariffs will be in the discussion. Trump ideally wants no tariffs between nations, so that’s where he will be coming from.

The US currently has the advantage since its economy is booming and will continue to do so because energy prices are low and will continue to be low and that is a perfect environment for some business who wants to do business with the United States but is prevented from doing so by local tariff restrictions. The businessperson’s solution: Move part or all of your business to the United States as long as the tariffs are on.

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  Robert Terrell
March 6, 2020 3:29 am

Brexit has left the EU desperately short of cash, but I doubt President Trump will let the EU fill their budget shortfall by slamming US businesses with a new carbon tax.

Similar extorsion “laws” that didn’t work, ….. that were enacted by towns and counties in the late 1800’s that attempted to collect a “head tax’ on the beef cattle herds that were being driven north from Texas to the railheads in Kansas.

The Trail Boss would just stampede the herd right thru the middle of the town.

John McClure
Reply to  Robert Terrell
March 6, 2020 8:50 am

You are paying attention to this nonsense.

Globalism is dead under the Trump administration.

Thank heavens!

So, olives were top of mind (wife and I have been enjoying Greek recipes recently), yet German jet engines as well as other amazing EU components are part of the mix – conversation.

Morons from Ivylag schools caused the “Rust Belt”. Yet, we don’t build complexes in 14 days.

Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 3:37 pm

Argentina has over 20 million olive trees…you’re safe John

Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 4:18 pm

California grows wonderful olives.

Mike McMillan
Reply to  greengene
March 6, 2020 1:07 am

The green variety or the black variety?

Reply to  greengene
March 6, 2020 1:12 am

Californian olives are bland and flavourless compared with Greek Kalamata olives.

Reply to  Graemethecat
March 6, 2020 2:03 am

Who eats olives? They suck, no matter where they come from
And most people do not like wine, no matter which vineyard produces it.

Reply to  Graemethecat
March 6, 2020 3:54 am

its how theyre processed black olives are often treated with iron to make them black apparently
you know, the tatseless dry round things on pizzas and superdark in bottles n canned
you could DIY you know its not hard , any ripened olive will process well as “kalamata”style
it might take a few hr sitting round to slash and then a week or so changing brine but you get a huge amount of olives as a result to enjoy all yr.

Mike McMillan
Reply to  Graemethecat
March 6, 2020 6:37 am

So you’re saying that black olives matter?

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  Graemethecat
March 6, 2020 12:07 pm

Mike McMillan wins the “Best post of the week” prize. 😊

Reply to  Graemethecat
March 6, 2020 1:24 pm

Try the italian ‘taggiasca’ olives from northern Italy – they’re the best

Craig from Oz
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 4:37 pm

My take from reading the extracts is that the EU intend to add ‘tax’ (for want of a better word) on any US party importing goods into and/or bidding for contracts within the EU.

Exactly how that is going to work in real terms I have no idea. Considering this is Time Magazine the answer may involve either unicorns or Greta.

Reply to  Craig from Oz
March 5, 2020 4:44 pm

You should embrace the healing power of “riding”.

Reply to  Craig from Oz
March 5, 2020 5:34 pm

Counter taxes. Ie, tariffs.

Reply to  Craig from Oz
March 5, 2020 8:18 pm

It’s a tariff and we will respond with some reciprocal tariff that is so painful they water it down and it goes away quietly.

It’s just a stupid political game and the 5th graders writing for Time are just embarrassing themselves.

Reply to  Craig from Oz
March 6, 2020 5:22 am

It won’t work they will start a tit for tat trade war they already got hurt in the US/China trade war and had to grovel to trump to exempt them from some tarrif he imposed.

It is a story pedelled by some 3rd rate hack journalist showing how stupid they really are.

Hot under the collar
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 5:50 pm

Let’s see what happens when they start taxing the gas and oil they’re importing from Russia

Patrick MJD
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 6:42 pm

NZ exports olive oil and it is some of the best, not cheap though.

Dennis G. Sandberg
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 7:35 pm

San Luis Obispo County California, including my backyard has lots of olives. If EU doesn’t give up on wind and solar pretty soon they won’t have the money to buy anything from anybody.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Dennis G. Sandberg
March 6, 2020 5:08 am

” If EU doesn’t give up on wind and solar pretty soon they won’t have the money to buy anything from anybody.”

Isn’t that the truth!!!

David Stone
Reply to  John McClure
March 5, 2020 8:10 pm

Super effort that John – they’ve all gone off on an olive tangent. As good a tangent as any.
America doesn’t need the UN the EU, NATO or any other acronyms. All those crony committees are as useless, expensive and wasteful as an Elvis entourage. They’ll drag you down, wear you out and then wash their hands of you when you’re broke.

Reply to  John McClure
March 6, 2020 3:46 am

Australia does good olives and oil Im sure we can work it out and manage to stick it right up the EU
and doesnt america have olive groves? if not, now the time to get some planted

Reply to  John McClure
March 6, 2020 9:07 am

John McClure:
I can live without all but olives.

I agree John, but someplace will just HAVE TO fill the gap. Oh, the salty, vinegary goodness…..

Rod Evans
Reply to  beng135
March 6, 2020 11:10 am

There seems to be a group of commentors that can’t live without European olives? I have to admit to not being fussed either way, an olive is an olive is an olive as far as I am concerned. However,m have you tried pickled garlic? Now there is a delicacy worth fighting for. If anyone has not tried pickled garlic you just don’t know what you have been missing.

Reply to  Rod Evans
March 7, 2020 6:27 am

Rod, yes indeedy! And pickled okra too, when I can find it.

Reply to  OldGreyGuy
March 5, 2020 2:49 pm

We just realised to be short of medicine, China produces much cheaper than f. e. Germany, burt, helas, China has just other problems as to produce medicine or we stoped imports from China because of Corona.

Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 5, 2020 4:12 pm

Say again?j

Reply to  J=man
March 6, 2020 10:04 am


Reply to  OldGreyGuy
March 5, 2020 4:33 pm

Because of US switching to Natural Gas for much of our energy, we are reducing CO2 emissions faster than most of the EU. We technically could tax them!

Reply to  OldGreyGuy
March 5, 2020 6:35 pm

I cannot wait to see the tariffs that can be placed on the EU that completely cancel their stupid tax.

Reply to  OldGreyGuy
March 6, 2020 12:18 pm

Has Hull got a Big and deep enough Port? That’s where I recommend that they ( from the EU ) all Go to!

March 5, 2020 2:09 pm

Time Magazine has gone after Nixon, Agnew, Reagan, Bush1, Bush2 and Trump. I’m not quite sure why they are still around (the last printed magazine was like 16 pages). They certainly aren’t relevant.

The US is still the 500 lb gorilla, although Bernie is trying hard to kill it. Maybe the US can put a carbon tax on every Airbus flying into, out of and over the US. Might see a switch to Boeings on those routes pretty quickly.

Reply to  rbabcock
March 7, 2020 5:43 am

Yip, are they any better than the Spiegel ? – a German fake news mouthpiece

March 5, 2020 2:10 pm

Nothing of the sort will happen. The EU is a Paper Tiger which has recently lost a large limb in a Brexit encounter. Muslim refugee hordes are biting its flanks and infecting its interior organs. The EU is desperately trying to suppress other members from exiting after Brexit. The EU is battling a growing Covid-19 epidemic. The EU has little will left for a trade battle with the USA. Justin’s theory is just self-justification and pipe-dreams. the EU has no backbone when it comes to new trade disputes.

Reply to  nicholas tesdorf
March 5, 2020 2:54 pm

Even if the EU was to impose massive sanctions on US products, so what?
They will lose more than the US does when the US locks out their goods in retalition.
On the other hand, thanks to carbon taxes and their import taxes, any goods coming out of the EU will end up being so expensive that the US won’t need retaliatory sanctions. They will have already priced themselves out of all markets.

Reply to  MarkW
March 5, 2020 3:40 pm

The Time Magazine is following a failed campaign to stop Brexit by Le Monde and Frankfurter Allgemeine. Pile up all bad things that COULD (a key word here) happen! The EU (GDP $16 trillion, without the UK) did not frighten the UK (GDP $2.7 trillion). Why should it frighten the USA (GDP $21 trillion)?

William Astley
Reply to  Curious George
March 5, 2020 5:15 pm

Absolute zero carbon dioxide emissions = GDP (0)

GDP (0) = Mass unemployment and riots in the street.. .. and that is going to happen in a more few countries before this mess ends.

It is absolutely impossible to get to absolute zero CO2 emissions for basic engineering reasons.

The EU and UN bureaucracy is just trying to get more money for bureaucrats.

Reply to  William Astley
March 5, 2020 6:09 pm

“It is absolutely impossible to get to absolute zero CO2 emissions for basic engineering reasons.”

…… not least of which would be the human lung. There is a fix for that though if the planetsavers really want to do the ultimate virtue-signal.

Reply to  William Astley
March 5, 2020 7:07 pm

The idea of “zero carbon” means doing shit like CCS and wasting half of your energy resources: that’s the “sustainable” future. Then you pay others to “not emit” on your behalf and waste the little money you had left after taxing yourself out of business.

I have NO idea where the EU thinks it is going with this.

Kerry Eubanks
March 5, 2020 2:11 pm

Good luck with that. Somebody hasn’t been paying attention. If PDJT wins reelection, their “adjustments” will absolutely get “readjusted” at the US border.

Stephen Philbrick
Reply to  Kerry Eubanks
March 5, 2020 2:59 pm

Here’s a thought. The EU should not consider a tax on US good until the EU has matched the US emission reductions – and I don’t mean develop plans for such reductions – we’ve seen those plans made and ignored, but no consideration of a tax until there are actual reductions. I can’t imagine that will happen for a dozen years or more.

Robert Terrell
Reply to  Stephen Philbrick
March 5, 2020 3:41 pm

The US has already reduced emissions far more than Europe ever hopes to. Sorry!

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Stephen Philbrick
March 5, 2020 6:18 pm

“Here’s a thought. The EU should not consider a tax on US goods until the EU has matched the US emission reductions”

Excellent idea.

Where does the EU come off demanding penalties when they are not even doing as good a job as the U.S. does when it comes to CO2 reduction? The EU ought to take a few lessons from Trump on how to handle the situation. Trump is reducing CO2 while the US economy is booming at the same time, and meanwhile the EU is not reducing their CO2 and their economies are tanking. EU politicians need to wake up out of their delusions.

Reply to  Stephen Philbrick
March 5, 2020 7:34 pm

Yup. The EU bans fracking which has helped the US reduce CO2 significantly while importing Russian gas.

Reply to  Stephen Philbrick
March 5, 2020 7:38 pm

Hear, hear. The US is the farthest along in reducing per capita CO2 emissions. So if they plan to tax accordingly, they would have to pay us the tax for, I’m guessing 15-20 years before things would even up.

Never happens.

Mark Broderick
March 5, 2020 2:12 pm

….LOL, what is left of the EU countries would be decimated in a trade war with President Trump and the soaring U.S. economy, forcing more “Brexits” until the Fascist EU is FINALLY put into its well deserved grave !


trevor collins
March 5, 2020 2:13 pm

did you say…….Justin Wonderland??? I Am Hard of Hearing! regards, Trevor, from Trevor Collins, (NZ)……

March 5, 2020 2:18 pm

That’s hilarious, since our carbon footprint is shrinking, while theirs is not. “You don’t have laws that say the same stupid things as ours” is hardly a good case.

Reply to  max
March 5, 2020 2:28 pm

“‘You don’t have laws that say the same stupid things as ours’ is hardly a good case.”

They think it is, which tells you all you need to know about the arrogant jack@sses.

Andy Mansell
Reply to  max
March 5, 2020 10:09 pm

This is the sole reason the EU exists- to make more and more laws and rules which is why the left loves it and why we in the UK are better off out of it. It is a useless, pointless waste of resources- just another layer of self serving, pious bureaucrats on top of the ones individual countries already have!

March 5, 2020 2:22 pm

Is not the USA one of the few countries where carbon dioxide emissions are ACTUALLY decreasing?
Maybe not decreasing fast enough for the green zealots…..

This is due to the natural gas (fracking) replacement of coal which has more CO2 output per amount of electricity produced.

And as mentioned above, will the EU take a tax increase on imports form the real CO2 increasers, China and India?

Reply to  a_scientist
March 5, 2020 2:32 pm

don’t point out the facts. it makes the greens angry. US reduced GHE (not that anyone should give a rats ass about CO2) but we should look to reduce the use of natural resources. The EU is a sham organization, hence BREXIT. The UK also did a great job of reducing GHE but, they destroyed large forest and now have very expensive electricity.

US is going to do what the US wants to do, whenever, where ever. No apologies needed. The US saved the world 3 times from tyranny and evil 3 times in the last century. We created a weapon that could have been used to conquer anyone we wanted. but we didn’t , we actually went and helped rebuild those nations that were crippled by the wars. inlcuding Japan and Germany. The EU can F**K off.

Mark Broderick
Reply to  davetherealist
March 5, 2020 3:46 pm

Well said… Too bad they don’t teach that history in schools anymore !

Reply to  a_scientist
March 5, 2020 2:56 pm

To the left, saying the right things has always been more important than doing the right things.
Just look at the behavior of those the left idolizes.

March 5, 2020 2:27 pm

It would be good to see the EU make this official policy in ordering the USA to start a carbon tax, or impose a carbon tax on import trade, before the election in Nov later this year. That way, voters could see what alternatives in their voting choices would mean to their own pocket book, in addition to the appearance that the EU has control of internal USA affairs. This would probably add another 1-2 Million voters to the Trump column as well as for the seats and Governors up for re-election in the Senate and the House. All this nonsense has to be soundly rejected, and the best way to do that is to return the Republicans to full majority power in all branches of Gov’t so that there is no more stalling and hoaxed stumbling blocks thrown into the path of the administration. Even moderate Democrats are getting sick and tired of these goons in the Democrat party blocking everything from infrastructure spending to not cooperating on a coordinated response to the C-19 issues. Time to throw the Democrat bums out on their ear. Especially the rabid foaming at the mouth ones, like AOC and her ‘progressive’ ilk.

Robert of Texas
March 5, 2020 2:35 pm

They can *try* to force the U.S. all they want…fact is we can counter using tariffs. We need more manufacturing jobs in the U.S. anyway, so it’s a win-win for us over enough time (there is always pain in the adjustment). We can also save a lot of money in the defense budget as we no longer need to be protecting Germany nor protecting the world’s access to oil in the Arabian Sea – they can buy our oil.

You cannot have free-trade with countries that do not reciprocate – it’s why the world feels free to take advantage of the U.S. in their working around trade agreements. If the EU wants a trade war, bring it on. It would be a tremendous opportunity to grow the economies of South America, which is far better for the U.S. then growing the economies in the EU.

A carbon tax is just another way to tax consumers, which is mostly the middle class. It is a TERRIBLE idea. This is how we destroy a good economy, not grow one.

Reply to  Robert of Texas
March 5, 2020 2:57 pm

Won’t need any counter tariffs. Those carbon taxes are going to make their products so expensive that nobody will be able to afford them anyway.

Reply to  MarkW
March 5, 2020 5:17 pm

That is what I was thinking. US manufacturing would get very healthy once again. I like the plan to do increased business with India vs China.

Reply to  MarkW
March 6, 2020 5:26 am

Nah you do what trump did with China double whatever they put on and target industries that really matter. Why play with gloves off slap the stupidity right out of them. If they want to lock themselves out of the biggest consumer market in the world go right ahead.

March 5, 2020 2:38 pm

Sounds like the EU has let Climate Derangement Syndrome commandeer their mental faculties!

Perhaps EU stands for Europe Unhinged!

Great Britain is already seeing a resurgence in their economy and the stronger they get, the more the EU will hemorrhage members!

Some unions should never have happened!

Tom Abbott
Reply to  RockyRoad
March 5, 2020 6:25 pm

“Sounds like the EU has let Climate Derangement Syndrome commandeer their mental faculties!”


Just think of all the damage this CAGW lie has caused around the world. It’s an Epic lie which has caused millions of people to lose their senses, especially politicians.

They are deluded to the point of destroying their own homes with their actions to curb CO2.

March 5, 2020 2:52 pm

The world does want more efficient products.
They save money.
However, paying thousands more, for a product that only saves a dollar or two a year is not a good deal, as everyone who isn’t a leftist is able to figure out.

Zig Zag Wanderer
Reply to  MarkW
March 5, 2020 3:19 pm

I worked out a long time ago that you need to buy the equipment with the lowest ‘star’ rating. That’s are the only ones that actually work properly.

Reply to  Zig Zag Wanderer
March 5, 2020 4:23 pm

Is that anything like avoiding any movie that wins an Oscar?

Reply to  MarkW
March 6, 2020 1:38 pm

It’s like those guys in Switzerland insulating their houses for a hundred thousand bucks to save maybe one thousand bucks a year. No thanks.

Martin Howard Keith Brumby
March 5, 2020 3:05 pm

“The EU’s plan is a significant escalation, but it’s not a complete surprise. The intellectual foundations behind policy, which the EU has dubbed a border carbon tax, have been discussed in policy circles for years.”

So, a bunch of egregious morons have a policy with “intellectual foundations”.

Who knew?

These clowns couldn’t fart and chew gum at the same time.

March 5, 2020 3:05 pm

“The EU Could Force the USA to Act on Climate Change”

The EU can go pound salt up its ass.

Reply to  Kamikazedave
March 5, 2020 3:14 pm

“Europe” is always good for a laugh 😀

Donald Boughton
Reply to  Kamikazedave
March 5, 2020 3:26 pm

I suggest a raw peeled chili pepper up its arse.

Reply to  Donald Boughton
March 5, 2020 4:22 pm

Before pounding the salt.

Sweet Old Bob
Reply to  Donald Boughton
March 5, 2020 4:29 pm

Carolina Reaper ?
😉 😉

Reply to  Sweet Old Bob
March 5, 2020 7:12 pm

No, colonal reaper.

March 5, 2020 3:15 pm

The EU flag minus GB.
The yellow sphincter is incomplete.
Worrying times in their underwear department!!

Reply to  roger
March 5, 2020 10:32 pm

It can’t pucker any more.

nw sage
Reply to  roger
March 6, 2020 7:21 pm

I STILL think that off color star should be replaced with a bit of the Union Jack. The symbolism is useful.

March 5, 2020 3:20 pm

This much is true:

It’s pointless to reduce carbon emissions inside Europe, to then import them from outside …

Greg Cavanagh
Reply to  commieBob
March 5, 2020 4:22 pm

They know it, they say it, but they will ignore it and continue on anyway. Classic!

Robert Terrell
March 5, 2020 3:36 pm

The USA is NOT any part of the EU! Therefore, they can’t “FORCE’ us to do anything! That’s just wishful thinking!

Reply to  Robert Terrell
March 6, 2020 10:09 am

Wishful Thiniking

Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 6, 2020 10:51 am

Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 6, 2020 12:25 pm

Wishful Thinkings
Probs to embed a video here, maybe better as link now.
Tried as in “Test” proposed….

M__ S__
March 5, 2020 3:41 pm

Just reflect whatever tariff theEU imposes back on EU countries

Flight Level
March 5, 2020 3:53 pm

The Euro is “fiat money”, no one knows it’s real worth.

And the printing presses keep rolling new bills into an artificially evaluated economy.

Which is why EU desperately seeks new free money and robs it’s subjects each and every way.

March 5, 2020 3:57 pm

It is very clear from all the climatology energy diagrams showing back radiation that climatologists (and thus all the computer models) assume that the surface is warmer than the direct solar radiation could make it because of the back radiation supposedly causing about twice as much heat into the surface (324W/m^2) as the solar radiation (168W/m^2) supplies.

You all need to face the FACT that climatologists QUANTIFY the surface temperature by adding together the fluxes from the Sun and the atmosphere, then deducting the cooling flux by evaporation and conduction-cum-convection out of the surface, and then using the net total of about 390W/m^2 in Stefan Boltzmann calculations that then give 288K for a uniform flux day and night all over the globe (LOL). The fact that it is variable would give a mean temperature at least 10 degrees cooler – like about 5C.

This is totally wrong. Nothing in established physics says you can add fluxes like that and get correct results in Stefan-Boltzmann calculations. Nothing in established physics says the solar radiation can make the surface hotter than the black body temperature for the mean flux. There is no experiment that confirms radiation can be added this way – nothing anywhere! A simple experiment comparing the warming effect of a single artificial source of radiation and the warming by multiple such sources PROVES that this addition of radiative fluxes does NOT give correct results in Stefan-Boltzmann calculations, yet the WHOLE radiative forcing climate change conjecture is BASED on that FALSE assumption.

And THAT is the reason Roy Spencer’s graphs show no warming since the peak in the 60-year cycle back in 1998 and will not show future warming until after 2028. There may be more then, but the long term cycle of about 1,000 years should turn to cooling perhaps before any more than another half degree of warming after 2028. Cosmic rays vary for several reasons and they are now shown to affect the amount of cloud cover, and thus cause natural climate cycles.

March 5, 2020 4:02 pm

The EU can’t even get its’ members to reduce their CO2 to agreed levels and see what happened in France when they tried to initiate a so called ‘carbon tax’. This is a joke without a punch line. The cabal (UN) that made up the whole CO2 scare didn’t count on people acting rationally.

slow to follow
March 5, 2020 4:06 pm

Von der Leyen sees ‘momentum’ for improving EU-US relations

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said on Thursday (5 March) “there might be momentum” for improving the EU’s relationship with the US, but it remained unclear when she will present a trade offer to US President Donald Trump to avoid further tariffs.


March 5, 2020 4:16 pm

“In 2019, the United States was the largest partner for EU exports of goods (27 %) and the second largest partner for EU imports of goods (12 %).

Among EU Member States, Germany was both the largest importer of goods from and the largest exporter of goods to the United States.”

And Germany will be the hardest hit. Cop that Merkel. 😀

Any such action will harm the EU more than the USA. And remember, the US now has a free UK to sell to.

Joel Snider
March 5, 2020 4:26 pm

Sounds like they want to pick a fight. I’m down.

March 5, 2020 4:26 pm

…….. wonders if TIME is actually a paper thing these days or has it been sold off as plaything for some foreign oligarch?

– can’t even be bothered to look – like The Independent “newspaper” in the UK – pointless + irrelevant.

Alec Rawls
March 5, 2020 4:32 pm

Any tax /tariff that Europe puts on us Trump will put on them. Do they really think they can get away with one way tariffs anymore? Must REALLY not be paying attention.

Reply to  Alec Rawls
March 6, 2020 5:32 am

You saw what he did with China he will actually double it if he is true to form. With a different president EU might get away with this and get some leverage but if Trump has to burn EU relations to the ground to make the point you know he will because he isn’t a politician and doesn’t play the game.

March 5, 2020 4:36 pm

Until the EU reduces carbon dioxide emissions as much as the U.S. has over the last decade we won’t be taking lessons from them or trying to emulate their counter-productive climate policies.

Craig from Oz
March 5, 2020 4:40 pm

Semi related.

My pick for the next nation to Brexit? Poland

Anyone else want to play?

Right-Handed Shark
Reply to  Craig from Oz
March 5, 2020 5:01 pm

Erm.. that situation would be referred to as a Polexit. (Brexit is a contraction of British exit). But I wouldn’t be surprised if there were a Grexit (Greece), Itexit (Italy) and after that, hopefully the entire corrupt institution falls apart.

Reply to  Right-Handed Shark
March 5, 2020 5:44 pm


Andy Mansell
Reply to  Eric Worrall
March 5, 2020 10:22 pm

Eventually, if the EU has no members, it’s CO2 emissions will be zero- target reached! Simples!

March 5, 2020 4:47 pm

When the EU cut’s Co2 as much as the US has we can talk, you self important do nothing, hypocrites. Until then enjoy the reciprocal Trump Trade Taxes and him forcing the EU to pay up with it’s NATO obligations.

We all know who your going to call when Putin has you bent over a barrel.

March 5, 2020 4:55 pm

I would say that I get more relieved by the day that we left this arrogant, dictatorial shower, but unfortunately almost the entire uk political establishment is every bit as insane as they are. Ho hum, the lunatics are well and truly running the asylum this side of the pond. Beam me up Scotty.

Andy Mansell
Reply to  ChrisDinBristol
March 5, 2020 10:26 pm

I used to laugh when folk were arguing before the Brexit vote. When asked for my thoughts, I would point out that we were arguing about which bunch of overpaid windbags would get to tell us what to do and take our money away…

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Andy Mansell
March 6, 2020 9:58 am

But at least your own overpaid windbags can be booted via your own votes. The EU overpaid windbags are not elected and are accountable to no one, making them even worse.

Reply to  AGW is Not Science
March 6, 2020 11:50 am


Reply to  ChrisDinBristol
March 7, 2020 4:24 am

. . . except there’s no-one worth voting for at the moment. Labour are totally doolally and the Liberal Democrats are, as it turns out, neither liberal nor democratic. All are in favour of climate lunacy. When only 2 out of 650 mps vote against there being a ‘climate emergency’ you’re in deep doggy-doo. And we are, up to our necks. . .

Reply to  ChrisDinBristol
March 7, 2020 5:41 am

Aye indeed, what we need is someone with the where-with-all to burrow down and find the Plug to drain the swamp.
All this frothing around and hand-wringing, looking in a hall of mirrors isn’t helping. Aerating to get rid of the smell may help for REAL Slurry, but this obnoxious stuff just seems to THRIVE on it. Instead of giving it OXYGEN, they should be SMOTHERED in their own stuff – they generate so much CO2.

John Robertson
March 5, 2020 5:49 pm

Can we NOT rescue them this time?
Twice the best of America’s young men have had to go to war,to fight atrocity that Europe created.
This time,lets just sell weapons to both sides or all five sides and cheer from a safe distance.
My father spent 5 years,in the service of rescuing Europe from themselves,lost way too many friends.
And here they are 75 years later,doing it all over again.
They may be slow learners,do we have to be?

Rhoda R
Reply to  John Robertson
March 5, 2020 11:56 pm

You are not alone in that thought/desire.

Walter Sobchak
March 5, 2020 6:29 pm

How about if we close our military bases in Europe and tell the Russians that, as far as we are concerned, Europe is theirs.

Nations without armies do not have negotiating positions.

Reply to  Walter Sobchak
March 5, 2020 8:26 pm


That would be like telling Hitler in 1941 the Continent was his.
Keeping Russian ambitions contained is to everyone’s benefit in the long run.
As much as l would love to watch the entire German Green Party get put in a Russian Siberian gulag without fossil fuel heat in mid-Winter would be so much Schadenfreude, it would be condemning a lot of good people to a new 21st Century Iron Curtain of tyranny.

I have always said though that the possible Genocides of the 21st Century, if the Ecoterrorists and Climate Alarmist religious types get their way, will make the 20th Century genocides look like the warm up round.

Walter Sobchak
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
March 6, 2020 7:47 am

” it would be condemning a lot of good people to a new 21st Century Iron Curtain of tyranny.”

They have condemned themselves.

We cannot make them live when they so clearly want to die. Let them commit Green Suicide. They will be an example to future generations.

“Example is the school of mankind, and they will learn at no other.”
Edmund Burke, Letter i. On a Regicide Peace. Vol. v. p. 331.


March 5, 2020 7:16 pm

All this lunacy off course is playing directly into Russia’s hand.
The NATO alliance would be shattered with Germany leading this climate charge off the cliff. It remains to be seen how much Poland and Hungary will push back against Brussels.
The Refugee crisis of 2015 is about to happen again as Turkey is unleashing 4 million Syrians on Europe. That could fracture the EU.
A very non-linear situation.
Putin would like to see the EU socialists win and NATO shattered.
US and UK would like to see the EU shattered and NATO prevail to keep Germany in the alliance and out of Russia Gazprom energy blackmail.

And as an aside:
I wonder about Greenland and how the people there feel about fossil fuels. Without diesel/banker oil to run their community generators, they couldn’t live there. And Denmark, their parent country, is leading the stupid ban fossil fuels charge off the climate cliff.

Trump offered to buy Greenland from Denmark. I wonder what the Greenland residents are going to think when Copenhagen tells them they need to stop burn fossil fuels?

Rhys Jaggar
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
March 6, 2020 2:06 am

FFS, Gazprom does not ‘blackmail’ the Germans, they sell them gas at a fair price, which is far cheaper than US LNG.

I know you Americans sometimes have trouble with truth, but really: Germany and Russia have a cooperative attitude to energy provision and that is why Nordstream II is being built, something you Americans have to (try, but fail to-) vandalise to expiate your narcissism at not being able to compete on price.

Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
March 6, 2020 7:36 am

You clearly have more knowledge on the subject than I, as I’m not aware of any “vandalization” by Americans. (Note: In English, “vandalize” indicates physical damage.) Furthermore, it’s unclear to me why Americans would be atoning for narcissism. This seems like nonsensical rhetoric to me.

Regarding the point about LNG competition, why would Americans try to compete with Russia? As we say, they’re in Germany’s backyard. I think our main concern is allowing an historical aggressor to gain a potential stranglehold on Europe’s energy supply. This seems like a fairly reasonable concern to me, but I’m probably mistaken. Surely the Europeans wouldn’t allow themselves to be put into a compromised position by a member state. I mean, that’s just silly, right?

Finally, you seem quite dedicated to a negative opinion on the US. That’s ok, you do you. But, at the end of the day, pax-Americana seems to have been reasonably effective.


Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
March 6, 2020 7:46 am

They sell gas at a fair price, but only so long as the EU doesn’t do anything to anger their Russian masters.

Like most socialists, Rhys defines truth as whatever most advances the cause.

Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
March 6, 2020 7:47 am

Germany has a cooperative relationship with Russia until Putin decides otherwise.

Reply to  Paul
March 6, 2020 3:18 pm

As long as Merkel is there, that shouldt not be a problem, Putin and Merkel know each other for a long time as both worked in their respective communist / socialist party in the gone German Democratic Republic also known as DDR. I think, Merkel was Putins very best coup…

shortus cynicus
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
March 6, 2020 4:39 am

> Trump offered to buy Greenland from Denmark.

60 tsd. people living there.

What is the art of the deal?

Is he trying to buy people (like slaves) living in Greenland form their owners Denes, or only land, or both?
How is it, that Denes “own” Greenland? Have they made it?

Have better idea: I sell Denmark. Anyone want to buy?

Reply to  shortus cynicus
March 6, 2020 5:13 am

A previous US President offered to buy Greenland during the Cold War. Wanna bet it had something to do with the Thule Air-force Base?
Listening to Base Commander Jack D. Ripper of the movie Dr. Strangelove, it is clear some in the D.C. swamp are worried about their precious bodily fluids being infiltrated by communist, red-coats.

Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
March 6, 2020 4:52 am

Recall, from the legendary movie Dr. Strangelove : Base Commander Jack D. Ripper :
Mandrake, do you recall what Clemenceau once said about war? … He said “War is too important to be left to the generals.” When he said that, fifty years ago, he may have been right. But today war is too important to be left to the politicians. They have neither the time, the training, nor the inclination for strategic thought. I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion, and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.
Mandrake, come over here, the Redcoats are coming!

The insanity in the US about Russia sounds just like that movie – I wonder if ex-British Prime Minister May thought the Russians Novichok nerve agent got into their precious bodily fluids?

March 5, 2020 7:17 pm

don’t worry Von Leyden’s biggest claim to fame is failing to administer Germany’s token armed forces.

It went so well they gave her a job several orders of magnitude bigger, to see if you could do any better.

Reply to  Greg
March 5, 2020 10:27 pm

What is the female equivalent of the ‘Peter principle’?

Bob heath
Reply to  Richard
March 5, 2020 11:00 pm

Petra principle. Sadly my eldest daughter’s name is Petra

March 5, 2020 10:28 pm

North America has been net carbon dioxide negative since before 2000.
The USA has kept reducing its “carbon footprint” since then, without government policy or mandates.

The EU can talk to us when they actually reduce their “carbon footprint”. Fracking and nuclear energy come to mind.

Bob heath
March 5, 2020 11:03 pm

I’m a Brit. Now we’ve become an independent country again and left the ridiculous anachronistic EU, I hope the US does that’s all it can to make life difficult for those pompous continentals. It’s falling apart anyway and it can’t even see it. Any bets on who is out next? My money is on Denmark or Sweden

Reply to  Bob heath
March 6, 2020 1:35 am

Oddly enough it may well be France….

Matthew Sykes
March 5, 2020 11:30 pm

The EUs portion of global trade is diminishing. If they want to reduce this further, push up the cost of imported goods, and damage their economy with this carbon BS then let them. Quite frankly the UK, US, Canada, and the rest of the world can look after themselves and turn their backs on the EU. They are nothing but trouble and have been for centuries.

Bob Mount
March 6, 2020 12:07 am

This story is a good indicator of what Britain has had to suffer over the past 40+ years as a member of the EU mad house and why we, the people, have overwhelmingly voted to leave.

March 6, 2020 12:10 am

How Europe’s Border Carbon Tax Plan Could Force the U.S. To Act on Climate Change

The same way they forced The UK?

Ivor Ward
March 6, 2020 12:15 am

French wine is actually American wine. See “the great wine blight of the 1860’s” Only Bollinger is real original French wine.

Reply to  Ivor Ward
March 6, 2020 2:09 am

Well the stocks of American heritage, because of thicker rind blocking the Phyoxera parasite, do not themselves produce grapes. The French grafted branches do.
And the US had to call over French vintners to get their wine in order, the Aussies to. So instead of awful new-world “dry-red” now some really excellent wines give the French a real headache, no pun intended!

March 6, 2020 1:34 am

“The EU Could Force the USA to Act on Climate Change”.

This will be fun to watch.

Reply to  Jones
March 6, 2020 5:34 am

I know what would happen with Trump if they tried it, but it might work with a green or left president because they believe in the cause. I think what would happen is very dependent on who is in the White House.

March 6, 2020 2:03 am

To my astonishment I just heard the brand new British Passports, are manufactured in — the EU!
The tender went out in 2018. And they are poly-carbonate, one of the most “evil” plastic wastes.
Oh dear!
But more stunning is the BoJo Green Britain post-Brexit plan. I makes even van der Leyen’s EU schemes fade. Both trot to the tune of now-UN Climate Rep. Carney of the Bank of England, the City of London.

So instead of the fake EU flag of the lead , it should be Green with Britain still there. This cabal desperately want the US and China there too.

Patrick MJD
Reply to  bonbon
March 6, 2020 11:01 pm

Correct. BoJo may have won the battle of Brexit but he won’t win the war on the BoE. Where there is money to be made, you can bet your dollar, someone somewhere in the BoE and the “Square Mile” are in on the ground floor.

David Stone
March 6, 2020 3:45 am

The UK will certainly buy from America if the price and quality are right, without tariffs.
I think everyone here can now see why the UK left the EU. The rules are stifling. Now they are demanding a “level playing field” between us and them in case we compete! They have about 2 or 3 years left before the others realise it is really is a useless political control exercise, and leave too.
Good luck from the UK

shortus cynicus
March 6, 2020 4:57 am

Be aware: EU is a superpower on a Moral Certificates Market. Actually is the only region with experience in manufacturing Moral Superiority that is the only defense against Blaim Bombs.

Do you want to be excluded from Moral Market?

Look at Detroit vs. Hroshima comparison, one was bombed with Blaim Bomb, gues which one.

Vincent Causey
March 6, 2020 6:16 am

Apart from the EU having no backbone, it reveals the anti democratic nature of the EU. No individual democratic nation could long persist with such nonsensical economy killing measures before being booted out of office. The UK, will at some point, rebel against the same draconian measures currently being introduced under the 2018 climate change act (the judicial over-ruling of the Heathrow expansion project is one such outcome, but only the first of many more). But for the citizens of the non democracy of the EU, what are they to do? They can change their government but not the EU directives.

March 6, 2020 6:17 am

What happens if they do implement this carbon tax.
1) The price of energy and food skyrocket.
2) The globalist elite show their disdain for the deplorable working class in that the working class is to stupid to connect a carbon tax to the rising cost of living.
3) The working class has to make choices between heat, transport, and food.
4) Sooner or later a leader arises who advocates eliminating the carbon tax.
5) Presto no more Globalist leadership of the EU or no more EU.

March 6, 2020 6:51 am

Okay but the U.S. will have to tax the EU for it’s use of the Gulf Stream. Or be cut off from it.

March 6, 2020 7:32 am

There is nothing new here. It’s been always the idea behind the climate hysteria of EU that they would impose taxes, and other trade restrictions on countries that use fossil fuels to drive their energy and other industries. This is how EU is going to force their own energy poverty on the world and level the market. And it’s been always crucial that the US would take part in this charade, siding with the EU. But since we have fossil fuels enough for centuries to come, we don’t have to play the EU’s silly game, and neither do China, Russia, Brazil, Australia, India, and many other countries, whose industrial output is much more than that of EU. We should, and hopefully will, respond with matching tariffs on EU goods if they ever enact the border carbon tax.

Steve Z
March 6, 2020 8:21 am

[QUOTE FROM ARTICLE]”As the EU has doubled down on policies to reduce emissions, and the U.S. and others have lagged, pressure mounted on the bloc to take more sweeping action. “It’s pointless to reduce carbon emissions inside Europe, to then import them from outside,” Bruno Le Maire, the French finance minister, told reporters at the World Economic Forum meeting in Davos in January.”

France, to its credit, has had lower CO2 emissions per capita than most of the rest of Europe due to their numerous nuclear power plants, which supply about 75% of their electric power, with most of the rest supplied by hydroelectric power from dams in the Alps and Pyrenees. While most of France’s trains run on electric power, France still depends on Middle East oil for gasoline and diesel for cars and trucks, and Russian natural gas for home heating.

The same can’t be said for the rest of the EU. Germany used to have a lot of nuclear reactors, many of which were shut down as part of their “Energiewende” program, supposedly to be replaced by wind and solar, which is strange for a country north of 45 degrees latitude dominated by cloudy weather. Spain made a similar experiment, and its economy is suffering for it.

If the EU really wanted to reduce its CO2 emissions, they should start a massive program to build nuclear reactors to generate electricity, while continuing to use fossil fuels for transportation and heating. Solar power might work in Spain, the French Riviera, Italy, and Greece, but the rest of Europe is too cloudy (with low sun angles in autumn and winter) to generate much solar power. Hydroelectric works well in mountainous areas with lots of rain and snow, such as the Alps, but most of northern Europe is too flat for a hydroelectric dam to produce much power.

Imposing a “carbon tax” on foreign exporters that don’t “reduce CO2 emissions” (by whose criteria?) is bound to be counterproductive for Europe. Most of Europe doesn’t have much fossil fuel reserves, and most of what they have is coal, which emits more CO2 per unit energy than oil or natural gas. A “carbon tax” on imports from the USA will make such imports more expensive for Europeans, and the USA could retaliate by imposing tariffs on EU exports, which would hurt the EU more than the USA. Would they also impose carbon taxes on Russian natural gas? All that would do is make it more expensive for Europeans to heat their homes in winter, which is bound to be unpopular with the folks back home, something like former President Carter’s asking people to wear sweaters indoors in the late 1970’s.

Meanwhile, thanks to lots of fracking, it will probably be cheaper to heat the average home in the USA, despite the fact that winters are colder in most of the USA than in Europe.

Reply to  Steve Z
March 6, 2020 2:12 pm

“they should start a massive program to build nuclear reactors to generate electricity”

Well they can’t build nuclear reactors because nuclear’s been demonized,
and the greens are against nuclear, and the greens are against coal, and against more hydro, and against new windmills…

Looks like somebody painted himself into a corner… 😉

March 6, 2020 9:00 am

The self appointed elite could well be in for a shock


They won’t just upset Johmy foreigner.

March 6, 2020 10:16 am

I have been reliably informed that the said Ursula was,in a previous life the Defence Minister of Germany.Things were so bad under her tenure the Air Force couldn’t put airworthy combat craft in the sky.Think they had to rely old “Fokkers” to bail them out. Actually she had to jump. A career lite failure,with a large pension pot!

March 6, 2020 12:18 pm

The US could just respond with a stupidity tax.

The EU is clearly stupid so their companies should be taxed at the US border.

Reply to  Steve
March 6, 2020 3:23 pm

The US could just respond with a stupidity tax. What ever the rate will be, as stupid they are, no chance to pay that sum 😀

Patrick MJD
Reply to  Steve
March 6, 2020 11:04 pm

There is already a stupid tax; It’s called the lottery!

It doesn't add up...
March 6, 2020 12:30 pm

Some basic things to understand:

The EU gets a good chunk of its revenues from customs tariffs, so it quite happy to raise them in part to plug the Brexit revenue gap.


EU consumers will be less happy paying extra duties and finding some goods unobtainable. They may well rebel in the streets (see e.g. gilets jaunes and at the ballot boxes. This is by no means just about how the US might respond to a trade war.

It is highly doubtful whether there would be a legal basis under WTO rules for such a tax anyway. The US has been tending to undermine the WTO, but it may find reason to take a different tack on this.

The EU is about to do itself serious economic damage by pursuing green policy. That takes us back to EU consumers being unhappy again. It has the making of a self-destruct button for the EU as an institution.

Reply to  It doesn't add up...
March 7, 2020 4:03 pm

The arrogant and imperialist US made the EU make damage to itself, and the EU did great damages (esp to France) with silly sanction against Russia, because Russia decided to slightly dismantle Ukraine after the US and EU decided to completely dismantle Yugoslavia, after a war that was encouraged by irresponsible promises made to Croatians (like the EU made irresponsible promises made of almost EU integration to Ukraine).

The stupidity and arrogance of anti Russia non military sanctions is unprecedented: preventing Russia from buying porc and fish? What kind of strategy was that?

The economic damages done, and done for good, to French farming, is terrible, and a big taboo in France, and a huuuuge taboo in US liberal circles.

All that enabled Russian fishers, Russian agriculture, Russian cheese makers (which now imitate French cheese), Russians everything, and very strongly empowered Putin. It’s was a huge gift, perhaps the Most Bigly Political Gift Evah.

The West is making as many gifts to Putin as it can.

Reply to  niceguy
March 7, 2020 7:07 pm

The embodiment of US’ imperialism is the “sanctity of our elections” and “self ruling” BS (accepted by the allegedly fine mind of Judge Kavanaugh) and pro “Duty To Report Act” propaganda used to denigrate any foreign influence on US politics:

“It is fundamental to the definition of a national political community that foreign citizens do not have a constitutional right to participate in, and thus may be excluded from, activities of democratic self-governance.”

What the hell is that supposed to mean? It’s either narrowly interpreted, and inherently the case (those not allowed to vote don’t have the right to have, duh), or interpreted in the most general way, as potentially a prohibition to have any immaterial influence on politics, and so is a fascistic attack on people’s God given rights to voice and promote their opinions.

Historically, for good or bad, the US has been promoting its “values” (though it unclear how many Americans could clearly explain these, even on “obvious” subjects like “freedom of the press”), and telling other countries what they should do. Even foreign aid isn’t “neutral”; simply bringing in “GMO food” (whatever that is) is perceived as US involvement in local food and agriculture politics.

The idea that somehow US influence abroad is entirely good and Russian or other influence is entirely bad is:
– silly
– irrelevant if true
– directly, absolutely, contradicted by those who promote it but also promote “consensus” and the swampy ill defined “international law” (in practice defined as the middle position of the UN members, most of which are either dictatorships, lawless places, filthy ungovernable places, sh*th0les or all of the above).

Any real anti imperialist American or non American would oppose that “Duty To Report Act” propaganda with passion.

I don’t see that happening, so I can only conclude that the anti imperialism, esp. of the Left, is a scam (like US elections laws and the FEC).

March 7, 2020 9:52 am

If I remember my US History correctly, we won the “war” against freedom (1770s
/1780s). Here we go again !!! But, this time we have Donald Trump in our corner. We can survive an economic war with the EU. Tariffs ??? the Donald is a master negotiator. Just ask N Korea and China. Over here we voters have a lot of sway with our votes and conservative politicos. So, bring it on, and don’t forget that showing up with a knife to a gun fight isn’t a good idea. Retired engineer, US Navy vet (1966-1969); HM, E5, USMC Corpsman. God bless the US of A. Anchors Aweigh, Semper Fi, Hoorah. Sic’em Donald.

March 7, 2020 3:51 pm

Bruno Le Maire had no objection over low cost imports from China.

Bruno Le Maire did not try to provide at least moral support (as a French minister, Bruno Le Maire has little to no real world powers) to Trump’s “war” against China either.

Each of these facts, and many more, prove that Bruno is clown.

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