GLOBAL land/sea temperatures in July were the 5th hottest ever, and the ocean surface temperature set a new record high;

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2009/20090814_julyglobalstats.html

On the other hand, if we see continued all-time record melts of arctic sea ice in the face of this reduced solar activity, we would have un-deniable proof that the increasing industrial pollution of the atmosphere is driving our climate.

NASA CERES
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/factsheets/ceres_aqua.html

Big Bear Solar Observatory (BBSO) Earthshine Project
http://www.bbso.njit.edu/Research/EarthShine/

North of 43 south of 44 (13:30:59) :”Now what constitues a “deep” solar minimum?”

I had a look at Mary’s links and it shows it very well. presumably Grace was referring to the Dalton Minimum and getting her dates a bit mixed up. After the Dalton Miminum there was a period of high solar activity, the mid 19th century maximum. The term solar minimum and maximum is not applied to individual solar cycles but to the longer term trends. To simplify, the peaks and troughs of sunspot numbers during the mid 19th century were much higher than earlier in the 19th century and comparable with the late 20th century.
To repeat the solar minimum (this was what Grace was referring to) was not responsible for the Irish Famine. You also did not havethe ‘data’ to throw out Mary’s remark, she would seem to be correct in that discussion and you are plainly very wrong (though understandable due to your ignorance of what constitutes a solar minimum).

So a really “deep” solar minimum (whatever that really means) may not be needed.

I already gave you a second data point (hint 1840). Which ims (CRS sets in after 19 or so, just ask any teenager) was at about the same level of sunspot activity as 1845, yes that is correct on the downside of cycle 8.

Now what constitues a “deep” solar minimum?

North of 43 south of 44 (11:21:52) :
I have no concrete data to prove or disprove what helped cause the potato famine in regards to solar influences.

Of course there is ‘concrete’ data to show there was NO “Deep solar minimum” when the the potato blight tragedy occured.!

I did however have the required data to throw out your good buddies remark.

“Yet another example of coolist alarmism. The potato famine started in 1845, the same year as the peak of the solar maxima. ”

At no time during 1845 was there a “peak of the solar maxima” whatever that is.

As a matter of interest for Grace:

In 1840 late blight destroyed the potato crops in New England.

If they are calling this warm, or even just normal, I’m calling Bull Shi…eist on their whole map. I’ve finally got some tomatoes, but the green beans are still sulking and the cool season plants are thrilled. This is NOT a warm summer in the South Bay…
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E.M.Smith, I think there’s a problem comparing sat & surface temps. Since the sats average the temp over a relatively thick atmospheric slice, they don’t pick up the shallow temp inversions of colder surface air that occur in various places & times that surface thermometers will.

For serious study, ocean heat content is the way to bypass all this atmospheric temp stuff.

http://global-warming.accuweather.com/2009/08/second_warmest_july_on_record.html

It appears that Antartica should be muddy in the middle of the southern hemisphere winter.

So it’s been a cold July – even with biased (to the high side) temperature readings.

It’s been a cold July for the continental US. Amazingly, this only covers a small percentage of the planet. Other parts of the world had heatwaves in July.

Antarctica just looks wrong.

The anomaly map is from the UAH satellite data. Is nothing sacred?

In fact, satellite measurements of the poles have issues because of the ice. Doesn’t mean its wrong, but it also means that satellite records including the poles aren’t necessarily *right*.

Great! Now just tell me where I get an anomaly meter!

Oh, wait, we don’t have anomaly meters? Oh. What? We use a thermometer to measure temperature then compute an anomaly? We don’t have any way to measure an anomaly, so to get one we are still limited by the needs of thermometers? Oh Dear…

Please be a bit more careful about what can be measured and what is computed from some other real measurement.

That bugs me almost as much as talk of “forcing”. There is no “forcing” in my physics books. There are heat flows, gravity, electrostatics, and a whole host of other interesting things. But try as I might I cannot find the SI units for “forcing” listed anywhere…