From the soon to be a Climate Crock of the Week department, Barry Woods writes to me in an email:
One of the insights in the climategate emails was perhaps how poisonous Michael Mann’s involvement was, for the niche area of the paleo science community (ego due to IPCC and Hockey Stick)?
This tweet from earlier this morning (now deleted, only a text version survives -Anthony) shows the immediate labeling of “denier” for another scientist who disagrees with his paleo work.
Michael E. Mann @MichaelEMann
Closet #climatechange #denier Rob Wilson, comes out of the closet big time: http://www.bishop-hill.net/blog/2013/10/21/wilson-on-millennial-temperature-reconstructions.html … #BadScience #DisingenuousBehavior
Shortly afterwards, Mann got into a long and somewhat huffy discussion with Tamsin Edwards over that labeling, here’s the opening salvo:
Also in the feed earlier this morning, (though I can’t find it now) was a Tweet from Mann backing down saying he’d withhold judgment on Rob Wilson until he confirmed those words, suggesting that Andrew Montford (Bishop Hill) had misinterpreted Wilson’s words..
That Tweet apparently has disappeared too. (A WUWT commenter found it, see below, but the original “denier” tweet is still missing -A) I wasn’t going to bother with this article until Dr. Mann started disappearing his own words.
Awful blog piece (http://t.co/61oFMFD3Ho) may well have misrepresented Rob Wilson's views. I suspend judgment, pending his disavowal of it..
— Dr. Michael E. Mann (@MichaelEMann) October 21, 2013
Woods continues:
[About the same time] Rob Wilson, had just publicly confirmed (in comments at Bishop Hill) that he thought and had publicly told students, public, etc Mann’s recent work was a ‘crock of shit’… (his words)
“Lastly, the “crock of xxxx” statement was focussed entirely on recent work By Michael Mann w.r.t. hypothesised missing rings in tree-ring records (a whole bunch of papers listed below).
Although a rather flippant statement, I stand by it and Mann is well aware of my criticisms (privately and through the peer reviewed literature) of his recent work.
Rob”
in the comments
Here it is in full:
==================================================================
Greetings.
Although I vetted Andrew’s post, I want to clarify that my 2 hour lecture was, I hope, a critical look at all of the northern hemispheric reconstructions of past temperature to date. It was not focussed entirely on Michael Mann’s work. I described each of the major studies and tried to highlight both their strengths and weaknesses – they all have some useful information but it is important to understand the limitations of the studies as well. Of course Mann’s work was mentioned as several of his papers have been so prominent over the last 15 years but I actually spent substantially more time taking apart the D’Arrigo et al. (2006) study on which I did much of the analysis.
This was a session where I wanted the students to critically look at the different studies and specifically address what we can learn from them and how the science can move on over the next decade. Such large scale reconstructions are critically important for understanding the controls on large climate variability, but as yet, due to great uncertainties and large differences in reconstructed amplitude, they are not yet very useful at constraining modelled estimates of future temperature change.
Bar some personal comments, much of what I said is published (see papers below) and is in the public domain.
Lastly, the “crock of xxxx” statement was focussed entirely on recent work By Michael Mann w.r.t. hypothesised missing rings in tree-ring records (a whole bunch of papers listed below). Although a rather flippant statement, I stand by it and Mann is well aware of my criticisms (privately and through the peer reviewed literature) of his recent work.
Rob
I hope all the PDF links below.
NH RELATED PAPERS
Edwards, T.L., Crucifix, M. and Harrison, S.P., 2007. Using the past to constrain the future: how the palaeorecord can improve estimates of global warming. Progress in Physical Geography 31 (5), 481-500.
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/papers/Edwardsetal2007.pdf
D’Arrigo, R., Wilson, R. and Jacoby, G. 2006. On the long-term context for late 20th century warming. Journal of Geophysical Research, Vol. 111, D03103, doi:10.1029/2005JD006352
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/DArrigoetal2006a.pdf
D Frank, D., J. Esper, E. Zorita, R. Wilson. (2010). A noodle, hockey stick, and spaghetti plate: a perspective on high resolution paleoclimatology. Wiley Interdisciplinary Reviews Climate Change. doi: 10.1002/wcc.53.
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/Franketal2010.pdf
Trieste 2008 Paleoclimate Uncertainties Workshop, Final Report.
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/reports/trieste2008/trieste2008final.pdf
Esper J, Frank DC, Wilson RJS (2004) Climate reconstructions – low frequency ambition and high frequency ratification. EOS 85, 113, 120.
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/Esperetal2004.pdf
Esper J, Wilson RJS, Frank DC, Moberg A, Wanner H, Luterbacher J (2005) Climate: past ranges and future changes. Quaternary Science Reviews 24, 2164-2166.
http://www.geo.uni-mainz.de/Dateien/Esper_2005_QSR.pdf
MISSING TREE-RINGS AND MAJOR VOLCANIC EVENTS
Mann et al. 2012. Underestimation of Volcanic Cooling in Tree-Ring Based Reconstructions of Hemispheric Temperatures, Nature Geoscience, 5, 202-205.
http://www.meteo.psu.edu/holocene/public_html/shared/articles/MFRNatureGeosci12.pdf
Anchukaitis, K. et al. (2012). Tree rings and volcanic cooling. Nature Geoscience. 5: 836–837. doi:10.1038/ngeo1645
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/Anchukaitisetal2012.pdf
Mann et al. (2013). Discrepancies between the modeled and proxy-reconstructed response to volcanic forcing over the past millennium: Implications and possible mechanisms. JGR. 118, 14, p. 7617-7627.
http://www.meteo.psu.edu/holocene/public_html/Mann/articles/articles/MRSTF-JGRInPress.pdf
Esper J et al (2013) Testing the hypothesis of post-volcanic missing rings in temperature sensitive dendrochronological data. Dendrochronologia. 31 (3): 216-222.
http://www.blogs.uni-mainz.de/fb09climatology/files/2012/03/Esper_2013_Den.pdf
Esper J et al (2013) European summer temperature response to annually dated volcanic eruptions over the past nine centuries. Bulletin of Volcanology 75, 736, doi: 10.1007/s00445-013-0736-z.
http://www.blogs.uni-mainz.de/fb09climatology/files/2012/03/Esper_2013_BullVol.pdf
St. George et al. (2013). The rarity of absent growth rings in Northern Hemisphere forests
outside the American Southwest. Geophysical Research Letters 40, doi:10.1002/grl.50743
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/Stgeorge2013.pdf
D’Arrigo, et al. (2013). Volcanic cooling signal in tree-ring temperature reconstructions for the past millennium, Journal of Geophysical Research, doi:10.1002/jgrd.50692
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~rjsw/all%20pdfs/D’Arrigoetal2013.pdf
Rob Wilson ==================================================================
It seems that Rob Wilson has some serious basis for the claim, and he’s sticking by it.
Ross McKitrick sums it up pretty well in a comment:
==================================================================
Mann’s tweet just reveals openly what has long been his working assumption. To Mann, a “skeptic” is anyone who doesn’t accept his work uncritically, and a “denier” is anyone who actually disagrees with him.
Ross McKitrick ==================================================================
This is Rob Wilson:
Rob Wilson Earth and Environmental Sciences – Senior Lecturer
School of Geography and Geosciences
Irvine Building
St Andrews
KY16 9AL
United Kingdom
It seems he is well qualified to spot paleo-crocks:
-
A tree-ring reconstruction of East Anglian (UK) hydroclimate variability over the last millennium
Cooper, R. J., Melvin, T. M., Tyers, I., Wilson, R. J. S. & Briffa, K. R. Feb 2013 In : Climate Dynamics. 40, 3-4, p. 1019-1039
Article
-
Contrasting water-uptake and growth responses to drought in co-occurring riparian tree species
Singer, M. B., Stella, J., Piegay, H., Dufour, S., Wilson, R. & Johnstone, L. 2013 In : Ecohydrology. 6, 3, p. 402Article
-
Orbital forcing of tree-ring data
Esper, J., Frank, D. C., Timonen, M., Zorita, E., Wilson, R., Luterbacher, J., Holzkämper, S., Fischer, N., Wagner, S., Nievergelt, D., Verstege, A. & Büntgen, U. Dec 2012 In : Nature Climate Change. 2, 12, p. 862-866
=====================================================================
Update: In case anyone doubts the “poisonous” nature of the rhetoric Dr. Mann uses, I’ll point out what he has begun labeling an Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli, who wanted to look at Mann’s UVA emails under FOIA.
Conservative @RTDNEWS refuses to endorse #Cooch for #VAGov, citing "divisive agenda..that was unbecoming in an AG" http://t.co/ggCl4RbNSz
— Dr. Michael E. Mann (@MichaelEMann) October 20, 2013
The definition of the slang word “cooch” is:
Source: http://onlineslangdictionary.com/meaning-definition-of/cooch
What a terrible misogynistic label to apply to somebody. You’d think with the recent sexual harassment scandal over Scientific American’s Bora Zivkovic and his actions, Dr. Mann would be a bit more reserved in such nasty labeling.
My advice to Dr. Mann: When you’ve tweeted yourself into a hole, stop tweeting.
It looks like Mann is finally beginning to feel the burn.
The volcanoes ate the homework
Without intending to be rude to our host or Mr Wilson and with specific regard to the “crock” comment, my first thought was “tell us something we don’t already know”. Even Mann’s petulant behaviour when criticised is becoming incredibly passé and “old hat”.
Its true irony that thanks to Mann’s planet sized ego , he does much good work for the very people he hates as he attacks even those on his own side for the ‘crime ‘ of failing to appreciate his ‘god like powers ‘
Keep him ,under pressure keep him in the spot light and this will continue .
of course there’s missing tree rings after a volcano eruption…
….we all know temps are linear
The mann is cornered and getting more vicious as he loses ground.
I thought the word was “count”, or is that too upper class?
Mann (and his various henchmen) are powerful recruiting sergeants for the sceptic cause (*).
The trick will be to ensure that he is kept simmering nicely for long enough to p**s off everybody he comes into contact with, but without him completely exploding. So far, its working nicely. He’s on a rolling boil.
See, for example, LinkText Here for many testimonies to that effect.
I never (never ever never) thought I might defend Michael Mann but I really wonder if #cooch refers to the female anatomy since “cooch” is how you pronounce the first syllable of the attorney’s last name (Cuccinelli) and may be a common nickname for the candidate for governor. Well, maybe a common name for him among his liberal opponents, if not everyone.
There is so much for which to indict Michael Mann I would hate to include something that may not even be true.
–John Brosnahan
REPLY: I had considered this possibility before writing my update. A review of history on Dr. Mann’s Twitter feed shows a serial pattern of debasement of Ken Cuccinelli. Further, the hashtag could easily be #Cuccin or #Cuccinelli or #KenCucci or any derivative of his name. It isn’t. It’s a slang term with an entirely different meaning that simply sounds like his name.
An example of another tweet from Dr. Mann uses dual hashtags in the same tweet:
http://twitter.com/MichaelEMann/status/389881808667824128
Clearly to me the term is derogatory and Dr. Mann knows it is derogatory. If he doesn’t know it, he should. – Anthony
Surely after a volcanic eruption there are some missing trees 🙂
As long as journals keep publishing Mann’s papers and as long as the university keeps paying his salary, Michael Mann will be a blemish on the climate science community. But it appears they are starting to come to terms with Mann. About time!
Sometimes I think the Twitter bird should have a rope in its mouth for all the pleasure it affords.
It must be terribly frustrating to be the greatest climate scientist that ever was, and undoubtedly one of the top ten scientific minds of all time — and have to put up with colleagues who are Neanderthals who dare question your pronouncements. . . . . . .
I’ve noted that much of this terminology is now being said without regard to gender, indicating that the users might not understand their true meaning.
Having had the pleasure of meeting Rob Wilson from my old University, there are two things I can say about him:
1. Whilst he is willing to engage with us, he is not a sceptic and certainly not a denier
2. Even though I disagree with him, he was extremely pleasant and welcoming when I met him.
Mann has an incurable habit of falling on his own knife.
Barry,
I think you missed the best tweet of the bunch.
Michael E. Mann @MichaelEMann 6h
@flimsin Tamsin, I don’t need to be lectured on “tone” by you, of all people. Uninterested in a profile-raising twitter debate w/ you.
Collapse Reply Retweet Favorite More
6:20 AM – 21 Oct 13 · Details
I snorted with delight at his pompous “disavowal” tweet.
https://twitter.com/MichaelEMann/status/392311221371678720
And just in case:
http://i.imgur.com/7tjXGw8.png
One of the most important lessons that I take from watching people like Mann is that it is very important to consider each criticism of what I do carefully with a mind to whether it is a fair point or not. Shouting down people to shut them up is about the worst reaction one can have to well-deserved criticism, because the problems don’t go away but fester under the surface. By shouting them down, I can make my critics go away for a time, but the deficiencies they have observed will continue to exist. And if the conduct they are criticizing continue and even get worse, I would have to shout down more and more people. If I were to force people to choose between being true to their ideals and ideas and not being screamed at, people with integrity would be driven by me into having to be my enemies. The more I screamed and abused, the greater the number of people I would convert into my opposition.
If Mann had swallowed his pride and worked with Steven McIntyre to properly analyze his data, perhaps it would have resulted in a paper that said uncertainties are so high that the data doesn’t tell us anything, perhaps he would have missed out the celebrity status of having his work be front and center in an IPCC assessment, but he would have advanced human knowledge instead of corrupting it.
Rather than correcting the deficiencies in his work, Mann concentrated on maintaining a pretense that his papers are unassailable. I expect that the result is that in the long run his reputation will be in tatters and his work will be a cautionary tale of bad science with which professors hammer freshman science majors.
Mann unhinged, hilarious how angry these guys get when questioned.
DGH says:
October 21, 2013 at 1:03 pm
Pretty funny coming from a trickster who refuses to debate any D-word scientists at all, let alone those with higher professional standing than the sniveling, megalomaniacal coward.
Is there any way of setting up a vote or poll along the lines of …
is the paper a crock of ****
Yes
No
Dont Know
Then let the consensus decide then it will be a true AGW type test and Mann MUST go along with the consensus.
“The definition of the slang word “cooch” is: the female genitalia”
“When you’ve tweeted yourself into a hole, stop tweeting.”
——————————————-
Hah! 😉
…This was a session where I wanted the students to critically look at the different studies and specifically address what we can learn from them and how the science can move on over the next decade….
I congratulate Dr. Wilson, whose course seems to be packed with informative education. I believe that the lucky students on it will have had a superb introduction to a wide variety of academic experiences, many of which will be concerned with paleoclimatology. And many of which will be of wider application across science and human activity in general…
When a very small man puts on a very large hat, you see nothing but a pair of boots and a hat ricocheting about the room and crashing into the furnishings. Pretty entertaining to watch, actually.
Anthony, thanks for this expose. Rob would seem to part of the future hope for proper university education on these climate subjects. His courage in speaking truth is commendable. Your effort to lett him vet your post shows how much leadership you have of an invaluable global open source scientific network/publication/ resource. Bravo to both of you.
Once again this shows how Mann steps over all lines of decency and fact, then tries to erase the fact that he has done so from the record. In my world view, a pathetic firable offense.
Mann obviously has a few things yet to learn about the indelible nature of ‘ephemeral’ electronic communications. It is not just the NSA, or Petraus’ mistress’ phone calls. You know, it is also just the reason hard drives, thumb drives, snapshot .pdfs, and other backup archival systems were invented formthe restnof us keeping watch on something or other.
Mann is still fighting that in re his UVA emails. A lawsuit from which he has obviously learned nothing. Perhaps volcanic forcings also cause Mannian ‘memory ring’ lapses? Of course, there have inconveniently been no such VEI forcings since Pintubo. So Mann will need to manufacture some other explanation. Somehow, I think he might.
tarran: “Rather correcting the deficiencies in his work, Mann concentrated on maintaining a pretense that his papers are unassailable.”
Sure, but then that’s the normal practice of things. Scientists of any stripe, public or private, make their wage by producing useful results. Not, producing correct ones. And as much as we’d like the two to be the same, they only intersect each other. And as long as that’s the case, the wrong scientist, the unproductive scientists, and the outright fraud will all shriek to the heavens when called out. They have kids to feed.
Specifically, one can state that the only benefit to peer review is precisely that it does keep the rhetoric dialed back. As who allows you to eat is the who you allow to eat; it’s all Brothers-in-arms, or Mutually-assured-destruction. That also means there will be far more fraud and nonsense than otherwise. But it does keep the wheels greased for people more interested in the tenor then the tensors.
Gavin Schmidt @ClimateOfGavin 1m
Science is not linear. Interesting ideas can be proposed & challenged (w/o anyone’s work being a ‘crock’). Leads to deeper understanding.
Gavin Schmidt @ClimateOfGavin 1m
Science is not linear. Interesting ideas can be proposed & challenged (w/o anyone’s work being a ‘crock’). Leads to deeper understanding.
If Mann studied the cross section of an old crock, would he be able to identify its contents?
(Before indoor plumbing a lidded crock was sometimes kept beneath the bed.)
The above is a tweet by Gavin Schmidt. Is Gavin becomes a skeptic?
But, but, but… Mann’s “work” really IS a crock of…
Its clear, Mann was already an embarrassment to his peers, though happy for him to blow his trumpet in private. Now he’s blowing it more and more within ear-shot, and sometimes in their own faces, they’re getting a little fed up. Fun to watch!
Michael Mann came from nothing and looks like slowly going back to nothing. His lack of ability is hidden by the blunderbuss aimed at any criticism. His only claim to fame is the very questionable Hockey Stick and nothing in real science. Condemed to obscurity where he belongs.
I love this guy! He keeps pitching them up and we keep knocking them out of the park. To those of you suggesting we ignore him……don’t. This is exactly the type of guy we want on the pitchers mound.
Does Rob Wilson have a good lawyer?
Just like McCarthy, he’s going to one day call the wrong person a denier, and it’ll be over.
Mann is neither a man nor a scientist. He represents corrupt illiterate scientism and is too much of a [snip] to provide proof for his theology or properly defend it.
Somebody out there probably has the quote, but didn’t a warmer once say something to the effect that Al Gore was becoming a liability to “the cause”?
How long before before they say that of Mann?
It amazes me mann is still taken serious by so many.
I would not put it past Mann to be using the term Cooch that way. However, Cuccinelli is known by his nickname of The Cooch.
Mann is doing more for the alarmist cause than any other person. Single handedly killing any credibility they may have had.
What I love about Mann is that he simply doesn’t have the sense to lie down.
I wonder if any science historians can enlighten me.
Did Einstein or Newton suffer from a Mann-equivilent pestilential boil. One that was lanced and subsequently faded into the obscurity of the bathroom flannel
Given that Mann attempted to rewrite climate history, may he suffer the fate of all those before him attempting to rewrite history of any kind. He falls into the same category as the Holocaust Deniers, as far as I am concerned.
Ah – Mann’s world – if he didn’t exist we’d have to make an android with such life like characteristics to kill global warming from the inside. Thankfully he comes equipped with such a terrible attitude and a complete lack of communication skills.
Just the anticipation of future warming has caused Michael Mann to become more extreme. If it actually happened, he would become insufferable.
“Mann’s recent work was a ‘crock of xxxx’”
As opposed to his previous work which was a bucket of xxxx.
LOL
Too much attention to the dirty linen of a pathetic forger, IMO.
not only a blemish on the climate science community,but a blemish upon humanity.it may well prove to be a good thing for science in the long run, in the not too distant future mann will become a pariah,shunned not only by his peers, but every person in the developed world with half a brain cell.
nice to know rob wilson actually teaches science in my local university,considering its struggle for funding,it would be all too easy to jump on the bad science bandwagon.
Sounds like Dr Mann needs to go hide in the deep ocean along with the heat.
The next book on Climate Science will be the “Rise and Fall of Mann”
Mikey seems to go in to free fall when ever some one disses the hockey stick. Fancy he’s under some pressure…wonder what’s causing that??
@Scottish Sceptic says: October 21, 2013 at 1:00 pm
=========================================
Agreed on Rob Wilson. I exchanged a few emails with him a while back after another appearance by him at the Bish, and found him friendly, informative and open-minded. Unlike the increasingly hysterical Mann,
Michael E. Mann @MichaelEMann
Closet #climatechange #denier Rob Wilson, comes out of the closet big time: http://www.bishop-hill.net/blog/2013/10/21/wilson-on-millennial-temperature-reconstructions.html … #BadScience #DisingenuousBehavior
——————————————————————————————————————————
Hash tagging “BadScience and Disingenous Behavior” you got some neck Mikey,
Seems like Rob Wilson would make an excellent expert witness in the lawsuits involving Mann.
A number of UK scientists were unimpressed with Dr Mann’s tone..
Tamsin Edwards @flimsin
@MichaelEMann And if it’s the tone you don’t like, address that rather than call him denier?
Michael E. Mann @MichaelEMann
@flimsin Tamsin, I don’t need to be lectured on “tone” by you, of all people. Uninterested in a profile-raising twitter debate w/ you.
2:20 PM – 21 Oct 13
Reply to @MichaelEMann @flimsin
Tamsin Edwards @flimsin 6h
@MichaelEMann “of all people”? I was interested in hearing which points you disagreed with and how you classified “denier”.
Tamsin Edwards @flimsin 6h
@MichaelEMann & I think it’s important to show scientists discussing technical points & sci comm in public forum.
Tamsin Edwards @flimsin 6h
@MichaelEMann But if you don’t fancy having that conversation and/or see it as me self-promoting I will sign off, cheers.
O. Bothe @geschichtenpost 6h
@MichaelEMann Sorry, but the ‘denier’-tweet was (at least) inappropriate and the profile-raising one not much better.
——————————–
later on.. Michael Mann moderated his tone towards Tamsin Edwards considerably.. (I guess because other scientists, UK in the main, supported Dr Edwards, (Dr Doug Mcneall is at the Met Office, nice chap, had lunch with Doug at the Met Office)
Doug Mcneall
@MichaelEMann 1) I also agree that use of “denier” in general is inappropriate (if not always unjustified),
Dr Doug McNeall @dougmcneall
@MichaelEMann 2) @flimsin’s article was in good faith, and actually at least partially represents the opinions of a number of scientists.
Michael E. Mann
@MichaelEMann
@dougmcneall I disagree w/ that, as do many climate change communicators
Mark Brandon @icey_mark
@dougmcneall @flimsin depressing. Really depressing. I think that is what one calls a “drive by”?
This tweet from another UK academic (a while back) I concur with, and I believe that very many UK scientists are just like Dr Edwards, and as I imagine are most USA scientists, they just never get any media attention:
“If most climate scientists were like Tamsin, there’d be hardly any sceptics” @etzpcm
http://www.bris.ac.uk/geography/people/tamsin-l-edwards/overview.html
————————————-
But the important issue here, putting personalities to one side) is their is considerable disagreement (openly) in the community about aspects of Mann’s work, which I do not think we would have seen a couple of years ago..
What has changed.
Rob Wilson comments were originally made in a 2 hour lecture at St Andrews University.
http://bishophill.squarespace.com/blog/2013/10/21/wilson-on-millennial-temperature-reconstructions.html
Though we have ample evidence of ‘poor communication’ skills now of some scientists in the media.Wilson’s and Mann’s work is what should be discussed, .
I guess the alarmists are all feeling the heat now, but… that’s what they wanted, wasn’t it?
On July 6 Michael Mann retweeted Peter SInclair, “Ridley also repeats the tired “temp leads carbon” crock”
Mann has invited the treatment that he receives.
With the tweet deletions, I wonder if Penn State is getting involved, since his tweets are a refection on them. Dr Mann is required to honour Penn State policies such as:
“They respect and defend the free inquiry of their associates. In the exchange of criticism and ideas they show due respect for the opinions of others.”
” the faculty member agrees at all times to be accurate, to exercise appropriate restraint, to show respect for the opinions of others”
Of course, Cooch could be short for Coochie, first used in the late 1890s for Hoochy Coochie Man: meaning a person, a man, who either produced or enjoyed watching sexually provocative dancing shows by black females. Muddy Waters recorded the first song called (I’m Your) Hoochy Coochie Man in 1954. Maybe Mann has great expectations or just enjoys being a climate cooch?
Where is the outrage from his friends, peers, colleagues and employers? Their silence continues to allow such unprofessional conduct to undermine every working scientist. When every scientitst’s reputation is finally trashed and the public demands that most research is unafordable (coming sooner rather than later!) they will have no one to blame but themselves. I hope they all end up having to work for a living.
Whether we like it or not, Mann is almost as important as promoting the sceptic cause as Anthony.
Nasty little men mouthing off rarely impress anyone but themselves.
Newton was a pretty odd bird. One of his endearing traits was to write a groundbreaking paper which he then put away. Years later, when someone else independently came up with the same ideas, a very angry Newton would pull his paper out of storage and accuse them of stealing his ideas.
And, yes, Newton was prone to epic temper tantrums.
Tamsin Edwards: “you’re calling Rob a denier? ….That’s pretty strong… ”
Hey Tamsin, instead of
“that’s pretty strong” try
“that’s totally unacceptable behavior!!!!!!!”
Mann gets another free pass and Tamsin is hardly any better.
EternalOptimist says:
October 21, 2013 at 1:52 pm
Scientists are human, often exceptionally so. Newton & Einstein both behaved badly on occasion (well, often, in Sir Isaac’s case), but they had both actually achieved great things, unlike the forger Mann.
As noted on this blog, Einstein took umbrage at a paper of his being peer-reviewed. It turned out the critical reviewer was correct. Newton was frequently at war with someone, often more than one person at a time, notably Leibniz, Hooke & Flamsteed.
The term “nasty” is way too clean for Mann.
And he’s the best enemy the Warmistas could ever want.
Wow.
I am put in mind of some old advice.
“Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake”
I believe the name of that mistake just might be Mann
Gavin schmidt’s tweet on the matter
https://twitter.com/climateofgavin/status/392384557523025920
How rude, uncouth, and socially unacceptable.
Well, I never have had any interest in tweeting or following tweets and still don’t, but I think I’m going to get onto twitter just so I can follow Dr. Edwards. It’d be nice if she had more followers than Dr. Mann.
Mann = Queeg//Caine Mutiny//strawberries//ball bearings.
But Bogie was a far better actor.
Rud Istvan
Just to be clear, Rob Wilson vetted Bishop Hill’s post before it was published, Anthony has re-blogged a conversation that took place there
Gras Albert @ Lucia’s
I think the term “Asshat” fit Michael Mann well.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=asshat
Dr Mann has not figured out that shoddy work will follow him like a bad dream, all his life. The best he can do is admit it and move on. He cannot move on without some sort of admission of his crappy work.
=======================================================================
I never thought I’d be defending Mann but in this tweet I’m not so sure he meant it as the slang definition. (I’d never heard it before.)
I knew American preacher that went to England and spoke to a group of people. He wanted to tell them to “Get off your ass” but chose instead what he thought was a more dignified wording. He told them to “Get off your fanny.” In England at the time “fanny” meant the same as “cooch”.
What kind of serious scientist has a twitter feed? Is it really possible to communicate on climate science in 140 characters or less?
Disagree that Mann’s work is a crock of shit. One expects the contents of a crock to be fresh. A more appropriate container for Mann’s Oeuvre would be a bucket.
more solyent green!: “Is it really possible to communicate on climate science in 140 characters or less?”
— GHG heats air. Does not effect convection. Oceans are sneaky.
[62] characters of haiku.
Someone needs to remind the “good” Dr. Mann that all tweets are live-archived to the servers at the library of congress for posterity. Right now there isn’t a good way to search them, but they are working on that. All his nasty tweets will be there no matter how much he deletes them from the twitter feed. Once sent, they are forever available!
Some historian or sociologist is going to have a field day with his twitter blasts some day.
“125 characters of haiku.” — Some guy that can’t count.
Wrong column in the text editor… 62 Characters. Should have made a pair of haikus.
Risk is a funny word to use in the context of milder weather.
Risk of some projected warmth over parts of a large landmass?
As Onslow said to Daisy – “anything goes”.
http://www.wunderground.com/news/fall-winter-forecast-weather-channel-20131021
It doesn’t seem to occur to Mann that the entirely artificial, human-designed and computer-generated global climate models could be fallible. The fact that they don’t match the real temperature record except in the very narrow range of years used to calibrate the computer models is not so much a problem of incorrect design of the computer models but the failure of the natural world to properly record what really must be going on. In other words, the computer models become the real world and the real world is just a fallible proxy of the computer models. Yeah, I can see why Wilson might smell a stinky crock.
Gunga Din;
He told them to “Get off your fanny.” In England at the time “fanny” meant the same as “cooch”.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yeah, I remember being totally confused when someone from Britain asked me if I had a fag on me. Turns out he meant a cigarette, not the north american common use which would be a derogatory term for a gay man.
On the other hand, I am ex of Winnipeg, Manitoba, where a “Nip” means a hamburger. To this day I don’t know what a “Nip” means in Texas, only that when I tried to order one I got slapped.
Mike’s Mama used to chuck him under the chin, saying,”Coochie, coochie! Coo!”
And the phrase stuck!
Michael Mann and his Twitter feed are the gift that keeps on giving!
Just a point of clarification (re Mann’s use of the offensive word “cooch”), Mann is not the originator. It seems to have been coined by a Virginia-based abortion activist named Shelley Abrams, the founder and domain owner of coochwatch.com, created as a platform to attack Cuccinelli. This by no means exonerates Mann, guess he figures the local feminists have his backside covered
coochwatch.com is currently unavailable and returns a 503 error.
Here’s the most recent wayback archive:
https://web.archive.org/web/20121112035250/http://coochwatch.com/
Missing tree rings following the 1258/59 eruption? There’s a big problem here, equatorial eruptions are supposed to give warmer winters in the mid-upper latitudes, and cooler wetter summers, I can’t see how that would reduce ring size.
While strong cooling before the eruption would follow the usual pattern, so I looked to see if there was a frost ring in 1257:
“There are frost rings, however, in 1257 and 1029. While volcanically forced cooling in the AD 1200s has been tentatively associated with Anasazi cultural collapse and population movements on the Colorado Plateau ( Salzer, 2000 ), tree-ring growth associated with the large ice-core signal of 1259 was not small enough for this eruption to be identified using our method.”
http://media.longnow.org/files/2/Salzer_Hughes_2007.pdf
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I lived in Texas for a year. I don’t why that got you slapped.
I’ve heard “nip” used for a shot of whiskey. I’ve heard “nip” used (in old movies) as a Japanese.
In what type of establishment did you order a “nip”? 😎
(Just to be clear, that was meant as a joke! (and I sure hope “joke” doesn’t mean something odd in another country!))
@daviditron:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Understatement 🙂
N.B. I’m British…
@John West
Thanks! Welcome to Twitter. Do say hello.
Gunga Din
“In what type of establishment did you order a “nip”? 8-)”
———————————————————————-
If it was a Shinto Temple he got off lightly.
If it was in an Irish pub he also got off lightly as he should have stopped breathing from alcohol poisoning…….
to davidmhoffer says:
Not sure what Nip means in Texas, but growing up in CA it was a derogatory word for a person of Japanese (i.e., Nippon) descent. Chink was used similarly for Chinese, Gook for Vietnamese.
[“Nip” is normal word in long use, meaning “to cut off” – Usually, implying to cut off with a sharp instrument, close to the branch or source. Mod]
Gras Albert says:
October 21, 2013 at 3:00 pm
I see no evidence that Mann’s IQ is particularly high.
Engaging in his fraudulent activity would require an IQ no higher than 120, if that.
IN 2007 wilson and 9 other tree ring experts reported
“No current tree ring based reconstruction of extratropical Northern Hemisphere temperatures that extends into the 1990s captures the full range of late 20th century warming observed in the instrumental record.”
Obviously temperatures in natural habitat away from airports and heavily populated regions will not reflect urban warming. But Mann and other CO2 advocates argue that tree rings that do not show his modeled warming are essentially wooden-headed deniers. Such arguments truly earn “crock of the millennia” award.
Tamsin Edwards says:
October 21, 2013 at 3:46 pm
@daviditron:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Understatement 🙂
N.B. I’m British…
@John West
Thanks! Welcome to Twitter. Do say hello.
Yo, go girl!
The day is yours!
On holiday at present but when I get back near a family brat I will try Twitter to aid John West in his quest!
Mann HAS to defend himself — if his work is generally accepted as being the crap that we know it is then he, himself, is in deep kimchee. Look at how much of climate science literature is based on Mann’s work – think about what it would do the the reputations of those authors if Mann’s work was generally considered do-do. Think about how those scientists would THEN think about Mann… Scientific knives and a dramatic fade-away.
<i Tamsin Edwards says:
October 21, 2013 at 3:46 pm
@daviditron:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Understatement 🙂
N.B. I’m British…
=========================================
David, “that’s pretty strong” is Brit-speak for “WTF are you talking about ??!!??”
I always look forward to Tamsin’s insights, wherever they appear.
Mann has a PhD does he not – any resemblance to this fellow?
http://goo.gl/LywjPp
Observations:
– As to Mann’s idiocy in tweets, he should be advised by his associates that ‘less is more’ . . . . in fact wrt his tweets his associates should advise him that ‘none is more’.
– His problems with criticism means he choose the wrong career, science is a very very criticism filled world indeed. He should have gone into a night watchman career.
– He would be really funny if he wasn’t so pitiable.
Q => I wonder if he is he still on the sabbatical which started IIRC from 2011?
John
Manniac.
Mann’s work is piss poor and his intellect his so bereft of any value that he is unable to afford a pot to piss in.
Mods it’s not a swear word just an old word for urine 🙂
Nip is short for nipple of course.
Mann is his own best friend as he’ll never find another so faithful and forgiving of him as himself, and he is also his own worst enemy as nobody tries harder to make him look bad. He excels in both roles, don’t you think?.
den·i·er [ dénnyər ]
1. one who uses the term “denier” as a weapon. It is self-referencing.
Prior to this I’d always thought that being on pot was a lifestyle choice.
I now realise that it’s a fair, albeit scatalogical thumbs-down to post-normal BS!
So we’ve moved on from missing heat to missing tree rings? Is the overall new narrative going to be all about missing things?
shenanigans24 says:
October 21, 2013 at 4:49 pm
Nip is short for nipple of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
That thought occurred to me. That said, it was 20+ years ago. It was a greasy spoon diner across from the hotel I was in. If memory serves (and it frequently doesn’t) it was Austin. The manager came out and asked me to leave, so I did. I was too embarrassed to ask anyone, and actually forgot all about it until just now.
I think that after Mann sued Mark Steyn et all for comparing him to a sex pervert he damages his case by tweeting sexually abusive language.
MinB says:
“Not sure what Nip means in Texas, but growing up in CA it was a derogatory word for a person of Japanese (i.e., Nippon) descent. Chink was used similarly for Chinese, Gook for Vietnamese.”
I believe gook was used for Koreans originally. The story goes that the Korean word for Americans which is Miguk was heard by the Marines. As they kept hearing Koreans speak the word they took it as a self description.
And what would nonce like M.Mann know about cooch ?
(nonce, as in the slang meaning, not computer parlance)
Note the double-double entendre in Mann’s original tweet. We have “out of the closet” and “denier” all in less than 140 characters (not that I consider either attribute to be a negative per se).
Nice guy.
Well it’s about time some of the real scientists started distancing themselves from Meltdown Mann and his Crockey Stick. What took them so long?
Don’t you mess with me
But you know I’m him
Everybody knows I’m him
Well you know I’m the hoochie coochie Mann
Something tells me that Mann’s nomadic academic career is no accident. I also bet that he is invited to a lot of parties as a first time guest, but very seldom as a repeat guest.
shenanigans24 says:
October 21, 2013 at 5:59 pm
The term “gook” to refer to locals is attested among Marines during & after the Spanish-American War in the Philippines. Its etymology is obscure. It was later applied to Nicaraguans & Haitians during the Banana Wars.
Still, “American” in Korean, transliterated as “Miguk” or “Migug” is a plausible etymology, although the final consonant is almost silent when spoken. One name for Korea in Korean is “Hanguk/g”.
The ego of this twit knows no bounds.
Luke Warmist: “Is the overall new narrative going to be all about missing things?”
Always has been. It started from the absence of an ice age and has progressed to the absence of the absence of ice. They might have found this instructive, but the Wizard of Oz happens to be absent as well.
Let’s see, you berate Mann for calling Wilson a denier, but cheer Wilson for saying Mann’s work is shit. Doesn’t that seem a bit inconsistent? I am not defending Mann’s tweet, but Wilson’s comments are hardly the epitome of professionalism.
Jquip says:
October 21, 2013 at 6:54 pm
………
Thanks! Glad you cleared that up.
(I thought I was missing something :))
Does Mann actually do any real work or does he spend all his time being a raging A-hole on social media? How much are the taxpayers of Pennsylvania spending on a person that seems to do little work & the work that he does do is shoddy at best?
Mark X says:
October 21, 2013 at 6:57 pm
Let’s see, you berate Mann for calling Wilson a denier, but cheer Wilson for saying Mann’s work is shit. Doesn’t that seem a bit inconsistent?
————————————–
Not from the pov of truth, if Mann’s work is inaccurate, he should be called on it and that’s what is happening afaics.
Mark X says:
October 21, 2013 at 6:57 pm
Let’s see, you berate Mann for calling Wilson a denier, but cheer Wilson for saying Mann’s work is shit. Doesn’t that seem a bit inconsistent? I am not defending Mann’s tweet, but Wilson’s comments are hardly the epitome of professionalism.
One attacks the (a) person, the other attacks the quality of work.
A subtle, but distinct difference.
Dr. Edwards doesn’t need to “lecture” Mann about his tone; it is abundantly clear that his tone is more appropriate to an NFL defensive back on amphetamines and steroids.
In Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, there is a restaurant chain known as Salisbury House. They serve what are called “Nips”. This is a hamburger. Salisbury House is a 24 hour diner where breakfast is served all day. People in England often go for a “curry” after an evening at the pub. In Winnipeg, after a night in the bar, people would head to “Sals”.
The “Cheese Nip” is quite a good burger, as it is served plain (no condiments), yet has caramelized onions and real aged cheddar cheese, and the bun is warmed on top of the onions, cheese, and patty while they are cooking.
The quality of food from this establishment is hotly debated amongst Winnipegers, but at 3:30am, it is rarely refused.
Sorry, but you are a bit detached from reality here; you need to get more outside and see what the other kids are doing in the non-climate world.
The ‘Cooch’ is widely and casually called that, with no intent to associate him with any female private parts. E.g. I have just seen a The Young Turks clip where the host Cenk calls him Cooch short for his name, obviously in a ‘buddy’-way; that is like calling Bush ‘Dubya’, or calling a Matthew ‘Matt’ – hey, that’s me! Maybe the spelling is a bit unfortunate here, but you got to keep it real and not get your knickers in a twist over everything. Picking something seemingly clever out of a dictionary can still leave you looking stupid if you evidently don’t know what you are talking about 🙂
Mark X says: October 21, 2013 at 6:57 pm
Let’s see, you berate Mann for calling Wilson a denier, but cheer Wilson for saying Mann’s work is shit. Doesn’t that seem a bit inconsistent? I am not defending Mann’s tweet, but Wilson’s comments are hardly the epitome of professionalism.
Dang, looks like someone has borrowed my name!
Re the issue at hand, I think if Wilson had previously discussed it openly with Mann, and had made no headway, it is probably legitimate to bring attention to his view on the work. And yes, he talks about that work, not Mann himself.
Mikey’s ego is really starting to look like an epic embarrassment and liability to the warmists. Heck, it seems like Mikey is embroiled in a another brouhaha every week.
It can’t be long before they throw his sorry ass under the bus.
Matt @ 9:05pm
Yeah Matt. Wouldn’t want you to leave here looking like you don’t know what you’re talking about.
Oh…wait. http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cooch
“I thought the word was “count”, or is that too upper class?”
The British Peerage was very careful to rename that particular rank (between Duke and Earl) as “Marquess”…….
Sure Matt (21st@9:05pm), Mann calls the man a #denier and then you think he turns around an calls him ol’ “buddy”? Didn’t know Mann is Turkish as you mention. Sounds more like you are reclassifying Mann as either deceptive, you know, a good deciever, or maybe just two faced. Guess any of those fit too. Maybe you are right there.
JimS –
Alarmists are deniers of an actual Holocaust, the people freezing to death in Europe because oif carbon taxes, and the Africans starving because corn and soybeans are diverted to ethanol and biodiesel. If these policies aren’t reversed the death toll could eventually rival that of the Nazi Holocaust. GLOBAL WARMING ALARMISM IS MASS MURDER, period.
Entertaining.
“Michael E. Mann
@MichaelEMann
@dougmcneall I disagree w/ that, as do many climate change communicators”
Climate change communicators? So he’s admitting he’s not a climate scientist! Well done Mike!
I suspect mann has begun to realize that his hopes for a cushy retirement in a high-carbon-footprint lifestyle, are rapidly being flushed (along with his hockey stick). The latrine floodgates are opening upon him and he’s flailing in panic, now.
I was trying to think of where I had heard this kind of behaviour before and then it came to me:
Lance Armstrong.
The more sh*t that was hurled his way the stronger the denials from Armstrong became. Seems to me you don’t need to resort to such behaviour if you know the truth is on your side.
We’re seeing them crack one by one.
(Just the other day a well known blogger from the warm side descended into outright madness; starting to post personal info or what he thought was personal info about his opponent on a blog).
Serious Xanax shortage on the warm side. Obamacare responsible?
Ryan says:
October 22, 2013 at 3:03 am
“I was trying to think of where I had heard this kind of behaviour before and then it came to me:
Lance Armstrong.”
Correct me if I’m wrong but Armstrong didn’t get foul-mouthed for all I know.
Matt says:
October 21, 2013 at 9:05 pm
“Sorry, but you are a bit detached from reality here; you need to get more outside and see what the other kids are doing in the non-climate world.
The ‘Cooch’ is widely and casually called that, with no intent to associate him with any female private parts. E.g. I have just seen a The Young Turks clip where the host Cenk calls him Cooch short for his name”
So because a hard left Al Gore sycophant and employee uses the word – or the Left in general – makes it acceptable behaviour? In other words, you think that the Tea party are arsonists, terrorists, and have dynamite strapped to their chest?
And your call your worldview “reality”? No, your worldview is the Orwellian 5 minute hate of the day as dished up by the Left media bloc.
Stop taking the Mexican Xanax.
Mike Ozanne says October 21, 2013 at 10:59 pm:
The problem only came about, Mark, when the elevation of rank was announced in The Guardian.
“DirkH says:
October 22, 2013 at 4:40 am”
Until he got found out!
Interesting too that Prof Mann thinks that someone tweeting on his feed is raising their profile by the mere fact of interacting with the great man.
Reading his tweets, one has to wonder if Mann has a good cardiologist.
======================================================================
I remember about 40 years years in Lexington Kentucky there was a diner that was actually called “The Greasy Spoon”. It was near the UK campus and was open all night.
I ate there once. The manager didn’t have to tell me not to come back.
..’In England at the time “fanny” meant the same as “cooch”.’
Still does.
As a relative newbie to the subject of Climate change I have studied very carefully the so called evidence for AGW and my opinion is that the “evidence’ is extremely thin to being below the noise floor.
To anyone that can process simple data and read what the charts are saying the above statement is obvious. The IPCC so grossly over complicates the subject (1200 pages) instead of looking at their models that are so inaccurate in their predictions as to be laughable. I am only talking about AGW and CO2 . To say that a 30 year pause in Global warming is in line with their AGW theory is beyond the pale and is to me an obvious admission of failure and a ruse to explain the last 15 years of pause to keep the money flowing.
A question I have thought about for a while is : Who is this Michael Mann ? And why is the Industrial wealth of the developed world in his hands although I suspect not for long!
How can such an unelected mediocre scientist atain such a position of trust when it is obvious to all that he obviously can’t read or play hockey.
Well, we could start by saying manners maketh Mann. But I think Steve Harley put it best.
“Mann, it was mean, it was mean. Man it was mean.”
And it’s only going to get meaner. Michael Mann is far from the only obnoxious voice on the alarmist side. It’s just that he’s such a good hater by nature. Many other leading figures such as Gore and Hansen now regularly go way over the top, while the establishment chorus of politicians and journalists are getting increasingly desperate as their singing voices are becoming ever more shrill.
Then there are the rank and file alarmists and the trolls (doubtless in the pay of Big Wind) who mount thuggish attacks anyone who comments unfavorably on their home turf such as at the Guardian’s CIF. I swear a lot of the latter group must be chat-bots or cyber-drones.
While most of us on this side are interested in science for its own sake, what we’re dealing with on the other side is a political movement aimed at carrying out an agenda. These people aren’t going to let Marquis of Queensbury rules stand in their way and they aren’t going to be very happy or polite if they are placed in a position where they are called upon to defend indefensible scientific theories and dodgy statistical analysis. So by all means, let’s keep up the pressure on them.
When I read about Drs. Mann and Hansen, I’m always reminded of Trofim Lysenko. He got a head start on his opposition, got the establishment on his side, kept coming up with more and more “ideas”, generally rubbished his rivals and denounced his critics, and, crucially, got the Lenin Academy of Agricultural Sciences to teach Lysenkoism as “the only correct theory”. It didn’t seem to matter that very little of what Lysenko prescribed actually did any good, and the overall results for Soviet agriculture were horrific.
Despite their current prominence, Hansen and Mann don’t have anything like the power or influence that Lysenko had, but the arrogance, contempt and hubris they display suggests they would grab power and influence if they could and they would use it to push through energy policies that could be just as destructive to industrial society as Lysenko’s were to agriculture.
With these thoughts in mind, I think the sooner it’s Mann Overboard the better.
Snotrocket – brilliant!!!
“The problem only came about, Mark, when the elevation of rank was announced in The Guardian.”
🙂
I’m sure that a peerage for the good Doctor would be a Barony, Baron Mannchausen has a nice ring to it.. of course many would think of him as a rank Count, or almost anyway….
At this point, anyone still publicly supporting the work or actions of Michael Mann is putting their own professional reputation at risk.
Piltdown Mann: The Story of Climate Fraud.