Comments on: California Proclaims Drought – Governator demands action

By: MrSpindles

MrSpindles — Fri, 06 Jun 2008 01:27:32 +0000

In regards to “Cadillac Desert” after setting aside the writer’s personal view the book gives a good overall history of water politics in the US southwest.

By: SteveSadlov

SteveSadlov — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:43:17 +0000

Cadillac Desert (I own a copy) is a worst case combination of Gaia worship, doomer prognostication and general hatred of the LDS engineers who helped conquer the US West. Of course it makes some good points, but it’s very overblown. California is not Ancient Egypt.

By: SteveSadlov

SteveSadlov — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:37:48 +0000

RE: 14″ per year in SOMA (especially South Beach). A little known Bay Area microclimate fact … there is a “subsidence desert” over the Bay, which impinges on the western and southern shores. At Pier 1, it extends only a few hundred yards inland, in Santa Clara it extends 2 miles inland. Back before the South Bay was built out, it was fascinating to drive across the mouth of the Santa Clara Valley and note the massive changes in flora through the transect. In Mt. View, open forest / oak savanna was native, in northern Santa Clara / Alviso, short grass and desert scrub. That is a distance of 5 miles.

By: SteveSadlov

SteveSadlov — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:31:17 +0000

17″ in SF for the 2007 – 2008 season to date … to put that in perspective, when I lived in SOMA, the normal rainfall was about 14.” Somewhere like Mt. Davidson it’s probably 25″. So, microclimate variation within the City alone is massive.

17″ at Dolores, while less than the “normal” 19 or 20″ or whatever it is (tangent for another day, the moves of the measurement location … just what is normal?), is respectable. Of course, the whole thing is bogus, since the important watersheds are miles away from SF.

From my perspective, we are in a light to moderate two year drought. For now. If it goes to the third year, then that’s a different discussion. We had a light 5 year drought in NoCal (7 year in SoCal) late 80s into the early 90s. That was actually pretty bad, we had rationing in a number of locales.

By: Reid

Reid — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:30:00 +0000

Speaking of farmers I predict that if a serious drought arises the farmers will be cutoff. It becomes a national security issue when populated areas don’t get water. Water and electric have to flow or there will be blood.

By: pablo an ex pat

pablo an ex pat — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:09:49 +0000

I think that the State of California should open a bunch of corn ethanol plants and run them as state owned Co-op’s. Site one or two in San Francisco. They could use state money to subsidize the Ethanol and reduce the price of automobile fuel. All the time creating a greener planet and employing lots more people. It’s a win – win – win situation eh ?

Then a multitude of green ideas could fester in the same place. Just the processing part of Corn Ethanol uses 4 gallons of water for every gallon of Ethanol produced. This vandalism is already subsidized by $0.51/Gallon by the Federal Government.

What a pleasant prospect it is to be lead down the garden path by these people…. NOT.

By: austin

austin — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 20:18:06 +0000

The Farmers built and paid for that water infrastructure.

The cities should do the same for theirs.

Its BS that the former is being stolen by the latter.

By: Wondering Aloud

Wondering Aloud — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 18:56:37 +0000

Housing prices are much more reasonable in Wisconsin or Michigan or South Dakota, If you don’t like blackouts and water shortages… or if you think it’s too hot where you are because of global warming… you may want to relocate.

By: Mel Pahoa

Mel Pahoa — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 18:14:16 +0000

I am terrified by the idea of water restrictions I could be trying to control my
water usage but my mentally ill sister is not goin to listen to anyone–and take a long, long , long shower–twice a day! My family has had fights over even each other’s methods of trying to save water! What can I do?

By: JP

JP — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 18:11:06 +0000

People on the West Coast should get use to this. A cold PDO will mean dry, dry and still more dry climate regimes. Places like Oregon and Washington will see more precip, but California -esp in the north- could see colder, snowier winters, but hot dry summers. This could play havoc on thier argiculture industry and will certainly raise the cost of living.

If the AMO remains in a positive mode while the PDO is cold, drought could also move into the eastern Rockies and Plain states. If the Rockies overtime see less winter snowfall, and the ethanol plants in the Plains continue to grow in number, there will be major problems with the drying of the Ogallala Aquifer. Ethanol production requires tons of water.

By: Retired Engineer

Retired Engineer — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 18:10:16 +0000

SuperDBA: Spot on! We (CO) lived with low rainfall for several years, so we cut back on use. Had to tell the @#$% immigrants they couldn’t have Kentucky Blue grass lawns. Awwww. Then CA sues us to get more water from the Colorado. Right. Like we can control that.

Last time I was in southern CA, they still watered the medians of their freeways. Reality: CO is high plains desert. We live with it. The leftcoast should learn to do the same. (I recall a story about students at one of the major CA universities getting up in arms that the administration installed low-flow shower heads. DAISNAID)

By: MrSpindles

MrSpindles — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 18:03:15 +0000

I know people may have moved on to more recent posts but required reading for anyone in the US southwest should be “Cadillac Desert” by Marc Reisner!!

By: Michael Ronayne

Michael Ronayne — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 17:49:43 +0000

Confused In New Jersey???

I though the west cost had record snow falls this past winter? The ski resorts couldn’t count the money fast enough. Here is the official NOAA report.

Northern Hemisphere Snow and Ice Winter 2007/2008
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2007/snow0708.html

Here is the graphic for just the west cost for March, April and May.

Mountain Snowpack on March 1, 2008
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/img/climate/research/2008/feb/MtnSnowpack_1Mar08.gif

Mountain Snowpack on April 1, 2008
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/img/climate/research/2008/mar/MtnSnowpack_1Apr08.gif

Mountain Snowpack on May 1, 2008
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/img/climate/research/2008/apr/MtnSnowpack_1May08.gif

California appears to have gone from above average snowpack in March to below average snowpack in May. I am confused by the statement “very low snowmelt runoff” which can mean two things.

1. There is not much snowpack to melt.
2. The snowpack is not melting.

What are the temperatures in the California Mountains?

Arizona appears to be in very serious difficulties. They may not want to share the Colorado River waters with Arnold this year.

Mike

By: H.Oldeboom

H.Oldeboom — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 17:07:11 +0000

In Mister Schwarzenegger’s homeland Austria this last winter was a special one; snowing and lower than normal temperatures started approx. half November (this is about 5 weeks earlier than normal). During the winter there was little snowfall and above normal temperatures. End of the winter strong snowing till the 10th of May (skiing possible).

By: Scott Walker

Scott Walker — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 16:02:40 +0000

Long time lurker; first time poster. Great blog! To the fellow upthread suggesting flooding Oregon with Californians: too late. They’re already here. Anybody thinking to grab water from Oregon had best establish air superiority first…although this year we’ll have plenty. Coldest spring I can recall, and snow forecast in the Cascades down to 4000 feet. From where I live, on a rare clear day, I can see snow on mountains where people should have been pitching tents or hiking a month ago. My tomato plants would appreciate some global warming.