Repeat after me… I [state your name]

Hilarious video clip of climate crusader turned opportunistic occupier Bill McKibben leading a flock of protestors in chant.

It reminds me of this classic scene…

h/t to The Daily Bayonet who named McKibben “hippie of the week”. Kenji got props too.

BTW, those wiggly five fingers in the air you see behind McKibben are “twinkles”, which is hippie sign language for “I agree”.

 

 

Advertisements

126 thoughts on “Repeat after me… I [state your name]

  1. Sounds like a priest leading his congregation in prayer. Can anyone doubt that we are witnessing a new wave religion, with gaia paganism at it’s center. Are any of these followers capable of speaking and thinking for themselves. Like the Hare Krishna(s), protein starvation (vegan diet?), seems to be an element affecting cognitive capacity. Warmist have finally filled me with alarm, for the future of a liberty enabling civilization.GK

  2. Now Now Be Be Nice Nice! No no Calling Calling idiots idiots idiots idiots!

    “BTW, those wiggly five fingers in the air you see behind McKibben are “twinkles”, which is hippie sign language for “I agree”.”

    And here I thought it was the secret salute of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster….

  3. Oh lord, I am so glad that I am hundreds of mile from this nonsense. On the other hand, being there to heckle this crap, could be a moment of destiny for the right person…

  4. WTF?

    Are you guys in the USA not just a little bit embarrassed by this?

    Wow. What a moron.

  5. I thought the twinkle is a sarcastic comment in sign language meaning “Ooo la la, fuddy duddy” as said by Ralph Cramden.

  6. If it’s true that the company building the pipeline got to choose who conducts the environmental review, then I believe that has to be changed. I find this similar to- let’s say- conducting an investigation into Climategate without consulting a skeptic, to name an example.

    Also, that is 1.37 rallies a day, which makes me think that the term “rallies” is being used rather loosely.

    On a funnier note: after overhearing the video my girlfriend (who is liberal and doesn’t hold any strong views on climate change) turned to me and said, “Is that a parody?” I feel that sums up the way I feel about McKibben nicely.

  7. I got as far as the rigged environmental impact statement. So this Bozo is upset that they hired a consulting firm, they had used before, to do the environmental reports required by the government? HMMM, been doing that for 3 decades.

    Yes, Tbear, we are a bit embarrassed by this. We are a lot more disgusted with the way the press and the pols are handling it.

  8. This is all very good news.
    The lunatics are exposing their insanity to the world like never before. With the ease of immediate and global sharing they are quickly moving beyond losing all respect and credibility. With this obviously happening more frequently, by more of them, they are entering the foyer to the institution of the absurd where history will hold them forever.

  9. Raise your right hand, open your wallet and repeat after me: – “Help Yourself”.
    BBC Radio, Goon Show: “Tales of Old Dartmoor” (I think); 195(?).

  10. That 5-finger “I agree” looks very similar to what people in gospel churches do when they’re agreeing with the preacher, by the way.

    This is not to say that there are any similarities between political indoctrination and religious indoctrination. Why would I imply that?

  11. Bill McKibben, the man who helped convince Julia Gillard to introduce the Carbon Tax. This country is in deep do-do’s.

  12. I’m as down on McKibben as the next person, and don’t buy the global warming myth, but still there is this to consider: A story that got buried said that the authorities wouldn’t let these people have bullhorns, so that is why they resorted to the bizarre cult-sounding repetition. They can’t be THAT out there, can they?

  13. This is hilarious. Judging by the accents I hear it seems that once again American jobs (parrotting speeches in this case) are being outsourced to immigrants.

  14. As mentioned on another forum (possibly smalldeadanimals) the chanting masses act as a megaphone for the central speaker. Assuming that there’s more than 20 of them, it will help the folks outside the inner prayer circl……er, group hear what the main speaker has to say. Regardless, it still reminds me of Hu Bris’ link more than anything else.

  15. Is there an anti or negative “twinkle”? If so, would it put you at risk of a repeatative strain injury?

  16. I watched 21 seconds of it before I couldn’t take it any more. They were doing OK until they had to recite: “…that the company building that tar sands pipeline…”

    And why is the guy to McKibben’s left not joining in the chants? He looks pretty serious – maybe he’s too cool to chant.

  17. If the pipeline gets built, it is “game over for the climate,” says McKibben. And this is the conclusion of the objective scientists, he states.

    Wow, one large infrastructure project and the climate is doomed. It is not even about rational argument anymore . . .

  18. So, what was gained by having the audience repeat the gospel according to McKinnen? Learning device? Help keep the audience awake? Bill just likes to hear his words? Make the You Tube clip twice as long?

  19. I tried to watch it all – honest. i couldn’t take more than 1 minute 20 seconds of it. It’s toe curlingly awful – a bit like the “Borat” movie.

  20. The most disturbing and perplexing thing about this whole group is their primitive GROUPTHINK where the “leader” recites and the others repeat.

    It is really bizarre. And apparently endemic among their species. They are doing it all over.

    [Personally….I don’t give a f*** as to how GOOD a speaker you are. Don’t care if you are Henry the 5th or Churchill. You recite….and I am NOT going to repeat afterword. Just not gonna do it.]

    Observe the same weird phenomenon in DC recently. PS this video is also funny.

    Get ’em Adam.

    Chris
    Norfolk, VA, USA

  21. G. Karst says:
    October 16, 2011 at 8:12 pm
    “Sounds like a priest leading his congregation in prayer. Can anyone doubt that we are witnessing a new wave religion, with gaia paganism at it’s center. Are any of these followers capable of speaking and thinking for themselves. Like the Hare Krishna(s), protein starvation (vegan diet?), seems to be an element affecting cognitive capacity. Warmist have finally filled me with alarm, for the future of a liberty enabling civilization.”

    I happen to be fond of many pagan traditions, and I also favor vegetarianism because I don’t like contributing to the suffering of animals. To speak so disparagingly of paganism is bigoted and unjustified. If Christians and others who ridicule pagans or treat them like devil-worshipers bothered to research their own traditions, they might discover that almost none of them originated with Christianity, but with the very pagan religions and cults Christians later attacked and wiped out, ushering in the Dark Ages. Krishna was one of the models for Jesus; his mythological history provided many of the elements of the Christian gospels. So did Mitha’s. So did Buddha’s. In the field of astrotheology, these “beings” all represent the same thing.

    Yes, the global warming scare has turned into a substitute religion for crazy people, but don’t try to disparage it by labeling it pagan. These are not real pagans; they’re political activists cashing in, and wouldn’t know a genuine pagan teaching if someone shoved it down their throats. And in case you missed the news, the current Pope is a True Believer in AGW.

  22. savethesharks says:
    October 16, 2011 at 10:22 pm

    ahaha, really? they’re in a public place and they don’t want to be filmed? That’s hilarious.
    If you’re embarrassed about how absurd your behavior looks to others, don’t behave that way in public. They act like Cops who have something to hide. This is supposed to make me feel like these people believe in freedom?

    What a joke these people are.

  23. WUWT gave a link to “Occupy Wall Street” a couple days after it began. (It was in a comment.)

    I followed that link and have watched the movement ever since with a sense I was following something much bigger than a few crazies tripping.

    The crazies are there. There is also something much deeper which is having an effect which could become momentous.

    Today, Krugman in the N Y Times appears to be saying much of what I feel.

    Laugh, sure; but keep up with it just in case it is history in the making. You would not want to miss that.

  24. Re Borat

    It would be really funny to have Cohen make a parody of climate nonsense. There is SO much material available! “Borat Goes Green.” Maybe it would be better for a certain Austrian fashion personality to take on this subject. It is after all, fashionable in some circles.

    PS Loved the reference to “Beyond the Fringe” above. Ah, memories. “So you want to know about the Wa-ar….”

  25. They say they have to do this because the police outlawed using voice amplification….but I could swear I saw a video where they used both voice amplification and this.

    Creepy brainwashing cult.

  26. One more time, the repetition is to pass the message out to those who wouldn’t otherwise hear the speaker because they weren’t supposed to use bullhorns. They’re still idiots but not chanters. I wonder if, like the game “telephone” the message changes with each wave of repetition. It might be interesting to hear the last iteration ;)

  27. McKibben has been relying on his Global Warming Weather Rock again.

    If the rock is wet, it’s raining (due to AGW)
    If the rock is swinging, the wind is blowing. (due to AGW)
    If the rock casts a shadow, the sun is shining. (due to AGW)
    If the rock does not cast a shadow and is not wet, the sky is cloudy. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is not visible, it is foggy. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is white, it is snowing. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is coated with ice, there is a frost. (due to AGW)
    If the ice is thick, it’s a heavy frost. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is bouncing, there is an earthquake. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is under water, there is a flood. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is warm, it is sunny. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is missing, there was a tornado. (due to AGW)
    If the rock is wet and swinging violently, there is a hurricane. (due to AGW)

  28. Why did anyone think it was a good idea to take a routine from the two biggest comedy films of all time and assume people hearing it would take them seriously?

  29. WOW! Unbelievable! This guy (and his followers) are completely crackpots.

    Hu Bris says:
    October 16, 2011 at 7:56 pm

    reminded me more of this

    Yes, that was the first thing that jumped to my mind when I saw this.

  30. I am lost for words, really, is this what their movement has been reduced to? It is disturbing, but also sort of funny in a strange way. This is almost as alarming as a physics teacher telling me CO2 traps heat.

  31. As for why the crowd keeps repeating what McKibben is saying, for those that don’t know, the police have prohibited all forms of sound amplification. The demonstrators have taken to using what they call the “human microphone”—speakers address the crowd in short phrases which are then repeated across the crowd as many times as is necessary for all in attendance to hear what’s being said.

  32. I’ll think all humans are brainless idiots. Especially middleclass. This is kinda of thread that I don’t want to see in here. Occupy Wallstreet has good purpose, but it’s not a science and there ia some stupid people in that movement as well as any other. Warren Buffet is right, when he says Rich people should pay more taxes, otherwise they’ll soon be jailbirds, in their own houses. Look at the history.

  33. “As a member of Occupy Wall Street, I have a VERY strong opinion about Global Warming! Now excuse me for a few minutes while Bill McKibben tells me what it is.”

  34. Like in Europe there is demand to use biofuel for traffic. That makes elevation to food price and makes poor people even poorer. Climate solution ? Let me laugh. Im embarrassed about collective stupidity. If they don’t bild that pipeline, what then, more unemployment, growing federal debt, ten years this stupidity and it’s game over to midle class people.

  35. Marek and othes, I’d believe that if I hadn’t seen video of people doing the call/response thing to a guy with a megaphone and people on stage talking with microphones.

  36. I think that the Wall Street protests and other similar events throughout the world are a healthy sign.
    The global warming scam and the 2008 CDO triple AAA rated junk induced financial meltdown are both examples of elite fraud.
    Its no accident that Goldman Sachs and Hedge Funds are behind both.
    What do you expect the middle and working classes to do as their pension funds, savings and just living costs are crushed?
    People are no longer willing to accept what the “elite consensus” position is.
    What else can a poor sceptic do but protest.

  37. Thank God for the internet, by this means alone are we finding out just how crooked our politics are on both side of the pond and how weirdo’s who have never had a “proper job” or left the halls of academia are lining their own pockets using tax money. My taxes are higher than they need to be, due to these “nuts”. There is Chris Huhne in the UK saying utility companies should drop their bills, but saying nothing about the extra “green” taxes, people will freeze to death this winter. “Save energy” is the cry on the one hand, whilst there is talk of raising the speed limit in the UK for Motorways, Does not compute unless you are a moron!
    Keep going everyone, fight and tell at every turn.

  38. The people want to end capitalism.
    My questions are ” How? And replace it with what?”
    Don’t try to end it …..We need to establish capitalism here in the USA.

  39. “That’s where the empire lives”, Obi-Wan Kenobi!

    All it needed was a theological dog collar to make it a mass!

  40. It’s another dirty trick to undermine climate science by reporting what these people actually say and do.

  41. That’s great guys. Thanks.That’s great guys. Thanks. No, I’ve finished now. No, I’ve finished now. Stop repeating me. Stop repeating me. Shut up, you morons. Shut up, you morons. Oh God. Somebody stop them……..

  42. So what is the behaviour the “chanters” are exhibiting at the Climate and OWS rallies? Let someone else put words in my mouth and I will repeat them? Let someone else do the thinking for me because I can not think for myself?

    This is truly odd behaviour.

  43. Another good one is Monty Python’s “Life of Brian” where Brian addresses a crowd and says “you are all individuals” and they collectively chant back “We are all individuals”

  44. what was the point of the whole recitation thingie? Color me confused as to why a bunch of immigrants are gathered around this guy parroting him.

  45. Roger Carr says:
    October 16, 2011 at 11:03 pm
    WUWT gave a link to “Occupy Wall Street” a couple days after it began. (It was in a comment.)

    I followed that link and have watched the movement ever since with a sense I was following something much bigger than a few crazies tripping.

    The crazies are there. There is also something much deeper which is having an effect which could become momentous.

    Today, Krugman in the N Y Times appears to be saying much of what I feel.

    Laugh, sure; but keep up with it just in case it is history in the making. You would not want to miss that.

    Roger, I’ve never understood what OWS is all about. Wall Street and Big Banking didn’t bail themselves out. Big Banking didn’t want to make loans to people who couldn’t afford them. The OWS people need to learn about the Community Reinvestment Act and how the Justice Department under the Clinton Administration threatened to sue banks if they didn’t start making loans to people who couldn’t afford them. Sallie Mae and Freddie Mac started underwrote most of those loans and then bundled and sold them as securities to the investment firms, telling them not to worry, the federal government would back the loans if necessary.

    The housing boom and bust, the Wall Street bailouts and bank bailouts simply would not and could not have happened without government interference. Put the blame where it belongs – Congress, the Bush administration and the Clinton administration and the Federal Reserve.

  46. Did someone mention ‘time to cull the herd?’ Well you did all ‘twinkle’ for it-
    http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Camel-cull-could-limit-climate-change-MQFEF?OpenDocument&src=hp14

    On the one hand the Occupy Wall Street mob shake a fist at the Morgan/Sachs/Macquarie finance crowd and with the other they beckon twinklingly with their fresh air credit creation. It didn’t take long for Oz carbon credit creation legislation to unleash the bane of the usual suspects. To borrow a phrase- I try my level best to be cynical but it’s getting harder to keep up.

    Here in Oz of course we have Euro Money’s, World’s Greatest Treasurer trying hard to emulate the fiscal profligacy of his peers everywhere. Wouldn’t you reckon if he really had the financial smarts, he’d grab the carbon tax money and scoop up all the carbon credits for less than a dime on Ala Gore’s precious Chicago Climate Exchange and lead the world at saving the planet for a song? Nope! Apparently it’s best to charge $23AUD/tonne instead. That’s Euro Money high finance for you folks with clearly a Nobel just waiting in the wings.

  47. Its really rubbish , if you going to do this at least keep in short and simply , you really can’t have people repeating a ramble it just looks and sounds stupid.

  48. Soylent ,
    Please remember that the CRA was Carter’s baby . I read the Krugman piece and think he’s wrong – the MSM plays this up , but the whole thing doesn’t seem to be getting much tracton in ” fly over ” country .

  49. My first response was a gag reflex.

    Brainless enviro zombies energized by the mindless ramblings of the village idiot.

  50. I’m sorry, I had to stop watching that. What a pathetic load of b*llocks. Childish, pointless, etc., etc., etc. I could go on, but will conclude by saying that he managed, in one fell swoop, to make even Al “Millions of degrees” Gore look smart. Gah.

    Loved the Blazing Saddles clip, though :D.

  51. Between Hansen and McKibben, does anyone have any doubt of the political leanings or goals of these climate alarmists?

  52. Ha ha! I cringed the whole way through that video, laughed a fue times and felt a little bit sick at the end.
    But in all seriousness It’s unfortunate that Bill McKibben has found himself surrounded by a herd of brain dead Zombies, Some scientists say that is only a mater of time before this type of Zombie evolves into a flesh eating necromancer that is known to even attack other Zombies, at the moment this lower form of Zombified humanoid (Homo Coprophagus Somnambulus) is usually found chanting around people that they believe are in possession of a living brain, which raises the question of why are they surrounding Bill McKibben? Although there are many theories and speculations being discussed among the scientific community concerning this disturbing behavior, a primarily consensus is beginning to form under the precautionary principle, soon to be released by the International Panel on Zombie Contagion (IPZC).
    In the first assessment report by the IPZC It is recommended that people avoid contact with such creatures for at least 29 days, and to resist saying anything intelligent that would attract an audience of chanting Zombies, avoid breathing in any noxious fumes being emitted by the ‘Homo hippy erraticus’ a slower moving dopey form of Homo Coprophagus Somnambulus who’s fumes will make you susceptible to it’s mind numbing verbal noises and various other sounds.
    A recommended defense strategy when cornered by a herd is to point upward and begin chanting in a dreary undead groan “Global warming’ errr Global warming argh”

  53. Anton says:
    October 16, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    …I happen to be fond of many pagan traditions…

    So you long for the days of sacrificing babies to the Beezlebub of ancient Summeria or the burning sacrifice of chickens, goats, and other animals, including a man (Wicca). As long as they don’t eat of this burnt flesh, and remain vegan. Is that what you are saying? GK

  54. Wait! They’re not done yet.

    William M. Briggs reports on Occupy Sacramento!

    The movement began with a rally on the Capitol steps, then proceeded by parade to Cesar Chavez park, at 10th and J streets, where it mingled with the folks who had gathered for what was reported as the Indigenous Day of Resistance.

    Occupy Sacramento consisted of those pictured above and one gentleman off camera. Their leader was Stephen Payan (on the right), an earnest young man who told your reporter that the rally was off to a late start.

  55. If McKibben is so upset by the pipeline company employing a company it’s worked with before for the EIS, is he going to condemn the pal review of the AGW research paper writing crowd?

  56. P Walker says:
    October 17, 2011 at 9:04 am
    Soylent ,
    Please remember that the CRA was Carter’s baby . I read the Krugman piece and think he’s wrong – the MSM plays this up , but the whole thing doesn’t seem to be getting much tracton in ” fly over ” country .

    The last results of the statistical modeling shows 5.3 journalists covering the story per actual occupier (USA only).

  57. This bonehead fails to understand that oil is fungible asset sold in a global market. If the Canadians don’t sell it to us, they’ll sell it to someone else. It will be used for fuel irrespective of the pipeline.

    I’m hoping for for a lot of pouring cold rain to inundate the east coast.

  58. G. Karst says:
    “Anton says:
    “‘…I happen to be fond of many pagan traditions…’

    “So you long for the days of sacrificing babies to the Beezlebub of ancient Summeria or the burning sacrifice of chickens, goats, and other animals, including a man (Wicca). As long as they don’t eat of this burnt flesh, and remain vegan. Is that what you are saying? GK”

    What are you going on about? The ancient Jews cruelly sacrificed animals right and left, and some sects sacrificed humans. Have you forgotten the story of Abraham being asked to make a burnt offering of his own child before God jumps in and says, “Just kidding! It was a test!!!” Abraham was all ready to do it, and he’s held up as an example of a good father?

    This 2011, not 3000 B.C. Most of the ancient world’s religions, including its versions of Judaism and Christianity, were barbaric by today’s standards. Buddhism is an offshoot of Hinduism. Buddhism and many Hindu sects prohibit and condemn any form of sacrifice, but some sects of Hinduism actively practice it.

    Jim Jones was a Christian.

    Beelzebub is a mistranslation, sometimes claimed, incorrectly, to mean “Lord of the Flies.” It’s a variant of Baal, meaning “Lord,” and is used in Judeo-Christian scripture for God AND for Jesus too. It is not by itself a pejorative or negative term.

    Obviously, you didn’t read my post, just reacted knee-jerk. It must be fun belonging to a religion that encourages such instant hostility.

    By the way, the so called Wiccan sacrifice you reference was performed by a crazy woman pretending to be a Wiccan. But, such distinctions probably don’t matter when you’ve already made up your mind.

    Look up Mithra and Krishna and their contributions to the Christian story. Better yet, start here:

    http://www.pocm.info/
    http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/source.html
    http://freetruth.50webs.org/Index.htm

  59. Apparently it is perfectly honorable to be a sceptic of AGW, but scepticism of the contemporary version of capitalism is a sign of despicable communist tendencies…

  60. TBear (Warm Cave in Cold-as-Snow-Sydney) says:
    October 16, 2011 at 8:31 pm
    WTF?

    Are you guys in the USA not just a little bit embarrassed by this?

    Wow. What a moron.

    To answer your question directly, yes. But we’ll see you a McKibben and raise you a Gilliard! :-D

  61. More Soylent Green! says:
    October 17, 2011 at 7:23 am
    “Roger, I’ve never understood what OWS is all about. Wall Street and Big Banking didn’t bail themselves out. Big Banking didn’t want to make loans to people who couldn’t afford them. The OWS people need to learn about the Community Reinvestment Act and how the Justice Department under the Clinton Administration threatened to sue banks if they didn’t start making loans to people who couldn’t afford them. ”

    They don’t want to know; they want to play revolutionaries. OWS is all about fame ( in the 15-min-of-fame sense ); it is DIY “reality” TV.

  62. Anton:

    Wrong again, I don’t belong to any organized religion. Defending depraved pagan human and animal sacrifices by citing Judeo-Christian outrages, hardly convinces me, that Gaia/Climate worship should be encouraged. Run along to your coven, and examine fresh entrails, for additional understanding. Meanwhile, me and the “big guy upstairs”, will continue our argument, as to the proper role of Man (myself) in His universe. We have already settled the matter of Pagans – they are out. Sorry, we are now deciding about [snip. Please don’t go there. ~dbs, mod.]. GK

  63. WetMan says:
    October 17, 2011 at 11:43 am
    “Apparently it is perfectly honorable to be a sceptic of AGW, but scepticism of the contemporary version of capitalism is a sign of despicable communist tendencies…”

    WetMan, you are the very first commenter on this thread who used the word “communist”.

  64. dbs: That was a skit right out of South Park. Are you saying WUWT is less controversial than prime time television. Regardless, everyone now knows the forbidden word. It is not nice to snip a conversation with GOD. GK

  65. G. Karst says… *(&)^&(%*&)(*&^

    For somebody visiting a science site, your interest in reality appears to be zero. Since pagans make up far more than half the world’s population, and were the sole contributers to ancient Far Eastern, ancient Middle Eastern , and classical Western, architecture, philosophy, astronomy, mathematics, and civilization, your dismissal of them amounts to cutting off your own nose to spite your own face. Try living without the ideas and things pagans have either invented or manufactured. It cannot be done in the civilized world. Our Republican form of government is a product of paganism. So is indoor plumbing,

  66. A lot of the occupiers have student loans, as they admit in this video. So for them it makes perfect economic sense to try to crush the current financial system – it would be the easy way out for them.

  67. I liked the “Free Obama” part. When Obama’s thugs decide that this attempt and replacing ACORN is off the rails, this guy is likely to be one of the first ones to disappear.

  68. Bob Johnston, I reckon this will make you as uncomfortable as it makes me, but nonetheless, I’m wiggling my spirit fingers at you…

  69. Dave Snoozooka weighs in…

    He amazes me…he’ll start out in first gear, the launch into diatribe mode all of a sudden. Same old meme.

  70. Anton [October 17, 2011 at 11:29 am] says:

    “Jim Jones was a Christian.”

    Are you drinking tonight? Jones was the classic case of a cult, of his own design. His defining characteristic was of being a Socialist/Communist, with a side order of San Francisco rainbows thrown in.

  71. Mike Bromley the Kurd [October 17, 2011 at 9:16 pm] says:

    “Dave Snoozooka weighs in…”

    Suzuki, Gore, McKibben. All spouting support for the anti-capitalist anarchy cabal.

    Once a few more climate kooks chime in, the usual gang of moderation that say: “Climate Scientology is NOT an organ of the leftists” will have to shut up. Or not.

    Quick, someone put a microphone in Hansen’s face. And Ehrlich, and Pachauri, and Mann, and Tamino, and Holdren, and …

    Nah, don’t bother. We know that every single one of them side with these Socialists.

  72. Blade says:
    October 18, 2011 at 3:23 am
    Anton [October 17, 2011 at 11:29 am] says:

    “’Jim Jones was a Christian.’

    “Are you drinking tonight? Jones was the classic case of a cult, of his own design. His defining characteristic was of being a Socialist/Communist, with a side order of San Francisco rainbows thrown in.”

    Jones was as much a representative of Christianity as the primitives G. Karst referred to were representative of paganism. Funny, Christians and Muslims who insist each other’s and everyone else’s religion is wrong and backward can find lots of examples to prove their point, but completely ignore even worse examples within their own faiths. The Christian pot calling the pagan kettle black is beyond stupid, since the three Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) have inflicted more death, disease, misery, and ignorance on this planet than all pagan religions in history combined. Yes, they’ve inflicted many good things too. So have pagan religions.

    There are literally thousands of so called Christian denominations in the world today. By any definition, they are ALL cults, and the fact that many are huge makes no difference. Every time some dufus comes along and says, “I have a NEW interpretation of this or scripture; follow me!” and people follow him or her, you have another cult. Every time somebody says, “I believe this because my parents believed it and their parents believed it, blah, blah,” you have a cult. And every time someone says “This is the truth because a consensus says so,” you have a cult.

    The AGW religion is retarded, but you can’t fight retardation with another version of it. For one to sneer at the Warmists for being stupid “pagans,” while one is simultaneously thumping ones own bible isn’t logical or reasonable. It’s ridiculous.

  73. DirkH says:
    October 17, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    “WetMan, you are the very first commenter on this thread who used the word “communist”.”

    This is not the first thread on which the protesters are bashed. And likely also not the last. I’m not going to check, but I am pretty sure I read a commie comment or two on another thread.
    It is clear that the opportunist warmists are trying to hijack the protests and this should be condemned in the strongest possible language.
    However, some of the protesters are genuinely angry about what is happening, particularly here in Europe, and it is a sentiment widely shared by the common folk.
    I live in Belgium and here the government is bailing out a bank again, for the second time in three years, which is just going to be another bill for the taxpayers. We are asked to accept 10 billion in cuts (read tax increases, and I already pay 55% in income tax. Yes, you read that right…55%), next year while the government is going to guarantee the debts of the Dexia bank for 45 billion. And there is nobody here that believes that this guarantee will not be turned into a bill in the near future. Adding 15% to our national debt overnight. So hell yeah, we are pretty angry!

  74. Although the numbers are small (per George Will, the total of all OWS rallies/camps is less than the single Washington DC Tea Party event), the media is hyping it to the skies.

    Ironically, another fave target of the Greens may stop the pipeline for them:

    According to an estimate from Ohio state geologists, that state’s portion of the Utica alone could contain up to 15 trillion cubic feet of natural gas, which would make it a significant contributor to national supplies of the fuel that will help cut greenhouse gas emissions and create thousands of jobs.

    But the Utica is distinguished by also harboring natural gas liquids and large quantities of oil which have sparked a rush by energy companies to acquire leases on millions of acres of land, especially in eastern Ohio.

    The Ohio geologists calculate there could be as many as 5.5 billion barrels of recoverable oil underlying their state’s share of the Utica, or about a third of the expected production from Alaska’s Prudhoe Bay, the largest US oil reserve.

    “This is huge from the standpoint of energy independence,” said Mike Arthur, a Pennsylvania State University geoscientist and co-director of the college’s Marcellus Shale Center for Outreach and Research.

    It could even obviate the need for a pipeline from the tar sands,” he said in reference to a proposed pipeline from Canada to Texas that has sparked opposition from environmentalists.

    Hilarious.
    (my bolding)

  75. Anton says:
    October 16, 2011 at 10:47 pm
    ……..”Yes, the global warming scare has turned into a substitute religion for crazy people, but don’t try to disparage it by labeling it pagan. These are not real pagans; they’re political activists cashing in, and wouldn’t know a genuine pagan teaching if someone shoved it down their throats. And in case you missed the news, the current Pope is a True Believer in AGW.”

    ____________________________

    If you’re not a troll, don’t behave like one.

    Paganism is not a belief, it is defined as those individuals who are not believers in one of the three predominant monotheistic religions.

    Moreover, if the following statement makes Pope Benedict a “True Believer in AGW.” then I’m a monkey’s uncle.

    PAPAL STATEMENT TO CLIMATE CHANGE MEETING

    “The Earth Is Indeed a Precious Gift of the Creator”

    VATICAN CITY, SEPT. 24, 2009 (Zenit.org).- Here is the text of a videostatement from Benedict XVI that was sent to the Sept. 22 U.N. summit on climate change. It contained the words he said on this issue Aug. 26, 2009, during the Wednesday general audience.
    * * *
    I wish to reflect today upon the relationship between the Creator and ourselves as guardians of his creation. In so doing I also wish to offer my support to leaders of governments and international agencies who soon will meet at the United Nations to discuss the urgent issue of climate change.
    The Earth is indeed a precious gift of the Creator who, in designing its intrinsic order, has given us guidelines that assist us as stewards of his creation. Precisely from within this framework, the Church considers that matters concerning the environment and its protection are intimately linked with integral human development. In my recent encyclical,Caritas in Veritate, I referred to such questions recalling the “pressing moral need for renewed solidarity” (no. 49) not only between countries but also between individuals, since the natural environment is given by God to everyone, and so our use of it entails a personal responsibility towards humanity as a whole, particularly towards the poor and towards future generations (cf. no. 48).
    How important it is then, that the international community and individual governments send the right signals to their citizens and succeed in countering harmful ways of treating the environment! The economic and social costs of using up shared resources must be recognized with transparency and borne by those who incur them, and not by other peoples or future generations. The protection of the environment, and the safeguarding of resources and of the climate, oblige all leaders to act jointly, respecting the law and promoting solidarity with the weakest regions of the world (cf. no. 50). Together we can build an integral human development beneficial for all peoples, present and future, a development inspired by the values of charity in truth. For this to happen it is essential that the current model of global development be transformed through a greater, and shared, acceptance of responsibility for creation: this is demanded not only by environmental factors, but also by the scandal of hunger and human misery.
    With these sentiments I wish to encourage all the participants in the United Nations summit to enter into their discussions constructively and with generous courage. Indeed, we are all called to exercise responsible stewardship of creation, to use resources in such a way that every individual and community can live with dignity, and to develop “that covenant between human beings and the environment, which should mirror the creative love of God” (Message for the 2008 World Day of Peace, 7)

  76. WetMan says:
    October 18, 2011 at 12:17 pm
    DirkH says:
    October 17, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    “WetMan, you are the very first commenter on this thread who used the word “communist”.”

    This is not the first thread on which the protesters are bashed. And likely also not the last. I’m not going to check, but I am pretty sure I read a commie comment or two on another thread.
    It is clear that the opportunist warmists are trying to hijack the protests and this should be condemned in the strongest possible language.
    However, some of the protesters are genuinely angry about what is happening, particularly here in Europe, and it is a sentiment widely shared by the common folk.
    I live in Belgium and here the government is bailing out a bank again, for the second time in three years, which is just going to be another bill for the taxpayers. We are asked to accept 10 billion in cuts (read tax increases, and I already pay 55% in income tax. Yes, you read that right…55%), next year while the government is going to guarantee the debts of the Dexia bank for 45 billion. And there is nobody here that believes that this guarantee will not be turned into a bill in the near future. Adding 15% to our national debt overnight. So hell yeah, we are pretty angry!

    The OWS people don’t know who they are, what they believe or what exactly they want (except other people’s money), so it’s no surprise we can’t get a good handle on them either.

    It’s a heterogeneous group — part Marxist, part anarchist part (economic) fascist (oh yes, and part Jew-hating fascist), part unionist, part homeless, part free-love hippie, part nihilist, etc. Good ole ‘communist’ has to fit into their somewhere.

  77. Pope Benedict has repeated spoken and written on the issue of so called manmade global warming, and has flip-flopped.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-501316/The-Pope-condemns-climate-change-prophets-doom.html

    So, I will retract my statement concerning him. If he has changed his mind, that may be a good thing, though his clear indifference to animal welfare indicated in the article is discouraging. Too bad St. Augustine didn’t declare that animals had immortal souls. Since this pope and all before him have proved incapable of thinking for themselves or recognizing the animals are sentient beings, such a pronouncement would have a world of difference and spared trillions of animals untold suffering. The scandal of animal misery infinitely surpasses that of human misery.

    Had you bothered to read all of my posts and responses before jumping in, you would see that I was defending pagans against unwarranted generalized smears. Do you think Buddhists are primitives who go around sacrificing babies? The original poster clearly did think so, making cracks about Earth-worshiping pagans and, later, about Beelzebub and human sacrifices. The Western Greenies are not pagans by any historical definition; they’re political activists, and they don’t represent pagans historically or globally. Even those who claim to be pagans are just wannabes following silly trends.

    Calling me a troll is interesting, since I’ve been posting here for years. As a former devout pagan, I am always annoyed by Christians and others who call “my people” names and try branding them as savages. The word, from Latin paganus, means villager, country-dweller, or peasant. It doesn’t mean devil-worshiper, Democrat, dirty hippie, pothead, barbarian, ignoramus, or crackpot. That’s how the Church has used it.

  78. Anton,

    Thanks for the partial retraction. Please show where the Pope has flipped, or flopped, or where the Pope has encouraged harm to animals. Otherwise, retract your latest libel.

    I repeat, there is no such thing as “paganism”. Your OT post about your religious convictions,while bashing others’ is trollish. Moreover, please don’t put words in my mouth.

    A devout pagan? Is that an atheist?

  79. His view of animals as inferior to humans is clearly stated in the very article I linked to. Some people claim he is a defender of animal rights and welfare, but actions speak louder than encyclicals. When a reigning pope finally states to the world that animals (1) have immortal, not temporal, souls (what good is a temporal soul?), and (2) that cruelty to animals is a mortal sin, then I will re-script my entire position on Christianity. Till then, it’s just another Abrahamic nightmare to me.

    I am not, and have never been, an atheist.

  80. Anton:

    If everyone became a vegan today, there would not be a single cow, pig, sheep, chicken alive next week. Unless they are bred specifically for animal sacrifices on your altar. Or did you think farmers would keep them around for pets? They would die by the billions. How very hateful of you.

    Btw, many people regard Buddhism as a philosophy, NOT a religion. There are many religions based somewhat, on Buddhist thought, however, that is not the same thing. Ancestor worship is only slightly better than animal worship. Get a life that doesn’t require either.

    As long as you keep mentioning me in your comments, I will have to keep coming back to this non-scientific, religious discussion. Please stop, the back of my hand, is getting sore. GK

  81. Karst, the only people I know who engage in animal sacrifices are followers of Santaria, Voodoo, some strange sects of Hinduism, some versions of Orthodox Judaism, Greek Orthodox Christianity, and in Spain, Roman Catholicism. Oh, yes, and some branches of Satanism.

    There will always be animals bred for food; our pets have to eat, and they eat meat. But, if humans stopped eating meat, all the farm animals would not die by the billions, except for old age, if the humans responsible for them took care of them. Until humans stop treating fellow creatures as objects, I’m not holding my breath.

    I’ve spent my life rescuing animals from Christians; my vet bills are more than ten thousand dollars a year. I actually live by my principles.

    No sacrifices in my religion, not now, not ever. I happen also to be pro-life with regard to humans; fancy that.

    Are you sure it’s the back of your hand, and not your palm, that’s getting sore? You’ve obviously already gone blind….

  82. Anton,

    Take your meds.

    The quote from the article you posted is: “The 80-year-old Pope said the world needed to care for the environment but not to the point where the welfare of animals and plants was given a greater priority than that of mankind”.

    You said: “His view of animals as inferior to humans is clearly stated in the very article I linked to.”

    Nuf said?

    If you’re not an atheist describe witch, or how many Gods you worship, or whatever your beliefs expect you to do for her/him?

    Is masochism part of your system of belief? Apparently so.

  83. Anton says:
    October 20, 2011 at 1:01 pm
    Karst, the only people I know who engage in animal sacrifices are followers of Santaria, Voodoo, some strange sects of Hinduism, some versions of Orthodox Judaism, Greek Orthodox Christianity, and in Spain, Roman Catholicism…….

    __________

    Anton,

    Check your facts. See below for another persons answer for a clumsy libel against the Church

    “”””””””””Quote:
    Originally Posted by puzzleannie
    animal sacrifice is not and never has been part of Catholic worship and practice. It sounds like you are describing a cultural practice, not anything endorsed by the church. since you have provided no link I will take this as urban legend until some evidence is forthcoming, but even if it were true, it is not something the Church undertakes. Your agenda for this thread is?
    Hi,

    I have provided no link since all the websites linking to this horrible practice have graphic images. A quick search on youtube with the term “Galgo” will yield plenty of (terrible) videos.

    Since this practice is publicized in some videos as a form Marian devotion, (which I know is utter rubbish) I thought that maybe together we can educate people on this subject. A person stumbling across this kind of practice would obviously be disturbed, and it certainly isn’t good publicity for Catholics, especially since it is not part of Catholicism. I’m sorry if I came across as stating it is a practice sanctioned by the Church, I only meant that , unfortunately, some people think it is.””””””””

    To say that Galgo is a Roman Catholic practice is like saying that rape is a Wiccan practice.

    So much disinformation, and so little time.

  84. Chris,

    It may be a cultural thing, but there is at least one church in Spain where every year the priest climbs to the top of a spire and throws a live baby lamp into the stone courtyard below. The Vatican has not intervened.

    So you’re in the same boat I am. People think Catholics worship statues and practice cannibalism, and they think pagans sacrifice animals on altars to bloodthirsty demons posing as gods. The truth is, stupid people, no matter what their religion, do stupid horrible things. Then they hide behind their religion and its scriptures to justify their barbarism. None of the pagans I grew up around would dream of harming an animal or sacrificing anything to any god, real or imaginary. But, some pagans do, and some Christians do. It’s up religious leaders to stop them.

    The religion Bon–a sister to Buddhism–forbids sacrifices or cruelty to animals or even eating meat, yet some followers perform terrible animal sacrifices. The Dalai Lama finally stepped in and told them to knock it off.

    I believe in a unified intelligence, conscious or not, that controls the entire Universe as a single organism, which is what keeps it from falling apart: the same intelligence that maintains homeostasis in our bodies, and keeps everything running a concerted whole. But, I also accept that one can address aspects of this intelligence individually, rather than collectively, and that these may be defined as gods by some people. I also believe that if enough people believe in something, they can create it, so that some “gods” are actually thought-forms. I think of all gods as cosmic Web browsers, giving one access to the whole by enabling an emotional bond with something on a level one can relate to. It’s easier praying to a “god” one can imagine than to one beyond human conception. Since people of all religions claim their prayers are answered, it’s obviously their faith, not the god, who produces the response.

    There may be no atheists in fox holes; there are also no former pagans. In a pinch or crisis, I would pray to anything benevolent that might be of help, and I couldn’t care less what this or that religion teaches about such things. I lost my fear of God when I began studying comparative religions as a teenager.

    I also believe that deliberately harming an animal is every bit as bad as harming a human baby. Animals ARE babies compared to humans, and every bit as innocent. There are also a hundred times as many animals as humans on this planet, so, yes, I think their need surpasses even ours, and that the Pope is wrong for not recognizing this. The Church rightly rails against elective abortion, but says nothing about cruelty to animals. Why do you think that is? I already know. I went to Catholic schools are heard the official explanation time and again. But, why the loony philosophical mutterings of Thomas Aquinas should take precedence over the evidence of our own senses is inexplicable.

  85. Typo: That’s baby lamb, not baby lamp.

    BTW, the “gods” I refer to are things in our own minds, like imaginary friends, that somehow resonate with us. I don’t believe in gods out there meddling in our affairs. It doesn’t matter. If praying to an imaginary friend produces results, why not do it? We answer our own prayers, but to do so we have to set something in motion, and faith is the trick. The bigger trick is to imagine something higher, not lower, and better, not worse.

    In a hundred years, who is going to care?

  86. I’m speechless, I rest my case.

    Btw: A lamb is a baby sheep. A baby lamb is a baby baby. You would know that if your cognitive abilities were not inhibited by a protein deficiency. GK

  87. So if someone says “baby kitten” or “what an adorable little pup” that negates the statement? A lamb is a young sheep, not necessarily a baby. A kitten is a cat who isn’t fully grown, not necessarily a baby. The priest on the roof throws a baby (lamb) down into the courtyard. It is an animal sacrifice performed by a Christian for a Christian audience.

    If you can’t defend your idiotic comments about pagans and pagan bigotry with something better than erroneous word-parsing, you can’t defend it, period.

    For someone who is speechless, you keep yapping. And how can you rest your case, if you keep going on? Seems to me, you have the grammar problem. I’m an editor, and I’m pretty careful with the words I use, though this is a blog, not a newspaper. Baby lamb (specific), not lamb (general). Now, why don’t you look up “speechless” and “resting ones case?”

  88. Anton says:
    October 20, 2011 at 3:50 pm
    Chris,

    It may be a cultural thing, but there is at least one church in Spain where every year the priest climbs to the top of a spire and throws a live baby lamp into the stone courtyard below. The Vatican has not intervened.

    _____________________________

    I’m assuming you meant lamb, and not a baby lam(p), which presumably is a small light fixture.

    At the risk of prolonging the torture, do you have any evidence of this claim of yours? If not, please refrain from your persistent anti-Christian bigotry.

    [NOTE: This has gone on for far too long. Please take note of the WUWT policy here. Any further attempts at prolonging this discussion will be trashed. -REP]

  89. Moderator REP,

    I read the policy, and agree that discussing religion on WUWT is counter productive. My issue is that false claims against any religion, or group, or individual, should either not be allowed, or should not go unchallenged. That puts you as a moderator in a tough spot.

    I’m glad that this line of discussion has been, mercifully, ended.

    Thank you.

    C

Comments are closed.