(Note: I can back Mike up on this, I’ve been getting several letters like this from my TV Meteorologist friends from around the country, all nearly identically worded. – Anthony)
Guest post by Mike Alger
If you thought the dishonest tactics taken by Gleick et al were somewhat under the tableau of honesty, I am beginning to find that it is a pattern that is beings followed by much of the CAGW movement as a whole. Let me illustrate:
Just a few days after the smoke was just beginning to clear from Gleickgate (although I imagine there will be a stench to come from it from some time), I received what at first appeared to be a sincere letter from a well meaning viewer of my television weather reports. Here is the letter:
“I am John Lopez, and I am a viewer here in Reno and I’m interested in the issue of climate change and how it is affecting our weather. As someone who studies these things, I was hoping to get your opinion.
As I’m sure you’re aware, there’s been a lot of extreme weather recently, and last year set records for severe weather events. From what I have read, climate change is a factor in all of this. Because I’m interested in climate change and weather, I have joined a campaign called Forecast the Facts, which is focused on how broadcast meteorologists report on this important issue. They’ve helped to put me in touch with reporters like you to ask them their views.
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans. I’m also aware of reports that climate change is likely to have an impact on weather events like heat waves, droughts, and shifting rainfall patterns. Do you agree with the AMS’ position? Do you think climate change is happening? And do you think it will have an impact on weather in Reno?”
Now, normally I’d be happy to have a discussion about what I think we know and what I think we don’t know about all this, as well as challenge some of his assumptions (last year set records for severe events, etx…), but as had already been brought up in his fine forum and others, “Forecast the Facts” is designed only to pressure the heretics in the broadcast meteorology community for their a apostatic refusal to toe the party line on CAGW. So they try to phish answers from broadcast mets to find out what side of the fence they lean, and then they go after the cretins…pitchforks raised in holy banner…all the way to their nearest newspaper and TV station general manager.
I still retain enough of a Pollyannish view about life that I was willing to see if this John Lopez really existed, and if so if he was a local who fell in with a bad lot. So I responded simply that the issues he brought up were complicated and multifaceted, and would be best explained in person. I then invited him down to the TV station where we could have a great talk about it. If he lived in our area and was sincere in trying to educate himself on at least some of the many factors involved in climate, then that should be easy. If not, and he was cooped up in “Forecast the Facts” strategic war room, then I wouldn’t hear from him again.
That was nearly a month ago. I’m sure I don’t have to tell you what the response was (n’t).
I have always heard that in a court of law that truth is a good defense. It appears like there’s too little of that going around in the CAGW camp.
Mike Alger
Chief Meteorologist
KTVN TV
Reno, NV
Astroturfing and Paid Marketing from the “Deniers of Natural Variability” camp
Commentary phishing tactics by the Climate Worriers
Probably a poorly educated employee of George Soros…
When you’ve got so much money that you can almost literally persuade people black is white (that you lack money and your evil opponents – who have none – are funded by massive oil money). When you can persuade the public that something like a 1000:1 ratio in favour of your PR is really a 1:1000 ratio the other way …. in other words that “reality” and facts are 1:1,000,000 to one … or to put it another way, that one sceptic is worth a 1,000,000 warmists.
What won’t you do?
Odd how the Warmist camp has no problem throwing things out but not
defending their positions….
In person, particularly…
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.
The stunning power of warmist logic.
If you’re selling gold bricks you have to distract the mark, and lies are so useful. Seems to me just what you’d expect from that crew.
Is the “local viewer” always named John Lopez?
On a more topical vein, we are seeing what might be called “etch-a-sketch alarmism”: The threat used to be GW, but now that that has stalled for 12 years, with a shake of the hand, it becomes “climate change”.
You should understand that this is an even more focused and directed campaign than you may suspect. David Axelrod became Obama’s top advisor because of his work for the DNC at the company he founded, AKPD Message and Media. (formerly Axelrod and Associates)
From the very beginning, this type of strategy has been AKPD’s *Specialty*. It’s known as astroturfing, and Axelrod is the best in the country at it. (which is how he got to where he is) Now of course there’s no way to know if Axelrod’s organization is behind this particular effort, since his extreme success has spawned countless imitators, but even if he isn’t directly responsible, he is still the inspiration.
Let me make this clear – this is *Not* some aberration, or some splinter faction. This is the primary tactic the left in general (and the Democrat National Committee in particular) uses to advance their agenda, and they pump tens of millions of dollars into these efforts constantly. What’s amusing is that they even occasionally pay representatives to go to various blogs and post these kinds of things on message boards. If you see someone refer to a “concern troll”, this behavior is what they’re talking about. I personally doubt that any of these are even written by an actual person anymore; to me they all sound like A I generated posts built to follow a template with an assigned random name, and what’s true for posts is true for letters.
This is left wing politics in America, today. It is all fakery and fraud.
As far as faked “letters to the editor” goes, this one is almost as bad as the Gleick memo.
I had typed out rather a long formatted comment. As usual wordpress tried its best to force me to log in so as to make the comment ( a recent, unwelcome change ) and when I did this my comment had been removed from the comment box and was not held in the ‘back’ page. I’m getting rather tired of this.
I don’t comment much at WUWT but it is my favourite blog. WordPress are just making it annoying for me, who has registered his email with wordpress but never uses it in a personal capacity, so much so that it’s jsut not worth the hoops I have to jump to to comment. I’m certainly not typing out posts twice because a system that has worked fine for years is suddenly broken.
As I’m sure you’re aware, there’s been a lot of extreme weather recently,
================================
Only if you claim history started less than 50 years ago….
You don’t look at the facts….
….and you don’t read Steven Goddard’s blog
http://www.real-science.com/
I would have just sent back the following response:
“Thank you for your letter. Absolutely I believe in climate change. The earth’s climate has changed throughout its entire history. I have no doubt that the climate will continue to change througout the remainder of its life.”
To warm or not to warm. Very odd.
A~N
I am a (proud) member of the Chartered Institute of Public Relations in the UK. If you are caught astro-turfing – H/T to Macro Contrarian at 9.39 – you will be kicked out of the CIPR and finished in UK PR circles…quite rightly.
It is not just a matter of professional ethics. It is also a matter of personal honour.
Anthony, if you or any of WUWT’s contributors, can help to track down the individuals involved with sending these emails – and if they are a member of an internationally-recognised PR body – please let me know and I can promise investigation and retribution.
“…human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.”
——————————————————-
The Department of Redundancy Department.
“Forecast the Facts” is an oxymoron, because Facts by definitions “have already happened” (“Fact” comes from Latin and it means “done”) and so cannot be forecasted. Unless FtF is into divination that is.
This latest tactic is such a shame but hold true to the ” discredit, slander, isolate” anyone who opposes the teams consensus.
When I first had interest in the subject of CAGW I couldn’t figure out what the truth was. it was a local Weatherman that I contacted via email who directed me to this site and ICECAP so I could find some factual data and judge for myself. He offered his opinion on the subject but stressed to make my own call based on the data. Its not rocket science when you see temps have flat-lined and CO2 is still climbing…
“I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.”
Uhhhh what was the question again?
http://forecastthefacts.org/
Not much question about who they are or what their goals are. This isn’t a secret project.
It is difficult to combat propaganda. Hitler and the Nazis had a propaganda machine that was able to bend the minds of the majority of Germans in WWII. The AGW folks are doing the same today using the same basic tools including the broadcast media. In 2011 local meteorologists did a reasonably good job of explaining La Nina cycles including the drought period 1950-1957. They also did a fairly good job of explaining the back to back La Nina in late 2011 and early 2012. However, they did nothing to explain that the AO cycle interfered with the 2012 La Nina, thus warping the jet stream to the west causing colder weather and snowfall to the northwest and warmer and wetter in the northeast and central US.
The only way I see to combat propaganda is to tell the true story any time it is obvious that weather is acting in an unpredicted manner. It need not be told in a combative manner but just a few simple words to keep the truth before the general public.
Just as National Socialism was trying to take over Europe in the 1930s and 1940s, Global Socialism has been trying to take over the world since the 1980s. The liberals never give up no matter how many times their policies fail. Those with a bully pulpit must use it to speak the truth.
wws (9:49 am ) I can’t see any difference between your paid shill theories and the big-oil funded shill theories, and think both are likely as not pure fiction.
A popular Hispanic surname to give it a bit of ethnic flair. How cute.
To reiterate, for everyone who thinks “oh, you should have said this or should have said that” – these are in all likelihood A I generated letters and posts which are placed only to try and steer a public conversation in a direction that the financier of these efforts desires. There is no actual “person” behind any of these things, therefore there is no point in crafting any kind of reply, except to make it clear to any other readers what is going on.
These letters are a form of passive-aggressive assault; “psy-ops” is the only accurate way to characterize them. So the question is, what is the best way to respond to an aggressive psy-ops campaign by an enemy trying to remain hidden? Publicize what they are up to as loudly as possible. Which of course is what is happening with this post, and I commend Mike for writing it and Anthony for posting it.
You have struck another blow for freedom, sirs!
JJ says:
March 23, 2012 at 9:48 am
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.
The stunning power of warmist logic
——————————–
Only largely though. So there must be some residual of human-induced climate change caused by something other than humans. Zombies ??
entrapment comes to mind although in a US court room its actually innocent until proven guilty…
The surveys have been so poorly designed that any claim of consensus is absurd. Here’s an example:
Is there agreement amongst climate scientists on the IPCC AR4 WG1?
source: http://www.jamstec.go.jp/frcgc/research/d5/jdannan/survey.pdf
excerpt:
ABSTRACT. An online poll of scientists’ opinions shows that, while there is strong agreement on the important role of anthropogenically-caused radiative forcing of CO2 in climate change and with the largest group supporting the IPCC report, there is not a universal agreement among climate scientists about climate science as represented in the IPCC’s WG1. The claim that the human input of CO2 is not an important climate forcing is found to be false in our survey. However, there remains substantial disagreement about the magnitude of its impacts. The IPCC WG1 perspective is the mean response, though there are interesting differences between mean responses in the USA and in the EU. There are, also, a significant number of climate scientists who disagree with the IPCC WG1 perspective.
In our poll, there were 140 responses out of the 1807 who were contacted by the first author.
note: bold emphasis is mine
Only 8% of climate scientists bothered to respond to the Pielke and Annan climate survey. 70% of the 8% represents a scientific consensus of opinion?
On another blog I read that Gleike could no longer be considered a liar since he owned up to lying. LOL!!! Following that tortured logic I suppose a murderer could not be called a murderer if he confessed to being a murderer. Unbelievable!!!
Great response, make them appear in person to prove they are genuinely concerned.
On the offchance a real person shows up, point out that according to 98% of the experts, “more research is needed”.
That’s all they want to hear anyway.
Defunding all that “additional research” can then be handled at the ballot box.
Climate change solved!
“I am John Lopez, and I am a viewer here in Reno…”
————————————————-
“Any business or enterprise attempted with liars will always fail.”
kbray.
Good for you Mike, If the letter was from a genuine young person who had an inquiring mind it would have been worded a little differently, don’t you think!
Global cooling must be fought. Each of us must release as much CO2 as possible.
Forecast The Facts’ PR agency is FitzGibbon Media, a “progressive” communications firm. This URL might interest you as it has quite a bit about Forecast the Facts:
http://fitzgibbonmedia.com/news?pg=4
One thing I found on that page was this:
Forecast the facts, fight the smears, join the truth team, attackwatch, moveon, politifact, nolabels, the coffee party, climate science rapid response team, media matters for ‘mericuh, think progress . . .
Maurizio Morabito (omnologos) says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:03 am
‘Unless FtF is into divination that is.’
That seems a reasonable conclusion and could explain a lot about climate science.
From the article:
I have always heard that in a court of law that truth is a good defense.
In American jurisprudence the truth is an absolute defense. It is essential to counter the misinformation and outright lies told by those pushing the CAGW [and AGW] stories.
The jury is still out on AGW. But in science that means it is a conjecture, not a hypothesis, which is testable, and not a theory,which makes accurate predictions. And of course there is zero evidence supporting catastrophic AGW.
This is an issue of truth versus propaganda. By countering false statements it will eventually become clear that the “carbon” scare is baseless. We can already see that the public is beginning to question CAGW/AGW. Keep the pressure on. The truth has a way of emerging. It just takes time and persistence.
This much is straight from their website:
http://forecastthefacts.org/about/
OUR PARTNERS: 350 .org, CEL
350 is Jim Hansen’s outfit. CEL’s website has this statement:
I think it’s safe to say that this is a left-wing operation. As I said above, they’re not exactly trying to hide any of this.
Maybe Anthony and Mike and the others who’ve received these emails can extract the header details so that we can examine the mail routings…
These guys are kind of creepy aren’t they? Speaking of David Axelrod, here is a link to a short clip of him being interviewed by Fox’s Bret Baier. It is obvious Axelrod is not used to being asked tough questions by a mostly adoring media:
http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2012/03/21/david-axelrod-interview-baier-obama-explanations/
Can we all agree that human induced climate change is caused by humans?
Reno, Nevada. What kind of idiot would move into the middle of a desert and into what isn’t much more than a gambling casino and then become interested in more accurate weather information?
Either the letter is a fake or this Forecast the Facts is a BS organization designed to discredit people who question the settled science.
I have received two of these emails (one the last week of February, a second the first week of March). They are nearly identical. I forwarded them and my response to WUWT. I basically created a form response that I will use if I received any more.
I included some of what had been discussed here when “Forecast the Facts” first came to light. I gave my permission to be added to its list of “bad” TV meteorologists/forecasters/weathermen. I questioned if the sender was an actual viewer, based on the email address, what appears to be a form email, and what appears to be a suggested subject line. I extended an invitation to happily engage in a true person to person exchange and noted the sender had my email but I didn’t have theirs (since the domain was @forecastthefacts.org).
I noted the people behind forecastthefacts.org aren’t interested in facts. They are interested in intimidation, suppression of free speech, and impeding the scientific method, and then offered a few clues from the ftf.org home page.
Just in case an actual viewer wrote the email and saw my reply, I extended an invitation to happily engage in a true person to person exchange and noted the sender had my email but I didn’t have theirs (since the domain was @forecastthefacts.org). I suggested to the senders, on the chance they are sincere and truly worried, they spend many hours over the course of many days and weeks reading WUWT, a couple other blogs, and that they read http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02148/RSL-HouseOfCommons_2148505a.pdf
So they now want the T.V meteorologist to sing there song or take them to the gallows if they don’t? Sad. It’s about face time more then truth and it’s annoying and sad.
Have you ever had a WordPress account with the email address you’re using? If so, that’s the cause. I don’t know the work-around.
“Etch-a-Sketch Alarmism”, a phrase by Huh McCulloch 9:49 am
A great phrase to remember. It captures the disconnect from data, the impermanance of the fear, the fact that they are toying with you, and the end result is to shake thing up.
“human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.” (A.K.A. John Lopez
“there was over a one degree cooling of the atmosphere’s temperature or something like that. Can you see where I’m going with this, or am I just another tree hugging earth lover with my head in the polluted clouds?” (Sherri Quammen)
With warmista intellect of this calibre on display it is a wonder that they can even dress or feed themselves. If ever proof that Darwin was wrong is needed we have it here.. By natural selection they should be long gone.
Take a look at this…
http://openline.medialine.com/archive/index.php/t-41867.html
Feb 24th 2012, 11:35 AM
Anyone else been contacted by viewers who have “joined” the “Forecast The Facts” campaign? I got this email today when we’re nearly 25 above normal and expecting severe storms, less than a week after our only shot of snow so far this winter…(emphasis mine):
I am a viewer here in A____ and Im interested in the issue of climate change and how it is affecting our weather. As someone who studies these things, I was hoping to get your opinion.
As Im sure youre aware, theres been a lot of extreme weather recently, and last year set records for severe weather events. From what I have read, climate change is a factor in all of this. Because Im interested in climate change and weather, I have joined a campaign called Forecast the Facts, which is focused on how broadcast meteorologists report on this important issue. Theyve helped to put me in touch with reporters like you to ask them their views.
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans. Im also aware of reports that climate change is likely to have an impact on weather events like heat waves, droughts, and shifting rainfall patterns. Do you agree with the AMS position? Do you think climate change is happening? And do you think it will have an impact on weather in A___?
Feels like (a) a form email and (b) a troll to me. Anyone else getting this or something like it?
—
Looks like a phishing scam from FTF…it would be interesting to track the origin of the e-mail.
Curry had a March 6th post on the most recent AMS survey.
AMS members surveyed on global warming
http://judithcurry.com/2012/03/06/ams-members-surveyed-on-global-warming/
Comments ripped the AMS survey to shreds.
Consider a carefully designed WUWT survey for AMS members where anonymity is guaranteed. The results would be very interesting if they include chi analysis. The frequency analysis based on poorly designed questions has to stop.
I know they’re harassing at least one TV station here in Grand Rapids, Mi. “Turn in your local weatherman for heresy!!”
Scottish Sceptic says on March 23, 2012 at 9:46 am:
“… or to put it another way, that one sceptic is worth a 1,000,000 warmists.”
========
“1,000,000 warmists.”?? – What, as many as that? – I thought there was, according to their own claims, only around 2500 of them. – Well, unless you also count the vast army of mimicking water-melon people that follow in their wake.
I live in the Reno metro area, and Mike is a longtime, excellent meteorologist in an area that is challenging to forecast the weather.
In addition, this article was on NASA describing how the solar storms have warmed the atmosphere: http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2012/22mar_saber/
I always find it amusing that the AGW crowd assumes that the climate model is static, and that any point is the zero occurrence. I have yet to have ANYONE explain to me at what point the climate (or geology for that matter) have ever STOPPED changing.
Would it matter if they used an “Etch-a-Sketch”, a blank piece of paper or notebook, or a blank computer screen in a word processor (or any other program that lets you start afresh)?
They’re all the same–what matters is the content added.
As I see it no one bothers to define Climate- everone has it ass backword-climate is the results of weather -here is a proper definition:
Definitions of the Climate Discussion
What is Climate?
Definition:A few hundred thousand weather days end to end for a specific location. ( an average pattern)
How many climates are there in the world?
Every part of the country and the world has a unique climate -the south of France, the North slope of Alaska, the heart of Africa, the northeast Great Lakes region of the US ,the north of Italy, the south of Italy,thousands of different climates etc.
What is weather?
The atmospheric conditions where you are.
Can mankind control the weather?
We have tried for thousands of years from the Indian rainmaker, to the cloud seeders of the 1950-60. Man can not control the weather, then how the hell can man be controlling the climate. This whole B.S of MANN-made global warming is a fairy tale. The MANNipulation of temperature data is a crime against humanity and these criminals should be put in jail.
Be careful of the Pied Pipers of Gorezillaism- remember Hamlin- except it is happening to ignorant supposed adults.
Climatologists”- are temperature historians. If they chose to project into the future they have gone from historians to Flat Screen fortune tellers. “computer generated Models” “garbage in is garbage out”
Another definition: “Climatologist” : A temperature and weather historian. If one projects to future events then they are “fortune teller” Weathermen do a somewhat better job of predicting the future- 30 to 60 % correct.
Edit note; “that is beings followed ” → that is being followed.
____
If you use Firefox, install the Lazarus add-on. It saves as you type, and can be set to hold the text or full form data for as long as you want, pretty much. Default is 14 hrs. I set mine to 54 weeks, just because! 😉 Searchable, accessed with a right-click in the reply box, and also includes direct URL link to the site and page you were on at the time.
In re: zootcadillac at 9:50 AM I had the problem and the next
time I typed in one of my other email addresses and it worked.
It doesn’t take more than a minute or so to see where Forecastthefacts.org is coming from, and what they’re all about. They even boast about partnering with 350.org and the League of Conservation Voters.
What I really don’t get is how a meteorologist would forecast the weather differently based on his opinion of AGW, or for that matter, his aversion to shoveling snow or washing dishes. I’m sorta funny like that, I want accurate weather forecasts, not opinions on the evils of CO2.
A weather forecaster’s credibility comes from…..uh….forecasting, about a week at a time. What the meteorologist does outside the weather broadcast is an altogether different matter.
“We should see some light showers by mid morning Tuesday, then partial clearing in the afternoon with temps in the mid 60’s. By 2100 sea levels are expected to be up by 15 feet, and polar bears will be extinct.” — A Forecast The Facts weather report
If you search for some of the phrases in that letter, you find meteorologists who are discussing the letter.
http://openline.medialine.com/showthread.php?p=791530
There also is a reply from ForecastTheFacts, part of which is:
… Last week, we sent out an email to a small group of our supporters, directing them to a webpage where they could look up their local TV meteorologists, and email them through our system. Because we could not actually send an email through users’ individual account, we sent an email on their behalf from an email address that ended @forecastthefacts.org.
You can look at the webpage users saw here:
http://forecastthefacts.org/ask_your_meteorologist/
…
If you try out the web site, you find that the only option being offered to supporters are “SEND” buttons. The text of the email is generated by ForecastTheFacts, and supporters can not send a different message, so the “sent an email on their behalf” phrasing is a somewhat strained definition of what is happening. They are making the meteorologist’s email addresses visible to the public, so someone can independently contact them if they wish to.
ForecastTheFacts does not say how long they will retain the email addresses of participants, nor what else they might do with them. Their privacy policy explains what they do with survey and petition addresses, but does as this email relay is not labeled as either type of activity then the limits of their activities are not defined.
Write your comments in a text editor (mind you, vi is a symlink to ed, & emacs is a symlink to rm -rf ${HOME}), save it to a file like /home/stickylegs/Climate/wattsupwiththat.com/20120323.comment15.txt and cut&paste from there. You can also run it though a parser (to make sure your tags are closed), spellcheck it, etc.
“I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.”
Oh! and silly old me, I thought that if human induced climate change is occurring it is largely created by pigs that can fly?
Do not agree if You compare liberalism with different leftist isms, refering to ideologies that in theory advocates of freedom and equality for the individual, but never been practiced in the real world … (Generally socialism, regardless of type and close related communism.)
OT
WWF is running a campaign here in Sweden, including through advertising in the mobiles, on Earth Hour. They are encourage people to challenge other people to make the best contribution to the climate. A friend gave two challenges, both based on turning on as many lights as possible. In the first case, to celebrate life, hope and knowledge. In the second case to send a thought to all the poor people who already suffered and those who will suffer, badly affected by the proponent (the authentic deniers) of the climate threat …
/OT
Any change could be a threat, if not accepted and adaptation fails …
P.S. The 2.x version of Lazarus is for Firefox. There are also 3.x versions, less elaborate but adequate, for Chrome and Safari.
johnl says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:48 am
Can we all agree that human induced climate change is caused by humans?
Sorry John, that is “mostly” caused by humans. And there is a big difference between “mostly” caused and “completely” caused (apologies to “The Princess Bride”)
😉
Some of us are not using traditional MicroSoft software to view the web. When I checked the Forecast the Facts website there was a link, of sorts, from “Here’s our methodology” that gave something that appeared as a blank box.
For those who might be seeing a blank box, here’s what’s in it (as data-tip=):
“Forecast the Facts defines a denier as anyone who expressly rejects the overwhelming scientific consensus about climate change: that it is real, largely caused by humans, and already having profound impacts on our world. We only include meteorologists who currently report on the weather, whether as regular broadcasters on local or national news stations, or as guest commentators on cable media outlets. We track the views of meteorologists through their on-air statements, blog posts, social media activity, public appearances, interviews, and interactions with viewers.”
There is another “data-tip=” at “See the petition”:
“I urge the AMS Council to immediately pass a new information statement that reflects the widespread scientific consensus that climate change is increasingly impacting our planet, and then vigorously promote that statement to AMS members.”
As someone who is not a meteorologist or climatologist, but who generally favors democracy over autocracy, I urge an immediate worldwide plebiscite to determine the truth of the cutting issues of our time:
YES or NO: Heavy objects fall faster than light ones.
YES or NO: We are at the center of the universe.
YES or NO: We are overheating the earth.
YES or NO: Faith trumps science and logic.
YES or NO: Force trumps science and logic.
– – – – – –
YES, the truth will be found, and the deniers punished.
Simple, use a different email address.
On the subject of Forecast the Facts, the thing that had me most curious is they started a campaign & petition to ask GM not to give money to Heartland.
Anyway the thing that I found curious is then they first announced this petition, the very first time it was reported in the press, in fact their initial press release on March 5th – they said they had 10,000 signatures from GM owners on their petition.
See here:
http://forecastthefacts.org/press/releases/2012/3/5/more-10000-gm-owners-demand-company-pull-its-suppo/
Notice the date on the press release – March 5th
“More than 10,000 GM Owners Demand the Company Pull Its Support from the Heartland Institute”
“20,000 total Americans have joined campaign against GM hypocrisy on climate change”
And if I go to their web site today, 2.5 weeks later, it says they have 10,000 signatures from GM owners on their petition.
As of now, – March 23rd – this web page says:
http://www.forecastthefacts.org/stories/gm_heartland/
“10,000 GM Owners Demand the Company Stop Funding the Heartland Institute Immediately”
“More than 10,000 GM owners, and 20,000 total Americans, have joined the campaign calling on GM to stop funding the climate change-denying Heartland Institute. See what they have to say below, and then sign the petition here: ”
So:
1. How did they get 10,000 signatures from GM owners so quickly – apparently instantly?
2. How come the number hasn’t moved in the past 2.5 weeks?
Did they really have 10,000/20,000 signatures 2.5 weeks ago? How did they get them? Or were they using a “trick”?
I believe Allan’s title of ‘More fakery from Forecast the Facts” is in reference to this post from Jan.
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/01/22/forecastthefacts-org-political-activists-gagging-our-tv-meteorologists-on-climate-issues/#more-55144
Mike Mangan says:
March 23, 2012 at 11:11 am
I know they’re harassing at least one TV station here in Grand Rapids, Mi. “Turn in your local weatherman for heresy!!”
Yea, one of them is a member of ICECAP
Well, it looks like Daniel Souweine, Twitter @mackabean Berkeley, CA, who claims the title of Co-founder of Citizen Engagement Lab. Director of Forecast the Facts campaign is also quite active in the OccupoopOakland movement also.
https://twitter.com/#!/mackabean
Well, it appears that Daniel Souweine, Twitter @mackabean Berkeley, CA , who claims the title of Co-founder of Citizen Engagement Lab. Director of Forecast the Facts campaign, is also very active in the OccupoopOakland movement.
Not that there is anything wrong with that, just goes to show how non-partisan he is.
https://twitter.com/#!/mackabean
“Citizen Engagement Laboratory is a non-profit, non-partisan organization that uses digital media and technology to amplify the voices of underrepresented constituencies. We seek to empower individuals to take collective action on the issues that concern them, promoting a world of greater equality and justice in the process.”
Really???? If they are non partisan and they want to amplify the voices of underrepresented constituencies…. does that mean they are doing so an the behalf of the TEA PARTY as well?
I’d more likely suspect they only represent LEFT LEANING constituencies. If so, then the CEL lies and misrepresents itself in its’ mission statement as a “non-paritisan organization”.
crosspatch Fenton Communications seem to have their sticky little fingers all over lots of things that linked to ‘the cause’, given their certainly no charity you have to ask whose picking up the bill?
In the USA The believe that Global Warming is Primarily Caused By Humans” is hovering around 36% to 40% and has since 2008.
[snip . . OT . . .kbmod]
Mike I hope you and the other honest Meteorologists do not get caught in the cross hairs on this.
I received the same email in Providence. Mine came from “Frank Spadazzi”. I didn’t even bother responding. As for tracing the origin of the email, it came from an @forecasthefacts.org email address, but can you tell if it originated in Providence? My buddy also received it in Maine. He didn’t read it very closely and immediately sent an honest reply. You can expect to see him on the deniers list soon.
[snip . . try and use sense . . kbmod]
Who funds these fascist idiots?
“Forecast the Facts defines a denier as anyone who expressly rejects the overwhelming scientific consensus about climate change: that it is real, largely caused by humans, and already having profound impacts on our world. We only include meteorologists who currently report on the weather, whether as regular broadcasters on local or national news stations, or as guest commentators on cable media outlets. We track the views of meteorologists through their on-air statements, blog posts, social media activity, public appearances, interviews, and interactions with viewers.”
Shouldn’t that be ‘forget the facts’?
Yeah, Reno is such a hot bed of climate change. Perhaps some glaciers will return to the area soon.
No wait, that was last year…this year not so much!
I built (and abandoned) a WordPress blog site long ago. Now I find my comments here posted under that old name. Does anyone know why WUWT now insists the old (but not deleted) has to appear instead of my name, Peder Larsen?
FitzGibbon Media is the PR firm behind Forecast the Facts.
Trevor FitzGibbon used to be Sr. Vice President of Media Relations for Fenton Communications, before leaving to set up his own firm.
FitzGibbon Media’s clients include WikimediaFoundation.org
David Fenton is the principal puppetmaster behind most of the eco-propaganda.
Not to worry. I’m on his case 🙂
http://fitzgibbonmedia.com/news?pg=4
************************************
More than 10,000 GM Owners Demand Company Pull Its Support from Heartland Institute
Posted by FitzGibbon Media
Client: Forecast The Facts
For Immediate Release:
March 5, 2012
Contact: Blair Fitzgibbon
202-503-6141
More than 10,000 GM Owners Demand Company Pull Its Support from Heartland Institute
Over 20,000 Join Campaign against GM Hypocrisy on Climate Change
http://forecastthefacts.org/stories/gm_heartland/
San Francisco, CA – More than 10,000 current and former owners of General Motors vehicles are calling on the company to pull its financial support from the Heartland Institute, a leader in efforts to deny the science behind climate change. The campaign coordinated by Forecast the Facts comes in response to leaked documents that revealed a host of major corporations funding Heartland.
[…]
In the coming weeks, Forecast the Facts will use a host of online and offline tactics to ensure that GM is well aware of the customer frustration their support of Heartland has caused.
************************************
http://heartland.org/sites/all/modules/custom/heartland_migration/files/pdfs/17072.pdf
Trevor Fitzgibbon, Fenton’s director of media communications, helped develop the strategies used by MoveOn.org, the legally separate MoveOn.org Voter Fund and Win Without War. Fenton Communications’ own publicity blurb boasted, “Fitzgibbon’s messaging and PR efforts on behalf of MoveOn.org have helped position the online advocacy group as a national political force in America.”
************************************
http://fitzgibbonmedia.com/
Trevor FitzGibbon
http://fitzgibbonmedia.com/about-us/14/trevor-fitzgibbon
In 2008, Trevor started FitzGibbon Media to provide domestic and global public relations strategy around cutting edge political, human rights, environmental, and nuclear proliferation issues, as well as for progressive campaigns. Prior to that he served as a Communications Director in New Mexico for the Barack Obama Campaign in the Democratic Presidential Primary, and for seven years, he was the Sr. Vice President of Media Relation for Fenton Communications – helping to oversee media relations strategy for the One Campaign, MoveOn.org, and much of the progressive movement. Trevor has placed clients in front of a wide range of audiences on shows including 60 Minutes, Meet the Press, Nightline, The Colbert Report, The Situation Room, The Rachel Maddow Show, and Countdown with Keith Olbermann, and on networks such as Al Jazeera, BBC, CNN International, NPR, FOX, Phoenix TV (China), and NHK (Japan).
[…]
http://fitzgibbonmedia.com/our-clients/111/testimonials
“For six years, while at Fenton Communications, Trevor was our lead media relations partner. Reporters know and love him. He’s tireless, brilliant, and he made getting MoveOn on everything from the Colbert Report to Meet the Press look effortless. Trevor’s work has been one of the keys to MoveOn’s success – we couldn’t recommend him more highly.”
Eli Pariser
President
MoveOn.org
You’ve helped us tell one of the most important stories in our history, probably one of the most important tech stories of the year. Amazing. I’m in awe.”
Jay Walsh
Head of Communications
WikimediaFoundation.org
************************************
Reblogged this on Climate Ponderings and commented:
More…”and politicization of science ($720,000).” From Soros.org?
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2007/09/26/nasa-s-hansen-mentioned-soros-foundations-annual-report
KnR says:
March 23, 2012 at 11:59 am
crosspatch Fenton Communications seem to have their sticky little fingers all over lots of things that linked to ‘the cause’, given their certainly no charity you have to ask whose picking up the bill?
___________________________
It was discussed here: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/11/30/tying-wwf-uea-fenton-communications-and-commissioned-research-all-together/
Others on the web tie Fenton Communications back to Tides which is used to launder money so the actual people funding a questionable activity can not be traced.
McCarthyism is alive and well amongst the CAGW crowd.
More Soylent Green! says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:55 am
.
Have you ever had a WordPress account with the email address you’re using? If so, that’s the cause. I don’t know the work-around.
The simplest work around may be hit ctrl-a (select all) then ctrl-c (copy) to save your work on a long post. Although I think on another thread someone posted an add-on that saved previously typed pages.
steveta_uk says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:10 am
“wws (9:49 am ) I can’t see any difference between your paid shill theories and the big-oil funded shill theories, and think both are likely as not pure fiction.”
Ah, you want evidence, right. Here goes.
Rockefeller
Rockefeller Family Foundation >> Sustainable Markets Foundation >> 350.org
>> “It’s hot in here” (Youth lunatics)
http://compleatpatriot.blogspot.com/2009/10/peer-reviewed-earth-sciences-literature.html
From John from CA on March 23, 2012 at 10:19 am:
So now scientific facts are established by survey? Well, it would go faster than that boring “hypothesis, experiment, theory” method. Methinks that survey result could have been slightly better worded.
Damned Humans! Damn you all to hell! You warmed it up!
Interesting January article by Bob Ryan at ABC StormWatch 7 related to FtF; Weather, Climate and “Facts”.
http://www.wjla.com/blogs/weather/2012/01/forecasting-the-facts-or-not-14379.html
excerpts:
So what does this all have to do with the firestorm that FtF has created? I’m afraid, whatever the good intentions on trying to show the scientific misstatements, it has only created more polarization on the topic. We can learn by discussing and understanding and frankly putting our agendas, biases, personal beliefs, economic theories, politics, etc. on the table first and not using my science as a Piñata to confuse the public. I would hope thoughtful discussion leading to better decisions is still possible. Maybe I’m still a dreamer but I hope not. My friend and broadcast colleague John Toohey-Morales and I wrote about this in a guest editorial.
“Outing” so called “deniers” with selective quotes almost falls into the camp of those political agendists who also cherry pick data or a sentence from a scientific report to support their agenda. I have written before that “Nature has no Agenda”. The world, our climate is changing. Climate, the globe, the earth, our lives are not static; change is part of time, part of who and what we are and where we live. Do we choose to accept these changes without changing ourselves? Ah, my dear Watson that is the question.
I don’t know if this has been pointed out (and I simply don’t have the time to browse through over 80 comments, but here is a thread on MediaLine in which people are receiving exactly the same letter. http://openline.medialine.com/showthread.php?p=790439
Again, if this has already been posted, my apologies.
I would like to see some research into all of the “human-induced climate change” which he implies is not caused by humans.
John V. Wright says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:00 am
I am a (proud) member of the Chartered Institute of Public Relations in the UK. If you are caught astro-turfing – H/T to Macro Contrarian at 9.39 – you will be kicked out of the CIPR and finished in UK PR circles…quite rightly.
It is not just a matter of professional ethics. It is also a matter of personal honour.
Anthony, if you or any of WUWT’s contributors, can help to track down the individuals involved with sending these emails – and if they are a member of an internationally-recognised PR body – please let me know and I can promise investigation and retribution.
——————————————————–
I didn’t know there is a Chartered Institute of Public Relations in the UK. I always wondered: what is “Public Relations”, or PR?
And who “charters” the Chartered Institute of Public Relations in the UK?
I have watched the excellent “Century of the Self” documentary about Edward Bernais (Sigmund Freud’s nephew) a number of times, over the years. He is often referred to as the father of PR, I believe. He got his first big break working with the tobacco companies in the 20’s, breaking the taboo (at the time) of women smoking in the USA. So he got the suffregettes to light up cigarettes while all the newspapers were there taking photos and got the newspapers to use the term “freedom torches” (he was quite an influential person at the time, being Freud’s nephew and all). Job done – he moved on to flouride in the fifties. Nice guy.
Do PR people get jobs with the government promoting the fear of AGW, or not? Were PR people advising on the Carbon Monster £6 million prime time advertising campaign in the UK (part of the Act on CO2 BS)? And you want to help?
Sorry, I don’t mean to be combative, but I feel that PR was employed to get us into this fear of our carbon footprint BS in the first place.
LinkedIn listing…… fwiw
John L. Lopez
CEO at Panda/UPG
Location: Reno, Nevada Area
Current: CEO at Panda/UPG
Education: University of Utah
Connections: 17 connections
Public Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/john-l-lopez/13/265/187
fredcampagna says:
March 23, 2012 at 12:05 pm
Fred – could you post your letter here? Did your letter pretend that it was coming from an individual rather than an organization? If so, that is Phishing…
This could be the next Gleick-gate…
Frank – same letter as all the others. Email address is frank.spadazzi@forecastthefacts.org.
Hello!
I am a viewer here in Providence and I’m interested in the issue of climate change and how it is affecting our weather. As someone who studies these things, I was hoping to get your opinion.
As I’m sure you’re aware, there’s been a lot of extreme weather recently, and last year set records for severe weather events. From what I have read, climate change is a factor in all of this. Because I’m interested in climate change and weather, I have joined a campaign called Forecast the Facts, which is focused on how broadcast meteorologists report on this important issue. They’ve helped to put me in touch with reporters like you to ask them their views.
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans. I’m also aware of reports that climate change is likely to have an impact on weather events like heat waves, droughts, and shifting rainfall patterns. Do you agree with the AMS’ position? Do you think climate change is happening? And do you think it will have an impact on weather in Providence?
Thank you for your time.
Sincerely,
Frank Spadazzi
Providence, RI
What? Could “human-induced climate change” really be “largely created by humans”?
ZootCadillac, Brian h, others:
Whatever happened to just highlighting the text, then right key mouse and using copy for a save; or typing original in a Word or similar document then copying and pasting. Are MACs this un-versatile?
You may not get a visit from John Lopez, but you can expect one from the Inquisitor General in the near future.
“If you thought the dishonest tactics taken by Gleick et al were somewhat under the tableau of honesty, I am beginning to find that it is a pattern that is beings followed by much of the CAGW movement as a whole.”
Unfortunately yes, it is so. It is enough to look at the continuous adjustments of the past, in any temperature data or sea level data. Once you take the time to look at it you see the pattern.
Mike,
I have lived in Reno for 38 years and enjoyed your TV work ever since you arrived. Now you are my hero for standing up this way, when I’m sure there is some risk to your position (not knowing what KTVN management’s position on CAGW might be.)
I will let KTVN know how much your work is appreciated (without necessarily telling them exactly why I appreciate it!)
Brian Adams
” … human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans ..”
I might add that chicken-induced climate change is largely created by chickens. Same with rabbit-induced climate change. I wonder what the percentages are?
Did the AMS really say this?
Heavens… I’m not sure I expected this kind of response, but thanks to all on both sides who commented. I also apologize for the numerous typos…I’m still getting used to the auto correct on the iPad. I think most of all of my media colleagues have gotten the same letter, as the links to the thead in Medialine has indicated.
Again, I want to emphasize that I don’t mind an open and honest debate about the issue (in fact… I encourage it, as most here on this blog seem to want). But the use of deception, and ultimately intimidation to squelch dissent creates a scientific fascism in which science itself can only end up the loser.
How can anyone live in Nevada for any length of time and NOT experience extreme weather? I’ve been in the mountains and the desert there and in Utah and experienced extreme weather numerous times. Sometimes several kinds of extreme weather in the same afternoon and the same location!
Jay Davis
Anthony
No. 943 – WMO annual statement confirms 2011 as 11th warmest on record
Climate change accelerated in 2001-2010, according to preliminary assessment
GENEVA, 23 MARCH 2012 (WMO) – The World Meteorological Organization’s Annual Statement on the Status of the Global Climate said that 2011 was the 11th warmest since records began in 1850. It confirmed preliminary findings that 2011 was the warmest year on record with a La Niña, which has a cooling influence. Globally-averaged temperatures in 2011 were estimated to be 0.40° Centigrade above the 1961-1990 annual average of 14°C.
http://www.wmo.int/pages/mediacentre/press_releases/index_en.html
Gail Combs says:
March 23, 2012 at 12:26 pm
KnR says:
March 23, 2012 at 11:59 am
crosspatch Fenton Communications seem to have their sticky little fingers all over lots of things that linked to ‘the cause’, given their certainly no charity you have to ask whose picking up the bill?
___________________________
It was discussed here: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/11/30/tying-wwf-uea-fenton-communications-and-commissioned-research-all-together/
Others on the web tie Fenton Communications back to Tides which is used to launder money so the actual people funding a questionable activity can not be traced.
============
Follow the money….
What, other than a handful of coins, does Fenton have to gain from deceiving the American people with this absurd attack on the AMS?
This is out of control. PR and Advertising are governed by a set of laws. Laws related to misstatements of fact. Its called false advertising and it carries a stiff penalty.
I think its about time to pass the hat and sue them out of existence with a case action suit both regional and International. A suit on behalf of the people of the world who seek reason in a climate of lies.
vukcevic,
The SST seems to be flat to cooling:
http://weather.unisys.com/surface/sst_anom.gif
As for the WMO, they are hopelessly biased, as anyone can see by their constant use of buzzwords like “sustainable”, so I suspect that they are no different than GISS in altering records. The WMO announced that 2011 was the “11th warmest” year. But farther down there is an article saying that 2011 was the “10th warmest”. Did the records change? And I recall Ryan Maue’s chart showing a significant drop in global temps from 2009 to now. Who is right, Dr Maue or the WMO?
FYI, Fenton Communications is the epitome of a “watermelon” activist front group, pursuing the “Revolution” via various environmental campaigns. I doubt that anyone gets to work for them who is not a carefully vetted activist for “The Cause”….
Mike Alger says:
March 23, 2012 at 1:32 pm
…intimidation to squelch dissent creates a scientific fascism in which science itself can only end up the loser.
=========
It will never be allowed to occur in Our Republic. Where is the statement from the White House supporting our freedoms in the face of this foreign and fascist ignorance?
Inquiring minds including over 14,000 AMS members want to know the truth. ; )
Oh, left out link to overview of Fenton Communications:
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/printgroupProfile.asp?grpid=6958
Around ten of those astroturfing emails hit my e-mailbox in January and February. I responded that clearly the sender was not a viewer of mine or he/she would already know my position on human induced global warming because I had done numerous news reports and two hour long specials on the topic. Then I refered the sender to my global warming webpage at
http://www.kusi.com/category/195823/colemans-corner
I never had any follow up from any of them and as best I know my employers did not hear from any of them.
Big deal. I think not
A very smart response, mr. Alger
Has anyone asked them to explain how the process actually works? Record climate upheaval in 2011 while the global temperature was relatively tepid? If extreme events are actually caused by extra heat in the atmosphere, shouldn’t they occur in record numbers when temperatures are higher?
They’ve been engaging in this for years. One of the most telling quotes was from Hansen himself, when he was asked about Gore’s failed predictions of stronger/more frequent hurricanes:
>>“We need to be more careful in describing the hurricane story than he is,” Dr. Hansen said of Mr. Gore. “On the other hand,” Dr. Hansen said, “he has the bottom line right: most storms, at least those driven by the latent heat of vaporization, will tend to be stronger, or have the potential to be stronger, in a warmer climate.”<<
OK, so they'll either be stronger or, if not, they will have some unrealized potential to be stronger. Someone needs to ask Dr. Hansen exactly how that statement would be falsified. This isn't science, it's snake oil. As long as there are anomolous weather events somewhere in the world, there will be a gang of Texas Sharpshooters drawing post hoc circles around them.
Fenton Communications… they have taken the techniques developed by the totalitarian govts of the 20th century to a new level…
Fenton Communications – taking techniques developed by 20th century totalitarian governments to a new level…
100+ comments and nobody is willing to stand up for this tactic and its organizers? NUFF SAID. COWARDS SELLING LIES. The radical left is well-organized, don’t let them intimidate you from your beliefs.
Hooray for you, Mike Alger!! I live in Reno and have enjoyed your supurb coverage of our difficult to forecast weather. Like Anthony, you are an honor to your profession.
Tom Bakewell
Cut to the “Nobody expects the inquisition” video clip 3 2 1
Larry
Smokey says:
March 23, 2012 at 1:58 pm
As for the WMO, they are hopelessly biased …
From what I have just read skimming their report, the tool of choice seems to be playing fast and loose with the date ‘when records began’.
This gem on the world map on page 4 stood out:
United Kingdom
Warmest spring and second warmest year (behind 2006) since national records began in 1910
It’s worth noting that 2011 was only 0.3°C warmer than 1779 in the HadCET data.
Isn’t the League of Conservation Voters a Political Action Committee and as such required to file it’s accounts with the Federal Election Commission? For the LCV these records include full details of all donors and the amount they individually contribute, as well as the politicians being funded.
http://images.nictusa.com/cgi-bin/fecimg/?C00252940
If FTF is partnered with a PAC then does not Forecast the Facts itself become part of a
non-connected Political Action Committee and as such be subject to the Federal Election Campaign Act? Only asking.
A non-connected PAC is described by Wikipaedia as follows:
“Groups with an ideological mission, single-issue groups, and members of Congress and other political leaders may form “non-connected PACs”. These organizations may accept funds from any individual, business PAC or organization. As of January 2009, there were 1,594 non-connected PACs, the fastest-growing category. ”
OpenSecrets.org gives a clear breakdown of LCV’s financial activities here:
http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/lookup2.php?cycle=2012&strID=C00252940
I did a phrase search for
and got
I got a letter exactly like Mike’s sent via email. Apparently, the concerned viewer wasn’t aware that I made the original list of 47 “Weathermen Climate Deniers.”
You should understand that WWW 9:49 am and JFD 10:05 am are probably not actual people, but sound to me like AI generated posts built to follow a template with an assigned name by the DNC or neo-Trotskyites. Let me make this clear. These AI generated posts advance the fake post neo-liberal agenda of showing global warming skeptics to be such ridiculous and paranoid ideologues that any thoughtful person would immediately reject anything that they claim.
sarc off WWW and JFD- Get a life!
The Forcast the Facts web site shares its IP address with various political web-sites:
Citizen Engagement Lab http://www.engagementlab.org
Presente – Strengthening the political voice of Latino communities http://www.presente.org
Video the Vote – Keeping watch on democracy http://videothevote.org
Basta Dobbs – campaign to remove Lou Dobbs from CNN http://www.bastadobbs.com
No harm in such associations of course, but it does colour Forcast the Facts as a political operation rather than any kind of organisation interested in ‘the facts’.
zootcadillac says:
March 23, 2012 at 9:50 am
For all but the simplest replies, I use a Firefox addon called It’s All Text. It adds an “edit” button to the text region, and clicking on it opens your favorite editor (emacs for me). I have emacs configured so an existing window picks up the text, I edit it there, save it, and then click “Post Comment” in the WUWT window. If something messes up, I still have the emacs buffer & file.
It also lets me scroll back through the post in Firefox while keeping the editor window handy so I can cut & paste pieces from other messages.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/its-all-text/
Three of the meteorologists at our stations have had these letters, including me. I tried to get the station to do a story on it (identity theft – looks like they just picked a local name out). The emails were traced to Forecast the Facts. There have also been emails and letters to the station asking for me in particular to be fired (I’m the chief meteorologist). I have a rather successful blog, http://blogs.woodtv.com/category/bills-blog/ (4 million hits last year) and it’s constantly bombarded with alarmist comments. Anyone with free time that wants to help me respond to them, feel free. This is a kind of war and our jobs may be at stake.
“Can we all agree that human induced climate change is caused by humans?”
Boy, I missed that on the first pass. LOL.
I think we can build a consensus around that one.
It’s 100% caused by humans, no error bars. The debate is over for real.
Report it to the Federal Trade Commission. Send a copy of unwanted or deceptive messages to spam@uce.gov. The FTC uses the unsolicited emails stored in this database to pursue law enforcement actions against people who send deceptive spam email.
Mark and two Cats said @ March 23, 2012 at 10:02 am
Not quite; they omitted the giant mutant scapegoats that also cause “human-induced climate change”. 😉
Hey Mike, I watch you on KTVN every morning. Thanks for being analytical and honest…but sorry, there are still carhart coveralls behind the seat of my pickup no matter what the forecast!
I am thinking Mother Nature is sitting on a log hugely amused by the arrogance of humans lately.
I really think it’s important to distinguish between CAGW and AGW and CC. I think most scientists agree that humans influence the climate. It makes sense. What most scientists do no agree with is whether the human induced climate change will eventually end up being catastrophic. The reason for this is that in order for climate change to be catastrophic, it requires positive feedbacks. Feedbacks are very poorly understood. In the climate models, the feedbacks are positive. They have to be in order for anthropogenic global warming to be catastrophic. It is more likely that in nature and, therefore, what will actually happen is there will be negative feedbacks dampening anthropogenic induced warming. In addition, there will be other natural factors that will have both warming and cooling effects that when combined with AGW will produce climate change (CC). Based upon levels of CO2 and temperature over geologic time, it does not appear that feedbacks are positive (positive feedbacks are far less common than negative feedbacks in nature which is what creates a relative stability in nature), as it appears there have been periods when both CO2 and temperature have been higher than today but the earth did not have runaway warming; in fact; such periods were eventually followed by ice ages. For those interested in viewing a chart of CO2 and temperatures over geologic time go to http://www.geocraft.com/wvfossils/carboniferous-climate.html. It is really important not to fall into a trap. CO2 does raise temperatures as it is a greenhouse gas, but water is also a greenhouse gas more powerful and more abundant than CO2, but it is not known whether the effects of clouds, and what type of clouds, create positive (as in the models) feedback or negative feedbacks. This is one of the most important but also the one of the least understood issues in the theory of CAGW. I like to use the term “It’s the Feedbacks Stupid”. Th alarmists conflate the three. There has been GW in the 20th century. There has been AGW in the 20th century. There seems to have been a natural cooling during the 21st century offsetting the AGW. That there will every be CAGW, I highly doubt it because I suspect the feedbacks will be negative and have a dampening effect. The anthropogenic warming mitigation policies advanced by the warmists are only worth their horrendous cost is CAGW is highly likely, which in my opinion it is not.
JJ says:
March 23, 2012 at 9:48 am
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.
The stunning power of warmist logic.
——————————-
Who knew? So, they think it’s humans who create human-induced climate change.
Thank you Mike for this post, I was wondering if we would ever see this come to pass or not. I do not know if the meteorologist in my area believe or not, do not care, just want them to be right about the weather.
One has to wonder whether this might actually be another Univ. of Illinois masters student’s survey or an eighth graders social studies project. I found the following mind boggling.
“I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.”
Used to be you could blame it on the dog if there was some extra methane around and the smell cleared the room. Now human-induced climate change has been largely attributed to… gasp… the horrors …..Humans?? I never would have guessed that! O.K. So it’s largely humans responsible for human induced climate change. Hmmmmm, I wonder what else is responsible. Somebody inform the Climate Rapid Response Team ASAP!! /sarc
It is fully understandable why the warmista side thinks they have a communication problem. It is because they do.
Anonmoose — thanks for the link. All of the meteorologist in my area will be getting the form letter from viewer “Bogus Alarmist”
They have a page for comments. Here’s mine …
We’ll see if I get a reply.
w.
From Willis Eschenbach on March 23, 2012 at 11:59 pm:
Did you use your real name? You likely made the “first to the camps” list years ago, so they have you set for “auto-delete”.
JFD Says: “The only way I see to combat propaganda is to tell the true story any time it is obvious that weather is acting in an unpredicted manner. It need not be told in a combative manner but just a few simple words to keep the truth before the general public.”
As I explained to my students the other day on a black board. I made a small dot and called it the truth; I then drew a 100mm circle and called it the lie. I then said that the truth always remains the same size; but the lie will require the circle to grow larger and larger and that the size of that circle can continue and continue until it is broken by the truth. The truth is easy, the lie is not.
Here is my first draft on how I would answer this zombie:
Alleged Viewer—-As someone who studies these things, I was hoping to get your opinion.
JK—– From your studies, what evidence convinced you that it is a serious enough issue to send your email to me?
Alleged Viewer—- As I’m sure you’re aware, there’s been a lot of extreme weather recently, and last year set records for severe weather events. From what I have read, climate change is a factor in all of this.
JK—– Do you believe “climate change is a factor in all of this”? If so, why?
Alleged Viewer—- I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.
JK—– Do you think they are correct? Why?
Alleged Viewer—- I’m also aware of reports that climate change is likely to have an impact on weather events like heat waves, droughts, and shifting rainfall patterns.
JK—– Do you consider these reports credible? How have you researched their credibility?
Alleged Viewer—- Do you agree with the AMS’ position?
JK—– Please tell me why, or why not, I should agree?
Alleged Viewer—- Do you think climate change is happening?
JK—– Obviously the climate has changed since the last ice age. And since the more recent “little ice age”.
Alleged Viewer—- And do you think it will have an impact on weather in A___?
JK—– The climate in A_____ has been ……….. in the last ……….. years.
The Olympic Games start in the UK in August? How much extra CO2 will be generated with all those hundreds of heavy breathers [40k PPM] over two weeks? Save the planet – ban the Olympics. Phil Jones will be able to record a Huge Increase in Global Temperature of at least 1 Ten thousandth of a degree C.
Looky looky what I have found on the Internet:
” From: “Mr. John Lopez” (may be fake)
Reply-To:
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 18:22:01 +0100
Subject: Re: Federal Reserve Bank of New York ..
Federal Reserve Bank of New York .
33 Liberty St New York, 10038, USA
Attention Eduardo Guglielmino,
I am John Lopez; 50 years old, I am working with printing and minting unit of Federal Reserve Bank of New York, Sometime ago two silver metar boxes was intercepted by the US customs at the JFK airport and brought to the Federal Reserve Bank, The boxes contained $100 bills to the amount of $21million and all were stamped.
I was mandated to examine the boxes and upon my examination; I found out that the first and second $100 bills were only stamped; it was actually brought in from Africa, apparently to deceive the US customs.
I used a diluted chemical to clean up the stamped and found the $100 bills perfect. My purpose of contacting you is that I found your information underneath of one the boxes as the beneficiary.
Further details would be giving upon your response to this message
Thanks
John Lopez
”
http://www.419scam.org/emails/2010-05/19/01073332.97.htm
So these are the warmists tactics now…
When the law is against you, argue the facts. When the facts are against you, argue the law.
When both are against you, attack the plaintiff. – R.Rinkle
The CAGW’s are taking a page from the legal arena with the “law” being their dogma on global warming. Obviously, they are very,very afraid.
Its a form of MCarthyism in reverse if you get my meaning. If you are “exposed” as being a skeptic, it doesn’t mean you are a careful scientist who likes to keep track of the real facts, it means you couldn’t possibly be fit to do your job. Thankfully these people don’t get to rule the country, at least, not yet.
But …. but …. I thought Gorgaphiles said meteorologist weren’t real “climate scientist” so if any of them disagreed with “The Consensus” what they said didn’t matter. Why would what a meteorologist says matter to them now?
philincalifornia says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:17 am
JJ says:
March 23, 2012 at 9:48 am
I know that the American Meteorological Society says that human-induced climate change is occurring and is largely created by humans.
The stunning power of warmist logic
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Only largely though. So there must be some residual of human-induced climate change caused by something other than humans. Zombies ??
================================================
Zombies? Nahh… It’s those pesky Chicago voters that keep voting long after they are dead. Who knew they had such a large effect on climate?
KnR says:
March 23, 2012 at 11:59 am
crosspatch Fenton Communications seem to have their sticky little fingers all over lots of things that linked to ‘the cause’, given their certainly no charity you have to ask whose picking up the bill?
I thought Trevor FitzGibbon/Fenton Communications rang a bell. FitzGibbon’s the PR flak for Bradley Manning, of Wikileaks notoriety.
Not his lawyer, his Public Relations ex-spurt.
Trev’s the one who howled like a banshee (in four separate press releases) that Manning was being tortured by being forced to sleep with only a blanket for protection in his air-conditioned cell — and never mentioned that Manning’s jammies were confiscated because he’d threatened to use them to hang himself…
They know that meteorologists know that climate is global weather over a longer period of time … They also know that meteorologists know that the weather is very difficult to predict longer than five days … Therefore, meteorologists are a threat to them, as they have not embraced the The AGW-tales ….
As most meteorologists would not join the the agenda, a smear campaign is preferable. Warmistas just need to know who they will attack, with a little help of this “study” …
I am beginning to find that it is a pattern that is beings followed by much of the climate skeptic movement as a whole. Let me illustrate:
——–
Errr this article.
Yet one more out of 50 million attempts to slime people who do not agree with what Gleick did.
Let’s compare the positions of the 2 sides.
1. Gleick admits he made a mistake. Its maybe 50:50 on his approval on the CAGW side.
2. The Climategate guy has never owned up. 100% approval on the climate skeptic side.
So morality-wise you guys don’t have a leg to stand on. So please give up on the holier than thou attitude.
I then invited him down to the TV station where we could have a great talk about it.
————
Come into my larder said the spider to the fly.
… as when the hunter becomes the hunted .
LazyT you are as hopelessly clueless as sherriq. You don’t know that Phil Jones himself didn’t post the Climategate emails. It was clearly an inside job, not a theft like Gleick’s illegal phishing. There is a huge difference between stealing the property of others, and posting information that was paid for by the public. I say Jones did it. Prove me wrong.
You exemplify the fact that the alarmist cult has no morals. You don’t know right from wrong.
I don’t like what Forecast the Facts appears to be doing, the phrase chilling comes to mind. But you haven’t quite proved the fakery promised in the headline, there could be other reasons why Mr Lopez hasnt got back to you. But what about other broadcast meteorologists ? Has Mr Lopez written from other addresses to other TV stations around the US ?
I get a bit of alarm bells. This is not just spam, it’s phishing. Why? So that they can obtain a list of denier weathermen and attack them. Fenton Fitzgibbon is now attacking Heartland’s donors, now that the donor list is public thanks to Gleick. As David Ross notes at 12.22 and it bears repeating and highlighting):
On the up side, I am amused at their name. Fitz=illegitimate son, bastard. Gibbon=monkey.
Peter Gleick to speak at Oxford – as far as I know, this is going ahead:
The Human Right to Water, lecture by Peter Gleick
By Oxford Amnesty Lectures
Tuesday, 24 April 2012, 17:30 until 18:30
The Gulbenkian Lecture Theatre, St Cross Building, Manor Road, Oxford OX1 3TU.
Protect the Human: Protect the Planet, Oxford Amnesty Lectures 2012
You can verify this at:
http://www.oxford-amnesty-lectures.org/index.php?p=Lectures
And this is how you take a crankism minority point of view and spin it into a “we are the 97%”.
robo-letters …who’d think!
It looks like our FTF friends will have their work cut out for them –
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2012/03/14/shock-poll-meteorologists-are-global-warming-skeptics/print/
kbray in california says:
March 23, 2012 at 10:20 am (Edit)
“I am John Lopez, and I am a viewer here in Reno…”
————————————————-
“Any business or enterprise attempted with liars will always fail.”
kbray.
—————————————————————————————
Just like the lie that says man made CO2 is killing the planet. It cannot prevail.