SEE UPDATE BELOW – looks like the WSJ got punked.
From the broken promises department and the WSJ:
NEW YORK—Trump administration officials said Saturday the U.S. wouldn’t pull out of the Paris Agreement, offering to re-engage in the international deal to fight climate change, according to the European Union’s top energy official.
The shift from President Donald Trump’s decision in June to renegotiate the landmark accord or craft a new deal came during a meeting of more than 30 ministers led by Canada, China and the European Union in Montreal.
“The U.S. has stated that they will not renegotiate the Paris accord, but they will try to review the terms on which they could be engaged under this agreement,” European Commissioner for Climate Action and Energy Miguel Arias Cañete said.
The White House did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
White House senior adviser Everett Eissenstat unveiled the U.S. plan, according to an official at Saturday’s gathering, as Ottawa, Beijing and Brussels accelerate their joint effort to minimize the fallout from a potential U.S. withdrawal from the Paris agreement.
full story here
UPDATE:
Within 10 minutes of us posting this story, we got word from the WSJ reporter Ed Stokels that the White House has responded:
WH responds: “There has been no change in the United States’ position on the Paris agreement…”
“As the President has made abundantly clear, the US is withdrawing unless we can re-enter on terms more favorable to our country.”
That statement, from
@LWalters45, is a good reminder that Trump has always left this door open.
White House Deputy Press Secretary. Tweets will be archived.
Also:
NEW: WH officials say "NO CHANGE" on US position regarding Paris Agreement on climate change after report.
— Kelly O'Donnell (@KellyO) September 16, 2017
Tell me this fake news. Please!
It is, feel better?
I sure do.
Get scared! The fecal fan has detonated!
Nevermind…
(apologies to Gilda)
Actually the ‘door open’ is an awful reminder how Trump appears to be ready to use climate change.
I pointed this out the day it happened and everyone here was clapping like seals who had just been thrown a fish. His initial statement was clearly one aimed at doing a deal , NOT pulling out. If he had intended to pull out he would have done so with the stroke of his pen.
Sarah Sanders
✔
@PressSec
Our position on the Paris agreement has not changed. @POTUS has been clear, US withdrawing unless we get pro-America terms.
10:32 PM – Sep 16, 2017
my bold. “Unless …..”
What parts of the ‘deal’ would Trump wish to keep if he can negotiate? Apart from throwing inconceivable amounts of cash into the UN slush fund and cutting “carbon” what else is there?
One graphic says it all: Who actually pays the bills of the Paris Green Climate fund?
” according to the European Union’s top energy official.”‘
Why would anyone believe anything from the person who is ignorant of energy and either thinks we don’t need it or total green energy will be sufficient .
The European Energy plan is insane and not sustainable and he wants the USA to fail also.
No it is not dave it would have had to be ratified by Congress in years time, by when there would be a Democrat majority, or possibly some Republicans would see the light. dave, why would Trump be buying the highlands in Florida were it not for the fact that he knows that flooding has already become more frequent in Florida. Why put extra strong sea defences round his golf course in Ireland?
As to why is he stating the opposite. As an owner of several coastal sites do you actually think that he would talk their value down?
You lot keep on saying he’s a businessman yet you don’t seem to know the rules.
[??? .mod]
he is a businessman you idiot ,,,
Hi Mr. Ron, is your first name Mo…? The coasts of Britain are highly prone to erosion, have been for many thousands of years. You would know that if you had any common knowledge at all. Trump also owns extensive waterfront land. Here’s another fact for you Mo, we are at 400 PPM Co2, up 100 PPM since the little ice age which inc. practically all the industrial revolution and the increase in water vapor induced Co2 due to natural warming since then…the geologic average level of Co2 since life began on Earth is about 2,000-2,500 PPM. And nowhere in the geologic record, even when we have been at 8,000 PPM and more…no runaway global warming.
So Mo, bugger off back to your stinking socialist rats nest under mommies house where you will live until she throws you out, and leave matters of reality to those that can think for themselves and care not about your retarded groupthink conditioning.
And Paris would only have to be ratified by the Senate… if it was a treaty. In which case it would require a 2/3 majority.
Trump doesn’t need Senate approval to withdraw from the Paris agrrement. He doesn’t even need Senate approval to withdraw from the UNFCC.
Pulling out of UNFCCCP is his nuclear option. He can do it any time and only needs 12mo notice to pull out.
He may be avoiding making a clear move because the hope that he will not pull the plug means he has leverage. Once he makes a move he loses the leverage with Europe.
It’s a bit like EU pretending they were going to allow Turkey to join. ROTFL 😉
“Florida Highlands” that’s rather like saying “boiling ice” isn’t it?
Hi Ron,
Well he’s putting (pardon the pun) up the defence to protect his golf course here in Ireland because of the exposure of the coastline to coastal erosion. I assume if anyone was considering property in Florida, they wouldn’t want to buy in any of the flood plain areas where flooding has always been a problem.
Why does Gore buy beachfront property?
The sea level rise rate is unchanged around FL for over a century. Subsidence is also a factor. Sea level rise globally (a misconstrued metric for what it’s worth) is also nearly steady for centuries. And WE-CAN-NOT-AFFECT-SEA-LEVEL-RISE by carbon credits. (Pulls out hair)
Greg G, regarding Turkey, well unfortunately when you accept millions of immigrants, the majority of which have a very different and antagonistic culture, not letting them join NATO is of small consolation.
Regarding “the highlands in Florida:”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britton_Hill
I’m not much of a Wiki fan, but even they are good enough for this one.
I’m sure you’ll obfuscate with some Miami comment. They admit that they drained an everglade when the founded the city. The city has canals. They aren’t there as convenient places to ride around the city in boats. They were dug for drainage. No, I’m not going to give a reference for this one. I’ll leave it as an exercise for the reader.
Ron: Where are the highlands in Florida? And would you please punctuate?
When everything is political, everything is potential leverage. I’m never surprised at what gets floated in the process of going after a good deal somewhere, that’s what this guy is about. But it behooves us all to keep a close eye on things regardless.
Also the media’s insane overreaction to this presidency has taught me to never believe the first thing you hear from the mainstream press.
@Ron…if you were to take a look at Tides and Currents from NOAA, then you would see that the coast line where Trump’s golf course sits is and has been steadily subsiding. So planning for some sea defenses is a reasonable idea.
http://palacioinn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/MIAMI-BEACH.jpg
Florida highlands are on the left hand side of the picture.
I lived here from time to time. The Highlands is most know for Lake Wailes, a lake within Lake Wales. The high school goes by The Highlanders. They wear full Highlander Costume at their foot ball games. It is a very good community on the corners of Fl Rt. 60 and US Hwy 27 which finishes up in Chicago, I believe. You will also find Bok Tower behind the High School that I once taught at. Supposedly Bok Tower sets on the highest ground in Florida.
It is also the home of Spook Hill. It is a hill near the Highlanders that has reverse gravity. One parks on a flat stop and the reverse gravity pull you up hill.
There is a ridge, with much conservation and orchards beginning on the south end at Frostproof. I don’t have the geology on the area. Lot of sand and maybe old reefs. It begins to flatten out at Ocala. The area is rich in dinosaur bones and can samples be found at the Mulberry Museum in the old train station.
A lot of bass fishing.
I believe they found a sabre tooth tiger skull in one the many springs and evidence of primitive man in underwater spring caves.
So Highlands in Florida does exist, and its some 130 ft above sea level. I can see it rapidly increasing in value as sea level continues to rise, sorry natural cyclic erosion.
Looks like someone hasn’t been taking their pills…
Tell me… There’s another me!
David,
No more than the usual diplomatic weasel word double speak push and shove by the EU climate team. A junior WSJ guy fell for it and had to be bailed out by some more experienced colleagues in the update.
Just read the words carefully. Position has not changed.
FAKE news – McMaster (National Security Advisor) was on Fox News Sunday 17-Sept-2017 and said WRONG – the US is out (still out) of the Paris Accord….though he POTUS is always listening to revisit a better ‘deal’ for the US within this Accord.
Not having a WSJ subscription, a few more details would be useful. Could be fake news.
New York Times, linked from Drudge, today: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/16/world/americas/the-big-question-as-the-un-gathers-what-to-make-of-trump.html 3rd paragraph from the end, it says specifically and clearly that “Trump will NOT (caps mine) attend meetings on climate change.” Sounds like the schedule is set. Glad it’s his job and not mine, I’d die of boredom listening to all those do-nothing nattering nabobs!
…of negativism. Spiro Agnew, call your office.
The swamp has dragged him in.
Yep. He’s in the process of devolving into a swamp monster but, for reasons other than Obama’s Paris Executive Agreement… So sad.
The Wall Street Journal? Anonymous officials in the administration? And this is simply because we sent an observer to their meeting? Oh, and “The White House did not immediately respond to a request for comment.” That seals it right there! They had no comment!
Mr. Watts, really!?
Until now, I trusted the WSJ.
And perhaps I should respond a little less negatively. I had a rough week, is my only excuse.
Thanks for keeping an eye on things, Mr. Watts.
Nope WSJ is part of the fecal swamp
Anthony Watts
“Until now, I trusted the WSJ.”
We all make mistakes.
Anthony Watts
that didn’t read as I wanted it to. I should have said:
The WSJ is as entitled as the rest of us to make mistakes.
My mistake 🙂
(scot, care to walk that back any further? ☺)
While the WSJ is less often sucked into the fake-news whirlpool than most other papers, in part because their emphasis is business which relies heavily on facts, please do not forget that it is a Rupert Murdoch owned publication (as is the New York Post and Fox News) and there is a generational succession in play which does not bode well for future objectivity. The Murdoch heirs and their wives are strongly left-leaning, and the degree to which this will affect content and editorial stances down the road is unclear. Many on the right in the Northeast are not optimistic. At the end of the day, even the WSJ is put out by Big Corporate Media, with all the bias that brings.
” The Murdoch heirs and their wives are strongly left-leaning…”
Of course. They got theirs the easy way. Now, they can pat the plebes on the head, condescendingly promise they will be taken care of, and bask in praise for supporting policies that close off their ranks to the dreaded nouveaux.
That said, I’m not sure the WSJ news was ever particularly different from the rest of the pack. It’s just the editorial page that flies the conservative, pro-business flag.
WSJ has been corrupt for a long time now.
you should reduce that trust … (for the last several years especially) … they are Never Trumpers …
Anthony
See my comment to David M above. The WSJ is and remains kosher.
Tetris: ” The WSJ is and remains kosher.”
Kosher as in it reflects the Jewish controlled NY world of finance ? Or was that an freudian pun?
When Murdoch bought the WSJ, what was left of the old WSJ’s reporting and/or editing integrity went away. This was the MO for anything Murdoch purchased, and his reason for being. His job for The City was to sanitize any global MSM that might hint at the big picture truth, and to put them on board with the globalist’s agenda.
uk.reuters.com:
“Washington has said it would participate in UN climate change meetings during the withdrawal process”
See above, NYT states the exact opposite. General Assembly in town this week and Trump stuck there dancing the required kata, but there are supposedly no plans to re-address “climate” at this time. Folks, if we are EVER going to run it up the flagpole, LOUD AND SHRILL, that there is no need to “fight” a NON-PROBLEM, now would be the time!
MONTREAL (Reuters) – The United States attended a Saturday meeting of ministers from more than 30 of the nations that signed the Paris climate-change agreement, though the White House issued a statement saying it will stick with plans to pull out of the deal.
The Wall Street Journal reported that Trump administration officials said the United States would not pull out of the agreement and had offered to re-engage in the deal, citing the European Commission’s Miguel Arias Canete.
A Commission spokeswoman told Reuters at the Montreal gathering that Canete – commissioner for climate action and energy – had not said the United States had changed its position on withdrawing from the deal. The White House said that the report was inaccurate.
“the report” … which “the report” ?
I have to wonder if this has to have something to do with dealing with North Korea. Trump’s got to realize he’s going to need more allies and that he’s got to give up something in return. Just a guess.
Giving up a significant portion of GDP is not worth it. If everyone else wants to kill their economies that is fine.
What could our European allies offer us that we can’t do for ourselves, when it comes to the DPRK?
Nothing.
Our European allies barely have the military capability to defend themselves much less offer the US any meaningful military support
,,,and that is [their] catch 22….if they give us a deal….they will have to give everyone a deal…and that’s the end of it
my phone can’t spell…..their
who again will be opposing N Korean stuff ? Russia and China is it … no, he doesn’t need to give away climate chips to get support against the Norks
Russia and China are not opposed to North Korea’s possession of nuclear weapons. If the Chinese were opposed North Korea’s possession of nuclear weapons, then Kim Jong Un wouldn’t have nuclear weapons… if China actually has the influence they are believed to have.
Fox News reports that the White House denies these claims from EU sources.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/16/eu-officials-says-us-wont-reject-paris-climate-treaty-but-white-house-denies-statement.html
Dear folks–Trump has changed nothing. What we read in the “accounts” above is wishful thinking on the part of EU folk, as well as another attempt to discredit Trump. He said what he meant, and he meant what he said. Of course, he could change his mind; but he hasn’t. Pie in the sky from the Left; more botheration for the Trump administration to deny the latest rumors. Junk journalism, garbage diplomacy; disregard.
Sounds to me like some WSJ junior reporter over-responded in Pavlovian fashion to a cellphone “alert” and only read every fifth word, in his/her/its/their/zir haste to “get the story.”
This sounds like one of those international legal things that generates tariffs and such if you don’t.
Still, Washington’s move may prove a Pyrrhic victory for Paris Agreement champions. The U.S. is expected to significantly reduce its ambition to curb greenhouse-gas emissions, which would be in line with Mr. Trump’s goal of clinching “fairer terms,” the official said.
T’Heck with terms — For staying in? Get the heck out. That is the only acceptable terms that are available.
Trump’s most trusted advisers are leading him down a primrose path to be a part of the DC swamp. He will become a swamp critter who founders, flounders, flails and then in the end, fails.
Some of his personnel choices are beyond bizarre. He’s proving to even more inept than George W. Bush, and that’s really bad news.
I’m baffled that the FakeNews was so oblivious to his actual LIVE TELEVISED comments in June that they breathlessly published the EUSSR official “leaking” the exact same thing.
So reading the “leak” and the original, what’s changed?
In June, everyone sneered at “better terms” – the Accord was handed down from Mt Sinai on stone tablets. It can’t be changed.
Now the EUSSR has worked out that with the US out, their economy is destroyed. It’s taken 35 years but they now understand that activity flows from carbon pricers to non carbon pricers (with no change in global emissions). EUSSR closes steel mills, China opens them. For 35 years emissions went up.
So they worked out a face saving compromise: Don’t change the text of the agreement, but both in it stops the US changing its (non binding) abatement commitment.
It is consistent with their June outrage. They put it to the Administration which had no objection to the principle. An explosion of premature extrapolation followed.
This is fro0m the European Commissioner for Climate Action and Energy. They are desperate for the US to be a part of this deal, which is unraveling after the US announcement. I will wait for the Trump administration to clearly state what they are actually doing before becoming too concerned.
TCFD | Task Force On Climate-Related Financial Decisions
Michael Bloomberg, Founder & Chair.
Click on:
Supporters: as of June 29, 2017
Support through additional Initiatives and Organizations
Some big wind support at TCFD.
And others such as Richard Branson & David Blood.
http://www.fsb-tcfd.org/supporters-landing
G20, 2017
Re: Renewable energy
‘G20 Hamburg Climate and Energy Action Plan for Growth”, July 2017, 13 pages
http://unepinquiry.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Climate_and_Energy_Action_Plan_for_Growth.pdf
UN Environment
‘Climate Initiatives Platform’, which has many organizations
Browse Initiatives
Examples:
List includes:
Global Wind Energy Council, Brussels
Global 100% RE, which includes wind
Clinton Climate Initiative
Click on the organization names for more information and links to organization websites.
http://www.climateinitiatives.org/index.php/Browse_initiatives
http://climateinitiatives.org/index.php/Browse_initiatives
Correction:
http://www.climateinitiativesplatform.org/index.php/Browse_initiatives
http://climateinitiativesplatform.org/index.php/Browse_initiatives
Global CCS Institute / Publications
About GWEC / Global Wind Energy Council, Brussels
“GWEC and Greenpeace”
At:
http://pub.globalccsinstitute.com/publications/global-wind-energy-outlook-2008/gwec-and-greenpeace
Try:
http://hub.globalccsinstitute.com/publications/global-wind-energy-outlook-2010/gwec-and-greenpeace
Or internet search: “GWEC and Greenpeace”
Transcript of hearing:
Witness for the Prosecution (Enviroprofiteers, Inc.), European Commissioner for Climate Action and Energy Miguel Arias Cañete:
Counsel for Defendant USA: Objection. Hearsay.
Judge Wright: Sustained.
CFD: Bwah, ha, ha, ha, haaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
#(:))
*******************************************
Trivia for anyone interested
Definition of Hearsay in U.S.:
Elements:
1. Out of court
2. Statement
3. Offered to prove the truth of the matter asserted {by that statement}.
“The U.S. has stated that they will not renegotiate the Paris accord, but they will try to review the terms on which they could be engaged under this agreement,”
The crap is strong in European Commissioner for Climate Action and Energy – Mr. Miguel Arias Cañete
Could be a journalists understanding of Mr. Miguel Arias Cañete’s interpretation of the words of an unnamed person in the US governance/administration. Perhaps the words uttered by Mr. Jerry Brown, Governor of California, who Mr. Miguel Arias Cañete will meet today in New York. https://ec.europa.eu/commission/commissioners/2014-2019/arias-canete_en
But not a lot can be deducted from that. Looking at Mr. Miguel Arias Cañete’s biography at the same site, he seems like an unlikely watermelon poster boy candidate.
This is a classic ‘Art of the deal’ play.
Paris needs the US more than the US needs Paris.
Leak something to the Europeans and they fall for it.
Keep in while negotiating.
Make sure Obama’s billions are used in supporting clean coal in places like the Ukraine and gas in Pakistan.
The US then exports to these countries strategic energy, keeps them on side while fixing the balance of trade.
Man, I hope you’re right! I LIKE to think Trump is playing “Go” while the EU is looking for checkers.
Just getting ready for the UN meeting in New York City later this month? Put the pressure on Mr. Trump?
A question:
Obama bypassed Congress by issuing a bunch of “Executive Orders”.
Paris is an example. It was not a treaty. Whatever “fine print” Obama agreed to does not bind the USA.
Why can’t Trump, as the new Chief Executive, just cancel this and any or all of the rest?
What’s the Constitutional reason he can’t? (Assuming there was a Constitutional justification for what Obama pulled to begin with.)
President Trump,
The USA is not a business looking to make a better deal.
It is a Constitutional Republic looking to preserve the rights of the individual.
Just scrap Paris (and the other Obama Blunders).
Forget looking for a “better deal”.
Return us to the the best deal any nation ever had, The Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
Now read that again imagining Jimmy Stewart saying it. Good thought, GD.
The only interest the USA now has in “the individual” is making sure we all get our bar-coded ear tags and microchips in time for the Nanny State to dictate our every moment around the clock. If you think I’m kidding, go to RealClearPolitics and read that article about the electronic monitoring of truckers! Stuff to curl your hair.
MOTD, by Gunga Din.
nobody ever said it better.
He can overturn EOs. He just did by ending DACA, putting the ball in Congress’ court, where it should have been all along, and would have been had Obama respected the Constitution.
Giving us more favorable terms seals the deal…..they can’t do that
…it’s over
Short, simple, correct analysis. EU already said emphatically so once. Its over despite this new fake news.
Thank goodness fer that, EU swampies!
Glad yer got through Irma a/ok, Rud .
Exactly. How to kill a deal without killing the deal. Require something the other party can’t or won’t ever give over. “Hey, we gave them an option…”
ristvan,
Good to hear you’re OK after Irma, and that you were spared the worst of it.
“….the US is withdrawing unless we can re-enter on terms more favorable to our country.”
After Trump’s 180 in the Middle East and his apparently changing position on DACA, I wonder if the above is a “statesman’s” way to keep the door open for reentry?
What’s the motive for a re-entry to the Paris Accord?
Australia is back-pedalling, the UK is back-pedalling, the Chinese and Indians are paying lip service to it and most of the rest of the world is building coal fired power stations at a rate of knots.
It’s just clumsy political spin by a panicking EU that’s about to lose the UK whilst watching their precious Paris Accord fall apart at the seams.
why do you care ? you didn’t vote for him …
The “Climate Agreement” is not about climate nor is it an agreement. To be an agreement, it would have had to have been submitted to the Senate for ratification. It is not about climate either. It is about global wealth redistribution with the United States footing most of the bill.
Totally correct Phil.
The only reason for this charade was to bilk the US for billions of dollars.
Without the US there is really no reason for it to exist.
People need to keep SAYING THAT in the highest-profile ways possible; even if it costs you a few friendships with leftist snowflakes.
When I challenged the WSJ fact checker on the size of the payment from the West to the developing world they did not reply. Trump was right to say $100 billion a year, WSJ said 10. The authors of the so called “fact checker” preferred to stay silent to admitting a mistake – and that Tump had a point!!!
The reality is that the climate change we are experiencing today is caused by the sun and the oceans over which Mankind has no control. The Paris Agreement if fully implemented will do nothing to affect climate change. But even if we could hault climate change in its tracks, extreme weather evernts and sea level rise are part of the current climate and would continue to happen. There are many good reasons to be conserving on the use of fossil fuels but climate change is not one of them.
And yet the energy flu from the sun varies by less than 0.1%and is cyclic. So why have climate change at all. If it is solar variability that makes 280K X 0.7/1000 = 0.196K variation due to the sun’s variability. But we are getting more .
Total solar activity affects albedo which has a much larger effect than total irradiance at the top of the atmosphere. The oceans, a huge nonlinear thermal capacitor also play a very significant roll. The climate has been changing for eons and it clearly could not have been caused by CO2. Warmer temperatures cause more CO2 to enter the atmophere but there is no real evidence, only conjecture, that the additional CO2 adds to any warming. CO2 does not trap heat. A good absorber is also a good radiator so any energy it gains through LWIR absorbtion it also radiates away. In the troposphere, the primary heat energy transport is via conduction, convection, and phase change. LWIR absorption band radiation is not important. The AGW conjecture is based upon the existance of a radiant greenhouse effect caused by trace gases with LWIR absorption bands. A radiant greenhouse effect has not been observed in a real greenhouse, the Earth, or on any planet in the Solar system with a thick atmosphere. The radiant greenhouse effect is science fiction hence the AGW conjecture is science fiction as well.
You have to divide your 0.196 by 4 to get the correct number.
Ron,you like many others make the mistake about the TSI changes. It is specific wavelengths that changes a lot,NOT TSI itself.
But those changes are themselves cyclic, so have no trend.
So the Ron if you need to divide by 4 then the variability of the sun is minute. 2 questions why divide by 4? What does TSI stand for?
Thanks
Sunsetonme, I have looked upTSI and, please could you point to me an article as to what you are on about.Could you explain where you get the information that the wavelength of the sun’s radiation changes? Could you also explain exactly how changing the sun’s emission spectrum affects climate change?
Thanks
The Sun’s influence is more than TSI. There are many different aspects – infrared, ultra violet etc. and possibly more important the charged particles (solar wind).
The current low sunspot numbers affect the discharges of charged particles from the Sun and there are theories gaining traction that these interact with the Earth’s magnetic field which in turn can affect cloud formation by altering the amount of cloud seeding by GCR’s (galactic cosmic rays). By increasing/decreasing cloud formation the temperature of the Earth can be changed quite drastically with very little increase/decrease (percentage wise) in the Sun’s other outputs.
There is so much to find out about the Earth’s climate.
SteveT
If trump signs onto that craziness he might as well pack his bags.
WSJ is a pathetic rag, who resort to making up Nazi stories about Youtuber kids who have more subscribers than the WSJ.
WSJ like the Guardian will not be around for long, two dying rags
The marketplace is wide, WIDE OPEN in all media for conservatives, libertarians, or just plain good old constitutionalists to step into the breach left by dying “rags” and radio stations. Somebody like Bannon, O’Reilly, Hannity, Ingraham etc. need to get some backers and DO IT. There is money to be made–great hunger out there in the country for SOMEONE, ANYONE to validate we deplorables’ point of view!
Laura prefers “Ingram.”
I have a doubt about this huge market. The left is basically One Big Thing, the right is many small things. The essential element is herd or hive; if these concepts appeal to you then you are part of the Big Thing. If not, then not; but what does that leave? Many small things.
Let’s look at the recent DACA situation in order to appraise the value of a White House denial.
First, the Democrats and the MSM reported breathlessly that Trump would legalize DACA. Second, we got an official denial from the administrations’s spokespeople. Third, Trump himself was incoherently speaking out of both sides of his arse. And fourth, it turned out Trump did legalize DACA, just as the MSM had reported in the beginning.
If this pattern holds, then Trump will not pull out of the Paris agreement. He just makes some grunts of denial in order to keep the Ever-Trumptards yelling “MAGA” as he stabs them in the back for the umpteenth time.
ID, you have many painful lessons coming your way. MAGA.
wow, at least 3 outright lies or falsehoods in one paragraph … that is hard work sir … you should go back to your day job … nothiong, zero, nada has been done on DACA BESIDES TRUMP REVOKING it …
you never Trumpers really just can’t handle him can you … he lives rent free in your mind … (that makes sense given the small size)
’Dasein’. What a pun.
The rest of your trumparding is not as intelligent. Trump has it very different from Obama, and while American international politics changes surprisingly little from kin..president-to-president, Trump has something to give to his voters.
And it definitely is not a knife in the back.
You are the only one on this thread who has been paying attention.
As I have written before, until the EPA withdraws the finding of endangerment for CO2 nothing Trump (or anyone else) means anything.
Amnesty Don can flip on this like he has flipped on other things. All it took was one dinner with Chuck & Nancy for DACA, one dinner with someone else and we will be back in the Paris agreement, or maybe worse. We are only one dinner with Bernie away from Medicaid for All. One dinner with the Norks away from unilateral disarmament.
Trusting Trump is a completely unreasonable thing to do.
Totally off-topic . . . . sorry, but F1 World Champion Lewis Hamilton has told the BBC that he’s going vegetarian to prevent the “emissions of global-warming gases being produced by the amount of cows”.
Had to chuckle. Full story here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/41296229
But I guess it’s ok to thrash a V12 F1 car around Singapore circuit this weekend. Talk about high profile hypocrites not having any grasp of climate truths.
It’s a hybrid, turbocharged V6, not a V12.
Other than that, good comment.
Hamilton is a product of the millennial generation. Elitists who take everything they can and feel good about themselves because they separate their trash into separate bins, and imagine that humans haven’t adapted to eat meat over thousands of years.
And everyone has cancer and diabetes in their family somewhere, no reason to believe any of us are more, or less susceptible to any disease.
Recent research has demonstrated that the ink from tattoos causes life threatening conditions. Pity Hamilton didn’t think of that before he covered himself in them to satisfy his own vanity.
The wagging nannyfingers love to leave out the part that we now have the LUXURY of dying in our dotage of “diseases of civilization” because we’re no longer dying in infancy, early childhood or young adulthood of common childhood diseases, malnutrition, childbirth, pathogens caused by lack of sanitation, a broken leg or a rusty nail. Fat dumb and ugly that we are, but we’re STILL living longer every year! BTW, HotScot, loved your latest book and wish I was over there to knock back a few pints with you! 😉
Agree entirely.
But, my new book?
HotScot, you’re right. It’s been a while since I followed F1 in the ’80s when they were V8, V10 & V12 lumps. Should have checked.
@ Goldrider
September 16, 2017 at 6:01 pm
” Fat dumb and ugly that we are,”
Speak for yourself…I’m not fat (:-))
I am 🙂
So am I.
Soy gives me gas.
Sounds like genetically modified soy isn’t agreeing with your system. Would recommend not eating it.
Another reason, if that is possible, to ignore F1.
I thought he looked a bit miserable during practice.
I guess he has been blackmailed.
More.
Whoops! The second copy didn’t copy what I intended. Here it is:
The media pushing hope over experience once again.
DACA has been mentioned by a few people. Before this becomes Breitbart II, I’d like to remind people of something that then-candidate Trump said to Chris Wallace: “If it weren’t for me, you wouldn’t be talking about illegal immigration, Chris”. Nobody would be talking about DACA, or a southern wall, or about illegals streaming over the border, if it weren’t for Donald Trump bringing up the subject during a presidential campaign. Nobody would be debating whether-or-not to be in the Paris Accord, if it weren’t for Donald Trump deciding to pull out of the accords. He has faults, just like anyone else. But, he has led on bringing up these topics for discussion, against the will of most all of the politicians, whom we The People voted in.
So, rather than going by mere rumor, like the Wall Street Journal, let’s just wait for official announcements, and actual bills being passed and made into laws.
As I read the article, it was the EU top energy official who was the source. Given the bankrupt EU energy policy I wonder if he is a reliable source for anything.
“..U.S. wouldn’t pull out of the Paris Agreement, offering to re-engage in the international deal to fight climate change, according to the European Union’s top energy official.”
Mr. Obama made the deal, let Mr. Obama pay for it.
On a more serious note, the Constitution ought to be amended to limit the power of the Executive in making agreements to burden the U.S. without the consent of its representatives (such as they are). Such as, any agreements, accords, etc., are only in effect while the president is in office and must be renewed by every successor within 30 days of taking the oath or they become void.
The Senate didn’t ratify. The US is not and never has been part of the agreement.
What’s this Constitution thingy everybody likes to bring up now and then?
It’s the most brilliant document ever written. link Most people don’t appreciate how special is the United States of America. The Constitution is written with the realization that the foundation of America’s greatness is its people.
There’s the rub. The future of the nation is the responsibility of the people.
If the people drop the ball, the nation is doomed. America is for the people, not the elites, not the corporations, and not any special interest groups. All those folks who think they know better than the people should take The Donald’s election as a friendly shot across the bow.
Commie Bob
Well said, but the Democrats don’t like these constraints and are trying to do away with it along with the electoral college which was part of the Brilliance, Even Ruth Ginsburg and other supreme court members don’t like it based on their votes.
We dodged a bullet.
Obama pay for it? Y’don’t see his good buddy Branson mothballing his fleet of planes and rocketships, do you? Do as I say, not as I do . . .
This is Fake News in that the WSJ story is a repeat of what DJT said in the Rose Garden last June 1st when he declared that the U.S. was leaving the Paris Accord because the country was getting screwed by the terms of the agreement. However, he added that he was open to renegotiation. Don’t know what’s up with the WSJ other than it’s a globalist rag.
And UNFCCC and EUnsaid was was not open to rnegotiation. A brilliant Trump ‘resonableness’ maneuver. Game, set, match. This is fake news.
Hear, hear.
Trump has enough to do, without inflaming the media etc any further than necessary.
Leave the ball in their court.
Give the impression that they are the ones being unreasonable.
SteveT
It’s a slow news week without a hurricane, so they recycle stuff. Friday afternoon the lib media was busy wetting themselves all over again about Trump calling Sessions “an idiot”–last MAY. The annoyance factor listening/reading to them now outweighs any possible “information” one might thereby gather.
huffsplaining and the daily hate are truly becoming a bore.
This is getting way too sketchy.
The climate obsessed are better organized, control nearly all parts of the public square and are fanatical in their tenacity.
No matter how many holes are poked in their apocalyptic claptrap, few if any are willing to admit that they have been wrong.
What scientific holes are you talking about ?, certainly none that exist outside the denierbowl.
If there were viable counter evidence in the real world it would have floated to the top by now.
It is all very simple for you, WTF. Rely on the IPCC approved models, and automatically reject any cracks in the edifice. Michael Mann is still authoritative on paleoclimatology, and that Chinese study just cannot count, as it is doubleplus ungood. Rely on the surface temperature “records”, despite there being so many infills they outnumber actual records.
If one wants to be a True Believer, just keep on doing what you are doing.
So True. Plus, any thing to the opposite has been pulled from the curriculum long ago.
Tom,
So why are you keeping this dynamite evidence to yourself ?. Submit an article for peer review and be done with it.
I’m afraid that unless he get’s more constitutional conservatives around him in his cabinet, that he will cave in on “climate change” just like he did on these other examples….
1. Day one – I will back out of the Iran deal – it’s a bad deal.
2. I will build the wall – not funded, not even started.
3. Illegal immigrants will not be allowed to stay – DACA???
4. I will repeal Obamacare…
5. I will lower taxes for all including corporations and small businesses – not in the cards…
6. Other promises – just add it to the list here, He is turning into a democrat, which he has supported throughout his life…sorry…!!!
Yup
JPP, you hope for too much, too fast. Unrealistic. Let the Trump game proceed, grasshopper.
Let’s hope you are right…(he was going to shut down the government unless they funded the wall) – Reagan shut down the government at least 6 time to get what he wanted, and he had a democrat congress to deal with…
Most of these republicans are RINOs – republicans in name only.
I bet JPP can’t snatch the pebble from your hand.
“It is said the Shaolin can walk through walls–but the person who said that is not Shaolin.” 😉 Trump’s unorthodoxy and lack of beholden political relationships is his strongest suit, and I’m not counting him out yet. Keep the faith, MAGA!
The Rios you voted for have blocked all these promises. You may need to brush up on how gov works. You can’t build a wall without congress passing a bill to pay for it and half the swamp dwellers are Republicans. Ditto, Obamacare, etc.
Not many businessmen are commenting here! Leaving “the door open” on climate change – this is a strategy I won’t bother to flesh out for you (hint:don’t do anything for now because you don’t have to) Embarrassing the GOP leaders with “negotiations” with the Dems (now go into your base with rallies and shake up things for the GOP incumbents that won’t vote your agenda in – do you guys want to be responsible for allowing lefty compromises?). Even the “deal” with Dems was prefaced by a canceling of DACA and that shook them into wanting to work with Trump. The deal. That’s all he knows. Start with that piece of intelligence and one may begin to get somewhere. Relax (except for harassing the GOP holdouts you voted for who haven’t done a day’s work since the slipped into the swamp.)
RINGS, not rios, sheesh!
#$&$&RINOS!!! Android or Samsung are illiterate idiots. They don’t know the names of countries, cities, topical words, common nouns…. Yargh
Yes, I might need to “…brush up on how gov works”.
But you (and a lot of current republicans) might want to read Reagan’s principles 7 to 11:
Reagan is dismissed too easily these days regarding how government works.:
http://www.theblaze.com/news/2014/03/03/the-11-principles-of-a-reagan-conservative/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_1984
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_1980
give it a rest … you are no constitutional conservative … just another Levin groupie … you really don’t understand our system of government do you … plus you didn’t vote for him and you don’t want him to succeed so your opinions really don’t matter much 🙂
I’d rather be a “Levin groupie” than a Bernie Sanders groupie…
Trump is in….then Trump is out. Then he’s in, then he’s out. Sounds to me like something he’d be doing to Melania.
Subversion from within? Perhaps. That’s how we realized our present state of progress: diversity, rites, prophecy, etc.
The U.S. has stated that they will not renegotiate the Paris accord, but they will TRY to review the terms on which they could be engaged under this agreement,” European Commissioner for Climate Action and Energy Miguel Arias Cañete said.
Why waste time on a no nothing statement like this – The media would be far better to say Miguel is indicating that they will cave in to Trumps demands! That would spice things up and sell more papers even though it means the same thing.
Dont TRY — DO
Speaking of Paris…
Zero Hedge commenter Boris Alotovkrap expounded on this very issue a couple of years ago. In his own unforgettable words of wisdom that will be forever etched into my mind, no amount of brain bleach can ever erase it (nor can Hillary). Even boobs take second place…well, that’s a toss up but some fellow said something similar on tee vee the other day and I am in agreement…
“In cave in rural France is painting circa 5000 BC, and is tell story. One day is rain much and lightening is loud and scary. Leader of cave community is explain danger of lightening and is predict end of world if citizenry is not work hard for stopping of lightening. Every citizenry of community must bring it portion of berries and meat for sacrificial god and make incantation. Leader of cave community is so very smart, is not help hunt and gather, but is must make strategy and “guide” community for self-preservation technique. One day, citizen is look up and see is still lightening, but is look around and is still alive. Other is still alive. Lightening is come and go, and community is survive. Citizen is make comment at cave meeting and next day is fall in tar pit.
Leader of cave community is explain danger of tar pit and is predict end of world if citizenry is not work hard for prevention of tar pit…”
——–
That was worthy of a medal of honor, a nobel prize and a pardon if Boris ever needs one.
Memo to President Trump: NO DEAL on the Paris Accords. As you can clearly see by historical data presented above by Boris, and permanently etched in stone on the cave walls in France, which by millenia supersedes tree ring data without adjustments deserve priority consideration. This fraud and data manipulation must be stopped.
http://joannenova.com.au/2017/09/too-late-bureau-of-met-buys-time-with-a…
The poles flip flop every few million years, and that is a provable geological given, but we elected you to do differently and trust you stay true to your words.
Just Germany and Japan in WWII. MSM and IFCCC-IPCC attempts to invent Fake News, get caught.
I heard his speech last couple of months. The main point is he would have to give up a lot of contacts, international contacts he will need later. Not a good time to be a hard nose. As for his ocean properties, he could sell it as well as use. it. Pulling out is like a divorce and in international relations a terrible thing to happen. Renegotiating our positions could be beneficial. Didn’t you hear the press secretary, Hurricanes are in decline and our climate is cyclic. Get the whole picture.
President Trump has good reason to have very little faith in the fractured Republicans with people like John McCain who would rather undermine Trump than support Republican long standing promises to fix health care .
At least the Democrats realize the only way they get what they want is to do what Republican’s can’t . Namely work in unison and don’t let Excellent get in the way of very good . At least something doable .
Republicans seem content with in action and furthering long standing peeing contests . Forget the public and the public will forget you . Just ask the Clintons and their fake green backers .
Dear Bemused Bill at 6:36 pm. The golf course in question is in Count Clare which is NOT in Britain. It’s an other island. Its in a different country. As to erosion of shores, dune formation is the deposition part of the cycle. They generally grow where the coast has been advancing. For example Harlech castle built in the 13th century in Wales (now that is on Britain) has sea doors yet in the 21st century there is some half a mile of sand dunes from there to the sea. Trump’s planning permission stated that the wall is needed due to global warming and sea level rise.
Independent ( not the Irish Independent) 7 Dec 2016
By the way, Bill , your resorting to personal insults would indicate that you did have the recourses to a valid argument.
No mention of sea level rise here in Irish Times, just normal erosion. One of the objectors is a surfers’ group which suggests some decent waves.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/donald-trump-firm-abandons-plan-for-10m-doonbeg-sea-wall-1.2895232
You may recall this excellent debunking of fake claims about erosion on North Sea coasts and elsewhere.
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/08/28/climate-change-threatened-shishmaref-town-on-sarichef-island-lessons-from-vlieland-and-schokland-in-the-netherlands/
Nigel S The global warming and sea level rise was in Trump’s submission has been reported widely in other news reports, e.g. Politico 23 May 2016 has a copy of the submission.You clearly need to be better informed read a bit more.
Do recall that when renegotiation of Paris is mentioned, the EU flatly rejected any change to the agreement whatsoever…..
It should be obvious the campaign to enforce “order” at the White House by the liberals is succeeding. By that it means taking away Trump’s control of the news cycles. By mostly ending his Tweets, you’ve seen an increase in unnamed sources directed toward separating Trump from his base.
Making Trump “conform” to “Presidential” means he’s becoming like Bush the Second and will become a media victim on a scale worse than Bush. And all aided by the usual left wing trolls.
Yes, very reassuring. Assurances given by various Trump officials are very credible indeed. Remember that Mike Flynn never talked to Russians about abolishing sanctions: Vice president solemnly said it on TV. Remember James Comey fired because he was too mean to Hillary, solemnly declaimed by every Trump official for 24 hours until he himself went to Lester Holt’s interview and said it was because of Russia investigation (and then confirmed it, just in case, to his Russian buddies in the Oval Office). So now you desperately want to believe what some “Trump official” says about Paris accord. But deep down you know you’ve been had and he will make you look stupid, as many times before.
That is one of the dumbest comments I’ve ever read, and I’ve read quite a lot of them. Where do people like you come up with this stuff? There is nothing true in anything you wrote. I hope you aren’t always this delusional, but if you are seek adult assistance.
These EU-officials obviously have nothing else to do but to spread disaffection and Fakenstein’s horror news. What can one expect from unelected distortionists who won’t forget that DJT has been elected in a democratic way and they themselves have not?
The WSJ’s report seems to have WH economic advisor’s Gary Cohn’s signature written all over it. Gary Cohn, the former Goldman Sach’s executive, is a believer in CAGW, and I believe he argued in favor of staying in the Paris agreement. [Funny how people who don’t actually make or build anything (insurance institutes, lobbyists, investment bankers, hedge fund managers, politicians) are the biggest supporters of CAGW.]
Before taking the WSJ article too seriously one should listen to the 60 minutes interview with Bannon (easily found on Google). When asked about the leaks out of the WH Bannon named one leaker by name: Cohn. This interview should restore some faith in the Trump administration.
Stock market people see great investment opportunities with the AGW story line. The monetary aspect easily overrides sceptical questions on the subject. Wall Street is drooling over the potential trillions of dollars which would flow from all out war with CAGW.
Not Wall Street.
The City.
It’s The City who profits most from war . . . owned by a small inter-related private international banking cabal that owns The City, the Vatican, Washington D.C,the UN, and the 150 central banks that control the world’s paper money for all nations who profits most from war. They finance both sides during wars at exorbitant interest rates. It is their most lucrative enterprise. The winner is shackled with indefinite high interest payments directly to the cabal, and they get first choice of the loser’s spoils to satisfy the loser’s contractual loan obligations to these bankers.
Instead of constantly whining, maybe some you Anti-Trumpers should think about how things would be if Hillary had won…….Things that make you go Hmmmmmmm….
>>Ooops…”some OF you”… D’OH !
Hellary Clenton? The US would certainly be fecked up.
Why would anyone believe the MSM anymore? It’s either op ed, flat out misinformation, or selective/biased reporting. The MSM has been bought and paid for by the same cabal that pushes CAGW. This is the “New World Order” being pushed by the UN.
100% correct.
Nigel S the story that Trump quoted global warming is reported in several other titles eg Polotico 23 May 2016.
The fact that dunes are being eroded indicates that a region of deposition now has become an erosion zone. This indicates something has changed, climate, and or sea level
A change in sand deposition is likely due to shifting ocean currents, and/or surface wind patterns.
No Trump, in his submission stated it was global warming and sea level rise!
I know what was stated, but that has nothing to do with the fact that the coast line along that stretch is subsiding. Trump has little to no understanding of the details of “why”.
Funny when the 5 th estate takes back control of the White House the leaks magically stop .
The President can’t do anything with the traitors in his midst so why not work with the
Democrats but my oh my how quickly they can all agree to bump up the public’s credit card limit .
Tillerson is a Paris cheerleader and carbon tax enabler make no mistake about . Does anyone think Enron wouldn’t agree to another tax to shut greens and globalists up ? …. For awhile.
Most people dont know,i only heard one time that a journalist sayed it in german tv.He sayed China,India,Russia,Turkey speak only if they do the “Climate Deal” but when you really hear what they say they will do NOTHING!
“Actually, Trump owns several other properties in Highland County [Florida]”
yoursun.com/sunnews/sebring/12256835-699/story.html.csp
My metric is the WWII cartoons poking fun at Goebbels et al. Our current, crazed media groups appear to be in worse shape, louder and more obnoxious, than they were in the middle of the war, when our cartoons were made.
We have the delusional unreality of Baghdad Bob in spades.
The thing to remember is that there will NOT be anything honest reported on Trump or Climate Change in the mainstream press – the way they shoved Climategate back up into the horse should be evidence of that.
Simply take into account that every mainstream news story is being brought to us almost unanimously from the perspective of ‘destroy Trump.’
They’ve tried the stones, the smears, the slurs – they’ve blurted their hatred in a thousand ways. Now, having started to gain control of themselves, they are attempting more insidious (and potentially more effective methods), and that is to separate Trump from his base – a method they’re using on this and other issues, with false media reports that Trump is caving on this or that.
That’s the value of those Tweets – he can confirm or deny without the intrusion of the press.
One of the things that makes Trump effective is that he makes people show you who they are – and I think we can say with confidence (what we here already suspected) is that the Republican party was simply giving lip-service to the issues they ran on, and now have become the ‘palace guard’, protecting all the Progressive agenda issues that their bean-counters have been exploiting. They had no intention of acting on any of it – absolutely proven in the last several months, as the GOP’s actions have amounted to nothing less than sabotage.
My only off-note on Trump, so far, is that he might still be operating on that entrepreneurial optimism that ‘everyone can win’. But I’ve come to the understanding that, in the political world (as opposed to the business world), that’s not really what the players want – he CANNOT win over Progressives – their hate is rigid, predetermined, and absolute.
But he can play the establishment totem poles against each other. And at this point, he has to, in order to break through the deliberate stasis and stalling tactics of his own party.
As a supporter, I’m watching what DOES happen, rather than worrying about what the enemy-action press tells us is going to.
He is buying up land in Highland county Florida. That is the highest part of the Florida peninsula. He has been benifiting a lot from insurance damage claims to Mar a Lago ie climing for damage not to repair costs . He wants a sea wall between his golf course in Co Clare.
To anyone this looks like a man who is well aware what the projections on sea rise can do.
Similar such stories also crop up now and again at the BBC. The authors often include one of the usual BBC suspects, people too dyed-in-the-wool to actually believe it.
Notwithstanding that their regular abuse of truth and accuracy actually compromises their own ability to separate fact from fiction, I suspect there is a different explanation: They are trying to give their loyal readers some kind of a meaty climate ‘win’ story where in reality there is only a very thin gruel these days . Of course this is made that much harder by the continual demonisation of Trump in most other spheres. This is why the stories appear so incongruous, a bit like “Why nutritionists say pork bellies are the new wonder food” and “Market analysts go long on pork bellies stock”. It’s partly clickbait and partly just a Hail Mary story, hoping that if they say it is true then it will actually become true because it worked with persuading people about some other things in pop culture.
Goldmine 12 :59, wow the coast is sinking at Doonbeg!, it has been going since the ice age! The report last year from Durham university showed that the sinking due to postglacial readjustment in this region had SLOWED DOWN. So these dunes were fomed during a period where the subsidence was greater but are being destroyed in a time of weaker subsidence, so the change is not due to subsidence but due to rising sea level and/ or increased storm energy. ie global warming. Try looking at the skeptical science website. It has a tool that allows you to see for your self the rise in temperature that has been recorded through the world.
You no longer have to rely on cherry picked stations that show thar a singLe point in the mid West desert was hotter in the 1930s than it is now.
Let’s put it this way Trump is buying land in the highest part of the Florida peninsula . I think he has access to beer advisors that you have or I have. Take the old adage “Follow the smart money”