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	<title>Comments on: Gore wrong on Kilimanjaro snow: Its the trees and &#8220;freezer burn&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/</link>
	<description>Commentary on puzzling things in life, nature, science, weather, climate change, technology, and recent news by Anthony Watts</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:48:30 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Another dumb climate stunt from NBC - climbing Kilimanjaro &#171; Watts Up With That?</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-56279</link>
		<dc:creator>Another dumb climate stunt from NBC - climbing Kilimanjaro &#171; Watts Up With That?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 16:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-56279</guid>
		<description>[...] your bets now on if there will be mentions of these key words which actually are relevant to the true Kiliminjaro story: evapotranspiration, deforestation, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] your bets now on if there will be mentions of these key words which actually are relevant to the true Kiliminjaro story: evapotranspiration, deforestation, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: leebert</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32902</link>
		<dc:creator>leebert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Leon Broznya:

&lt;cite&gt; The Lords and Ladies of Environmentalism have no interest in doing anything. &lt;/cite&gt;

This is one of my gripes. If they want to do something about any potential risk posed by human-driven global warming, they needn&#039;t risk burning out the public with a fear campaign. The most productive use of Al Gore&#039;s $300 million campaign money would be investing in energy efficient technologies like FloDesign&#039;s new wind turbine concept, or Cree&#039;s new LED lightbulb, or Luxim&#039;s new plasma incandescent, or NanoSolar&#039;s new gigawatt-scale PV production facilities, or Rotartica&#039;s solar-powered HVAC for home use ... all of these are technologies already available and needing capital for further marketing and improved manufacturing process. 

Or if they want to getting more cutting-edge, there&#039;s thorium nuclear power, or superconducting power grid capacity, or ocean current turbines, and (drum role please) the all-time energy super-techs of the next 50 years: Infrared Photovoltaics &amp; He3 fusion. 

Solve these last two problems and we&#039;re home free.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Leon Broznya:</p>
<p><cite> The Lords and Ladies of Environmentalism have no interest in doing anything. </cite></p>
<p>This is one of my gripes. If they want to do something about any potential risk posed by human-driven global warming, they needn&#8217;t risk burning out the public with a fear campaign. The most productive use of Al Gore&#8217;s $300 million campaign money would be investing in energy efficient technologies like FloDesign&#8217;s new wind turbine concept, or Cree&#8217;s new LED lightbulb, or Luxim&#8217;s new plasma incandescent, or NanoSolar&#8217;s new gigawatt-scale PV production facilities, or Rotartica&#8217;s solar-powered HVAC for home use &#8230; all of these are technologies already available and needing capital for further marketing and improved manufacturing process. </p>
<p>Or if they want to getting more cutting-edge, there&#8217;s thorium nuclear power, or superconducting power grid capacity, or ocean current turbines, and (drum role please) the all-time energy super-techs of the next 50 years: Infrared Photovoltaics &amp; He3 fusion. </p>
<p>Solve these last two problems and we&#8217;re home free.</p>
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		<title>By: leebert</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32872</link>
		<dc:creator>leebert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 03:56:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32872</guid>
		<description>Thanks for post this one Tony! The loss of arboreal microclimate precipitation and sublimation has been noted since at least 2003 / 2004 as likely causes of Kilimanjaro&#039;s glacial recession, but Gore paid that no mind in his 2006 movie An Inconvenient Truth. 

It gets better: James Hansen, the main consulting scientist for Gore&#039;s movie,  coauthored a 2003 paper on soot deposition on tropical glacial packs REPLETE with the NASA web page showing a series of pictures of Kilimanjaro&#039;s progressive glacial recession. 

http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/news/20031222/
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/news/topstory/2003/1223blacksoot.html

Now riddle me this: How is it that Gore could get such a fundamental fact so wrong when extant research contraindicated using Kilimanjaro as an AGW poster child? Gore claimed to have had his facts vetted. By whom? James Hansen? If so, then just this one gaffe would serve to discredit both Gore &amp; Hansen for playing so loose with science. 

see also:
http://www.scientificblogging.com/leebert/dont_blame_kilimanjaros_glacier_loss_on_global_warming</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for post this one Tony! The loss of arboreal microclimate precipitation and sublimation has been noted since at least 2003 / 2004 as likely causes of Kilimanjaro&#8217;s glacial recession, but Gore paid that no mind in his 2006 movie An Inconvenient Truth. </p>
<p>It gets better: James Hansen, the main consulting scientist for Gore&#8217;s movie,  coauthored a 2003 paper on soot deposition on tropical glacial packs REPLETE with the NASA web page showing a series of pictures of Kilimanjaro&#8217;s progressive glacial recession. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/news/20031222/" rel="nofollow">http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/news/20031222/</a><br />
<a href="http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/news/topstory/2003/1223blacksoot.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/news/topstory/2003/1223blacksoot.html</a></p>
<p>Now riddle me this: How is it that Gore could get such a fundamental fact so wrong when extant research contraindicated using Kilimanjaro as an AGW poster child? Gore claimed to have had his facts vetted. By whom? James Hansen? If so, then just this one gaffe would serve to discredit both Gore &amp; Hansen for playing so loose with science. </p>
<p>see also:<br />
<a href="http://www.scientificblogging.com/leebert/dont_blame_kilimanjaros_glacier_loss_on_global_warming" rel="nofollow">http://www.scientificblogging.com/leebert/dont_blame_kilimanjaros_glacier_loss_on_global_warming</a></p>
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		<title>By: Bill P</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32617</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 03:12:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32617</guid>
		<description>Correction: Alan Chappell - sorry for mangling your name.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction: Alan Chappell &#8211; sorry for mangling your name.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill P</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32570</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32570</guid>
		<description>I thought this thread had petered out.  I hope a personal reflection doesn&#039;t drive a stake through it.

Kilimanjaro is a fascinating place for reasons Allen Chapell and many other readers have pointed out.  Herald Lange&#039;s book, &quot;Kilimanjaro, the White Roof of Africa&quot; (1985), makes several relevant points:

It&#039;s the largest free-standing massif in the world, and as such &quot;makes&quot; its own climate.   Climbers from the base (savannah) pass upward through several different climate zones to reach the crater rim.  Each of these &quot;zones&quot; is classified, in part, by the amount of moisture which reaches it:  the savannah gets about 750-1000 mm of water per year; the shrub and cultivated zones (expedition porters and guides are drawn from the Chagga people there), gets about 1,000 to 1700 mm annually; montane rain forest (cloud forest) receives between 2,000 and 3,000 mm annually; alpine zones get 600 - 1,000 mm; and the summit, in near-arctic &quot;cold desert&quot; conditions, receives less than 100 mm.  So the montane rainforest is noticeably wet, and wett-est. 

I climbed it twenty years ago, in the summer, following a route on its east side.  The forest at the level of human occupation (the Tanzanian government prevents people from living above about 5,000 feet) is what I would call jungle.  It takes a few days of hiking to pass through this zone, and one emerges from the rain forest into the alpine zone to see a spectacular disk of clouds spreading around the mountain beneath you, at about 9,000 feet.  This could only be generated by the warm, humid air rising off the forests and moist soil on the flanks of the mountain.   

Below the cloud disk is an almost self-contained forest belt containing colobus monkeys, cape buffalo, eland, leopards, fig trees and other strange life.   That life stays, for the most part, below the clouds, which makes scientists all the more puzzled at the not-uncommon discovery of antelope, monkey and other animal carcasses near the summit.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,403035-2,00.html 

I can guess what the stripping of those mountain flanks for firewood and for cultivable space would do to that disk of cloud.  The article refers to the loss of more than 50 square miles of mountain forest in the last 30 years.  This is a perfect example of a unique microclimate.  And it is an environmental crisis of sorts for the people who live there.  If it is a &quot;man-made&quot; crisis, it wasn&#039;t made by outsiders or by tourists, but by the people who live there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought this thread had petered out.  I hope a personal reflection doesn&#8217;t drive a stake through it.</p>
<p>Kilimanjaro is a fascinating place for reasons Allen Chapell and many other readers have pointed out.  Herald Lange&#8217;s book, &#8220;Kilimanjaro, the White Roof of Africa&#8221; (1985), makes several relevant points:</p>
<p>It&#8217;s the largest free-standing massif in the world, and as such &#8220;makes&#8221; its own climate.   Climbers from the base (savannah) pass upward through several different climate zones to reach the crater rim.  Each of these &#8220;zones&#8221; is classified, in part, by the amount of moisture which reaches it:  the savannah gets about 750-1000 mm of water per year; the shrub and cultivated zones (expedition porters and guides are drawn from the Chagga people there), gets about 1,000 to 1700 mm annually; montane rain forest (cloud forest) receives between 2,000 and 3,000 mm annually; alpine zones get 600 &#8211; 1,000 mm; and the summit, in near-arctic &#8220;cold desert&#8221; conditions, receives less than 100 mm.  So the montane rainforest is noticeably wet, and wett-est. </p>
<p>I climbed it twenty years ago, in the summer, following a route on its east side.  The forest at the level of human occupation (the Tanzanian government prevents people from living above about 5,000 feet) is what I would call jungle.  It takes a few days of hiking to pass through this zone, and one emerges from the rain forest into the alpine zone to see a spectacular disk of clouds spreading around the mountain beneath you, at about 9,000 feet.  This could only be generated by the warm, humid air rising off the forests and moist soil on the flanks of the mountain.   </p>
<p>Below the cloud disk is an almost self-contained forest belt containing colobus monkeys, cape buffalo, eland, leopards, fig trees and other strange life.   That life stays, for the most part, below the clouds, which makes scientists all the more puzzled at the not-uncommon discovery of antelope, monkey and other animal carcasses near the summit.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,403035-2,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,403035-2,00.html</a> </p>
<p>I can guess what the stripping of those mountain flanks for firewood and for cultivable space would do to that disk of cloud.  The article refers to the loss of more than 50 square miles of mountain forest in the last 30 years.  This is a perfect example of a unique microclimate.  And it is an environmental crisis of sorts for the people who live there.  If it is a &#8220;man-made&#8221; crisis, it wasn&#8217;t made by outsiders or by tourists, but by the people who live there.</p>
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		<title>By: retired engineer</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32555</link>
		<dc:creator>retired engineer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 19:53:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32555</guid>
		<description>Boris: Of course glaciers (well, most of them) are shrinking due to global warming. The question is why is the globe warming? Is it due to natural forces and cycles, or human activity? People&#039;s actions affect the climate, certainly locally, perhaps globally. By how much? 50%, 3%, 0.1%? That&#039;s the debate.

The Sahara used to have a lot of trees (500+ years ago). The sand has spread south slowly ever since. Hard to blame that on SUV&#039;s.

Change is inevitable. You can deny it, ignore it, rail against it, or live with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Boris: Of course glaciers (well, most of them) are shrinking due to global warming. The question is why is the globe warming? Is it due to natural forces and cycles, or human activity? People&#8217;s actions affect the climate, certainly locally, perhaps globally. By how much? 50%, 3%, 0.1%? That&#8217;s the debate.</p>
<p>The Sahara used to have a lot of trees (500+ years ago). The sand has spread south slowly ever since. Hard to blame that on SUV&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Change is inevitable. You can deny it, ignore it, rail against it, or live with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Boris</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32526</link>
		<dc:creator>Boris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:45:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32526</guid>
		<description>Calm down, Anthony.I just thought the phrase was odd. Your explanation makes sense and I have no problem accepting this study at all, though I haven&#039;t looked closely at it.

Of course glaciers around the globe are shrinking due to global warming. I&#039;m sure you have no problem accepting those studies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Calm down, Anthony.I just thought the phrase was odd. Your explanation makes sense and I have no problem accepting this study at all, though I haven&#8217;t looked closely at it.</p>
<p>Of course glaciers around the globe are shrinking due to global warming. I&#8217;m sure you have no problem accepting those studies.</p>
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		<title>By: John McDonald</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32494</link>
		<dc:creator>John McDonald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:30:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32494</guid>
		<description>The whole morphing of the Global Warming Alarmism position into the much more defendable term of Climate Change is on-going and will save the reputation and funding of so many former AGW professors.  It like to see a trend line on the number of Google hits on Global Warming vs. Climate Change vs. time.

I predict in 10 years that AGWs will be history and another underfunded ACCC (Anthropomorphic Climate Change Crisis) will be underway.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The whole morphing of the Global Warming Alarmism position into the much more defendable term of Climate Change is on-going and will save the reputation and funding of so many former AGW professors.  It like to see a trend line on the number of Google hits on Global Warming vs. Climate Change vs. time.</p>
<p>I predict in 10 years that AGWs will be history and another underfunded ACCC (Anthropomorphic Climate Change Crisis) will be underway.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Chappell</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32456</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Chappell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:28:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32456</guid>
		<description>The Driver,
                by the tone of your comment you have never been to Africa. Having worked as an Engineer in Africa (9 years, 6 countries ) I can assure you that the only reason that there is  any ice on top of the mountain is that it has no commercial value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Driver,<br />
                by the tone of your comment you have never been to Africa. Having worked as an Engineer in Africa (9 years, 6 countries ) I can assure you that the only reason that there is  any ice on top of the mountain is that it has no commercial value.</p>
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		<title>By: woodfortrees (Paul Clark)</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32444</link>
		<dc:creator>woodfortrees (Paul Clark)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 09:27:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32444</guid>
		<description>This is more confirmation that deforestation is a huge issue due to its first-order effects as well as its second-order effects on CO2 (to whatever extent you believe that matters).

Leon:  I for one would certainly support protection of existing forests and a reforestation programme.  Remember that there are plenty of &quot;environmentalists&quot; around the world still doing things the old-fashioned way.   If some &quot;carbon credits&quot; flow in that direction to fund them, that would be fine by me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is more confirmation that deforestation is a huge issue due to its first-order effects as well as its second-order effects on CO2 (to whatever extent you believe that matters).</p>
<p>Leon:  I for one would certainly support protection of existing forests and a reforestation programme.  Remember that there are plenty of &#8220;environmentalists&#8221; around the world still doing things the old-fashioned way.   If some &#8220;carbon credits&#8221; flow in that direction to fund them, that would be fine by me.</p>
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		<title>By: Pamela Gray</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32355</link>
		<dc:creator>Pamela Gray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:56:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32355</guid>
		<description>By the way, January 2008 saw a bunch of snow dumped on that big ol&#039; piece of dirt.  Climbers at the time wrote that it was beginning to look like the pile of dirt from old.  And it stayed snowy till summer.  With summer coming to a close, the mountain is forcasted to be snowy for the next three days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, January 2008 saw a bunch of snow dumped on that big ol&#8217; piece of dirt.  Climbers at the time wrote that it was beginning to look like the pile of dirt from old.  And it stayed snowy till summer.  With summer coming to a close, the mountain is forcasted to be snowy for the next three days.</p>
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		<title>By: statePoet1775</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32354</link>
		<dc:creator>statePoet1775</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:52:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32354</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;The snows of Kilimanjaro&quot;,
we were scair&#039;t they&#039;d go away.
Turn&#039;s out it was some cut down trees
and not what Al G. saaid?&lt;/i&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;The snows of Kilimanjaro&#8221;,<br />
we were scair&#8217;t they&#8217;d go away.<br />
Turn&#8217;s out it was some cut down trees<br />
and not what Al G. saaid?</i><i></i></p>
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		<title>By: Patrick</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32321</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:22:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32321</guid>
		<description>The wheels are already coming off of the GoreMobile and there will be a great deal of egg on the faces of many.  Yet very little will be learned except that the human penchant for a &#039;good story&#039; and its consequent hysteria may forever be with us.  May we not do too much damage before we&#039;re off to engage in another morality play.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The wheels are already coming off of the GoreMobile and there will be a great deal of egg on the faces of many.  Yet very little will be learned except that the human penchant for a &#8216;good story&#8217; and its consequent hysteria may forever be with us.  May we not do too much damage before we&#8217;re off to engage in another morality play.</p>
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		<title>By: wattsupwiththat</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32311</link>
		<dc:creator>wattsupwiththat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 16:17:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32311</guid>
		<description>Mary and Boris,

Yes I saw it too. “Deforestation of the mountain`s foothills is the most likely culprit because without forests there is too much evaporation of humidity into outer space.&quot; I thought about making a note of it, but then I figured nobody would bother with it. Thanks for proving otherwise.

Look at the source of the article. The correspondent probably has Kiswahili as his 1st language. Thus I expect the term &quot;outer space&quot; is a translation error for a technical term the correspondent didn&#039;t understand. Think about it, if the correspondent who wrote the article was well fluent, don&#039;t you think he&#039;d question the use of the term?

What would make sense here? Upper troposphere, perhaps? Maybe the words &quot;upper atmosphere&quot; were originally used. It is an easy jump from &quot;upper atmosphere&quot; to &quot;outer space&quot; in translations.

As it is though, zeroing in this one phrase error gives you the tool you need: to ignore the entire conclusion by saying this one phrase negates everything. He said &quot;outer space&quot;! {buzzer]! Negation sequence initiated.

In Boris&#039; case especially, you&#039;ve lost the right to ever again to use the phrase &#039;cherry picking&quot; on this site, since you&#039;ve demonstrated it in the extreme by ignoring the entire article and the findings of the scientists quoted simply for two out of place words. Well played indeed, Boris.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mary and Boris,</p>
<p>Yes I saw it too. “Deforestation of the mountain`s foothills is the most likely culprit because without forests there is too much evaporation of humidity into outer space.&#8221; I thought about making a note of it, but then I figured nobody would bother with it. Thanks for proving otherwise.</p>
<p>Look at the source of the article. The correspondent probably has Kiswahili as his 1st language. Thus I expect the term &#8220;outer space&#8221; is a translation error for a technical term the correspondent didn&#8217;t understand. Think about it, if the correspondent who wrote the article was well fluent, don&#8217;t you think he&#8217;d question the use of the term?</p>
<p>What would make sense here? Upper troposphere, perhaps? Maybe the words &#8220;upper atmosphere&#8221; were originally used. It is an easy jump from &#8220;upper atmosphere&#8221; to &#8220;outer space&#8221; in translations.</p>
<p>As it is though, zeroing in this one phrase error gives you the tool you need: to ignore the entire conclusion by saying this one phrase negates everything. He said &#8220;outer space&#8221;! {buzzer]! Negation sequence initiated.</p>
<p>In Boris&#8217; case especially, you&#8217;ve lost the right to ever again to use the phrase &#8216;cherry picking&#8221; on this site, since you&#8217;ve demonstrated it in the extreme by ignoring the entire article and the findings of the scientists quoted simply for two out of place words. Well played indeed, Boris.</p>
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		<title>By: Boris</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32306</link>
		<dc:creator>Boris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 15:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32306</guid>
		<description>Mary beat me to it. Well played.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mary beat me to it. Well played.</p>
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		<title>By: Evan Jones</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32293</link>
		<dc:creator>Evan Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 14:20:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32293</guid>
		<description>You still see the old story popping up every now and then as dramatic proof of AGW. (It was one of the first of the inconvenient truths to be debunked.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You still see the old story popping up every now and then as dramatic proof of AGW. (It was one of the first of the inconvenient truths to be debunked.)</p>
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		<title>By: MarkW</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32281</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 12:23:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32281</guid>
		<description>&quot;Here’s a novel concept. Instead of Mr. Gore and his environmental cohorts telling us how to live, &quot;

Here&#039;s another novel concept.  Why don&#039;t Mr. Gore and his cohorts start living the lifestyle they are telling the rest of us to live?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Here’s a novel concept. Instead of Mr. Gore and his environmental cohorts telling us how to live, &#8221;</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s another novel concept.  Why don&#8217;t Mr. Gore and his cohorts start living the lifestyle they are telling the rest of us to live?</p>
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		<title>By: Les Francis</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32271</link>
		<dc:creator>Les Francis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 10:16:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32271</guid>
		<description>Richard (21:23:22) :

    Just a small correction Anthony. The decline IS due to climate change. A localized climate change due to deforestation. In biology we call it micro-climate.

    Of course it is nothing to do with global climate change and nothing at all to do with AGW (which is theoretical and unproven).

Correct. I believe that Anthony all along has been pushing the &quot;Land Use&quot; scenario.

It cannot be denied that the clearing of tropical rainforests in Asia, Africa and South America has contributed to localised &quot;climate change&quot;. (micro-climate).

How much does this equatorial massive tropical land clearing influence more Northerly or Southerly climes?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard (21:23:22) :</p>
<p>    Just a small correction Anthony. The decline IS due to climate change. A localized climate change due to deforestation. In biology we call it micro-climate.</p>
<p>    Of course it is nothing to do with global climate change and nothing at all to do with AGW (which is theoretical and unproven).</p>
<p>Correct. I believe that Anthony all along has been pushing the &#8220;Land Use&#8221; scenario.</p>
<p>It cannot be denied that the clearing of tropical rainforests in Asia, Africa and South America has contributed to localised &#8220;climate change&#8221;. (micro-climate).</p>
<p>How much does this equatorial massive tropical land clearing influence more Northerly or Southerly climes?</p>
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		<title>By: Arnost</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32263</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnost</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 09:06:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32263</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s a link to the Mote and Kaser American Scientist article:

http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/feature/the-shrinking-glaciers-of-kilimanjaro-can-global-warming-be-blamed/1</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s a link to the Mote and Kaser American Scientist article:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/feature/the-shrinking-glaciers-of-kilimanjaro-can-global-warming-be-blamed/1" rel="nofollow">http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/feature/the-shrinking-glaciers-of-kilimanjaro-can-global-warming-be-blamed/1</a></p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/17/gore-wrong-on-kilimanjaro-snow-its-the-trees/#comment-32244</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 04:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=2298#comment-32244</guid>
		<description>Just a small correction Anthony. The decline IS due to climate change. A localized climate change due to deforestation. In biology we call it micro-climate.

Of course it is nothing to do with global climate change and nothing at all to do with AGW (which is theoretical and unproven).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a small correction Anthony. The decline IS due to climate change. A localized climate change due to deforestation. In biology we call it micro-climate.</p>
<p>Of course it is nothing to do with global climate change and nothing at all to do with AGW (which is theoretical and unproven).</p>
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