Meet the Doomers: Climate Worriers so Extreme Other Radicals Avoid Them

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

h/t JoNova; What happens when climate panic turns into despair? Their fellow travellers accuse them of “climate denial”, of course.

Breaking up over climate change: My deep dark journey into doomer Facebook
THURSDAY 7 NOVEMBER 2019 5:00AM

By James Purtill

Things came to a head at dinner one night earlier this year, when my girlfriend suggested the chat was too depressing.

She wanted to keep living her life as normal, and I wanted to freak out.

And then we broke up.

‘Welcome to our world Mr Franzen’

The phrase ‘doomerism’ was popularised in the commentary around Jonathan Franzen’s 2019 article in the New Yorker, in which the famous American novelist argued we have no chance of averting catastrophic climate change, and we should just admit this

The essay was titled, “What if We Stopped Pretending?” and it argued that Green New Deal progressives were, in fact, the ones in denial. 
“All-out war on climate change made sense only as long as it was winnable,” Franzen wrote. 

The internet tore it apart. Franzen had gotten aspects of climate science wrong and misrepresented the priorities of environmental groups, it turned out. 

But his greatest sin, many said, was strategic and moral — he sounded like a climate denier.

But there was one corner of the internet where Franzen was drawing cautious admiration.

That part was doomer Facebook. Members of groups like Near Term Human Extinction Support Group (NTHESG) and Abrupt Climate Change believe they’ve been rejected by the mainstream for speaking the truth — that it’s too late to avert civilisational collapse.

“We get attacked daily, welcome to our world Mr Franzen,” one member wrote.

‘Activism, but without any hope’

I went back to the NTHESG admins with a question: Aren’t you just giving up?

Climate emergencies have been declared, so what?” one replied.

“Trudeau approved an oil pipeline, and he’s supposed to be the social justice favourite. All this hate against Trump, but he’s no different, just punching with the gloves off.

“We humans like to think our activism will solve the problem. [But] we don’t take solace in false hopes. That will only betray in the end.

But other admins disagreed – a rare moment of internal dissent.

Another said: “Like our members, [the admin above] and I have different ideas. Members are split on this kind of thing. I protest. [The admin above] doesn’t.

Read more: https://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/breaking-up-over-climate-change-my-journey-into-doomer-facebook/11678736

WUWT covered the Franzen article in September.

It would be easy to write off such despair as the hilariously absurd beliefs of an isolated group of cranks, but there is evidence that a lot of people really do believe the world is doomed.

Last September, a high profile Australian drug rehabilitation specialist testified to a government committee that climate despair is a significant factor driving young people to destroy their lives with hard drugs.

Advertisements

93 thoughts on “Meet the Doomers: Climate Worriers so Extreme Other Radicals Avoid Them

  1. Wait a minute, are using fossil fuel products to complain about fossil fuels 😐 ? These people are beyond help, clearly yoga and a kale diet isn’t helping… Imagine if they had to live like the Amish, ploughing the fields, walking everywhere, and the absolute unthinkable thing of not having facebook to complain 😐

    • They wouldn’t last 5 minutes living like the Amish. They’d have a nervous breakdown not being able to use their cellphones.

      • Not a nervous breakdown, they’re already having that. They would certainly experience withdrawal and panic, but they would probably calm down mentally as they approached physical exhaustion.

        • Randy you have it right. They would actually become productive citizens and find happiness in their life.

          The only problem is that you would have to prevent them from escaping that lifestyle and in a free society they have the liberty to run back to their own self destructive ways. The irony is that their personality type, in which they would voluntarily enslave themselves to central authoritarian government for the illusion of safety and security, thrives on negativity with an addiction to doomerism. In their case freedom leads this personality to voluntary state indenture.

          They have always existed, a small segment of our society, but our governments drive toward socialism aided by social media and a new print and television media that only reports on what is playing out on social media, has given this small doomerism mentality a magaphone voice electronically amplified by orders of magnitude. They are recruiting the depressive personality types, among us, to their cause and without hope this group turns into violent terrorist groups like Anfifa.

          We reap what we sow and we have been growing doomerism for 3 generations and they are turning violent.

      • If they lived like the Amish, they’d have to do the following:

        – Cook on a woodburning stove
        – Plant their own food and preserve it for future use
        – Learn how to cook from scratch – no microwaves, period!
        – Put up with an icebox instead of having a refrigerator
        – Do their laundry by hand – no washing machines, all human-powered stuff
        – Hang laundry to dry in the fresh air, using clothespins. (It was fun, running through the sheets my mother hung over the clothesline in the 1950s. )
        – No TV, no internet, no phones except for the community phone down the road
        – No electricity – but then, if you have oil lamps, they work just fine and you don’t have to worry about power outages
        – Go everywhere in a horse-drawn buggy at a slow pace, about 4.5 MPH

        I don’t think they could handle the load.

        • The Amish are required to have a telephone in the barn, or somewhere nearby, for purposes of summoning the fire department in case of need.

        • Not to mention the care and feeding of horses is a major undertaking in and of itself.

          But who knows? Maybe a (very small) percentage of these folks would find an Amish-like lifestyle rewarding; the satisfaction of enjoying the fruits of your labor. And it’s doubtful they’d have any time or energy at the end of their workday to bellyache about how the climate is going to exterminate them.

          • They would be using the horses to haul hand cut and split wood for the wood stove. That is year ‘round and keeps the kitchen nice and warm,- in June-August.

            The good news is that we wouldn’t have to hear from them since they would not be connected.

        • – No TV, no internet, no phones except for the community phone down the road

          In the home. At their place of work, they can have access to all of those things, if needed.

          – Go everywhere in a horse-drawn buggy at a slow pace, about 4.5 MPH

          Unless they hire an “Englisher” to drive them. While they can’t own or drive one themselves, they are not adverse to riding in them when necessary.

          Mainly, it’s technology in the home/for personal use that’s the real big bug-a-boo for them.

        • Sara,
          you’re describing my childhood, apart from the horse bit – bicycle for me. Unless I didn’t have a bike with me when it was Shank’s pony. Cycling home on a frosty night in moon/star light or watching the northern lights, happy memories.

    • If they lived like Amish, then they would have a religion and wouldn’t need to substitute climate doom in their lives for Bibilical Armageddon. Most of these people have abandon more traditional forms of religion and that hole in their cultural makeup is filled by climatism.
      Maurice Strong predicted this.

    • Brilliant, that’s what they need! Just one month, say November or December when they cut firewood endlessly except when they’re tending the animals. That is the cure!

    • I believe people in this category deserve a little compassion, even from us climate skeptics who are “woke” to the fact that CO2 is unlikely to cause a tipping point disaster, the climate being dominated by negative feedbacks that keep it fairly stable against all forcings.

      Compassion, because these people are mentally/emotionally ill. For them, climate change is just the current problem they glom onto. There has always been one predicted apocalypse or other. The depressive personalities these people have cannot look away from the horrible futures that somehow might happen.

      In my lifetime: the inevitability of nuclear holocaust (1950’s and 60’s), the Club of Rome predictions couple with a coming ice age (1970’s), Nuclear Winter (early 1980’s), Acid Rain and the Ozone Hole (mid-80″), the frogs dying (what was that all about?), the bees dying, then the perfect storm of Global Warming after a mere decade of mild warming (1980-1990). Whatever the prediction, they cannot help but see a small current trend extend to extremes, and to disaster.

  2. of course the high profile aussie shrink wouldnt have the nous or guts to say the fearmongers need t be held to account
    for warping weak/ gullible and fragile minds
    then of course the school system promoting this crap is also guilty
    but they specialise on brainwashing to the agenda so theyre not going to stop or fess up either

    of course if they werent using climate fears as an excuse for their habits
    it’d be one of the more usual abuse poverty or even spoilt rich kid got bored etc memes
    and yup some is really how they do hide from reality and sort of cope(badly ) for a while
    but too many just use the well worn lines they learn from the social workers and mates.
    cos its good in court when you get busted

      • Pedantically speaking, Brad, nobody alive knows for certain which was used. As both drink mixes were among the supplies at Jonestown either one, or even both of them, could have been used that day.

        • Way off topic. But actually, the KoolAid story wasn’t quite the full tale. According to the Chief Pathologist of Guyana, speaking at an international conference one year later, 80% of the bodies had needle mark injuries in their shoulderblades. They didn’t die from Kool-Aid. And if you actually look up what happened, 400 bodies were found the first day, and another 400 fled into the jungle to escape. The authorities searched for them thoroughly for a whole week without success. Then a breakthrough: they announced they had found them. Turns out, so they said, that they were under the original 400 bodies the whole time. Each of the dead 400 actually had another dead person underneath. They hadn’t fled at all. This will sound completely unbelievable if you haven’t heard it before. When I read it, in an article by John Judge in the 1990s, I went to the library to read for myself the original newspapers. To my utter shock, that is exactly what was reported.

          Obviously, it could not have happened that way, so something is very off about the Jonestown story. It was us who drunk the Kool-Aid, not the poor souls who died in Jim Jones mind control camp. And that’s the real metaphor for what’s happening today.

          • The only way investigators could have missed that 400 people were lying on top of 400 other people would be if all of the investigation was done from several hundred feet in the air. Anyone on the ground would see it immediately.

          • Not only that MarkW, they would have had to *not* move or examine the bodies for a whole week. really? leaving bodies lying around in a jungle for a week? pull the other one, it has bells on. As soon as they started movig bodies (such as so the pathologist could do the autopsy that revealed the needle marks, or to ship the bodies to loved ones back in the states, or just to give them a proper burial) they’d notice the second set of bodies beneath the first.

          • “Hokey Schtick November 8, 2019 at 1:51 pm
            80% of the bodies had needle mark injuries in their shoulderblades{sic}. They didn’t die from Kool-Aid.
            … and another 400 fled into the jungle to escape. The authorities searched for them thoroughly for a whole week without success.
            …Each of the dead 400 actually had another dead person underneath. They hadn’t fled at all. This will sound completely unbelievable …”

            So, all of the pathologists moved the top bodies enough to find needle marks between the shoulder blades; yet they failed to spot the dead body underneath?

            That’s the first time I’ve ever heard of blind pathologists working a case.

            Way off topic indeed. Another attempt to hijack a thread.

          • According to news reports at the time the needle marks where in the arm not the shoulder blades:

            The only evidence introduced during the 10-day inquest that indicated that anyone might have been injected with the cyanidepoison came fron Dr. Mootoo, who is the Guyanese government’s official pathologist.

            In a letter that was introduced to augment his oral testimony, Mootoo said “several” of the 39 bodies he had examined on the ground in Jonestown had needle marks on their arms. He drew on conclusions from this finding in his letter.

            and it’s possible those needle marks were from prior to the day of the “Kool-Aid” drinking:
            It is also possible that the needle marks could have been made by injections prior to the “white night,” of death. Some Jonestown survivors have told of injections of tranquilizers that were given to troublemakers and old people

            https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1978/12/23/guyanese-panel-rules-all-but-2-were-murdered/2ee4d8ab-a96d-432e-97cd-bbd5f0165d12/

            as for the body count, the actual sequence of events according to contemporary reports is the 400 number was “based on a rough count made by the Guyanese authorities who were first on the scene” that estimate was made before any bodies where moved. It was only when the US military were “packing the dead in plastic bags” to ship back to the states and were reaching the number 400 with “many more to go” that they realized that initial estimate that they were given was wrong.

            https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1978/11/25/370-more-bodies-discovered-in-jonestown/13d8632e-2d8d-41cc-9c03-7141c1c310bf/

        • John—

          “nobody alive knows for certain which was used”

          —OK, you’re right, nobody can say for sure, beyond a scintilla of doubt. But how sure do we need to be before we take action? To me, even 1% certainty is unacceptable.

          Uncertainty is not your friend. It’s just using you. You watch: when you don’t have anything it needs any more, it won’t even return your phone calls.

          I just don’t want to see you get hurt, John.

    • We shouldn’t really joke: this is going to happen sooner than later.

      Not that I want to happen at all, but I can only hope its useless old farts, and not anyone from Generation Tide Pod. Teen suicides tend to occur in micro-clusters and its hard to stop, especially with social media not helping at all.

      I think the only reason why we haven’t seen flaming suicides such as we saw in Viet Nam is because they haven’t figured out a way to find anything to douse themselves that is organic and flammable…

    • That would be a great way to show the sincerity of their beliefs, but it should be the elites that do it. They are expecting the poor to suffer from fuel poverty, never themselves.

  3. Sometimes I wonder whether doomthinking is just another fenotypical aspect subject to Darwinistic selection. If so there may be a gene for it. If so, don’t have your kids with any of them.

  4. See today’s London Times for a silly letter from members of the Royal Society and Royal Geographical Society saying that UK must show leadership and example and drive through a summit agreement next year to finally drive down emissions. It is beyond belief that such educated people can be so vilely stupid. They believe the world ends at the English Channel, have never visited a zero electricity community, have never checked out BP’s magisterial energy source forecasts, believe that anybody in the real world pays ANY attention to what the UK with it’s one per cent global CO2 does or will do. Here’s a prediction, bets? Any takers? The Glasgow summit will be the usual flop.

  5. Geoff Chambers recently tried to help Stuart Capstick (the tweeter quoted performing a non-consensual perineotomy on Jonathan Franzen) come to terms with his, ahem, water-pistol envy.

    Coming face to face with a leading light of Generation Why Bother Waking Up proved infectious for Geoff himself. He’s no climate desperado by any means, but he said people like Capstick “fill me with a feeling of despair.” Not for the atmosphere, as such, but for the human condition.

    Remember when Greta hissed indignantly:

    “You all come to us young people for hope!”

    This struck me as a near-perfect reflection of reality. Across the reality axis. We go to them young people for a laugh.

    But if you’re really jonesing for the opioid of hope you’d be better opening a copy of Malthus, Ehrlich or Rachel Carson than reading XR’s latest pronouncement. Generation How Dare You makes the early eco-prophets look like purveyors of the most irresponsible sort of escapist feelgoodery.

    Too pretentious to read fiction? That’s OK—the newspaper isn’t for everyone.

    Pour yourself a dessert wine and curl up with just about anything by H. P. Lovecraft. The best thing is, the whole family can enjoy the real-world exploits of Cthulhu and his pet goat Shub Niggurath. What better bedtime bromide for the the 6-to-12-year-old in your life who’s terrified of the light? Next time little Timmy—shaken and enuretic after another exposure to An Inconvenient Truth in Phys Ed, Math or Scripture class—insists on sleeping in pitch dark #BecausePolarBears, how are you going to parent your way out of that situation: by acquiescing to his electrophobia at the risk of validating the delusion that underlies it? Or by letting a good book open the door to a brighter, less godforlorn world?

  6. Source: https://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-law-of-unintended-
    Excerpts:

    The law of unintended consequences is the outgrowth of many theories, but was probably best defined by sociologist Robert K. Merton in 1936. Merton wrote an article, The Unanticipated Consequences of Purposive Social Action, which covers five different ways that actions, particularly those taken on a large scale as by governments, may have unexpected consequences. These “reactions,” may be positive, negative or merely neutral, but they veer off from the intent of the initial action. Merton also described five reasons why a “law” or change might fall under the heading of the law of unintended consequences.

    The two top reasons why the law of unintended consequences works, according to Merton, is that the framers of a social change are either ignorant of possible far reaching effects of the law or make errors when they develop a change that don’t have the effects they desired. Other reasons why we sometimes see changes occur after any type of event, new scientific development, or treaty is passed may have to do with “self interest,” so much so that a person who desperately wants to see a change doesn’t evaluate the ultimate effects of that change.

    The Doomers, Alarmists , Media, and Deniers are useful pawns.

    Years ago, JoNova posted numerous articles related to the idiocy which restricted farmers from clearing brush from their own farms. To what extent has that idiocy contributed to recent forest fires in Australia?

    Intended or unintended consequence? <– IMO it's both.

  7. Speaking of doom and somewhat off-topic, the movie “Blade Runner” is set in November, 2019. Now that we’re here, it looks like the rainy climate predictions were somewhat off.

  8. “Last September, a high profile Australian drug rehabilitation specialist testified to a government committee that climate despair is a significant factor driving young people to destroy their lives with hard drugs.”

    I like to ave a larf occasionally, but climate ceases to be a joking matter when people start destroying their lives.

    In Australia we’ve learned first-hand that mankind’s addiction to fossil fuels isn’t just a metaphor. And like all aspects of the climate crisis, it hits marginalized and indigenous persons and peoples first and hardest.

    Countless remote communities Down Under have been reduced to ghost towns, or rather zombie towns, by the epidemic of petrol sniffing.

    The most unforgivable thing is that #Exxon and the other Big Seven oil companies #Knew their products were addictive, and actually had armies of scientists on the payroll working on ways to get users *more* dependent. Perhaps the most cynical example was the day they added ethanol to their products in a move calculated to appeal to Australia’s alcoholic children.

    When I was a kid we had three choices at the bowser: diesel, leaded or unleaded. None of this high-octane Red Bull nonsense. And E10? E10? Gimme a break. If you wanted a cocktail you brought your own grog to the gas station.

  9. Geez, the Oz shrink says the kids are susceptible to hard core drug use because of the fear of climate change. And I am wondering what drug I could take to numb the absolute stupidity of having to listen at least 100 times a day everywhere to ..”we have to tackle climate change”. What guarantee is there that the weather will return to a blissful state if we just quit using fossil fuels? As if the weather was even ever blissful. The poor kids have been conned by the biggest deception in history.

  10. You don’t need anymore tipping points to convince me there’s no point changing my lifestyle so I’ve adapted with the inclusion of a modest camping/backup genny. I’ll wait and see with extra ammo for the trap gun plus the baked beans. No rush with the next tipping point milestone. Where are we up to 2030?

  11. “Last September, a high profile Australian drug rehabilitation specialist testified to a government committee that climate despair is a significant factor driving young people to destroy their lives with hard drugs.”

    This is a sign of mental illness since the evidence for climate doom doesn’t exist at all. It takes very little effort to find the evidence that the climate is not going into a DANGEROUS PHASE, heck there is NO increase in Tropic storms, hurricanes, Tornadoes, droughts and so on. The only increase I see is abject stupidity and the visible effort to lie to themselves about the world around them.

    These people never learned how to protect themselves from the lies and propaganda, which is why they are reacting in that manner. This is clear case of Human abuse being forced onto others.

    Many of these people need to throw the Television into the trash and get away from the streaming divisive, comformative propagandic media, who are the main source of fearmongering and despair with their ideologically derived lies.

    I have a TV, but I watch History, Discovery, Sports and National Geographic and little else, I certainly avoid soap opera, violent, and crime dramas, and the biased news programs. That is how I protect myself, is to first avoid reading their bullshit! in the first place, that is a sign of being mentally healthy, protecting my brain from the delusions of others.

    This is a sign that I am protecting myself from the torrent lies and propaganda, it is why I long ago stopped visiting warmist websites, as their illness is plain to see in their drivel they post. Why subject yourself to it, when you know their sickness is not worth reading as rational people realize being educated on the topics is only useful way to arm yourselves from their propaganda and lies.

    Do you closely associate with people who have Pneumonia, flue’s and other germ or disease based sickness that are contagious? Do your avoid the sources of lying propaganda vectors that only waste your time and irritate you? Do you avoid ugly, angry people?

    Think about it, why are there mentally sound people who are never found in drug rehabilitation centers, why they are not in jail or prison, or why they are never participating in destructive activities?

    The science fiction book, The Marching Morons, written back in the 1950’s, talks about a future where people lose the necessary critical thinking skills to understand the world around them and about themselves. Now it seems to be coming true as more and more people get stupider for many things that are not what they think it is.

    That is a sign of mental illness.

    We have seen manifestations of mental illness on the Mueller investigation farce, the current impeachment absurdity, which so many leftist democrats seems hypnotized by, despite the dearth of any hard evidence of impeachable offenses. The incessant lies and attacks on a lawfully elected President is amazing, yet many democrats are seething in their hatred of him.

    That is a sign of mental illness.

    I see it every day in how we build our cities, buildings and even homes that are so poorly designed, the sheer waste of street lights that destroys the night sky, that once moved humans to wonder, now it is a sheet of white in the sky. I now have to drive 15-20 OUTSIDE of the city to see the night sky with the 12″ F5 Telescope decently, yet the skyglow is too much to the south of my location.

    Humans grew up in nature, now they seem more and more at war with a part of it, cutting themselves off from the wonders nature and outer space provides. It is not surprising that more and more people are going insane, when they turn themselves into uneducated morons, when they don’t reach out to nature, they chose to escape into drugs and drink.

    That is a sign of mental illness over things that doesn’t exist. Hell I walk outside every morning and see no sign of danger at all, yet there are people with delusional hallucinations say it is already there, that is mental illness.

    I for one have a LOVE of nature, participating in Gardening, Deep sky Telescope parties and visit places of special nature spots such as waterfalls, snowfields and so on. It is a life where wonder and fun is maintained, there is no reason for the climate despair, that can only be a sign of mental illness.

    Only rational mentally sound people try to protect themselves, all others eventually get sick in some way, drugs, violent crime, drinking and other self destructive decisions that makes them unhappy or even sink into despair and depression. It is largely a failure to protect themselves from sick people and society they live in.

    • “Many of these people need to throw the Television into the trash….”

      I did that when my TV died. I decided to not get it fixed or replaced, just move on without it, read books instead, spend real time with a camera in the forest preserves around my area – LOTS of them – and see what things are really like. And guess what? The geese still take off for migration to the south at sunrise, then return in the very late winter to the ponds and lakes where they were hatched. The wildflowers still grow up and blossom. Bees still forage in the wild areas. Songbirds still come to my feeding station, and the squirrels still steal the peanuts I put out for them.

      There’s plenty of good food at the local markets, plenty of clean, fresh air and rain, wind and snow in those seasons. Occasionally, there’s a tornado or a bit of hail.

      The rivers and fishing lakes are still full of water and fish. So what was the problem again?

      Oh, that’s right: the Doom and Gloom crowd can’t see anything that isn’t on their tablets…. which is why I didn’t fall for that junk, either.

      • Good post, Sara. The truth is that of the people I know who get outside (horsemen, landscapers, gardeners, mariners, hunters & fishermen) NOT ONE has fallen for this alarmist delusional hysteria. But people that weather impacts during the 5-step walk from the lobby of their building to their Uber waiting at the curb, they can be sold anything because they honestly don’t know any better!

        It’s also becoming increasingly noticeable that the vast majority of college grads don’t have the slightest idea about biology–of plants, animals, or even (especially!) their own bodies. It would be laughable if not so pathetic. The most basic rules of Nature are unknown to them, therefore they can readily be sold anything from hemp oil to reiki to cryogenic fat freezing to Gwyneth Paltrow’s eggs! There are all stripes of witch doctors for pets now running around too, treating animals with pseudoscientific “cures” for non-existent ailments for thousands of dollars, and the more “educated” the client, the more likely they are to believe it “works.” No wonder “novelists” and “journalists” telling them the world is ending can actually gain traction. Our “elites” have WAAAAY too much money and absolutely NO real-world experience or common sense!

  12. Now I can see how if the OK Doomers lived in San Francisco or L.A., where when they step out of their abode only to step in human feces, they might feel the world is doomed. Otherwise, the doomers should take a break from their respective form of sadistic Social Media, and stick their heads out the window to see that the real world environment is just fine, and is not going to change in theirs and their great, great, great[nth] grandchildren’s lifetimes (after that, we may be slightly measurably into the next Little Ice Age; in which case they are doomed).

    • …we may be slightly measurably into the next Little Ice Age; – I hope so. I sincerely hope so. I want to see what happens when everything they depend on – all that electronic junk they hold so dear – is useless because someone hacked something and shut down all of them for 24 hours… in the middle of winter… with thundersnow… and snow deep enough to snowboard in the streets – Oh, wait, that’s something I’d enjoy. Okay, no street snowboarding, but all shops closed so that they can’t get their usual lahtays and can’t connect to anyone because the storms have taken out the WiFi transmitters – something like that.

      What???? I can dream, can’t I?

  13. Addiction is no laughing matter. It effects a very large part of the human population almost always with bad consequences. But addicts need very little reason to become addicted, all they need is access to what they are addicted to. They don’t use drugs or alcohol because of climate change or any other reason, they use them because they can’t help themselves.

  14. Climate Alarmist Scientists blew it from the start by abandoning normal civilized science debate (meaning tough and often ugly but “inside the ropes” conventional).

    The tactic of starting a debate with name calling IS THE OPPOSITE OF PERSUASIVE. And it normally disqualifies the name caller from further participation in scientific discussions.

    So they quickly moved away from science and into a political discussions which should try to be persuasive IF YOU WANT TO WIN the argument…but the name calling still predominated the “one way” discussion.

    Politically, they will lose the “shouting match” when energy consumers don their yellow jackets in protest of high energy costs. In the US, we can just show videos of the yellow jacket protestors…and miles and miles of tractors driven by Dutch farmers protesting fertilization regulations and economic ruin due to energy costs.

  15. Climate change is a double Kafka problem.

    Kafka Level 1
    The unintentional consequence of the solution to the Left’s fake CAGW problem, force massive spending on green stuff and the forced shutdown of the hydrocarbon industry, will destroy our economies and will make almost no difference in world CO2 emissions.

    The Left are waking up to this engineering and economic reality. For example, the Michael Moore promoted documentary.

    https://www.nationalobserver.com/2019/08/08/news/new-michael-moore-backed-doc-tackles-alternative-energy

    “It turned out the wakeup call was about our own side,” Gibbs said in a phone interview.

    “It was kind of crushing to discover that the things I believed in weren’t real, first of all, and then to discover not only are the solar panels and wind turbines not going to save us … but (also) that there is this whole dark side of the corporate money

    … It dawned on me that these technologies were just another profit centre.”

    The fact that green energy simply cannot be used to get to zero CO2 emissions is not new fact.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/11/22/shocker-top-google-engineers-say-renewable-energy-simply-wont-work/

    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/11/21/renewable_energy_simply_wont_work_google_renewables_engineers/

    In reality, well before any such stage was reached, energy would become horrifyingly expensive – which means that everything would become horrifyingly expensive … ….everyone would become miserably poor and economic growth …

    Kafka Level 2
    The Kafka twist is there is no AGW and we did not cause the CO2 rise and the solution does not work.

    Rather than spend a gazillion dollars on green stuff that does not work.
    There is a nuclear reactor design that was successfully tested 50 years ago and then covered up, that is mass produceable, six times more fuel efficient, and has no catastrophic failure modes, that can compete on initial cost and operating costs with the cheapest hydrocarbon power plant. A Canadian company Terrestrial has reached phase 2 approval for a new reactor design that is a copy of the optimum reactor design that was built and tested 50 years ago.

    From an engineering, economic standpoint, and political standpoint:

    A complete commitment to convert the electrical industry and the industrial heat industry to the new nuclear power is the win-win option to make the Kafka level 1 problem go away.

  16. Doomsterism is just an extremist version of Climate Belief, which has the hallmarks of a gigantic Super-Death-Cult. It is all based entirely on a fantasy, more or less of the false and ridiculous claim that our CO2 is “destroying the planet”. Honestly, how can any sane person look at these “die-ins” they hold, and not see that this is essentially a gigantic cult based on pseudoscience? The Cult of Calamitous Carbon attracts the emotionally unstable, and the weak-minded, filling their mush-for-brains with all manner of horrible thoughts. No wonder many go over the edge, into complete insanity.

  17. ‘Doomers’ — I like it!


    1. Climate change is dubious and irrelevant –> no point cutting emissions
    2. Climate change is apocalyptic and impossible –> no point cutting emissions

    Yup. Finally somebody gets it right. Cutting emissions enough to matter is not possible. Period.

    There is a book, “Drawdown: The Most Comprehensive Plan Ever Proposed to Reverse Global Warming”, edited by Paul Hawken.
    https://www.drawdown.org

    I have not read it, or even seen it. But here is a quote from a review:
    Two conclusions stand out after wading through Drawdown’s compendium of charts, calculations and conclusions. The first — no surprise — is that achieving carbon neutrality will require a commitment so complete, both in action and participation, that one really has to wonder whether we have it in us. The second, and by far the more troubling, is that populism — setting public policy according to their popularity amongst the constituency, i.e. climate change activists — is actually the biggest roadblock to reducing/reversing global warming. (David Booth)

    Scaring people into change isn’t going to work because if you make it scary enough you also make it sound too hard to fix (which is true, it is too hard to fix). (But it’s not broken, so don’t fix it)

  18. Of course it’s backwards to declare doomsday thoughts drive some to hard drugs. Anyone who considers hard drugs an answer is stupid as hell to begin with.

  19. Last September, a high profile Australian drug rehabilitation specialist testified to a government committee that climate despair is a significant factor driving young people to destroy their lives with hard drugs.

    Yeah, and why are these young people despairing? because the child abusing adults in their life have been feeding a lie about how doomed they are due to the non-problem of CAGW.

  20. Doom Quiz time:

    Who will be the Prince of Doom?
    Who will be the narrator of doom?
    Who will be the Ambassador to Doom?
    Who will be the money bag man for doom?
    and Who will be the political face of doom?

    answers: Charles, Sir David A. or Bill Nye, J. Kerry, Steyer, Warren or the Bern

  21. @Sunsettommy,Well said.
    Mutual Assured Destruction, that cloud hung over my imagination while developing into adulthood.
    Why worry about consequences when your world can disappear in a flash of madness?

    The current doom saying has the same power,some people trust the herd,usually truly nice kind gullible citizens. Others look at the mob/herd and then are repulsed by the madness.
    Suicide is a long term solution to a very short term illusion.
    We are all vulnerable to really bad ideas,that is the University of Hard Knocks.
    For this reason,my contempt for those who attempt to brainwash children, rises every year.
    And this new state religion,”Climate Cataclysm”, is appalling .
    For it offends ones intelligence on every front.

  22. This is off-topic, but I wondered if anyone else has had the same experience. A few months ago I put in an order for Rex Fleming’s The Rise and Fall of the Carbon Dioxide Theory of Climate Change. Then a few days ago I got an email from Amazon telling me that they had cancelled the order. Going out to Amazon.com, I found that the image of the book cover had the word “Retracted” in large letters above the title. (The URL is amazon.com/Carbon-Dioxide-Theory-Climate-Change/dp/3030168794) I then tried Springer, but encountered nothing but dead links when I tried to purchase the book. Any idea WTF is going on here?

      • Published in June of this year – and already out of print.

        I just checked the link I posted again, and it still says, “RETRACTED BOOK” – on the front cover above the title. I’ve never seen anything like that. (And there is nothing to this effect on Fleming’s website.)

        Interesting …

  23. If you don’t believe it is an apocalyptic global warming emergency, then what is the point of the rage?

    Doomsday Global Warminge belief IS a mental health problem, not an environmental one.

  24. Doom porn has a very negative effect on people, especially youth. I distinctly remember being all anxious and outright depressed over the “population bomb, limits to growth, cold war will go hot any time now and the ice age returning will mean crop failures”. In short “WE’RE ALL GOING TO DIE”. Over and over and over.

    Then I read “The High Frontier” by Gerard K O’Neil and that snapped me out of it. It wasn’t so much that his idea of building 2000+ times the surface area of earth from the material in the asteroid belt (all self sufficient) was correct. It was just the fact that it was possible and NONE of the “expert doomsters” thought of it.

    They had limited their thinking to current technology. A fatal flaw that they all overlooked.

    So to all the young people you meet who are depressed over this try to get them to take a break from reading or watching the news. It works.

  25. The Democratic party desperately needs a way out of the Climate business. If they just said the issue doesn’t matter because it’s too late and then just let the whole thing dissolve slowly they could get out. Otherwise I don’t see a way this religion doesn’t end the Democratic party permanently.

    The up side might be that there could be 20 or 30 years before we all forget to dismiss “world savers” right out of the gate.

  26. Facebook doomers? Just when you think that you have heard everything! Every time they post a stupid meme or a stupid post with 10 sad face emojis or watch a stupid youtube video, they are burning fossil fuel! This post that I am about to submit right here is no different than hitting the accelerator on my car. If you have no idea what I am talking about, congratulations, you have something new to learn about how the world works today and the relationship between technology and energy consumption. Let me give you a hint: The computer processing power (and expelled waste heat) required for all of us to watch cat videos is massive and these data centers guzzle massive amounts of energy! Let’s get real facebook doomers. If you own a smart phone or use a computer, you cannot claim to be climate crusader! Forgive yourself. You are already part of the problem so free yourself from the burden of carrying the hopes of humanity on your back. If Facebook doomers want to be part of the solution, they need to resist the urge to live their lives online (or go on a serious technology diet) because this is equivalent of driving a massive SUV.

  27. I grow weary of doomers. Fortunately, I can easily get away from them.

    Occasionally, though, just to mock them, I’ll make a comment along the lines of, “You’re right. Zero CO2 emissions for the US. But it won’t mean a thing if India and China don’t eliminate theirs. Let’s protest for a war to force them to comply. We’ll call it, the War to End All Warming.

    I don’t get any support for the protest, but at least they go away.

  28. Well, California and Germany might well be doomed with their irrational energy and immigration policies. If Canada or Sweden want to keep following them into that Abyss than that is what their majorities voted for. Trial and error is humanity’s oldest way of progress.

    India and China are not going down that suicidal path, sorry.

  29. “climate despair is a significant factor driving young people to destroy their lives with hard drugs.” No, just an excuse to do nothing with our life. The lack of spiritual connection/life is why people are losing hope.

  30. So now we have three groups
    Climate Deniers(1)
    Climate Realists(2)
    Climate Doomers(3)

    1. I don’t care much for consensus or models. Show me how to falsify your theory and I may give you a listen
    2. Danger. Just give us power, we will sort this out. capitalism has to go
    3. It’s too late. pass the dutchie from the left hand side

  31. What will be the backlash -if any- when Gen-Z wakes up -if they ever do- to the fact that CAGW becomes a widely acknowledged fraud -if it ever does?

  32. “She wanted to keep living her life as normal, and I wanted to freak out.
    And then we broke up.”

    Happens all the time.
    Too many drama queens turn red, puff up, rant, rail and harp about some miniscule minor point and the other person starts thinking “I’m never answering this character’s phone calls again!”
    “I’ll move without a forwarding address, if I have too.”
    “What a lunatic, How will they act and what will they do about a genuine problem?”

  33. Ha ha ha!
    I know the feeling, climate change destroyed my marriage.
    My ex-wife is a fully bought in ‘environmental scientist’ who works in things like environment planning and approvals and so had to professionally sign up to the whole climate change ‘story’ as part and parcel of being in the mainstream.
    I’m an engineer and have followed the ‘science’ closely and of course I am sceptical about most of the ‘science’. Apparently my genuine desire to openly discuss other perspectives ’embarrassed her’ professionally, it became a thorn, and combined with some other family stuff lead to the breakdown of our marriage.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *