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	<title>Comments on: Here&#8217;s something you don&#8217;t see every day &#8211; a USHCN station reopens</title>
	<atom:link href="http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/</link>
	<description>The world&#039;s most viewed site on global warming and climate change</description>
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		<title>By: Bern Bray</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-61001</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bern Bray]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 15:24:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-61001</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Retired Engineer:
You are right of course. I did see that the MMTS is thermistor based, and I did see one paper that indicated that it is set up in a voltage divider configuration with a 1K resistor of unknown tolerance and ppm.

I would still imagine that a regular calibration should be required, especially since most standard electronic components are not really designed to for temperature fluctuations and extremes (thermistors excepted). Those that are, tend to be very expensive.

Are you on the Front Range?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Retired Engineer:<br />
You are right of course. I did see that the MMTS is thermistor based, and I did see one paper that indicated that it is set up in a voltage divider configuration with a 1K resistor of unknown tolerance and ppm.</p>
<p>I would still imagine that a regular calibration should be required, especially since most standard electronic components are not really designed to for temperature fluctuations and extremes (thermistors excepted). Those that are, tend to be very expensive.</p>
<p>Are you on the Front Range?</p>
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		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60890</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ray]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 22:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60890</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[NEWS TIP: http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,27574,24733718-2761,00.html

Apparently they have a crapy summer down below.  But talking of cyclones... isn&#039;t the difference of water and air temperature relative?  If they air is actually cooling but of course the water stays warm (since it has a much greater heat capacity) wouln&#039;t this dT be much more important than the Gore expected dT in his global warming movie senario?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NEWS TIP: <a href="http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,27574,24733718-2761,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,27574,24733718-2761,00.html</a></p>
<p>Apparently they have a crapy summer down below.  But talking of cyclones&#8230; isn&#8217;t the difference of water and air temperature relative?  If they air is actually cooling but of course the water stays warm (since it has a much greater heat capacity) wouln&#8217;t this dT be much more important than the Gore expected dT in his global warming movie senario?</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Alberts</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60889</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jeff Alberts]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 22:02:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60889</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[How exactly does one check for accuracy after the fact??]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How exactly does one check for accuracy after the fact??</p>
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		<title>By: Mike C</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60877</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike C]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:30:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60877</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Being a properly located station, it will be cooler than others in the area... which means it will get an upward adjustment by NCDC]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being a properly located station, it will be cooler than others in the area&#8230; which means it will get an upward adjustment by NCDC</p>
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		<title>By: Tim L</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60854</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tim L]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 18:40:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60854</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[this still is in the campus which is an urban heat island.
better than top of a roof or middle of a parking lot.
Also will give a few kids a chance to see what happened 100 years ago.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this still is in the campus which is an urban heat island.<br />
better than top of a roof or middle of a parking lot.<br />
Also will give a few kids a chance to see what happened 100 years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Leon Brozyna</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60841</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Leon Brozyna]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 17:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60841</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From the slope of the roof and the direction of the shadows, looks about right for it to be facing north.  And it appears to be well sited in an open field, well away from any of the usual suspect heat sources. Of course, since these photos all appear to have a North/South orientation, we&#039;d need a couple East/West shots to confirm placement.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the slope of the roof and the direction of the shadows, looks about right for it to be facing north.  And it appears to be well sited in an open field, well away from any of the usual suspect heat sources. Of course, since these photos all appear to have a North/South orientation, we&#8217;d need a couple East/West shots to confirm placement.</p>
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		<title>By: J. Peden</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60834</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[J. Peden]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 17:15:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60834</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;This could become an interesting challenge to meteorologic departments throughout the US.&lt;/i&gt;

Which raises the question as to whether these esteemed meterorologic departments are aware of Anthony&#039;s project itself, as they very well should be, etc..  Watts up with that?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>This could become an interesting challenge to meteorologic departments throughout the US.</i></p>
<p>Which raises the question as to whether these esteemed meterorologic departments are aware of Anthony&#8217;s project itself, as they very well should be, etc..  Watts up with that?</p>
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		<title>By: Douglas DC</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60826</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Douglas DC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 16:48:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60826</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Being an old SAWRS guy-I set up three stations back in the 70&#039;s two in NE Oregon and one in Richland, Wa.I have a tear in my eye.As an addition,yesterday Redmond,Or had a high of 68,I believe,I know that is at the Airport-which is now a Sea of asphalt.
It would be worth a look...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being an old SAWRS guy-I set up three stations back in the 70&#8242;s two in NE Oregon and one in Richland, Wa.I have a tear in my eye.As an addition,yesterday Redmond,Or had a high of 68,I believe,I know that is at the Airport-which is now a Sea of asphalt.<br />
It would be worth a look&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Retired Engineer</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60823</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Retired Engineer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 16:20:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60823</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It would be interesting to look at any shift in the record that occurred in the &#039;mid 70&#039;s&#039; and another shift today. Still, if young folks can get interested in doing it right, there is hope for the future.

Bern Bray: Some thermistors are better than the semiconductor sensors. Not by a lot. I&#039;d love to see a schematic of the MMTS system, or have a chance to examine a dead one. I suspect your &#039;vintage 1920&#039;s&#039; thermometer would give better results.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would be interesting to look at any shift in the record that occurred in the &#8216;mid 70&#8242;s&#8217; and another shift today. Still, if young folks can get interested in doing it right, there is hope for the future.</p>
<p>Bern Bray: Some thermistors are better than the semiconductor sensors. Not by a lot. I&#8217;d love to see a schematic of the MMTS system, or have a chance to examine a dead one. I suspect your &#8216;vintage 1920&#8242;s&#8217; thermometer would give better results.</p>
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		<title>By: Bern Bray</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60820</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bern Bray]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:49:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60820</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m happy to see that they are doing it the old fashioned way, even though the resolution is only plus or minus .5 degree.

I&#039;ve done some work with low cost National Semiconductor electronic temperature sensors and was not impressed with the linearity and repeatability. When you toss in the variability of the supporting electronics, and lack of regular calibration, you are just guessing. /sarcasm on/ However, I&#039;m absolutely sure that the sensors in the MMTS units are a far better unit that never needs maintenance or calibration /sarcasm off/

Do you want to know what I used as a temperature reference as I worked with the temperature electronics? A sealed 1920&#039;s vintage mercury thermometer.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m happy to see that they are doing it the old fashioned way, even though the resolution is only plus or minus .5 degree.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve done some work with low cost National Semiconductor electronic temperature sensors and was not impressed with the linearity and repeatability. When you toss in the variability of the supporting electronics, and lack of regular calibration, you are just guessing. /sarcasm on/ However, I&#8217;m absolutely sure that the sensors in the MMTS units are a far better unit that never needs maintenance or calibration /sarcasm off/</p>
<p>Do you want to know what I used as a temperature reference as I worked with the temperature electronics? A sealed 1920&#8242;s vintage mercury thermometer.</p>
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		<title>By: Bruce Foutch</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60819</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bruce Foutch]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:34:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60819</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Professor, Cameron Craig, shown in the above photos, has published a text supplement to his meteorology course. It is available as pdf here:

http://ux1.eiu.edu/~cdcraig/WC/essm.pdf

This could become an interesting challenge to meteorologic departments throughout the US. Set up their own, properly sited and maintained Stevenson screen weather stations and maintain an independent temperature database. Could provide an interesting comparison to &quot;official&quot; data.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Professor, Cameron Craig, shown in the above photos, has published a text supplement to his meteorology course. It is available as pdf here:</p>
<p><a href="http://ux1.eiu.edu/~cdcraig/WC/essm.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://ux1.eiu.edu/~cdcraig/WC/essm.pdf</a></p>
<p>This could become an interesting challenge to meteorologic departments throughout the US. Set up their own, properly sited and maintained Stevenson screen weather stations and maintain an independent temperature database. Could provide an interesting comparison to &#8220;official&#8221; data.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Covert</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60818</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scott Covert]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60818</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Is anyone from the school reading the comments here?

If so, please give us some details about the resighting and your instructions related to siting and collecting/ processing data.

Since there will presumably be a number of observers, how will you handle data consistency?

What sort of training have the potential observers been given?

This is very pleasing to see the students will be getting to see the parameters for a high quality station. It will still be pretty easy to screw it up.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is anyone from the school reading the comments here?</p>
<p>If so, please give us some details about the resighting and your instructions related to siting and collecting/ processing data.</p>
<p>Since there will presumably be a number of observers, how will you handle data consistency?</p>
<p>What sort of training have the potential observers been given?</p>
<p>This is very pleasing to see the students will be getting to see the parameters for a high quality station. It will still be pretty easy to screw it up.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Clark</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60817</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tim Clark]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:19:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60817</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[crosspatch (00:03:14) : 

Bravo!

These folks surely have the best intentions, but let&#039;s not get too worked up just yet.  I know it&#039;s not Siberia, but............

&lt;i&gt;After checking for quality, the preliminary data are sent to the National Climate Data Center (under NOAA) to check the data for &lt;b&gt;accuracy.&lt;/b&gt; After about a two month period, the data are &lt;b&gt;officiated&lt;/b&gt; and placed in the NCDC online archive.&lt;/i&gt;

For brevity, this disclaimer should be condensed in all original station output as &quot;The preliminary data will be Hansenified (or Hansenefiled)&quot;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>crosspatch (00:03:14) : </p>
<p>Bravo!</p>
<p>These folks surely have the best intentions, but let&#8217;s not get too worked up just yet.  I know it&#8217;s not Siberia, but&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p><i>After checking for quality, the preliminary data are sent to the National Climate Data Center (under NOAA) to check the data for <b>accuracy.</b> After about a two month period, the data are <b>officiated</b> and placed in the NCDC online archive.</i></p>
<p>For brevity, this disclaimer should be condensed in all original station output as &#8220;The preliminary data will be Hansenified (or Hansenefiled)&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: George M</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60811</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[George M]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 14:48:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60811</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[...slopes DOWN front-to-rear.  Geez, haven&#039;t had my coffee yet.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;slopes DOWN front-to-rear.  Geez, haven&#8217;t had my coffee yet.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris D.</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/12/01/heres-something-you-dont-see-every-day-a-ushcn-station-reopens/#comment-60810</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris D.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 14:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=4391#comment-60810</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Looks like it might be a very nice siting. I wonder it that&#039;s the original location? I&#039;d bet one or more of the students would be willing to put together a station history for surfacestations.org, if that&#039;s not already been done.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looks like it might be a very nice siting. I wonder it that&#8217;s the original location? I&#8217;d bet one or more of the students would be willing to put together a station history for surfacestations.org, if that&#8217;s not already been done.</p>
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