This is excerpts from a column that appeared Sunday by Chico Enterprise-Record editor David Little. To say he’s annoyed would be an understatement, especially when he titles it ‘Another startling episode of ‘Your Tax Dollars At Work’ – Anthony
By DAVID LITTLE
I fish and I hunt, which means I send about $200 a year to the state for hunting and fishing licenses, tags, stamps and report cards.
Add my wife, daughter and son to the tab, and our house pays probably $500 a year to the state.
…
It’s a minor annoyance, however, as long as you know that money is going to a good cause. I’d like my money to be spent on increasing the fishing and hunting opportunities for all Californians, and managing fish and game populations so future generations can enjoy the same hunting and fishing traditions, as my children already do.
Money spent by anglers and hunters should benefit fishing and hunting, simple as that.
That’s why I was annoyed Wednesday to see a news release from the state Department of Fish and Game with the subject line: “DFG Launches Climate College to Better Understand, Address Climate Change.”
I learned a lot from this earnest news release. For example, I didn’t know the DFG had a “Climate Science and Renewable Energy Branch.” I always thought the DFG was focused on fish and game, critters and habitat, not windmills and snowpacks. The state has other departments to study that, right?
This Climate College, the DFG proudly noted in its press release, is being launched “to increase climate literacy.” (Huh?) …The release promised “lectures, presentations, online discussions, reading assignments and a final project.” The reward for completing the course? A “certificate of completion.” And “the opportunity to show their final project to DFG leadership.” Oh joy.
…
The release went on to say: “The college is another initiative that keeps California at the forefront of climate-related planning and action.” OK, maybe there’s a place for that in state government. I don’t think it’s the Department of Fish and Game (emphasis on fish and game).
…
When Californians forked over $52.9 million last year for fishing licenses and stamps, and $22.7 million for hunting licenses and tags — a grand total of more than $75 million — I’m betting they didn’t think it would be used to help develop a Climate College or to fund the salary of a person called “Climate Change Adviser.”
==================================================
You can read the press release from DFG here:
DFG Launches Climate College to Better Understand, Address Climate Change
You can visit the “Climate College” here: www.dfg.ca.gov/Climate_and_Energy/Climate_Change/Climate_College/ .
Look at who is involved, its like an episode of Government Gone Wild:
DFG Climate Training Stakeholder Working Group
Not content to have a California Climate College, they have even bigger plans:
The USFWS National Conservation Training Center will roll out the National Climate Academy in October 2012. In the spirit of collaboration DFG is working in partnership with the steering committee to coordinate training activities and materials between the two courses. Both courses compliment each other and build on the need for increased communication and collaboration around climate change.
Religion.
Kurt in Switzerland
Don’t even get me started on the hated Adventure Pass.
What a load of tosh.
And when you buy bread, the TAX should be spent on supporting the growing of more agricultural products, and when you buy a gun or ammunition, the TAX should be spent on buying tanks, stealth figthers and making war in general bla-bla-bla. How well reasoned, isn’t it? The state has the right to do whatever they seem fit with TAX money. Is this really news to anyone? Why would anyone write an article about it, and why would you repost it – only because it somehow got the word “climate” in there? No matter how nonsensical it is? TAX can be spent on anything. In Germany, we have the champagne TAX – it was introduced by the Kaiser to finance the war fleet – one Reichsmark a bottle (later a DM = 0.5 EUR), and we still pay it, even though there is no more Kaiser and we are currently not building a new fleet… just my favourite example amongst the gazillion taxes that “don’t serve their purpose”.
But it is still a befitting example for Americans. You know, if you happen to live in a country that has military presence in +170 countries of some 190 in total, then that money got to come from SOMEWHERE. You spend more money on the military than all those other +190 together (still bitching it is somehow not enough…) — but here you are bemoaning that a few bucks for your hunting license are spent on climate research or whatever. You got other, REAL problems, but the fact that you post this nonsense shows that you are oblivious to them.
The reasons to leave keep piling up, don’t they? Get out while you still have the chance.
The inmates are running the asylum in my home state.
Make sure you vote for that tax increase our senile governor wants this November.
“Thou shalt not question the consensus nor obstruct it’s Holy Quest… Your contributions are duly noted in the book of penitence…” Religion not allowed in government? Except for GREEN religion. Yeesh.
“Both courses compliment each other…”
It would probably be better if the two courses were to “complement” one another, but, hey, this is the post-normal climate world where pal review reigns …..
Anyone who has ever dealt with the California Department of Fish and Game to try and pass “environmental review” to permit an energy project will not be surprised at this latest outrage. Of all the governmental agencies I ever had to deal with, DFG was the least honorable and most politically driven by a wide margin.
What’s needed is a fishing and hunting strike statewide and let the politicos make up the difference out of their pockets, preferably from their election funds kitty. You know who they are so kick them out of office as many as possible.
Matt says:
September 10, 2012 at 11:04 pm
Blah blah blah….”The state has the right to do whatever they seem fit with TAX money.”
==========================================================================
Well Matt, it is thinking like that which was cause for the existence of the USA. Please stay in Germany where such statist idealogy is welcome. First of all learn the difference between a tax, and a fee, and then begin to understand why it is rational to place limitations on government powers of spending. after reading, (and getting an education) about the ideals on which the USA was founded consider anotherpost and then consider putting in a link to your off topic assertions on military spending. Strange how a european whines like a little girl about US military spending, and then begs the US to deal with a little problem like Lybia.
Wild? You ain’t heard nothing yet.
Get a job as a government lifeguard in California.
$200,000 per anum and chicks for free!
http://bit.ly/Q9SEG8
they should be buying snow ploughs for the next ice age
If license monies are collected as tax, I suppose the government can use as they see fit. If they are collected as fees I would expect them to go to support the activity for which they are being collected.
Luckily I don’t live in California. Not that Connecticut handles its money much better. 🙁
Kind of like watching a developing train wreck when you’re watching a State commit suicide like this.
It’s right out of ‘Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy’, replete with ‘management buzzwords’.
Money chasing the Myth that is Anthropogenic Global Warming/Climate Change/Disruption/Hysteria.
When is California going to get a reality check? If ever?
Matt says:
September 10, 2012 at 11:04 pm
What a load of tosh.
And when you buy bread, the TAX should be spent on supporting the growing of more agricultural products, and when you buy a gun or ammunition, the TAX should be spent on…
I couldn’t disagree more. Tax bread so the Government can use that tax to support growing more “agricultural products”? How about forgetting the tax, forgetting the subsidies, and letting the market decide the price of bread? Too crazy for some, I guess. As far as I’m concerned, when I buy bread it has nothing – I mean absolutely nothing – to do with the government. I shouldn’t be taxed at all for buying anything. I shouldn’t have to buy a license – aka the Government’s permission – to fish, I shouldn’t have to buy the Government’s permission to watch TV… I could go on with my gripes over Governmental control and theft from the people. But if you accept that these taxes are right then you’ve given up your right to complain about how those taxes are spent. It’s like complaining to a thief that after he squandered your money away on booze instead of something sensible, when you should be saying “That’s MY money, you thieving b@***ard!”
Matt,
You obviously don’t understand how the system works in common law based countries in the Anglosphere, where democracy and limited government have existed for centuries (though are now under threat).
In our countries the power of governments to impose “taxes” is subject to strict controls. They differ from country to country but are designed to ensure that a “tax” is properly approved according to special procedures that don’t apply to other laws. When money is confiscated from citizens otherwise than by a “tax” (or a fine or penalty for some wrongdoing) it is supposed to be done only on the basis that the citizen gets something in return for it. There may not be highly precise rules about exactly what is a “tax” and what isn’t, or what counts as a citizen getting something in return for having their money taken away other than by a “tax”. That’s in part because a good deal of our system of government operates by convention rather than by express rules.
It may well be that in California it is not strictly illegal for money coerced for a hunting or fishing “licence” to be used for “climate college”. However, to anyone who lives in democracies which have the benefit of those long standing freedoms there is something obnoxious about being made to pay a “licence” fee just to do something and then find out that the money is being applied to fund something so far removed from any benefit to the payer of the licence fee.
Matt
Maybe Germany would have been better off if our military hadn’t invaded in WWII?
Anyway, here is the description of what the fees are SUPPOSED to go to (pay specific attention to the last line):
California law establishes fishing and hunting license fees each year for the DFG. The base fee for sport fishing licenses established in Fish and Game Code Section 7149 and the fees for validations and most report cards are established in other sections of the FGC or Title 14, of the California Code of Regulations.
The FGC requires license fees adjust in responce to increases (or decreases) in costs of goods and services using an index called the Implicit Price Deflator (Fish and Game Code Section 713). This index is a gauge of the change in the cost of goods and services from year to year.
For example, as hatchery, law enforcement and wildlife management costs have increased, license fees needed to increase to keep pace with these rising costs. Essentially, license fees adjust up and down to compensate for inflation or deflation. If license fees did not adjust for inflation, then funding for fish and wildlife management and protection would actually decrease because the buying power of a dollar has declined over the years.
Generally, the cost of goods and services increases at a fairly steady, slow rate. About two to three percent per year is common. In recent years, some costs have increased dramatically, particularly the cost of fuel. Because of this, the cost of goods and services jumped approximately 6.19% and 2009 license fees increased accordingly. If the cost of goods and services were to decrease, then license fees would actually decrease the same percentage.
Although fishing and hunting license fees have increased throughout the years, the increase ensures that the DFG has adequate funding to manage California’s diverse fish and wildlife resources and provide the public with enjoyable fishing and hunting experiences.
Hmmmmm…..I dont see a Climate College listed in there anywhere…do you?
This IS California you are talking about. The state that should have “State of Insanity” on its licence plates. The state that has 12% of the US population and one third of the welfare recipients. The state that has to find masses of new sinecures every election for the Senators and Members who can’t stand for re-election. The state that on some definitions is technically insolvent.
What do you expect?
The warming alarmists got a hundred billion dollars in federal taxes and its not enough. It only kickstarted The Blob, which will now consume every resource. After all, it has great MORAL URGENCY on its side (regardless of how fraudulent) and hence is simply more important than mere human or animal concerns.
Matt: “You know, if you happen to live in a country that has military presence in +170 countries of some 190 in total, then that money got to come from SOMEWHERE.”
Obviously it comes from hunting and fishing licenses. Which doesn’t seem near as out of place as the Bund keeping about the Kaiser’s Flotilla tax on French flotsam. But good luck to you when elections are next held.
@Matt…
I sort of agree with you. European countries should be left to fend for themsleves. Let them provide for their own securith, because we sure as hell can’t afford to do it for them anymore.
Governments raise taxes for all sorts of things from various different sources, so spending hunting and fishing license money on other things is no surprise.
The point is that California is bankrupt because of the incredible waste of money spent by dismal management and unscrupulous politicians on trendy green programs, armies of bureaucrats, needless subsidies and croneyism.
So this is just another instance of the above – how long will it be before this ‘Climate College’ is assigned to the dustbin of history? My guess is around 3-5 years. California still has to axe a lot of pointless expenditure before it has any hope of rescuing itself from its present financial mire. When they, or the administrators, start to get serious, then this ‘Climate College’ will be one of the first things to be scrapped.
So this returns me to the point made in this article: Why not spend the money, raised from licenses and permits, on something useful and tangible like preserving California’s fishing and hunting resources for future generations? The problem is this: It is not trendy, nor green, and does not require an army of bureaucrats to administer.
September 10, 2012 at 11:04 pm | Matt says:
———————————————————
I’m not privy as to how you are taxed in Deutschland, Matt, but in many other countries where a licence fee, levy, or tax is raised by a government agency that is not the Tax Department, there is a stated reason for its collection and use. Consolidating it to general revenue and spending it at will is an abuse of the licence, levy or tax.
[snip . . OT . . but interesting enough to post on Tips & Notes . . kbmod]
“You got other, REAL problems, but the fact that you post this nonsense shows that you are oblivious to them.”
No, it is not the place to post articles for those other non AGW grievances. This article is perfectly appropriate for this site. For a state like CA to introduce wasteful spending in a deficit ‘climate’ like they have there, is totally mind blowing to me. If they can waste money on this, there is no end to their stupidity and they deserve the ending they will get.
Ooooh, I can’t wait to see the certificate, i want one of those.
Gee Matt we should be good citizens and not question govt unless of course it something you disagree with. Maybe if eu got off their dead beat buts and did something we wouldn’t have to. Remember the African nation that use to be Liberia? Civil war got to protect the innocent and all that. Bush said not our fight. EU begged him to send troops. What a bunch of hypocrits. Hate american muscle and money until
we say no.
It isn’t often that I get my back up about this stuff but when they start messing with the money spent by hunters and fishermen, it gets my attention. I lived in California for 17 years. I left 20 years ago because I saw the writing on the wall. Best move I ever made. But, I still have deep connections to the state and I have lots of family living there. The hunting and fishing opportunities in California are really spectacular and they have been nurtured by those who enjoy those opportunities. To have their resources squandered on this stupid global brainwash is a crime. Those of us who pay out for tags and licenses every year do so in good faith. That faith has been broken in California. If I still lived in California and I was having to pay the freight for this garbage, I would skip a year, maybe two years. I would hunt in the Steens or the Rubys, hey Colordo has elk and deer. I am sure you always wanted to do a dream hunt somewhere else. Why, Wyoming is going to have some really cheap wolf hunts. It could be fun. And, it is an opportunity to flex your economic muscle and set the record straight. Those whackos in Sacramento need to know who butters their bread.
. . and Liberia originated how exactly? If there is any external power in the world that should be responsible for Liberia it’s the USA. And it is still a member of the UN, so it didn’t used to be Liberia, it still is Liberia.
But back to Matt’s point – fees are not taxes and are usually ringfenced. Taxes may or may not be hypothecated; politicians hate hypothecated taxes, so almost all aren’t.
On the face of it this use of licence fees seems like an abuse. It will have to be left to your US lawyers to figure that one out.
Next, I suggest that policemen should study the effect of climate on crime, instead of gun training or crowd control seminars. One course could address urban heat islands and the effect on crime statistics. Oh, I forgot—there is no UHI effect: cities are actually the same temperature as adjacent rural areas. Mann, Hansen, Madonna and Trenberth said so.
The govt. in CA are really losing it when they start to piss off the people with guns, In the UK, the govt. get worried when they get handbagged by grannies.
You’re all forgetting the DoFG’s crusade to save the delta smelt from evil farmers. Bill Marsh mentioned the ‘Hitchhikers’ Guide to the Galaxy’, which had its own little fish, the Babel fish. The delta smelt should be renamed the babble fish, babble being what passes for intelligent discourse amongst those in California who would bankrupt the “Sunshine State” in the name of something which is never defined – “sustainability”.
So PETA and other groups in California still allow people to hunt and fish in California?
Hey guys, Libya is different from Liberia. Libya is large, up on the north coast next to Egypt. Liberia is small, down on the southwest, Atlantic coast of West Africa.
California is three bats left of the moon.
Makes me want to check where my license fees in Virginia go. Like most folks I assume they go so support hunting, fishing and other wildlife resources but I never check. My guess is Kalifornia believes it can get away with diverting funds because people won’t check on where the money goes.
The college does have to do with hunting and fishing. The next step will be to require hunters and fishermen to go there, before they get their licence. It is called a reeducation camp. The last step is to require hunters and fishermen to go there, and then not let them out.
This has actually happened in other parts of the world. However California thinks, “It can’t happen here.” (Frank Zappa)
Agree with Matt.
Income tax isn’t spent just on economic development. Taxes are taxes.
p.s. The idea of a fishing license is alien and bizarre to me.
Would be interesting to see if they are allowed by California law or thats it in their remit to do this with license money,would of thought any monies taken by this agency would be have to used for
the betterment of those paying it in the first place?
Wow, someone will be telling me next that our car tax in the UK does not all go on road maintenance. I wonder if hunting and fishing are related in some strange way to the environment and climate? Tax is tax, you can call it a ‘fee’ you can call it anything you like, it goes into the same coffers. I would also caution Europeans against commenting on Fee/Tax affairs in the US. In Europe they are seen as a necessarry evil, in much of the US they are seen as completely unacceptable except to fund very basic services and the military. Politics in the US are completely different to those of Europe and not really comparable.
And Bosnia, Kosovo, etc.
This is so foreign to what I expect in New Hampshire. I don’t hunt or fish, but don’t grumble about the fairly recent parking permit fee in the White Mountains.
Our Fish & Game department is so strapped for money that they try to get reimbursed from the idiots who go hiking completely unprepared for delays from weather, darkness, lack of maps, etc.
They also refused to admit there are Mountain Lions in NH, we suspect because they don’t want to spend money on educational programs on what to do when you see one. Then one of the rangers saw one and now the official line is the only lions are escaped pets.
F&G does okay with the rest of their stuff. About the only “waste” has been free distribution of “I brake for moose” bumper stickers. And that was a pretty efficient educational project.
Maybe DFG can make one that says “I’d rather be walking.”
Nice to see that ‘Both courses compliment each other’ – perhaps they have a budget to send each other admiring emails or for advertisements telling each other how wonderful they are.
This Climate College, the DFG proudly noted in its press release, is being launched “to increase climate literacy.” …The release promised “lectures, presentations, online discussions, reading assignments and a final project.”
Reading between the lines, that sounds like a program for paid vacations from doing any productive work, except worse than simple amicable corruption as rather a diseducation campaign of indoctrinating with propaganda from the usual dishonest sources.
“It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so.”
— usually attributed to Mark Twain
Advancing partisan agendas is not the proper usage of tax dollars. Anything superficially labeled as “education” sometimes faces an Emperor’s New Clothes situation of almost nobody wanting to seem less than respectful; in reality, some types of educational spending have contributed greatly to the beneficial advancement of industrialized technological civilization — but others are of net harm starting from opportunity costs in allocation of limited economic resources. Bit by bit, waste (and worse than simple waste like this) adds up to contribute to harming the economy and society.
AGW corruption expands until it either meets strong resistance or absorbs all resources available.
I would sue the state of California for violating the reason the money was designated to be collected for.
Maybe even a petition for a ballot initiative to force the state to spend money as designed.
AGW is a social madness that is inherently destructive.
Another misdirected agency–yesterday I read an article (on AOL News) about NASA’s new ship to study the unexpected and completely unexplained ocean salinity changes. NASA? Really? This was linked to global warming (of course). Doesn’t NASA have another job?
Matt,
I recall a cross- country flight during the Arab Oil Embargo of ’73 during which a fellow passenger from Germany was going on and on about the German superiority of this and that and especially of German ideas of government. Not being very politically savvy yet, at the age of 22, I didn’t have much to say to counter that blowhard until he started talking about the superiority of German oil and gas ownership by the state. I finally got him to shut up by simply asking “where are the great German oil discoveries and oilfields around the world? What are the great German innovations in oil extraction and transport”?
By the way Matt, do you happen to recall the reason that there has been a continuous US military presence in in your country since 1945? Those in the know make a good case that our presence is needed now, as much as any time in past.
Matt, your thinking, and that of some of your countrymen whom I have encountered over the years, leads me to believe that the sentiment is correct.
Some people just never get it.
From the Declaration of Independence:
“Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
How much longer are we to suffer the evils of our own government?
Perhaps the chicken or the egg question. Government that has no boundary will propagate its own demise. How can sane-objective scientific minds find or produce any resolve in a centralized system that refuses resolve-solution? Government – “Government is not reason, nor eloquence. It is force. And like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearsome master” George Washington.
You need a license in the States to kill things? For me, killing anything for a laugh is what Americans did, no matter how it’s dressed up. Killing things for entertainment is just wrong. I think that’s why I have such a problem with this blogspot. The science is disappearing and polemic is flowering; in the garden of contributors, all the flowers lean to the right and libertarian. Very scientific.
Is there any country in the world that actually taxes *bread*?
None that I know of.
Steve Lohr says:
September 11, 2012 at 1:18 am
It isn’t often that I get my back up about this stuff but when they start messing with the money spent by hunters and fishermen, it gets my attention. I lived in California for 17 years. I left 20 years ago because I saw the writing on the wall. Best move I ever made.
____________________
One can hardly drive anywhere, here in Oklahoma City, without seeing Caiifornia license plates. They tell me it’s worse in the “fashionable” places, like Denver. Californication.
On a recent short drive across part of the OKC metro, I counted 8 construction cranes.
Elsewhere in the city, an 850′ skyscraper was recently completed and all of the other construction “downtown” makes navigation an aggravation.
To the elected leaders of CA:
Is anyone even building a chicken coop in California?
The climate in California, for whatever reason, has been changing. These changes have impacted fish and game and other wildlife. So, why shouldn’t some part of the license fee go toward studying this?
Matt: I think your point is basically correct, but if this license fee had traditionally been only used for fish and game issues and was now being diverted to something unrelated and even frivolous, hunters and fishers would be expected to object. (As I stated above I don’t think a changing climate is unrelated to fish and game issues.)
“For me, killing anything for a laugh is what Americans did, no matter how it’s dressed up.”
Jim B, unless you are 100% vegetarian, your hypocrisy falls on deaf ears here. Hunters will eat the meat from the animals they harvest. No different then if you get it plastic wrapped from the meat department at your local grocer. Dead is dead, whether it was brought on with a smile or from low wage workers at a packing plant.
This looks like something organized by an ICLEI (an Agenda 21 organization of the United Nations Environmental Program). Chico has one but, unless it is disguising itself by another name, I don’t see Chico ICLEI on the list of ‘stakeholders’. The CA LCC logo with its interlocking (sort of) circles might be a mask.
the religion of government. Facts we don’t need no stinking facts, we just want you to do as we say.
mbw says:
September 11, 2012 at 6:16 am
mbw says:
September 11, 2012 at 6:20 am
The use of taxes and fees are spelled out in the taxing authority document. If that document defines the intended use of the funds, that is what the funds must be used for. Most municipalities have a general revenue fund that is used for operating expenses and all other revenue is designated for specific things. Unfortunately at the state and federal level things can become clouded as most of the money collected goes to the general fund. However, if a specific fee is collected from a subset of the population for services provided, that revenue must be used to provide those services. Now, politicians know they can sneak just about anything by the population because most people just don’t care enough to take any meaningful action. So once again, the blame ultimately falls on us for allowing them to do what they do.
Matt’s random coherent utterance of September 10, 2012 at 11:04 pm:
“In Germany, we have the champagne TAX – it was introduced by the Kaiser to finance the war fleet – one Reichsmark a bottle (later a DM = 0.5 EUR), and we still pay it, even though there is no more Kaiser and we are currently not building a new fleet… just my favourite example amongst the gazillion taxes that “don’t serve their purpose”.”
And the CAGW crowd wants to address perceived problems how? Why by instituting new taxes and regulation on a global scale. Long after the AGW hoax has faded into history the taxes and regulations would still be there to enrich the lives of an elite privledged few who have moved on to other more timely crises that require still more control.
“A Prince, whose Character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the Ruler of a free People.” T. Jefferson, US Declaration of Independence
Live Free!
Matt/Jim R
Remind me again which bridge you live under?
If it wasn’t for us “killing things just for the fun of it” Americans, you Germans/Euros would either be living under the Kaiser or Hitler (I am actually surprised it took this long for Godwin to poke his head out…sorry it was me…).
The fact that “Americans” get so pissed off about where our government spends our money, is one of the reasons we ARE Americans…we believe government should answer to the people not the other way around.
I can’t speak for other states, but in Oklahoma, Fish & Game takes no money from the general fund. It is solely supported by hunting and fishing license fees.
****
Matt says:
September 10, 2012 at 11:04 pm
****
Your problem is that you think the people should work for the government, not the other way around. Thanks for demonstrating this perversion so clearly. No wonder so many Europeans fled Europe…
In Oregon, there are folks in tucked away counties who, even though are licensed to hunt, are not allowed to hunt in areas they can get to. Why? Because they don’t put in for tags in places their budget does not allow them to get to and are lucky if they pull a tag in an area they can get to. In this economy, these folks depend on game animal meat. What do you think they should eat instead? Rats?
I was raised in my grandparents’ foster home. Back then, foster care was essentially something you did out of the goodness of your heart with little outside funding. My grandparents kept their brood fed with game and garden. We ate well. Under the current restrictions, we would have had to depend on foodstamps.
Let’s get America back to where it belongs, in the hands of its people.
walbright@dfg.ca.gov
I just sent an email with telling them my displeasure…..
Fools and their money….No, wait…Fools and our money…
Duncan said on September 11, 2012 at 4:39 am:
Feudalism Revived. All wildlife belongs to the Lords, you must gain the permission of the Lords to hunt or fish or trap, and pay whatever taxes the Lords require to grant such indulgences.
Likewise you are not to question what the Lords do with the taxes they have ordered paid, it is your duty to pay them to the Lords regardless.
So be a good loyal serf and don’t question the actions of the Lords. And willingly pay the Lords whatever tax they shall demand for their permission to emit carbon dioxide.
So was the Kaiser’s “champagne tax” the original carbon dioxide tax”? And the only correctly labelled one? Bubbles the mind!
Beng Says:Your problem is that you think the people should work for the government, not the other way around. Thanks for demonstrating this perversion so clearly. No wonder so many Europeans fled Europe…
That may have been true in the past, but many Americans these days are trying to get out and emigrating to Europe. It’s tough for them to get in, which I think is a bit ungrateful of us, but most villages in the UK now have their collection of American immigrants happily settling down in their chosen country. The UK is a popular destination because of the language and relatively high standard of living, but many on the political right in the UK are pressing for no more as they feel we have enough population as it is. Perhaps we could swap populations, those who enjoy low taxes, but don’t mind poor services could go to the States, while those who don’t mind paying taxes but want to see the results in a good welfare state can come here. By the way we have fishing licenses but no hunting etc.
Go Home says:
September 11, 2012 at 6:35 am
“For me, killing anything for a laugh is what Americans did, no matter how it’s dressed up.”
Jim B, unless you are 100% vegetarian, your hypocrisy falls on deaf ears here. Hunters will eat the meat from the animals they harvest. No different then if you get it plastic wrapped from the meat department at your local grocer. Dead is dead, whether it was brought on with a smile or from low wage workers at a packing plant.
Good Lord, Are you saying these hunters eat Wolves, Big cats, Bears and suchlike? Things are worse than I thought. By the way harvesting bears and wolves seems to be an odd description. Apart from trawling I had always seen a harvest as a result of ploughing. sowing reaping and mowing, something that farmers did. I have this really strange picture of our Church having it’s harvest supper with dead bears and wolves all over the altar. Maybe it’s a language thing. I agree though that I would rather eat wild game any day than factory farmed chickens or beef from feedlots. Pheasant are the ultimate in free range chickens.
kadaka beat me to identifying Matt as a “serf”.Not to mention being a whiny little bootlicker.
I guess generations of living under a semi-feudal system have bred the love of freedom out of these servile little drones.
Dang, Alec, you could’ve fixed a lot of road and bridges with 100 billion. So what happened to the fuel and road use taxes to pay for road & bridge construction? How much of that got diverted to warmists? Anyone know?
SpaghettiO is all smiles about getting us into more debt to fix roads.
Diverting money from where it was intended to special interest projects has been a bipartisan sport, unfortunately. Arrrrrrggghhhh!
Lancifer says:
September 11, 2012 at 8:39 am
kadaka beat me to identifying Matt as a “serf”.Not to mention being a whiny little bootlicker.
I guess generations of living under a semi-feudal system have bred the love of freedom out of these servile little drones.
And to add insult to injury they have a higher standard of living, lower unemployment and a higher lifestyle satisfaction index. It’s outrageous and should not be allowed. They have it all wrong.
Both Dingle-Johnson and Pittman Robertson federal excise tax laws prohibit state legislatures from diverting any wildlife game cash funds to projects other than wildlife management. I would guess that California’s use of those funds for climate research would probably fall under those federal acts. Although I disagree with that use, I doubt that the US Fish and Wildlife Service who monitor the states for compliance would object.
So Matt thinks the state has the RIGHT to do anything they want with TAX money. Yikes! Even Karl Marx was more subtle than that. Perhaps we are moving along “The Road to Serfdom” much faster than I thought.
I just finished an Alaskan cruise, awesome. The US National Parks Service sure pushes the man caused global warming issue related to glaciers on the cruise. They have related displays set up at all their venues and the subject is included with their on board lectures. What was interesting is that a couple of people, hardly a survey, were not buying it. That being said most people where most likely taking in this one sided view.
I do wonder though if the Forest Service is just pushing this issue to jump on the gravy train?
It’s not a TAX, it’s a FEE. Big difference. A fee is not fungible. Well, not as fungible as a tax.
nc, you’re right. I noticed this when I visited Bryce Canyon this summer:
http://nature.nps.gov/climatechange/
I wonder what % of national park $$s are spent on this?
What so frustrates me with this is that even if California managed to shovel a gazillion dollars to people to “study” “climate change” and even if they found precisely the cause, there is nothing California can do about it. This is nothing more than a diversion of public money to political supporters and pandering to a special interest voting block. It is basically criminal, in my opinion.
@garethman
They do *not* have a higher standard of living.
Noted in passing, the bear on the California State Flag, known as the California Grizzly, is now extinct. I dare say, the balance of the state will achieve that status in the not too far future the way it is going.
From shrnfr on September 11, 2012 at 2:52 pm:
California can always import new grizzlies from Canada, same as they do with actors.
Garethman,
After the fall of the Soviet Union I saw an NBC on the street interview from Moscow. The reporter was asking people how they felt about their new situation. A small group of people were grousing that the shops still didn’t have much meat and that there was no strong leader to help them out.
Suddenly a Red Army Lt. stepped in front of a guy complaining. HE turned to the camera and said in disgust,
“This man would trade his freedom for a potato.”
He gets. You don’t.
Got a passport? Planes are leaving on the hour.
User pays
Use anything, pay for everything.
@ David Little – you forgot to add another $8 million where “The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service administers the Wildlife and Sport Fish Restoration Programs and distributes funds to State fish and wildlife resource agencies.”
Handguns – 10%
All other firearms, parts, and ammunition – 11%
Archery and accessories – 11%
Arrows – $0.45 per shaft
Fishing rods, reels, line, lures, etc – 10%
Import duties of to 3.7% 9.2%
Electric outboard motors – 3%
Import duties of 1% to 3% on boats
@ Bob in Virginia – some of the same craziness is here, DGIF monies going to build birdwalks in Loudoun Co, environmental labs, etc
Matt,
I guess you don’t know. Everyone has beaten the Germans. The Americans, the French, the Soviet Union, the British. We each believe that we beat you single-handedly, and that you should thank us for saving you from your own evilness forever. What you don’t understand is that we are “exceptional” which means we are better than everyone else. We believe that its our duty to protect the entire world, and to force our values on the entire world, including our sick gay culture, porn, and the rest of it.
But I agree with what they say about the hunting license fees, which should go for conservation, not to be confused with environmentalism. I get your joke about the bread and so forth, but with hunting licenses its different.
Government should not be funding ANY climate change studies regardless of tax source.
I hope our green-left Aussie PM Julia Gillard doesn’t get onto this idea. If she does, I’ll give up fishing rather than put more into her coffers of spendthriftness.
If by They you mean the Eurocrats, you’re correct. Europe’s high living standards are unsustainable, a temporary result of monumental borrowing from the future based on treating inherently shaky sovereign debt as risk-free. Europe has another year, maybe less, before the roof falls in.
Taxes and fees used be used for improving/sustaining their collection. That’s why there’s general taxes and sales taxes and property taxes, school taxes etc. But gasoline taxes were supposed to be to build/maintain highways and roads, not used as general revenue. Fees are even more imperative that they be used where collected because (a) fees aren’t taxes (b) fees should only be used to maintain what they were originally charged for (c) fees should not be considered a general tax to be used as seen fit (d) they shouldn’t be collected in amounts greater than required to maintain/improve whatever wherever they were originally charged for.
rogerknights says:
September 11, 2012 at 8:23 pm
Garethman says:
September 11, 2012 at 9:08 am
And to add insult to injury they have a higher standard of living, lower unemployment and a higher lifestyle satisfaction index. It’s outrageous and should not be allowed. They have it all wrong.
If by They you mean the Eurocrats, you’re correct. Europe’s high living standards are unsustainable, a temporary result of monumental borrowing from the future based on treating inherently shaky sovereign debt as risk-free. Europe has another year, maybe less, before the roof falls in.
****************************************************************************************
The roof won’t fall in until they run out of money. This won’t happen because they are printing more money (just like Obama does). When people have to go shopping with carts of money is when the roof falls in – probably more than a year off and very painful. The latest bail-out plans (to be paid for with printed money) in Europe seem to have been accepted by the markets for the short term, it should see a clear run for the elections in USA (Nov) and maybe, just maybe (Merkel hopes) Germany in 2013. They just need a few more years to get the iron collars manufactured and distributed.
Steve T
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Garethman says:
September 11, 2012 at 8:16 am
****
Interesting anecdote, but w/o looking up the numbers, I’d wager more Europeans currently immigrate to the US than vice versa.
Wanna bet?
Some good links here if anyone is considering making move to Europe. http://ask.metafilter.com/17806/What-is-the-easiest-country-to-immigrate-to-in-Europe It’s not easy, but most new Europeans I meet from the US tell me it was well worth it. By the way when I responded to earlier postings on better standards of living etc, I was referring to Germany as most of the critical posts were directed to that country. Subjectively I know for a fact that my standard of living in Europe is much higher than I could have ever expected in North America regardless of how much I enjoyed living there. Interesting article from the N Y Times which is worth reading.http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/business/economy/08leonhardt.html
Garethman,
You seem to be missing the point. (Not to mention misunderstanding the difference between a fee and a tax.)
I would rather live free in poverty than submit to tyranny in opulence.
You don’t live in tyranny yet, but the winds of change aren’t favorable at the moment.
Matt’s post is a fine illustration of the statist philosophy that prevails in Europe. The state knows best, it can decide anything, the citizen is there to comply. Hunting license fees in Europe often go to the direct financing of outright or indirectly anti hunting and antifishing NGOs like WWF and its ilk. There are “green funds” established ostensibly to promote the management of game, and eventually are diverted to cordoning off large areas as no go areas. In some cases (mount Parnon, Greece) EU plans include the licensing of walking in public land. The great european public, which has been fooled into thinking itself liberal and democratic, is so brain dead it cannot see the dangers of licensing walking on public lands.
I used to have California hunting and fishing licenses. A few years ago it became too much trouble, so now they get nothing from me.
Oddly, I’ve just learned that the imported alien species of Eastern Gray Squirrel that is a significant garden pest, has fleas and mange, and drives out the native California Squirrels is classed as a “game animal”. So if you want to remove any from your home (say, for example, they sit in your apple tree and eat apples while “pooing” on your yard / roof / whatever and delivering a load of fleas to your yard) you are NOT allowed to do so until you ask the DFG for “permission” AND buy a hunting license…
I guess that makes them a protected alien invasive pest species… Welcome to California…